Faith and Recovery: Can Spirituality Help Heal?

Recovery is possible!

Recovery is possible!

Recovery is possible!

Recovery is possible!

Recovery Dialogues Sober Stories.

Welcome to Recovery Dialogues Sober Stories. Sober Stories. I'm your host, Antonio Matta, and I'm grateful to have you with me today for another deep and meaningful conversation. A big thank you to our sponsor, City Voices, a nonprofit dedicated to connection, creativity, and community mental health support. Their spirituality group, a non-religious space for exploring spirituality and mental health, has Zoom meetings on Saturdays at 11:30 AM Eastern time. Learn more at City Voices is online.org. Today's topic: faith and recovery. Whether rooted in religion, personal spirituality, or something entirely unique, faith has long been tied to healing and transformation. But what is it about faith that makes it such a powerful force in recovery? Is it the structure, the sense of belonging, or is it something deeper, something woven into the very fabric of how we find hope? Science backs up what so many in recovery have intuitively known, which is that faith in its many forms has real psychological benefits. Research shows that spirituality enhances recovery capital, the resources one draws upon to heal and maintain wellness. People with a strong spiritual foundation report not only lower relapse rates in addiction recovery but also improved outcomes in psychiatric recovery. A systematic review found that those who engage in spiritual practices often experience reduced symptoms of depression, anxiety, and PTSD with some reporting that faith provided a lifeline when traditional therapy alone wasn't enough. Faith and spirituality also play a role in reshaping how individuals understand their experiences with mental illness. Many who struggle with psychiatric conditions ask existential questions—why me? Or does my suffering have meaning? Spirituality offers a framework for answering these questions, helping individuals reframe pain as part of a more significant journey rather than a personal failing. In collectivist cultures, faith is incredibly vital, acting as a bridge to community support, reducing stigma, and increasing access to care. But faith isn't just about belief, it's about practice. Spiritual meditation has been shown to lower stress hormones, reduce intrusive thoughts, and improve emotional regulation. Mindfulness, a practice with deep spiritual roots, is now a cornerstone stone of evidence-based therapies like Dialectical Behavior Therapy (DBT) and Acceptance and Commitment Therapy, helping individuals navigate both addiction recovery and mental health struggles. Even those who don't identify as religious often find solace in personal rituals, whether through nature, journaling, or moments of quiet reflection. At the same time, spirituality in recovery is not without its challenges. Some experience spiritual struggles, feeling abandoned by a higher power, wrestling with guilt, or trying to separate their personal faith from past religious trauma. For many, healing isn't just about finding faith; it's about redefining it in a way that nurtures rather than hinders their well-being. Whether you draw strength from a specific faith tradition, a more personal spirituality, or are still figuring it out, one thing is clear: Faith, when authentic to the individual, can be a powerful source of meaning, resilience, and recovery. With that, let's turn to those who know this journey firsthand. For this episode's lived experience expert segment, two remarkable women will remind us of a truth that cannot be overstated: recovery is both possible and powerful. Chaplain Sandra Mitchell is a fierce advocate, a spiritual leader, and a woman who has walked through fire and emerged with a mission. Her Journey from the psychiatric ward where she was misdiagnosed, medicated, and marginalized to becoming a peer specialist and a beacon of faith is a testament to resilience. For years, she has empowered others to reclaim their dignity and hope, reminding them that no system diagnosis or past mistake can define them. Even after multiple strokes, she continues her advocacy work as a community leader and, most importantly, a living example of faith in action. Akwape Ashley, also known as Sister V, has built a life around turning pain into purpose. When everything else felt unstable, faith became her anchor, something to hold on to when nothing else made sense. She found the strength to heal through prayer, self-affirmation, and deep spiritual connection. Her journey has led her to advocacy, using art, storytelling, and public speaking to uplift others. As a We All Really Matter Warm ambassador, a Fountain House artist, and a future NAMI In Our Own Voices speaker, Akwapey is proof that faith, creativity, and community can transform not just an individual but an entire movement. Let's start with you, Chaplain Sandra. Were you born into your faith, or is it something you discovered along your journey? Was it a conscious choice, or did it evolve naturally as a response to life experiences? I was born into my faith, Baptist faith.

We went just a couple of times and then something happened at the church between the adults and we were not allowed to go back anymore. My mom said, "Enough of this nonsense." So I didn't go to church anymore, maybe after about 2 or 3 times, and I missed it. I loved it. I loved the atmosphere. I loved the getting up and getting ready and going to meet God. But then something happened in the church. My mom yanked me out of there, but the indelible mark was there. The awakening was there. And I would just talk out loud to God and say, God, help me to do this. Help me to pass my test. Help me to do whatever. And it just seemed natural. And my faith grew the more that I asked God for help and He gave me the help. There was never any voice to come back to me, but there was just a knowing that God is there for me.

Chaplain Sandra, at what point in your recovery did faith or spirituality become a meaningful part of your journey? Did it come as an early foundation, a turning point, or something you leaned on in moments of crisis?

In my recovery, I had a foundation. Not in traditional church and training, but my mom planted a seed in me and it grew like a forest. She said, if God spares life, we will do A, we will go here, we will do B. When I was misdiagnosed, I said, oh God, help me. Just a simple prayer. Oh God, help me. Why is this happening? It was just a knowing. That he was there. I cried and cried and asked him why, and I started to get a knowing of why, and then why again, and then just acceptance that this was something I had to go through, but not fearing. He was there for me.

Chaplain Sandra, are there any specific spiritual or faith-based practices— prayer, meditation, scripture, rituals, or your community worship that have played a role in your healing? How do they support your mental well-being and recovery?

When I got old enough to go to church on my own, I went to a spiritual Baptist church and everything was spiritual and everything was this Holy Spirit and singing and dancing and going into the spirit that I didn't understand at all. But as time went on, I opened myself up to the Holy Spirit. I would just feel comforted in the songs we would sing and that knowing that God will never leave me, never forsake me. If I make my bed in hell, he'd be there for me. No weapon formed against me shall prosper. Reading the Psalms, "He's my ever-present help." Just praying earnestly really helped me to feel that connection and to be patient and to know that God will see me through.

Sister V, have you ever had moments of doubt in your faith or spirituality during your recovery? How did you navigate those struggles and what helped you find meaning again?

As far as having moments of doubt in my faith or spirituality, I always believed there, the Almighty was there no matter what. I feel like it's what I've always had to believe in order to have hope and to go on. And it's the only thing that has comforted me when nothing else could. I've had moments of fear of situations or being with abusive people, lack of mental clarity, or repetitive thoughts and negative thinking, judgmental thinking. And really, it was like me trapping myself in, and maybe just a lack of knowledge or enlightenment on how to help myself heal from that. How did I navigate myself? From those struggles, continuing to seek the truth and make the most of whatever I did have, because I felt like it's what I've always had to do anyways as a young person growing up with a parent in a low-income type of environment and, but I had life. I may have been walking around with holes in my pants and short, like flooded pants and hair undone and looked down on in mainstream society as someone who may have been a bit unkempt or didn't know the right ways to do certain things, didn't have the quote unquote right type of connections, et cetera. The way that I have navigated my struggle, even though I was very sad for a very long time until I was about 30, was my faith that the Almighty valued me. If no one else did, if this world did not, that I had value in my Creator's sight, no matter what I looked like, what material things I had or didn't have, what clothes I had on, whether I knew how to present myself in this or that way. I knew that the Almighty was there and he had been protecting me all this time. What helped me find meaning again? I would say staying curious about life and others and myself and continuing to persist, be steadfast with those things I dreamed of for myself in life and to continue to pray and have courage, even bit by bit, no matter how tiring my circumstances may have been in attempting to raise two children while not feeling fully mentally well, yet being afraid to be open about those things, afraid of being locked away or my kids taken away. I had to have courage each day and continue to pray and push forward. And I also had to do it for those two children that were looking at me for protection and direction when I felt the other parent was not as readily available. I felt that despite my issues, they needed my love, whether or not I knew what love was and whether or not I ever fully understood what good human touch was, except for the lovely hugs and smiles that my grandmother would give me. Odd hugging my children in the beginning, but I knew they needed it as children. And I had to hug them and show them that they were wanted, make them feel wanted and loved, whether or not I knew how to fully give love. So my children continued to help me find meaning over and over again. And continuing to learn and open myself up to more in life and also coming to Fountain House. And having the chance to do DBT skills that have had a drastic impact on me even within a few weeks. And it was just an amazing thing that helped me after 50 years of life that I never knew I could be helped in that way that quickly. And also being able to come to a diverse place such as Fountain House, where you have many different people. We're taught to be adversaries of one another and to behave in certain ways towards one another because of the colors of our skin or different categories that the current international power structure puts us in. And being able to connect with people as humans really helped to heal me. In many ways and helped me find new meaning and excitement in life. And I'm very grateful for all of that.

Chaplain Sandra, some people struggle with the balance between faith in a higher power and personal accountability in recovery. How do you see that balance in your own journey?

I find that my faith is everything. I have to walk by faith and not by sight. So it's not about, it's not about anything other than that. God promised us that if we have faith as small as a mustard seed, we will get through. The fight is fixed. So I might not feel like it in my five senses, but it's not about my feeling. It's not about my intellect. It's about my faith in God, who God is to me, who God is, period. God promises me that I would be more than a conqueror. If I'm gonna be more than a conqueror, then this stuff is nothing. I began to trust and believe in the word of God and started to speak it over my life, my situation, my feelings, and I began to be saturated in God's love and protection.

And I made it through. Sister V, has being part of a faith-based or spiritual community helped in your recovery? How has connection with others who share your beliefs or even those who don't impacted your journey?

Yes, I would definitely say that being part of faith-based and spiritual communities have helped me in many ways to give me encouragement. The only thing that I've not appreciated as much is when I feel that others seem to wanna control my perception when it comes to my spiritual experiences within certain religious circles. I really I do strongly believe in personal mental exploration and developing my own thought process and relationship with the Almighty. Yes, but I enjoy going to those circles because I do share many beliefs that are expressed in certain religious circles. To be my own person and to use my own mind and power of perception and observation and to examine things as I feel are satisfactory. Connecting with others who share certain beliefs that I do is definitely fortifying. As they say, iron sharpens iron. Connecting with others who don't share my particular beliefs at times opens my mind to new ways of seeing the same thing that I might already believe, but it's like opening little pockets of tissues adhered together, giving new perception and new freedoms of thought. Very enlightening. When I do go into these other spaces I choose to reserve for myself, certain thoughts that have been strengthening or empowering for me. So yeah, I reserve the right for myself to stay within certain boundaries, and a lot of times I find that others seem to be inspired by some of the positivity that might come from that. Many seem to be open to the fruit that comes from some of the teachings that I've gathered from different spiritual traditions. So basically, I do believe in putting on the shield of the Almighty. And when I'm out in the trenches, getting dirty in the trenches, I'm observing and as a human being, I'm experiencing and it's affecting me. But at the same time, ultimately, I'm maintaining the shield of the Almighty and some of my core beliefs that keep me feeling as though I'm rising higher within my own self, my own life and experience, and keep me moving forward.

Chaplain Sandra, not everyone connects with organized religion, yet many find strength in spiritual belief. How would you define faith or spirituality in a way that resonates with your personal recovery experience?

Spending time alone in a quiet place, reading His Word, meditating on His Word, asking God for divine revelation, asking God to soothe your heart, asking God for that balm in Gilead, reading the stories of our ancestors who are written about in the Bible and understanding what they did in times of trouble, really developing a relationship with your Father who art in heaven. Is priceless. Your soul can be uplifted in the worst of times. The worst of times become the best of times 'cause you get a closer walk with your Creator, with God Almighty. I realized I just had to develop a faith walk that had nothing to do with no one else but just me and God.

Sister V, what would you say to someone struggling with recovery who is unsure about the role faith or spirituality could play in their healing process? What insights from your experience could help them build their own sense of faith?

I would ask the person to look at the pros and cons of building a sense of faith or spirituality or not building a sense of faith and spirituality and which one might take you down a road that you might prefer? Would it be worth the journey to choose a sense of faith or forwardness to help you with recovery? Or would it be worth it to go in the other direction? I would say to look at nature, plants, and even babies it's natural to be tested, to grow, to go through things and to have to move forward. I would ask them about character, the test of character and spirit, and how even small successes in those areas could help them feel stronger and wiser and possibly in a position to give back more in the world. As far as developing a sense of spirituality, ultimately the physical bodies that we are born into, we're— they're born to break down eventually. But the essence of the person is still in existence. We are spirits. We are magical. Why not give that magic a chance? Give that spirit a chance. Engage with that spirit, that sense of spirit, and the power of connecting in spirit Having faith and courage is also a spirit.

Sister V, was there a specific moment in your recovery journey when faith or spirituality profoundly changed your perspective or gave you new strength? If so, what was that experience like?

A very recent moment where I had a changed perspective that gave me new strength is when I started going to Fountain House. I used to have intrusive thoughts and a difficult time focusing on what a person was saying to me. I would have all these negative interfering thoughts and was preoccupied with people's race and their color and other things on the outside of them. And At some point, what helped me with that to start dissolving those things was to focus more on the— that each person is a soul. Yes, your looks in society do affect what type of experiences you might have, and it might express certain conditioning that you may or may not have according to what you look like or what your financial status or family background is and things like that. But more importantly to me, and the thing that goes beyond all of that, is that this person is a soul. Working to look at that person from that perspective first and work from inward to outward, and also being compassionate started, like, I remember just having the opportunity to be at Fountain House and being around people because I had been isolated for most of my 50 years of life, except at work or certain serious interactions. I had not really been in an environment where I was able to interact healthfully with people. Having the chance to be around so many different people and experience so many things and see how other people were reacting and responding, I really feel it helped me with a learning curve I was having as far as certain intrusive thoughts and how I was operating. I'm really happy about that because growing up, was very difficult for me with all of the focus on race and color. Because of these social and structural messages, I don't watch much TV or listen to the radio because I get repetitive thoughts in my head. I do watch YouTube and I like to read through different materials and learn different things. I've gotten into art as well, which has been a very spiritually cathartic situation for me. Being able to artistically express myself in ways that I have had challenges being verbal about before. Yeah. Yeah. A specific moment where faith and spirituality changed my perspective. Yes, definitely being at Fountain House, becoming a Fountain House artist, going to DBT, group skills classes have drastically started to affect my thinking in a more positive way. And I feel that in that sense, life is more enjoyable. And I'm also enjoying being more self-compassionate, less judgmental on myself, and appreciating my own humanity and starting to honor and love myself love myself more. Fountain House has really had— been having a drastically positive experience on me, and so has attending WARM, the Domestic Violence Prevention Organization, where I've started to learn about boundaries, PTSD, anxiety, and depression. And I've always wanted to be someone who helps others. So being able to take these tools and as I'm teaching or sharing with others, allow it to continue to help transform me too, have definitely continue to keep pushing me on and increasing my faith and enjoying the spirit that I am in living within these human constructs.

Lastly, Sister V, how has your understanding of faith or spirituality evolved throughout your recovery? Has it changed in ways you didn't expect? And if so, how has that impacted your healing?

I would say that I really didn't expect or realize that there were new ways to relax and trust the maker that made me and the experiences that I'm going through. I am deeply pleased with the feeling of learning to be more compassionate, less judgmental, and which helped me to practice reducing my levels of anxiety. And realizing that yes, I can slow down right now. There's no big hurry in this moment to do this. I feel like just being more aware of time and sometimes I feel like I'm in such a rush, but I'm like, wait, what am I rushing for? I have the time to take a few deep breaths. Okay, let me stop. And deep breathe because I'm actually not breathing. I'm breathing kind of shallow or holding my breath, and I'm catching that and realizing that I need to slow down. I have— being able to stop and have faith in the moment, be present in the moment has been a drastically new and different feeling for me. I'm working on continuing to become stronger in that as I connect to reality and being in the moment and being in the moment of reality and not beating myself up so much or piling tons of things to do on myself when it's just not necessary. As DBT talks about, I need to stop and check the facts and look at, are my actions or behaviors applicable in this moment and situation? A lot of different DBT skills I've been applying. I do feel that I've been able to release some heavy burdens off my head. By realizing that I don't have to be as intense in many instances where I had started to develop the feeling that I needed to be intense or in a hurry. I'm just immensely grateful that life is so expansive. I'm— happy for the DEI of life, diversity, equity, and inclusiveness of life itself, that it's non-ending. It's a big, beautiful thing with many different pathways. There are many ways for us to elevate ourselves and to free ourselves from the self-oppression that many of us are guilty of putting on ourselves. Once again, just back to gratitude in the now.

Thank you to Chaplain Sandra and Sister V for sharing your journeys. Your wisdom, resilience, and faith are a testament to the power of healing. Faith in recovery is deeply personal, Sometimes it's rediscovered, sometimes it evolves, and sometimes it shakes us to our core before it grounds us. But what happens when faith becomes not just a personal anchor but a calling to help others? Pastor Micah Abenanto knows this firsthand. A former addict turned pastor, she battled addiction from ages 14 to 21 before a belief in something greater set her on a new path. Having grown up witnessing the effects of addiction and PTSD firsthand, she now co-pastors The Oaks, an unconventional church in the heart of the Bible Belt. A mother, entrepreneur, and fierce advocate for early intervention, Mycah is passionate about reaching the next generation before they walk the same painful road she once did. Mycah, how do you guide individuals in recovery who struggle with faith or belief?

If I was dealing with someone who was struggling with faith or belief, I would tell them that it's okay. And that a lot of us do. And most of us, even who are believing in something higher than themselves, still at times struggle with doubt. I would say that they don't have to believe in something or someone. The first step would be to be open. Trying to shove someone into believing that there is a God or Jesus or anything is the wrong step. First, they just need to be open. Watch in your life and see. See if something gets revealed to you or feels special, or maybe there could be something out there that's bigger and beautiful and wants the best for you.

What role do you see spiritual communities playing in long-term recovery?

I think community is everything. If you're watching any kind of show that's a scientific study of human behavior and how they enjoy life, longevity, community becomes number one, even over health. So the much more for someone who struggles with addiction or mental illness, a supportive community involvement is huge. Whether that be church or there's just all different ways to have community, but I believe it's crucial. I think that you cannot stay sober and you cannot be whole as a human if you do not have community.

How do you address the tension between faith-based healing and medical or psychological treatment?

That question digs deep into my soul because when I first became a Christian, someone important in my life at the time who knew about my brother being bipolar, schizophrenic, said to me, if he would just get saved, he wouldn't have those struggles anymore. He is demonically possessed. My response was, he thinks he's Jesus right now. So how is he going to get saved? It's erroneous to say someone battling mental illness just needs to accept Jesus Christ. It's asinine. I do think there is a harmonious balance between the two. I think they can work against each other. And, but the reality is that we need both. The medical field has a lot of positive things that can help us in our mental instability. Church and other spiritual programs like meditation. There's so many things we could be doing that actually helps us mentally, physically, and spiritually. We are three, mind, body, and spirit. We have to address all three to be a whole person. Unfortunately, the spiritual world sometimes just focuses on the spirit. The physical world just focuses on the physical, et cetera. But I was very spiritually advanced for years, but guess where I was so weak? It was mentally. And so I really discovered after that season of my life that while I may know a lot of things about God and the Bible and that sort of thing, I didn't know a lot of things about the mental strength that you needed. The power and trying to focus on all three for those who struggle and for those who don't is very important in life.

What are the most common spiritual struggles you see among those in recovery and how do you help them navigate those challenges?

I think we already addressed the first one, potentially not willing to embrace anything spiritually and realizing the importance and impact it can have on your life. But beyond that, many have been hurt, whether in church or by church people. So that makes them angry in any church or having anything to do with God or spirituality. They're completely closed off. That has been a big one that we have faced at our church. I would also say that hypocrisy that many have faced, where they see someone saying and doing one thing, but maybe their parent or behind closed doors. Doing another. And I also think, at least in my case, I just simply wasn't taught that there was something real and beyond me. And when life is so hard and you go through so many difficult things, it's like a veil is put over you, and it's hard to believe that there is something beautiful that connects us all and that It's okay to believe and be spiritual even though you're desperately wounded. Sometimes simply the validation of the pain and the suffering brings openness to something beautiful. When I went through an F5 tornado in Moore, Oklahoma in 2013, you would think that would crush my belief in God and spirituality because I lost everything. But it was quite the opposite because in the midst of my suffering, I saw the rally of humans coming together in such a beautiful way. But I think that in the spiritual realm, sometimes people just have a really difficult time showing compassion to those who are really struggling. And it's unfortunate because I may not be in the middle of a difficult addiction right now, nor you. We're all addicted to something all of the time. So we can relate more than we realize. And I think that showing compassion is just essential.

Lastly, how can someone develop a meaningful spiritual practice if they are skeptical or unsure of their beliefs?

One thing that I became aware to just in the last few months is something called immersion. If you're battling with something, or even if you had unbelief, putting yourself in a situation where you are immersed with potentially being confronted on how you're thinking. For instance, I went to a Tony Robbins event for 5 days. I got immersed in being confronted with life's choices. And let me tell you what, I did develop some spiritual practices from going to that. And while I'm not battling any addictions right now, I do battle busyness, which can negatively impact my life. I battle, maybe I work a little too much, but what I loved about the spiritual practices he taught is that they aren't Christian. They are Mind, Body, and Spirit, which was a beautiful experience to have where you not only engage your mind and your spirit, but you engage your body. And I think that's a huge missing element that I've seen so much in the Christian world and even sometimes in the spiritual world that in other countries, let's say the priests, when they pray, they rock back and forth. They're showing a physicality to their spirituality. If you do not engage your physicality while you're trying to change or grow spiritually, you almost can't. You have to engage your body in order to grow. That was extremely profound for me to realize. And I have used it even with the ladies of my church, for instance. The biggest thing that I got from that conference was the pain was for my good. Now, I've shared with you just a few things that I've gone through, and in a way, while I wouldn't say that all my life struggles was my identity, definitely in my head it was, because I could just rattle them all off. I remembered them all, but I couldn't tell you all the beautiful things that happened yesterday. Red fog. But when you are trying to change how you think and feel, you have to put your hands out and you're gonna do a physical pain is for my good, right? And so I made my ladies at my church do it. We were all in a circle and many of them did. And it was interesting how a lot of their faces lightened and they were realizing the power in that statement. I did have one lady who said, "I'm just not there yet." And she cried and I loved her honesty.

Pastor Micah, thank you for your heartfelt insights and for the work you do to guide others toward healing. Your journey reminds us that faith is not just about belief. It's about action, transformation, and service. While faith and spirituality can be powerful forces in recovery, their integration within clinical psychology adds another layer of support. Many mental health professionals recognize that meaning-making, mindfulness, and belief systems can enhance emotional resilience and long-term healing. But how do these elements fit within evidence-based treatment? To explore this intersection, we turn to two experts who bring both clinical rigor and a deep understanding of personal transformation. Adam Wick is a board-approved, licensed alcohol and drug counselor supervisor, a certified sexual addiction therapist, and a licensed professional counselor dedicated to helping men break free from destructive behaviors. He brings a compassionate and structured approach to addiction recovery. Robert Kamen is the founder and CEO of The Beekeeper, an international mental health organization reshaping the care landscape. With a career spanning over 20 years, including work with the United Nations, he leads a team of over 120 professionals delivering cutting-edge holistic mental health services. Adam and Robert will provide insights into how spirituality and evidence-based therapy can work together to support lasting recovery. Adam, let's start with you. How do you incorporate spirituality into your clinical practice while maintaining an evidence-based approach?

Antonio Matta, MD: I think incorporating spirituality into therapy while maintaining an evidence-based approach is all about meeting clients where they're at and learning how to integrate their beliefs in a way that supports their mental health, whether it's faith, religion, sense of purpose, or connection to something greater. These all can be powerful resources in the healing process. From an evidence-based or clinical standpoint, the first thing that I'd want to do is assess how a client's spirituality impacts their well-being. Research will show that spirituality can enhance resilience, provide meaning, can be used as a coping skill. So if a client finds strength in their faith or spiritual practice, we'll integrate that into a clinical or a clinically appropriate way. One example I can think of is using EMDR. I've had clients, but one in particular, use some of his religious beliefs in what we call resource building. When we're preparing for EMDR sessions is that we find a calm, safe place. It's really important when you get into trauma work, because when we dive into the nitty-gritty, we may need to ground ourselves. By establishing a calm, safe place, we can come back to that place if we get too far into the weeds with trauma. And some of the imagery that he came up with had to do with some religious experiences that he had and integrated well with his faith. So we use that and he found it very comforting. Ultimately, our job as therapists is not to impose any beliefs that we might have, but use all available resources that the clients have, including their spirituality. While integrating these evidence-based practices that we all know.

Robert, I'd love to hear your perspective as well.

I think it's important to define what spirituality means to you as an individual. Mindfulness-based practices can often be an anchor into spirituality. So if we look at perhaps, say, as an example, yoga. Yoga is an evidence-based approach when it comes to the treatment of trauma or PTSD in particular. And can be very efficacious or very effective in working with individuals in what we describe as a somatic way. So that's working with the body. And I think that's one of the really exciting and interesting areas of contemporary research in terms of evidence-based approaches and how Eastern practices can enhance and integrate with contemporary Western approaches.

Have you observed specific ways in which spirituality positively or negatively impacts mental health recovery? Adam, what are your thoughts on this? Robert, feel free to jump in after.

Spirituality can be both a powerful asset and also an obstacle in recovery. It depends on how it's integrated into a person's life and belief system. Some of the positive impacts that I've seen of spirituality in, in recovery from addiction, trauma, mental health disorders, The first and foremost I would say is that it can provide a sense of purpose and meaning. Spirituality can provide a framework for understanding suffering, finding meaning in their experiences. It can also be a strong motivator for change. Another huge benefit of spirituality in recovery would be the community and support that clients feel when they get engaged with either a faith-based community or an addiction recovery, a 12-step group, or something along those lines. It can bring a sense of belonging, accountability, encouragement. All those things are going to be really supportive for somebody's recovery. I'd say the, another benefit to spirituality and recovery would be the ability to emotionally regulate and find mindfulness, particularly within those traditions that emphasize that. But there's a lot of neurological benefits to meditation. Along with gratitude too, it can actually restructure the way we think and there can be actual physical changes in our brain. The more we engage in those practices, being engaged with spiritual community that engages with mindfulness, you're actually starting to build up some neurology that can be more adaptive to overcome mental health challenges. Also, I've seen some negative impacts of spirituality and recovery. A lot of religious shame and guilt that can become barriers, particularly with those with addiction. Clients might struggle so much with self-worth and they feel like they've failed in their faith and it can be a real barrier to them getting well. It's religious trauma that I've noticed too, where people have experienced spiritual abuse or coercion, which can lead to a lot of fear, anxiety, or distorted thinking about themselves or their self-worth. I have noticed that there sometimes can be conflicts between faith and therapy. Certain denominations or religious beliefs may conflict with what we do in the therapy office. This particularly, my experience has been, revolves around medication, but there has been some resistance to some therapy models where clients don't want to engage in something because it doesn't necessarily align with their religious beliefs.

Again, it's important to remember that spirituality is diverse in nature and can mean diverse things for different different people. And also it's made up of different components as well. Here where I work at The Beekeeper, we use a lot of somatic approaches, but also meditation is really a core component of what we do and is also a core component of Buddhist practice. This can play a significant role in addiction recovery by promoting mental clarity, emotional resilience, and self-acceptance. Techniques such as vipassana, which is insight meditation, and metta, or loving-kindness meditation, amongst others, can help individuals process past traumas, develop compassion for themselves and others, and this reduces self-judgment, which is often a barrier to sustained recovery. By creating a space between urges and actions, meditation strengthens an individual's ability to break compulsive behaviors. It's important to remember that the Buddhist principle of non-attachment is particularly relevant to addiction recovery. Substance use often stems from an attempt to escape suffering. Buddhist teachings emphasize that suffering is an inherent part of life and should be acknowledged rather than avoided. This shift in perspective helps individuals develop healthier coping mechanisms, moving away from external substances to regulate emotions. But of course, this all requires a degree of discipline. And when it can go wrong is when we stop meditating or the practices that we're finding useful. And that can create a slightly grayer area where we're more likely to slip. So we have to be mindful to ensure that we maintain these practices for long-term healthier outcomes in our lives.

Adam, let's hear your insights first. Some individuals seeking help have experienced harm from religious institutions. How do you help clients process religious trauma while still exploring spirituality as a healing tool?

Antonio Matta, MD: That's a really important question because for a lot of people, spirituality can be both a source of pain and also a source of healing. My experience has been when someone has experienced the religious trauma, whether it's spiritual abuse, even overly religious teachings that lead to shame, or maybe even exclusion from a religious community, what we want to do in therapy first is to create a space where they can talk about it openly. Openly without any fear of judgment. A lot of clients, when they come in and they've had religious trauma, feel guilt or confusion, they start questioning their beliefs. So we start to work on validating their experience and help them understand that healing doesn't have to mean rejecting spirituality altogether. After that, I'll focus on the psychological impact. Religious trauma can shape a person's sense of self, their ability to trust, and sometimes inner core beliefs about worthiness or suffering. I'll use cognitive behavioral therapy or EMDR to help clients untangle these harmful narratives. If somebody grew up believing that doubt is a sign of weak faith, we might reframe that through a cognitive behavioral lens and explore how questioning can actually be a sign of growth and deeper spiritual engagement. One of the hardest parts of religious trauma recovery is dealing with the grief that can come from it. Grief over losing certainty, strained relationships, or letting go of beliefs that somebody thought were foundational. It's almost sometimes being experiencing betrayal trauma in a, in a marriage or something like that. So a big part of what we're going to do in therapy is to help clients move through that grief while also reclaiming some autonomy. Spirituality doesn't have to be all or nothing. It can be something that they choose, shape, engage with in a way that supports their healing rather than gets in the way. At the end of the day, it's not my job to tell someone what to believe. It's to help them process their experiences, heal from the wounds of religious trauma, and find a way forward that feels true to themselves.

Robert, I imagine you have a unique angle on this as well.

Many people who have experienced religious trauma struggle with feelings of shame, fear, guilt, or even betrayal, which is often linked to rigid beliefs, authoritarian structures, or harmful teachings. At the same time, spirituality can be a powerful resource for meaning, connection, and emotional resilience. The key is separating harmful religious experiences from the potential benefits of spiritual exploration in a way that empowers the clients. It's important that we validate religious trauma and its impact. The first step is to create a safe, non-judgmental space where individuals can share their experiences without fear of dismissal or retraumatization. And many people who have experienced religious trauma struggle with internalized shame and fear of divine punishment, making it essential to acknowledge that their pain is real and valid. Exploring the ways their religious experiences impacted their self-worth, health, relationships, and worldview can help people begin to untangle harmful conditioning from authentic spirituality. Addressing cognitive and emotional wounds is also important. Many individuals dealing with religious trauma have been conditioned to, to fear questioning beliefs, leading to cognitive dissonance when their lived experiences contradict religious teachings. We use cognitive restructuring that can help them challenge these internalized beliefs and replace them with perspectives that align with their personal values. Techniques such as mindfulness, self-compassion, and somatic therapies can help individuals process the emotional toll of trauma, particularly if they experience anxiety, guilt, or hypervigilance around religious themes. It's important to remember that clients need to define spirituality on their own terms. Rather than rejecting spirituality altogether, Individuals can be encouraged to explore what spirituality means to them outside of religious dogma. Some may find connection through nature, meditation, mindfulness, community, or artistic expression, while others may choose to reclaim aspects of their former faith in ways that feel healing rather than oppressive. Clients should be given permission to question, explore, and reconstruct a spiritual framework that feels supportive rather than restrictive in their own individual lives and their lived experiences. Introducing healing spiritual practices. For clients who wish to engage in spiritual practices without religious harm, incorporating mindfulness, breathwork, gratitude practices, and meditation can provide a sense of connection and grounding without requiring adherence to a specific belief system. Journaling, dream work, or connecting with supportive spiritual communities can also help individuals rediscover spirituality in a way that promotes healing rather than fear.

Many secular therapeutic modalities, such as mindfulness and meditation, have spiritual roots. How do you see these practices benefiting those in recovery? Adam, from your experience, how do you see this playing out?

I love this question because mindfulness is one of those practices that really bridges both spirituality and evidence-based treatment. I know mindfulness has deep roots in Buddhism and other traditions, but it's also been extensively studied in psychology and neuroscience. And it has a lot of evidence that it improves mental health. My experience has been that what's most powerful about mindfulness or meditation is, is that it helps clients develop an awareness around their thoughts, their emotions, without any judgment. Which from a mental health perspective is key for managing things like anxiety, depression, or trauma. One of the most valuable aspects from a clinical lens about mindfulness and meditation is its role in nervous system regulation. And we think about trauma or anxiety, people are often stuck in that fight or flight mode. Their nervous system is stuck there. It can't get out of it. Mindfulness, what that will do is will activate the parasympathetic nervous system. Also known as the body's natural relaxation response. This helps clients to feel more in control of their emotions, their reactions. It brings them down out of that fight or flight response into a place where they can make much more wise and usually more intentional decisions. This is huge for people that have struggled with emotional dysregulation or compulsivity, or even just overwhelming distress. Mindfulness isn't about forcing a particular religious perspective. It's about helping people develop self-awareness, emotional resilience, and the ability to respond rather than react.

Robert, I'm curious to hear your take too.

Mindfulness helps individuals break free from the automatic impulsive reactions that often drive addictive behaviors. One of the primary benefits of mindfulness in recovery is improved emotional regulation. Emotion. Many individuals struggling with addiction have difficulty managing distressing emotions and often turn to substances or maladaptive behaviors to cope. Mindfulness teaches them to observe emotions without judgment, reducing reactivity and increasing tolerance for discomfort. By learning to sit with cravings, anxiety, or difficult thoughts instead of acting on them impulsively, individuals gain greater control over their responses. making it easier to maintain long-term sobriety. Mindfulness also helps individuals in recovery restructure their relationships with cravings. Instead of viewing urges as overwhelming or inevitable, mindfulness encourages an attitude of curiosity and detachment. Practices like urge surfing, where one observes a craving like a wave that rises and eventually subsides, allows individuals to experience cravings without feeling controlled by them. This shift in perspective reduces the intensity of urges and empowers individuals to make intentional choices rather than acting on impulse. Another crucial benefit of mindfulness is its role in reducing rumination and self-judgment. Many in recovery struggle with shame, regret, or negative self-perception, which can contribute to relapse. Mindfulness fosters self-compassion and acceptance by helping individuals recognize that thoughts are not facts and that they are not defined by past mistakes or past experiences. By practicing non-judgmental awareness, individuals can develop a more balanced and forgiving relationship with themselves, which is essential for long-term recovery. Physiologically speaking, mindfulness helps reduce stress and regulate the nervous system. Chronic stress and trauma often underlie addiction, and mindfulness-based practices such as deep breathing, meditation, and body scans can activate the parasympathetic nervous system, lowering cortisol levels and promoting relaxation. And this not only improves mental resilience, but also addresses the physical dysregulation that can drive addictive behaviors. Beyond individual benefits, mindfulness also fosters connection and presence in relationships. Many in recovery struggle with interpersonal conflicts or feelings of isolation, and mindfulness enhances active listening, empathy, self-awareness, and can improve relationships with loved ones and create a stronger support network, which is a key factor in sustained recovery.

Adam, how do you think clinicians can incorporate spirituality into their practice while respecting their clients' individual beliefs? Robert, I'd love to hear your approach as well.

Antonio Matta, MD: It's a really important distinction to make because spirituality can be so important for our clients and for their recovery. But as therapists, our role is to support and absolutely not influence or direct their journey. The key approach to spirituality, the same way we do any other aspect of the client's identity, with curiosity, respect, and it has to be client-centered. First thing I would do is start with an assessment. To understand how a client views their spirituality and how it impacts their mental health. Some clients are going to find a lot of comfort in their faith while others may not have any faith or may have a negative experience of it through religious trauma or just feeling disconnected spiritually altogether. Remember, as therapists, our goal is to explore. I like to ask open-ended questions like, how does your spirituality influence the way you see yourself and how do you think that might help you heal? A client will guide the way. Another important piece is to use those evidence-based approaches that we talk about that naturally integrate spirituality without prescribing to or prescribing a particular belief system. Things like mindfulness, gratitude, meaning-making. These are all research— research-supported practices. That align with spiritual beliefs, but don't require them. If a client's already using prayer, meditations as a part of their coping strategy, we can explore how those can contribute to their healing while staying grounded in their goals. If spirituality is causing distress, like religious shame, rigid beliefs, spiritual bypassing, it's about gently exploring those areas with respect. We can challenge harmful patterns while still honoring a client's faith. Therapy should always be a space where clients feel free to define or reshape their spirituality in a way that supports their wellbeing and is self-directed by them. For practitioners, my advice would be to be curious, flexible, and above all, client-led. Spirituality can be a really powerful tool in therapy, but only if it's integrated in a way that really serves the client's healing. Not a therapist agenda or belief system.

There are some key principles to this approach. One is adopting a client-led approach. Practitioners should begin by exploring the client's perspective on spirituality. Some clients may have a strong spiritual framework while others may have experienced religious trauma, skepticism, or have a secular worldview. Asking open-ended questions such as, how does spirituality or meaning play a role in your life? Could be one way to gain a better understanding of where a client sits with this. It also allows a client to define what spirituality means to them, if anything at all. It's important to normalize a broad definition of spirituality. Spirituality doesn't have to mean religion. Many people find spiritual connection through nature, meditation, mindfulness, personal values, community, creativity, existential exploration, using inclusive language like meaning, purpose, connection, and inner peace can help make people feel spirituality is more accessible without tying it to a particular doctrine. Another important aspect is to respect and acknowledge diverse beliefs. Practitioners should remain culturally humble and non-judgmental, recognizing that clients come from diverse religious, spiritual, and secular backgrounds. Rather than assuming what is beneficial. Active listening and curiosity without judgment ensures that the client's belief system, or lack thereof, is always honored in the process of working with them. And using spirituality as a tool, not a directive. If a client expresses interest, spirituality can be integrated as a therapeutic tool, much like mindfulness, cognitive reframing, or self-compassion. For example, a client who values faith-based prayer may benefit from incorporating prayer into coping strategies. While another may find meditation or nature-based reflection more meaningful. The key is to facilitate exploration rather than prescribe practices. An additional area to address is if a practitioner integrates meditation, breathwork, gratitude practices, or existential inquiry, it should always be framed as an optional tool, saying some people find this helpful But would you be open to trying it? Gives clients autonomy, ensuring they never feel pressured to engage in spiritual practices that do not resonate with them. By honoring each client's unique spiritual or secular journey, practitioners can create a supportive and inclusive therapeutic environment that recognizes spirituality as a potential resource without imposing any particular belief system. The goal is always to empower the client. To define and integrate spirituality, or not, in a way that supports their healing and their personal growth.

Adam and Robert, thank you for sharing your expertise and offering valuable insight into how spirituality and evidence-based therapy can complement each other in recovery. And to all of today's guests, thank you for your your honesty, wisdom, and the impact of your stories. Your voices are shaping the dialogue around mental health and recovery in powerful ways. If this episode resonated with you, consider sharing it with someone who might need to hear it. Download, subscribe, and leave a review. Every interaction helps us reach more people on their own paths to healing. If you'd like to support the show, even a small contribution of $5 to 's active GoFundMe campaign can help keep these conversations going. You'll find the link in the episode description. Again, a special thanks to City Voices for making this episode possible. Their sponsorship won't last forever, so if you or an organization you know is passionate about supporting mental health awareness and addiction recovery, reach out through the contact details in the description. Together, we can continue bringing these purposeful discussions to the forefront. Recovery is about more than just getting by. It's about being. It's about making intentional, positive life changes that lead to empowerment, self-direction, and a fulfilled existence. Until next time, take care of your mind, your story, and the path you're creating. Recovery is possible. Recovery is possible. Recovery is possible. Recovery is possible. Recovery is possible.

Recovery Dialogues and Sober Stories.