How To Start Hiring and Outsourcing When Starting Your Business #TheOnePercent

And today he was basically telling me, you still have this idea, Ryan, that you need to build this team and then the team will move things forward. And so you know what that forces me to do, Nathan, and I hate that this is the answer.

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This is capitalism.com and we are the 1%. Hey, real quick. I'm doing a test in my business right now that I think you'll be interested in. We have a training called Million Dollar Brands and it helps business owners and entrepreneurs get clear on those first three to five products that they're going to build that will get to 25 sales a day at $25 to $30 and thus be a million dollar business. And we sell that for $297. And I recently had the idea of what if at the end of that training when somebody completed it and they filled out a form saying they know what their three products are going to be, they know how they're going to launch the products, let's refund them the cost of the training. Let's incentivize the action of actually making some decisions in your business and getting clear on your business. And I did this because someone challenged me with the thought of what would I change in my business if I only cared about my customers results and I didn't care about profitability. And I immediately said let's incentivize action. And then I said, well, would I really spend however many thousands of dollars a month I spent on Facebook ads or would I take some of that money and put it into a scholarship fund and then fund some of the cool ideas that came from my training. And it was like this whole world of creativity opened up for me. So this is a test right now that we're running. If you are starting a new business or you are still under that million dollar threshold or even that 25 sales a day threshold, then we have this training called Million dollar brands that's $297 and it's refunded to you when you complete the training. And I figure if you walk out of that training, you're going to leave with such a clear business plan that you're going to want to work with us ongoing. So you can find this@capitalism.com brands and depending on when you sign up, we're also opening up strategic windows where you can qualify for a scholarship and have your business funded. So this is all an experiment. If I lose my rear end on it we'll probably shut it down, but for now you can find it@capitalism.com brands.

Welcome back to the Outsourcing and Scaling show. My guest today is Ryan Moran. Ryan, how you doing today?

A little bit hungry, but I'm ready to go.

It's a Monday morning. Really appreciate you coming on. For those of you that don't know, Ryan is an Entrepreneur, founder of Capitalism.com and host of the 1% podcast. He's the world's biggest Cleveland Indians fan and the future owner of the Indians. And his best skill is eating leftovers.

True.

Really appreciate you having you on. We'll talk all about that, but first I want to take a gigantic step back. What were you like as a kid growing up? Were you a straight a student? Were you a rebel? Did you always know you wanted to be an entrepreneur?

You know I did my. I was, I was actually all of those things. How the hell do you know that about me? So, yes, overachiever, always knew I wanted to be an entrepreneur. It's interesting you actually asked me this right now what I was like as a kid because I, I've been doing a lot of self discovery work over.

Not what elements of my childhood do I bring into now, but what did I not bring in with me that I wish I had?

So I indeed was straight a student overachiever who knocked on doors and raked leaves and shoveled drives and had little garage sales where I sold baseball cards. Yes, I was all those things. And that's. And those are things that I've carried forward. The one part of me that I have been doing a lot of work in accessing lately is all I really wanted to do as a kid was perform. All I really wanted to do was tell jokes, ride bikes and hang. And at some point in our lives, we lose access to that part of ourselves, shut down that part of ourselves that has a lot of fun. And my kind of work as a human being lately has been letting that come out to play more often. So it's very interesting that you asked me that now because I would have had a different answer for you a month ago.

And I think the podcast allows you to do that, right? I mean, going on other people's podcasts, having your own, it's kind of that, that way to get back into the fun, the banter, the all the stuff you kind of miss once you start getting away from people, let's say in college where you're with everyone, that's your same age group that you can relate to.

Yeah, but when I'M stressed, that goes away. And my podcasts suck. And they get really serious and they're all about like, here's how to do xyz and I'm not having fun. The audience isn't having any fun. And I'm teaching because I think people want it and then it sucks.

So if I prioritize the things that give me enjoyment in the first place, then everything else kind of falls into place.

Yeah, people can tell when you're having fun or when you're forcing it.

Yes. Yes they can.

So talk to me about your first entrepreneurial endeavor outside of being a kid, outside of selling the baseball cards or the lemonade stand as an adult, what was your first venture that you took on full force?

I'm not sure that.

They'Re separate. I mean, I legitimately, every summer was raking leaves.

Was selling baseball cards, was umpiring, was doing everything that I could because I believed that the way that I would make my money was as a real estate investor. I worked with a real estate investor close to my hometown and helped him fix up houses and he told me about the financials of it all and he taught me how to trade stocks and buy income producing covered calls and sell naked puts and stuff like that.

Those two things come to me as hand in hand. I started, I started getting fairly good at Internet marketing when I was in college and when I graduated college, mostly as an affiliate doing search engine optimization, which later paved the way for me to build Amazon based businesses because I knew about search engine optimization and it applied to Amazon and physical products as well. So there's a trajectory always right. But I'm not sure that I can separate where I am now from those first ventures of umpiring and fixing up houses and selling baseball cards because that gave me the seed capital, if you will, that I thought was going to go into buying houses and renting out houses, that actually went into buying websites and fixing up websites and then that leading to the next stage and the next stage and the next stage. I think the only thing that has changed is that my wins are bigger and my failures are way bigger. So I'm just operating at a higher scale, but my activities are kind of mostly the same.

Nathan, it's funny you brought up umpire. So I was a longtime umpire. I was the head umpire for my town, so to speak, when I was 15. And I felt like I had learned a lot of lessons. I mean, I had to manage people's schedules. So I learned how unreliable people could be and how you had to vet them, but there's also a level of customer service dealing with angry people from both sides, a sense of structure and interpreting them. Would you agree?

I think the thing that it gave me the most was I got used to talking to people in authority and putting them in their place. I can remember one time as a 12 or 13 year old kid calling this coach over like coach, you need to calm down and him laughing because I, I had the authority as a 12 year old. So that was the skill set for me of learning like you have to make a decision, he's either out or he's safe and you're going to deal with consequences of somebody's going to be upset and somebody is going to be happy. And maybe you were right, maybe you were wrong. It doesn't matter. You still have to make a decision.

And. Yeah, right. So that was the muscle that I developed as an umpire.

Okay, let's talk about Amazon a little bit. I got in in 2008. What year did you get in later?

It was 2012. 2012.

What was Amazon like back then and how did you get into it originally?

Do you know that's funny.

I hate to sound like a broken record. It was a little bit of a wide open west from like a ranking perspective, right? I mean if you could get 50 reviews, you were the envy of everybody in your space. But also getting 50 reviews was a lot harder than it is today. So just like Google was different.

15 years ago, 10 years ago, ranking was easier. It was, it was easier to manipulate links. Everything was of lower quality as well. Today all the principal.

Sound like a broken record, like it's the same marketplace. The design hasn't changed, the algorithm hasn't even changed very much. But now you have to be higher quality in order to win. So the puck hasn't even moved. There's just better players competing for the puck. So I think a lot of people have said it's getting harder, but the reality is when I was ranking websites from my dorm room in college, this was before WordPress, I was hand coding things on Dreamweaver on a dial up computer. So of course it's going to be easier because you don't have access to the same tools now. The tools are available to everybody, so the game is easier. For some it is. You have more opportunities, more resources available, but you have to be, you have to use those resources to have a higher quality customer experience if you want to, if you want to hang. And so that to me is what has changed.

And how do you use your Internet marketing Background for Amazon because to me, the sellers that have the most success are the ones that are doing that. The people that end up failing is when they're just an Amazon seller. And once Amazon changes something, they can't adjust, they can't adapt.

Yeah, 10,000% accurate. The phrase that just is like nails on chalkboard to me is Amazon business. Like no one says I have a Walmart business. No one says I have an affiliate business. No one says what their business is as defined by their customer acquisition strategy. Nobody except for Amazon sellers because they tend to be bad marketers. So the people who win are the ones who buy traffic to opt ins, warm them up and create customer experiences and then close the deal on Amazon. The ones who win are the ones who are doing search engine optimization and sending the traffic to Amazon and closing the deal on Amazon and the ones who are putting money into their customer experience so that they choose them over everybody else. That's called building a business. If you're optimizing for Amazon, then you're running a nice little cash flow game that is going to go away the next time there's an algorithm change. They're very, very different games and there's a lot of people who think they're entrepreneurs who are actually traffic manipulators or who are algorithm manipulators and they're not really building something that's available or sellable. Yeah, I think no opinion on this.

Well, what advice would you have for the people that are stuck as the Amazon seller that haven't taken the time to get into marketing to understand what's working? Where do they even begin? What direction would you point them in?

Yeah, good question. So the first step is they need to create a budget of their profits to invest into other areas. Most people though are putting them into direct response funnels, which is a completely different game than Amazon. My recommendation would be to put it into audience or to put it into customer experience. If nothing else, take part of the budget that you are making from your profits and put them into dialing in an amazing customer experience so that that person is choosing you over everybody else. That alone will have you stand out among everyone else if then you want to take it one step further. I love building or sponsoring audiences. I don't like paying for shout outs or influencers, but what I do like is going to the people that I really want to have on as influencers or audiences and creating partnerships with them. I will create equity arrangements or profit share agreements with those influencers because if you don't have audience, you have nothing. So you either need to put the money and the resources into developing it yourself so that you've got an extra leg on the stool of your business, or you need to go out and create a partnership with that person so that there's a long term relationship. Otherwise you have no ability to command your own traffic. You're always beholden to someone else. And then from there, I mean, if I were to go one step further, I'm totally biased on this, Nathan. I'm real hot on search engine optimization right now. Everybody else is chasing LinkedIn and Instagram, man. Nobody is doing Google well.

You have to think really long term to be good at search engine optimization, just like you have to think long term to be good at Amazon, but even longer on Google. So as a result, I think the competition's really weak in developing really good search engine optimization sites. So you've got to think long term and it takes resources and if you play that game well, you win. So that's, that would be my order of operations. But it starts with saying, okay, the check I'm getting from Amazon every month is the business's money. It's not my money. I'm on salary at my company and I need to create a reinvestment pool of taking 20% of those profits and putting them into something else. Whether that is hiring somebody or sponsoring somebody or reinvesting it into the thing that builds your asset. There's such a difference between chasing short term cash flow and building a long term asset. They're different mindsets. When you put up a product that you hope ranks on Amazon, you are building short term cash flow. When you are building up an audience that will buy product after product after product after product, you are building an asset. One is long term thinking, one is short term thinking. Most entrepreneurs in today's world are addicted to short term results and they don't build assets. It's why most people can't sell their companies. But if you build up the do the hard work of bringing on people, building systems, setting a long term vision for the company, that's an asset that will make you rich.

Yeah, I completely agree. And I think the partnerships go hand in hand with the search engine optimization. I mean some of our, we have hundreds of partners and they'll write for our blog and write a backlink, vice versa to theirs and just getting links everywhere and over time it's just building your SEO. And we have articles that we've written for someone else's blog that appear on the top five of Google a year later because we spent that extra time just making that small investment back in the day.

Yeah. So at the first ever Capitalism conference, which is the conference I hold about once a year, I brought on Gary Vaynerchuk. This is right before he really popped. And I brought him on because his, his singular goal in his career is to buy the New York Jets. Mine is to buy the Cleveland Indians. I've been following him for 10 years for that reason. Like this guy will contextualize the next steps forward for me. So I brought on Gary and he, and he said, if you're at a million dollars and you want to go to $100 million, it is all about people. It is all about your emotional intelligence, not your own personal intelligence. It is all about who you surround yourself with and investing into other people. And man, I did not want to hear that advice, Nathan. I wanted to know that there was a step by step plan because I was probably at maybe I was under 5 million. I was definitely under 10 million. I think I was under 5 at the time. This is back in 2015. And I really wanted to hear that there was a clear path to go from 5 to 50 million. And that clear path was better learn how to lead, you better learn how to succeed through others. And I didn't want to do that because I sucked at it. And now a few years later, I, I suck less.

And I have probably sacrificed a lot of short term profit to get adequate at finding recruiting and managing talent just adequately. But I know that in the 50 year cycle, I will out earn the kid from 2015 who is just looking for short term, win short term.

So how do you decide when's the right time to hire and what you should be hiring for?

It's always the right time to hire when you know what you're hiring for.

It's funny, part of my job when I'm advising someone I've invested in is getting them to think about doing less. And just this morning I had breakfast with both my mentor and my best friend.

Who encourages me to do less. And he always comes back to like he hears my vision and then he goes, who's the one person.

You do not need to build on an executive team, dude, you need one person, one person probably for the next stage of this business. And today he was basically telling me, you have, you still have this idea, Ryan, that you need to build this team and then the team will move things forward. It's like, no, you need one person and you need to identify what that one role is. And so you know what that forces me to do, Nathan. And I hate that this is the answer. It forces me to make job descriptions.

Right.

Forces me to think about what KPIs I'm going to track. It forces me to be able to describe what that person is going to do when they join me. And I wish that wasn't the case. Like, I just want to be able to find amazing people and say, figure it out. Nope, I made that mistake too many times. I need to have the filter for how I will know that is the right person and how they will know that they're on track towards their goals. Because I've done the opposite and it really doesn't end well. So it's always the right time to hire when you are clear about who that next person is and then you move forward.

And I love the honesty because I think a lot of people look at entrepreneurs who have had success, who have a team and they're like, wow, this person figured out hiring when really no one's figured out hiring. We're all trying to get better little by little by little and avoid those costly mistakes. Can you talk about some of the mistakes and what you learned from them?

Firing too slow. So I think it was Brian Lee. He's the founder of the Honest Company, was also the founder of LegalZoom. He, he's got $3 billion.

Companies on his resume. He's so smart man working on his fourth. And Brian said to me once, he's like, nobody knows how to hire.

The only thing you can good at is firing.

I asked his strategy for hiring is hire fast, fire faster. Not hire slow, fire fast, hire fast, fire faster.

Like this.

This is either the right person or it's not.

And so I have hired people who are up and comers. That was a mistake. I've hired people who I haven't worked with in the past. Like we did do a test project together. That was a mistake. I have kept people on too long after you knew it wasn't a fit. That was a mistake. I have hired multiple positions at the same time. That was a mistake. I have hired without getting my team's feedback on the person. That was a mistake. I have hired without having a woman in the interview because they're more emotionally intelligent than we are. That's a mistake. I have paid way too much. You just, oh, this person's worth six figures. I should pay them six figures. That was a mistake. I mean, how much time we got? I could keep it. I learned by making mistakes. Dates and then I get better and I'm less likely to make them again. It is how I learn is the only way I know how to learn. So I just guess and I get, I take them across the chin and I take a few to the nose and I go, that hurt. Let me do it differently next time. And so the next time I get punched a little bit less and I move forward. I'm not recommending that strategy to anybody, but it is how I'm wired and it's how I move forward.

Yeah, I'm very similar. I mean, we put out so much content in our Facebook group, our blog or YouTube channel, our podcast, and we get clients who will read it for months. And they're just my recommendation, just do it. At some point you got to just go for it. And if you learn like you said, fire quickly, adjust your your from your mistakes and move forward. And you got to get in that mentality. In my opinion. It sounds like you agree.

So if you get into a relationship, you are going to fight. Inevitably you are going to have problems. If you're in a romantic relationship, right. If you start a business, you will have days that it sucks. If you are born, you will have trauma.

You can just accept those and move forward anyway. Or you can try and insulate yourself against anything bad ever happening by not getting into a relationship, not starting a business and killing yourself. Those are your options. Business and hiring is the same. You are going to get mistakes, you're going to get punched, you're going to make bad decisions, you're going to lose money. It's part of the process. So just make them like, just make them as fast as possible, get them out of the way and move forward. And maybe you're, you'll be lucky and you'll get one of the first three. People will be amazing and you just jive well together and you move forward. Awesome. That's great. You're one of the lucky ones. Just expect that you're gonna get punched and then move forward.

I love it. One of my favorite questions when I interview people who are running seven eight figure businesses, what does your structure look like? And I know you invest in different companies. How do you set it up? Do you have a project manager, a team leader, a COO who's underneath them? Can you give us a little bit of a sneak peek behind the scenes?

Yeah. So I do really well with partners or having that person on the team who is like my anchor person. So I always have one person that I do all of the numbers with all the systems. With all the operations with. So right now that's my chief of staff@capitalism.com and in my investments or other businesses, it's the operator or the one person that I'm mentoring or like there's some anchor person who's running the business. That's how I work best. Under them, there's almost always a project manager. So the project manager is in charge of freelancers, they're in charge of agencies, they're in charge of ensuring that we hit our goals, that we move the ball down the court. I think it starts there. I think from there there's got to be somebody in charge of sales. There's got to be somebody who is in charge of acquiring leads, creating conversions, acquiring customers, managing Amazon. Like when there's people who ask me about secrets of Amazon, I'm like, dude, I don't know anything about. Like I know enough about Amazon to know what the 8020 is for us to win against everybody else and for me to know if my Amazon channel manager is doing a good job. If you think that the secret to doing well on Amazon is you knowing all the secrets to Amazon, you are not an entrepreneur. You are are chasing short term cash flow. You are not building a business. So somebody in charge of sales, somebody overseeing what your customer acquisition strategy is and there's nobody in that role, it's you for a while. But I want to hire for that position. So it's my singular person, project manager, somebody in charge of sales.

What do you look for in that singular person and in your project managers and the higher level people in your organization? Are there certain traits that you're looking for?

Yeah, I'm looking for personal responsibility. I'm looking for an eagerness to grow and I'm looking for some.

Operations background. Like do they have the ability to take the bird's eye view of the company and see what is going on? Can they jump into something quickly and clear a bottleneck? Like I'm looking for my operations person, really. And operations has a finance aspect to it, it has a systems aspect to it, as a people aspect to it. So do they have those core skill sets? Because I'm a growth guy, I think about scale and I think about hiring and I think about spending money and I think about being aggressive and I think about winning, I think about the goal line, I think about vision. So you've got to have the person that says no, wait, hang on, we should not do that. That's a terrible idea. Here's why. So I'm hiring my filter I'm hiring the person that says no. I'm hiring the person that decides how fast we go and we've got to have a good dance together. If somebody can't tell me no, they're.

Not the right person, I love it. Can you talk a little bit about how you structure meetings and how you build a culture? I mean, I met your team at Sellercon. They all seem very similar minded. I know you were going out to lunch with them and you talked about the structure. How are you actually managing them and communicating?

Oh, you just asked a growth guy about management.

Because I am not nearly as good.

As I need to be in order to do that. Let's talk about culture for a second. Culture is a top down thing. If your company culture sucks, something about you that sucks. And so this is only. I only know this because I've had a lot of sucky culture and so I realize I'm the problem. So culture is not about ping pong tables. And it's not about. It is, it is about. For me, it is about when I go to war with the other people on the team, do I trust the other people on the team to have my back? And in order for them to have my back, they need to know that I have theirs. Sometimes that means a lot of hard conversations and it means a lot of difficult decisions. But they all know I've got their back and vice versa. When it comes to management.

The only thing that I do that I feel like I have authority to talk about is that every quarter we set 90 day objectives together and I can stay out of their way knowing that they know what's expected of them and I know what's expected of them. Apart from that, I try to stay out of their way unless they need me. I confess that I have not been able to get the same results out of a virtual environment, out of a personal environment. But I have had a few virtual people that have been amazing and that feel like they're part of the culture. So that might just be a personality thing. But overall I would say, Nathan, I don't feel like I have the authority to be able to speak on that because I'm still guessing my way forward.

I think a lot of the best entrepreneurs do that and I think a lot of entrepreneurs struggle to do that. To actually hand off the business and say, you're in charge, I'm hands off. There are a lot of people that can't do that.

I think there's people who do it and still can't do it because I might be in that.

I probably err on the side too much of staying out of people's way.

One thing that I've really had to come full circle, like I've had to come forward on this, is that I think that people want to have full autonomy. People really want to be told what to do and they want to know if they're doing a good job. And so I have had to really practice.

Providing more direction than I'm comfortable doing naturally.

Interesting.

And I think that comes from operating in a virtual environment. I expect that if I'm really clear up front with somebody what my expectations are, I think they're just going to run with the ball. I have found that there's at least three to six months of me coming down and working with them more ongoing before we can do this. So I always think, get the right person, give them the expectations, let them go. In my experience, there's a longer curve than I expected of being really in the mud with them for a while until they are ready to go off on their own. And of course, I'm talking about a team that's less than 10 people, so I'm in charge of that. In a corporate culture, it's going to be a little bit different. So I am not yet good at this, but I'm learning that in my experience, people need a little bit more of a, of a, of a close, of a close knit touch point to be able to feel like they're freed up to go in that, to go on their own before they can just like operate. Unless you're just going total freelance designer, I need this thing done so and so I need you to write this article that's a little bit different. When you have somebody internal or somebody who's committed on a monthly basis as an agency, I think there's more of a handoff that needs to happen.

Yeah, I agree. How do you structure your day? What does your day look like? Is it a lot of meetings, a lot of podcasts? Is it consistent? Is it different every day?

Yeah, I have a week to week schedule that is consistent. My day to day is less consistent. So depending on how many projects I have going on, depending on what I'm focusing on, my day is my weeks are broken up a little bit different or my day is broken up a little different, but the week tends to be consistent. I tried to be very protective of my creative time. My creative time is recording. My creative time is thinking, it's writing, it's brainstorming. Right now, my projects are finding good People. I have one central hire that I'm hell bent on finding and that's my major focus right now. And then I save my meetings buffer email for end of day because I'm far less creative at the end of the day. So I'm very protective of my day until about noon. That's my creative time. My meetings are tend to be three to five.

That's also like when I'm mentoring one of my brand managers or one of my anchor operations people is I'll get together with them and we're working through things. But my creative time is until about 12, 1 o' clock, depending on when I eat lunch. And I try to be very protective of that.

I love it.

Can we talk about owning the Cleveland Indians? When did that goal come to be? How are you breaking down that goal? I know a lot of people out there have much shorter goals than that and they can't think that big picture. Can you talk a little bit about that?

Yeah. So, I mean, the goal came about when I was.

I was like 12 or 13. And the reason it came about was because I knew my dream as a kid was actually to be the general manager of a baseball team. I wanted to be the guy signing free agents, making trades, doing acquisitions. I wanted to be that guy. But when I was a young teenager, I realized two things. One, I thought I was going to be a pastor, so my career route was not going to be that to a baseball team, to be on staff at a baseball team. And number two, what I realized was that if you're the general manager, it means somebody else hired you, so you're not in control of getting that position. So my chances of making enough money to buy the team were higher than being the person who interviewed well and hired for that position. Right. So I just decided that I would become the owner instead of the general manager. But I still want to be involved in the trades and the acquisitions of being the dugout with eye black on my eye, doing annoying chance and firing people when they strike out.

I love it. What do you think of the Trevor Bauer trade? I got to ask you that while you're here.

Brilliant. I'm so glad you asked me this, Nathan. I think this will go down as a similar trade to Bartolo Colon in 2002. In 2002, the Indians traded Bartolo Colon at the trade deadline for Cliff Lee, Brandon Phillips and Grady Sizemore. Three all Stars. I think you are going to see this compared to that, in the long haul, we freed up potentially $18 million in payroll, got Better on paper in the short term, got younger in the long term. Oh my goodness, it was such a good trade. They had to make it. It was an absolute slam dunk of a trade. My hope is that we've now freed up enough payroll to re sign Francisco Lindor for the long term. So the Indians got better on paper in the short term. In the long term, there's an absolute slam dunk of a deal.

I love it. And the opposite of that would be the Mets keeping on to Noah Syndergaard, which they could have made the same type of move, gotten the same type of impact. And I think that's going to kill them in the long term if they.

Didn'T do that well, you know, when, when the Blue Jays traded Marcus Strom Stroman, they didn't get as big, nearly as big a return as Bauer. Who knows what the return on the table was. The Indians front office has proven to be extremely creative. I've never seen anything like it. So who knows what the other deals that were being dangled around were.

I love it. We're getting towards the end. Can you talk about capitalism? The Capitalism Conference? I want the audience to know more about it. How do you come up with the idea for it? What do you see as a vision of it going forward?

Yeah, so a few Years ago, around 2015, I felt like I had hit a ceiling. I felt like I could only really think up to about $5 million. And so I decided that you're the average of the five people you hang out with, supposedly. So it's not like I was going to go hang out with the best entrepreneurs in the world. So I figured that I would hire. Hire the best entrepreneurs in the world and sell tickets to there, because that would be my selfish reason was I would upgrade the people that I was hanging out with. I would upgrade my knowledge, my expectations, my skill set. And a few years in running the conference, I built my first eight figure company, had my first eight figure exit. And so it is just the way that we stay sharp for my community. We bring in the people who are 10 years ahead of all of us for three days and kind of just incubate new expectations. That was my intent behind it. And so that's why we do the Capitalism conference every year. Capitalism.com is a media play for entrepreneurs because I don't think there's anybody having a real discussion around wealth and capitalism, even politics. I think most of the noise that we see is noise. And so I just wanted to do something about that because I feel I feel this responsibility to my generation that is suddenly skeptical of capitalism to do something about that. Because the fact that in today's world, when we have all this abundance, we're questioning capitalism. Are we crazy? This is absurd. We have longer lifespans than ever. We're safer than ever. We don't have a lack of food, we have too much food. We have an abundance problem and we're questioning capitalism. I think we need to be questioning personal responsibility. We need to question individuals more than we need to question capitalism. So I just feel the need to defend that.

I love it.

Ryan, this has been great. Where can people find out more about you and what are you most excited about for the rest of the year?

So my biggest focus is doing less and making better decisions. I'm not hard to find. I'm ryandanielmoran on Instagram, my website, my podcast are a book called capitalism dot com. I'm worth a Google and I can be found there.

Awesome, man. Have a great rest of the day.

All right, thanks for having me, Nathan.

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