How To Talk Yourself Up (Without Turning People Off)

AI is transforming the world. And it starts with the right compute. ARM is the AI compute platform trusted by global leaders. Proudly NASDAQ listed, Built for the future. Visit arm.com discover.

Welcome to the hbr ideacast from harvard business review. I'm alison beard. By now most of us know that doing good work isn't always enough to.

Get you ahead in your career.

Colleagues and bosses need to recognize what you're accomplishing for it to really matter. Hopefully they notice on their own.

But you can't count on that.

Which means you need to learn how to self promote. I know what some of you are thinking right now.

Ugh.

Ick. I hate people who brag about themselves.

I can't imagine doing it myself. Other listeners might have the opposite reaction.

You're saying, actually I'm pretty good at letting people know about all the amazing things I've done.

And you're probably the ones that everyone else hates. So where is the happy medium? How can those nervous about self promotion get better at it? And how can natural braggarts find more subtle ways to showcase themselves? Our guest today has answers. She's studied all the different ways people draw attention to their own achievements and figured out which are most effective. Leslie John is a professor of Business Administration at Harvard Business School and the author of the HBR article Savvy Self Promotion. Leslie, thanks for coming to the show.

Thanks for having me.

So how did you get interested in self promotion?

Well, if I'm honest, it's because I was a little tired of rolling my eyes at people just shamelessly self promoting themselves. And I with social media it feels like it's even more rampant and it's just such a cringe worthy behavior. And I also think that, you know, in a way I feel sorry for those that are, that are so blatantly self promoting because it's not helpful to them either. So I wanted to write a piece that I kind of unofficially call a Canadian's Guide to Bragging. Being a Canadian to kind of help people juggle this balance, this kind of communication dilemma that we face when we're trying to self promote. That is we, you know, we want to convey our strengths and our accomplishments. We want people to be aware of them. But the bind is that when we do that, we often come across as egotistical, inconsiderate, insecure. And the thing is these negative inferences that people have, they, they can even get in the way of what you're trying to do in the first place. Because bragging doesn't even always work. It doesn't even always make you seem more competent.

Why is blatant bragging so bad? Because sometimes it seems like the people who self promote in pretty obvious ways do get ahead.

It works for them.

The studies that have looked at whether self promotion actually pays off, they actually point a, I would say mixed at best picture on whether it's effective. So when we look at actually controlled experiments, for example, where people are asked to, for example, read a transcript from a job interview, and in one of the transcripts the person is super forthcoming about promoting themselves even when not solicited, and another person is more humble, raters actually rate the person who is more humble as someone they would rather work with, but also someone who is potentially going to be a better fit for the job. So it doesn't even necessarily pay off all the time to self promote. That's not to say that it's not important that others are aware of our successes. It absolutely is important for others to know about them. But I think there's a lot more subtlety to how we should communicate that.

Knowing that humility is a trait that people value, what's the argument against just putting your head down and doing good work and expecting it to be recognized?

Well, so my kind of general advice is just that is to kind of nose to the grindstone, earn recognition through consistent performance. And you're not going to always be recognized for every single thing you do. And I think we shouldn't have that expectation, but rather over time, if we're patient, chances are our successes and our performance and our contributions will be recognized. Now, that being said, I want to immediately qualify it, and I don't want to sound trite in suggesting that because there are some very real barriers that people face to being recognized. One prime example of that is there are biases in our perceptions of people's contributions to projects so underrepresented minorities, for example. It's sad but true that we tend to under under attribute positive successes to them. So there are some real thorny things that get in the way. But my kind of general advice is I think we should be less concerned with having to self promote. We need to find a way to have our successes be conveyed. But I think that there are more successful ways to convey successes than us kind of blatantly sharing them unsolicited. And so in this piece that I've been trying to walk people through, situations where self promotion is effective and sometimes in some cases, actually if we don't self promote, we can suffer negative consequences. So sometimes self promotion is expected and if we don't do it, then that's a problem.

All right, so let's talk about trying to solve the problem or walk the line. You first in the article address some strategies that people use that don't work at all. You know, one example is the humble brag, which you say is awful. So explain what that term means for those who don't know and then tell us why it does not work.

Right. So in the lead in, when you said some of us are really, we're really good at self promotion and I would say some of us think we're really good at self promotion because it turns out that some of our mental models about how to self promote are deeply flawed. That is to say that sometimes our intuitions on how to, how to kind of walk the line, as you say, between showcasing our strengths without coming across as obnoxious, some of our intuitions on how to do that are completely off. One example of that is the humble brag, which is some fascinating research that's led by Oval Sasser at unc. A humble brag is a brag that's cloaked in a complaint or a statement of modesty or humility. So it's the kind of thing that once you're aware of what humble bragging is, it's like everywhere. You notice it all the time. So like just the other day, for example, a colleague said, oh, you know, I was bored, so I wrote a book that's a complaint based humble brag. Right? It's like complaining, oh, I hate being bored. But the real brag is of course, writing a book. Another one would be something like, oh, it's really hard being the only one the boss trusts. And then one based on modesty would be something like, you know, I just, I can't believe I got a top performance review. Totally unexpected. You're trying to take the edge off with modesty. But the thing is in, in these beautiful controlled studies where Ovul and her co authors have looked at how you come across when you do that, it turns out that you come across worse when you do that relative to if you just did an outright brag. So it would be better to say I got a top performance review than to cloak it in this kind of false humility.

There's another funny term that you used, which I hadn't heard before. Boomer asking.

So Boomer asking is like, it's a little bit of complex thing where it's not that complex. You're trying, if you want to convey that you just got let's say you qualified for the Boston Marathon. And you, you realize that, you know, just to say that outright is too abrasive, it's too braggy. So then you ask your people that you know, run, you ask them, oh, have you been running much? How's the running going? And so you ask them questions that hone in on the topic that you want to talk about, the thing that you want to brag about so that you kind of manipulate them into. Then as a good conversational partner, they're going to ask you how your running is going. And then you, then you kind of get to, oh, just, I happen to qualify for the Boston Marathon. As if it's like this unplanned, unpremeditated brag. Right.

Funny you should ask me.

Exactly, exactly.

Right.

That doesn't work either, because people are onto you.

Right. Okay, so what are some better ways to self promote?

So the general advice I would give is, well, if in doubt, probably don't self promote. But the times when it's socially appropriate and sometimes socially expected. And so let's go through those. One is when you're asked directly. So imagine you're in a job interview and the interviewer asks you, what are some of your strengths? And you say, oh, I prefer not to say. Right. So that's a terrible thing to do. We've got lots of research, including some of my own, on how when you refuse to answer questions, it makes you come across as untrustworthy, as shady. So it's important if someone asks you directly that you convey that you answer the question and you convey your strengths.

And I think people are used to doing that in job interview settings. But should we be more attuned to opportunities that might arise sort of in the everyday workday, in conversations with colleagues and bosses?

Yeah. So another example would be if you follow the following, the conversational norm of kind of reciprocation or matching. So if someone reveals something that they've accomplished, you in turn can reciprocate and reveal something that you've accomplished. So reciprocation is a strong conversational norm. We expect people, when we reveal something, we expect them, if only implicitly, to reveal something that's kind of similar in return. And so it's kind of safer to do it in that context.

With that one, though, how do you avoid a sense of one upsmanship?

Yeah. And so you don't want it to devolve into that there you can look to other conversational tools to grab control of the conversation. For example, you can share your success but then you can also end with another question that shifts topics so that you can. That turns you away from getting into this battle of the braggarts in a way.

And then in settings like a conversation with your boss where they say, what are you working on? Should you have, you know, talking points or a little speech ready about all you've achieved?

So no, in the like starkest way. Right. I'm envisioning how that would play out. And I think in many cases when you just kind of volunteer these hyper quantified proof points of how great you are, this is kind of gets into the problem again where you're perceived as a little bit obnoxious in doing that. But I do think there's very much merit in what you're saying where you want to have a sense of, in your mind of what the kind of the key contributions that you're making to the team are. So that when the conversation naturally shifts to something where it's appropriate to share that you have those kind of at the tip of your tongue. You don't want to be scripted about it though, because I think there you run into the usual problems where like this person is obnoxious and possibly even insecure for doing this. So general, there's lots of context. There are some contexts where it's expected. So for example, on LinkedIn, LinkedIn, everybody kind of knows that this is for job seekers. And so we are more accepting of some degree of promoting yourself, of conveying your successes and your accomplishments. In fact, if you didn't in that context, it may again seem a bit weird or counter normative to not share. Another thing I was thinking about in coming into this interview of the problem of like how, you know, some people are more naturally conveying their successes and even if we don't like them for it, at the end of the day, they are conveying the information in a way that those who are more humble are not. And so I think that organizations can work to formalize or institutionalize the sharing of your accomplishments. So for example, some companies have every year, instead of having the performance review, just be your supervisor telling you how they thought you did. As input to that conversation, they'll have the employee, you know, fill out, describe what their contributions have been. And so the kind of a formalized way of doing this, which I think is helpful in leveling the playing field.

When we talk about giving people feedback, we talk about, you know, the sandwich where you say something good and then something negative and then something good. Can that work in self promotion too? In that you're not just talking about everything that's terrific about yourself and what you've done, but also acknowledging a bit of weakness.

Yeah. So acknowledging some weaknesses, not terrible, damning weaknesses, but real weaknesses, can make your strengths alongside your strengths, can make those strengths more credible and really make them shine. So for example, a leader who says, you know, I'm sometimes nervous about public speaking alongside some strengths, then it makes those strengths kind of pop more, if you will. And one of the reasons is that it just, it makes the person more credible, more human. It's kind of like one of my guilty pleasures is reading gossip magazines and there's this section, stars, they're just like us. And so it's kind of refreshing. I will say that you have to be careful. And this strategy works well for people who have been kind of unambiguously successful, people who are, for example, leaders in firms. It's a lot more risky. If you're kind of an unproven newbie in the field, then I wouldn't advise doing that.

And for those of us who just are really uncomfortable with any kind of self promotion, is it okay to sort of make it about the broader team or group or does that just really diminish the effect?

Yeah, that's a bit tricky, right? Because to your point, it diminishes the amount that you personally get credit. I mean, my personal view is that the kind of the long game here, the better long game, is to not just emphasize your contributions, but also those of the team because it makes you look good too, if the people around you are thriving. And I think that that's perfect. Segue into another point I wanted to make with this piece, which is that it's not all on you to promote yourself. I want to kind of liberate especially those of us who are less comfortable self promoting, which I personally think is a virtue. But I want to liberate those of us who feel that way from feeling as though we need to do it ourselves. In fact, in many cases it's more compelling if your successes are conveyed by someone else. So there's research, for example, on how when someone else, for example, a mentor or a recruiting agent, speaks on your behalf about what your strengths, then that information on your strengths is actually more credible than if you were to say it yourself. You want to also pay it forward and be thinking about who you can promote. I think sometimes people think of praise and conveying strength as zero sum, where if I promote someone else, then it's going to take away from me, but it's actually, on the contrary, there's also amazing research on how if you promote someone else, if you talk positively about someone else, then that actually spills over on people's perceptions of you too.

I'm curious as to how this advice translates across different organizations that might have different norms related to self promotion, and then also across countries and cultures. Some places where there's sort of a more communal culture, it might seem very strange for someone to talk about their own accomplishments. So how do you navigate that variety?

Yes. So in the absence of having a lot of research on this important question, what I would say is be very sensitive to the context. Right. So just as I'm saying, follow conversational norms, share when asked. It's safer when others are sharing. You want to be sensitive to the context and the culture you're operating with. So if you are in a workplace that people are more humble by default, you want to kind of dial yourself back a little bit to match that where appropriate. On the other hand, if you're in more of a bravado culture, then it's, it's probably safer to be a bit forthcoming. So be very sensitive to the context.

Are the rules different depending on your gender or race, based on what people are expecting of you? We know there's still so much unspoken bias out there. So do people of color and women, for example, have to walk a finer line than minority than majority group people?

Might have to, yes. So sadly, the answer is yes. So for women, for example, when women outright convey their successes, they are penalized more than when men do it. And by penalized, I mean they're perceived as more arrogant, more egotistical, more insecure, less likable, and so on. Why is that the case? It's probably because a woman self promoting goes against our kind of societal though it's changing refreshingly slowly but surely instinct on how a woman quote unquote should behave. I'm aggressively using air quotes because that's of course not how it ought to be, but that's just kind of how it is. And so unfortunately, I think women need to be particularly sensitive to these things because we face, I think, bigger penalties when we violate norms of what's expected.

One other thing about this current moment of 21st century work life is that, you know, we're all in various stages of working at home, probably moving to hybrid environments. So how do you do all of this over zoom? Is it much more difficult?

Yeah, I mean, I think that it is harder because it's harder to be cognizant of Contextual and conversational cues. On Zoom, it's more impoverished. Just like social media is kind of impoverished relative to. In person.

You can still do it, but just be more careful.

Yeah, I think you can still. You can still do it, but. But just be more careful. And you have to, you know, really be paying attention. So let's. So. So don't be multitasking on. On Zoom, because you're already in a impoverished environment. And then if you're distracted, that makes it even harder to pick up on some of the more subtle cues.

And what can organizations do to make sure that people who might feel a little bit uncomfortable promoting themselves have opportunities to do it? So what can I, as a team leader do? What can I, as the HR department do?

So as a team leader, I think you want to make sure that you are actively soliciting both from your employees and their colleagues. You're soliciting information not just on their points of improvement, but also on their strengths. So you want to get the information to surface. You want to solicit it. And one way that I think organizations can really do that is to formalize the solicitation process. So some companies for performance reviews, they elicit from the employee themselves. They elicit the employee's sense of what their accomplishments are. So it's not simply the manager evaluating the employee, but the employee is giving input, is given an opportunity to formally brag, so to speak. Right. And we know that when these things are formalized, when we're directly asked to share our successes, then it's acceptable to do that, and we should do that. So it kind of levels the playing field, I think, for people who are more reserved in conveying their successes, and for people who, you know, underrepresented minorities who may be understandably reluctant to share.

Is this really just about the individual and how we all can enhance our careers, or is there a broader benefit, you know, if we all get better at self promotion, is that actually gonna help our teams and our companies?

Yeah, I think that there is a broader benefit to it. I mean, if you just think of how the kind of interpersonal costs, if we just take the interpersonal costs of bragging. So to the bragger, the bragger, when you're not bragging properly, when you're doing it in a taboo way. We talked about these penalties you experience, you're viewed as less likable, inconsiderate, and so on, but also the people on the receiving end, it makes them feel badly. It can instill envy, jealousy. And so there's a Lot of cost involved with that. Hard to quantify. But if we are better able to navigate this or walk the line between when it's too much and maybe when it's not enough. In those cases, I talked about where it's actually expected.

That reminds me of another point of advice. You talk about celebrating in the right way. And for example, when something really great happens to me at work, I just call my mom because I know it's okay to brag to your mom.

Exactly.

So talk a little bit more about how people can celebrate in the right way.

Yeah. So you really want to milk your successes. You want to get the most hedonic value out of them that you can. And one way you can do that is by reliving them. So I keep a. It's literally called in my. Oh, look, a Warm Fuzzies. I have a Warm Fuzzies folder. And so whenever I get a really positive email, I put it in the Warm Fuzzies. And then on rainy days, I look through the Warm Fuzzies folder and I. And I reread them, and it always lifts my mood.

My folder is called Praise.

Yeah, it's a great thing to do. It also reminds me of an important point, which is when you say you like telling your mom about your successes. There's some really amazing research by Emma Levine, Annabel Roberts, and Ovil Slayser on how. On hiding your successes. And it's about how sometimes our instinct, especially with close others, is to not reveal our successes. So we may feel, for example, imagine we get a promotion at work, and we don't tell our bestie that because we're worried that, oh, it'll maybe make them feel badly. Well, it turns out that if we hide our successes from our people who are really close to us, that are really rooting for us, that can actually be harmful for our relationships. And the reason is that if you think about it, you think like, you know, why didn't this person. Why didn't my bestie tell me about the promotion? Does she think I can't handle it? Does she think I'm that insecure? Right. So it kind of makes the friend feel that way, and it can kind of harm the relationship. So you really do want to share your successes. You want to brag. Your instinct to call your mom is exactly right. You want the people that are close to you. You want to tell them. You actually want to unsolicited. You want to share your successes with them.

Terrific. Well, Leslie, thank you so much for all that advice on how to brag better. Hopefully I'll start putting it into practice.

Wonderful. Thank you.

That's Leslie John, professor of Business Administration at Harvard Business School. She's also the author of the article Savvy Self Promotion. You can find it in the May June 2021 issue of Harvard Business Review or at hbr.org. This episode was produced by Mary Dew. We get technical help from Rob Eckart. Adam Buchholz is our Audio Product Manager. Thanks for listening to the hbr ideacast. I'm alison beard.