Adam O'Leary: How to Convert More SaaS Users Using Video Reviews # 172

This episode is sponsored by ShoutOut, a 2-way text messaging and campaign management platform that provides analytics and facilitates conversational messaging that delivers, engages, and converts more. Send personalized campaigns from unique phone numbers to the message content itself, letting you brand your campaign to promote yourself and create your messages in a way that users are made to think you sent it personally for them. You can then monitor and improve your campaigns over time with real-time analytics. Start reducing messaging and campaign costs with cost-effective effective bulk SMS. Scale efficiently without having to worry about high costs. If you'd like to start using mass texting services with simple packages to choose from, visit getshoutout.com today. Hello everyone, this is your host, Akeel Jabbar, and welcome back to another episode of SaaS District.

In today's episode, we'll be talking about how to convert more of your SaaS users using video reviews. Today we have our guest, Adam O'Leary, joining us. Adam is the co-founder of TrustScout, a video testimonial capture tool that helps their customers get video reviews in a fast, simple, and automated way. Originally developed for agency white label, e-commerce, and SMBs, TrustScout helps clients increase their sales conversions, social media management, And SEO ranking. So Adam is, more importantly, he's a good friend of mine. I've known him for over, I think, almost 6 years now. So I think this will be a fun episode. We haven't— it's been a while. Um, good catching up, man. Good to see you again.

Dude, I'm looking forward to this. Great to be here and, uh, really looking forward to finally being on the podcast. I know we've been talking about it for like almost a year now.

I know, I know. I'm glad we could finally find some time between, you know, partying in Mexico City and, and, uh, you know, getting back to— looks like, uh, you know, back to business. We got some time. Let's, let's, let's do this. So Yeah, I'm excited. You know, you've been working at this company Trust Scout. You guys, you know, co-founded this between, you know, Dan and I think Heather at the time. So you guys got, you know, small team. We've worked together, you know, years ago. You know, people listening in got a good relationship with Adam and he went out and built this amazing company Trust Scout where you guys are now working with over like 1,200 businesses. I'd love to hear, man, just, you know, we haven't— you haven't told me this, you know, outside of this podcast. Like, walk me through what are the steps like if I'm, you know, from first contact all the way to a finished video? And then from there, like, where do you even publish this? Like, how do I get the most impact if I want to, if I want to, you know, run this myself?

Yeah, absolutely. So just for everybody who doesn't have any background, so yeah, Akeel and me, we've gone ahead, worked together for quite a little bit of time, especially back a couple years ago, 6, 5, like 4, 5, and 6 years ago, I think it was that we were working pretty closely. And I was working inside of a SaaS company at the time, and I ended up branching off to start an agency up. And I started working with all sorts of different clients and even some of the same clients that Akeel was working with at the time. And one of the things that I was doing is I was going and writing copy and really focused on helping those software companies, those SaaS companies be able to convert more of their users. So convert more of the leads into actual paying users, which we ended up when we were doing our high-level like research of a lot of the initial companies that we were doing, we realized that about 96% of the leads would not actually turn into paying customers. And to me, this almost was like dumbfounding because I was just like, wait, we have 96 out of every 100 users who isn't turning into a paying client. So I ended up going ahead and I called a bunch of different users from these different SaaS companies that I was working with, and I wanted to figure out why people were not converting. Like, what was it? Was it they were going to competitors? Was it they just got bored, or they were doing like quick research, and they just weren't in the market yet. And one of the big things that we started to find on a pretty consistent basis was sometimes it would be— actually, a lot of the times it would be like, ah, okay, we didn't go with this one. I chose this other alternative. I say, well, why did you do that? And they say, well, it seems like it's a better fit for me. And I kept hearing this same statement over and over and over. It's a better fit for me. So I started then asking the question of like, what What do you mean by a better fit? Like, how did you determine that it's a better fit? Because basically software A was the exact same thing as software B. There was almost no difference at all.

Right.

And the more that I started to find out was that people would usually go ahead and they'd connect with, say, a testimonial, or they would connect with a specific angle that the business was showcasing up front. This kind of took me by surprise because it seemed like such a quick and simple fix that I went ahead and the SaaS company I was working with at that time, I said, okay, great. Can we get like a bunch of different, like all of the different testimonials that you have? So this way we can kind of create some different angles or say, hey, it's a perfect fit for this type of a user. Just go and look at this. And the crazy thing was, is that there was no testimonials. There was very few written testimonials. And there was no video testimonials. So I started going ahead and researching this a little bit more and saying, okay, wait a minute, let's go in and try to go get some of these testimonials. So the manual process that I did was I would reach out to all of their users. I would have to hop on a call with them, the ones that actually responded back. I would need to figure out what they were like, what they liked about the software. I'd be like, great, can you take your phone and record this video for me? And then just shoot me a message. You can send it to me on email or WhatsApp or wherever you want to go and send me. And after me jumping on like 50 different calls or something like that, I think I got like 2 or 3 videos back of me spending all of this time. And I was like, this is just clinically insane. Like, this should be way easier. So I went ahead and I made a tool. It was for us internally to be able to work with our different SaaS clients that we were working with. And it didn't have a name at the time. It was just, here's an easy way to go collect it. So what happens is you just copy a link. You send it out to your users via an email blast or social media blast, whatever you want to do, text messages, anything. And once the user clicks on that, it gives them 3 questions that you're basically asking them to answer. Guidance questions is what we refer to it as. They record the video, they type their name, their email, they say, okay, you can use my, my face for marketing and stuff like that. And it's done. Like it's all taken care of right from there. So now you have their whole dashboard with all of the different videos. And this drastically increased how fast we were able to go and collect. I didn't have to do any more manual calls or anything along those lines, which was one of my favorite things. So now we can go and use those video reviews for things such as on our sales pages. A lot of the times we make wall of loves is what we refer to it as, like just a page of all the video testimonials. We'll put it inside of our checkout pages too. And especially if we're doing high-ticket sales, which some of the SaaSs that we were working with were doing, $10K, $20K type of sales, we would create or we'd send specific testimonials based on who that user was. So if that person was trying to go and work with a, I don't know, for example, they were trying to work with a marketing agency, then you would send the testimonials of other marketing agencies that have had success with the platform.

Mm-hmm.

Or if you're going ahead and you're reaching out to, I don't know, ticketing services, for example, then you would send the ticketing services testimonials and that would help us drastically increase those conversions.

Got it. Yeah, it sounds like in every relationship or whether you call it a product or a person, there's generally 2 things that people will want to do business with. It's like there's competence and then there's trust, right? So it seems like you found this company, it's like 2 similar products. They have the exact same features. So, you know, they're competent, they'll do the job. And then they go towards, they call it fit, but really it's just like something gave them that, that ability to feel that trust that this company is better. And it seems like those videos enhances that, like, okay, that gives more comfort. Like maybe there's more trust in this company because all these other people are saying it, right? The social proof. And yeah, there's a lot of power into that, right?

Exactly. And I mean, it increases the conversion rates quite drastically. Like I would encourage anybody who's listening to this just to test a page that has only written reviews on it and then another page where you throw one to a few different video reviews and just do a split test. Just do an A/B test. Like you don't, you don't have to try to use my software if you don't want to, but just go and do a split test right away, just so you can like visually see the results. When we went ahead and we did the conversions, like we did the split test for it. I mean, our conversions drastically increased when we threw a video on the page.

Hmm.

When we were running a Facebook ad campaign, you see other companies, so such as Unbounce, Unbounce went ahead and they did it for a lead opt-in, a lead magnet that they were doing. And they wanted to test written versus video. And they got a 25% boost or 25% lift in conversions when putting the video on the page. So I would just encourage anybody, just try it. I mean, it's a fast, easy way to increase your conversions.

Yeah. Do you have any other data, like, to kind of see that, like, with what you've seen? So why video and why written? What is the impact, do you think, of, like, why video is more impactful or increases conversion versus, you know, like, reading a bunch of Google reviews? I usually read that and it seems to work, or Yelp or whatever, right?

Yeah, and I think it just depends on what type of business you're doing. Like, if you're doing a local business, then of course, Google Reviews, I mean, you can't even compete. I mean, Google Reviews are so critical for local types of businesses. But if you're selling a SaaS or something like that, like, you can't really go ahead and use Google My Business, for example. Instead, what you would be looking at is you're probably looking at more like Trustpilot or those types of things.

Right.

Now, one of the downsides that we've seen of written, just from our personal experience, Is that if you throw like Hotjar or whatever on a page, just, just go look at whatever you're using to track your users on your pages. You'll see a lot of the times when they hit those written reviews, they're, they're not going and reading those written reviews like entirely. Like you'll see they skim right past it. And God forbid if you just throw up a logo or some random stock image looking thing of the person's face. People always just skim right past it. Like, go look at your Hotjar right now and you're going to know exactly what I'm talking about. The cool part with video is that people click on videos and now they can click on the video. And even if they're scrolling through the page, they're listening to this person or multiple people sharing their experience. So you're almost kind of like selling them in the background too, which is something that you can't get out of written. And that to me is, I believe, the reason why there's a lift in conversions is because, yeah, in the video or as opposed to like the video and the written, it could say word for word verbatim, but it's just a matter of somebody actually hearing those words is the big difference there.

And then if you're thinking about like the entire buyer's journey, you mentioned one place is you put them on your sales material, you have that wall you put in, and then sometimes in the checkout page. Where else is it like, you know, super critical that You know, by looking at that, they're going to improve conversions in that stage. So, you know, is it your homepage you're putting this? Is it in, you know, even after they close, are you sending this like, you know, after they pay you, it's like, here, hold on, there's more we got to show you, like how good we are. Or like, you know, where's the best part here that you want to focus on?

Yeah, I think there would be 2 different areas. So the first part is when somebody's coming through. A lot of people, so like when somebody is trying to make the decision to become a user of yours or whatever, For us, we love running retargeting ads with video testimonials in them. For us, it's been a huge, huge win for us because, I mean, I mean, we're, we're just going ahead, we're targeting people with exactly what they need to hear in order to make that decision, and they're not hearing it from us, which is key. They're hearing it from another user who's just like them, who's going and doing it. And the second, like, way that we like to use it for when, when users are coming through is that wall of love that I was referring. In that wall of love, we'll usually put it inside of a follow-up email. If somebody's like, for example, an abandoned cart, and says, hey, listen, I see that you're on the fence. Don't just take it from us. Here's 100+ users who are using the platform who are sharing their thing. And it's just a little way to just kind of push somebody over the edge to make the decision. The second way that I've— that we personally use it in our business is that we will throw one, usually one or 2 videos inside of our onboarding sequence, and it's nothing crazy. What we actually do is we cut the clip, so we don't show like the full like 2-minute video testimonial. Instead, we will usually show a segment of that video clip or a couple of different ones. So I think in the video now we have 3 or 4 different testimonials that are cut into like 3 to 7-second marks. And it's nothing crazy, but the reason that we do that is we start the video by just saying like, hey, welcome to Trustpilot. You're going to be able to collect video reviews just like this. And then we're basically reselling them on why they just bought. And then right after that, we'll go ahead and say, okay, so here's how you can collect these types of video testimonials for yourself on autopilot. And then we show them. So what we're doing there is we're just reselling them. right away the second they come in on why they actually signed up. Because I feel like a lot of the, at least from us when we were doing our testing in the early days, and one of the reasons that we found that like 96% of users weren't converting is because they would go ahead, they'd go into the free trial or whatever, and then right away they would kind of forget why they signed up, like what that sales thing was. So we like to just slip one little thing in there to Let people know why they signed up again.

Yeah, that makes sense. So part of the onboarding process as well as what you're saying is it's important to actually—

Exactly.

Yeah. Remind them of what— why this tool is important. So I mean, on the other side of this platform, right? Like, so one is like, you know, getting people to use it, but then, you know, when people sign up and they want to— I'm a SaaS company. I want to start capturing these video reviews for myself so that I can start using it and using it for my sales and improve conversions. When is the best time to do that? Like, is it, you know, as soon as they sign up? Is it, you know, a month in, 2 months in, 6 months, 2 years? Who are you going to capture those?

Please don't do 2 years. The best time that we found to capture it is definitely the second that what we call is an aha moment. So the second that somebody has an aha moment with your business, and what I would encourage you to do right now is just go on to the App Store and find the top trending games that are on the App Store. This is how we discovered this method. What will happen is if you go to those, say, top 5 games, just download them, spend an hour just getting through the initial standpoint, you'll notice that the second that you get that dopamine rush, the good games, the ones that have thousands and thousands, like tens of thousands of reviews, right away, the second you get that dopamine rush, They'll say, hey, are you liking this game? Rate us on here. And then you click 5 stars and it takes you directly to the review. And it's ingenious.

Mm-hmm.

So what we did is we kind of stole that from the gaming world, because it really works well. And I think a lot of SaaS businesses especially, they don't go ahead and they don't recognize when the aha moment is for their user. So for us, when we create a software, so at Trust Scout, even If you were to go into Truska right now, you'll realize that within like 7 clicks of a button, you know exactly how to use the software. You know exactly what to do, and you've probably already done everything that you need to in order to use the software. So we like to make it very, very simple for somebody to kind of get that little dopamine rush and realize what that win is. So inside of your business, you need to look like— I would just go ahead, create a free account inside of your own SaaS. And at what moment is it when somebody goes, I get it. Okay. I understand the software now and I know how to use it. Like, that's the moment where you should go ahead and collect a review because it, it's in that moment when the customer's at that peak euphoria that they're pretty much ever going to be inside of your business.

Mm-hmm.

Um, and if you're running, for example, like an agency, I'm sure you have some like agencies that work with SaaS on here. The moment that you want to collect the video review is not after you've done the whole contract and all that type of stuff. What you want to do is you want to build usually a very quick win for that client in that first week period. I would say don't go longer than a week. So if you're doing like SEO, for example, outlining the different keywords that you're going to be placing inside of those scripts or whatever. Like, that's the first aha moment. That's when I would go ahead and start asking for a video review. Because the thing is, you can always ask multiple times for video reviews, but the key is to get right at that first dopamine rush, because that's when that user's gonna have that natural sound to them and it doesn't sound scripted. That's when you're gonna hear people say, oh, Akeel's the greatest person I've ever worked with. I couldn't believe how simple it was. And that's when you're going to hear like that tone kind of rising up as opposed to, Akeel, he's a good guy. I like working with him. It's been great. So like that's the difference of the video reviews that you get. Hopefully that makes sense.

No, it makes sense. So I think it's called like their time to value. The moment that they realize that time to value is like, okay, this is the moment you should trigger them and hit them with that, you know, reason to want to capture the testimonial. I guess, you know, so once you get to that point, I think generally that's going to be like in your— you know, you said a week, I think that seems good. You know, other, other companies like that are more built for enterprise, maybe like a month, uh, maybe longer sometimes. But okay, let's call it less than a month. And now you're like, within that 30-day period of after they sign up in that activation phase, what's the— how do you best approach them like to ask for that customer review? Do you say, hey, so like you've just, you know, used our widget and you successfully created this nice video, can you create record a video for us and here's $20 from Amazon. Or do you give them like a script too?

Like, because you want to make it as easy as possible too, right?

Like you ask them to like, oh, people, people get so like caught up in their head when you ask them for video. Like, yeah, no, what about lighting? What about my sound? How do I look? And they dress up and like, and then like they just over— get like overwhelmed and then like they just don't do it. And probably that's what happened of like 50 of those calls that you had. The only reason like 2 people do it, because most people just got like overwhelmed of like doing it. Um, so like do you give them like a script Do you tell them what to do? Do you give them some money? Like, how do you get them to like, you know, do it as easily and quickly as possible?

Yeah, absolutely. So there's 3 ways that you can go and do this. So the first way is if you're working with an enterprise client, I mean, you're working with like probably like a vice president or the head of marketing or somebody like that. That's probably the individual that you're talking to. You can't really automate that process. And enterprise sales is always Much more conversational, a much more relational type of approach. So if you are doing enterprise, I would wait for your next, or that onboarding call or the check-in call that you have, to ask that person to go ahead and record for you. Enterprise clients, I wouldn't say I'll buy— I'll do $20 for a coffee or something like that. Like, it just, you don't need to a lot of the times because I mean, enterprise clients, you should be probably like 6 or even 7-figure types of deals that they're not gonna get excited over a $10 gift card. So that's the first thing that I would say just for enterprise clients is usually a lot of the time they're willing to help you out because you've probably already made their life 10 times easier. So that's not really a worry. The second type of platform that I would say, so if it's a SaaS platform, Where the users are coming in through the door, whether it be your SEO tactics or your advertising tactics, where you're not having a conversation with them, there's 2 little tricks that you can use. So the first one that we like to use, almost like— we don't use Intercom, but I think that's the easiest way to reference it— like that little pop-up thing that appears. So once you know where your aha moment is, you can have that pop-up appear. at the exact moment of that aha that says like, hey, are you enjoying our software and want, you could say, a $10 gift card? If you would like to do that, you can totally go ahead and do that. Just quickly make a review for us and we'll happily give you a $10 gift card. Sure. And that'll get you quite a few users to go ahead and do that. The key is just that dopamine rush. The second little trick that we've seen work really well, and one that We're testing out now, so I don't have the data on it yet, but we are going to be testing it out. Is that— I have a gut feeling that yes, is the $10 gift card trick, is it worth it for somebody to go and make a quick review? Sure. But for me, I had somebody go ahead and send me a message just like that, and they wanted like a Trustpilot review. And it was like, I mean, it would have took me what, 45 seconds to go ahead and get a $10 Starbucks cup of coffee. And I chose not to do it just because it kind of slipped my mind. So what we're going to test out trying is instead of buying them a $10 cup of coffee or whatever, instead we're going to buy our development team a cup of coffee. So we'll say, hey, are you enjoying the platform and want to buy our developer a cup of coffee? Just quickly go here, make a little review, and we'll, we'll use the $10 to go ahead and do it. Because now they're doing it out of service as opposed to—

Mm-hmm.

Uh, their, their own, their own mentality or whatever.

Interesting. I'd be curious to see how that kind of, uh, that works.

I'm really excited for this.

So yeah.

Um, and then, and then I guess going back, what does that script look like?

Are you giving them the script or like, you know, okay, from, uh, like from a conversion perspective, what is like a video that you've seen, like if they follow ABC, um, you know, that's gonna lead to better conversions? Versus, you know, like just a crummy one that they put together?

Yes. So we give them 3 guidance questions that we map out for them. And a lot of the times too, like, well, I mean, we always are testing and changing the questions to figure out like what gets the best responses and things for us personally. And of course, for any business here, it's always going to change depending on who you're working with, what the market is, and those types of goodies. But really, we found that 3 guidance questions is the perfect thing, and we like to follow almost like a hero's journey. So if you think about like a drug commercial is the easiest way to think about it, like a drug commercial in the US, there's usually like, hey, are you feeling sad because you're bald now? And then all of a sudden, they'll go to the next part, it's like, take this magical pill. And then all of a sudden, there's like the next thing with like the guy throwing the frisbee with the dog, and he's all happy, he has all his hair, like, like that exact process. So that hero's journey works really, really well, especially for retargeting ads and things. And the reason for it is because Think about it. You're having people come ahead and let's just say, for example, somebody's coming ahead using your SaaS. Well, I was really struggling. I hired 4 virtual assistants to try to go ahead and help me collect video reviews initially. So when somebody goes ahead and says that problem right off the bat, somebody could say, oh, that's the same problem I'm having. And then I found Trustpilot. Okay, so bam, there's the solution. And then it goes right into the next part, which is like, and now I was able to let go of For the virtual assistants, and I'm able to capture video reviews, and it takes me literally zero time at all. Like, so right there, when somebody hears that, it doesn't need to be long. It could be 30 seconds of somebody just doing a very, very quick clip. When somebody says that and somebody hears that, now it's like, wait a minute, that's the same problem I'm having. So Trustpilot clearly is the perfect fit for me.

Got it.

So I guess at that point, you're really like highlighting the problem, like just making them feel the problem. And then you know kind of walk them through like all right there is a solution here look and look look at this guy he's happy now nice he took the magic pill he took the magic pill and here is your met yeah exactly awesome I love it man this has been good I mean I think I learned a lot here and I mean I had no idea about this you know how the power of video reviews are and I think we're going to try it out and use it within our own funnel do you guys integrate with like within HubSpot like to like trigger these things to go out as they Yeah, so we made it like super simple.

So we don't have any integrations because, I mean, we were thinking about doing it, but it's like, you'll see if you, once you go into Trust Scout, I mean, it's, you just copy a link and you can paste it anywhere. So there's really no integration that the only integration that we would make is like, click here to automatically add the link, but it's the same thing as just copying and pasting. So it didn't seem like worth it.

That makes sense. If it's, so if it's just one link and it works for your whole system, then yeah, you don't need to.

Correct. Yeah, you could use it with any CRM, any autoresponder, any text message software, social media, wherever you want to go ahead and use it.

Love it. Cool, man. Uh, yeah, lots— I'm sure lots of value here for people listening in. Uh, hopefully that was helpful and you guys start using it today. Check out, uh, Trust Builders. Um, so—

TrustScout.io.

Trust Builders. Sorry, because you have UpBuilders and TrustScout.io. Got confused between— um, all right, Adam, let's go towards the, the rapid-fire personal questions. Let's do it. You ready? We'll keep it under, under a minute each. All right, so, um, what's one activity you enjoy outside of work? Because I know work definitely gets you into flow, um, that gets you into flow state. So you can't say webinars and you can't say, you know, sales calls.

I would say the number one thing that gets me into a flow state is, uh, going on walks. Walks is definitely my go-to. Uh, once I go on a walk and if I'm throwing music, just kind of listening to music and I switch it up all the time. Sometimes I listen to tribal music, other times it'll be reggae or whatever. But just once I find that music, I kind of go on a walk and I come back and I come back and I have like a whole page of notes that I'll just go ahead and start writing down for me.

Nice. Um, what's one piece of advice you wish you had known and would tell your maybe 23-year-old self? Because, you know, you're still pretty young. How old are you now? 25 was too, too recent. So it'd be like 20 years ago.

Yeah, that'd be too recent. I would say if I had to tell myself one bit of advice, I would say right away I would have started reaching out to people who already knew like the process before instead of trying to figure it out. I feel like trying to research things on your own is the absolute least impactful way to make a difference in your career. It's just 10 times easier to find somebody who's already done it before. And be able to know what to do and what not to do.

Yeah, yeah, the wisdom, the power of the wisdom. Yeah. Um, what are some of the biggest challenges you're currently facing in order to continue to grow TrustCount? Meaning like, what's keeping you up at night these days?

Facebook keeps me up at these days. Facebook keeps the magic— yes, exactly, the magical random shutdowns for no reason, and then waiting 2 weeks to get your accounts back up and running. So that's, that's what keeps me up right now. Zucks is too busy playing in the metaverse to be able to help out any of the people spending money on Facebook.

Yeah, that's brutal. Yeah. How much of your business is tied to that? Like probably a good amount. Like you're—

I mean, it's not like, it's not the vast majority of it, but I mean, it is, it's probably about 20% or so. Uh, so it's just annoying.

Okay. Makes sense. Who are— what are the best 3 resources? It can be, you know, books, mentors, or people you follow in the space who you'd say have been the most instrumental to your success over these last few years.

Okay, that's a loaded question. I would say the book I like the most is The 10X Rule, I would say, by Grant Cardone. I really, really love that book because it gets you into a different mindset. I guess you kind of think that you're doing well until you realize you're not. So I would say that would be my favorite book. And I'd say people that I've listened to a lot, I really like Russell Brunson's podcast. I forget the name of it, honestly, but it's a really, really good one. I listen to that quite often. And then the last one is I listen to— oh my God, I can't believe it's called The Daily Stoic.

Okay.

I forget the guy's name who does that. For me, that's really helpful because it's It helps kind of keep me grounded outside of work because I feel like your mental health is equally as important as your work life. If you have unbalance there, it'll damage both.

Yeah, definitely. I guess that kind of ties to the next question, which is, what does success mean to you today? So this could be either personally, this could be business, could be financially, it can just be life in general and your stasis Or, you know, there's no right answer. How do you define it today?

Yeah. For me, it's not having to worry about, I guess, finances at all. So, for me, I'm a huge traveler. I travel crazy. Like, we just went ahead and planned out a whole Euro trip and Middle Eastern trip for this year. So, I'm really, really excited. To me, it's less about trying to hit numbers and I would say more about being able to consistently grow the company while minimizing the amount of time that I have in the company. Uh, to be able to actually go and enjoy travel, to go scuba diving in crazy places, to be able to go skydiving. Like, that's, that's what I really love. So.

So it sounds like it's like optimizing your time to be like, you know, well-balanced, where like you're making a difference in your, in your, you know, work world, and then you're able to go out and like adventure and do all these fun things at the same time.

Correct. Yeah. Like always increasing the bottom line, trying to get that 20% growth that we're always looking for, but not tying that 20% growth to my time personally.

So that's, that's a, that's a very— I mean, if you can do that, I mean, most people get like bogged down, right? It's like, oh, we don't hit our goal, I'm not gonna go have fun. Like, now my external world is like miserable. But like, you're able to separate that cleanly. That's, that's awesome.

Yeah, no, I don't do that. No, if I'm— if I have plans to go somewhere, I am going somewhere to make it happen. Like, and then I'll pay it, I'll pay it back when I get back. Like, for example, we just went to Puerto Escondido, uh, the other day. And that was an incredible time, but the thing is the internet's not the best there, so we definitely had kind of a dampen the amount of time that I worked. So what do I do? It's just the next week when I'm not doing anything crazy where I am now, I just kind of double up my workload and just trade it like that.

Yeah, yeah, makes sense. Love it, man. This has been good, Adam. Where can, you know, SaaS founders or marketers listening in, where can they get in touch with you, learn more about you?

Yeah, they can go ahead to trustscout.io to go ahead and take a look at the software, go play around with it, collect some video reviews for yourself. And I'm telling you guys, really just go ahead and just test a split test with a page with a video review on it versus none. You'll see an instant little lift in your conversions. So yeah, thank you so much, Akeel, for having me on.

Thank you, Adam. All right, we'll add that to the show notes, guys. Check out trustscout.io. Thanks, man. Good catching up.

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