Ronnie Lieber, a TV host and keynote speaker, shares how to make presentations stick. He breaks preparation into three phases, explains how to build emotional moments, and offers specific techniques like watching audience members' feet to read engagement and warming up your voice before you perform.
Chapters
Foreign. We're talking about making great impressions today, leaving memorable presentations that really impact and connect with people. Our guest today is Ronnie Lieber, TV host, presenter, keynote speaker. He'll share more in just a minute. What can Ronnie teach you about making a great presentation, doing a better job with your pitches, your talks, fundraising, evangelizing, everything that you do around your business? Hi, everybody. My name is Bill Gallagher, scaling coach, host of the Scaling Up Business podcast. We bring our show to you every week with something new in the world of scaling your business. Getting the people right, dialing in the strategy, getting execution, working well so that you could focus on the strategic things and optimizing the cash in your business. And along the way, all the things to do with you, the person in the mirror, the person in your seat between your ears who is doing what you need to do to elevate your leadership so that you grow along with the business and the business is well matched to who you are. I want to welcome Ronnie Lieber to our show today. Ronnie, welcome to the show.
Thanks for having me, Bill. Great to have. Great to be here. And also welcome to everybody who is joining us right now.
Yeah, thanks so much. So, Ronnie, where the hell are you?
I'm right now in Vienna, Austria. I already figured out that you are in sunny California, so. Wow, I'm impressed.
You know, it's cool the way that we can connect, and we've been able to do that for many years now. But the application of it, the comfort with connecting, having conversations worldwide, has grown like never before. And I think it's a really cool byproduct of the last couple years and the crisis that that represented. So I'm excited to have you on the show, and I think this topic is really useful because so often the leaders of our companies are pitching their companies to potential users, partners, that kind of thing, investors and prospective employees. And when you don't make a memorable presentation, when you don't make a great favorable impression, right, you. You're. You're not putting your best foot forward. And so I'm excited to have that. Ronnie, as we get into it, tell us a little bit of your background. Like, you know, how did you get started? How did you become awesome in this area?
Well, thank you for this introduction, Bill. And that's actually a great question because I had quite a journey in different areas, in a way, and all of my life, it's been about putting different areas together to make something more and something better out of it. I was actually 20 years ago, I worked in door to Door sales. So I was at three, three thousand people's homes. And you learn quite a bit of how. What's that?
That's very good training, very hard work.
It's an incredible training. You learn quite a bit about how people react when you actually want something from them. And so it's also, when you're talking about pitches, it's the best training of all because you're like, hi, I'm here. Oh, I didn't expect you. And so it's like, all right, here we go. But that was during my university studies. I studied economics and sports. And afterwards I thought, hey, what do you want to do now in your life? Like, what is it that you really want to do? Also long term. And that's a question many people ask themselves. And so I thought, hey, how about I do something that I'm passionate about? Well, okay, that's great, but what are you passionate about? Like, it's not an easy question to answer off the cuff. And so I was asking myself the same questions for weeks and months until I figured out I want to work in an area that brings people together. Like from the. Since I was a little kid, I was always fascinated about events that bring the whole world together, like a soccer World cup or the Olympic Games, where you have the feeling the whole world circles around that. At the moment, at least when you're a sports fan or when you go to a concert and you're there and you're totally soaked up by the energy of the moment, you're totally there. You're not thinking about, oh, I need to go to a hairdresser tomorrow, or I need to write a text message. You're totally there, whatever your favorite concert is, or something that totally consumes you. And I thought, that's an environment that I want to work in. I had no clue what. But I knew why. I knew that there is this fire inside of me. And then around the same time, it happened that one of our professional soccer teams in Vienna, they were looking for a stadium host for their. For their youth teams. And. And some friends of mine that I knew from university, they recommended me. And so it was me sitting there like once a month on a Saturday afternoon for some milk money and announcing the players that the youth kids, so to say, for 100, 150 people, and announcing their names and the goal scorers and playing some music. And one year later, one year later, something magical happened out of that. I was at a university party and I went out at 5:15 in the morning. It was quite a party. And at the same time with me left a friend of mine, a colleague of mine who worked at the professional ice hockey team in Vienna. And you know, I mean this is a typical action from like at 5:15 in the morning, hey, are you by any chance looking for a new stadium announcer at the ice hockey team? And she was like, I have no idea, I'll ask. The next day she calls me, well, you know what? We're looking for somebody. Oh, okay. And so I had a few appointments and then with the manager and then the first ever ice hockey game I saw live of that team, I was doing the music and also hosting it, like announcing it. And that was the beginning when I thought, I want to do more of that. That's incredible. And then when I started to, to develop myself also as a public speaker, as an announcer, I started to take lessons, voice coaching, I went to logopedic, I went to, I took singing less lessons, I, I did all kinds of stuff to develop myself as. To become a better speaker.
Yeah, it's interesting. So thrust into it, building on it by accident, but being fascinated with these moments where people are connected and you're totally engrossed in, in something along the way. So I, you know, I think it'd be useful to talk then that kind of encompass a little of your lucky break, right? What do you suppose has been your biggest challenge, setback or learning along the way in this?
Well, basically, since my path is not a path that is like being an entertainer or being in front of people, being a public speaker is not something that is like you go to school or you go to university and you get a certificate and then you are like, hey, you want to hire me? So it doesn't work like that. So you really need to work for everything. You need to build your brand. You're basically your own entrepreneur, you're your own business from the start, from the get go. And when I started, I had a dream that was pulling me, but I had no network, I didn't know anybody and nobody knew me. And especially I think that's also something for small business owners when they are starting out. It's like you need to get your clientele, you need to find your client somewhere. You need to get known in a way like how do people find you? How do people know about you and how do you build a brand around your thing, like not just a commodity, not just like, okay, I'm selling this and that, but that people want to come to you because it's you and not just because you sell light Bulbs or something?
Yes. Is that what you sold door to door?
No, I actually didn't. It was about telecommunications. It was telephone contracts. Even worse, it was not even to touch.
Yeah, it's funny how that confrontation right there. So you're there trying to build your business, you're getting some traction, but all the world of that you don't know. So what do you think? What is it that you notice that speakers don't do well in the beginning? Whether giving a small talk or a large talk, a big presentation or small thing, what do you think is like the first, most basic mistake or a couple of mistakes that you see?
I think one of the biggest mistakes that I see and also see from friends of mine, when they are just learning how to pitch and when I'm coaching them, is that they're way too focused on themselves. They're totally in their tunnel of this is my product, this is my company. And basically, as if the world is waiting for you and it's not. So basically, you need to turn the whole spectrum around and think about who is it that you're selling to, who is your ideal client and what are their needs, what are their wants? How can you pick them up from where they are right now to where they want to go? If you think about it that way, for more than 12 years, I've been now the stadium host of our Austin national team in soccer. And when you are, I don't know, have you ever been to a stadium, Bill? Yes, so. And I'm guessing also some of our listeners have been to a stadium. And when you go to the stadium and you don't actually consciously realize that, but you're there for the experience like you want to. You don't just want to watch it on tv, you want to have this experience and then basically come to the stadium. And my job is it to know exactly who you are, who are those people that are coming to a stadium, why are they there, what are their emotions, what are like, what are their hopes? And it's going to be different also depending on if you're following a sports team, for example, who is the opponent? Is it a big rivalry is something that's really emotionally touching for them, for example, then you can play with that, and then you need to grab them. And basically my job is to build up the emotion to that point when there is the kickoff, when there is like, when we kick it off, when it's really time to start and when it's time to support the team. And so you build up an emotion like you take them on a ride, on a journey. And so you really need to know who is that person. You need to be in their heads, in their hearts, in their souls. And then you take them to where you want to have them. But you can only do that when you know who that person is. When you're not thinking about who you are, like just about you, you need to think about them. So think about it that way. For example, if you're selling, let's say you're. You're in the financial services industry and you're selling, one person is maybe selling insurances or. Or yeah, and it could be an insurance, like a car insurance. A car insurance is not really something that is emotionally very juicy because like, at least where I'm from, you need to have it. So it's not that, that like, yeah, I got a car insurance. Awesome. But if you're the person, for example, who is. Who makes it possible for a family to finance their new home, it's going to be a totally different emotional state that they are coming there because there are some dreams, some hopes. There's something that, wow, this is really cool. So you're not selling the insurance, you're selling the feeling.
Well, yeah. So I mean, you know, you might get excited about a new car. A new car. And the journeys you'll take with your family together in the car. Or maybe you're buying a sports car and you're thinking about the exciting adventure of your life and driving up a back canyon in the twisty curves. Or maybe like my latest car, I'm thinking about all of the surfing equipment I can stick in the back and how it's really long and I have room and I can go on trips and you know, do. How many trips do I go on? A few, but not as many as the. The imagination has for it. Right, so exactly. Insurance for that. But. But the emotional side is on the trips, like. And then there's like peace of mind so you can enjoy your adventure or whatever.
It is absolutely true. And what I was saying also, like, why are they here? Usually they are not there because of you. Also, when I'm in the stadium, I don't think that the people are here for me. Maybe the two people that I gave the free tickets to, but not like, besides that, nobody actually came for me. They came for the team, for the show, for whatever is gonna happen.
Right. So first thing mistake is thinking too much about yourself, your product or whatever and not about them. I think what I'm hearing is if you're Thinking about them, then the thing that you have is for them. But the framing of it is not what do I have to say, what do I have to sell, but how is this of interest to them?
To put it in another way, Bill, is don't fall in love with your product. Fall in love with your client and make everything that's possible for them. I always, you know, one of the things that I love to. To create our magic moments. Because when you're in a live event, when you're in that setting, it's all about those memories that you are creating, those magic moments. Something that. For me, a magic moment is something that I can tell my grandkids about or something that is. I mean, I don't have any yet, but at some time, hopefully. Or that I can. For example, that makes me smile when I go to bed at night, or it makes me grin in the morning when I think about it. And those moments. Think about. How can you create some magic moments for your clients or for your employees? How can you.
So what is the magic moment? What is that? How do you create that?
Let me give you an example, because oftentimes when you think about a magic moment, it's like, well, yeah, that happened, but I mean, how do you actually create it? And then oftentimes I ask people, well, I mean, who of you is married? And then I'm sure some of us. Some of us that are watching us are married. And also at the same time, or who of you know somebody that is married? And when you get married, Bill, since you just raised your hand, then before the marriage, there comes the proposal. And oftentimes most of the times the man does it. And so before you actually propose, you're asking yourself some questions. I mean, first of all, of course, who you're going to propose to. But I guess that at that point, you already figured that out.
It's not like a game show where there's three possible contestants.
Yeah, exactly. Who's going to get the last rose? No, not like that. But then you're asking yourself, okay, like, what does she love? What is it that or he love or whoever it is that you're like, what does the person love? What is it that? Like, how should the light be? How should it. Should it be on the beach? Should it be with other people around it? Should it be just the two of us? Or how, like, you're thinking about everything, every little detail, because you want to make it memorable at the same time, of course, you also want to make it that the other person doesn't say no, but obviously, like, you want to. Really? I always say you want to lay out the red carpet, but the emotional carpet for the other person. And you're creating this moment. You're creating this magic moment because, I mean, you're always going to remember how you propose to somebody or how somebody proposed to you. It's not like, yeah, we got married, but I totally forgot how that happened. Like, nobody ever said that.
So I'm hearing, how do you want to feel? And then what are the characteristics of the moment or the environment that you're trying to create? Like, what's that?
Yeah, think about everything. Think about. When I'm thinking, once again, with the stadium example, I'm really thinking, where are the people? Like, first of all, who is coming to the stadium? Like, who are your customers? So to say, who are those people? And in a stadium, you have a wide variety of people, but at the same time, what connects them? Yeah, really. But what connects them? What is the common denominator? What is the drive that they have all together? What is the emotional drive? Like, why are they here? What is it? That is, how is their emotional involvement to it? And then what music do they love to hear? What is it? For example, different sports. If you just talk about that, have different kinds of energies, have different kinds of music that you're playing. Also, how do you build up the energy? You're not gonna. When you go to a concert, for example, when you go there, the rock star is not gonna start off with the biggest hit. It's about building up, like, having that flow, having that energy. Or when you have a DJ on the floor, it's like, really, you need to warm up the crowd. And that's what. The same applies to you when you're pitching to somebody, when you're. You need to take the other. You need to see it more as a journey, as a ride, and not just as, here I am. That's my product. Those are the facts. Well, great.
Yes. Yeah, I think that's like thinking about all of that. So there's an initial, like grabbing something, but also not giving your big. Your biggest moment right at the beginning. So building up something, thinking about that experience from the other side and breaking it down is what I'm hearing.
And also, for example, I've done probably about a thousand interviews in my life, and when I do an interview with somebody, especially when it's a live interview setting where there's an audience, and it might take an hour, depending on the setting, of course, but then I really need to think, how do I craft this interview, that it makes sense for a listener, how do I craft it, that it feels natural, that it feels that there is a flow to it. For example, once I had before the Euro 2016, and the Euro is the European championship in soccer, and Austria was part of that in 2016, and I had the opportunity in front of 30 top managers to interview the national head coach of the soccer team. There was a great enthusiasm, and my job was to translate from sports into business. And so I had a set of like 12, 13, 14 questions prepared. And so it was for me also to. To change a bit the order, because I was going through it and I was thinking, like, okay, but if I, if I asked that question, that the next question, actually, this question would make sense more as the next question than another one. Because it's natural. It feels like when you have a conversation, you're leading somebody from A to B to C. And. And of course, you need to give yourself the room to be flexible in the moment. Like, you really need to be there in the moment. Because that's another mistake that I oftentimes see when. When somebody's pitching or when somebody's doing a presentation that you're. That many people are way too much in your. In their head. That means at the moment, when you're in your head, you're inside yourself. When you're inside yourself, because maybe you're like, okay, what was the next question? How did that go?
How.
What is my next sentence? What am I going to say in that moment? When you're in your head, you're not out there. You're not out there with the audience, and you're not picking up how they are feeling, where their journey is at. So basically, your preparation is that you need to know your stuff. You need to know how your journey is that you want them to take. And then you need to pick up those little subtleties, those little details. Like when I was interviewing the head coach before that, ahead of time, I was asking the event manager, look, how is that? Like, how flexible are we with time afterwards? Is it an option? For example, do we have like another 10, 15 minutes? If they are really engaged, If I feel that there are questions, is it possible to get that? And they said, yeah, sure, that's no problem. And so what I was doing throughout the whole time of the interview, I was. I was really with him, with the head coach at the same time, I was always scanning the audience. How are they? Like, are they following or are they on their cell phones? Are they falling asleep. And if I realize that they are drifting off, I need to change the topic. Like I need to change. And I know, okay, this question is not like they're not really feeling the topic that I need to go somebody else somewhere else. And if I feel that I'm not catching them anymore, then I need to come to a closure, I need to come to an end. And that's the same when you are out there pitching and your pitch is maybe very long or it might not feel to you very long because it's your product and you love it. But they don't know that for them it's long is what feels long to them, not to you. And then it's really about feeling where they're at and really getting a feel for their needs, for their wants and asking questions there to ask questions to make sure that they're still with you on the same journey.
I think that's a really good thing to point in because a lot has been said about paying attention to and body language and things like this. Except I have with great experience now noticed that sometimes people look upset, they look awful, and they're having a good time and other people are smiling and nodding along and they're having a bad time. And so people lie to themselves, to the world, all the time in subtle ways. I don't mean necessarily the outright lie, but sometimes we smile and it's a lie. Right?
Look at their feet, Bill, look at their feet if you can. Yeah, look at their feet. If you have an opportunity, look at their feet. Because their feet are the furthest away from their brain and their feet are not gonna lie. They tell you if they're engaged or not.
So don't pay attention to the shoes. Oh, those are nice shoes. Wow, those are terrible.
In general, what I'm saying is if their feet are pointing towards you, they're engaged.
Uh huh.
If their feet are like already on the way out in a way, like if their feet are kind of like pointing away from you, then you need to really wrap it up or you need to change the topic or the question to make you need to see how they're reacting to you.
Interesting. You say the feet are a big tell on where people are going, what they're thinking.
Yeah, look, we are trained as human beings, the older we get, we are trained as you called it, we lie. We're trained to be nice or we're trained to be polite and oh yeah, that's awesome. And then you're thinking maybe like, man, how do I get out of here really fast. But. And so you also, like, you're trained to control your facial expressions, maybe your hands, but you're not thinking about your feet. You're not thinking about, well, what are my feet gonna do? So if there's an opportunity for you to look at the feet of your. Of the person that is in front of you, it's gonna be a big tell.
We'll have to watch this now and see what I notice about it. That is not something that I've ever given any thought to. Look at the feet I have thought about. Look at the body language, look at the faces. But I also notice, like I said, that it's not always revealing. I've had people that, like, look miserable, and then I find out they're like, oh, my God, this is so what I needed to hear right now. And I'm really, like, you know, dealing with something, but it's perfect. And then other times I'm. People are smiling and they're, like, bored to tears, but they're trained themselves to. To be pleasant. Oh. To put on a nice face. And. And sometimes you could tell, like, that's a fake smile. Right. But they're working too hard to smile. It's not natural, but a lot of times you can't. And I liked also, so we'll have to try the feet thing. And. And I also like this, the idea of asking them, like, how are you guys doing? What are you getting so far? Where are you at? You know, that kind of thing. Obviously, that doesn't work as well if you're working with thousands of people, but I think even then you can, if you're loving today, you know, say yay. And you're going to tell by how, like, real and immediate that response is if they're into it.
Well, when. When you're working with thousands of people, then it's not. You're not going to ask open questions because they're not going to be able to tell you.
Right.
What you can do is, like, you can kind of make a survey of the audience or like, you can, like, who of you has experienced that or who of you has. For who view this is relevant.
Yes. Yes.
Let's have them raise their hand. Yeah. And get them engaged. Like, you always get them engaged.
Stand up. Actually, not only gets them to vote, but also it, like, changes the energy. Like, all right, if you're into this, everybody stand up, you know, and then pretty much everybody starts to stand up.
And it changes the state.
Yeah.
As you said. Yeah. Changes the energy, changes the State.
Yeah. You know, I think that having the freedom. So what do you think it is that gives people the freedom to really just swing out and play out and put their attention on the other person, to not be worried about themselves, to inhibit themselves, to hold back. Like, where does that come from?
First of all, you need to be prepared. And because in order to do that, you need to have certainty and certainty of what? You need to be certain that you did your homework. Because when are we in your head? What are the questions that we're asking ourselves? It's usually like, oh, my God, what do we do next? Or what is like, you're questioning yourself.
Yes. And where am I going? What am I doing exactly?
Or like, okay, what am I gonna do now? How is that right? And the reason why you're questioning yourself is because you're not completely certain of maybe of the value that you're bringing or maybe of something that you have not experienced yet. Trust yourself. Trust yourself that in that moment, decide that you're ready. I was, you know, I was a competitive dancer for six years.
You were? What kind of dance?
Latin dance, like samba, chacha, ramba, pazadobo, jive. And we had tournaments, like in spring and in fall, like pretty much every weekend, sometimes even two on a weekend. And of course, you have training in between and you're working on things and you want to show it at the tournament, but when you go there, oftentimes it's not as developed as you would like it to be. And you're always working on something. It's a great metaphor for life because there's always something that you're working on and you're never really ready because there's always something that you can improve. But at the moment, when it's your time to shine, at the moment when it's your time to perform, at the moment when it's your time to pitch, you're ready. You're ready the way you are. It's a process. It's not the end game. It's not like, oh, my God, if I screw this up, then life is over. It's not. So whatever happens, happens. But trust yourself in that moment. Just show what you got. And wherever you are in the process, it's okay. Mm.
It's interesting. I think about, like, I try to prepare generally early, right? So like. Like, I look at the notes for this show yesterday, and then today, not so much. I looked like one minute, maybe at the write up of our notes in preparation for you. And most of my time was spent preparing Myself, like, making sure I have a good morning, feeling good, playing some music while I get ready and have my breakfast and that kind of thing. So I'm like, mentally prepared. And then I know that, like, okay, my equipment's in good shape. And then a couple minutes before we go start, we discover there's a little problem. So we restart everything and like. But then I get on and I'm like, I'm ready to play and have a good time and listen to what you have to say. And I only have to look at a couple things in the course of it.
I would love to give an example about that or a metaphor.
Yeah, yeah.
Because I just wrote it in my new blog post, actually, about three phases of preparation. Because when you prepare yourself for an appointment or for whatever you're preparing yourself, there are three phases. And I think the metaphor of a sports team is very good for that. Because as a sports team, first of all, let's say you have an American football team, and the NFL season starts in the preseason in August, and then the season starts in September. So basically, you start in the beginning. You don't start immediately with all of the details of how the match is being played. You start at the foundation. You started the basics. And what are the basics like for your field that you need to work on? For example, in my field, it was like, okay, taking acting lessons, taking singing lessons, taking voice education, all kinds of things. Or I went to a comedy, to a comedian workshop, for example. Like, it's fun. Like, I just like two parts from everywhere. And then so it's. You're building your foundation, you're building your. Your. Your building your house. So to say, yes, yes, the phase two is then, okay, the season starts and now you're preparing from match to match, from game to game.
Yes.
Basically, let's say you have a game on the weekend and on Monday, you start to prepare for that opponent for that match, or is in a business context, you start to preparing for your next appointment, for your next pitch, for your next.
Right.
Whatever it is, for your next big thing. And then you just prepare for that you like. And oftentimes also, we think maybe like three, four, five games along the road, but actually you should be focusing on just the next one from game to game. And even in the, in the game, you can think you can focus about from play to play. Like really be focused. Not. Not be focused on five plays ahead, be focused on the next play. That's actually an advice that Tom Brady gave me. And the third thing is the third Phase of preparation is really on the game day. On game day. Like the moment it starts to tingle, the moment that you're like, okay, I did my homework, but now it's like the last hours, the last minutes before it's really showtime. And how do you, how do you deal with the nerves? How do you actually calm yourself down? What do you do to. To really to be ready when it's, when it's kickoff? And that's the same that applies to you when you are going to be somewhere on a stage, when you're going to be having a pitch or whatever it is that you're going to have something you need to be able also. Then you did a preparation. You did it. You. You did your foundations, your preparations, and now it's about calming your nerves and being ready to go, as you said, like now, today, you just were like, okay, you went through it and to be focused and to be there in the moment when it's your time to shine.
Yes, yes. You know, that's an interesting thing. So there's the early foundational stuff, then there's immediate pre event, and then there's in the moment.
Right, Exactly. Those moments before you actually step on a stage or before you actually have the pitch.
Yeah. And then what about in the middle of it? That's not preparation anymore.
No. And then you just, you just go with the flow. Then you're there. Like, then it's really about to be focused, to be in the moment. For example, when I'm with you here, when I'm with you in the podcast, it's not about thinking, oh, yeah, maybe that would be smart to say, or whatever. It's like really having a conversation, responding to whatever you ask me. Because I, I need to have done my preparation beforehand. Like, I'm not gonna. Now when you ask me something that I'm not prepared for, I'm not gonna be like, oh, wait a second, I'm gonna Google that.
Okay, so wait a minute, let me make sure I got it. You said three levels of preparation, right?
The season preparation, the foundation preparation. Yeah, the season preparation is the foundations. Like, everything. Like, for example, as an athlete, you're working on your general.
I got that part. This. The game preparation is what?
The game preparations, when you are preparing for your next appointment, for your next match, for your next opponent, like, you're doing video studies, for example, you're like, okay, how are they playing?
What are the specific application of that particular pitch sale, hire, like whatever it is. Right, Exactly. Yeah. What's that going to be like and then the third one is just on game day.
The minutes and hours leading up to the match. Like you're, what you're eating, for example, the warm up. What are you doing to warm up in the stadium? Like we all, when, when an athlete is already in the stadium and they're warming up. What do you do as a warm up before you go to an important meeting? Well, how is your warmup ritual? Of course it's not going to be some, some warm up drills as an athlete does. But maybe you need to warm up your voice, maybe you need to calm yourself down, maybe you need to meditate, whatever it is like to have your warm up virtual.
You know, it's funny for me it's generally like loud music, dancing and singing. And this is, and especially true in like the toughest times. One of the most confronting, frightening things that I did was stand up comedy. And I was worried about, you know, remembering all my material and I'd never done it before and like that kind of thing. And so I, you know, I put very loud up energy music and I danced around now where I was. I didn't have a private space so I was a little uncomfortable, self conscious to just sing and dance, like completely ridiculous. But I like really amped it up and I, and I noticed I was so like off. I actually took two shots of vodka also. And that's not something that normally I would do, but I felt like, okay. So for an entertaining performance like comedy, it was totally okay, very nice, a little bit like loose. I wouldn't do it in a business pitch but in that environment where I was just like. And so the very loud music, the movement, all of those things together. But in a day like today, a show or if I have to go give a talk, like I have some next week and the following week it'll be like loud music, movement, dancing and then lots of like, you know, am I well rested? Did I eat enough? Some things like that. Right.
One more thing actually about that last part because the phase three is all about getting you in state for the moment when you start. And so the question is, what state do you need to be in when you are engaging with an audience and maybe just an audience of one person. When you are in, in the space of somebody that you want to influence.
Yeah.
And you do, because otherwise you wouldn't be here. Then you need to think about what is the state that you want to get them to like, to what state do you want to leave?
I want them left.
Exactly. And if you want to Ignite a spark in somebody else. If you want to ignite a fire in somebody else, who needs to burn first?
Well, we do. Right. Like I have to be something or I can't light you up.
Exactly. So you need to be, you need to make sure that when you start, when you step on that stage, when you enter the room of whatever important meeting you got, you need to be in state. You need to be in that state that you want to ignite in somebody else.
So this is interesting because it also ties to the leadership work that we do. So we have this leadership flywheel and we work people through learning how to use these things in sequence. And the first thing is lighting other people up, having people optimistic, excited, in a positive emotional state. Right. So I'm inspired by excited about something. And in order to do that, of course, like you said, you have to first be able to be excited yourself about, in touch with yourself and then freely give yourself and communicate it so they can get it so that it's contagious, so that they get some of that excitement. And then the second part, and I think this is true every time we make a pitch, is I want them to see what is the opportunity for them. Like we're excited now, but that's not very specific. But now I want them to translate it and apply the thing and see, oh, I'm excited about this. And there's something here for me, whatever it is, a role, an opportunity, something for me to do that I can say yes and begin to take action on.
Actually, I have one more cheat code for, for, for everybody listening right now or watching the person. Whenever there are several people in a room engaging with each other, the person with the most certainty is going to win. Like, you need to be certain about what you're presenting them. You also need to be certain that this is something great for them. Like, you need to be certain that this is fantastic. And I remember back in the days when I was doing door to door sales, it was, it became a game to me. It was really incredible. It was really fun because obviously, I mean you got, you have all kinds of people and you never know who's gonna open the door. It could be like the 80 year old grandma or it could be like some, some young dude or something. And I remember and it was not, I mean, oftentimes or sometimes when you, when you knock the door and then somebody opens up and then the first reaction like we're not buying anything. Like, yeah, we're not buying. And yes. And obviously, I mean after some And I was at 3,000 people's home. So after some time, you figure out how you're going to react to whatever comes to you. And it was always funny when somebody said, I'm not buying. I looked at them like they're from the moon. I looked at them like, like, what are you talking about? And the funny thing was, and that was like, usually, like the first thing that they said, I'm not buying. They didn't even hear what I said.
Right.
And since I looked at them like they're from the moon, then they got confused. They were thinking like, did I just say something stupid? They're like, could you change the whole thing?
Yes, yes, yes.
Could it again, like, who are you and where are you from? And then I said exactly the same thing, like in the beginning. Ah, okay.
Okay.
And suddenly you were totally in the game.
Yes. Yeah.
Because you were certain, changed.
You flipped it up a little bit. Yeah, it's a great hack. I. That's a great place to. To leave it. Let me tell folks, if they want to know more about you, they're going to go to ronnieleber.com and what do you all have at your website, Ronnie?
First of all, I think what's going to be a great resource for you is I got a blog there. Like, when you go there, also make sure to click on English because it's bilingual and well. And then when you. Yeah, and there is a blog, so you can go and blog. And there are a ton of blog posts about, for example, about public speaking, about presentation tips, about webinar skills, about virtual events, all kinds of things like whatever you want to know it in terms of wowing your audience you can find there. Or just write me a message.
Ton of stuff there, Ronnie. Lieber.com and remind everybody to go for the show. Notes, the links, that kind of thing. For this show, you're going to go to scalingcoach.com so all that and more. You know, near over 400 shows actually now@scalingcoach.com we've been doing this for years now. We bring a new show every week to our listeners. Everything to do with scaling your business. Also, we can help you find a coach maybe in your area who fits your particular challenge or need. We have 200 coaches now in our network, so all that and more. If you want to send us a note, get in touch with us. The email is info. Scalingcoach.com love to help you and connect with you. We have coaches in Europe. We have coaches who speak German. We have coaches who speak Hebrew, coaches who speak Arabic, coaches who speak Japanese, companies. We've got people in every kind and everything who can help you with growing and scaling your business. And then of course, every week we have guests like Ronnie Lieber who help us to elevate and to think about the different areas that are of interest in scaling your leadership and scaling your business. I want to give big shout out and thanks to Verne Harnish, author and creator of the Scaling Up Framework, my mentor and partner in all things scaling up. And to Wanda Mitchell producing our show in the background there, big shout out. Also to the folks at Podfly Productions who produce our show each week and get the audio out and on iTunes, Stitcher, etc. Wherever it is. Of course, we go live on LinkedIn and YouTube and Facebook and all the places so you can watch live on video or you can go hear it in audio, as many of you like to do while you're working out, running, driving, flying, like whatever it is. So Albert Burge produces our audio. I'm Kadina writes up our show notes. Tim McGowan proofreads everything. Thanks again everyone for listening for watching. Give us a like subscribe get notices every week. Thank you for being with us. Keep scaling up. Bye bye now.
