047: Expansion During a Pandemic? Yes, You Can!

Get ready, because everything is about to change. There's a new way of living life and doing business that will blow your mind. This is a podcast all about the timing of life and the timing of success. It's what we call the Right on Time Life. And you are listening to the Right on Time podcast with Amber McHugh. Hey. Hey. Welcome to the Right on Time podcast. I am your host, Amber McHugh, and I've got something exciting for you today. My business partner in my photography business, 3Boudoir, Joanna Tiger, is going to be joining us in this episode. I've been wanting to get her on the podcast with us for a while and finally everything synced up and she's coming on the show. And this is important because we've had a a lot of stuff happening this year, like maybe you as well. And I wanted to take a moment to reflect on that and do that with you and share this behind the scenes and share what this year looked like for us in case there's a nugget in there that is helpful for you. Because we went as a photography business who used to see people in person, to full shutdown. We had to completely stop doing business for a period of time, three months, just over three months in fact. So we went from full on plan in place going to full shutdown. So we used that time for what we call readiness. We got ready for when we would be able to reopen, and we took that time to prepare for what we wanted our business, this to be in the future. So we didn't want to start operating again in a space of what we were, but we wanted to create something different when we were able to open again and really use that time as best as we could. I wouldn't say that, you know, we didn't create a whole music album. We didn't write a book in quarantine or on shutdown. But we got some really cool stuff done. And that window of time when we were shut down gave us the gift of focus and we got more done. We got as much done in those three months that maybe would have taken us three years before, but we saw an opportunity there and we collaborated. And as you listen to this episode, you may hear some nuggets from Joanna that inspire you to find someone who aligns with and complements your strengths as a leader. Because as I work with Joanna and as we reflect in this episode, I am reminded how important it is that we surround ourselves with people who compliment us, that support us, that nurture us, that love us up And I'm so glad you're listening. And I hope that you get a little bit of inspiration and you feel some love in this episode because I want you to feel a little bit of that love because I love what you are stepping into as a modern CEO and entrepreneur. And I want you to have people around you that support you and lift you up just like Joanna does in this episode. So you're going to hear a little bit about the behind the scenes of what we did during that shutdown window, a little bit of the fear that might have emerged and what we did about that and how we navigated some of that and how Joanna supported me through some of my fear and what I messaged her when I was feeling some fear. And she's just going to share some strategies that have really allowed us to go from operating in uncomfortable spaces to being able to take some steps forward even when we don't know exactly what we are doing. So if you've ever been in that space, this episode is for you. And I hope there is something in there for you that is exactly what you need to hear right now to take your business to the next level. You're right on time. And here's introducing Joanna. Let's dive in. Joanna Tiger, my business partner from 3Boudoir is here with us today. Joanna, thanks for being here.

Amber, thanks for asking me.

I'm so pumped.

I'm so excited to finally be on your podcast.

I know it's been too long. I've been thinking about it a lot, but timelines, you know, when I was in Ethiopia, that just didn't work out well.

Yeah, there was a lot of transition, a lot of stuff happening. Plus you and I keep very different hours. I feel like in general, so we do.

I'm up, I'm up a little bit earlier and I really do go to bed as early as possible these days. I mean, I lay in bed for a little while and unwind, but I try to get my buns in bed early. And you're up late.

I am a late night worker. I prefer after 7pm when the world kind of quiets down is when I jump in. And I usually work till maybe 2 or 3 in the morning.

Oh my gosh. I used to do that. Not anymore though.

No other stuff happening that requires your time during the day. Exactly. Oh my gosh.

So I talked about the photography business, Three Boudoir, that Joanna and I founded about 10 years ago. We both had full time jobs at the time. We grew this as a side hustle. And I've shared about it a lot and it's been long overdue that we've had Joanna on the podcast and we're as we're moving through planning season now, frankly, we do planning all year long, but it really, I was reflecting a lot on what we planned for, what we don't plan for, and then how sometimes plans just we don't even know, like this year. And I'm like, we've got to just have a conversation around this because I think there's a lot in here that may be interesting for other modern CEOs and entrepreneurs as they're growing their business. And especially people are going through hard, challenging times right now. How we navigated some of it, how we thought about some of those things, and then fast forward where we are. So we're just going to dive into some of that in a casual chat.

Yes. Love it. I also want to say I'm excited about this chat because I feel like we have done so much in the last few months that I'm not even sure I have my head all the way around all of the things that have happened. So I think talking about it right now is going to really help solidify, like, oh, you did that. Yeah, we do that. It's real easy when you're in it and doing it to not realize how much you're getting done.

It really is. And even though I think as CEOs and entrepreneurs, we should be reflecting every single Friday. So we have the Reflect and Rise journal, which we can link up for everyone in this post that we've written through one of our companies, empowerandrise.com and we've written this journal. I use it every Friday. I've used it for a couple of years now, reflecting on Fridays to what have I done? Where am I feeling good about things? Where do I personally need to reset as well as in the business? But getting elevation and having these conversations and doing reviews is, oh, we did it. I was actually writing copy for an email and reflecting on this journey. And like we got as much done in three months as we might have gotten done in three years otherwise if we didn't really just focus.

Yes.

And this year, the year that almost, I don't even want to name required focus. I mean, it just forced it. So we use that as an opportunity. So backing up, it was about March actually was a year ago. It was just over a year ago and we were operating in six cities and we knew we had been talking out for a while. We want to expand to other Cities. We want to serve more women in our photography business. Three Boudoir. How would you. How do you describe what we do at 3 boudoir?

I say it's empowering. Photography experiences for women.

Yes.

Yeah, it's like, it's just super empowering. It's not even the photo shoot is part of the experience, but it's the overall experience that is so empowering.

Agree. We started totally photography thinking it was photography company business. And people would walk out like, whoa, like, life changed on fire. You could see everything shifting, and we're like, oh, that's what we are about. That was so cool. So we knew we wanted to share that with more and more people. So we started in one city, expanded to two, eventually got to six over about nine years. And then we're like, all right, let's crank it up. So we were going to add, I think, four more and go to 10. But in March, when things slowed down, we're like, you know What? We're adding four. Why not just, you know, take it to 16? Why not?

Yeah, it's really. We took that opportunity of forced shutdown, forced slowdown to throw all of our energy into opening more. I mean, I don't even remember the conversation where we said, let's go from 4, 4 more to 6 more to let's do 16. But it just happened. It just was like, why not? We're already pushing ourselves. Let's just push a little more.

So I remember many of these moments, and I remember feeling like a little bit of team discomfort. And I was all about it. And I've been trying to plant seeds for a little while. I'm like, I think we can do more than two or three at a time. I think can really do this. Like, if we're going to do it, let's do it. And I had mentioned it to Joanna, and behind the scenes, she was like, yeah, okay. Okay, yeah, like, totally on board. And Joanna processes like, all right, how are we going to bring this to life in our systems and operationalize this? And March. The march we're referring to, of course, is when the COVID pandemic prompted a lot of shutdowns, and it prompted in person businesses to not be able to serve their clients. So that impacted us in a very big way. Our photography business was shut down for three months, three full months. It was a little bit longer than that. And so we did some other things in that time, which would be definitely another path and an episode we could do. But one of our big things was opening up these Cities. And I remember planting seeds and I remember, like, I don't even know if we knew exactly what was happening or what we were getting ourselves into, but our marketing was working, working really well for the first four cities that we committed to. And I was like, yo, let's just. Can we just duplicate those pages? And you're like, yeah, I can duplicate those pages. And then all of a sudden we're like, pages are up. Okay, now we can start, you know, start our marketing. So we started doing our marketing and then like, okay, next. All right, let's fire up the hiring engine. And though it just kind of kept expanding and before you know it, like, we're doing it.

Yes, that is exactly what it felt like too. It was just sort of like, okay, well, we did those three or those four. Yeah, let's just duplicate. Let's run ads, let's test, let's see. And they were doing well. And it just. Next step, next step, next step. It was just like that. I don't know that I necessarily had like a big picture vision of what it all looked like. I think for me it was definitely, I'm going to focus on this step and then I'm going to focus on the next step. And I don't even necessarily know what that next step is yet. It's just going to be one step at a time until. Until it's done.

Yeah. That's so interesting. And I think that's an incredible thing as we think about our collaboration and our partnership that I value so much because I 100% have a bigger vision, Ty. Like, I can like, okay, see these pieces. I don't have every detail of it explained. Like, I'm like, way up there in the vision. I describe it sometimes as the mirage. And like, I. It's a little. Some of it's a little bit murky, but there's something out there. I can see it. Like, I got that. But some of how all of it was going to happen, I was spot on with that. I'm like, well, all we got to do is set up some pages. Like, that's our first step. How do you think that. So fast forward to today to give everybody the full lay of the land here, we returned and we started doing shoots again in the second half of July. Really? August was our first full on month where we were operational in 15 of our 16 cities. September will be our first month where we are in all 16 cities.

Yes.

And it's amazing. How do you think it's going?

I think we're doing an awesome job. I think it's really. It's really going well. It's. I definitely feel a little bit of the ramp up, and now we're in it. And it's not that it's. I don't want to say overwhelming, but it's busy. It's definitely busy in a way we haven't been in a while. Not that we're not busy, but now we're busy in a growth mindset and in a growth, which is a different set of stress and a whole different thing to sort of tackle. So that's been interesting and definitely busy. But I think we're handling it super, super well. I think we have an amazing team. I think we have built great systems. I think we really. We took our time getting here, so I feel like we really laid a solid foundation for this.

So can you speak to that a little bit more? Like, we took our time getting here, we laid a solid foundation. What does that mean?

Well, when you think back to when shoots first started and it was just you and I shooting in your house, and then we expanded into another market and then a third market, we kind of sat at that third market for a while. That was the first time we brought in other people to be doing shoots, and we kind of grew the team a little bit. And we sat there and we worked out what that looked like, what it looked like to have other people running shoots, what that meant for us. We got the systems in place to empower our team members to run with it and be in shoots and handling that side of the business. And then it was a few years later we decided we went from three cities to six cities. So we had an opportunity to, when we got to that six city mark, continue to build our systems out and really test them by adding new team members. And how does it work in different time zones and what does this system do? And really testing it all out. And then we sat at six cities for a good chunk of time. We really iron those. We iron the systems out. I feel like they are so solid.

You know, we did sit at six cities for a long time. I don't even know, maybe five years. And one of the things that is an aha to me, as I'm hearing you talk, is that we in there, consciously or unconsciously made a decision and a commitment. We made a commitment to growth, and we made a decision to make a quantum leap in our growth. Like, what are we doing? Like, are we just gonna keep like this, like, little teeter up, like, wobbly? Like, okay, we're going, but it's, you know, it's slow. And I think that that was more frustrating and uncomfortable to me than this quantum leap that we have decided to take.

Mm, yeah. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I guess. So in retrospect. In retrospect, looking back at that time, are we kind of idled there at six cities? Yeah, I can see we're. Yeah. That may. Yeah. Why didn't we do this sooner? But I don't think that sooner would have been better. I think we need that time, you know?

I agree. Right on time. Right on time. Always the. I don't. Like, we were getting things ironed out, and still there are things that are not ironed out. But we have so much confidence and we have so much clarity in what it is that we do and we do not do. Although, again, we're still learning. Like, things come up. Even last week, like, oh, no, no, no, no, we can't do that. But I think that it was right on time. And actually, we were speaking with. So as we forecast and we think about, where are we going as a business, we had connected with a mentor, and we were talking about our growth, and we were talking about strategies for growth, and this person said to us, he's like, this business model works. Yeah, we know.

Yes.

Like, well, why aren't you in other cities yet? And we're like, well, we will be. And he's like, why are you there? Now go. We're like, oh, yeah, okay. And actually, that was probably the moment for me. I'm like, I've been planting these seeds. I've been thinking about it, like. And you were on the call, too, so you heard it also, like, I see Joanna nodding. Yes, I hear it. I'm like, she's bought in. I could see it in your eyes. I'm like, okay, go. That was, like, my permission. Yeah.

I think maybe for me, personally, sometimes it's hard to reflect or see. Oh, yeah. Like, this is solid and steady and ready to. We can be in other cities. Like, it is all there. Because I'm such a detailed person that I can very easily get stuck on. Well, this one thing isn't. Isn't perfect. So let me get that perfect, and then we can. Which is. Which is where I appreciate your mindset of, like, no, no, just do it. We'll figure it out as we go. We will get it worked out. You know, we're. I can very easily get stuck there. So then hearing another person say, oh, yeah, this is like, why aren't you in other cities? Why? And it was so simple to him to see it that way that I was like, oh, yeah, we've been kind of talking about this. What are we doing? Yeah, let's do it.

So, so cool. I love what you said there about the wanting to have every detail worked out and the perfectionism that's come up for me in a couple ways recently. I was thinking about Amber McHugh.com and the consulting business a bit, and even the photography business as you were explaining some things. And when I worked in consulting or when I worked in operations in any company or strategy, we would build out a gorgeous deck with a gorgeous plan, and everything would be thought through and everything would be laid out. And I'm like, yeah, that feels good. Like, I thought through everything. I have an answer for everything. So as an employee, as a strategist, as a consultant, I was really trained to think through all of those things. And it's been a huge reset and relearning for me now as an entrepreneur and a business owner, be like, we just. We just gotta go. Like, we've just gotta go. But I think I also feel empowered and comfortable going because I know we are serving people in a big way. And I know@ambermceh.com and in three boudoir.com we are surrounded by incredible people. We have a fan flippantasket team. Like, it's not gonna be bad. Nothing's gonna be bad.

I know. I know. It's so true. It is so true. Every. And if I do, I. If there is something where I'm like, oh, this isn't. I know that it will work out. I know that we have the right people around us to jump in, and they see stuff that we don't even see sometimes that, you know, you would think like, oh, we kind of have our hands and everything, but we miss stuff and they grab it and are like, hey, there's a thing. And it's like, oh, bless you. I love you. You're the best. Thank you so much for noticing that.

I think that's something too. In parenting. I try and do it in the business. I try and do it when we catch a mistake, like, oh, I feel, of course, the worst when I make the mistake. So I try and gift this grace to myself. But when somebody finds something in the business like, oh, this is. This is wrong. Like, you guys didn't mean to do that, did you? Oh, my gosh, you're right. Thank you.

Right.

You found it. My typos. Yes. There are many. Ay, yai. Yai. When you think about that journey of. For me, it's the relearning. You have been such an important part of that for me. I think I've shared this with you in the past, but something you asked me, so little throwback here. Joanna and I would sit next to each other in corporate and things would come up, or we'd be talking about something in personal or business and you would say, we don't have to decide on this right now. I don't have to make a decision on this right now. You don't have to decide that right now, do you? And that was so empowering for me. Do you remember this?

I don't know if I remember this specific conversation, but I do know that that is a. A mantra of mine that I use always. And I do share it with, like, friends or people who. When you're under stress or you're in a bad situation, like, you're not in a place to make a decision when you're under it or in it. And you don't have to make a decision right now. You never know. You don't have to. You can sit with something for a while.

And that was so comforting for me. And I've pulled that through now because I am. I get it done. Er, and I think that ties back to a little bit of, like, workaholicism and the hustle. Like, we're going to get it done. No, we got to decide now. Let's go, let's do it. But that can get me. Or it could in the past, get me caught in this little tailspin spinning of working and a cycle that felt really unhealthy. And when that was introduced, like, do I have to decide now? No, not really. And I know rationally we have to make decisions as business owners. Yes, we have to make decisions. But choosing to not make a decision right now is also. Sometimes it's number one, that's decision, but sometimes it's also very healthy.

Yeah, sometimes you have to just sit with something, especially if you're like, under stress or your body isn't settled and centered. For me, if I can feel it in my body that I am not centered, like hard anchored, and that I am not in a position to make any decisions.

Yeah, that's good. How does that. Does that conflict with, like, your wanting to get something done or conflict with your wanting to hit a certain goal or do you ever come up with internal tension there?

I don't think. I don't really think that I do. I actually think, like, I was saying earlier about the next step. The only thing I ever have to do at any given time is the next best thing. And sometimes that next best thing is nothing or sometimes that next best thing is pivoting to something that I know that I can get done that doesn't require big decisions. It's just sort of checkboxes, getting work done. So I think you have the mirage big vision. I don't know that I ever really have that. I have it very maybe fuzzy, but I can't let myself go there. I have to stay right here, right now. And what is the very next best thing or overwhelming? Because I know that I will get to my goals. I know that the big thing will happen. I know that I trust myself. I know that I am ambitious and I am a go getter and I know that I'm not going to fail myself. So that will happen. All I have to do is the immediate.

That's awesome. You also brought to life something there as you were speaking for anyone that's working in a partnership right now or who has team members knowing strengths and weaknesses of the team members. Really just the strengths, like weaknesses, yes, we know those too, but really those strengths. And Joanna brought to life something there that I am terrible maintenance mode. Which is why the idling like in between feels so uncomfortable for me. I'm like, ok, what am I doing? What am I doing? Because I am one of my strengths. On the strength finders. If you have not taken the strength finders assessment, I definitely encourage you to do that. We will link that up so you can understand your strengths and it may give you some AHAs also. But I am strategic. So what is our strategy? Are we making any steps towards our strategy and sitting in it? Like, I know we're making progress, but ok, but you are so incredible. And actually I think this is the number one reason three boudoir took off. Because we balanced out our strengths so wonderfully. Like, I am good. Like, I will get, I will help get that website up. I will set up all of our products, processes. Like I will lay out all of the things. I will do that. But I never would have followed up with our prospects like you did. I would have been like, oh, yeah, okay, they're there. Yeah, okay, I'm gonna go work on the website. So there are so many complimentary skill sets that we have. And how do you, how have you seen that come up between us?

Well, I see it all the time with us and almost every kind of business decision that we make. And your strength of having the big vision and the strategy around it is, I don't have that. I don't have. I don't. I just. I. When you say it or when you lay something out, it's like, oh, yeah, of course. Yes, that makes so much sense. But even getting. I just don't have it. I just. I'd much. I'm much better in. This is the vision. This is the thing. Okay, here's how we can implement. Here's step. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10. All the way through. I see that all the time in our business. And even when I'm talking to friends or people who are like, oh, your business is growing. You have all these studios now, I immediately am like, it's my business partner. She just is fearless and has a big vision and a strategy and lays it out, and it's. I can just jump right in. It's just like, I jump in and lay out pieces. But if my business partner wasn't so brave and had this big vision and strategy around it, I don't know. That's not my strength. So, yeah, I think we complement each other in that way.

That's so fun to hear. It's also slightly funny because, as you're saying, brave and fearless. Joanna must be forgetting the times when I messaged her saying, joanna, I'm pooping my pants right now. I'm so scared. Not literally, but, you know, yeah, but.

I think that's normal. It's one thing. It's normal to be scared. It's normal to be scared around these big changes. It's totally normal. But to be able to implement it or make that leap takes big guts. I think it takes big, big guts.

Do you hear Joanna? I mean, this is the kind of person you want on your team as the business partner or on your team, period, anywhere, as the coach, as the mentor. Like, I say, I'm pooping my pants, and she says, it's totally normal. Like, there's no. Like, no, you're not pooping your pants. Yeah, no.

Yeah, I am. That is, like, the craziest. Not craziest, but the oddest thing that people say. I know this from being a performer, and, you know, I do improv and comedy, and every time before I go on stage, I feel nervous, right? And when people are like, don't be nervous. Don't be like, how does that serve me? I'm already nervous. Telling me not to be nervous is just adding a negative on top of a feeling that I'm already experiencing. That is In a negative space. So just acknowledge that it's there. Like, yes, it's there. But you know what, you've gone out on stage before when you've been nervous and you've still been able to do it. So you know you can do it. It's okay to be nervous also. That's, like how you know you're alive. You have all this range of emotions, and you should feel all of them and let yourself feel it and know that it's normal.

So good. I love how you brought that up. You've been nervous before and you've done it. The other exercise is working, prepping right now for the plan. A thon that I was pulled back to was looking back at your goals, a goal that you've met in the past. Like, we've met hard goals in the past. We've done things before that we weren't sure that we could do. And that's sort of how I get proof. Like, all right, I've never done this before, but I've done things I haven't done before. And here we go.

Yeah.

Yeah.

There is a strength in partnership, because if I am feeling, if I'm pooping my pants, I know that I have not just a business partner, but a friend who cares the same way that I care. And I'm not alone in it. You know, I have a partner who, as much of a risk as I'm taking, she's taking, we're taking it together, and we support each other through that. You know, there's real strength in that.

That's so beautiful. I think that one of my core values personally, and I know this pulls through in our businesses is business is not just business. It's personal. And this is why when this is why I say, like, love ya when I hang up the phone with my clients. And this is why in our team slack messages like, you're amazing. Xoxoxo. Xoxo and maybe some more xo depending on how stressful whatever we just worked through was. But I think recognizing that we are humans and we can care for each other and we can nurture the human, even though, yep, it's business. And yes, we have a contract, or yes, there's an employment agreement, or yes, we have deliverables and timelines and projects, but we've got to take care of the human side of all of this. Otherwise, like, what is business for? What are we doing this for? And sometimes I can get going and I can get really excited about a project and I can forget and I know there was a team meeting recently, and I was like, all right, we've got an agenda.

I've only got an hour. We're gonna work through this. Like.

And someone was like, hold up. I'm overwhelmed. I'm like, okay, in that moment, I have to totally change everything about how I'm going to approach this entire meeting, because we need to love up that person. I can't sit next to her and give her a hug like we would have, but I've got to send all the energetic hugs through that. And that's so beautiful that you embody that. And of course, why we are good partners, but I want everyone, everyone to have that. Like, if you are out there doing this solo right now, you're like, where are my people? Like, find your people. And if you have a team, you're like, my team doesn't love me. Like, let's find, like, let's build that. You can build a team that you nurture and love up. And at first, I felt hesitancy around that. Like, can we infuse this into our business? Like, yes, 100%, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. And there are brands that I'm sure do this even more than we do. So what's coming up for you around this, Joanna?

I'm just thinking, yeah, this is not limited. This feeling is not limited to partnership. This is something that you cultivate and surround yourself with people. If it's not necessarily a business partner, it's your network, it's your mentors, it's your people that meet you where you are, support you. And it's not just business. It's. It's personal. And the way that you extend that out to your team, even if you didn't have a business partner to take the risks with you or to, you know, to have big guts to do things, you still surround yourself and build your team with people who will support and empower and lift you up through all of that. I mean, our team is really great at that. I feel like our team is so good, and we do a good job. I think our team does a good job of acknowledging, oh, someone is. Is kind of in, like a level one or a level two energy, like, in a low energy space, we acknowledge that and go, okay. The same thing we do in all areas. We don't have to make any decisions right now. We can sit in this energy until we sort of rebound or bounce out of it and support each other through it.

Yes. Joanna referred to energy level one and two. We work with an energy leadership coach. Rachel. We'll link up her information in the podcast episode as well. And she's also a mentor in our program, freshly implemented and our Accelerate mastermind. And it's incredible to think through, okay, where's my energy right now? And that may impact how I'm responding to a certain situation. What energy would I like to be bringing to this situation? Or where am I? And catching ourselves. And it also gives vocabulary to have a conversation around, which is really powerful, too.

Yeah, it's really powerful to hear a team member say, sorry, guys, I'm at, like, a level one or level two right now. It puts everything into context. Yeah, I get it. I get where you are. Cool. No problem. Exactly. Yeah.

Yeah. That's beautiful. Oh, my goodness. Okay, so we started back in March, shut down. What are we gonna do? We're gonna. Everybody's in this together. I mean, literally everybody. And we're gonna make it through. So fast forward, actually. Well, we started 10 years ago. We started 10 years ago. One city, one master bedroom, actually. We made our way around my whole house. We kicked the family out for a weekend. Fast forward. We're in 16 cities, and there's so much in between city number one. Shoot number one. And moving to 16 cities around the US that we could dive into. But as we think about this first episode, Joanne, I think we're going to have to do a comeback episode and dive into some more pieces and parts of this. But as we think about those first 16 cities and this journey, what would you say is the number one thing? If there's an entrepreneur who's gone through this year, and there have been joys, there have been lessons learned, there have been best month ever, there's been hardest month ever, and there's been a lot of challenges. What would you say to that person?

Mom, my gut right now is saying you are worthy. Like, you are worthy of whatever you want for your business. Right? Because when you're in challenging times or you are not feeling great about things or there's. There's stuff going on or stuff comes up, you can. You can doubt yourself or. Or think you don't deserve it or not, or kind of shut it down. So two things you are worthy. Like, go after it, try for it. And my other favorite thing, and this is such an Amberism, is the right on time. It will happen when it's supposed to happen. You don't have to. You don't. You have to push a little bit in the direction that you want to go, but it'll happen when it's supposed to happen right on time for you. So I don't know, it's tough because so many business owners right now are in this space of, like, just stress and you know, what's gonna happen or where am I going or what's my next step. And it's, it's just trust yourself, you're worthy of it and it'll happen when it's supposed to happen. Yeah, I don't know if that's helpful at all, but that's what my gut said.

So good. I like your gut. I like your gut, girl. Oh, my goodness. Joanna, thank you you so much for coming on the podcast with us. Will you come back and party sometime? And I obviously chat all the time, but a lot of it's in Slack and it's fun getting to see her here on video and have a little chat for the podcast. We hope that you check us out if you want to find us on social media. I, of course, am Amber McHugh on Instagram and on Facebook and would love to hear from you if you had any nuggets, lessons learned, anything at all in this episode. Joanna, where can people find you?

I am on Instagram. I am Joe Jo Tiger. Joetiger01 on Instagram. I think I'm Joanna Tiger on Facebook. I don't know. I'm not really a Facebook user. I'm on there, but I'm not really. Instagram's where it's at for me. Oh, and I have a website, joannathiger.com where I sometimes write and draw things.

Although it's.

It's been a little while, I love it. But yeah, Joanna Tiger. Com.

Oh, my gosh, I love it. Joetiger01 on Instagram. Perfect. So give Joanna a shout out. Tag us in. You can also find us both at three Boudoir. You can find our whole team and all the magic the team is making over there at 3 boudoir. If you are in. If we are in your city, we'd also love to meet you. So come on by, meet us in person and know that you are always right on time. There was a nugget in here that you heard. It was meant for you. Talk to you next time.