#728: How Successful Boutiques Scale with Email, SMS & Smart Marketing Systems

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Business can be a lonely game, but it doesn't have to be. Welcome to Boutique Chat where we explore community over competition and how to scale your company with the balance and the happiness that we all seek. We'll hear from product based businesses of all types, retailers, e commerce and wholesale brands, along with industry experts shaping the future of our industry. I'm your host Ashley Alderson from the Boutique Hub and and I can't wait to chat. Hey guys. Welcome back to the podcast this week, Kenzie. I'm so excited that you're here and we are about to have this conversation because I think that you and I have a unique vantage point to work with so many retailers and see the industry from a certain angle and what most retailers that are successful have in common. So we've got lots of angles to dive into today. But before we do, 10 take me back. You've been doing this for a while, just the whole marketing agency, starting as a virtual assistant. You've been inside of a lot of businesses. Give me the evolution of where you started and why you wanted to jump into this side of the industry.

Well, it actually started even longer ago when I started my boutique and after running it for eight years and reaching burnout, I got to a point where I was like, I can't do this anymore. And I ended up selling. And that's a whole other story. But through all of that heartache and heartbreak, I got to a point afterwards that I was like, I don't ever want somebody to feel this way again. How can I serve other boutique owners so that they never have to experience this kind of loss? Because you don't know what it's like to lose a business baby until you lose a business baby. And even though it was successful and I was able to sell it, it was just so different. So first I was like, okay, well, I know one thing that I struggled with was not having the proper team to support me, like on social media and doing these like admin tasks. And so I started there. That quickly evolved into needing to generate more traffic for these clients. So we started getting into emails and we started getting into all these different channels and then it's kind of just snowballed into what it is today. And we went from doing content and social media and virtual assisting to now we are just strictly in holistic marketing strategy where we're focusing on email and texting and Pinterest management.

So huge. And it's really like, I think the evolution is so clear because I think when I think virtual assistant, what are some of the first things that retailers hand off. Content is a huge chunk of what we do. Like, it takes up so much time, so much energy, but it's so necessary. We can't grow our business without it. So take me back before it became like the full fledged marketing agency and it was more virtual assistant from the start. I'm sure you were probably getting pulled in a million directions with I need content, but they didn't really have any content. So what would your advice be when someone's looking at hiring an agency? How to be the most prepared so that you have something to hand off and you have content to start to work with.

So I think number one is having a very strong brand because you can't expect someone to take over your social media. They don't know who they're talking to or what your brand even stands for. So that is step one and we see it all the time in the hub groups about branding and how important it is. But it truly, it matters so much. So starting there and then also just having clear expectations, what do you want this to look like? Because a lot of people were very last minute with their planning. That is going to bite you every single time. You have got to be proactive. I understand a lot of us are in fast fashion in this industry. However, there is a way to be strategic and plan so that you are able to have what you need to hand over to your team members or a service provider, whoever it is that's helping you.

Yeah. And actually in retail bootcamp, I feel like we talk about this a lot. If you're going to hand something off, it does just like you said, start with your customer. So we love to do customer service surveys and then build customer avatars from there. Do you have a process that you like to go with with clients just to better understand the brand, the voice, the tone, the avatars before you get started?

Yes. So I actually went through retail bootcamp when I had my boutique. I love that course. People will see me talking about it when it's enrollment time because it changed my life and I still use it, so much of it in what we do today. But as far as getting their ideal customer, I really try to encourage them. Like most people say, oh, wow, market to everyone. Everyone could be my customer. That is not true. You will never succeed that way. It has to be a specific person that you're targeting. And so I really do try to just talk with them. Like, does she drink coffee? What time does she go to work? Is it even a she? Like what does this even look like for you? What, who do you want to be talking to? And it is actually like a super hard thing for a lot of people to hone in on. And I get it because I was there at one point, but now my ideal client is so clear to me. So every time I'm able to post something, we're talking directly to them. And it helps you too with your social media strategy. With any type of marketing, if you know who you're talking to, it's just going to come naturally.

You have to, you have to. When you. And to your point, I think a lot of people start out with like, well, I'm just going to sell to anyone who wears clothes or anyone who has a home to decorate or whatever it is. But the truth is when you target everyone, you reach no one.

Exactly.

So you've got to really hone it in. All right. So when I'm thinking about again going back to retail boot camp, we always say do what you do best and hire the rest. And there's just so much content to create. And I think that store owners get this concept or this idea in their head. I'm just going to hand off all of it. I'm just going to give a, give away all the, you know, Facebook, Instagram, Pinterest, like all the things. But really like that's not the ideal strategy. Like you still have to have ownership, vision, your voice and then you can bring on a partner or an internal staff member, however you're going to do it to then support you in the day to day content generation. So when you're looking at again, your best clients, what do they have in common when it comes to just being able to hand you what you need to be necessary, but them still having the appropriate vision and day to day interaction with their marketing. So there's a cohesive strategy of the two of you together.

So again, step one is that they know who they're speaking to, their brand is solid. When I ask them for brand color, any kind of brand asset, it's there. We don't have to go digging on their website to try to pull things. Not only that, but then they also have clear KPIs for their team members. So like, if they don't want to do content management, that's fine. But if you have a storefront in particular, there should be somebody that is creating content for you on a daily basis with those products in house. Right. So then they're able to hand that to us and we're able to run with It. And the one thing I see that stands out to me between the clients who are super high revenue and those that are struggling every single month is the difference between properly training your. Your staff and your team members and micromanaging. Most of the time we're micromanaging because we haven't done our part on the front end to do the training. I was so guilty of that. Like, so guilty of that. Honestly, up until the beginning of this year. And then I was like, hot mess consulting Angela.

Yeah.

Yeah. So she actually came in and did operations overhaul, helping me streamline my systems and working with her, I was like, I am the worst boss because. Because I had not been training how I needed to train.

Yeah.

Once I did that, the freedom it gave me and the freedom it gave my team members to fly, flourish, and be who they are, can be professionally. It was so awesome to see. And they are so happy, and I am so happy I got time back. And I think that can be said just literally for any business. I think you do a great job at that, too. I can see how well, like, your team members can start a position and just go with it. You've taken the time to put the proper training in place, and that does matter.

Yeah, it's critical and it's so often overlooked. Managing people and building a team, I think is one of the hardest things we do as business owners, but the most rewarding because you can't grow and scale without them. You know, it's so necessary. So to your point, two things. One is the systems and processes you mentioned. Is everything documented? Is there a system? Is there a flow? Is there one central? You know, is there a spreadsheet you're managing all your content off of? Or, like, what is the tool and the mechanism? But then to your second point, what is the actual measurable. How are we measuring? Like, how do we define and measure success? And I'm going to, like, go back to retail boot camp again. But talking about, you know, coaching a basketball team, as a business owner, we're coaching, you know, our team members just like they're players on our basketball team. And if they don't know what the score is, what quarter we're playing in, then there's no way for them to know what play we're about to run and be successful. And something kinsey. I don't know if you guys work on. On this level of marketing or this detail of marketing. We've really been honing ours in at the Boutique Hub in the last year. We're great about, like, Social media metrics, email performance like click throughs, open rates, traffic to the site. But now we're starting to really turn it up a notch and go to UTM codes on absolutely everything because you want to measure the acquisition but then did it actually result in the sale so that we know what channel is actually driving revenue in the business. So speak more to the metrics and the measurables that you're helping your clients with so they know I'm investing in this support system. Is it actually giving me return? How do I know?

Yes. So that is every month we send our clients analytics reports and we kind of go over with them how their accounts performing and we do look at things like click rate and open rate and revenue per recipient and all of those things.

Yeah.

But one thing I do think people get wrong with email marketing because yes, any type of marketing that we do, we want it to generate revenue at the same time email as social media is. We got to stay top of mind here. We need to make sure because they might not see something in that email that they like, but they're probably going to think about you. If you send it to them on Monday and on Wednesday they get a call like, hey girl, you want to go to the flower farm on Friday? They're going to be like, oh my gosh, I did just see a really cute dress from such and such. Let me run in there after work. Yeah, like that's. Emails are a must. It's like social media for every business. You can't, you're not going to run a business today not having social media. The same really should be said for email marketing because not sending emails is leaving so much out there and I just can't. It, it baffles me and it really makes me sad for people to not understand like the importance of email marketing. I know though I 100% did not understand how important it was when I had my shop. And I did end up hiring somebody towards the end to start doing it, but it was like too far gone at that point. I had already kind of reached burnout. I wasn't doing my part to keep things fresh on my website and things like that. So it was just not a good situation. But if I could get anyone to understand one thing about marketing, it's that emails, you must. Yeah, you absolutely must. Because you're not going to show up on an email and never show up on social. Like, you know that is not going to work that way. So it really shouldn't work the other way around.

Yeah, let's talk about that a little bit more. So I think about email marketing as a must for two things. One, it's the list that you own and social media you don't own. But email is your list and you can use it not only for email marketing, but also running Facebook ads. You can build custom audiences off your email list. But then to your point, which is really important, what is the stat? Only 3% of your customers are ready to buy right now.

Yes.

So what are you going to do to reach the 97%? So talk to me more about the power of staying top of mind, getting people in your funnel. How many emails is too many emails? Like, we've just got to keep them engaged with our marketing through email. So what's an average email week look like in terms of staying top of mind?

So it really is going to depend on that list, how many people we have to work with and how strong of a list it is. Because you could have 250 people and like, there's no way to really segment that. We're not looking at big numbers yet. And honestly, I tell people, don't consider hiring it out until you at a minimum have 250 subscribers. But that being said, if we have somebody that has upwards of 1500, 2000, that segmentation is going to start looking very different. We need to start segmenting to a large, engaged audience. We need to segment to an unengaged audience. We need to segment based on buying behaviors. There's so many things that you can do to break down your email marketing and that is something that's very, very hard to learn. And why we do suggest, like there's. Can you do emails by yourself? Yes, you totally can. Are they going to be effective? Maybe. But when. But not as effective as if you have professional strategy. That's not possible. It's like you couldn't ask somebody randomly off the street, hey, can you sell this top to this next person that walks by? And they've never had sales experience, they're not going to be able to do it. However, as a shop owner, you likely can sell that shirt. Like it's just, it's just about having put it in. You put in the reps right now.

You put in the reps, you do what you do best and you hire the rest. So let's talk about just campaigns versus automation. So on an average week, if we've got at least a thousand people on an email list, which we're going to talk about growing our email list and how to do that in just a second but campaigns on a weekly basis. If I'm just starting to segment my list and I'm sending campaigns, what are some of the most important campaigns that I'm getting started with and the most important segments that I should be starting with.

So the number one segment you should start with are your engaged audience. I personally like to start our clients at an engaged and 365 days audience. And we're trying to learn what this list is capable of because that's going to give us a large enough time space there to capture in every possible person. We could have the likelihood of somebody who hasn't looked at your anything in a year turning around and purchasing. That's gonna be very hard. So let's start with that more engaged audience because metrics matter with deliverability. We need to make sure we're getting those higher click rates, we're getting that deliverability score continuing to increase. So you've got to work with those smaller segments. So if you're like 1500,000 or less, one email per week, start out how many people can we get in that? 365 engaged. And then what I like to do is yes, we're going to talk about new arrivals. We're going to even tell them hey, we got some new arrivals. We're also going to feature another section in there from a different collection. But what I don't love is when you only are sending one email, sending that email on the day you launch your new arrivals. And the reason for my strategy behind that is because most of these, most shop owners are super active on social media. Your like good shoppers are probably gonna see it because you should be posting it a lot on social, right? So I like to use email as let's hit them again when they're most likely to make this purchase because they're likely not gonna purchase that first time around. So let them see it on social while they're scrolling. Oh that's cute. And then let's show them up. Let's show them in the email inbox a few days later and they're like I loved that. I cannot believe I forgot to purchase it. And then they're going to make the purchase. If you show them that item in that email for their first look, they are not going to make that purchase most of the time and you just wasted that click and you're not going to get anything from it.

It really goes back to the rule of marketing, right? The seven times rule of marketing. Most people have to see something seven times in order to take action. I Think that's a huge benefit of email and sms. Yes, they might see it on Facebook, but then they also need to see it on Instagram and in their text and in their email to really get them excited and push them over the edge. Because we're so distracted. Yes, we might be seeing something and then all of a sudden, boom, we're taken away over here for God knows what reason. And so email, I think is the thing that brings them back to making that decision.

Exactly. Okay, that's exactly how we look at it.

So besides then just like new arrivals, featured collections, what else do you like to see in just campaign emails on a weekly basis or monthly basis that aren't related to new arrivals or a featured collection specifically.

So we have some different clients. Most of our clients are at the beginning stages of email marketing because most shop owners aren't actually doing it. And so when they come on board with us, we're having to build it from the bottom up. So for most of them, that's what it's going to look like for people who have more of a history utilizing their email back end and their deliverability scores already at a pretty healthy rate, et cetera, et cetera. Then we're going to start doing other things. Like some clients love that they do really well with Game Day. So we might send just like a Game Day campaign. We might send if there's somebody just got like Corky's, like a whole like boxes of Corkies. We're probably going to segment based on that buying behavior with email. There's just so much you can do with it. And that's what gets me excited about it. Because when we get clients who are having, you know, three emails go out a week for me, my personal recommendation is sending daily with us from a small business is excessive. There are very few of us that are at that level. And you're gonna have a really, really big list to make that make sense. So for the most part we're doing like three emails max. Because you don't want them to get fatigued seeing your name in their inbox. Right. So especially if you're also sending text messages, you don't want them to get sick of you.

Yeah, so true.

Because I get sick of people really fast when I see it on my phone getting the same text message almost every single night. I'm just like, okay, that's enough. I'm going to have to unsubscribe from that. So we don't want people to unsubscribe from anything. So I Think that it is definitely going to be based off of so many different parts of the entire account. Like you can't just look at one thing because somebody might have 5,000 subscribers, but does it make sense to segment them? I don't know because I have to see that account in action. And once we see it in action, then there are so many ways that we can not only help make that list stronger, but then increase that revenue by doing those segmentations.

Yeah. So good. What about automations? Talk to me about the most important flows that retailers should have in their arsenal.

Well, first of all, you should have flows. So many people miss this step or, or this is quite common. They grab just the template on Klaviyo and like they go ahead and like have it built out and it's so generic.

Yeah.

And they're like, yeah, I have flows set up, they don't convert, but I have flows. You are not speaking to your ideal customer whatsoever in those things. They have got to be on brand. So we, we focus on multiple flows. We for our flow package. But one thing, your welcome series is very important. That's going to be make it or break it with that particular person. Right. So we always stress those. Also doing your abandoned carts, abandoned browse, abandoned checkouts, at least have one set up, you know, because otherwise you're, you're sitting here spinning your wheels, driving all these people and for what? Like again, the likelihood of them purchasing on that first look is not likely. Yeah, we've got to keep hitting them with it. But really at the end of the day I would just be happy that people have some sort of flow set up because it's a huge missed opportunity.

The idea is, I mean we want to make money while we sleep, right?

Yes.

And so flows are the number one way to do that. Like that's your biggest opportunity to get people into your funnel to warm them up to your brand, to, to turn them into raving fans and then to offer them products at any given time. So I think that's a huge, you know, abandoned cart, abandoned browse, keeping them coming back. Talk to me specifically about get back flows because I think that's one of the most important flows we should have as well is warming up people who have purchased from us in the past. But we've got to get them back again to do it again in the future.

Yes, absolutely. Because life gets busy and with those flows in particular that, that flow and the welcome series, it has got to be a serious emotional connection and that's where a lot of people Miss out on it. Because in today's world, we are hit constantly with people wanting to take our money.

Yep.

And we need to let these people know you mean more to me than your dollar. Yeah. And so when we build out our flows, we really, really focus on that win back being an emotional connection and letting that person know that we value them as a human being. As much as we would love for you to shop with us. That's great. Are you good? We're checking in with you. And that seems to work really well, I think with small businesses because we do a lot of education with our clients and what we have to get them to understand is that small businesses cannot market the way big box stores market. And our emails cannot resemble theirs because they don't care about the emotional connection. We have to because small businesses, that's why people choose to shop with your business. It's because of you and how much you show that you actually care about them. They want that, they need that or they're not going to purchase from you. And so email flows are a great way to make sure that you're making that connection.

Yeah. I can't echo that enough. That is so smart. So true. It's not about the products you're selling. It's about the community that you're building and flows. All of your emails have the opportunity to make that happen.

Exactly.

Are you ready to collaborate with us in community over competition on Pink Friday? I hope so. This is your invitation to join us for Pink Friday November 21st. Held annually the Friday before Black Friday in an effort to tell your small business's story, mention your massive economic impact and plus support small businesses first before the big box stores on Black Friday every year. Our opportunity to gather together as an industry has never been better. When you sign up, it's completely free at the boutique hub.com you're going to get done. Free resources like signage, a complete media kit coming with press releases so you can work with your local media on Pink Friday. Plus signage, printed materials and it will get you on the Pink Friday map. Also new this year, something we've never done and I am so excited about, we're teaming up with Hard on Main street, which is a nonprofit supporting small business owners and retailers who are hit by by natural disasters. So this year the Boutique hub is donating $1 for every single small business that signs up for Pink Friday on our website. So when you sign up, we're sending money on your behalf to Heart on Main street to support small businesses hit by those natural disasters. Specifically this year, the Texas floods. So I hope you'll join us November 21st for Pink Friday. Host an event, a giveaway, a collaboration. Do what you've got to do to tell your story of what it means to be a small business owner today. Sign up. Join us for free on Pink Friday, November 21st. All right, so let's talk about growing your list. So you mentioned this to me before we started to record and ironically this week I was doing a whole bunch of website audits in Retail Bootcamp. And so as I was going across people's websites, I was noticing like the call to action to join the email list was either very poor, like there was no strong what's in it for me. It was more like, get on my email list so I can market to you. So that was like a big red flag. Or there was people who either didn't have a pop up or they only had it on desktop or they didn't have it on mobile, or there was just a lot of pop up issues that I found. So talk to me about how to grow your list and how to correctly manage your email pop up on your website.

I'm so passionate about this. I'm so passionate about list building in general because like we mentioned, like, it's the one thing that you own with your marketing and it can go, it can transition if you transition into a different business, like, you can just take that and nurture that list in so many different ways. So pop up for sure is the number one thing. The problem is, so they're not, it's not super hard to set up a pop up really. Like tech wise, it's not that hard. However, there are, there's strategy there. I see a lot of them where if they do have it, they're offering $5 off or maybe a 10%. 15% off is going to be like the bare minimum. I remember one thing you, I don't know if it was in Retail Bootcamp. I think it was throw 15% around or something about 15. Like throw it around like it's confetti. Yeah. And, and that's so true because 10% doesn't sound nearly as good as 15. Yeah, it just doesn't. And I do have some clients that are like, put 20 out there. It's the cost of doing business. Like, how much do you want to acquire this? Because I don't know about you, but my inbox is very full. If I'm going to add somebody else to it, I'm going to need something. Give me a little Bit of something here. And so having at least that 15% off discount and again one time discount, you're not having to give this to them every single time they purchase. At least having that there is going to entice them and make sure that it's very clear. And not only do you want to grab those emails, you, you want to grab that SMS consent as well because you're working really hard to build your email list hopefully. So we want to also be growing that SMS list to be able to utilize it in the future. So making sure that both are there, super duper important. And then just making sure it's on brand and don't have a Christmas photo in the summer, please, we could talk.

About this all day. Yes, please make it on brand. Please make it a beautiful photo. Please update it just like you would the window of your storefront. And to your point, when you think about like running ads, if I was running Facebook ads and I'm going to pay say $50 to $100 to acquire a customer because I know my customer's worth $3,000, 20% off your first purchase is nothing in the game of acquiring a customer. So definitely give them that offer. Make sure on your website it's clear like what's in it for them, not just what's in it for you. What other ways have you used like giveaways or campaigns or really focused in on building email list outside of just the email pop up alone?

So one thing I always tell people is that you need, if you are storefront or you have, you know, you go and do pop ups. Yeah, you need a QR code or some way to collect that consent and offer that discount to them. I know if you're out there doing a festival, you don't really want to give that, but you might never see that customer again. You need them on that list, you need them to consent to receive that email marketing. So offer it even. And the QR code is just going to be the easiest thing. My personal favorite for growing your email list and we have a freebie for this for people to, to like learn how to do it is to offer a freebie. Yeah. And I know that a lot of people get stumped. They're like, well I sell clothing. Like how do I, how do I incorporate this? And it all goes back to how well do you know that ideal customer? What does she want to see? Like we have some that are children's brands. We're like, okay, well a great freebie would be a bucket list of fall activities. To do with your whatever age range you're serving. Right. Or with. We're going into fall a freebie. Here are five different outfit ideas to wear to the pumpkin patch if you're sponsored, speaking well to your ideal customer. And that's something that she really would want. She's going to grab it and then it doesn't even cost you the discount. But so you can have as many freebies out there as you want, which is what I love. And then you're able to use that on so many different social media platforms. It's great for when we're managing Pinterest for people being able to put that out there to help grow their list. That is an incredible tool to be able to put together. You can use it on social media, on your stories, you can share it. It's a great thing to share in groups. Like if you're part of a mom's group and you happen to have a freebie, that would be great for them. Hey, I made this freebie. Here you go. Like a lot of groups will allow you to do that because you're serving those people right. And that is yet another thing that is so important is serving your customers instead of always trying to take.

Oh, so good. I could think of a million freebies that I've seen work tips on how to dress your body type. We did something in trend lines that I think is really interesting that stores could do. And it's a simple quiz. It's like, what type of retailer are you? Well, it could be a quiz. I mean everyone remembers like Seventeen magazine back in the day and the quizzes that you used to take. Having those as a freebie I think is another really great opt in gift guides, I mean recipe exchanges. There's so many different ways how to dress your body type. All the things. Yes. We continue to grow the list.

Yes. And if you want to really want to get into it, don't ask me how to do this. This would be like one of your awesome service providers that, that do shopify and stuff. But there are ways to make it to where. For instance, I just talked to a jewelry wholesaler and I was like a freebie for you. Could be, are you a gold girl? Are you a silver girl? Right. And then when they take that quiz, it pops out an answer and then it's going to segment them for your email. Then you're going to be able to push gold, silver, blah, blah, blah. Yeah. So there are so many ways that you can build on this and make it more and more advanced. But at least just having one out there, see how it performs and just keep tweaking it.

Yeah, this is. I'm so glad we're on this conversation because to me, this is one of the number one reasons why I would outsource and ask for help in the realm of email marketing. Because does the average store owner have time to figure out how to build the freebie, to come up with the constant new ideas for the freebie and. And continually market new freebies all the time?

No.

No. There's too many other things to do. Give me some other ideas. Kinsey on when someone's really deciding, okay, is it time to outsource? Whether it's Pinterest, email, sms, I'm sure you have packages for all three. What other, like, questions should a retailer ask themselves if they know they're ready to outsource or not?

The first thing is, does it bring me joy to do this? Nine times out of ten, it's a no. So I am at a place in my life where it's like, if it doesn't bring me joy, I have got to figure out a way to get it off my plate. Because life is too short to do something that sucks your soul out of you. Especially with marketing because you're doing it so often every single week. Like, that's a huge drain. So that's number one. Number two, does it fit in your budget and not does it fit in your budget? Like, oh, I can spend $5. Yeah, like, you have to be willing to invest in your business. That is something else that has taken my businesses to the next level. Once that, like, clicked in my brain and I finally listened to what you have been saying for so long. Like, once I listened to that and I started investing in my business, it was truly unreal to me how that changed everything. And yeah, I think it's also really important to partner with someone that you feel aligned with and who, like, gets it. Because, like, I'm not the only, we're not the only marketing agency in the hub. We may not be the right fit for you, and that's totally fine, but I bet somebody in the hub is. And so it's just a matter of just talking. Like, who do you connect with? Who do you feel like understands you? And then another factor in all this, it. Cause I did this wrong. When I own my shop and I outsourced emails, make sure they're telling you how things are going. That goes for if you're hiring out content help va work. That goes for even your team members there's got to be some sort of feedback loop so that you can know what is working and what's not. And so I think I mentioned earlier, we do a monthly analytics report for every single service that we're providing on a recurring basis for our clients. And not only am I going over analytics, I'm looking at their business holistically, and so I catch things. Okay. Hey, you don't have the pop up. Hey, your email flows are performing terribly. Hey, I noticed this was broke. This link is broken on your website. Like, because you need partners. That's the whole thing. Like, we are as a service provider in this industry in particular, I want to partner with you. I can't. I can't handle it all for you, but I can definitely be a sounding board and give you a different vantage point. I can see that business in a completely different way than the shop owner or a team member, because I see it from the marketing perspective.

Yeah. Okay. I got to. I got to, like, needle into this for a minute. And this might be like, a little in your face for everyone who's listening, but let's have this conversation. What you just said, nailed it. And whether you're a service provider or a wholesale brand, you're a partner with the business. You're equals. You have to lock arms and say, we're going to work on your business. We're going to fix your business. We're going to do it together. Let's go. It's not, you know, here's the retailer and here's you just serving them, but it's, we're gonna go at this together. So I think that there's a level of professionalism in relationships between service providers and the retailers they serve. There's a right way to do things. There's a wrong way to do things. Talk to me about just maybe some of your experience in how some of your best partners, your customers, work with you that are most successful versus maybe some of the unprofessional things you've seen that I know you're not alone when you bring them up, because I know a lot of people have dealt with this. Some of the more unprofessional things that don't help retailers get the results that they want from you as a partner.

Yeah. So I think the one thing that I see from people is the trust. The trust factor in a service provider or brand is very important. If you don't trust me, please do not hire me, because I hope that you're wanting me to partner with you because you Believe in what I say I'm going to do for you. And so when people come into our client list, they do a form, it's going to ask them all their preferences. It's going to ask them so many different questions. And the ones that are most successful are the ones that say, hey, you're the professional. Take it and run with it. And report back to me what happens versus. And it's again, it's micromanaging. It's trust. Like, are you building the systems on your. On the front end so that people can serve your business properly? Right. So that is one thing. And what I've noticed with those clients is that they are also very respectful of our time and they are very respectful of my team members. And maybe it comes from. Because they're not stressed out, because they aren't having to micromanage every aspect of their business. But on the other side, we have a group of people. And don't get me wrong, I love every single one of my clients because I, and I know how hard this is. And so I'm always very empathetic to the bad days and, and all the things, because I get it. But we have had issues with people where there's no, there's no respect. Like, you wouldn't want a customer to speak ugly to you if you made a human error, for instance. Like, how is that okay that you talk to other people that way? And I don't know how those people are talking to their team members in store, but you have to, when you are sitting as a CEO, you have to know how to give constructive criticism and how to do it very unprofessionally, you know, and we are, we are like, we're very good at our job, but human errors do happen. And making sure to be understanding is one of the things that I have noticed between our most successful shop owners and those, because I think they're so scared of making a mistake that it just spills over into everything and it feels very chaotic for them all the time because it is. Because you're never going to get it all perfect. I know one thing I learned from the Hub is done is better than perfect. And now you don't want to be paying a service provider to do a messy job by any means. But you do have to understand with your team members, with your service providers, with your brands, like, mistakes are going to happen and just being okay with that, like, it's life. We're all in the messiness together. Let's like, okay, that mistake happened with this team Member, like, let's keep going.

Yeah, I think it's about, like setting the right expectations. So what is the job that I'm expecting right off the bat and are we both in alignment with that, or is there an unrealistic expectation of I'm expecting a miracle overnight or what is the communication expectations? So if I'm hiring a service provider, how do I. How do they expect me to communicate with them? I can't be sending them midnight messages saying, sos is an emergency. You need to do this right away tomorrow, because they've got 30 other clients they're trying to manage and keep happy as well. So what is the standard and the expectation there? And then if there is constructive criticism to give, what is that standard expectation as well for that feedback loop? How do we continue to get better together? Because it's not going to be perfect right off the bat. No matter if you're hiring a new employee or an outside service provider, it takes a little bit of time for the two to get on the same page and truly to become partners. So I'm glad we're having this conversation because again, whether you're a wholesale brand or a service provider or you're a retailer, I think everyone wants to be treated with the same level of respect and dignity and to do so by locking arms as partners.

Yes, partnership is definitely what it's all about in this industry, between shop and customer and between shop owner and everyone that supports them.

Yeah, let's take this a step further. So I think the other question that a lot of retailers have when they're looking to outsource or hire is what is it going to cost me? And you mentioned this a minute ago that you had heard in retail bootcamp, and it is something we talk about quite a bit when we're analyzing when is it time to ask for help? And then also when it comes to managing just cash flow in general, looking at your books and asking, what's an investment versus what's an expense? And so when I look at outsourcing marketing help, it's not an expense expense. This is an investment. Because whatever I invest, I should be making a return on my money. If it costs me a hundred dollars a month to invest with you, I'm hoping I'm making about $1,000 back right. With that investment. And a lot of times you get what you pay for. If you expect it to be cheap, expect cheap results. If you expect quality, you might invest a little bit more to get more in return. So how do you have that conversation or how have you seen your own business evolve and grow in terms of product pricing strategy and set that expectation of this is the quality of service we provide for this level of investment.

Yes. So I do think that one thing that has stood out to me and the service providers in this industry is that we really do try to meet boutique owners where they're at. Because, like, email marketing outside of this industry is wild. I spoke with someone yesterday for weekly emails. $7,000. Okay. Like, I wouldn't, I can't do that. I would never ask that for someone in this industry. It's not possible for most. Right. So we really try to meet clients where they're at. So at one point when we started, we had one package and, and that's all we offered. Now we have four different email packages alone to help meet people where they are. So, like we have a newbie package. This is for those people who don't have a really solid subscriber count. And this one, we're going to do less sending, more coaching you basically. So every month you're going to get a campaign strategy. How do we grow this list? Because yes, if you're investing with us, I do want to get you results in revenue, but I'm also held to how strong is that list? Because again, as a service provider, I can't perform miracles if those are poor quality leads and just people that, you know, they came into your store and you click the subscribe button when you were putting their email in and they didn't really care to be like, I can't, I can't fix that, you know, but I can help you build this. And that's the thing, like when you're locking arms with partners as service providers or brands, you have to understand like, it's, it's going to take time. We're, we're building this together.

Yeah.

I don't want you to think you have to do it alone anymore. But also, don't expect us to create something that is not there yet. We can get there and I'm going to show you how. And so I do think that, like, for right now, for us, and I think for most people in this industry, doing marketing for emails, like $400 for weekly sending is pretty much where you're going to be at if you want something that is designed beautifully, that converts well, that has the strategy there. Because anything less than that, what I found for us is when we were charging less than that, it became very hard internally to do, to take care of these people, you know, because it's like, I simply can't. Like, I can't keep hiring people to take these people on because the margins aren't there. Like, it is expensive to run a business, and so being able to having to bump up a little bit, but offering different options for different people has enabled us to really hone in and serve our clients even more. I mean, we were already giving them great results, but now it's like, at a different level because we get to breathe when we're in your account, and we get to really see what strategy is going to make the most sense today versus feeling rushed, feeling like we're underserving people. Now. I don't ever have to feel like that. Like, I love that I can take care of people and their accounts because one thing I always thought about when I had my boutique and I still hold this to be like, probably one of my core, just the most internal core value that I hold. It is hard to make a dollar in today's world. And if you're willing to give me that dollar, you better believe that I'm going to do my absolute best to take care of you. Because behind every dollar, is a person, is a family, is a lot of blood, sweat, and tears that got them that dollar. And I think if we all just really take care of each other in that way, I just think the world would be a better place, both business and personal life, because we all are just trying.

You see this mic right here? Mic drop. Mic drop. So true. Amen. Right? Treating other people how you want to be treated is the core of everything as a service provider or serving others in this industry. I love that. And I think the thing that you're paying for, like you said said, is it's the white space. It's the time to create the strategy. You're not just paying for task completion, you're paying for strategy. And that's a whole nother way of being and serving a small business owner. So I love that you mentioned that as well.

Yeah. That is a hard thing, I think, for people to grasp because our one. One thing we hear back is, but why? Like, you're just sending this email and I'm like, there is so much that goes into the strategy of this and, and the thing. The truth is, if it was easy, you would be able to do it, right? Like, it's not easy. Strategy is hard and it does require a lot of analysis that. And thankfully, we're able to give that to our clients and it. And we have seen a huge difference being able to shift. We Were. You know, we focus really hard on those metrics, and they've always performed, but it's performing at a completely different level at this point. And I couldn't be more proud of being able to serve people like that.

Yeah. That's awesome, Kinsey. Our time together has flown by today. We could have just kept talking for another hour, I'm sure, because I love all things marketing. I get so nerdy when we get into the conversations because I relate wholeheartedly on everything you shared today. So I just have to take a minute and say thank you. Thanks for being a longtime boutique member of the Boutique Hub and retail bootcamp student, but then also coming back and speaking, serving our community with the care and the compassion and the creativity that you do. I mean, that makes my job so much easier here at the Hub, and it's what community over competition is all about. So thank you for who you are and thank you for all the things you're doing here at the Hub.

Well, thank you for everything you've instilled in me. Like I said, I have taken everything from day one and been able to apply it because. Because of the Hub, like, truly, my life was changed. And I know that that sounds, like, so silly, but it's true.

No, that's center of my vision board. So thank you for speaking that into life for me. For sure.

You're awesome. Thanks again.

All right, thanks for being here today, Kenzie. You guys follow up with Kenzie in the show notes. I'll get all of her links, maybe even a freebie for her as well so that you guys can get on her list and learn more about her services. Thanks again. Thanks for listening, guys. I hope you took away all kinds of nuggets and new ideas from this week's episode. Don't forget to subscribe. Subscribe and leave a rating and review. We love to hear your feedback and give you a chance to be featured on the show each and every week. For more information on our spirit of community over competition and to access guest downloads and bonuses and all the resources we talked about on the show, head on over to the boutiquehub.com and join the community. We'll see you next week.