#069: How Alex Ikonn Went from Fired Banker to Shopify Mogul and Beyond

You know, I was from social media perspective in this most perfect life. I have an incredible business. I have now meaning, purpose. I have incredible, you know, I was married. So my business partner was my wife. We have an incredible child. So this most ideally perfect lifestyle. And for a lot of people, it's like, this is too good to be true. And, you know, a year and a half ago, I got dealt with where even though we had a perfect relationship, my wife decided that, you know, she no longer kind of loves me and wants to separate. And that was probably one of the biggest adversity things that I was dealt with. And so I'm going like really high in terms of, uh, dealing with something difficult. And to connect to what you're saying is no matter where you're at, you're still gonna have to face human challenges.

Welcome back to Season 3, Episode 12 of the Turning Pro Podcast. Today we have Alex Icon, who's the founder of Intelligent Change. Thanks for joining us today, Alex.

Thank you for having me.

So I was talking about earlier before we started how great it is to have your own studio because just on a whim you can, you can book an episode. Alex and I were texting yesterday and I was like, He's like, yeah, I'm in town for 2 days. I'm like, great, you're coming on the podcast.

Wait, it came about that quickly?

Yeah.

I just saw the calendar pop up and I was like, oh, this is a very impressive last minute guest that we got on.

Just gotta make it happen.

Exactly. Thank you for having me.

Yeah, I would love to maybe just start, give a quick background.

Yeah, for sure. I think, you know, you know how, I don't know how deep you want me to go.

Yeah, it's not that quick.

Whatever you get excited about. Yeah.

What excites you?

I, well, I think right now overall is is the space that we're in, you know, kind of wellness, self-development. I really believe with the AI that is coming, we just kind of quickly talked about it, a lot is going to change for humanity. And at the core with Intelligent Change, what we do is really help people on their self-actualization journey. Because what I realized for myself is, you know, once you strip out meaning of having to work, because that's what I do with my businesses, is really be able to— and we can get it back into that is how I started, you know, my whole entrepreneurship journey. But once you get to the stage of like, hey, you don't need to work, then the real existential crises really start to creep in. And I think this is the reason why so many people in our society are depressed, uh, or because of really this lack of meaning. And we as humans really need to self-actualize as people.

Do you, do you follow Jeremy Giffen? No, he was the number 2 at Tiny, Andrew Wilkinson's.

Oh, of course. Yeah, I know Andrew. Andrew is a good friend.

Were you an investor in Tiny?

Yeah. So, uh, yeah, I have to be— I'm very grateful to Andrew, and probably 20% of my net worth is because of Andrew. So, uh, wow. Uh, I was involved, um, kind of very early when he took over Backpixel Union and he took it public with e-commerce. So I was part of that. Um, so Andrew is I mean, she's amazing.

Amazing. We got to go into that. That's another story.

But a lot of loops.

What you were bringing up around self-actualization reminds me of a lot of Jeremy Giffen's writing. He's been on a couple of podcasts and pretty prolific on like writing essays and short-form stuff. And something that he talks about a lot is that the scariest thing in the world is when, say, an investor that makes a ton of money or startup founder that makes a ton of money and exits realizes that even though they're good at that thing, it wasn't actually what brings meaning to their life. Like on their deathbed, they may not even remember that. And that's the scariest thing for a lot of people who are very prolific at what they do and then sometimes are told by their friends or others or family that, hey, you know, you actually may derive more meaning from being a third grade teacher or traveling the world or being a photographer. And that kind of comes to terms with like who they are or like the, the embodiment of what they've become. So I'm curious from your lens, Has— have you progressed through that journey too? Like, what was your self-actualization journey?

Yeah, for sure. So let's get into it. So now we're back to the basics. So for me, kind of my backstory is I was born in Russia, Soviet Union, and I immigrated to Canada when I was about 9 years old and really hoping for that better life. You know, my parents were the type of like just sold whatever they had and moved to start a new life. Shortly after, parents divorced because it's very difficult being immigrants in a new country, not knowing language, has never been in that place. And here I am, you know, 10 years old, parents getting divorced, now with like a single mother, 2 kids in a new country, not speaking language. So she's like, we're on welfare, you know, um, she's working night shifts at a factory for cash. Um, I barely see my mom. Like, so from age from 10 to 16, I would say those are kind of like the medieval dark ages of my life where it really shaped me. But I really became like a street kid and where I would just, you know, already be smoking and smoking up and drinking when I was like 11, 12, 13 years old. Then I started like dealing drugs, mostly weed, got caught gambling, all sorts of things. So a lot of people look at my Instagram or my kind of the way I look now, and they're like, oh, he's a preppy white boy, you know, he's just being handed everything, he's never struggled. What do you have to say? Yeah, it's easy for you to be grateful because your life is so good. But the reality why I kind of speak about this is that my life was very difficult. You know, I remember coming home not having food, having to maybe make pasta was going to be like a nice meal. Well, if I have a canned tuna, that's like, you know, gourmet. So it was really difficult, especially not having a present father or not having a present mother in my life. And God bless her, because she wasn't— she was not present because she had to provide for us. And of course, there's so many people these days, as you know, we're in New York now, it's such an expensive city. People have to live and work 2, 3 jobs just to get by. And that was really the upbringing that I came up with. So similar to how I'm connecting this to my self-actualization journey, Growing up poor, you just want to be rich. You're like, I just want to be rich. I just want to have money. I just don't want to work. I want to win the lottery. I remember so many people buy lottery. Oh, what if I win the lottery? How will my life be? What will I do? I never want to work a day in my life. That's kind of because coming from that very poor, lower class, that's what you think. Is going to solve all your problems, money, because you don't have it. And so for me, I grew up wanting to be in finance, want to be a stockbroker, Wall Street, because back in the day, you know, entrepreneurship wasn't as sexy. It was being in finance that was going to get you and make you a lot of money. And so I thought, you know, I'm going to be a banker, make lots of money. And that's what I'm going to become. So ever since I was very young, I want to be a banker. And then I finally turned my life around because, you know, I think there's a few rock bottoms that you may hit in your life, and for me, I just kept hitting them. And one of them was I got arrested, and then I was still juvenile, so I wasn't of age, and had to go to court, and my mother had to come with me. And being in court and seeing other youth like me, and looking in their eyes, I saw that many of them lost hope. They're already— you can see, like, there's— they turned against society. They're like, the society is against me, kind of screw the world, and they don't care, you know. It's not their first rodeo, kind of being arrested and being in court. And in that low, I realized I don't want to be like these kids. Like, I have such a better future. My mom is like, she's so sweet, you know, and she didn't, you know, hit me, blame me, think I'm like, I'm a loser. She really believed in me. And so I was like, you know what, like, I have to like get my life around. And but it was a very difficult time. And I'll say lows of the lows, same thing. Like, then my father passed away from cancer, and it all happened around the same time. And then also I had like— I used to play basketball, broke my arm, my arm didn't move, they said I'm going to be disabled. So there's like a trifecta of just shit going on in my life where you're like, what is happening with me? And I think life will put you in these difficult places to make you realize, like, get your shit together. And or you don't and you go down the path, you know, as, you know, even going up to the studio here in New York, you have so many homeless, so many people who are lost. And to be honest, potentially I could have been that case if I did not have the awareness to be like, you know what, I have so much going for me because in those times you can feel like the world is against you. and that, you know what, might as well say fuck it and just go against society. However, I believe slowly, that's when I actually discovered Tony Robbins. And for me, it was life-changing because it showed me that by setting goals and visualizing and having something to strive for in your life can really change your life. So that is really, I would say, it was a pivotal moment in my self-actualization journey, realizing how you can start looking to the future. And even if your life is messy at the moment, you can turn it around. So anyways, fast forward, uh, started getting my life around, um, got a job at the bank, more retail level, got into university for business. Like, it was really like quick. And I think that's the amazing thing is once you decide to like, you know, like I'm going to— you, number one, you're aware, like I'm a fucking loser, right? Be aware. Like if you're fat, you're fat. Like if you're like broke, you're broke. Like decide what you got to do and what your situation is and what you have to do to turn around. So at that moment, I got really real, be like, hey, Alex, like the way you're leading your life is like not going to get you in good places. And really started changing my life around. And then I would say, again, as just things are picking up, I got a job at the bank, I'm working university, I got a girlfriend, you know, like things are good. Boom, I get fired. It's 2008, you know, the financial crisis. And I get fired from being in the bank. And I didn't get fired because of financial crisis. I got fired actually because I had a side hustle. And I think side hustles are kind of welcome now. But if you're working in the financial industry, you can't do side hustles. And lesson to everybody, don't use your corporate email for anything. There's no conflict of interest, nothing illegal. But if you're running a different business that's totally not related, don't do it on your day job. Respect the day job and do something else. However, once again, just as I'm climbing up, boom, it hit another rock. I'm like, oh my God, like, what's going on? Like, this was my dream and I fucked it up. And then I kind of said, you know what, I had 2 more years of university left and I was going to university full-time and I was working full-time. So in Canada, York University, you can take lectures for a Bachelor of Commerce at night. So I'd have lectures 7 to 10 and work 9 to 5. So I said, okay, no more day job, but let me give this entrepreneurship thing a shot for 2 more years until I have school left and see what happens. And so that's when I really entered into entrepreneurship. I then learned about The 4-Hour Workweek and the whole lifestyle business. I'm like, this is it. This is my kind of way out. I don't need much. I can just have a lifestyle business. And very quickly, Uh, from then on, of course, not so quickly. It took about 2 years of failed ventures, and I think it was what you guys can relate as well. Like, this is what I love about New York, is the hustle culture. And a lot of times you have to try different things to see what sticks. So for 2 years, I did different things. One of them was social media consulting in 2008. So if you look back then, you know, Gary Vee was definitely a huge inspiration with like Crush It and everything that he was doing then. Another kind of New York local, Seth Godin, was a huge inspiration in regards to his book Linchpin. And it really got me thinking how social media is really going to change everything. And I really believed in it. But back then, being a social media consultant, you're a snake oil salesman. Everyone's like, this is not going to work. And you might as well be selling snake oil because people didn't believe in social media. And just kind of fast forward to everything, and we then kind of started our first business, which was an e-commerce business, D2C. We're store 4,000 on Shopify. We used to be, you know, top 10 Shopify store for like 3 years running at the beginning, and back in those early days of e-commerce. However, I always led the business more from a lifestyle perspective. Lifestyle, meaning I would just have 2 staff, travel the world. Like, as soon as we opened the business, we went to like south of France and then like go to Costa Rica to surf. It was very laid back. It was not like, hey, let's make the biggest business possible. However, in that time, very quickly, because we made, you know, in our first year of business, we did like a million revenue, second year of business, 3 million. So fairly quickly, I went from being a poor kid in, you know, some suburb of Toronto, so all of a sudden having freedom of time, freedom of money, and also freedom of having love in my life, meaning I'm not seeking love, I have love in my life, I have everything that you can ever want. And to get to the point that you're talking about, then you hit against a real existential crisis of what's my purpose, what's my meaning. At that point, my first business was in hair extensions. I'm like, am I here to sell hair extensions? Like, is this, is this what I'm here to do? And I'm just— and then just to consume and live this hedonistic lifestyle, it felt very empty. And that is, I would say, really was the beginning of me wanting to create and make money in a way that has purpose and meaning beyond just for myself.

I want to talk about a point you made where you get in trouble when you're young. You're like, I don't want to be that kid, I need to find something else to do. And then you find this business, and then you kind of go back to that, you know, place of loneliness or lack of purpose. I'm curious to hear, as your career has evolved, how has your barometer for like, this is something I should be doing versus not, evolved as well? Because I think one of the misconceptions for people who look on social media and they look at people who are successful because they've started a business or they've traveled or they've made money, they just assume that those people don't actually deal with any sort of adversity because oftentimes social media paints a picture that they want you to see, not what actually is real. So I'm curious, as you've gone up the ladder in all your different ventures, I imagine you're still dealing with adversity along the way, but how has that changed for you from like Day one, it's I need to figure out how to put food on the table. That's obviously not your issue now, but that doesn't mean you're not dealing with issues like every day when you're going on your journey.

Well, I think, you know, to talk about something recent, like a really big adversity is, you know, I was from social media perspective in this most perfect life. I have an incredible business. I have now meaning, purpose. I have incredible, you know, I was married, so my business partner was my wife. We have an incredible child. So this most ideally perfect lifestyle. And for a lot of people, it's like, this is too good to be true. And, you know, a year and a half ago, I got dealt with where even though we had a perfect relationship, my wife decided that, you know, she no longer kind of loves me and wants to separate. And that was probably one of the biggest adversity things that I was dealt with. And so I'm going like really high in terms of, um, dealing with something difficult. And to connect to what you're saying is no matter where you're at, you're still gonna have to face human challenges. And sometimes those things are in different ways, you know. You have— you may have, you know, a family— they may— members that may die, or somebody else, or you may have some sort of health issues, or something else may arise, or you may have difficulty in your relationship. You know, things change, especially when it's kind of long term. And in those moments, for me, the way I have been able to deal with such a a massive blow when you think you're on top of the world is really go back to basics. And so for me, from the beginning of my journey, when I turned my life around, one of the things I didn't really focus too much is really that gratitude has been the biggest guiding light in my life. Because when everything was really dark when I was young and it seemed to be like there's no hope, and I'm on this really wrong path. When I discovered that the practice of gratitude, meaning what can you be grateful for in your life, even when everything is going to shit. And so for me, back then, I started slowly practicing and the way I would do it is I'd wake up in the morning and I challenged myself to say at least one thing that I'm grateful for. And if I would forget, and when I wake up in the morning, I'll take a shower, and usually when I'm in the shower, I'll say it. And for me, even to this day, it's still to the basic things, which is I'm just grateful to be alive, to live another day, to be healthy. Because I think many of us know that once our health is taken away, you're like, you don't want anything. You don't want a nice meal. You don't want a kiss. You just want to be healthy. And that's why for me, that's really kind of the foundation of everything. And also what really helped me to see the light is instead of seeing even at the beginning of, hey, I have nothing going for me, is realizing, hey, at that point I was like, I was 17 living in Canada. I have so much opportunities. Any 80-year-old billionaire would trade places with me in an instant. To be a broke 17-year-old in Canada. Okay, like that's a great spot to be in. And same thing now, of course, you have to, as I said before, to be present with the challenges and the pain that you have. So you can't be totally ignorant of the fact of what may have happened. And, but then you also have to pick up by thinking, okay, what else do I— in my life do I still can be grateful for? And that is, you know, everyone's still healthy. Even my partner is healthy, my daughter is healthy, I'm healthy. We have abundance of options, opportunity. We have great communication relationship where we can go through stuff, we can be understanding. And I also have the time to be able to have for myself to be able to say, how do I approach this next chapter? And so for me, what would be the big challenges as I painted from when I was younger or now to even the smaller ones, my really guiding force is always to go back to gratitude and to think of, okay, yes, this may be bad. However, what do I still have in my life that I can be grateful for and appreciate in this moment? And a lot of times the challenges allow us to have the biggest opportunities. As I said, when I got fired from the bank, which was my dream job, like, what's there to be grateful for? You know, like at that point I thought like I was literally that guy with a cardboard box, like, get out of here. And that closed door, which was my dream, and I was really sad to be fired from the bank. I really wanted to be a banker, allowed me to have one of the best things in my life, which is to become an entrepreneur, to have freedom. And now when I think back, I'm like, thank God I'm not a banker. But at that moment, it's hard to appreciate, it's hard to be grateful, like, of that what you were dealt. And so even now, to these smaller, bigger opportunities, I think of how do we— how do I go with the flow and surrender when life may be closing a door for you? And how do you appreciate what happened? So for example, even I'm appreciative of, of all the great moments in the relationship that I have. And how can I now be appreciative for the potential future I may be able to see? Because the beautiful thing about in life that I see is that we don't know. You know, you really don't know what's going to happen next. I didn't know I was going to be on this podcast, right, until we talked about it yesterday. Like, hey, come in. I'm like, cool. And you don't know what the next opportunity is going to create for you in your life. And so for me, The magic that I create is by being curious, being open, and keep opening doors and walking into those doors with appreciation, even though sometimes it may not be the greatest thing that hap— will happen to you.

I want to talk about your mindset. You mentioned earlier, you know, you had this lifestyle business that was doing 1 and then 3. All of a sudden you had money, you could travel the world. I'm sure you could go expensive dinners, you can go out. And I'm really curious about the moment or series of moments where you realized maybe this isn't what I want or it isn't making me happy. Mm. Because I— you've seen me through this kind of like early phases. I run a marketing agency and the first year where we immediately started to do revenue figures like that, I immediately started— I got a nice apartment, I got a car. We're going to fancy hotels, fancy dinners. And then looking back on that period, after 6 months, I was like, I don't even remember the last 6 months. It was like a blur. And then I was surfing with my girlfriend in Costa Rica. We were just going out for a bit for my birthday, and that memory like overshadowed anything of the past 6 months. And I was on a $10 surfboard in Playa Hermosa, and we were just surfing all day. We get out, the sun's beating down, and that didn't cost really that much money. There was no business around. We weren't going to crazy fancy dinners, but that still I remember way more than like the blur of the, quote, idyllic 6 months that I'm sure you see on social media following like Adam Horowitz or Iman Gadzhi or any of those folks. And so in that vein, like, tell me more about the moments that you were like, what am I doing? Is this actually bringing me happiness?

Yeah, I think a big part of— and even it's interesting that, you know, we're doing this podcast now. I actually rarely do podcasts. I really share this journey, but I'm kind of committing to being more open and realizing kind of a new version of myself. And for me, it was fairly early of— society will paint certain things that you need, and you run a marketing agency, you said, so you're, you know, you're kind of the blame for this.

I am.

And we're all in business. So for us, for businesses to be able to sell their products, they have to communicate that, hey, you're lacking something or you're in pain. So here's my product that's going to solve your problem. And a lot of businesses sell this, that you're not enough. You need this. You need this dinner. You need this holiday. You need this type of car, you need this type of home to be something. And that's fine. I went on that journey too. And I bought my convertible dream car that I wanted. I had a certain amount of bank that I thought I needed to have. I bought the dream house. And then as you said, the most important thing is being aware and sitting with yourself. Does this actually bring me joy? Do I care about this? Let's say you buy that fancy watch that you see the influencers wear and you're like, does this genuinely bring me that happiness every time I wear it? If it does, great. If, same thing as that car, if you're really into cars and you do it, amazing. Do it. However, for me, for example, I live in London. You can literally offer me Bugatti. Like, Alex, would you like a Bugatti or ride your bicycle as you do? I would take my bicycle because I have more joy riding my bicycle in between London, between meetings, than being stuck in traffic in a fancy car. As cool as it may make me look, however, I know in my heart that having the freedom to just, you know, bike is what brings me more joy. And figuring out that, let's say as well, living in a house in Toronto in the right neighborhood, but still having to drive does not bring me as much joy as maybe having a smaller apartment in London, but in a city where I love being. So it's really about, so for me it was having that luxury of being able to do the things that I can do. And sometimes it does take you, you know, making that money, selling that company, going on those holidays to realize actually it doesn't bring me happiness. And for all those people who are like, yeah, it's easy for you to say, great, go out there, make that money, go out and do it, but see for yourself. But the most important factor is be honest with yourself. If you're not actually happy, change something around.

What do you think is the driving force that has caused so many people in society to just like long for this fake life where, you know, you see the cars, you see the watches, all the success, and then every time you talk to someone who's been there, like, you're not the first person who's been like, I made the money, I did the things, and I'd rather ride my bicycle. And then you have the young kid who, to what you just said, is like, it's easy for you to say because you've been there, but why have we built a culture where everyone strives to get to this like pinnacle despite hearing all these people who've been there say, trust me, like, this is not the thing that you really want to strive for? But even if I tell you that, you're still gonna think I'm naive or like not really understanding of how you feel because I've been there. Like, what do you think? It's social media? Do you think there's just an illusion that you are like a product of your environment. So when you're exposed to more, you always feel like you're not enough. Like, I always wonder why there's so many people who will talk to someone who's been there, who's done that, is like, trust me, this is not peak happiness. And they'll hear it, they might internalize it, but they still don't believe it because they're going to go to sleep at night sad that they didn't get that like physical thing. And I don't understand why that is, like how our society is now.

I, I think it's fine. Like I said, I was part of— I had to go on that journey myself as as well. And all of us have our own individual journeys, and we have to learn our own lessons. And this is why I believe— let's say even me, I'm a parent now— or the way I was raised, sometimes you have to let your kid touch that hot pan and learn from himself that it's hot, you know, that it's gonna hurt you. You, as much as you may tell them, they have to feel it for themselves. So there's nothing I think entirely wrong in people seeking that. What, where that all comes from, as I said before, is really our consumer society, capitalism, and that's how it's built up. And at the same time, I feel there's, you know, there's good things of capitalism that come to it. At the core, I'm very grateful for America and it's because it's a big part of my business. And for people consuming. However, I think the future is now is how do we shift the narrative to be more towards building businesses that are actually, let's say, solving real problems or actually helping people on their journey versus getting into a space that's not going to be really helpful on their journey. And we should strive and evolve to do that. Doesn't mean it's going to happen right away. And at the same time, I want to say is some people generally do enjoy those things. I've been kind of part of social media and e-commerce now for more than a decade. I've seen a lot. And a lot of the guys that you see on social media, I'm either friends with them or I actually was the one to tell them to go on social media because that's my background. So for example, You know, Tai Lopez, I told you, like he stayed in my house in London, like before he was Tai Lopez. And I told him like, I'm like, Tai, you're such a character. You should film yourself and go on YouTube. And then here it was here in my garage, right? The thing is with people will say, Tai will say, flaunts that type of lifestyle of Lamborghinis, women, all that stuff. But I knew Tai before. That is him. That is authentic to him, right?

Yeah.

So you can't blame the guy. So if there's people who want to be like that, great. Great. So it's up to me, for example, and I obviously also have certain things to blame. I also show off my beautiful lifestyle and the way I live, but I want to be able to also be an inspiration for a different thing. And that's my journey. That's true to me. That doesn't mean that Tai is going to have to change and trade his Ferrari for a bicycle if he really enjoys his Lamborghini. All hats to him. Same with Iman Ghazi, you know, like when I was in Dubai, Iman rolls up his Rolls-Royce for me and I go to his house, like cool, but that's him. I can't like, I'm like, hey Iman, let's go meditate. Maybe he's just like, I'm not into it.

Yeah.

So everyone has to go on their journey. Everyone has to go through their experience. All we can do is really bring our authentic selves to reality. So I think anyone listening to this is, All I recommend is be in touch with yourself. Even, you know, last night I'm here in New York and currently my girlfriend, she takes me to Sleep No More in New York. And like after like 15 minutes, I'm like, I'm done. It's like, this is not for me, you know, like, and I leave. And some people will go through the whole experience. Me, I'm like, you know, it's not for me. I was at Burning Man. I was like, that's my—

wait, so actually, this is, to be honest with you, the reason he's sitting here right now. You come straight from Burning Man.

Burning Man?

Yeah, well, so the reason he's sitting here right now is he posted a story on Instagram, uh, a couple days ago, and it basically was something along the lines of Burning Man is very cool, right? There's a lot of art, it's a lot of freedom, expression, creativity, but it's not for me. And I responded to his story and I was like, thank you for sharing this, because that was always— I've never been to it. I've been invited multiple times and I haven't gone because I'm like, I think I would get there and be like, this is so magical, but it's not for me. And so I messaged him on Instagram and said that. He responded, he goes, I'm in New York. That's his response. And I was like, great, come on the podcast.

What to say to that? So even being there, and some people will say, hey, you have to see things fully to really judge. And it's true by all means. But I think I've come to a point where I've experienced so many things and I'm still open to experience. That's why I went to Burning Man. So I'm still open to the experience. However, you can also be in the experience pay a lot of money for that experience and realize, hey, you know what? Like, time is precious. This is going to be 6 more days of my life, and I'd rather be in Yosemite in nature. That's my vibe, right? That's what I did. I left Burning Man and I went to—

Did you leave before you were planning on leaving? You're like—

Of course, I was supposed to stay there for like almost a week, 6 nights. I left after the first night.

Oh, I didn't really— Okay, I knew you left, but I didn't know you literally were there for one night.

You made that call so quick. Wow. And it was a lot of money. Like, you know, it was— Burning Man is not cheap, especially if you're staying in RV and a cool camp with food and everything. We had like proper showers, toilets. Like, it was amazing. Like, the setup was incredible. But for me, I couldn't sleep the first night and it was a bit crazy. I'm like, okay, I get it. And yeah, I can stay here. But at that point I was like, you know what? Like, it's not really my jam. So I leave. And for a lot of people, they wouldn't do that because like I said, they paid a lot of money there. And especially once you paid a lot of money, you're like, I'm going to see this through. And the way I see it is like, time is precious. Life is precious. Like you could die tomorrow. So you might as well enjoy it and live fully and do the things that truly bring you joy. Like my highlight from Burning Man, there was a car with like a basketball hoop and they just left basketballs and I was just shooting around like and shooting some baskets. I'm like, that was my highlight. So I'm like, but I don't have to be at Burning Man to shoot basketball.

It's an expensive round of, uh, free throw.

Yeah, it was the most expensive round of basketball I've ever done. So it's really about, you know, embracing and doing the things that bring you joy and going back in real life. Hey, you start going all these fancy things and you realize, you know what, playing pickup basketball with my boys every week is what I enjoy. Do that. And same thing in business, like shifting. I know a lot of the audience that listens to you is entrepreneurs or aspiring entrepreneurs. I think the biggest mistake many people make is we also have this culture of entrepreneurship and startups and being in business. And before I used to believe everyone can be an entrepreneur. And now I've learned, no, not everyone can be an entrepreneur. And the reason for is, if you're going to go into the entrepreneurship journey as well, you have to genuinely enjoy business, meaning listening to podcasts like this, being curious, wanting to improve, not being afraid of hustling, staying up, working late, whatever it takes, learning, getting that first sale. And for a lot of people, it's, you know, speaking to somebody recently, a good, you know, a family member. And they had, they've been on this journey of trying to be kind of an entrepreneur. And I'm like, dude, just like go back and do your regular job. You'll be happy. Like that person's a teacher. Just be a teacher. Like you have summers off. You have a good salary, you do something good for society, the whole entrepreneurship thing may not be for you. And that's why I love— I was in Japan earlier this year. Of course, there's certain toxic things about that culture, but one of the most beautiful things about that culture is that a lot of people really take pride in what they do. If they're a barista, they're like, you know, I'm going to be the best barista and just like be present within and bring my essence to what I do. And I think a lot of times in our society, you can see this, you know, most major cities in the world is there's a lot of comparison. So the baristas are pissed off because these, you know, hedge fund guys are coming in and they're doing coffee for these guys and they feel like they're disrespected. No, like whatever you do is your art. And this is why one of my favorite books of all time is Linchpin by Seth Godin. I mentioned it before. And it's a book that got me on my journey. He really got me to realize is that any job that you do, you have to bring your emotional self to it. Meaning if you're not bringing your essence, your being to it, then you're actually— it's not that you're actually taking something away from yourself because you can be a a FedEx delivery guy who's happy, who's interactive, and makes the best of his, really, life. Because so much of what we do is work. And we've all met those, you know, waiters or baristas or delivery people who are present. And you're like, damn, like, these people are, you know, they're embodying themselves in their spirit. And they're not only sharing themselves with others, they're also bringing that essence to themselves. So this is why what I'm really passionate about is really inspiring people to bring their full selves to whatever they do, whether that is you're a teacher or you're a hedge fund manager, you also do it fully. And there's a lot of hedge fund managers who are miserable.

I'd say majority.

Yeah, yeah.

If I had to guess.

So, so same thing. How do you shift that away? Because as you said, I run, I invited you to it earlier this year, the Intelligent Change Summit in Ibiza, where we fully take over Six Senses Ibiza. And the event is really created for these people, meaning people who have in a way made it and to help them realize if they're already on their journey, great. But if not, what are, how do you get in touch with yourself? To see what can you really do that will help you really connect with yourself and allow you to live life fully. Because so many— there's so many people who already have enough, and enough is, is different for different people. However, they keep doing the same thing because, uh, they're good at it. And instead, I believe we should be going towards how do we find our ikigai. I don't know if you find, you know, that Japanese term ikigai is doing what— it's the intersection of doing what you love, what you're good at, what the world needs, and what you can get paid for. And many times people just look at, okay, I can get paid for this and I'm good at this, but maybe you're not actually enjoying yourself. And that's a big missing link that's going to be a void in your life that you shouldn't ignore.

I want to get more tactical about— I want to make it useful for someone. I don't know, maybe yourself 5 years ago, right? That is just starting to make money or just starting to have some degree of freedom from both like capital as well as time perspective. And so can you walk us through things that just from your experience have been like a great use of time or capital, like that bike and maybe not so great uses like a fancy vacation or a fancy ski chalet? Like for you, what has been actually worth the money or time?

Or just in terms of things?

Yeah. Or experiences?

Experiences. Really good question. I think I host most of the time in London, and when you're there, I'll invite you as well, monthly dinners where I host and pay for the dinners, and I invite different people to them, usually for 14 to 16 people, sometimes 10. And also I probably do lunches with people at least 4 times a week. Kiefer Azzi never eat alone. Most of the time I cover the tab as well. For me, investing into relationships and getting to know people, probably some of the best money spent. And I have paid for a lot of lunches and dinners where like, okay, that was a waste of time. But I feel like there's this culture of dating for people trying to get sex, but like dating just people just to meet great humans and people is probably one of the most underrated things out there. And this is why I also run the summit, you know, as well, is because I genuinely love connecting with others. And meeting great people and also bringing people together. And there's something that happens when you do that. And most importantly, I would say doing it unconditionally, because a lot of people, when they do things, they do things with conditions. They're like, okay, I'm going to do this because I'm going to get this contact and this is going to happen and this is going to happen. No, like I do things not think of anything. I just do it because I genuinely enjoy, as we're doing now, getting to know people and learning more about them and their journey and also seeing how I can be helpful. So for me, like I said, that's one thing that I enjoy doing and how I love spending my money. The other thing is also the summit. You know, actually, although there's a fee, it is now, you know, 2 years running, I probably invested or lost a quarter of a million dollars on running these summits. So this is pretty big. But same thing, when I look back, I'm doing another one next year, right?

I thought you told me this one was the last one.

I know, but like, you do it, you're like, I want to do it again. So that's one thing is just building community and connecting with people. I really enjoy doing that. The other thing for me really simple is in terms of money, where you live, your home. So your bedding, your bed, your mattress, one of the best investments you can make. And I'm still always—

I agree with that.

Trying to up that in terms of how to increase that experience. Same thing, for example, simple things like a mug you drink coffee out of. A lot of times I remember when I first saw a mug for like a Japanese ceramic mug for like $50, I'm like, this is crazy. But then I'm like, you know what? Pay per use. If I use this, drink out of this mug, say 300 days of the year, it's nothing. Yeah. You're going to get a matcha or whatever at a at a Blank Street where we were just talking about for whatever, I don't know, $6. You do 10 of those. That's it. You're done. Here you're at home. You can make your own little matcha and your own amazing mug that feels great to you. That's awesome. So invest in things that bring you little joy. And for me, that's like that little mug that I touch and feel every day. And other things as well is like, I love travel. So we can also shift into kind of routines and travel and things like that. Especially in the last year, I've traveled a lot because I went on, you know, when I separated from my wife, I went on a semi-sabbatical. So I couldn't go full sabbatical because I still have to run things a little bit. But I'm like semi. But I traveled probably half the time around the world and went to incredible places. And for me to this day, I love travel. At the same time, for some people, you may see these influencers travel and you go on your holidays, you're like, this sucks. So don't travel. I know people like that who they— I tell them to come to Positano, they come to Positano and they're like, this is the worst place ever. Like, it's crowded, it's busy, it's hot. I just want to be in my home in San Jose. I'm like, dude, go back to your home in San Jose and enjoy yourself. You know, like It's not your thing. I go there every year and I feel like I'm in heaven. So everyone really has their thing. But for me, those are some of the things that bring me joy.

What about things that don't? Maybe Burning Man is on the X list. That's like bad uses of time or capital.

For me, what I've learned is, for example, a car. I think a car is just a nuisance. Like I have to park it, I have to maintain it, I have to drive it. I have to— to, you know, take care of it. It's a lot of work. Also real estate. I have a lot of friends who have a lot of real estate. I actually don't own any real estate. And just to keep things simple, like, I like to not have to worry about too many things, you know. So, and with the car, some of my friends have cars in London. I think that would be idiotic to have a car in London in terms of driving around. It would just bring a lot of hassle into my life. So the way I really make decisions is, will this make my life easier or will this make my life harder? And I tend to choose the things that will improve my well-being, quality of life.

How do you think about guarding your time? I feel like The more successful you get, the more access to opportunities you get, the more access to relationships you get. And as someone who likes to community build and bring people together, there's obviously gotta be a line somewhere. How do you think about prioritization with your time?

For sure. So, and it's crazy because, oh, I used to be that guy who'd want to be able to have people connect with him, reach out to him. And yes, over time you become more selective. And to what I said earlier is you just know who will kind of bring you joy. At the same time, I still believe you have to be open to some serendipity moments. Even I was in Bali and I rarely do this, but somebody reached out to me. And it's like, hey, you want to meet up? I'm here in Bali. It was just somewhere like not a person, not an entrepreneur now, but just a regular person. I'm like, sure, whatever, let's grab lunch. And I grabbed lunch with like her and her husband and we had a chat and it helped me kind of connect. So what I'm trying to say is for sure become more guarded over time. But at the same time, leave room for some of that serendipity to see what might kind of happen. However, for sure, more and more selective over time, and I can see as I grow older, I'll be even more selective with my time.

Do you just not respond to some people, or do you feel— still feel an urge to like respond to people and just say no?

No, I just don't respond. And I know it's kind of— it sucks, but you just don't have time. There's too many— there's important emails I'm not responding to right now. I'm not even talking to strangers, right? So after time, you can take it personally.

I'm curious, right now, we talked about kind of the last 5 to 10 years, lows and highs and other low and high and kind of what you've learned. Right now, today, in the next 6 months, what are you kind of grappling with internally about things that you want to change or things that maybe you need to be more honest with yourself about that aren't making you happy anymore or are making you more happy and you want to spend more time there?

Okay, yeah, I'll be very honest. So I'm going through a huge change in my life. So one of the things that we didn't get into is that although on paper I've done very well, in business, you know, with, let's say, previous business was an 8-figure business that we then sold. Intelligent Changes, an 8-figure a year business that, you know, we're currently running, you know, over 2 million journals sold. You can calculate that, how much that kind of generates. But I've done all these things without ever actually stepping in in the companies that I run and being the CEO. I've, uh, you know, I've had a GM who then became CEO. And my previous company, we sold, but I never took that position of day-to-day leadership in the company. And for the first time this week, I'll be stepping in as CEO of Intelligent Change. Yeah, thank you so much.

Wow, it's a huge change, man.

Yeah, and my friends were joking with me. They got me like, uh, congrats on the new job, like greeting cards and things like that when they were visiting me in London. And the reason I say that to what we're speaking about before is by all means, been very successful, done very well. I live and lead a beautiful life of, you know, also purpose, but also a lot of freedom. And what I've realized for myself is I want to actually build something meaningful. That is beyond just serving me short term. And now being around many great founders and operators, company builders, many, for a long time I felt like an imposter. Like, I don't know if I can build a company that is that substantial and meaningful. And now, As I'm close to many of these people, I realize they're just like me. And the difference that they have is that they decide, they build, they also decide on the vision that they want to build and they go after it. And I think I have the foundation to be in a place where I'm not doing this to make more money because I need more money or want more money. I'm doing this because I really, I genuinely want to serve and do this out of a place of meaning and purpose. And that's why I'm kind of really excited to be able to step in. It doesn't mean forever I'll be in this kind of a place, but for me, right, it's a big transition that I'm making of actually being active and not just being, as many people would think, I'm on a holiday all the time. So I'm actually going to be in the office.

Was there one moment where you like things change and you're like, all right, it's time for me to step in?

I've been trying to hire for— I had a CEO last year, it didn't work out, and then had a GM, it didn't work out. And I had a consultant who I'm working with, like an advisor, and she's like, Alex, you're trying to hire a CEO, but who's going to make— be making decisions at the end of the day? I'm like, me. She's like, you're not gonna get a good CEO like in that way because you're always gonna be the person who's making the last call and people won't feel— CEO is not gonna feel empowered if you're actually the CEO, unless you just want a manager. And she really just brought it to light to me that I am that person who needs to step into this position and be able to lead in that way. Because I think when you— there's several things happen when you say you raise money or you do give yourself the CEO title is ultimately the responsibility comes to you and you have to be responsible for your team and for the business to lead it through. Versus for me, I felt like, oh, you know, like I'll just— I won't take that responsibility. And that way I don't— I won't feel guilty because the way I am as a person, like once I decide, and I put myself in that position, I have to show up in that way. And so that's why for me it was more of an opportunity as well to show up and to do it.

Are you nervous? Are you excited?

No, I'm super excited. And same thing, because I don't have investors, I choose to— I personally invest in companies, but I don't take people's money, even though there's people emailing me probably every week wanting to invest is that I can build at my own pace. And that's what excites me, is being able to build at the pace that I want to build.

I love that. I want to talk about London briefly before we wrap up, because we were talking about this.

Yeah.

And we were talking specifically about like environment and pace of living compared to New York. And even though you're in New York right now, I'm sure you like parts of New York and kind of the energy that it brings. Expanding from just, you know, investing in your room and your mattresses and your bedsheets, I feel like a big part of the happiest people I know, they're very intentional, not just the city that they're in, but like the neighborhood that they're in in that city. And again, you can have different seasons of your life. Like right now, your season of life is you're building a really fast-growing company. You want to be right in the middle of it.

Yeah.

Literally in the middle of it. But you, I'm sure living in this apartment, you'd be going crazy because it's like right in the heart of New York.

Yeah.

And maybe you want a little more space and time. And so walk me through like how intentional were you about London, this neighborhood in London, this area, like, like even the specific streets that like, I think this is the right fit for what I want.

Oh, I think it's, it's a super important question and being intentional, the city that you live and you just said the neighborhood that you live. And the street that you live is very important. And you're asking the right guy. I was actually gonna mention it before to your question that you were speaking about, you know, best money kind of spent. Um, and that is for sure will connect to this question, which is a city, neighborhood and street. For me, like I said, I grew up in Toronto. I had the opportunity to really also then live anywhere in the world, and we chose London. If you love to travel like I do, London is an incredible global hub. We have 5 international airports, I believe, and direct flights to most places in the world. It's very easy to get to places. That's one. That's just the— if you love to travel, it's a really great city. It's English speaking, so which really helps for us coming from North America, because other places, whether it be Milan or Paris or Munich or Madrid, the culture is still different. And us coming in with our English speaking vibe, we're not going to switch to speaking the language most likely. We're going to be like, hey, Yeah, bonjour, can I get a baguette? Like, fitting in perfectly. Yeah, as far as we go. Yeah, you know, ciao, like, you know, like in Italy.

So bonjour, can we get a baguette?

That's a— I love that.

Like, yeah, that's, that's actually a big tip in France. Just say bonjour to them no matter what. It's like a sign of respect. You just have to say hi. So it's all I've learned.

And then pivot back to English.

Yeah, or struggle, like pretend like you're You're trying to speak French and they'll just switch to English. But in regards to place, same thing. I was just in, you know, national parks, the great national parks of the US, Yosemite, Tahoe, you know, Big Sur. We're so disconnected from nature. And I feel same for some people. Maybe live it out in nature. And some people want to just live in nature and do it. You can do it with online business. You can live anywhere in the world right now. You can live in Bali if you want to surf and have that kind of culture. Although cities will shape you as a person. What I love about New York, as you said, for the season in your life, if I was in my 20s single, for sure I would be. And building, for sure I'll be in New York. It's, uh, this is the city of hustle and you see it everywhere you go. I'm on the taxi and there's guys peddling jeans on the side of a car, you know, like I love that.

Oh, the Canal Street hustle, man, it's inspiring.

No, but it's—

someone has something to sell you at every corner of New York City and everywhere you go you just have to spend money, like it's just—

and, and so it's part of life. And it gets you thinking in terms of consumerism. So there's something like, that's the reality. This is what the city is. And if you want to be in that mode of hustle, it's great because it will allow you to embody that. And that's a word that I've used a lot and like really be it and be part of it versus, yeah, if you're going to be in Spain, they're going to have a little siesta. They're going to take it easy. They're not going to be like, why are you working so hard? It's gonna be a different vibe. In London, it's also an expensive city like New York, but I feel like London is a good place to go once you have some sort of money. You can still get by there. It's still, I think, a cheaper place to live than New York. But it's so you'll have a better life if you can live in how we see London. Because a lot of people also look at my stories, they're like, you know, it's fake London. People don't live like this in London. It's only, you know, the select a few, which is true. For me, where I live, the most important thing is, is I'm facing trees. I don't want to face a building.

I haven't seen a tree in a long time.

For me, it's super important. So if I lived in New York, I would have to be close to Central Park. Yeah. So that at least on a daily, I can connect with nature. For me, it's like vital. A lot of people see my stories I step into my garden barefoot, do my workout there.

You're always grounding.

Yeah, that's what makes me happy.

Yeah.

So I think, um, and for a lot of people, it will, it will take time. For me, it took a long time to also tweak to see what I like. Uh, for example, I like high ceilings. That's why in London I only live on the first floor because the way the houses are built, you have ground floor, first floor, which is second floor, uh, second, third, fourth floor. As you go higher, penthouse is actually the lowest ceiling height in London. So saying, oh, I live in the penthouse in London, that's not a good look, actually.

You're learning. See, don't say this.

Yeah, I want a penthouse. Like, no, in London you don't want a penthouse. It's like the hottest, like, and the lowest ceiling. That's where like the maids lived, you know? So like you want actually a first floor. Those are like the grand floors.

I feel like your recurring advice is be ruthlessly honest with yourself about what you actually like and what makes you happy. And that can maybe just start with like writing it down when you are happy and writing down what not makes you happy, or like when you're not fulfilled. I think I was using a 5-Minute Journal. I went off schedule, I wasn't using the prompts.

Yeah.

And I remember one weekend I was like writing down like the things that made me happy and things that not. And it was like sauna workout and like a dinner with friends and like a long solo walk. I love a good solo walk around the city. And then the next weekend I was like really tired at the end of the weekend and I was like, why am I like a little unhappy? And then I looked at my weekend, I wrote down what I did and it was like late night party, party, late night drinking. And I was like, This, this does not match like what I said makes me happy versus what I'm actually doing. And maybe it's just as simple as writing things down, but yeah, walk me through like your advice there. What should people start doing right away?

Yeah. In regards to what you were saying about realizing what makes you happy, journaling in general can be very therapeutic and helpful. Even, even just if you just do a dollar store blank notebook and you start journaling your feelings in day to day or even on your app and start seeing how you feel will help you bring that awareness into your life. So you don't need a fancy 5-Minute Journal or anything. You can do that with your Notes app, or I think now the iPhone has the free journal app, which they took a lot of inspiration from our app as well. That's validation. Yeah, for sure. It's good. And so for what you're saying is, and a helpful exercise, and the reason I believe the 5 Minute Journal has become so successful is because of its simplicity and the simple prompts that are there. And especially when you write, you know, every day the simple things that you're grateful for. And also at the end of the day, review what were your highlights of the day. And also answering the question, you know, what did I learn today? Or the previous original question is, how could I make today better? A lot of people will say, when we first came out with the 5-Minute Journal, said, this is so repetitive. It's the same prompt every day that I answer. Like, this is boring. This is part of the design. Because if you keep answering the same question every day, you very quickly start learning what it is that you need to change. And usually, especially in the last prompt of, you know, how can I make today better, or what did I learn today? If you keep learning that, like, I feel, you know, crappy when I go out, or you're trying to— I want to go to sleep earlier, and that's your thing. You're like, you know, that this is— I keep writing the same thing that I need to improve. This is the thing that I need to improve. And it's giving yourself really that awareness of having to improve or change something. At the same time, having the awareness of my highlights keep being my pickup games with my boys, so I should do more of that, or a dinner with my mom.

I think when, when there's actually very simple ways to make big improvements, I think people second-guess it. They're like, this is too like they're waiting for someone to give them some like magical answer, or like the simplicity of just writing down things that make you happy or things that don't. Yeah, I think people discount it because like it's— there's no way this is actually all I need to do. But I wanted to add one anecdote to what you said. I got on a call with my therapist last week and we got on, I was like, to be honest with you, I was going to cancel this meeting because things are great right now. Like I don't really feel like I have anything to talk about. And what she said to me was very profound, which was, Ben, therapy isn't only for like when something's wrong, you need to fix it. How about we take a moment to just address like why are you happy? Like why are you feeling this way? What are the things you've done over the last week that have allowed you to be in the headspace that you're in? Which was to what you said, like, did I go to sleep at a certain time? Was I exercising a certain amount of times? Was I eating a certain thing? Was I spending time with certain people? And in that moment, I realized it's so simple, but it's so profound to just be present with why you feel good and do more of the things that make you feel that way. It's not that complicated, but it's really impactful. Uh, so that was— for the longest time, I always thought like You go to therapy to fix something that's broken, but really it's, it's about like ongoing maintenance because there's always ways to just reflect and force yourself to think and be present.

Yeah.

So I resonate with that. But I, I know we're way over time here, which I appreciate. I always say that you can ask every single guest who comes on, if we run over time, that is, that means it was a good conversation, a great episode. But I want to just wrap with hearing how you started the 5-Minute Journal because I know that is like one of the most amazing accomplishments.

Yeah, thank you. It's a fun story. And going, connecting to what I said before about allowing for serendipity to happen in your life, somebody reached out to me because they read The 4-Hour Workweek and they said, I read The 4-Hour Workweek and I wanted to actually find somebody in real life who's actually done this. Because when you read The 4-Hour Workweek, like, is this really true? Can you actually build a business like this? And somebody else, a friend called Guy, his name is Guy, and Guy's like, talk to Alex because he's actually done the 4-Hour Workweek and he's living it. And that guy, his name is UJ, who became my co-founder in Intelligent Change. I was like, great, connect me with Alex. So he connects me and said, hey Alex, can you grab a coffee with UJ? I'm like, sure, I'll do it. So we grab a coffee and he's like, hey, teach me how to do the 4-Hour Workweek. And he's Indian by like heritage. And Indians sometimes can be very like upfront and like straight up and pushy. So he's very aggressive, like, tell me now. And I was like, dude, like, chill, let's get to know each other, right?

It's the first coffee date.

Yeah, yeah, like he's very intense. And UJ would laugh if you, you know, you hear about this because he knows it's true. And so we just start talking. I said And at that point I was already going through that transition of realizing don't build a business just for the lifestyle or for the money, which is very counterintuitive. And still today in today's culture, I said build with something that you deeply actually care or passionate about. And same thing, it's very counterintuitive advice, you know, don't build with your passion, build with whatever there is. Because I said that the goal should be for you to be happy. And the fastest road to misery is doing something that you don't enjoy. And I know many founders who make millions of dollars, but they hate their business. This is not uncommon. Like, I've actually met many of these individuals. And I'm like, I wouldn't— I would not want to be one of these guys. So my advice to him was like, hey, let's discover your passions and what you care about. And we became friends and we'd go on these long walks and he would tell me, you know, he's like, I really love meditating, journaling, and self-development. That was his space. He was like, you know, I journal for an hour in the morning, I meditate for an hour, I exercise for an hour. He has one of those freak 3-hour morning routines. And I was like, okay, I'm like, okay, cool.

I'm exhausted just hearing you tell me this.

But he lights up. He's generally into it. But for me, I'm like, dude, this is a lot. And at that point, we're, you know, the 5-Minute Journal was created in 2013. So more than a decade ago. And we started working on it, you know, 2011, really. So it's a long time ago. And we're both in our kind of like mid-20s. And I was like, dude, you can do this morning routine because you're like, you're single, you don't have a job. Hours and hours. And you just have all this free time. Most people don't have time like this. So I think there's a way to create a product around like morning routine and journaling, but it has— it can't be this long. It has to be something simple. And we really also got inspired by the whole idea of The 4-Hour Workweek and kind of that limited time. And the inspiration actually came on New Year's Day. Me and my former partner were in an Aroma coffee shop. I think they're around in New York too, and we have them in Toronto, in York Mills Plaza in Toronto. And New Year's Day, and we're getting a coffee and there's this lady next to us journaling, like she's writing something on a piece of paper. And she just, you know, some people you look at them and they're just like, they just look happy. She just exudes like positive energy and just joy. And she's like writing to herself and smiling, looking up. I'm like, whoa. She's like, and we're sitting next to her. And before that she like helped clean up our table. Just like great human. And I tell, you know, Mimi, my partner, I'm like, ask her what she's doing. And she asks her, and she's like, hey, what are you doing? She's like, this is my journal. And I write things that I'm grateful for. And she has like, and it wasn't a journal. All it was was an A4 photocopied paper where she handwriting wrote different prompts. It was like 8 boxes and she cut it out like that. And there was different questions. Like, I do these, I answer these questions every day and it makes me so happy. But you can see she was happy. You know, like she embodied that practice.

Yeah.

And I was like, okay, I'm like, this is great. And I just ran with that idea of creating something simple, simple prompts that you can do daily and that it's not going to take you an hour. It's going to take you only 5 minutes a day where you take the best of and you write it out. And the book that really inspired us as well was called Happiness Advantage by Shawn Achor. And you don't have to read the book, you can watch the TED Talk. It's a hilarious TED Talk by Shawn Achor about what he did in that book was summarize all the positive psychology research in regards to a lot of these practices. Like gratitude, practicing gratitude and gratitude and journaling and, and how it is scientifically proven to change your life. And I'm a big self-development, self-help junkie, like I read all these books. And at that point, my realization was what changes my life is not reading these books or watching these TED Talks. What actually changes my life is the daily habits and practices that I do. So you don't get healthy and fit by reading about going to the gym. You get fit by being in the gym and actually doing the reps. And I thought the same thing, we don't have anything, a tool like that for our mind. Because as you know, as we talked about on this podcast, the biggest game changer in my life was gratitude and actually practicing gratitude. Because once you actually put in the reps of writing out or thinking each day of the things that you're grateful for, in time, you're the, you know, the neural pathways in your brain will start to change. Because the concept that we really drew for the 5-Minute Journal in scientific terms is called RAS, activating your reticulating activating system, RAS. And it's a part of our brain. Once you kind of become aware of something, you start seeing it everywhere. You know, we just talked about Blank Street Coffee. Now I'm going to walk around New York. I'm going to start seeing Blank Street Coffees everywhere because you mentioned that story. You're going to mention, oh, that new Cybertruck. All of a sudden, you're going to start seeing everywhere. Because your brain starts recognizing these patterns. Your brain is a navigating machine. However, you can tell it to focus on the bad, it'll help you focus on the bad. You tell it to focus on the good, it'll help you focus on the good. And all the 5-Minute Journal is, is a tool to help you focus on the good that exists in your life and the good that you want to create in your life. And so that's how we really created it. It was with that idea of a really simple tool. And our— I think when creating a product, it's important to create an intention to what that product is going to serve. And before we even created the 5-Minute Journal, the intention that we have, we're creating the simplest, most effective thing you can do every day to be happier. That was our intention when creating the product. And I believe we delivered on that intention when creating it. but we never thought, well, a little bit we did. So my partner, UJ, we made this contract at the beginning that we're going to sell 1 million units. And it's crazy that it became true and we overdid that kind of goal. But it started with that simple idea. And everything else that spawned afterwards is there's a lot of also timing. Um, and, and placing the product in the right hands. So Tim Ferriss had one of the first, first 1,000 printed journals that we ever printed.

So that is—

that's awesome. Congrats. Um, I think that's a very, very good place to wrap on that note. Will you look at the camera on the left and let everyone know where they could find you and what you're working on?

Sure. I'm Alex Icon. You can find me on intelligentchange.com or @alexaicon on Instagram. Hell yeah.

Thanks for coming.

Thanks for coming on today.

Thanks for having me.