Health And Wellness In High-Stress Settings, w/ Zahra Karsan

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Yeah. What do you do for your happiness? How do you keep yourself, your team happy and mentally able to tackle the tasks at hand of growing the business? There's a lot of stressors that come in and your self care is so critical. We've talked about the importance of putting on your own oxygen mask first. Today is a little deeper dive into that conversation. Hey everybody, My name is Bill Gallagher, scaling coach and host of the Scaling up business podcast. Our show comes to you every week with a guest, a guru, a CEO, someone who's got something to share relevant to growing and scaling your business. And we certainly have that today. 500 million Jillian episodes and more@scalingcoach.com along with our monthly workshops on the stages and a free course on the stages of growth. So we got workshop every month on mindset and tools for scaling. Um, we've got coaching programs, we've got a free mini course on the stages of growth and what you happens at each stage and how to move on to the next stage of growth. All that and more@scalingcoach.com you can also search our full back catalog of shows there. Like loads of groovy reasons to go to scalingcoach.com all right, enough about that. I'm joined now by Zara Carson. So Zara Kessen is joining from Miami. I'm outside of San Francisco. And she's a mindset coach, a neuroscientist. She's got a deep background in all things related to this and came at it from. Well, she'll tell you more about how she came at this whole world, but she wrote a book, six weeks to Happy, which we're talking about like six weeks to happy and then staying happy. What are the things that you do to take care of yourself? I'm looking forward to talking. Welcome to the show, Zahra.

Thank you for having me, Bill. Great to be here.

Yeah. So you started as a management consultant and then like, which is a totally different world, not of so much of a focus on like happiness and well, being. So talk to us about that shift. How do we come to be on this show together?

Honestly, it's. You know, I, if you would have asked me eight or 10 years ago, would I imagine myself being here doing coaching in corporate wellness? I would have said I can't even begin to imagine that. But yes, I was a management consultant for over 20 years and you know, I had a great deal of success. I was very, very lucky. So early on in my career I got the opportunity to. What was that?

It's a Grind, Right. Like there's.

Oh, it's a hustle.

Yeah, there's something to that.

Yeah, very high stress. And there was part of me that thrived on that, you know, that. That sort of rush of really being needed and dependent upon, you know, so rigorously and being called in by, you know, as a trusted advisor to C level executives. I loved that part of the work and, you know, all of the accolades that came with that. But the stress itself, I wish I'd known back then that if I just knew how to dial it back, if I understood my brain and nervous system and understood how the mind works, what takes energy and how to prioritize things differently, I could have been just as effective. But you think at that stage in your life, you need to be on high stress, Olympic mode all the time. And what I came to realize is, well, that's just not sustainable. It's like trying to be in a sprint all day, every day. It's impossible. You get adrenal fatigue, you deal with chronic stress. And I really believe that was normal until I nearly had an all. I call it my almost nervous breakdown. It was. It was this moment where I was just going full force and I was walking to the kitchen of the office and I was, you know, I was just breathing and walking and I realized, oh my gosh, I do everything quickly, I breathe quickly, I walk quickly. Everything was just fast paced and intense all the time. And I had a little break in my schedule at the time and my body just started to fall apart a little bit. And I went into my boss's office. He called me in to let me know the project had been postponed. And I thought, okay, well, that's disappointing. We'd put in all of this work and then all of a sudden I just burst into tears. And I had been somebody that was known to be so composed and so measured and so intentional in every management setting that we both just looked at each other in utter shock. And he's like, okay, well, tell me what's going on and I will. I could never be more grateful for that moment of compassion from. From, you know, my leader. A leader, any leader at that moment. And I just said, look, a bunch of my things in, in my life are unraveling and high stress, and I think I just need a few days off. And he looked at me and he goes, maybe take two weeks. We both just burst out laughing. And I said, okay. And I was just so grateful. And I didn't know, you know, I had been studying psychology and all of the Studies regarding what's now called the study of positive psychology, which is the science of well being and happiness. And I had all these tools at my disposal, but I wasn't using them in my life. I just was. It was more of a curiosity and research and a study of mine for 20 or 30 years at that point. And I woke up on the first day and I thought, I thought there's. I'm missing something. Like, I've done everything right. I've done the formula for success. You know, I did the job, I started a career, I made a ton of money, I had a lot of great success. I got the house, got the car, got the marriage. Everything was on point. I checked all my boxes. What's missing? Why am I so stressed? Why is my body about to break down? And I just said, I don't want to feel this way. And a little voice in my head said, well, what do you want to feel instead? And that's kind of what started this journey. I kind of shifted my own mindset, my own. Found a way to quiet my mind and be peaceful. And I realized I could be just as productive. And I didn't know that before. I just like, that was my normal. I thought that was normal for everybody. And I realize now, you know, it doesn't have to be that way. It actually reminds me of a CEO that I worked with and I would ask him about his morning routine and he would wake up, he would turn all the TVs on, on news, you know, Good Morning America or whatever it was in his house. So as he walked from his bedroom to his bathroom to shower and shave, brush his teeth, walk to the kitchen to get his coffee, it was all news, full barrage. And I said, that seems like kind of a violent way to wake up. It's certainly not a peaceful way to start the day. And he thought of it as almost putting on his armor and getting ready for battle. And I thought that was such an interesting metaphor because high powered executives, certainly even me as a management consultant, didn't realize at the time that if you find some inner peace and you know how to quiet the mind, it doesn't mean you're going to lose your edge. It actually makes you more productive. So that was an interesting turn. And then I ended up starting a meditation app and a coaching business. And I started seeing these amazing transformations in my clients. And that's what led to the methodology. Because I became so good at delivering successful results as a management consultant, I took that approach and thought, how can I teach people how to do this for themselves. And that became the book Six Weeks to Happy. And so now we're here and I'm delivering corporate wellness programs out of nowhere.

You know, I think what's interesting about that, like one, leaders don't necessarily have the same psychology mindset as everyone else. Right. There are definitely different. And there's not one kind of leader. There's many styles of leaders. Like there's many styles of people. And I can relate to that. Like there's many days that I wake up and I, and I have that pull for the news on. Right. And I'm. And I, and sometimes and I've been a foreign place or a different city even, I'll put on the news in the morning because I had this like I need to know, like I want to know what's happening in the world. Like I need to connect. I'm by myself in this place. Like what, what's going on? What did I, you know, what's been happening while I was asleep.

Sure.

And I need an update. Right. And but it is a violent like arrest, especially like an all kind of immersive thing like any video based media, television in particular of any kind. Right. Like there's sound and light coming at you and, and some people I know turn on multiple sources in multiple rooms. It's stimulating your device while they're hearing it.

Like yeah, for sure. And it does, you know, it does wake you up, but it's not necessarily the best way to start the day. You know, if you start your day, what that happens, what happens there is, you know, we're in fight or flight all the time. So you wake up and you throw yourself into full throttle. Well, that's just going to start you drained from the beginning to the end of the day. Whereas if you can learn the tools to wake up more intentionally and quiet the mind and kind of set your intentions, kind of visualize your day, set your intentions for what needs to happen. How to prioritize your energy, how to prioritize the things that are really, truly urgent. Because not everything is. And we think sometimes that it is, you know, it's all allergic, it's all urgent. You know, it's like. Exactly. So it's. You can't be Olympic on all the time. And you know, I'm definitely a cheetah. So I've had to learn over the last 20 years that I had two speeds, Olympic on or offline. So I have learned to dial it back when I need to physically, mentally and to kind of reassess where I'M at in terms of how much energy I have to give the day and just show up and do, you know, what's on my priority list and then learn how to delay things. But I didn't know that early on in my career, so hence the near burnout.

I spend every morning. One of the things I often. Well, this time of year, I wake to the sounds of the birds. They usually wake me up before anything else. And I hear the birds and yeah, it's not always so nice. I'm like, I really wanted to sleep till six this morning and the birds are on before five, you know.

And.

I want to shoot some birds. But.

It is.

And then as the light comes up, right, it's nice to see the light and to see the activity. Like I can kind of see the street from my window. Not well, but I can. And I'll see a runner passing or somebody walking their dog or things like that. And that's all a really, like a beautiful way to wake up. And then I spend at least an hour, I would say, most days reading various things. And that's also kind of nice. But sometimes I have to watch myself on what I'm reading, right? Like if I read the news, I might not like that or what kind of news, what aspect of it I read is not totally settling, right. Not always taking care of myself.

Well, there's a lot going on in the world right now that's, you know, deeply disturbing. You know, we have Ukraine, we have Israel, Palestine. We have so much happening right now that the election in the US is quite polarized as well. And so, you know, we have to be. We have to be able to give ourselves permission to be selective about when we let that information enter. Yes, it's important to be updated on current events. Absolutely. I'm wired that way as well. I want to know what's. I want to be informed. I want to know what's happening in the world here in the US but elsewhere as well, and be able to have informed conversations about it. But I've realized, you know, a friend and her sister were going through this thing where she was sending messages at 10 o' clock at night or first thing in the morning. And she had to just push back and say, this is not the time to consume news. You don't start your day and end your day. How can you have a peaceful, restful sleep if you're worried about a war in other parts of the world, for example? So understanding when to consume that information just. And time box it as well. Give yourself a half an hour and.

Just say, that's an interesting thing on both sides. I think a lot of our leaders aren't necessarily thinking about the impact they have on others. They're just doing stuff. And I can remember one CEO who had a very negative impact on their company and who wanted me to coach everyone but them. And they had a habit of sending emails at all hours of day or night to people demanding almost immediate response to things from everywhere in the world as they went about their things. And I'm like, you know, you're having a big impact on that. But then as I worked with the other leaders who were, I had a more direct coaching relationship within that team. And normally I have the CEO and the rest of the team, but in this case I just had the rest of the team and not the CEO. But in this case, my coaching for them was turn that filter shit off. Like, change your notifications. Don't look at that first thing in the morning. Get yourself centered and stuff, because you know there's going to be something from him when you open, open that up and it's going to throw your whole day. So get a little coffee in you or stretch your legs or do whatever you need to do to like, center yourself before you, like, open up to that, like, assault of his energy.

Yes, that's great advice. I think if you can start your day off quietly and intentionally, that's, that's a much more peaceful way to get through your day. And what it does is it sets your brain and your nervous system up for the stress that's to come. Because you're not in fight or flight every single minute of the day. You actually allow yourself to retrain back to its, its natural, calmer state of rest and digest, which is, you know, it's almost like we've gone to the gym over the last 30 years, depending on your age, and unknowingly trained our stress response without actually realizing, oh, we an alternate calm response as well. Maybe we can rebuild those muscles and bring ourselves back. And that's why this book came about, because it's really all about rewiring the brain and the nervous system back to balance, which I think we all need.

As we were preparing, you shared some stories and I feel like it would be useful to talk maybe about the banking leadership team at this point and what you identified there and the work that you ended up doing for them. What impact that had.

Absolutely. Well, so I was working with a major bank and working with the executive team and we were talking about different challenges between My consulting and my human behavior background, there's so much layering and so many things I can bring to the table. And they were talking about challenges they had in past of getting a healthier workforce and how much they were seeing in terms of spending on medical and health care costs and what sort of phenomenon were happening in the office. So they were seeing almost 40% of their workforce showing up as pre diabetic, which, if you understand the way that the brain and the body works, if your sugar is up and crashing all the time, how are you managing your energy? How are you getting through the day and being productive? Their productivity was impacted because you had absenteeism, you had stress sleep, all of these other things. We had 80% of people reporting moderate to high levels of stress and stress related illnesses. And I mean, that's extremely high. So, you know, from my background in neuroscience, I also understand, you know, if you want a productive workforce, they actually need to be relaxed and happy. And it sounds so counterproductive because that's not how an office environment's supposed to be. But in order to spark innovation and creativity, you know, it's that Eureka moment where, you know, the scientist was searching for a particular solution and while he was sitting there trying to solution the task at hand, he couldn't figure it out. And so he went to take a bath and he was figuring out that it was a calculus formula on displacement theory. And so took a bath, all the water splashed out of the bath and he had this moment and the solution found him in a completely different state of mind. Not being at his desk, not trying to actually figure out the solution. And why that works is because your brain actually uses a different part of its neurology and its wiring to do task based work versus creative and innovative work. And that's also the same brain process is used for strategic thinking. If you're a leader, sometimes just getting up and walking around, or you get the best ideas on your drive to work or having a shower or out with your kids, even though you're not technically thinking about work in that moment is when you find those solutions. We were having this conversation about, you know, their stressed workforce and how can we find a solution that's easy to implement, that will include a high level of engagement. And also we live in a time right now where, you know, you have to be inclusive. And what they had tried in the past was fitness challenges. So they got everyone a Fitbit and they had this walking challenge and this nutrition and white, like a diet, diet challenge where people had to Weigh in. And people actually started feeling bullied. So this is a whole new world that we live in. So they thought, how can we put together an easy solution where people feel like they have the tools and they get to make the choices that make sense for them because they just want to bring their health back to normal. It's not about being in perfect health. I mean the sheer, the shame for some people of like walking in and having to do a weigh in at the office is just kind of gross, right? So let's not do that, but give people the tools to understand how your body processes certain foods, how to stay hydrated through the day, how to avoid that 3 o' clock crash or you know, and we've all had it, we've all been there on an eight hour day. After lunch, there's that sort of lull in the afternoon. And it's, it's about understanding biorhythms and about understanding how to do it in a healthier way so your energy is not peaking and crashing and understanding, of course, you know, how the brain works. And so we were able to put together a really cool program for them that included fitness, nutrition and the education and the tools so that they can better look after the mental health of their employees. And that went really, really well.

It's an interesting thing to think about it from multifacets, like what's all going on here and what are our regular practices and are they healthy or not? I think a lot of times just in meetings, we don't stop and notice. As somebody who's outside facilitating meetings for teams all the time, I'm looking at and feeling about like, you know, this feels a little, it's time to take a walk. Like let's stop now. Everybody get up, go leave the room for a few minutes, right? Like, don't just sit there and open your laptop. Like you need to get out and move. Putting on music, like thinking about all the senses, feeding the body, adjusting the light, changing the air, what are the sounds going on, moving around, all of those kinds of things, like at the macro level, creating programs and practice. But then within any particular meeting, like what's happening today right now.

Of course, one of the companies I used to work for did standing meetings and that this was 20 years ago, but this was in Europe and so they had a different work ethic there. And the idea was instead of coming into a one hour meeting where everyone feels like they need to have a voice and then it, you know, everyone's verbose and it takes way too much Time to get to solution. They would turn that into a 15 minute standing meeting. So. And you each get a minute, get your point across, give your updates, don't come into a meeting without an update. And you know, it just set people up for a different mindset altogether. We're action based, show up 100% on time. You get 15 minutes, you get a minute time box to give your update and we're done. And it was just as effective as those long, long meetings. Well, more so.

We have all of our teams doing that. We call that the, the daily huddle. And they take, there's variations in them, but almost all of our teams are doing a daily huddle and we do recommend standing for those huddles. Although it was recommended to me recently that you consider planking instead of standing because that would really encourage.

I'm not sure you'd be focused on the conversation. If you're feeling like you need to keep your plank.

Imagine everybody there in plank like trying to have their conversation. But, but the standing, you know, encourages leaning in a brevity versus that. Yes, I'm leaning back pontificating about whatever that I didn't prepare to speak about, you know, like that nonsense.

It also activates the body. Right. So you're, you're keeping your workforce active. Instead of picking up the phone to call someone in your office, walk, get up, walk over to their desk, have a face to face conversation. Just the movement of getting up and making yourself as active as possible. We weren't meant to sit in a chair and be so sedentary, so just that sheer all the time. Yeah, just that little extra movement in the day certainly helps. You know, when I had, many years ago, I had a back injury and they, they gave me a, one of those elevated hydraulic desks so I could stand and work. I've never been so focused and so energized as when I was standing and working was great.

Yeah, we have this one here. Look, I'm going down. If you're watching on video, I put the desk up.

That's great.

I'm not exactly sure how it ties in, but you talked about a CEO client who had trouble articulating his vision and why don't you share that? I don't know exactly how it relates, but I feel like there's something about how we see ourselves and how we relate to our teams.

Well, part of what causes us so much stress is, you know, when we're in the work environment, we seem to have removed the human factor. And a lot of my work was so fascinating because it didn't matter if I was dealing with, you know, somebody junior or mid level manager, senior manager, and Sometimes even the CEOs, we all have these basic fears. And you know, one of them is that I'm not good enough stuff. And so now a quite common expression is, and people are using it and I'm happy they're using it, but they're calling it imposter syndrome. So feeling like they're coming in to run the show, but you know, having this, this fear of imposter syndrome, like, oh, what, what if they find out I'm not quite so skilled or quite so capable of doing this? And, and I worked with one such CEO. But you know, when you're working with a CEO, you can't, you can't bring that to their attention. The way that you handle that situation is you figure out the solution for them and you bring them the answer. And so in this particular sense, what happened was he had imposter syndrome and he had a vision that he was trying to communicate top down, but he had no actual plan for how to articulate that to his team. So he sort of left it up to the devices of his management team to figure out what his vision meant. And I'm in a meeting with the director of communications and I looked at her afterwards and I said, we need a meeting. And she said, yeah, I think you're right. So we met on the side, we went out for lunch and I said, okay, what was that? We need to fix this. There's a big gaping hole in this communications plan and we need to help map this out. And she said, no, I totally agree. And so what we did is, and how you deal with CEOs is, you know, you provide a whole bunch of recommendations and then when they choose the recommendation, of course you congratulate them for their genius. You know, instead of calling to attention what might be a shortcoming, you just present the ideas and let them run with it. And then they are genius, which is wonderful. Give them the information to make an informed decision and then they can do that, which is, which is the job of a management consultant. So this is a really interesting thing though, because you know, when you're talking to young entrepreneurs, for example, it's so helpful for them to understand that even top CEOs of a, of a multinational company still have the same human fears and self doubts as the rest of us sometimes. And, and in this case it was, you know, I'm not really sure how to communicate this vision. I'm not really sure how to communicate this plan, but where it came from was an underlying belief, you know, probably in the subconscious that, you know, that the bad imposter syndrome popped up for them. And so how do you overcome it, you know, and how do you make people realize that it's part of the human journey? It's kind of a universal theme. So it's not just you feel like you're doing it wrong because most people think, you know, why is this person so capable of getting into the best health? And why is this person so capable of achieving great success? And, you know, what's wrong with me? What am I missing that I'm not doing it right? And the reality is everyone has it. If you're a human being, you're challenged with one of these five things, and how they play out in your personal lives and how they play out in your career is just fascinating. So if you understood what it means to be a human being and then attacking those belief systems and sort of unlocking them, we'd all have a lot more patience and compassion with each other, which would make the workplace a completely different place. Then you have conscious leadership as well, which is a really, really interesting thing. Then you can really support your people and help them feel valued on a different level.

Let me come back to conscious leadership one second. The imposter syndrome thing was not something I thought was going to come up here, but I think it's interesting because it comes up all the time around people, and I think everybody feel like they know what it means, and they're like, oh, yeah, I know what imposter syndrome is. And I think many people feel like they are dealing with it, have dealt with it like a singular event, like a particular passage in life, you know, like puberty or something else. Oh, yeah. I remember when I had imposter syndrome, and now I don't have that anymore. And I think it's actually way more common that in a variety of situations, variety of moments, imposter syndrome is a regular thing that comes up for us all the time for the rest of our life. And there's no escaping it, and there's no. There's dealing with it. Right. Recognizing and addressing it, the self awareness.

Yes.

But I don't think it ever goes away.

You're absolutely right. That's. That's a. I don't think there's a fascinating point. Well, you know, part of my studies was dealing with the subconscious. And so what I came to understand is there's. There's literally five buckets of Subconscious belief play out in every single person. And that's how I ended up creating the, the life, because I wanted to see where is everyone's unconscious belief patterns and how that plays out. So the five are that I'm not good enough. I'm alone in this world. So, you know, it doesn't always sound like that. It could sound like if I want anything done right, I have to do it myself. And so how that plays out in your question?

Yeah, I don't have anybody. I can't count on people.

Exactly. So if you're a business leader, does that give you the ability to rely on your team or to empower people? Or are you always hung out because you're trying to keep your fingers on everything and try and do everything yourself? There's a certain point where as a business leader, you have to be able to let go and trust that your team is going to handle it and then just learn how to navigate. And then the other ones are, I'm not safe, I'm not worthy of love, worthy of wealth and abundance. And so how those play out in business, in your abilities to work in teams, in your ability to trust in your management and your leadership team and run a business, or if you have a business partner, can you really and truly depend on them to, to pull their weight and do their part? So what ends up happening is we exhaust ourselves both in the workplace and at home. And so unless you address what, what is common and what is universal about the human condition, we'll never get past it. But in, in, in that search, what I realized is you can only bring it to awareness. So as you say, if, if imposter syndrome or the feeling of not enough is your story, it doesn't go away. It doesn't go away is because I believe our subconscious really kind of evolved to keep us safe from harm. So, for example, if you're crossing the street and you can sense that a car is coming, I think our subconscious was just to say, maybe just wait a beat, wait for this car to pass so you don't get hit. Or, you know, when I'm dropping this water bottle all of a sudden to make sure my foot doesn't get crushed and be able to pull it out of the way. I don't think it was meant to actually run our thoughts, feelings, and behaviors the way that they do today. And so how you fix that is by bringing what's beneath consciousness into our awareness with things like self awareness and with some of these studies and in subconscious behavioral patterns and how they Play out in terms of your values and how you design your life. But yeah, it doesn't ever go away. It just. The only tools you can have are to bring awareness to it and learn how not to let it stop you and how to use it as a strength and develop it in a healthy way.

You know, it's interesting as you think about that, I know that many of our entrepreneurs are, you know, they're either introvert, extrovert or whatever. And there's definitely a connection there to the tendency of feeling alone or disconnected in some way. I know I'm definitely need my personal private time, like to withdraw, but I also realize that like there's something valuable in connecting with other people. And I, and I have that, like I can't count on other people that comes up for me regularly. I. It's all on me, you know, that kind of thing. One of the things that I found super useful for myself is like a mantra or reflection of some kind, not exactly an affirmation, but like, I am not alone. And when I think I am not alone, even if I'm actively engaged in some solo thing, like if I go out for a run or I was out surfing yesterday, I'll go out surfing this afternoon and I will have this thought out here alone, I am not alone, right? Like, I'm surrounded by people who, whether they know me or not, notice me. And there are people who are thinking about me right now, like literally all over the world for whatever reason, who care about me and, and so who do I want to be in relationship to all that? Even when I'm by myself, right? And I notice, like if I'm on a run, I stand up a little taller and I hold my head a little higher and I'm like, okay, I'm not alone. I'm being watched. And I find also then in managing like my worst habits, the notion that I am not invisible, I'm not alone, is also really powerful because, you know, we do some crappy things to ourselves and with ourselves sometimes that are not healthy. And when you think, yeah, I'm not invisible, I'm not alone, like that that changes maybe some of your minute by minute choices, right?

Absolutely. I would challenge you that to a positive statement, which is what you did in your process. And the reason I say that is because our subconscious is so powerful. So when you say I'm not alone and what the brain does is it negates the negatives. Here's is I am. So you want to switch it to a positive, you can call It a mantra or affirmation. But if you're not alone, then what are you? I'm fully supported. I am fully connected. I am part of a bigger plan, a bigger team. I'm connected to the earth. When you're out in the ocean, I'm connected to source or whatever your belief system is. I'm connected to the people in my life. And, you know, there are certain core basic needs. We need to feel that we are loved, supported, connected to people, that we are worthy and deserving of love and affection, of social connection, wealth and abundance. And I think that's the disparity between a small percentage of people that sort of find that formula, happiness and. Or success, and the rest of the people that just leave so much on the table because they don't have that awareness of why it's happening. So I think you're onto something there. Absolutely. If you can, you know, dive into that. And this is part of the work we do, is part of even the corporate wellness packages. We have to address factors. So we have to talk about. If you have a belief that, a subconscious belief that you're alone, it doesn't always sound like that. How it sounds is, you know, let's say you're. You're a single mom or, you know, or just who's working as well, then to feel like you're running the story, I'm alone. I have to do everything by myself. I mean, that's utterly exhausting to know you've got to go to a job where you feel like you have to do everything even though you're part of a team. You know, does it allow you to fully rely on your team? Does it allow you to empower your people again? Does it allow people to be there and support you? People want to do that, do want to do that. They want to work together. You know, plays out in your personal life. Oh, you're just running yourself ragged. If you can allow yourself to flip the script. And we have lots of rules that, you know, that allow you to do. But if you allow yourself to flip the script, train the brain, what it does is it actually calms the neurology down as well. So it starts calming your brain and your nervous system down, which is why you. You've had that response, right? We call it a neurological response where you stood up a little bit taller, where you. You were kind of having your needs met in that moment when you realized, no, I am fully connected, and I have people around me all the time that are thinking about me all around the world. That's a. That's a beautiful, powerful statement, right? And you are, you know, you are here doing this amazing work to bring enlightenment to people.

You know, when I. When I think about that, when that. When that I'm not alone arises for me, it's like a bracketing declaration. It's like, oh, I'm not alone as a set aside. Because maybe the first thought is, I'm alone. And the I'm not alone is setting aside the thought. And then I start to think about, how am I connected? Who am I for others? Who are they for me? What am I doing in the world? And then maybe it's like, I'm out here flowing. And yesterday. Yesterday I thought. I thought about my dad, which I often think out on the San Francisco Bay, because after he passed, we scattered him there. But. But I thought, like, I'm grateful because he taught me both to surf and sail. Right? Like, so I thought about my connection to the past, and then I thought about the people around me and what am I teaching them and that kind of thing. And, you know, it was a beautiful, like, I, you know, I moved now, even thinking about that yesterday. But that is that shift of, hey, I'm here all alone. I'm afraid, there's sharks, there's like, whatever, it could be dangerous. And then the other is, now, I'm not alone. I was given this by somebody else. And here I am connected, and there are friends and there's people thinking about me, and I'm connected to satellites and things. There's a shift then, really powerful. And I think we're talking about surfing and that kind of thing. But this is true at 3 in the morning. This is true in the middle of the afternoon when you're dealing with something as a leader in a business. Like, you're struggling with something, you're worried about payroll or funding the next production round, or you're like, whatever it is, it's useful to set aside that whatever the stress is and then recontextualize it for yourself in some way.

Absolutely. I think, you know, I think that's what led me to create this. So I was, you know, as a coach, I was trying to figure out how do we bring the understanding of each other and understanding of these subconscious beliefs, like the I'm alone, I'm not good enough, the imposter syndrome and others to light so that we all have understanding of each other. And so I created the Lifeblock quiz, which it basically maps out your personality as, you know, a few animal archetypes and and each animal archetype represents your subconscious behavioral pattern. So let's say you did have this I'm alone belief. Well, what ends up happening is probably early on in life you had some experiences where you did feel that. And so part of your belief system and what ends up happening is you then learn how to be really self sufficient. So it turns into a strength. You learn how to be self sufficient, you learn how to be. You learn how to navigate difficult situations because you have to figure it out by yourself. If you believe that you're by yourself in this world. Right. When you start developing these strengths and you come to value things like freedom and independence. I'm alone is also one of mine, by the way. I can speak to this very clearly with some authority. You know, where it's.

I think a lot of leaders have this because the sort of person that steps forward and says I'll lead is often a person who started doing that at a very young age, you know, from whatever, an inattentive parent or something like that. Right.

So you're absolutely right because it's, it's those people with that belief system that end up being resourceful. And if you're comfortable being alone out there in the world, you can lead. You are going to have to rely on your team, but you're not leaving the team. You're not afraid of challenging the status quo because you're already comfortable being alone. You're not going to be cast from the herd, so to speak. And so. Absolutely right. Yeah, they're usually wired to be leaders as well. Pretty amazing.

Yeah. You start a lot of firstborns, a lot of different people with different kinds of childhood backgrounds. Right. They, they develop strengths out of them. But then there's also like this thing that you're not aware of, that you're not in touch with, that you don't see the, the whole of it and the impact on your life.

The trick is understanding the personality and that behavior and the, the belief system enough so that you know when you're developing it in a healthy way versus in an unhealthy way. Because for every, let's say you value independence and freedom and your belief system is I'm alone. Well, there's a healthy way to develop that. And part of that is developing some self awareness, understanding how your values play out, but also having an awareness of how not to alienate people, whether that's in your personal life or in your, your corporate or your business life as well. So if you partner, making sure that they know you can be depended on and vice versa, that you trust in them, that they're going to be there and show up. Because if somebody feels like you don't believe in them or you don't have faith in them, belief is I'm alone, I got to do it all by myself and nobody does it as well as me. Well, they need to also feel like, like you trust you have that faith in them that they are going to be able to bring what you need them to bring.

Well, so I'd like you to share one other story. But before you do that, let me just remind our listeners that there's over 500 shows on all kinds of topics related to growing, scaling your company and the leadership required to do it and what you need to do from people like you, people who work with people like you. All that and more@scalingcoach.com I'm going to give Zara's link also in just a few minutes. But we do a monthly workshop on the mindset and the tools for scaling particular around the growth and how you see yourself and your situation. And we have a free course on the stages of scaling and how you move through each stage of growth of the company. And then of course all these shows and more@scalingcoach.com so Zahra, tell us about your mutiny on Christmas Eve. Tell us the Christmas Eve story. Even though as we sit here today it's, it's fully like the beginning of summer and not Christmas Eve. But I think it's a useful thing to think about that. So share that with us.

It was, you know, it was back in my consulting days and I was, I was always fortunate, able to build really strong, high performing teams because, you know, I knew how to do that. I knew how to inspire the best in people and create that really strong team like we were, we were right with each other. If there were days we were working late, my team would stay late and we walk each other out to the car because in the winter in Canada, it's pitch black by the time 6pm rolls around, never mind leaving the office even later than that. So, you know, it was just, it was literally Christmas Eve and I had my team so, so hard for, you know, meeting our deadlines again. This was back in the day when I didn't know that I prioritize things and that everything isn't actually urgent. And now I've understood if you could color it with a traffic light system, red, yellow, green or red, amber green, then you have a very clear view. And so this was bad or any of that showed up, everything was urgent. We had had, you know, we did a Christmas lunch. So everyone was drinking the eggnog, you know, being social. Kind of the day when like you finish this lunch and everyone is just in a relaxed state of mind, you're about to enjoy the holiday break. And, and so most people knock off a little bit early, you know, o' clock taps out, that's an eyelash because everyone's left early. And I was so wired to, you know, I knew about myself at least at that time, that if I didn't finish a number of things before I left that day that it would just irritate me and, and interrupt my break. Pushing myself and my team all filtered around. Everyone was like, they had a couple cocktails and I was still on, you know, know triple espressos and they were milling about my table and my desk and you know, they were like, z, it's time for you to go home. I said, gotta finish this. So we had like a full on blast out where I ended up dismissing them early. But you know, looking back on it now, everything could have waited. I wish I'd known that, you know, now this is, you know, what I get to teach people in the business world is. And it's something I learned in Europe. I was interviewing at a consulting firm in the Netherlands eight years ago. They asked me, what are your hobbies, you know, what do you like to do in your free time? And I was so appalled by the question of North America, you know, just having that mentality that I said, can I ask why you're asking me this question? And she said, well, that you have work life balance, know that you're relaxed and energized and healthy and happy because we understand that makes a productive person and a productive employee. And I said, wow, I'm so shocked.

Thank you.

And I was so fascinated by the Dutch mentality that they only worked a seven and a half, eight hour day. And when I first started there, I thought, there's no way they're as productive as our 10 and 12 hour days in the US and, and in Canada. And you know what, they were probably more productive because they were rested, they had a life, they had enough time to get to work, get to the gym, make a healthy dinner, see their families, be social and they still were able to show up. And then you didn't have to wait an hour or two hours for the caffeine to kick in and your exhaustion lighten up so you full speed. But they showed up fully ready today and they were Just as effective, if not more productive, you know, so these are some of the tools I studied over the years is like, why? Why not happen? And the brain and the body.

So I, you know, I think there's value in looking at any other culture, right. And, and then reassessing yourself in light of that. One easy way to change your perspective is like, wait a minute, the Germans seem to work really hard. Oh yeah. But they also really are serious about their time off and their vacation and their weekends and God, the Italians have a different way of looking and working and the French have different. And the Dutch have a way and the Chinese definitely work differently and the Japanese. And I'm not saying copy any one of them, but reassess yourself and your choices and your patterns when you look at all of them. I spent a month in Italy once and I came back and I'm like, you know what, I'm going to have long lunches like all the time. And for a while I had them every day. But now I don't have them as often. But I do frequently when I have a meal like linger and spend more time connecting and I use it well, I'll have it with an employee, a business partner, a friend, like, you know, and I'll use it really well. But I think stopping and assessing your life and trying on new things, looking at any culture is a really great. That's a super useful tip for, for maybe all of us. So the website Zara, if you want to check out more of Zara Carson's work. Six weeks to Happy is the. We'll put the link there on the screen and we'll put it in the show notes. Six weeks to happy. Not hard to remember the number six. Six weeks to T O happy.com is where to go to for that information. Zahra, thanks so much for joining us today and sharing a little bit of your stories and your work with us.

Thank you for having me.

Reminder to everyone. Big thanks to my friend and mentor Vern Harnish who created the whole scaling up framework that we use at the core of our growth for companies and to the folks at Storeon who get our show produced, prepared, in and out every week and on Cameron, Seth Christel and the team over there. Thanks again everyone for watching for listening. Until next time, keep scaling.