Dr Greg Bahnsen - Islam, Judaism and Christianity: Dialogue (Part 1)

Trait of good teachers that you start on time and you stop on time. And so my Mickey Mouse is 7, 29 and 58 seconds. I think we're probably going to start. Welcome, welcome very warmly. My name is Jim Fitzgerald. I am not the president of the college. President of the college and I were together and he said, oh, by the way, Jim, I have to go to the board of trustees at the very same moment when someone should be welcoming all of our friends to the college for this distinguished event. So we drew straws. He lost. He's at the board of trustees. This is indeed the fourth year beginning of the fourth year of our visiting scholars in residence. Those of you who have been with us since 1988 on this auspicious occasion, remember, we had people from. And issues from Costa Rica, from the Soviet Union, from China, from Great Britain, and indeed last spring, clairvoyantly we concentrated on the Persian Gulf, made reservations six months before the war began, and our event occurred about the third week into the war. We're not in any religious wars, I hope, tonight. But at any rate, we are absolutely delighted that you are here. And on behalf of the almost 27,000 students and 1200 employees of this fine college, we welcome you and I would share with you that this program of visiting scholars in residence and they are with us tomorrow also to be with students in classes as well as you students here tonight. We already have seven classes that I'm aware of that they're going to be meeting with in addition to some additional group work. The program is funded jointly by the associated students of the college and the college's community services office. And at this particular event, the Orange Coast College foundation fundraising activity. Non tax monies that we use for a variety of community activities, including this, are all sponsors of this event. Our moderator tonight is Helen Johnson, associate professor of history and humanities here at the college. So we wish you a warm welcome and we know we're going to have an exciting evening with you and for you. And so it's my pleasure to turn the rest of the evening's activities over to Helen Johnson. Here she is.

Well, I'd like to personally welcome you to tonight's presentation and express my tremendous enthusiasm and pleasure in being here. Tonight's fourth annual Orange Coast College's scholarship or scholar program deals with a program of tremendous importance to each of us I know, as individuals, to our nation and certainly to the international community. The topic is, of course, Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Sister Faiths and conflict. It is with great pleasure, great pleasure that I'd like To introduce Rabbi Daniel Landis, University chair of Jewish ethics and values at the Yeshiva of Los Angeles. Please. Thank.

You.

I'd also like to introduce Dr. Greg Bonson, scholar in residence at the Southern California center for Christian Studies. Greg. And it's my great pleasure to introduce to you Dr. Muzamil Siddiqui, Director of the Islamic Society of Orange County. The formats for this evening's discussion allows each scholar 25 minutes for their presentation. There will be times set aside at the end of their presentations for each scholar to respond to the other. At the end of those responses, there'll be time for you. There'll be time set aside for you to put forth your questions to each of the scholars in your own way. I. I'd like to also remind you again that today's program is just the beginning of a program that continues tomorrow. And I'd like to urge you to consider coming back to campus at 1 o', clock right here in the Robert B. Moore Theater to join together with the panel as well as some faculty members and community leaders, including today, Ted Wall, professor of philosophy and religious studies here on campus, Dr. Gaine Anaker, Assistant professor of philosophy and religious studies here on campus, Don Pierstorf, associate professor of English and technical writing, and Sony Efron, reporter for the Los Angeles Times. We'll be gathering here tomorrow at 1 o' clock to put forth questions to gain another way of understanding these three faiths. Sister faiths and conflict. But shall we begin tonight? What I'd like to do is first introduce for his presentation Rabbi Daniel Landis.

Please.

Rabbi.

It's a great pleasure to be here. It occurred to me as I was driving in from Los Angeles, what a change a year or two has made. We talk about the world scene. Several years ago, the notion was that of the great fight between communism and capitalism. The situation of three faiths within the communist world was dreadful. And now, with the overturn of communism and return towards spiritual values within the world, the question that we face is will these three faiths themselves become great competitors? And if they do compete, how will they compete? How will they strive against each other? Is there a common opponent? I think there is. I think we now face within western society a godless capitalism. As we talked before about a godless communism, there's a godless capitalism. It has no sense of the sacred, no sense of absolute values, and no sense of the preciousness of humanity. And indeed, perhaps these sister fates can come together and find a way to oppose the degradation towards humanity that we find common now within western society. But before we come to the ways we can come together, I should address the question that was brought to me. Are we individually unique? I can only of course, speak about my own faith more directly. The question as it was presented to me is how did I come to my faith? In a certain sense by saying that I could replicate the entire structure of Judaism, easily done within 25 minutes. I do it all the time. When my kids ask me questions that they only want a 30 second answer, I always give them a 25 minute answer. Let me say this. I'm going to talk about a central fact of Judaism, a central claim that it makes, the consequence of that claim and the message of Judaism. Because the central fact is when I talk about how I come to Judaism or what Judaism means to me, as it's often asked on airplane flights, depending upon who I'm sitting next to and how many drinks they've had and they've discovered that I'm a rabbi, I come to it not through belief, not through conversion, not through a moment of faith, not through a moment of decision, but actually the way that all Jews come to it from birth. The central fact of Judaism is, is that while it is a religion, while it is a creed, while it's arguably also a civilization, most directly it really is a people. And it's the felt experience is that of an extended family. Very simply put, I was born a Jew and being born a Jew, I can't escape being a Jew and being born a Jew. I try to understand what is it this birth has brought me. Let me explain. Conversion exists, but conversion for our Jews is the exception at times in history is really the aberration. Theologically, conversion is a miracle. This is all parenthetical. Theologically, conversion is a miracle in that it takes a person who was outside the family and brings them inside the family. I understand it to be a miracle because I think it's miraculous that my wife's family ever took me in. Having said that, imagine how much more so for someone who has come from outside the faith. But basically this is an extended family and therefore being a family, this fact is also a claim that comes with it, that this particular people, and this is the scandal of Judaism and it's been scandalous from its very inception through the Greco Roman period up through today. Such a scandalous claim that many Jews themselves, foreign Jews, proud Jews, not proud Jews, have often rejected it. But within Judaism, the central claim is that this is not just a people, but a chosen people, an elected people, a people separated apart for a purpose. And the purpose is to bear a certain message. And the message which I will discuss later. But the message is born within their very bodies, within their very bones. It's borne by their very existence. Whether or not they recognize it or whether or not they accept it. It's tragic when a Jew doesn't accept is frustrating when they refuse it, frustrating for me, it is sometimes for myself traitorous when they reject it. But nonetheless, it's born within the Jews as a family, within their body, within their bones, within their flesh and blood. The central fact of Judaism is a family. The central claim that it's a specific family, a chosen family, has a certain consequence. And the consequence is to render it vulnerable. The biblical term, the suffering servants of the Lord who suffers because of a particular destiny. Jews have been the lightning rod for hatred and for opposition. There's an expression in Yiddish, it's hard to be a Jew. And I think this is something which is the very first consequences that almost every Jewish child knows growing up. And every Jewish parent who has a Jewish child has made a decision that in this century, when the Jewish people is almost extinguished, that nonetheless they will bring a child into the world who will face that possibility. And whether they make it directly or whether it is part of a dream or nightmare that comes in the middle of the night, make no mistake, every Jew knows this. I've talked about the fact of a family. I've talked about the claim that we're chosen, the consequence of being vulnerable. Therefore, I have to go to for what purpose? I believe this is the central message of Judaism. The central message is found in a biblical verse in Genesis, chapter one, verse 27. Please indulge me. I first need to quote it in Hebrew. I can't quote in English until I read the Hebrew and then I can translate it. Vayvra elohim eta Adam Betsalmo betselim Elohim bara' ototo zachar unkeyva bara'. Otam. And the Lord created Adam in his image, in the image of God. He created him male and female. He created them. Very interesting verse. But there's three basic assumptions that come with this verse. This notion of the human Adam has to be understood there as the human, that is the male. The human created in the divine image. Three assumptions. First assumption. This is assumption of Judaism that all humans, male and female, no matter where they come from, have a dignity, an innate dignity, being created in this image and bearing this image upon their own body. Secondly, second consequence is, is this as being a divine image that's not just passive, but one must act actively and that's to act responsibly. And the assumption of Judaism is that means to create dignity for others. And the third assumption is that while one is truthfully being human has the image of God, one can act godly and create in a very godly way. Nonetheless, to be human is not to be God. That there are absolutes, God being the absolute absolutes which challenge, define and make demands upon us. So what is it to be a Jew? Mark Twain said about the Jews that the Jews are like everyone else, except more so. But I understand Mark Twain to actually I'm willing to give him an honorary prophetic status within Judaism. I think what he's saying is not just the status of being, but is actually the innate challenge vocation of the Jews when we do it right, is that we're supposed to be. To be chosen, to be elected is to stand at the very center of humanity, the very center of this nexus of materiality and spirituality. To stand at the center of humanity is to live with dignity, to provide dignity to others and to know with humility that we are not the absolute, that we are not God. Let me show just in the few minutes that I have left how this central message of Judaism, this divine image in its three part way is worked through the history of Judaism. This is a particular history, a peculiar history. It's a private history, but it's a history that somehow in its central events have, I believe, a universal message. And I'll sketch it out because I don't have all the time. And I'll also sketch it out because I believe that's all I can do, even if I had all the time in the world. Because these events are so compelling and provide so much. Now go through a few of the central events of Judaism. First of all, the event of the Exodus, slavery and Exodus, Exodus from Egypt. The biblical story which shows to us that slavery is deadly, that to live without power, to live without economic power is to be almost as good as dead. And that the freedom story of Exodus means that all humans are essentially free, but they must be brought to freedom. The biblical story is not a story that teaches you how to live forever within a slave condition. But it's a story that says slaves must be set free and with being set comes responsibility. When one looks at the biblical commandments that respond to the Exodus and evoke the Exodus, one sees a certain pattern. I'll give just one example. One is supposed to protect the widow. Greatly powerless in biblical society and very powerless Today in Orange county society, let me tell you why is she supposed to protect the widow? For you were once victims of persecution in Egypt and God delivered you. And one is supposed to protect the orphan for the same reason. And the stranger within the myths is not supposed to be sent back to Central America, but is supposed to be protected and taken care of. For you were once victims of such persecution and the Lord set you free. And therefore, since you've gained your dignity, you have to know how to give dignity to others. The second major event is the Sinai Decalogue, the giving of the Ten Commandments, which refers to the whole nexus of law. A great significant contribution of Judaism. A great self defining characteristic of Judaism is that of being self consciously and a legal society. That society must be governed by absolutes, not situational. That there are yeses in all sorts of ways of developing human dignity. But there are also no's. And the nos impinge upon our sexual freedom and impinge upon some of our economic desires. And the nos impinge upon all sorts of other private rights. Because essential characteristic of Jewish law within the Bible and within its explication by the rabbis is that of. Not of rights, but of responsibilities. Give you a quick classic example if I can, of that. If one looks at Anglo Saxon law regarding. I have two brothers, they're both lawyers, so I get it from them. One looks at Anglo Saxon law and you have the problem of outside your house a pothole and someone walks down and falls into that pothole, he could sue you. Why? Because he has a right, or she has a right to walk down the street and not fall into that pothole and therefore they can sue you. Jewish law reverses the notion. Jewish law doesn't talk about those rights. Jewish law starts with the responsibility of the household owner to make sure that no one be hurt on his property. It's a common example. But the whole notion of these absolutes being brought down into practical life in a sense of our own personal responsibility is very strong. A third example central event is where Jews have been for the past 2,000 years. In exile, out of their land, in alienation. How does one survive in a fragmented society in which living is very dangerous? Two of the Jewish approaches has been the following. One is the sacralizing of community to create a holy community that takes care of individuals, that knows how to be within a hostile society, not as an aggregate of individuals, but as a community that cares for each one. And the second way is of sacralizing of time. And when you can't live in your own Space, you live in time. And the great example there is the Jewish Sabbath, a certain day of shutdown, of protest against all that goes on the rest of the week. And saying enough and living within a sacred liturgy, liturgical time, as if in a different country. And we who live as Americans, as members of Western society, live in a fragmented, contradictory, often hostile society, must learn how do we build smaller communities? How do we conquer time? And I think there's something to learn there. The fourth, and this is hard for me to pass over or to say just in a few moments, but the fourth major event that has shaped Jewish consciousness is that of destruction. And I'm referring now to the Holocaust. A particular event. Yes, the Holocaust occurred to others than the Jews too. Not all victims were Jews, but all Jews were the targets, all Jews were the potential victims. It was a particular and peculiar event in which almost the full destruction of our entire people was accomplished. A few more years, if battles had gone a few other ways, there would not be a Jewish people. A peculiar event, a particular event, but I believe one with universal significance as all humanity today faces destruction. And even though, thank God, there's this wonderful build down in terms of nuclear weapons, we face a situation that any puppet dictator, given enough money, given enough time, and given the acquiescence of the other countries, can build super guns, can develop germ warfare, can develop biological weapons of great destructive potentiality. And therefore we face a holocaust. All of us together, we're all in the same boat. And if so, what can we learn from this event? What is a particular situation which now has a universal significance? And the first notion, I'll just say, and maybe it's the only notion I would refer to right now. Talk about another time. Other lessons is the first thing is to know is that it can happen. It can happen. And you know what? It doesn't have to be fully effective to be destructive. We don't have to lose all of humanity to face the Holocaust. And until we wake up, until we recognize what has occurred in our society in our 20th century, unless we recognize that, then we are the greatest deniers of all and we are not fulfilling our responsibility of future generations. This is the fourth great event within Judaism. The fifth event is the return to our land. I'll just make a brief mention of Zionism. Zionism for Jews today, is the ultimate liberation movement. It's the statement that we will no longer allow our destiny to be in the hands of others or be by the sufferance of others. It means that we must take our own destiny into our own responsibility. It is a time of great expectation, of great fear, of great vulnerability. It is something which is happening to a very particular people. But in a certain sense, it imitates in its. Or I should say, it's paradigmatic. It's paradigmatic for other liberation movements and other potentialities of development. Where does this leave us? In a certain sense, Jews have been outside of history for the past 2000 years. When Jews were in a discussion with religious leaders of great distinction in the past 2,000 years, most of the times it was not in a spirit of goodwill, it was not in a spirit of free discussion, it was not in the spirit of the possibilities of affection and the possibilities of development. In the past 2,000 years, when Jews met in theological discussions, as often was with quaking and with fear, because if the wrong answer was given, perhaps the whole community would have to exit a certain city. Perhaps that the wrong answer was given or a debating point was too sharp or too sharply taken, heads would literally roll. In a certain sense, being outside of history. Was a time for Judaism to gather its strength and gather its resources, hoping for that point within history in which, with fellowship and good feeling, we can enter into a constructive dialogue with our other faiths, with our sister faiths. In a certain sense, I have to say, with our daughter faiths. The task of religion, Judaism among them, is not over. We must offer hope to humanity. We must offer dignity to humanity. Ultimately, the truths of our faiths will be judged by how we fulfill that task. Thank you.

Next scholar, Dr. Greg Bonson.

My thanks to the students and administration of Orange Coast College for this invitation to be with you tonight. And my greetings in the name of our Savior to my two distinguished colleagues as well. Thank you for coming to discuss these things with me tonight. Your program for the visiting Scholar in Residence series at Orange Coast College, which is the sponsor of this evening's discussion. As described Judaism, Islam and Christian sister faiths in conflict. There are, of course, a number of parallels. Judaism, Islam and Christianity are three major world religions which each have their historical geographical genesis in the Middle East. All three have spread beyond the Middle east and become, in their own way, an important factor in international events in mankind's history. All three claim Abraham as their father, either through the biblical lineage of Ishmael or Isaac or through the spiritual lineage of emulating Abraham's exercise of faith in God's promise. Each has fostered a distinctive message representing moral monotheism over against superstitious polytheisms on the one hand, and impersonalistic or irrationalistic worldviews. On the other hand, each has developed a cult and a culture which have enriched our experience in the world. Each has experienced differentiation within its ranks, the growth of differing schools of thought within the profession of that particular religious tradition, some more conservative, some more liberal, some more world denying, some more world affirming. Each faith has enjoyed its models of saintliness as well as its scoundrels. Each faith has moments of history where it has been clearly expressed at its best, as well as moments of spiritual failure and embarrassment. Each has known the tragedy of persecution, misrepresentation, and unfair treatment, sadly sometimes at each other's hands. Judaism, Islam, and Christianity can rightly be called sister faiths when we think of these many parallels between them. Yet, as our program announces, they are sister faiths in conflict. They do not see eye to eye on the nature of God, questions pertaining to sin and redemption, the issue of the Promised Messiah, lifestyle for the believer, and final judgment before God. Our concern this evening is not over the military, financial, or geopolitical conflict between the cultures which have been traditionally associated with with Judaism, Islam, and Christianity. Rather, our focus is on the religious or ideological conflict between these three important faith commitments. We wish to explore the content or the truth claims of Judaism, Islam, and Christianity to see where these three religions differ with each other, and to ask how the doctrinal conflicts between them should be rationally resolved. Now, to ask such questions in this way is already a major step forward in religious philosophy. The easy but powerful temptation which is fostered by our late 20th century American culture would be to dismiss questions of religious truth in favor of a comfortable and lazy relativism. It is obvious to all that we live in a world where there exists a plethora of religious opinions, rather than examining them rigorously to find the truth about religious relativism. But even more, logic itself would chide us if we accepted the cop out of religious relativism. To claim that nobody can know for sure regarding religious truth is itself an alleged truth about religion, and thus the truth would rule itself out if it were true at all. The fact that people have come up with different answers to religious questions no more renders religion relativistic than does the fact that students come up with different answers to math problems entails the relativism of mathematics. More importantly, you must be aware that a definite notion about God is implied by the dogmatist who says nobody can know for sure about religious truth. This notion is that God is so lacking in wisdom, power, and sovereignty that he cannot overcome the purported obstacles to Men learning about him and knowing him cannot overcome the vicissitudes of time, culture, or the human mind which prevent him from clearly revealing himself. But this in itself is a highly developed and partisan understanding of the one we call the Almighty. Religious relativism is therefore just a veiled version of religious prejudice. Certainly those who profess the sovereignty of God, as do Jews, Muslims, and Christians, cannot accept relativism as a rational resolution of their differences. Two basic issues require our attention in comparing and contrasting conflicts between these theological systems. The one pertains to the material adequacy of the messages communicated by the respective religions. Does the message which we are examining truly glorify God and do justice to his position and prerogatives? Does it accurately deal with human nature and the human dilemma? Does it offer a realistic remedy which grants peace and transforms us? Those of you who have come to this dialogue tonight need to be familiar, then with the central tenets of Judaism, Islam, and Christianity, so that you might compare the material adequacy of their fundamental theological claims. This will of course bring every thoughtful student to the second crucial issue which we might designate the question of formal adequacy, the authority or credibility of the theological systems which are being compared. This corresponds to issues which in the field of philosophy are called epistemological. In looking at a religion and its fundamental claims, we must eventually ask on what basis it teaches, what it does, or how it knows that its message is true. Are its dogmas arbitrary or incoherent with each other? Is there objective evidence for the truth of what that religion teaches? Left to the unwarranted and convenient say so of conflicting human opinion, these are unavoidable questions about one's religious theory of knowledge. In comparing and contrasting Judaism, Islam, and Christianity, you must eventually confront the rational question of truth or formal adequacy in the respective theological systems. The religious dialogue before us this evening enjoys a blessing, I think, which is not often found in cases of conflict between religious systems. The blessing is that of a common epistemological platform upon which to conduct our discussion and disagreement as Jews, Muslims, and Christians. That is, our three religious systems initially share a common basis for religious knowledge in the personal self revelation of God. Judaism, Islam, and Christianity all teach the transcendence of a personal, almighty and holy God. They recognize that God surpasses human temporal experience and goes beyond the natural or created order. God is exalted above the world and in his infinite perfection is incomprehensible to man's limited mind. God is not to be vainly imagined and conceived according to human preconceptions and wishes not to be made in the image of man. Rather, man has been created as the image of God and is to think his thoughts after him. If man is to know anything about his Creator and Lord, it can only come about through a voluntary condescension and self revelation on the part of God. This he has been pleased to do in the Holy Scriptures. This is a common testimony on the part of Jews, Muslims and and Christians. These three religions stand utterly opposed to the vanity of pagan idolatry on the one hand and to the pride and autonomy of humanism as a philosophy of life on the other. They are each religions of supernatural divine revelation. They each look to divine revelation to correct the waywardness of human life and to direct us as to how we might properly approach unto God. Furthermore, we can define more exactly the common epistemological platform for dialogue between Judaism, Islam and Christianity. Not only are all three religions of divine revelation, they share to a certain extent an agreement as to where the Word of God may be found. Accordingly, adherents of these three religions are often designated the People of the Book. Jews honor the Torah, the Psalms and the Prophets as Yahweh's word to his people. Christians look to the same body of inspired literature and call it the Old Testament, maintaining that every word of it has been written under the special providential superintendence of God. Islam's Holy Book, the Quran likewise recognizes previous revelation from Allah to be found in the Torah, the Psalms and the Gospel of Jesus. Accordingly, Jews, Muslims and Christians can all take the writings of Moses and and David for instance as a beginning point for dialogue over their religious differences. We can each as People of the Book, consult the objective message of Holy Scripture as God's personal self revelation, using that as a touchstone of truth in resolving our theological differences. This leads me to observe that from the Christian standpoint, the religions of Judaism and Islam are not to be seen in the same class, say as Hinduism or Daoism etc. They are not religious faiths which altogether represent a pagan counterfeit or competitor with the true faith. It is much more helpful and insightful from the Christian perspective to look upon them as theological deviants from the true faith, something like Christian heresies if you will. They share a common commitment to personal monotheism based on God's sacrifice, self revelation and Holy Scripture. However, from the Christian perspective, Judaism and Islam have seriously misinterpreted or misused that revelation of God and as such they are like Christian heretics This is not to minimize the serious nature of the disagreement between Christians on the one hand and Jews and Muslims on the other. Heresies can be greatly displeasing to God and have soul damning consequences. After all, it is simply an attempt to place the disagreement in a proper setting. In light the issue between Judaism, Islam and Christianity in large measure comes down to what God has actually revealed and the meaning of that inspired message. Now Christianity, as its very name indicates, is a religion which centers on the Christ that is God's anointed one, the Messiah. From the very outset of the Bible story, the remedy for moral and spiritual dilemma has been tied up with a coming Savior about whom God made a promise. To our first parents, we read in Genesis 3, verse 15, the first announcement of the good News, God promises to give a seed to the woman who will, in figurative terms, utterly defeat the tempter by striking a mortal blow to his head while in the process experiencing a painful wound to his own heel. Apart from this Savior, there is human hope of regaining the lost paradise of a sinless and happy communion with God. The Torah teaches us that the Creator has thus promised to provide a redeemer for mankind. Christianity calls men to faith in that Savior, as he has disclosed in the events of history and in the pages of God's inspired revelation. In Genesis 12 and 17 we read that God made promise to Abraham that he would be given a seed, an offspring through whom all families and nations on earth would be blessed, not simply the Hebrews. The saving blessing of God would not come to men by their natural right. However, by natural birth, men come into this world untold, clean and unacceptable in the eyes of God. Accordingly, the sign of God's gracious covenant with Abraham was the circumcision of the male sex organ, a sign and seal of the righteousness that comes by faith in God's promise rather than by inherent human right or merit. Later in the unfolding story of God's promise of a savior, Yahweh redeemed the children of Abraham, Isaac and Israel from their oppressive bond bondage in Egypt under the leadership of the great prophet and divine mouthpiece, Moses. Through Moses, God revealed his righteous standards of conduct, the law in terms of which all mankind stands guilty before him. God likewise revealed the way of salvation for those convicted of sin by that law. The laws in the law of Moses pertaining to priesthood, tabernacle and sacrifice elaborated upon the truths that death is the divine penalty for sin, that without the shedding of blood there can be no atonement, and thus no approach into the holy presence of God. The law served as a tutor for God's people, teaching them of the coming Messiah. And that justification comes by faith in his redemptive work. To David, God revealed that he would not let his Holy One, the most Messiah, experience corruption in the grave. His soul would not be left in hades. So Psalm 16 teaches. Rather, the Messiah's righteousness would be vindicated by victory over death. Moreover, Yahweh said to David's Lord that he would ascend to be seated at the right hand of God to rule over his enemies, as we see in Psalm 110. In our short survey of the Hebrew Scriptures, we should likewise make mention of the great prophet Isaiah, throughout whom God revealed his promise that one day the seed would indeed come who fulfills all the anticipation of the ages for salvation. A human son will be born, as the Prince of Peace, Isaiah says in chapter nine. One who is himself mighty God, and who will rule as the king promised to David. And yet in Isaiah 40:53, we read that this coming Savior will be a suffering servant of the Lord. This servant will be one who sets things right in the earth and brings salvation even to the Gentiles. Isaiah 42 Although Yahweh's servant has a righteous character, as we see in chapter 53, verse 9, he will be despised and rejected of men, a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief. According to verse three, the coming Savior would be wounded for our transgressions and bruised for our iniquities. According to verse 5, God shows through Isaiah his amazing grace, saying, yahweh has laid upon him the iniquity of us all. Isaiah 53:6, he will pour out his soul unto death, making intercession for the transgressors, according to verse 12. And although he will be killed and make his grave with a rich man, yet the pleasure of Yahweh will prosper in his hand, and his day days will be prolonged. Verse 10 says Isaiah confidently declared, in the name of God, he shall see of the travail of his soul, and be satisfied by the knowledge of himself. Shall my righteous servant justify many. That's verse 11. Now in the Gospel of John, chapter 12, we read that the words about the coming Savior which are found in the prophecy of Isaiah were written about Jesus. These things said Isaiah, because he saw his glory and spoke of him. John says, at a well in Samaria, a woman once said to Jesus, I know that Messiah called this coming. And Jesus replied to her quite categorically, I who speak to you am He? When Jesus asked his closest associates to identify who he was, In Matthew the 16th chapter, we read that Simon Peter answered, you are the Christ, the Son of the living God. For which Jesus commended Peter's insight and faith as given by his heavenly Father to his Jewish hearers. Jesus said, you search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life. Yet these Scriptures testify about me. After his resurrection, Luke records and beginning from Moses and from all the prophets, he interpreted for them in all the Scriptures that the things concerning himself. The Apostle Paul, who once adamantly rejected Jesus as the promised Messiah and persecuted those who believed in him, later wrote of Jesus, for how many soever be the promises of God, in him is the yes, and through him is the amen unto the glory of God through us. 2 Corinthians 1:20 for instance, each of the biblical references which have been mentioned in my previous remarks from the Torah, the Psalms of the Prophets are used in the Scriptures of the New Testament and applied to the person and the work of Jesus as the Christ. He is the thread which ties together the story and the theology of the Old Testament. Without him, the Scriptures simply make no sense. Christianity is a religion which proclaims the coming of the Christ then identified as Jesus of Nazareth. He is the one who was finally born as the promised seed of the woman to be the Savior of men. In the New Testament we find in various places that Jesus claimed to undo the work of Satan. He claimed to have kept the law of Moses perfectly without blemish. He claimed that he had come to give his life as a ransom for many. He claimed that he would lay down his life for his sheep, and yet that he had power to take his life up again. He claimed that he had been sent into this world, that whoever would believe on him would not perish in God's judgment, but be saved. He claimed that his body and blood were given to accomplish atonement and establish the new covenant with God's people. Toward this end he claimed that he would be killed, but would rise again three days later. And he claimed even more. He claimed to be more ancient than Abraham himself. In John the 8th chapter, he claimed to share eternal glory with the Father in John the 17th chapter, to deserve the same honor as was given to the Father in John the fifth chapter, and indeed to be the very divine Son of God. In John 5:18 he claimed the prerogatives which belong to God alone, such as for forgiving sins and receiving the worship of men. He freely accepted the testimony of Thomas, my Lord and My God. His monotheistic followers readily attributed Deity to him. He was to them the promised Emmanuel God with us, prophesied by Isaiah. Jesus claimed to be the judge of all mankind. He claimed that His Word would be the final standard of eternal judgment and that those who would gain eternal life must believe. Jesus claimed to be the judge of all mankind. He claimed that His Word would be the final standard of eternal judgment and that those who would gain eternal life must believe upon him. According to Jesus, I am the Way, the Truth, and the life. No man comes to the Father but by Me. Now, such astounding claims as these remove from us the option of considering Jesus simply as a good man and teacher, somehow a prophet from God. It would be patronizing nonsense to deem a mere man who said such things as a good person and a divinely approved moral teacher. He may be a megalomaniac, he may be a brazen huckster, but not a paragon of moral virtue. Unless what he claimed about himself was in fact fact. True Christians believe Jesus is who he claimed to be, the messianic Son of God. Christians are committed to the Jesus of history set forth in the pages of Scripture, not a Jesus of human imagination, not a Jesus cut down to preconceived convenience, not a Jesus of humanistic revisionism. They believe that he is God incarnate, that he worked mighty miracles, that he rose from the dead and ascended to the right hand of the Father in heaven. Christians also realize that such beliefs are breathtaking in their grandeur and challenge to the naturalistic mindset which is popular in our day. They also believe that from a rational standpoint, when one is acquainted with the facts and with the requirements of a philosophical worldview in which reason and morality make sense, it is really much harder not to believe these things, indeed that it requires nothing less than a spiritual suppressing of the truth. Now neither Judaism nor Islam have an Anointed One or Messiah which fulfills the Old Testament scriptures, even though they acknowledge them to be God's inspired self revelation. For this reason, the theologies of Judaism and Islam lack material adequacy. They do not do justice to the message of God's revealed Word. That is why we look upon them as heretical versions of the biblical faith, versions which do not deliver good news to mankind. Following upon their failure to affirm the Promised Messiah, Judaism and Islam proclaim an assured word of salvation to those who know that they stand guilty before a holy and just God. Christianity is uniquely the religion of salvation by grace through faith in the Family, finished work of the Christ. Paul puts it in these words in Ephesians 2. For by grace are you saved through faith, and that not of yourselves. It is the gift of God, not of works. Lest any man should boast, Christianity teaches that Christ paid the price of sin and that through faith in him and his saving work, men may be forgiven by God. They cannot earn this forgiveness by good works, nor can they take any credit, because before God, salvation comes as a gift appropriated by faith rather than through meritorious good deeds. Judaism and Islam cannot and do not teach such good news about grace and salvation by not trusting in the work of God's Messianic Son for redemption. Both Judaism and Islam are in their own distinctive ways committed to some form of works, righteousness or legalism. They are left to seek a right standing before God through imperfectly good works performed in human wisdom and strength. Now the apostle Paul knew the burden and the bondage of such a futile approach unto God. Those who attempt such do not properly comprehend the high demands of God's personal holiness as set forth in his perfect law. God says that before the law of God every mouth may be stopped in Romans 3, for all are condemned by that law. God does not judge on a curve. He doesn't judge by moral averages. He judges by his own flawless character. And as the prophet Habakkuk declared, his eyes are too pure than to look upon iniquity, whether it be the iniquity of idolatry and murder, or the iniquity of selfishness, lust, or gossip. Thus, as Paul wrote in Romans, by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. We flatter ourselves if we we believe that our moral goodness somehow outweighs the many ways in which we sin and fall short of God's glory. But even worse, we insult the unchanging and holy character of God if we believe that anything good done by ourselves could take away the offense and offensiveness of our unrighteous attitudes and actions, which we have admittedly done before Him. God cannot deny himself and simply pretend that we have not sinned. Even if we wish to act. Add to the balances a few kind deeds or decent attitudes as humans might judge them. Good works simply do not eliminate the fact of our sins or atone for them. And as long as those sins stand in our record before God, we have no hope of forgiveness and communion with Him. This is clearly the message of the Torah as well as the rest of God's inspired word. The penalty of sin must be paid by another if we would personally hope to establish escape that penalty ourselves. And thus Christianity uniquely proclaims the coming of the Messiah in accordance with God's inscripturated promises to pay the price of sin and make atonement through faith in Him, God's people may be justified before the Lord without sacrificing his unchanging justice. This is at the heart of the Christian message. Without this heart of the Gospel, neither Judaism or Islam present an alternative which is both formally and materially adequate to the nature of God, the human condition or the truths of God's inspired word.

Thank you.

Thank you Dr. Thonson. And now Dr. Tsiki.

Foreign.

Peace and blessings of God be upon you. In the name of God, the most Merciful, the Compassionate. All praise and thanks are due to Allah, the Lord and cherisher of the world. Peace and blessings be upon all his prophets and messengers, Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad, and upon their true followers, those in the past, present and in future. I pray our Lord guide us along the straight path. Show us that which is truth and right and help us to live by it and show us that which is false and untruth and help us to turn away from it. I mean, I'm indeed thankful to the Orange Coast College, its associated students and community service organization for their gracious invitations to me to participate along with my distinguished colleagues in this visiting scoram. As a Muslim, I'm very pleased to have this opportunity opportunity to listen to the representatives of Christianity and Judaism and to share with you some aspects of my faith and tradition. Islam In Islam we do believe in dialogue and discussion, especially with the people of the Book, that is Christians and Jews. God says in the Holy Book.

Quran.

Say O people of the Book, let us come to a common word between you and us that we worship none except God. We are called by our faith that there must be fair and honest dialogue. We must speak the truth, not bear a false testimony against each other and must always use the most respectful and cordial language. The Quran says in the Chapter 16 call to the way of your Lord with wisdom and good admonition and says in chapter number 29 and do not argue with the people of the Book except in a manner that is the best. Accept those who do wrong among them and say we believe in that which is revealed to us and revealed to you and our God and your God is one and we have submitted to Him. Having made these preliminary remarks about dialogue, let me come to our topic, Islam, Judaism and Christianity. Sister Faith in Conflict I shall focus my attention on five points. Who is a Muslim? What is Islam? What is the relationship with Judaism and Christianity? What are the areas of conflict? How can we live in peace and take steps to the resolution of conflict? Now, who is a Muslim? Probably these things are needed because the audience Many of you know Christianity, many of you know Judaism. But I suspect there is a very little knowledge of Islam. So I have to give this preliminary remarks about Islam and Muslim. Muslim is a person, male or female, who says that Islam is his or her religion. Muslim is an identity. This identity transcends races, colors, national background, languages and ethnicities. Muslim can be any person, white, black, brown, yellow, male, female, young, old, rich, poor. There are at present approximately over 1 billion Muslims in the world. About 5 million of them live here in United States of America and approximately 25,000 here in Orange County. Muslims are found in every part of the world. More in some places, less in some others. Some practice their faith more, some less. Some are nominal Muslims, some are real Muslims. Muslims belong to two major groups. Most of them are Sunnis and some Arshias. What is Islam? Islam is the name of our faith. This name is not derived from any person, place or from the name of any group of people who followed it or became dominant in its history at any given time. Christianity takes its name from Christ. Judaism takes its name, it takes its name from Judah. Hinduism takes its name from Hind, which is the land of India. Islam, however, takes its name from certain principles. The word Islam comes from Shalam, or in Hebrew you have Shalom, the word which means peace, wholesomeness. Islam means giving oneself voluntarily, fully to God. This brings ultimate peace, both internal peace as well as external peace. Islam is a vision. Islam is a response. Islam is a hope. Vision of Islam is that there is only one God. Allah is not a tribal God or a special God of Muslims. He is the same God who is spoken as Eloh by Jesus, Elohim by the Old Testament and Allah in Arabic. All the three words Elo, Elohim and Allah are cognate, similar. We believe that God is There is no God but one God. This is the basic creed of Islam. God created all of us and he created everything visible and invisible. He is loving, caring, compassionate, kind and merciful. But he is also strong, great, almighty, a judge, a sovereign Lord. He is just and demand justice. He is righteous and demands righteousness, conduct from individuals as well as nations. God is also a guide. Out of his infinite love and mercy, he sent for our guidance. Many prophets and messengers. Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses, Jesus were all God's prophets and his messengers. We believe in all of them and respect them. We believe in all of them and we believe that finally God sent his final prophet, Muhammad, who brought to us the final message of God and who showed to us how to live by this message. Muhammad was born in the year 571 and died in 632. He was a human being, but he was the most ideal human being. He was a prophet and a statesman. His message is not. His message is most comprehensive. It is to transform the individual, the society and the world. It is spiritual, social, economic and political. Muhammad came to fulfill the prophecies of Abraham, Moses, Jesus. He came to guide all people. Old Testament speaks about him. The gospels of Jesus speak about him. He is mentioned in the book of Genesis, in the book of Deuteronomy, Isaiah, John, many other places. His message is fully preserved and is authentic message. Islam is also a response response of the people like you and me to the word of God. Islam wants you to make a response response to God's initiative to teach you, to guide you, to uplift you spiritually, morally, socially and in every way. This religion does not seek conversion.

And.

Let me repeat, Islam does not seek conversion.