How to Get Your Ideas Heard

You're listening to Access to Anyone, the podcast that reveals how you can get to know anyone you want in business and in life using everything from the latest technology to the most time tested principles. All right, welcome back to Access to Anyone. This is Michael Schein and I'm Michael Roderick. And we are honored, privileged, thrilled to be here today with Alyssa Cohn, who we both know. I think Michael Roderick has known you longer than me, but we were instant friends.

Fast friends.

Fast friends. Maybe not instant, but fast at least. And you know, it's really interesting sometimes we have a guest on the show who, I mean, everyone's a great relationship builder who comes on the show. Everyone knows how to get access to the people they want to get access to. But we like to get people on the show who have an interesting occupation. And Alyssa Cohn does. And the title of her occupation is of a field that has a lot of people working in it. And it's an executive coach. And when you first hear that, you think there's a lot of executive coaches out there. But she's turned it into something brand new. She has really taken this field and gone somewhere else with it. So I'd love for you to explain what you do and how it's so different than what a lot of us think of as coaches.

Okay, sure. Well, first of all, it's really a pleasure and it's my honor to be here. So thank you so much. This is super fun to be able to do this with you guys. So I am an executive coach. Specifically, I work with CEOs of startups. And if you think about what I do with these startups, I help them improve their leadership capacity. So that really means about helping somebody get to be a better, stronger leader for a company which starts as a product and then turns into a really small company with like 8 people to 20 people to 50 people to 500 people. And the idea is that you have to be a different leader in every aspect of that to help scale the company. And that's what I work with my CEOs on.

And see, what I find so fascinating about this is that when you think of an executive coach, I think what most people do, they think of somebody at who's brought in by a mega company to give polish to their executives. Right. So, you know, you've got these executives and maybe they have an anger problem or maybe they have the exact opposite. They don't know how to speak up, or maybe they don't know how to get their points across. And you bring in a coach and they go through exercises and they polish. What you've done though is, is you've entered this wild and woolly world of startups, which has a lot of upside, a lot of downside and a lot of challenges you don't see in other places. So why did you choose that field?

Well, I think two reasons. First of all, my true love and my first love was with startups. Way back in the day after business school, I was a strategy consultant at PricewaterhouseCoopers. And when I woke up one day and I just realized this is not it and I had to go seek out what is it? And I realized I want to make a difference. And I discovered two things at that time. Actually two things at the same time. I discovered coaching. Like, wow, what's that? I want to do that. And I also discovered the startup world. So I was pretty young to be a coach. And also I hadn't taken training, so I took coach training and I was the CFO of one startup and the head of strategy of another startup. And let me tell you, that was it. It was such a great fit for me. In terms of your ability to be unstructured, to grab leadership opportunities and to sort of structure things which are not yet structured. And, and then I would just add that especially these days, there's a huge understanding that first time founders, first time CEOs, often first time leaders, first time they've ever managed, anybody need support and guidance to be able to do that. And without that they are much more apt to fail. With that, they are much more apt to be successful.

So let's actually talk about one of the challenges of access specifically within the startup world. A lot of people want to work with startups and often they'll focus on the CEO as the person that they want to work with. But these CEOs are, they're constantly being approached, they're constantly dealing with all sorts of fires that they have to put out. So how did you go about really being able to get on the radar of a CEO who is always being pitched, they're always being sold something. What was your technique when you first got started in that space to be able to be heard in such a crowded world?

Yeah, it's a fantastic question. And I especially like you saying that CEOs are always being pitched and frankly a lot of people are always being pitched. It's so accurate. And the way I think about the work that I do is I really don't think about pitching. I truly believe that I add a lot of value and like I'm not interested in going to a situation to pitch. I'm interested in going to a situation to add tremendous value within 20 minutes. That's my theme song. That's what I have in the back of my head. Always and forever. So initially I met. He was fairly seasoned, but he was just about to take over the. The COO role of a certain company. And I really liked him. We met at a social event. We really connected, and I wasn't that focused on really working with him. I was focused on let's get to know each other. You might be too even new to even think about coaching or to think about what you might want out of a coaching experience. That's okay. I think that I could be helpful to you. And oh, by the way, I like to talk about startups and I'd like to hear your experience of how you're doing. We met for coffee or lunch almost for a year before he had any interest in or any sort of opportunity to introduce me into the company. Once he did, the CEO and all the executives there started working with me again because they saw what I could add to them.

So that leads me to another question about really why we asked you on this show. I mean, the show is access to anyone. And you are really tremendous at not only getting access to what Malcolm Gladwell calls super connectors, but making them really happy that they know you. So, I mean, I met you at an event, a book signing of Dori Clark, who is the uber super connector.

Look at all of us here.

The universe revolves, you know, around her. Although she would never say that.

Right.

My understanding is that you're pretty well connected with one of the premier coaches in the world, right? Marshall Goldsmith.

That's right.

And you're connected with Michael, who humbly, I can say humbly because he's my co host, is one of those people. So I guess, A, how do you do it? And B, what does it do for your business?

It's an interesting question when you say, how do you do it? That's a very interesting question, I think. You know, and Michael, I'd love to hear your thoughts on this too. I would say that it's really helpful to believe that connecting is a good thing and that connecting others, and I personally get a charge out of connecting others and of adding value. And in particular, when I'm able to add value to some situation or some person, like in my head, I kind of think, there, that's done. Like, okay, good, I fixed that teeny tiny part of the world. So I Think a lot about that. And I guess I think that when I reach out to people, we're all going to be the better for it. I believe that I have resources to offer people by way of, you know, kinds of connections or ideas or kind of thought partnership. And then I would also say that I enjoy it. I don't mind reaching out to various different kinds of people. And I try to be available to my network. I don't know. Michael Rodrick, I'd really love to hear your thoughts on that.

I think you're dead on. I mean, I think that if it's exciting to you to connect, what tends to happen is that you attract other connectors. Just, you know, because it's almost like geeking out over a particular topic. Like Michael Shine and I, when we first met, we geeked out over the fact that we both really like comic books and we still do, you know, in that world, you know what I mean? And I think it's one of those things where if you are a connector and you meet another connector, it becomes this sort of supercharged. Oh, you're just kind of introducing people. So everybody kind of starts to end up in sort of similar circles. At least that's what I've seen.

Yeah, that's what I've seen. And big shout out to Dori Clark, too, because actually I've learned a lot from her about that orientation. And when you ask me about what it's done for my business, it's done a lot for my business. But I must say it was when I stepped away from thinking it would do anything for my business, and it did a lot more for my business. I'd love to really tell you a little bit about how I met Marshall Goldsmith. Would that be okay?

Oh, well, please. Awesome. If you didn't, I would ask. Yeah.

Because that to me is sort of an example of something that's been just tremendously personally fulfilling and, oh, by the way, great for business. Right. But when I was about, I mean, I was a super young coach, this is about 14 years ago, I was reading one of Marshall's books and I looked him up on his website and I realized, wait, he's got an 858 area code. That's San Diego. And as it happens, I was going to winter in San Diego that winter because, you know, I'm self employed and I can just do that, you know.

You'Re self employed when you can use a season as a verb, you know?

Exactly, exactly. It's like I'm a little too old, too young. For that. But all right, whatever. I was going to go winter in San Diego and I just thought, I'm going to find him. And actually, like all of us, you know, we had. My first thing is thinking about networking. So I tried to network to find him. I couldn't figure out how to get to him through network. I just sent him an email and I said, you know, I'd love to come and see you, even it's for a short time and even if it is for scheduled far in advance. He so nicely got back to me and we arranged his time for me to go to visit him in his home in Rancho Santa Fe. And just to say our meeting was gonna be at 8 in the morning and I made sure to get there at 7 in the morning. So I was like sitting outside like his gated community waiting for this time. I was so excited.

And then you were arrested by his 300 pound security guard.

Exactly. This woman, like outside my house.

And then Marshall bailed you out. I know the rest of this story. I read the papers.

We bonded forever over there. Exactly. So Marshall took me on a walk around his beautiful neighborhood. And in the middle of the conversation, he did what he often does, which he says, how can I make your life better? Now that's Marshall again, a great role model for me, very generous. How can I make your life better? And I just said to him what was in my heart, which is, I just like to spend more time with you. And then we talked about that a little bit. We came back to his driveway and we're getting ready to leave. And I thought, Alyssa, he's the big mentor, but you have to step up too. And I said, well, Marshall, how can I make your life better? And he said, well, there's a project you could work on with me. And I thought, wow, that's amazing. So indeed I said, I would love to do that. And then of course, I'm meeting him in San Diego. So he thinks this is April already, he thinks I live in San Diego. So he said, well, it's in New York. I said, perfect, I live in Boston. Right. And I flew home this when I lived in Boston. I flew home two days later because my winter was over. And two weeks later I was sitting with him in the executive dining room of like a Fortune 10 company. And in some ways my career was made in that moment. And I did not realize it was going to happen. It was just because I wanted to be in the presence of excellence. And Marshall Goldsmith is like the word in excellence. And I did legitimately and honestly and genuinely want to add value to him. And by the way, it's been years. Right now. It's been about 13, 14 years. I'm part of this Marshall Goldsmith 100 coaches program as a result of our long term relationship where I have really tried, you know, honestly, he doesn't need anything from me. He's offered me tons of opportunities, lots of generosity, a lot of love and support and friendship and mentorship. I've learned a lot at, you know, at his heels or his knees or whatever you want to say. And I have really tried to make it my business to add value to him because he's been so exceptional to me.

So I obviously love that story. But I think that there are a number of points there that are really, really important to pay attention to. One was the aspect of really saying to somebody, I understand how busy you are. And I think that so few people take the time to think, think about even just that when they're doing that initial outreach, especially if they're just meeting somebody for the first time to let them know, I'm happy to meet you wherever, whenever, as opposed to here's my calendar.

Right.

Oh, God. Click on this link to schedule a time.

Exactly. It's just a different. It's just a different dynamic.

Right.

And I think that often when there's a lot of education out there that's not so good in regards to, okay, well, this is how you connect with people. And they'll be like, oh, use the calendar link because it saves you time and productivity. But if you're dealing with somebody who. That's not going to be their way of operating, it's so important to pay attention to that. The other thing that I really loved was your use of language because after the conversation, you didn't say, what are you struggling with? Or how can I help you? Or any of these things that just would kind of put this person in this position where they're like, they kind of feel awkward. And you said, what would make your life better? Which is a very, very different kind of sound. It has a very, very different kind of feel. And it sounds more like you really are taking the time to care. And you pointed out that you did. You know, I think that that's the other really big piece when we look at this sort of like reaching out to higher level people or folks who could potentially mentor us. Like, we have to actually be interested in what they. As opposed to being like, oh, well, you're famous, so I want to know you. So what I would love to touch on is for you. Where do you find that things aren't a fit? Because you have some instances, of course, where it's like, it's a perfect kind of match. You like those individuals. But you probably have had instances where either somebody has wanted to work with you as a. As a mentor or even work with you as a coach, and you've decided for yourself that wouldn't be helpful for the business. So I'd love to know what are your tells? What are the things that you look for to make a decision as to who ends up in that circle and who you just don't feel right about?

I guess it's such a great question. It's a very astute question. You know, as it happens, Marshall and I, we shot a video and part of what the topic was, how do you select your clients? Because it's so important to select the right clients to be able to make sure they can make progress under your coaching. Right. So the two of you have a powerful partnership together. I think there's maybe a couple of things. Objectively speaking, I definitely want to work with people who want to make progress forward, who really are going to be open to coaching one way or the other, and who have show in some way the willingness and the ability to make important changes and to advance for themselves. Right. Because if I think about coaching, it's really about where are you, where are you going and how are you going to get there? That doesn't mean I don't deal well with skeptics. I love skeptics. Skeptics, please, are welcome. But it can't be sort of stubbornly, you know, someone who's committed to. As committed to their stuckness, that's not going to be an ideal candidate for me at all. And then I would add that when I think about my portfolio, I want to make sure I have time for people. So really, sometimes it's a matter of time. For example, there's a company that I did a small piece of work with and the request was, could I continue to work with the CEO and with the board and maybe with the executive team. And I would love to do it. And I think that these executives all have it in them to make progress and to take coaching and really to advance themselves. And it would be very meaningful. Again, my mandate is to make a difference. It would be very meaningful. But when I look at what's needed in that situation at that company with that CEO and I think about my current portfolio state, I just realized that I don't have the time that I need to devote to it. And that's really important to me to make sure that I have that time.

Well, so to seize on the one piece of what you just said, you know, the video, you know, you took the time to create content with Marshall Goldsmith and he took the time to create it with you and put it out into the world. So obviously this is a pet interest of mine.

Yeah.

You know, the reason I got into this show, into hosting the show with Michael Rodrick, was because I not only believed in relationship building and networking, but I used content to form relationships with people. But there's value in content for its own sake. It shows your expertise. So I just love to hear how often and what strategy you use to get your ideas out into the world and in front of the people who you want to see those ideas.

It's a great question and it actually takes a lot of time and thinking. There's no question. Again, I really want to give a shout out to Dori Clark, because Dori Clark is the one who really encouraged me and pushed me and then in some cases, introduced me to some folks to help me be a great content creator. And this year I decided I wanted to focus much more on my content. So right now I'm writing for Worth as one of their experts. I'm writing for Forbes as a columnist. I write regularly for Open View and other startup or VC oriented newsletters, and I'm doing many more podcasts and videos like this one, like this Fantastic one, and those kinds of things. So, you know, it takes deliberate, you know, it takes intention and I think that it takes you. I'll speak for myself. My being willing and able to carve out time in my calendar to recognize it's important to turn it into a process. So my writing is slowly and painfully becoming more of a process and more of this sense of, you know, if it's Monday, it must be Forbes day. Right. Kind of thing. And then I think it just takes your willingness to kind of throw yourself into new things. When my very first podcast that I did, I was just really nervous. I didn't know how it was going to go. And now I've been sort of building up and trying to get used to it. And the last thing I want to say, just about the video with Marshall. Marshall was doing a number of videos on a certain day. It was actually a Sunday, so he asked me to join him at a certain time. And I sat through hours of videos that he was doing before we were going to be on together. So it takes an investment. It was my pleasure. It's no problem to do it. But you. It didn't just happen. I mean it's sort of going to be a 10 minute piece. It didn't just happen. I think there's a big investment to make by way of time.

Well, yeah, I mean, so as a follow up question, it is an investment of time. It takes a lot of time. Have you seen value in it yet? I mean a lot of people, all of these things are just tools, right? I mean there are people who write articles and do videos and they get new business every day as a result. And then there are people who do it and do it and do it and nothing happens. Right. So have you seen the value and what value have you seen?

The answer is yes and then and still emerging. So the yes is. I have gotten specific leads from, for example, Open View. People saw me being either written up or writing for Open View who have come to me and they have become clients and that's been fantastic. I think when people search for me they see a lot and so that adds to my overall credibility. I've also gotten, I mean really 10x number of referrals through my website. 10x now, you know, my, my X is probably a small number, but still it's really multiplied for all of you.

Algebra fans out there, you know.

Right, exactly right. All you math geeks, by the way, I'm like, right. And just to say that they. There's a lot of noise to signal in that ratio. So a lot of the leads I'm now getting through my website are not great targets for me. So that's good to know. Okay, great to know. And also it brings up for me also what is the role now of my personal newsletter? So I'm trying to sort through that because of course I want to have my own email list and have a well regarded valuable newsletter for other people. But I'm noticing that my efforts can easily be kind of diffused. So I have often gotten leads through my newsletter and at the same time I need to sort of recalibrate my, I think my big picture approach. But I think the last thing I want to say is I've also recently put video on my website and I think that's been very compelling for people.

So let's talk about time. Because time management is one of the biggest challenges for anybody in sort of the entrepreneurial space. And you're dealing with both running a business, creating content and then also adding in this social mix of meeting with people, hosting events, going to events etc. What do you think is one of the biggest mistakes people make within this sort of productivity? Time space. Either something that you yourself have looked back on and said, wow, that's really, that's taught me a lesson or something that you just see your clients doing all the time where you're just like, yeah, this is not helpful.

There's so many things, you know, and also I'm constantly email overwhelmed, right? So I mean people, you guys kind of know that yourselves. I think that to me, the number one tool that I try to use imperfectly is simply structure, scheduling my time. So I'm doing these like what I call discretionary activities where it's not just like if I have a meeting with a client, I'm meeting with a client. That makes really life very easy in terms of calendaring, setting on my calendar time to do these different things like you know, writing or doing kind of reach out calls or you know, connecting with others, those kinds of things. It's hard and I'm not perfect at it. But I think that is a very important tool. And I see people not making time for that, you know, as a, that's a mistake. They don't put time in their calendar for that. I also think I'm getting much better at this myself, but I'm still susceptible to this. You know those things that we do when we're procrastinating, the 10 minutes of checking Facebook, you know, the New York Times, whatever is your poison. I know that people more and more and more are doing even just checking your phone constantly. People are more and more and more doing that in sort of 10, 20, even 30 minute increments where they can't quite figure out what to do. I myself do that, although I'm getting better at it because I'm reminding myself that this 10 minutes or 30 minutes or whatever it is can actually be productive time for me if I can be planned full in advance, if I can think through in advance what I want to do. So I've been doing a much better job at the beginning of my week thinking about if I have a spontaneous 20 minutes free, what could I do with that time that would be really productive. And by the way, that might also be reaching out to a friend because in all of this business world, the business that I do, and I'm so focused and you know, I am quite driven and I'm very focused and I think my having achieved some success doesn't just happen, you know, I'm very intentional about it and there's no question I can lose track of friends. So even just deciding If I have 20 minutes spare, I will call somebody or reach out to somebody I know, a friend of mine who I haven't talked to in a while or I'll think about this small piece of writing I can get done, or I'll think about keeping up with my social media or even just keeping up with my email in that period. There are different things to use to do during that time which aren't necessarily deep work but are actually very useful.

So as we get close to the end of the show, so you've worked with some of the upper echelon sort of professionals out there, from Marshall Goldsmith to your clients who are high level executives. You've also done a really good job at building the kind of relationships that feed your business. So if someone is deciding to get into a service business or become a consultant or become a coach and they're going out on their own and you've done it for a long time and it takes time and they don't really know the people they feel they need to know if they want to crack that upper circle. What is some advice you would give them? What are some things they can do right off the bat to sort of accelerate their chances of success or their speed of success?

You know what the first thing that comes to mind is commitment. Like if you want to do it, you have to do it. And I think a lot of people wait because they have to get their business cards done or they have to take more training or whatever it is they think they have to do before actually doing it. And the best way to start is to start and to do it. And then I think it's really important to decide. By the way, I think we're all in sales and I think the more self employed you are, the more in sales you are. So you have to think about what does it mean to be a salesperson. And part of what it means is be willing to put yourself out there and be resilient in the face of rejection or setback, being willing to be persistent. And I think building up those internal characteristics and traits are super important. I think having a plan for your day and deciding that you're going to be self. Like I'm very self motivated and I'm so blessed to have an internal sense of structure that at least kind of serves me well even when I'm not being formal about it. I think you need to build your own structure and build your own motivation. And then I think you have to keep trying and get better and better and better at your craft as fast as you can. I don't know. Do those resonate for you? I'd be curious about your answer without a question.

I think, yeah. I think that idea of action and picking some structure, no matter what structure. So I'm constantly changing my business as I'm moving. I mean, when I started, I was doing something that looks nothing like what I'm doing now, and I was probably nowhere. I had no idea what I was doing. And you'll hear every entrepreneur say that I had no idea what I was doing. It's like the mantra. Right?

Right.

So that's the first thing. And I'm a very inherently unstructured person. I mean, I've always struggled with that. I've always been ambitious. I've always had all that. But so I've searched high and low for the right structure system, and I finally found it. There's this thing called Strategic Coach and they have this.

Oh, yeah.

So, yeah, yeah. It's this planner. And they basically break things into focus days, buffer days, and free days. And it really helped me. But I don't think it matters what structure you pick. You got to pick one that works for you and just sort of use it. Otherwise you wake up in the morning and you're like, all right, what do I do today? I have a million things I could do.

And it's terrible. It's very dispiriting because, you know, you've got a million things to do. You can't quite figure out what you should be doing right now. And really. And this happens to me every now and again. And time goes by and you're like, now it's one hour less. It's very dispiriting, and you've got to really commit.

Right. Time can go by and nothing really meaningful happens. So, I mean, what. One thing that's been helpful to me in the Strategic Coach Planner is every week you pick the three things that if you were to do nothing else, you would do those things. So you got to do all your other stuff too. And it's broken up a different way, but they're like these three, and they tend to be high value things you're probably not going to do. File my papers. Even though you have to do. Yeah, right.

Come on.

But people will spend a week filing.

Oh, is that bad?

But don't we all do that? I mean, we wake up and we. And we. Oh, our. And sometimes you gotta file your papers. But should it be one of your top three takeaways Are you gonna look back in three years and say, well, good thing I filed my papers.

Right? Exactly.

You know, yeah, exactly.

Yeah. I'd like to actually say one more. That brought up another topic for me that Marshall Goldsmith has really popularized, which is called his daily questions. So what he does is he writes a set of questions for himself so that. And somebody calls him and asks him these questions every single day. And the answers are yes, no, or a number. So how many minutes of writing did you do today? Were you grateful today? Did you plan your day? Did you do your best to achieve your goals? You know, and for you, did you, like, as you just said, strategic coach folder? Did you work on one of these three most important priorities for the week? Yes, no, or a number? And then, of course, you could also use in your personal life. So what he says is, did you do something nice for your wife today? Did you do something nice for your kids today? And then the reason it also brought up for me is because his last question is, did you declare victory for today? And he gets 100% on that every day he declares victory. Right. Which I also kind of love. Like, you've got to, you know, be able to appreciate your successes and also appreciate for the three of us, we've created this business in this life, so it's really nice to know that we're the ones in charge. And it's really helpful to declare victory every day about what we've created for ourselves.

And, you know, when you declare victory like that, life feels kind of golden.

Totally.

And that's why I'm about to ask you golden question.

So, Alyssa, as you know, the name of the show is called Access to Anyone. And the question that we ask every single guest is, is if you could have access to anyone, if you could get a chance to sit down with anybody that you like, they have to be living. Who would that person be?

Okay.

Wow.

I should have been prepared for this. Okay, I'm gonna go with an inspiration to me. When I was a young coach, I thought to myself, I'm gonna coach Bill Clinton. And so I'm still gonna go with that. I would love to have access and have a sit down with Bill Clinton.

You're gonna have to have like a one on one duel with Tony Robbins, because I think he's carved out that turd. He is a big dude. You're gonna. Yeah.

There's room for all styles. There's room for all styles.

That's right.

Right.

Yeah, exactly. Because I'll meet Tony too. I got no problem with that, too, Tony. Together.

Well, Bill Clinton, everybody. We've gotten a lot of Barack Obamas, but we have not gotten to Bill Clinton yet. I don't think.

I just think that retired presidents have more ability to do good in the world. They have more ability to maneuver. And I think that, you know, he's done. I mean, there's certainly a lot of warts on all of our politicians, but he has a lot still to contribute. I really believe that.

I think that is a wonderful answer. So if any of you know Bill Clinton out there, send them our way and we'll make the introduction. And then I might actually ask you for a tit for tat. You know how they say don't ask for tit for tat? That's like the one person, like, I might want a favor in return for Alyssa.

Oh, really? You're saying that you want a favor in return if you. Wow, that's really interesting.

No, I'm just kidding.

I'm just kidding. No, I knew. I'm saying to myself, wow, I loved her. I'm totally kidding.

I just wanted to see if your head would explode if I said that. I don't know.

I think that's great. I kind of want to say who. Can I introduce the two of you two?

No, no, I'm just kidding. If Bill Clinton comes my way, he's all yours.

He's all yours.

No need for that.

Listen, I'm always here for both of you.

Thank you.

All right, well, this has been a pleasure. Alyssa, in all seriousness, this has been so much fun and I'm sure that the audience is going to get a ton of value out of this. You should have been taking notes if you weren't. So go back and replay the episode. And as always, it's wonderful talking to all of you. This is Michael Shine and I'm Michael Roderick. And you've been listening to Access to Anyone. We will talk to you next time. You're listening to Access to Anyone, the podcast that reveals how you can get to know anyone you want in business and in life using everything from the latest technology to the most time tested principles.