How He Sold $2,000,000 Per Month in Roofing Sales… Over the Phone

How he sold over $2 million per month in roofing sales over the phone. Not Zoom, not in person, over the phone. I can't wait to share his story with you today. Help me welcome Cody Landels. Cody, our fellow mentor inside RSA. How you doing, man?

I'm doing awesome. How about yourself?

Dude, I'm so excited to be here because this, I've been wanting to do this interview with you for probably 2 full years because you have innovated the roofing industry in a way that we've really only seen being done in the tech space. And I tell all the members of the Roofing Strong Alliance by TAMCO— by the way, there's a link in the description to join us— that you run a roofing company, or at least did until now, you're on the consulting side, like a tech company. And not only you started Reimagine Roofing, you completely had to rebuild the company. You launched this new innovative selling roofs over the phone like no one did. You built it to $2 to $3 million a month. You had a successful exit, and then you were VP of sales for a private equity platform, and now you consult companies and help them reimagine their own sales in a beautiful way. What did I miss on your background, Cody?

No, I mean, that's, that's pretty much it. I mean, just going a little bit further back, you know, I was, I was in the Marine Corps, then before that I was in the solar industry, and that's really where this all started. So, I was building a door-knocking team out there, and know, we, we'd gotten pretty large. We were operating in 7 states. You know, total across all of our sales groups was just under $100 million. And we kept running into the same problem, bad roofs. You can't put a bad roof on or you can't put solar on a bad roof. And so eventually we got to the point where we were using 10, 15 different roofing companies because nobody was covering our coverage area. And it all kind of came to a head one day. We were doing a roof in El Paso and The crew was about halfway done. Solar was about to go on either the next day or that Monday. We were under a tight timeline and the roofer calls me up because even as the sales manager, I was somehow running the roofing installs as well. I'm not sure how that worked, but that was the situation. He calls me and says, hey, I need the full payment Venmo'd to me or I'm not going to finish the roof. And that was kind of my breaking point. I figured there had to be a better way than that, obviously. But just in general, that I saw a real market opportunity. If there could be a roofer that could simplify that problem. Just my company alone was doing 20 or 30 re-roofs a month. And you know, that really in my mind created the kind of a unicorn business model where you had recurring revenue and, you know, outside of commercial, it's just very hard to get recurring revenue on the roofing side. And so I thought to myself, if I could crack this code and solve this problem for a whole industry, I'd really have a huge opportunity there. And so that's how I got started in roofing. And I knew I needed to learn roofing first. You know, I'm terrified of heights. I'm not a super handy person, so not the, you know, the ideal model for a roofer. And I went and joined this roofing company that had been in business 30 years. They did $20 million the year before, and to me seemed like the perfect thing to join. I was joining as a general manager. They already had a production team. They already had, you know, 7 sales reps. And what they told me is all they needed was a glorified sales manager to come drive sales through the business, and I'd be able to learn the rest of the business, you know, while I was, while I was doing that. I was not perfect. So I joined the company day one on the job. The entire team quit because the previous general manager went and started his own roofing company. So I was sitting there day one, had really no idea about anything, and I had a choice to make. It was either learn it myself or Go back to what was easy. And I decided to just buckle down. So funnily enough, funnily enough, I started watching your videos. Um, you know, Eric Reno, Deshaun Bryant, really just the couple of people that were doing YouTube videos at the time. And I just, I just watched and watched and watched, uh, videos. And then I went out with my crews because we had a little bit of a backlog and just told them, I was like, I know nothing. Just treat me like a third grader. And that's how I really learned the industry. Um, And then from there, I started to get some confidence. The rest of the company was a Midwest roofing company and they were door knocking for insurance claims. And I thought to myself, man, I'm door knocking to sell a $30,000 solar system and they're telling me I could door knock to just do a $1,000 deductible for a brand new roof and seems super easy. No brainer for me. So once I learned it over the course of 2 months, I went and recruited all of my solar sales team. Or a majority of them, um, that were a little bit unhappy with, with where they were at, at that time. Um, they came over, they joined, and we went out with 5 guys and we opened up somewhere between 80 or 90 insurance claims. Um, and we were already counting our commission money. We were, you know, over the moon happy. Uh, come to find out in Phoenix, they have this thing called, you know, keep listers, which are not covered by insurance. So of those 90, um, insurance claims, we got 2 approved. And so guys went from making six figures in solar to making nothing with me. And I basically had to restart from ground zero again. That was within my first three months. And so that was kind of how I got started in roofing. And then what I did from there is I just set out to solve the problem of why I got into roofing. I knew it enough then. And so I started reaching out to the previous solar companies. And I already knew the friction point is that when you're sitting at the kitchen table you go to present solar and the homeowner's like, I would love to do solar, but I need to get my roof done first. Most of the time what would happen is you go ask a roofing company, it would take a week or 2 weeks to get a quote back and time kills all deals. So I knew if I could solve the problem of a quote at the point of sale, I would unlock a huge amount of value to my potential clients being the solar companies. And so that's what I did is I, I was, as far as my knowledge, the first person to be on the quote roof within 15 minutes or less. What I did is I used Google Earth to measure the roof as well as dropping myself onto Street View, and I put up a pitch calculator onto your computer screen. And so I knew the square footage, I knew the pitch, and I could calculate a square count and then build a price per square model. And my original business model was quotes in 15 minutes or less. So I was the Guy Gove of roofing. And that's how we first started really seeing, you know, extreme growth. Was in this B2B model. I would go teach solar companies how to take a roof or get a roof quote from us by just texting our hotline. Then they would package it into the solar deal. That solar sales rep would present the roof to the homeowner, just the price, and we would overlay YouTube videos explaining our different roof packages. And you know, in our second year, our first year we did $5 million with that model. Our second year we grew to $15 million. And so it was— and that's when I kind of knew that we had unlocked, you know, a pretty competitive business model.

Yeah. And then the rug got ripped out from under you. You and I were at RoofCon, and I remember you got a phone call that set you on this trajectory to create this, not knowing it at the time, this, this selling roofs over the phone model that took you from, holy smokes, what's going to happen next to not only a successful exit, but being in a position where the acquirer wanted the strategic opportunity that you helped create and have since been teaching our members how to do that. We've run workshops together. You are giving away your knowledge just so generously in our community, but that all started what people don't see behind the scenes. And everyone's like, oh, it's an overnight success. It's like, yeah, minus the the lifetime of preparation and the crippling levels of failure. So would you, would you, what I'd love to do, if you could just share the moment that changed everything and the light bulb that led you to this new innovative concept. And then we're going to start breaking down some of the tactics of implementing this concept, because I know folks are having a barrier. You can't sell a roof over the phone. What about Zoom? You know, all the questions that obviously come up, we're going to address, but walk us through that breaking point that you had at RoofCon.

Yeah. Yeah. So it was, it was, it was really, really crazy timing because we had just taken on a minority investor that wanted us to blitzscale to the East Coast. And we had been doing that for about 6 months. Essentially, a solar company had heard what we were doing on the West Coast and they said, hey, we really want you to do it on the East Coast. We have this huge opportunity and how quickly can you get out there? So we blitzscaled to the East Coast trying to, you know, capture all of that business because at the time solar looked like it was on a rocket ship and we had the recurring revenue that, you know, would allow us to grow that quickly. So we were at RoofCon and it was, you know, kind of my first time being at a real conference, you know, first time us doing something together. So I was, you know, on top of the world. It was, I thought we were kind of reaching the peak of what I was building. And then I got my first call from one of my large partners. They had about $120K in AP, accounts payable, that was due, you know, this Friday. And I believe it was a Wednesday or a Thursday. And they asked, they said, hey, you know, some things have changed in the lending space. So we're going to be cash tight a little bit moving forward. Is it okay if I do like $25K Friday instead of $120K? And, you know, we had a large amount of AR that was expected to hit Friday and we weren't really cash tight at the time. Because of the model. So I was like, yeah, no big deal. And then I got the second call and it's like, hey, I owe you $60,000. Can I pay you $10,000 this week? And I got within the span of that day and the next day, 9 calls. We were not stiff, but we, you know, more than $1 million in AR that we thought we're supposed to hit Friday got pushed out into some payment plan. And that was just week 1. And you know, week 2 didn't get much better. And really what happened was the lenders stopped paying an upfront 50% and that basically sucked all the cash out of all of our partners. And at that time I was doing basically 100% of my revenue was coming from my solar partners. And so I was in this really tough situation where I couldn't really stop doing work because then I wouldn't get paid by them because You know, they can't install solar unless I do the roof, so I'm going to cut off their cash, but also I can't keep doing work for them if I'm not going to get paid. And so I really had to figure out how was I going to get off of this, you know, essentially a doom loop with him, but still sell enough to be able to guide the business into being a healthy business that's not going to go down with the rest of the solar industry. And that kind of brought me to my lightbulb moment. I was— I remember exactly where I was. I was sitting in my office. We were— I was wondering how I was going to hit payroll because the other thing to compound it is a lot of these companies were paying me net 15 or net 30. So I would go do more work next week and I would just get more in debt because, you know, it was a cash flow negative at the time. And so it's like, You know, but then if I don't do that roof and they don't get the money, and so it's like, how do you navigate out of that? And it was, it was about 2 weeks into it. I was sitting in my office. It was, it was about 4:30 in the morning. I was actually looking at VR trying to figure out how I was going to hit payroll, but just, just kind of feeling sorry for myself and a light bulb went off and it just was like, the quickest money is going to be retail. And also if people are willing to buy a roof, from a solar sales guy in a couple of videos, and that guy knows nothing about roofing, then it's highly likely they'd be willing to buy a roof from somebody talking to them on the phone with the same set of videos, knowing more than that, that solar sales guy. And, um, and we already had over 500 5-star reviews because we were really driving a ton of reviews into our business because I knew that I had to have a lot of brand equity, uh, for someone to buy a roof from me. From a solar sales guy that doesn't know a ton about roof. So I already built up all of that digital trust and that's where the light bulb went off for me. It's like, they, if they're willing to buy it from him, they're definitely willing to buy it from us. And then with a, you know, a 50% deposit, we start getting cash flow positive. And then, um, all we really had to do was to turn on just some basic marketing, some GMB, some— we weren't, because we had no sales, we weren't, we weren't driving any, any of that. And so we turned it on. And then, you know, within our first month we did $200K and that started adding cash to the business. And then over the course of a year and a half, I took my solar revenue from 100% down to 10% and my retail revenue from zero up to 90% on a revenue mix with year 3, not seeing any, um, actually an increase in revenue. We went from $15 to $18 while basically taking away all of our solar risk.

Yeah. $15 to $18 million just to, Let's clarify that. So dude, what a monumental journey in being able to turn bad news into a positive outcome. And I know there was a lot more going into that. You've shared some of this in our sessions inside the Roofing Strong Alliance. You've empowered some of our members who've been on hard times. You've been in the trenches. And I know that there are a lot of contractors right now that are hurting. You know, leads are down and they're feeling They're feeling the pressure. You've been a huge support on that front, especially in empowering a team because one of the most expensive assets is people. And obviously when you've shared, you know, where your team was at, the volume that an over-the-phone salesperson can handle is significantly higher than someone that's in the field. Because if you're in the field, you might be limited depending on who you ask and how long the sales process is. 3, 4, 5 appointments a day. 5 would be like, gosh, breakneck speed, probably not possible in a retail space unless they're neighbors, you know. Uh, generally capped at about 4, and some people like to keep it at 3. I've even heard other companies wanting to keep it at 2, and that's it, 2 per day. So you, you have created this model where you get more per rep and operating costs to service the Homeowner, obviously you don't have drive time. There's a lot of, uh, operational efficiencies at play. So walk us through just conceptually for those that are, that are tuning in, they're like, how do you do this? How do you sell a roof? This is, by the way, I know some of these answers, but our folks that are tuning in may not. How do you sell a roof if you haven't had your eyes on the roof? How do you compete against someone who's presenting in the home? What are the operational workflows like when it's over the phone? So can you just walk us like on a high level, step 1 is this to this, what it would look like as a homeowner. I reach out, I jump online, I fill out a form to get a, to get an estimate or a quote on my roof. What happens and how do you do it?

Yeah. So starting at the very top, it really comes down to problem awareness. So very first step is this, is the customer 100% problem aware or 99% or lower? Meaning are they calling in because I need to replace my roof or are they calling in because I think I may need to replace my roof? So that's step 1. If it's 99% or lower, then we actually do do an inspection. That's one of the common misconceptions is that everything we sell, we never put eyes on the roof first. So if they're 99% or lower, even if they say, hey, I have a 20-year-old roof, I probably need to replace my roof, but you know, I just, I just want to see. Then we go out and do a photo report. We need them 100% certain that they are going to replace a roof before we actually go for the replacement. Now in my business, we really optimize for roof replacements. We found that roof repairs tend to cause the most problems, have the lowest margins, and take the most amount of work. So we would just, you know, have a large enough minimum that we really just tried to opt out of repair work because it just didn't fit the model. So if they are not 100% aware, we do an inspection, good photo report, and then that's done by a job site supervisor or project manager or an inspector. If the homeowner's home, they might say hi, you know, they might introduce themselves, but they're there to just inspect the roof. Should take, you know, 15, maybe 30 minutes if it's a more complicated roof. And then what happens is they're going to go to a phone call. Now, backing up a little bit, we start to curate the process at the beginning of the conversation. And what we really do is we have the homeowner opt into our process, meaning we say things, hey, we have two different options for you. We either go the traditional route or we come out, we sit down for 2 or 3 hours with you and, you know, we stay in your kitchen and we kind of go over everything. Or what a lot of our homeowners prefer is we go the more A modern route where one, you know, if we need the inspection, when we come out, we inspect, we don't need you home, we'll take some photos and then we hop on a quick 20 or 30-minute call and review all of that with you. In the meantime, we send over information beforehand so you can self-educate. Of those two options, which one would you prefer? 90 to 95% of the people we talk to are going to prefer the phone conversation when we set it up that way. You know, less stress. They don't have to clean the house. And most importantly, in their mind, they go, man, that's a way easier way to buy a roof. And I'd actually prefer that. And so anybody else that's now gonna try to set up an in-home kitchen appointment is gonna meet with some resistance, even if the homeowner doesn't vocalize it subconsciously. They're like, man, why can't they just sell over the phone? This was so much easier. And so we build that up. And the one thing I always remind my team is really don't know how to buy a roof. Most people that you're gonna sell a roof to, they maybe bought one 10 years ago, especially on the retail side. Maybe if you're in a, you know, heavy storm market, you know, they're buying roofs every 2 or 3 years and that's a different customer. But in the markets I focus on and in the retail side, you're buying a roof once every 5, 10, maybe once in your life. And so they don't know how to buy a roof. And, and so if you give them the option and they say, wow, that's the way I wanna buy a roof. Anybody that's not offering it in that way or that streamlined, instantly you become higher on the altitude chain. And so that's how we set that. And then we just get on a, we have a phone call prior to the phone call. We send over some YouTube videos that basically are about, you know, 5 to 10 minutes long depending on the roofing system and gives them some initial information of what we're going to offer, you know, what our different packages are. And they come to the call saying, wow, I want this package, or wow, I watched these videos and I'm really interested in a Class 4 shingle, or whatever it is. I really want a standing seam roof, but they come pre-educated and that streamlines the call immensely. And then we, we do a quick photo report of review if necessary, if they're 99% sure or less with the goal of them saying, hey, yep, I do need to replace my roof. Then we do a quick 5 to 15-minute explanation. Of who we are, why we do things, and just, you know, build a little value. And then we're into our packages where they, we review the packages and then we make a recommendation and ask for the signature.

What a beautiful process and simple. By the way, I was taking some notes because I wanted to follow up on a few things. One thing that I hope folks picked up on, and they may not have, is that you said they have to be 99% problem aware. And for those who are unfamiliar, not what I love about what, what you've done, Cody, is not everyone's your customer. They have to have a roof problem that they know about, which means you are losing all of the market share of door-to-door of people who are not problem-aware. They say, wait, there's something wrong with my roof. I didn't know whether it's storm damage or retail, which is totally fine. You're very clear. Not everyone's your customer. And number 2, they have to be willing to buy a roof over the phone. You're fitting. This is your box and you're like, this is how we serve people. If you fit in our box, we will serve you. There's a magic lesson there for so many companies that try to fit all their customer into, like they try to fit around their customer's box. And that's actually what creates chaos. You cannot deliver a world-class experience for the people you serve. And even to this day, you, what's funny, you roofed my mom's house. I remember I was out in your office and I was walking through and, and gosh, what, what's the sales rep's name? He's on the tip of my tongue. Haven. Haven. He walks up to me and he goes, he's right here. And I'm looking around, I'm like, what? And then he puts the phone on speaker and I hear, hey honey. And it was my mom. She bought a new home, which by the way, I like, she's, she lives near me and she called you guys up again. I didn't even know she was replacing her roof or it needed to get replaced. She was in the middle of the home buying process. Just so happened to be, I was in your office. And then my mom's calling for you to do it because you did such a good job on her roof the first time when she got a new house, she called you back. So, so much of your world-class experience is knowing how you serve. The other things that I wrote down is, is you said that homeowners were pre-educated. You sent them videos, which allows you to control the sales process for consistency and to make sure that the message was delivered in the way that a homeowner needs to hear it because as you put it, most people don't know how to buy a roof. So you are, you are educating your homeowners on how to buy a roof. You've streamlined the process from lead, answer the phone, set an appointment for a runner to go out and do the inspection if needed. It's not always needed in, in the case that you've, that you've shared. The photo report is prepared while the second appointment is scheduled. The rep calls them, calls the homeowner back, walks through everything while they're on the phone, sends the report over, hey, go through these pages. They've sent the videos over and then you can walk through the proposal over the phone. It's beautiful. I just love it and it's so innovative. So what do you, like, if you could go back in time and fix one thing that would make, that you believe would make, had made you successful even faster? What's the one piece of advice you would've given yourself early on that you know now?

Systems before, before growth. That was, that would be the biggest thing. Build my systems for where I want to go instead of the systems for where I'm at. That, that is the single biggest thing, especially with how fast we are growing. There were several times where we broke the system and then we'd have to spend a month or two like, okay, we're not a $5 million company anymore. And, um, you know, just, uh, building the systems that, um, large enough to allow me to grow into the system instead of having to, oh, hold on, pause, let's stop growing for 2 months because this is crazy. And then, and then like, then we, we try to restart it up. And so it would, you know, one, allow the, the, the company to grow a lot more smoothly, but it also would've allowed me to sleep a lot more over the course of the years. But yeah, just thinking big enough and really seeing around the corner of, which, you know, I had never grown a company like that before. So it was, I had grown a sales team before, but not a company. And so that was things that I just, I couldn't even see. But that would be the biggest thing is having the systems in place that allow you to grow into those systems instead of building a system for today. And then rebuilding it in, in a year and then rebuilding it another year. It really starts to halt your, your growth and cause massive headaches.

Yeah. And you have exceptional discipline on slow. To speed up, we often need to slow down. And you've, you've, you've found that balance as a fast-moving entrepreneur. The, the classic, I think you and I are probably similar in the move fast and break things mindset. You know, it's just like, get it done. But you, you've had that restraint to slow it down. Like, what do we need to build the scale from? As opposed to try to build a system to meet where we are, and then you'll outgrow it anyway. So you're always behind the times. Now, you've helped quite a few people through the events that we've, we've hosted and through the sessions that you run inside RSA, which is now available at no additional cost to the TAMCO EDGE certified contractors. If you want to join Cody Down in the Trenches, you can click the link in the description or go to rsa.pro because Cody, you've got tons of sessions in there. We've got the Alliance Brain, which is our master AI. So folks are like asking questions on how to set up these systems, how to handle comp structure, your recommendations on comp structure for the sales team. So all that's like right at folks' fingertips. But for those who, who might be resistant just to the idea, like how, how could I ever imagine selling a roof over the phone when I need this structured process in the, in the in-home appointment? What advice have you given contractors in the past from a mindset standpoint that have helped them navigate this change and get inspired to change?

Yeah. So I think a couple things. One, I think when a business owner looks at how much more control you have on your inside sales team, like that is just super exciting. It's so much easier to record calls. It's so much easier to use AI to optimize what's being said. And standardize it. But what I always recommend to get started with is let's use it on our least qualified leads or our least risky or our most risky leads. So if it's— I just had a call this morning with somebody that's like, I work in this core area, but I get a lot of leads from these outside. And when we sell them, it's great for the business. But, you know, having a rep go out there just one day, you know, for one appointment a day, like it gets hard. And I'm like, Perfect time when maybe we should do some phone sales with. Mm-hmm. Um, he's getting these leads for like $15 a pop. Uh, you know, it's just, but it's hard on the operational of, of the business. And, um, but he, but he, because of the relationship, he has to run these leads cuz it's part of a larger program. Mm-hmm. And so I was like, perfect. Um, you know, um, adding them into areas where you might want to break into. And what I also did, um, that was really great is, um, started using it for new lead sources. Um, and so instead of sending, you know, um, your, your retail sales team driving out to, you know, 3 appointments a day that are all no-shows because you just brought on, you know, um, a new ad agency or a new lead provider, those are perfect for a phone appointment. It's a lot less of a morale hit when, um, a phone salesperson gets a no-show. It's like, okay, cool. I got a couple more minutes left. Um, the other, uh, really big operational, um, immediate lift is Rehash. The majority of field sales does not do a great follow-up because they're driving so much. So if you peel off just a small portion of your incoming leads, the least valuable ones, the one that the sales team doesn't want anymore, and then you also stack that with the other end of the duty for this inside salesperson is going to be rehash. You know, and whether it's 14 days, 30 days, 7 days, at some point, whatever your company policy is or whatever the, you know, the, the The norm is your field guy is going to stop chasing that lead. That is a perfect opportunity to roll that into an inside salesperson. So you get immediate ROI on leads that you've already paid for. And so he pays for it, him or herself, you know, within the first 30 days. And then you get a free test of your kind of outskirt leads that you may want to go into a new area, or you may want to maybe run them, but you don't want to necessarily send somebody out there. So that allows you to learn without— with one, actually learn while making money because of the rehash, but most importantly, learn without making your sales team angry. And they go, oh, awesome. The inside guy's taking all the appointments I don't want anyways. That's great. And that's, that's one of the big things. Whenever I add something new to a business, we got to think about the overall morale hit. You know, how's it going to— is it going to be additive or subtractive from what the team is feeling? And if, you know, you just bring in somebody that's, you know, poaching 10 appointments a day because that's how many you could run as a phone sales. And all of your guys go from 4 appointments to 2 appointments. Now it's going to be like, man, this is dumb. Like this, you know, there's going to be so much friction in the business versus if you just, you know, um, get those outskirt areas. Now everybody's happier and now we can really start building some teamwork and then really start growing the business.

Yeah. I love the advice that you shared early on when you're like, you can give one, you can use it for new lead sources. And the other thing I've seen you share, Some of our members have rolled it out as an offer. You can do it this way or that way. That way they can get, because a lot of folks are like, I don't know if it'll work in my market. Test it. You hire one person and then you test it. So Cody, as we, um, can I just work on that real quick? Yeah, please.

Yeah. So that's actually, um, something that we did, um, we did pilot, um, you know, with, with, uh, at Reimagine and some of the other brands as well. We saw an increase in demo percentage and a slight increase in close percentage. If you look at something like Home Depot, Home Depot offers right now the dual options. And I think that is the best path forward because when someone opts into something, they're much more likely to enjoy that or show up for it. So we, when we, when we piloted that, we just changed the initial script a little bit more. So instead of trying to shift most people into the digital, we make it more just equal and we say something along the lines of, you know, we have two options here. We have the traditional where we come out, we do an in-home presentation, we get to look you in the eye, shake your hand, and that's going to take like an hour to an hour and a half. Or some of our people like the more modern approach. And then, you know, we say the same thing we said before. Basically, we come out, we can take quick photos, or if they already know they need a replacement, we could just do satellite images. And then it's a 20 or 30-minute conversation. It's a little bit more streamlined. Which one would be better for you? So by just changing up the initial conversation a little bit, there's less of my first way I said that you're going to get like 90% want digital. The way I said there, you're going to get closer to like a 50/50. And then you can, you know, even go further and push it more into traditional. If you just change up the wording a little bit. But that's what I think is the best way for a company, especially with the field sales team now. Is to give that option approach so that people opt into it and then you'll have a much higher close percentage because there's 100% chance. I mean, there's definitely 100% people that will not buy a roof over the phone, like without a doubt. So if I'm losing 20% of those people and you could pick those up by a, you know, an in-person appointment, there's value in that.

Yeah. Cody, if you were to give advice to someone and your goal with this advice was to inspire them to begin doing this, and you could only say these are the first 3 things that you need to do, what would those first 3 steps be?

I would say first hire a dedicated person. The biggest mistake I see often is that they get like, you know, one of the field guys to do it in their, you know, just on Tuesdays and like they kind of limp into it. And I would get somebody that has experience selling over the phone previously. It doesn't have to be roofing, but they have to believe in the process and believe that's actually possible. If you just take somebody out of the field they're like, okay, I'll try it. And then it doesn't work the first or second time. Subconsciously, they're going to be like, okay, this is dumb. It's never going to work. And they don't have the conviction. So that's the first thing is get the right person there. Have somebody that has experience selling over the phone. Number 2, having a defined sales presentation, making sure that— and it could be the one you're using in the field, but just maybe modifying it slightly, but having something that the homeowner is looking at and the sales rep is looking at, uh, both the same thing. And then you just tell 'em, hey, next slide. And then the final thing I would say is, is videos. Um, they don't have to be complex, but, um, the videos are so important because when you're explaining something over the phone, there will be things sometimes lost in translation. But what we love about the videos and what the data has shown, 'cause we have the tracking on it, is people will go back and watch that video, you know, right before the call. And then after the call, they'll go back and watch it again. And even if they are still trying to decide, but those videos are evergreen content, they'll go watch the videos 3, 4 times. They'll watch them today, tomorrow, and then next week before they make a decision. So you have those 3 pillars, a dedicated person, a good sales presentation with, you know, as part of a sales process. And then videos, even just very short ones, they don't have to be overproduced, just basic videos that explain what is going to be happening. What packages you're offering, those 3 things combined, I think you'll find success within the first 30 days.

Yeah. Beautiful advice. And you've gone deep into this. I know you and I have both run sessions. We've tag-teamed sessions on the videos to use in the sales process. So for folks who are tuning in that want to start doing this, they got a couple options. Obviously they can join us in the trenches inside RSA. And then I know some of our members are now working with you since this is newly available and you're you're beginning to, to do some one-on-one work and group work to support contractors through this. So to pass forward, join RSA. There's a link in the description. Or Cody, what's a good way for folks who are interested in hiring you to get in touch?

They join RSA, they can obviously message me in there. They can also email me at just Cody@reimaginyoursales.com. And then just if it's something that they're interested in, I have the one-on-one options, but I will be doing a Digital Dollar Bootcamp. Coming up, which is like 25 contractors, a 6-week course. And it's group training, small group training with deliverables each week that you build it over the course of the 6 weeks. And then, you know, we launch it after those 6 weeks. So all those options available. And then obviously the recordings and RSA, just a wealth of knowledge with all of this stuff as well.

Awesome. Cody, thanks for being here with me today. And if you enjoyed this video and you want to learn more how to use video in the sales process, Jump into this very next one. We'll show you exactly what to make, what to say, and when to send it. We'll see you soon.