Why You Make Less Than $1M Per Year w/ Brooke Castillo

Foreign.

What's up, good people? Welcome back to capitalism dot com.

I'm gonna be joined again today by my friend Brooke Castillo. We've had Brooke on the podcast two other times, and they've both been the best interviews ever. This one's a little bit different because.

This one actually is the best interview ever. I seriously. We stopped recording this, and I went, brooke, that.

That was the best one ever.

I'm so excited to bring this to you because Brooke and I go into it deep by bringing in some of our personal challenges to the table, and we allow each other to battle it out and see where we're lying to ourselves, where we're holding ourselves back. And as a result of listening to.

This, you're going to see how you're.

Doing it in your own life, too. Brooks, a master at identifying the thoughts.

That we're practicing in our brain that.

Are perpetuating our lives over and over again. We're creating our lives with our thoughts and our feelings and our actions. And Brooke is the best coach in the whole world at holding up the mirror to you and allowing you to see how you are thinking and feeling and acting in a way that is perpetuating the life that you either want or don't want. And after a deep conversation with her, it's almost impossible for you to not feel like you can do anything.

And it's easy for you to see.

How you've been holding yourself back this entire time. So Brooke and I get into it real deep every time. She's one of my best friends in the whole world. I love her to absolute pieces. I cherish every moment that I get to spend with her, and I feel.

So proud to be able to bring.

This interview with her. It's my favorite one that we've ever done. We talk about money. We talk about money a lot. We talk about wealth, and we talk about our relationships and our struggles financially and in relationships, and how we see each other and how we see ourselves is not necessarily how other people see us. And what that does to our brains and our actions and our behaviors and how what we think we're creating is not necessarily what other people perceive and how we could be completely missing the opportunities and the stories and the experiences that are right in front of us. So as a result of this, you're going to experience a sense of freedom that you may not have experienced before, because you're going to realize how close you are to everything that you want and how you're just a few thoughts, emotions, or behaviors away from having the life that you desire. Enjoy this conversation with my favorite person in the world, Brooke Castillo. I believe very strongly that the role of the entrepreneur is to stay in vision mode. It's not to get into the weeds and the details of every piece of the business. The job of the founder is to cast the overall vision and then to bring in the right people to be able to execute upon that vision and make sure that the company has enough money to be able to ensure that you can continue to operate. This is what we call the owner's model. The owner's model is. Is our process for keeping the entrepreneur in the owner's seat. You cast a vision, you recruit the right people, and you ensure that the company has enough money to execute. And this is what we help people do inside of the capitalism incubator. We help them get clear on their vision, help them launch profitably, connect them with the people that they need to know. And we have an investment fund to invest in the businesses that are coming from our little incubator. So if you're an entrepreneur that wants to build something great, wants to build something that you can scale and even sell, you can find out more about what we do and who we've helped@capitalism.com Inc. That's capitalism.com Inc. Brooks, say hello.

As if we're doing a podcast right now.

Hello. As if we were doing a podcast.

Whoa. I see what you did there, Brooke.

Hey, Ryan. Hey, what up, you guys?

It's been a year. It's been a year since we did this.

It's a disgrace.

It is. I would. I have requests for people to do it for us to do this quarterly.

Yeah.

Just so you know.

Does everyone know who we are?

No one knows who we are. I don't even know why.

Can I ask you a personal question?

No.

Did you hear how my soda, like, burst when you said that? It was like a shot.

Absolutely not. I want to know what it's like.

You to be rich one more time, please.

I want to know what it's like for you to be rich. What's it like being rich?

What it is like being rich feels like.

Damn it, Brooke. Why did you have to mind me like that?

I had.

I came up with three questions for you to start. What is it like for me to be rich? It feels like calm. It feels like ease. It feels like excitement. It feels like choice. It feels like movement toward what I want. It feels like unencumbered progress. Wow. Yeah.

Okay.

That's what it feels like.

Yeah. That's what it feels like, for me, too.

Okay, great. Good podcast, everybody.

I think, like, you have to know what it feels like to be rich in your mind before you can get rich. So I ask you, what does it feel like to be rich? Where did you go to find the answer?

I went to when I. How it feels when I feel rich.

Yeah. So did you think about how much money you have?

No. No.

I feel like how I want to feel. And I. And I went to what I think wealth means to me. Oh.

What.

What it empowers me to do.

So I was asking you what it feels like to be you today.

Oh, okay. And I need you to reframe.

Okay, Wait. This is fantastic.

Okay.

I asked you.

I'm very afraid right now.

What does it feel like for you to be rich? Because you are rich. And I think a lot of your listeners who aren't rich are probably curious what it's like to be you. Oh, right. But when I asked you what it feels like to be rich, it's almost like you didn't identify yourself as rich now.

Well, I sometimes do. And I sometimes don't.

What?

Yeah, well, I mean, the. I wrote an email to my list about this this week. Sometimes when I hang out with you, some of my internal judgment comes up. Right, right. And I. And I. And that little voice, it's like, oh, I'm not quote there yet, or I haven't accomplished what I want yet. And I see the absence of what I want versus the reframe is. Oh, great. This is awesome. This means I'm actually moving towards what I want faster because I'm around somebody who is ahead of me in one area of life. But depending on what perspective I'm taking on, that will change how I feel.

Interesting. Because when I. So we're all hanging out, it's me and you and the hormosis. And I just think of us all as rich. Yeah. Like we're different. Like. What's the right word? Layers of rich. Different.

Just mention just like rich. We're different types of hot.

I mean, I'm hotter and richer. How does that feel?

Well, actually, depending on what perspective.

Depending on if you're male or female.

You know what, Brooke? If anyone. I will. I have no problems. If anyone thinks you're hotter than me, that's not my target.

You're okay with that?

Yeah.

That won't. That won't intrude upon what I'm after anyway?

No, but I think it's interesting because we were talking right before we started recording, and then we, like, go get the recording we were talking about. Most people who are in our industry that are just getting started are probably about this at the six figure mark. Right. And.

At what point do you decide now I'm rich? I think is an interesting question because I think when you don't have six figures, then you think, oh, when I have six figures, then I'll feel like I'm rich.

Yeah, yeah. But we were even talking about this a couple nights ago. Alex was sharing how the richest he ever felt was when he had a hundred thousand dollars in the bank.

Yes.

You know, and now he makes like $4 million a month or something. Right. But that was the richest he ever felt. So is rich a condition or is rich a feeling?

Well, it's obviously not a condition because I asked you what it felt like to be rich.

Because I think of it as a feeling like what I want out of that. And there are moments that I feel it more than others.

So cool.

But I also suspect and believe that the more that I am in that mode, the richer I will get. Because when I'm in that mode, I just tend to create naturally.

Yeah.

I tend to not do things out of scarcity. When we recorded last year, we were right in the middle of the economic meltdown and everything was, was, we were, I think Texas was just opening up. It was like, and I mean like you could leave your house or something.

Like that and still pretty scary.

And you said something, you said, I believe that it's all going to come back. It's going to be like, boom. You actually did this with your hand. You went boom. I know it's hard for you to believe that you would do something like that, but, but you, like, I think I'm just going to right back. And a year later we can look at it and say, oh, it came back and went boom.

Yeah.

But I suspect that there are people who went through a very fearful time during that time and said the economy is never going to recover. And now a year later is like, it's not really recovered, it's all inflationary. We're actually still in a recession. And as a result, I think that you were, you felt empowered to move forward. Let's go harder. The economy is going to come back. Let's go become a life coach, sell some stuff. People need me more than ever.

Right.

But the people who were like, it's all going to be a meltdown, got fear and are still in inaction.

Well, and now what they're saying, because I talked to many of them, they're Saying, well, you know, Covid, that slowed me down.

That prevented me from winning.

You know, when that all happened, then I didn't get to win. And I decided at the very beginning, like, it's easy to be successful. For me, I believe this. It's easy to be successful when everything's just perfect, when the conditions are wonderful. That's not when you're being asked of yourself, really. It's when the things are hard and challenging and stressful. That's when you really get to see what you're made of. And for me, that's what it's about. It's not about the money anymore. It's about, like, I want to show myself what I'm capable of. And so the harder things are, the more opportunity there is to kind of step into that and see and to. To have gone through this whole last year and have it be our biggest year is, like, delightful to me. And I think I grew more this year than I have in any other year of my life as well.

And was that intentional, like, when things got hard? Did you lean into that?

Oh, yeah, 100%. 100%. I'm like, let's go. Let's double down, is what I said.

Because you never seemed to have any.

Doubt during that time.

Oh, yeah.

I had lots of doubt, uncertainty, but I never saw doubt.

Well, what happens is the doubt comes up, and then I'm like, whoop, better get to work. We got to overcome this. And that's what doubling down is. Right. As soon as that emotion comes up, I think everybody did, like, everyone, go get in your home and don't come out. Like, I think everyone was freaked out, but it's like, okay, what are we going to do about this? I'm not going to stay here. This isn't productive. What can I do to overcome this and create? And the truth is, I knew if I was experiencing it, all my students were, too. So I took it, as their leader and teacher, my responsibility to here. This is how we overcome this.

So in that mode, the doubt comes up.

Yeah.

And that. What do you do to work through that or to. When you say double down on that.

Yeah. So we figure out what is the thought causing this doubt, which is, oh, my gosh, you know, we're all going to lose all our money. We're all going to lose our health. Life's never going to be the same again. You know, this is the beginning of the end. Like, all of those thoughts that I think many people had, and that created a lot of fear and doubt in Us, we just need to look at and say, okay, wait, those are just thoughts. There's so many other options of what we could think, oh, this is an opportunity. This is my chance. So many people need life coaching right now. Everything's going virtual. Wait a minute. This is everything I already do. This is perfect. This time was made for me and it was just a choice of how I was going to choose to think about it. That created a completely different trajectory and.

That allows you to find evidence to support that thought. Just like two people can look at the economy and say, oh, it came back, boom.

Yeah.

Or no, it's still. We're actually still underwater. Yeah, you can find that evidence. So for somebody who is not rich, for somebody who is stuck at 100k.

How would you coach somebody through that? Because I think most people get into this rut and then look at evidence outside of themselves. Like, nobody makes more than me. So it's. Or I don't know any rich people or. So according to what you're saying now, it sounds like you would just adjust the thought and look for evidence of it.

Yeah. So if. Right. Let's say you're making 100k right now, first of all, congratulations, you're not making 50k. So which really, I think giving yourself that perspective, what's the difference between you making 100k and you making 50k, understand that difference. If you're at 100k, it's important for you. It's like, I do this with weight loss. I'm like, yeah, you weigh 200 pounds, but you don't weigh three. Why? Why don't you weigh 300 pounds? Like, understanding why you're not, quote, unquote, worse off than you are right now will really help you understand the difference. The difference between you 50k and 100k, what's the difference? Understand that first, then what's the difference between you 100k and a million? And really answer that question. And it has to be an internal difference. What's the difference in you? When I asked that question, I think I was making 300k and I said, what's the difference between me and someone that and a woman that makes 5 million? And I was like, yeah, she probably doesn't get drunk on chardonnay every night was the first thing that came into my head. And there was so many things after that. She probably doesn't do this. She probably doesn't make this decision. She probably doesn't worry about this thing. And I started becoming that woman that made 5 million. And then before I knew it. I was that woman.

So it was, it was more of a. I'm sure there are people who make $5 million and drink chardonnay every night.

Right. But who am I?

Yeah.

As a woman, that makes 5 million. There's no way I could be productive at that level.

How do you know?

Well, I was barely being productive at 300K.

Okay.

Yeah.

Okay. So that's interesting because that means that the blueprint is different for you than it is for somebody else. Of course that's interesting to me as somebody who has formerly been obsessed with the how of figuring out how other people did it and then like trying to copy them, trying to model.

Yeah, yeah, right.

But in your thought process it is more about your own internal makeup.

Yeah.

What's. So in that case, do you, you imagine yourself at 5 million and the traits that that person has and now you were trying to model yourself?

Yeah.

Is that right?

Yeah. And I spent a lot of time thinking about it, like the level of discipline, how I showed up, how I communicated business wise, who I had around me, the kind of things I was spending my time doing. I immediately hired a full time assistant and, and had them start handling all of the things that a woman making $5 million wouldn't be doing. I started thinking in a way that was much bigger, much higher quality thoughts, much bigger opportunities. It really changed everything to think about it that way. But I think a lot of people have a hard time with that imagining. I don't know the difference. And so it does help sometimes to go backwards to say, okay, think of a time when you were making less money. Think of a time when you were in college and maybe you were making 20 bucks an hour. What's the difference between or 10 bucks an hour, depending on how old you are. Right. So if you're making 10 bucks an hour working in college, what's the difference between you then and you now? Every difference. How you party at night, how you show up, what you ask your boss for, how you show up to work, how much you care about what you do. It's like, like you could be a million dollar employee making $10 an hour. There are people that you see in certain jobs and you're like, they're not going to be here long.

Yeah. Right.

You can feel the energy like they are beyond this job already.

That's right.

And so I think that's similar. So when you understand that difference, then I think it's, it's easier to understand the next leap. And then for me now at 50 million what's the difference between me at 50 million and 100 million? And what's crazy is as you get more successful, as you make more money, the difference becomes smaller, less.

Yeah, I love that.

Which is crazy. Like, the difference between me, when I was working at Nordstrom selling fashion jewelry, Right. And now is so much bigger than the difference, which is, you know, what was that? I was probably getting paid $30,000 a year to 50. And then the same amount, 50 to 100 million, is very subtle.

Yeah, I like that perspective on it because that always makes it an internal game.

Always.

And an internal game is one that I can always control to some extent. Like, I'm always in control of how I show up, of how disciplined I am, of what my focus is and what my beliefs are, of how I treat people. Those are always things that are within my control. And I can't control the outside world.

Right.

And I think it's really tempting for people to look at the outside world for evidence of what's possible for themselves or evidence to the outside world to justify where they are as an explanation.

For why they can't get there.

Exactly.

Please don't do that. Please don't do that. It's just as easy to find an explanation as to why you can.

That's right.

You know, it's like when people say to me, well, I tried to be a life coach and I wasn't successful. I'm like, keep going. What are you talking about? You're not success. We still got the rest of your life. Like, the opportunity is still there. It's still so huge. Why are you making a claim? Why are you quitting now? That makes no sense.

Yeah, I, I, I get that. And, and the, I think the trap that can people can run into there is, is the longer that they have gone without what they perceive to be success, that is evidence now for why they won't continue to be successful.

And I think it's the opposite. I think the longer you've gone without success, you're probably pretty close. Right. You're probably just, it's probably just around the corner if you've been working.

But the strange thing about that is whatever perspective you choose on that, you're right.

Okay, 100.

If this is more evidence of why I'm not going to be successful, you will continue to perpetuate that. But if you're like, oh, must be almost there, you will not show up in a way that makes it inevitable that you will be successful.

Right. Like if you talk to people who aren't as successful as they want to be. And you ask them why their reason is. It's so clear. Whatever their reason is for not making 10 million, 50 million, 100 million, a billion, whatever. Whatever their reason is for that is their religion that they are going to continue to perpetuate if they're not aware of it and most people aren't aware of it. It's unrealistic is what so many people say to me. I mean, we need to be realistic with how much money we can make. I'm like, do we?

You glossed over something that I want to poke into. So the reason why somebody isn't why where they are is the thing that's keeping them stuck.

The reason why they say.

The reason why they say they aren't where they are is what is keeping them where they are. Right. So somebody is at 100,000, they want.

To be at a million.

Okay.

And you ask them, why are you not at a million? And they answer.

They say, I just don't have the skill set for it yet. That is what's keeping them from.

They rarely say that, by the way.

Sure.

Okay.

They usually say, oh, it's the economy and I don't have the opportunity and it takes money to make money and I just haven't had the time. And, you know, I have other responsibilities.

Okay, I got it. So I answered it with an internal answer.

Most people.

Most. Okay, okay, I understand now. I can see why if I were to choose any external reason, it would be a bullshit thought. I said skill set yet that actually gives.

It's not even a bullshit thought. It's actually could be true. It's just not useful.

Yeah, it's not helping.

That's what you need to be aware of. Like, is this what I want to be thinking about my own success? Like, you have to be like the guardian of what you think about your own success. It needs to be always. I'm just not there yet. I'm on my way.

Right.

Always something like that versus like, oh, well, you know, it's my mother's fault or my boss.

Got it.

Because.

Because like, when. When you posed the question originally, my internal answer was, I'm just not there yet. I was. I was kind of taken aback by it because internally I'm like, I'm not yet. Like, I don't have a justification for it. I'm just not there yet. Like, I'm. I'm working on it.

So it's so fascinating to me because the way I asked you the question was like, isn't it great being rich. I love being rich. Don't you? But you didn't go there. Like you, you associated being rich with some amount of money that's beyond where you already are. When in all. In all evidence, like when you look at your net worth. Yeah. Very rich.

Yeah.

Yeah.

But, but when I answer the question, it was more of a. What does it feel like?

Yeah.

And there are times that I feel it and times that I don't feel it.

But there's. But that's actually interesting. Right. The times that you don't feel it are in times you're just choosing not to feel it.

Right, right.

And you don't ever want to do that.

There's, there's something in my perspective that is disempowering.

Yeah.

The richest I ever felt, I was probably like 23 or 24 and I just graduated college and I just put myself on payroll at my own company because through college I pay myself 500amonth of spending money.

Yeah.

I was living in a dorm, so I put myself on salary of I think 90,000 a year. And I went to the grocery store and just like put everything in my cart and it was like, yes. All of the Honey Nut Cheer, all of them give it to me. And it was just like.

Get whatever you want. Everybody get more granola bars. And it was just an absolute blast. And that to me, like I was feeling rich. I felt rich. And I had no doubt that it was going to continue. I had no doubt of my growth. I had no doubt that I would be a millionaire. I had no doubt that. So I think that that's feeling of being rich actually made it and makes it possible for you to do rich people things and think rich people thoughts and thus become a rich person.

And it just may. And I mean, I've talked about this so many times before. You have to be that person before you actually cash that check. Right. And so it's like you have to be the millionaire before you actually see it in your bank account. And if you aren't, you will sabotage that money or that money will freak you out in depression.

Yeah. If you aren't that person, if you.

Haven'T already created that identity for yourself.

Well, that's not a muscle that people have practiced. So when you say that, do you mean imagining it and modeling it as much as possible?

So I have these memories where I had little kids in the car and I would go to the grocery store and I would get in the car and on the front of the grocery store there was like Ralph's grocery store. On the front was these big lottery signs about what the current, you know, spin amount was. Okay, so it was like 100 million or 120 million. And I used to sit there and imagine the person winning that money and how they would feel to have that money and what it would be like to be told, you now have $100 million, you just won the hundred million dollar lottery. And that's not as easy as it sounds, right?

What? Imagining.

Imagining that what that person is feeling and what must be going through their head and what they would be thinking and what they would be doing. And so I spent a lot of time practicing receiving money, like virtually in my mind, in my imagination. And so I got very used to it. Like at first it would kind of freak me out and make me nervous thinking about that being that person that would like win that. And then as I got kind of used to it, yeah, I got, I have $100 million. This is what I would do and this is, is how I would handle it. This is what I would buy, and this is the reality of it in terms of taxes. And I'd start thinking about it. Like, people think that when you win the lottery, I know a lot about winning the lottery now because I've done it virtually in my mind so many times. But people think when you win the lottery that you're just like, yeah, let's go buy everything. It's kind of a freak out feeling if it's anything like I imagined. Right. It's kind of like, oh my gosh, I have all this money, what am I going to do with it? How do I pay the taxes? Do I tell people? Do I not tell people? Do I buy a big house that I was going to know? And so kind of playing around with what it's like to have a lot of money. And then being in that space, I did a lot of that and I did it very specific to business as well. So when I made my first million dollars, that was the richest I ever felt. I was like, I made a million dollars in one year as a woman, as a life coach. Like, what in the actual. Like, that was such an amazing feeling. And it had so many other feelings associated with it that I hadn't anticipated. Right. That were like, concerning. And oh my gosh, am I gonna be able to do this again or was this a fluke or what? So I think even imagining all the peace parts of it and owning all.

Of that, the bad stuff too. Yeah.

Before you even get there is part of the process of claiming that identity.

You know what I like about that is I have practiced visualizing myself in the end and modeling that Persona. But when I get punched in the face when I'm there or when I'm on the way there, I haven't practiced that. I have not practiced what it feels like to be close to a goal and not hit it or to have a setback along the way. And so I think I have taken those punches a little personally or use that as reason to doubt that I will get to the goal in the first place.

This is such a good point. I think most people fantasize about making money. They don't actually imagine it. Huge difference. Fantasizing about it means I'm going to be happy and I'm going to be looking and I'm going to have everything I've ever wanted in the world and my health will be perfect. It's like we fantasize in a way that it doesn't bring the thought to activation where we're actually feeling it. It's almost like we're daydreaming about it so we're not experiencing it viscerally.

Yeah.

And that's a huge difference. So thinking about the reality of having a hundred million dollars makes it so much more real. And then you feel, you can feel like the dimension of that. If you think that when you're going to make a million, whatever your goal is, a million, 10 million, 20 million, a hundred million, that you're gonna be happy all the time, you're doing it wrong, or that it's going to make you happy. I think a lot of people say I want to make money because then I'll be free.

Yes.

Then I'll be happy. And those things are available to you now?

Yeah. They imagine as relief from their existing problems. But as we've talked about, problems just change problems. You can have what might be perceived as higher quality problems, but you are never free of problems.

You have very different problems. I think you have better problems if you're going to perceive them rich or poor.

Rich, sure. But as you perceive them in the moment, they are just as painful. Of course, in the moment that went as. As lower quality problems, you would still not trade them for lower quality problems. But they feel the exact same.

The stress is real, the pain is real.

That's right. And so what I'm hearing you say is the. That if that is not part of your reality, meaning if you aren't ready for that, if you aren't ready to manage that, then in some way you'll sabotage as soon as there is a setback.

I've seen it. I've seen it happen.

So you've only practiced that things are going to be great and there's going to be streets of gold and chocolate and bunnies everywhere.

Exactly, exactly. And that's not the reality of it. And it doesn't mean that you don't go after it. I think you should. But the reason I think you should go after more money and everybody listening should make triple what they're making now is because of what it will require you to do cognitively and emotionally. And I think the evolvement of yourself and the growth of yourself is what makes it totally worth it. Because money is fun, but it's also hard. And the work to get there is hard, but it's worth it because of who you get to become in the process.

Right. So, Brooke, do you struggle to believe anything about money or business now?

I mean, I don't fully believe in the 100 million yet, because if I did, I'd already have it. Right. So there's still definitely doubt that I work through and negotiate with myself, but it feels different. I feel like I've accumulated. Accumulated enough of my own belief systems that are, like, have, like, stabilized me that I have so much evidence in my mind that is possible and that it's easy and that I can do it three days a week and that my staff can handle it. And so I'm enjoying believing the hundred million much more than I was enjoying believing the million.

I get that. I get that a lot. So when you. As you get closer and closer to the 100 million, do your goals become more specific or less?

Less.

Less. That's what I kind of figured. Because a specific goal is kind of attachment to something. But I think you've proven that you'll accomplish whatever you set your mind to enough that you just hold yourself in the end, rather than trying to think about specific goals along the way.

Yeah, I do lots of specific things. Try a lot of specific things out. But I'm not like, oh, okay, in order to make a hundred million, I need to make 10 million this month. Yeah. And then I need to do the specific thing to create that. I don't think that way. I think bigger.

Well, this is an interesting recurring theme. Specifics. You don't feel setbacks by the specifics. No. Meaning you don't not make $10 million this month and see that as evidence for the goal not happening. Yeah. You just live in believing in the goal and you're Watching it unfold. You do lots of specific things, but you don't use the specific things as evidence against your goal.

Never. And don't ever do that, any of you. Right. Oh, this means I'm going to fail. This means I'm not smart enough. This means this. This isn't going to work. This means I'm not going to hit my goal. I just can't see any reason to believe that. And even if you don't hit the goal, even up to. Right to the minute where you don't hit it, like, don't be like, I knew that was going to happen. Just pick a new goal or give yourself a longer time frame.

Yeah. That is, I think, so freeing.

Oh, yeah.

And it. And it makes life so fun.

Right.

Because the, the I. I told you I felt really glad and, and grateful that some of my junk came up as we were talking business earlier this week, because it was. It was like I didn't know that was in there. And I need to work through that.

Of course.

And those are kind of subconscious things that I don't. You don't know are there until they're brought up.

Exactly.

And it is really freeing to see those and to work through those and be rid of it and now keep marching towards the goal.

Yeah.

And that, that makes it so fun to just consciously choose whatever you want to believe and work towards. And then you get opportunities like I had this week to have the junk come up and to work and to clear through it. I think most people set that they don't. They are not willing to say, I want to make more money or I want to make a million dollars because they're afraid of the junk that will come up in the process.

100%. And so they tell themselves this. That doesn't matter to me. I don't need that money. Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

So like, they say, I want to make a million dollars, and the first time they have one of those setbacks, it's like, oh, I guess that's evidence. I'm just going to be at 100k for the rest of my life.

Or this is too hard, or this isn't worth it, or I don't have time for this. And really that's the opportunity for you to take a deep breath and open up to it. Because when you open up to that junk that comes up, that's in the way of not just you making money, but in every other area of your life when you. This is what I love about, like, when I first started coaching, all I did was Weight loss. Right. And I love weight. I love working with people on weight loss because it requires them to climb into their body and experience the vibration of emotion. And when you learn how to do that through weight loss, it applies to everything, every other thing in your life. Because the only thing holding you back from anything, from trying anything, from working towards anything, is a feeling you're afraid to have. That's it. So when all that junk, what you mean by that is all those feelings come up, if you're afraid to feel them and you're just going to quit, you're just going to make excuses as to why you can't do that. But if you're like, these are feelings. I am adept at handling feelings. I know how to feel feelings. I know how to go through shame, humiliation, frustration, and doubt. This is my, you know, skill set. If you have the skill set of being able to manage emotions, then you just keep making your goals bigger.

Yeah.

And the better you get an emotion, the better you get at emotion. And if you're good at motion with money, you're good at emotion, with love, you're good at emotion, with your health, you're good at emotion with anything that you want to do in your life, you're always going to be kind of confronting your own emotional life.

So what I interpret from that is that if somebody is stuck at an income goal or not getting the results that they want, they're actually afraid of an emotion that they don't want to.

Have if they're not continuing to move forward. Because what people don't understand is you fail, that moves you forward. Right. Unless you stop. And a lot of people fail. And instead of learning from that and using that as an opportunity to take another step, they use it as an excuse not to keep going because they feel sad or they feel. They feel icky.

Yes. So someone fails, they feel shame. They don't want to feel shame anymore, so they stop. Yeah, right. And that's why they fail.

They miss the opportunity when you could feel shame and be like, how do I get better at feeling shame? Because I'll tell you what, the better you are at feeling shame, the less shame you're going to feel. Because the better you are at feeling shame, the more you're gonna bring it out in the open. And shame can't survive with an audience.

And the more you are free of shame, the more likely you are to.

Take shame, the less afraid you are.

I'm trying to play this out in, like, an extreme scenario. Like, someone fails and loses money and they feel shame and they work through it. And then they try again and they fail and they lose more money and they feel shame and they work through it. Now they don't feel shame anymore, but they. The next time they fail and they go bankrupt, but they don't feel shame over getting over going bankrupt. So they just keep going.

Yeah. Because they're like, okay, now I really know what not to do.

Yeah.

Three times. I'm not doing any of that again. And they survived it and they're on the other side of it and now they filed for bankruptcy. So now they got a clean slate now. Let's go. Yeah.

Yeah. They're back to zero.

And you look at so many people who are incredibly successful, there's a pile of failures. Pile of them. And so many people that aren't have two or three.

Yes.

And they're just like, oh, that was so hard. I can't. I can't do that. I give up. I mean, I look at my son who's playing golf right now, like, he has, like, way more failures than he has successes, but his success is huge. Like, he's going to be a pro golfer now. No one's going to say to him, so, like, how many 82 did you shoot? Nobody ever will care about that. But that's what got him to where he is. Right. So cool. Yeah. What.

What is so, so beautiful about that is I now see why people get into perpetual ruts. Because again, if somebody goes bankrupt and feels shame about that and is afraid to deal with the shame, their likely next decision is to increase their lifestyle in order to project whatever will make them not feel shame. So they buy a fancier car in order for other people to validate how they want to feel, which is just not shame. But they haven't dealt with their own. So they're likely to continue to expand until it bursts and they have to.

File bankruptcy 100% and. Or like. And criticize other people who are doing the very thing that they really want to be. Yeah. I watch that happen a lot.

Yeah. Just like, like look down upon or judge people who are ahead of them.

Yes.

And make up stories about them doing.

Something they don't care about. Their family. Right. They're not balanced. They're.

They're the reason I'm douchebag.

They're scammers.

Yes.

Right.

But if that person were to just deal with the shame on the first failure.

Yeah.

Even if it went to the point of them having bankruptcy, they would deal with it and keep going and.

Yeah. And what that looks like is, yo, I just filed for bankruptcy. That doesn't. Has nothing to do with me as a person. That has nothing to do with my worth. It has nothing to do with my intelligence or my ability to succeed. It's just, I did this thing, and this is what that caused. I'm not going to do that thing again. But I'm still amazing, and I'm still capable, and I'm still going to use this as an opportunity to create more in my life.

Yeah. And. And a lot of people will. If they say, I just filed for bankruptcy, what they are really expecting is for that other person to judge them.

Yeah.

But what they're really doing is just judging themselves. Because when you say it, I just filed for bankruptcy. There was no negative emotion. You're just saying it as, like, a fact.

Oh, that happened.

Yeah. And now I'm gonna do this and this and that. Cool. Yeah. Yeah.

I'm not bankrupt. That's another difference. Right? Like, it's not a character trait. It's not who I am. It's not like, oh, you know, I'm not successful because I filed for bankruptcy. It's like, no, I am successful. This is where we're at right now. This is step four.

Yeah. So, Brooke, there's a temptation that I fall into, which is to set the goal and to.

Not feel happy until I hit the goal. There's a quote from Naval Ravikant who says, desire is a contract you make with yourself to not be happy until you get it. And I don't like that quote. I don't like that thought. I like the thought that I can enjoy the goal now. So I just wanted you to comment on that.

Yeah, I mean, I heard the same quote. Our friend Alex said it to us. And, you know, I was like, I don't know if I agree with that, because I think desire feels good to me.

I think it can feel good. I don't think it feels good to everyone.

So here's the difference. This is when it feels good, when I have desire, and I know that I'm going to get the thing I desire, then it feels good when I have desire. And I doubt that I'm going to get the thing you feel, that desire. I feel bad. So I think desire isn't necessarily a contract to be unhappy until you get it. It may be a contract to feel desire and amazing knowing you will get it.

Yes.

And that's how I feel about my hundred million. I'm already so stoked about making $100 million, but, like, we were talking about this earlier. Like I'm single right now and I'm dating and I'm like thinking about a guy that I want to date. This like perfect guy that I eventually am going to day and like I have desire for that, but I don't have my belief system there yet. Which is fascinating. Right. We were talking about this. I know without a doubt I'll make 100 million. I don't know without a doubt that this guy exists, that I'm going to meet him. And because I haven't done my work, I'm believing in that. My desire hurts.

Huh.

So can we dive into this a little bit more?

Totally. Let's talk about my love life.

Yes. Because. Because the fact that you don't believe that he exists.

Right.

Makes you go shopping, right?

Yeah.

And you go shopping on the apps and looking around all of them and being around you during that time, I've noticed that you see evidence of a lot of dudes you don't want to be around.

There's a lot of unfortunate looking men.

Which further proves that my man does not exist.

That's evidence for the belief that he doesn't exist. So now I want to ask, who would you be if you believed that that man was there and was on his way to you?

Right. I wouldn't be like as worried about unfortunate looking men on the apps.

Yeah.

I would only be worried about the good looking ones because maybe that's my guy.

Yeah.

So interesting. Yeah.

And what if you believed that he was like making his way to you?

Yeah.

Like would you, you wouldn't worry about it at all if you, if you were on apps at all. It would just be for pure entertainment.

Exactly. That's so true. And the way that you know whether you believe in your goal is truly how you feel. And I'm so not there yet. Right. I'm so not in that place of like contented, patient expectation, which is how I feel about the 100 million. I'm just like, shit, where's this guy? We gotta find him. Anyone, anyone, anyone? Where is he? We need a guy. He's six' five and he makes a lot of money. In fact, if you're listening, you're 6 5. But that's so fascinating. Right. The energy and I feel like the quickening of the anxiety and like that doubt and that like frustration and taking action from that place is always fruitless. And so.

Yeah. It's the same with position of black.

Yeah. It's a position of black and it's never going to like, like needy, desperate women. Not hot.

I agree.

It's the same with business. Business, though, too, right? Like, when with your customers, like, if you're needy and desperate to make money in your business, your customers will be totally turned off.

Totally.

Yeah, totally.

God, I just love that. It's like life is constantly bringing you what you're like, reinforcements of your beliefs. Yeah.

Yeah. And this is kind of fun for us because, like, I can. We had talked about this earlier. Like, I can see in you the amount of money that you want to make in the success you want to have is, like, so obvious to me. I'm just like, why? Why would you worry about it for, like, a minute, you know? Like, I just can't see it. And, like, how does it.

I don't know the how yet.

I don't know the how. Right. Where. Where is this all going to come together? And I'm not worried about that at all for you. And you feel the same way about me, my love life? Like, you're like. I'm just. I was, like, talking about it. You were just so.

I was completely baffled as a belief of yours.

Why are you.

What.

What are you even talking about?

There's tons of good dudes out there. Yeah.

Yeah. I see them all the time. I'm like, you do?

Where?

So, but that's, like, for you all that are listening, it's like, you can test that and how you feel. Do you feel like you're in a hurry? That's always like, do you need to make money right now? Do you need to make money really fast? Do you want to do a launch tomorrow to try and catch up to someone who's ahead of you? Like, all of that energy versus I have plenty of time. I know exactly how to believe in myself. I know exactly how to believe in my goal. I know how to show up as that person. And I know that the wisdom I need will appear to me and then I'll just execute on. It is very different than this, like, needy, freaking out hustle energy.

Yeah.

That I'm experiencing right now.

Yeah. And when you're in that hustle energy, or I just call it like, the scarce energy, you do scarce things and.

You, like, repel the very thing that you want.

Yeah.

Yeah. So good.

I love this.

I hate it.

What this makes me want to do is, like, take inventory of everything in my life and explore whatever I am believing that is perpetuating that.

Yes.

Like, that. That's. That's like, my gut reaction right now is like, I want to look at, oh, why is that happening? Why am I not there?

Yeah.

And it's just like, oh, because I believe this and this and this and this.

Oh, my God. So I just had, like, a. In my. In my brain hit me because of base.

And that's the end of our time, everybody.

Based on what we were talking about earlier when I asked people, why aren't you making the amount of money that you want to be making? If you were to ask me the question, like, why haven't you met the man that you want to hang out with? It would be like, well, he's just not out there. I just can't. You know, he just doesn't exist.

Yeah.

Which is ridiculous. Like, it's such an external thing, and when I think about it logically, it's obviously not true. But that's a thought that is just spinning in my brain. What if he's not out there? What if I don't find him? What if he doesn't exist? What if there's no man in the entire world that can handle this?

That's what's going through my brain, and it's, like, under the surface. So I don't really, like, until you bring it up like that. I don't really see it as words. I just experience it as the truth.

Yes. So how do you expose that? How do you expose that stuff that you don't know is there? That is.

I mean, I think the way that we just did it is me having this conversation with you and being really vulnerable and honest about, like, hey, this sucks. This is how I feel about this. This is what I think is going on. And you just being like, what are you talking about? And, like, you coming to me with money stuff and me being like, what are you talking about? Like, what. What is it that you're thinking? That's a lie, obviously. That's in the way between you and what you want. And then being willing to look at it because it's ugly. Like, I don't want to know that. I think that about myself. Right. You see what I'm saying? It's like, I don't want to know that. I think that there's no man in the world that can handle me, that I'm just too much for any man. It's like, seriously ugly stuff to look at. But when you're willing to. It's kind of like that shame thing we were talking about. When you're willing to, like, pull that up and just, like, lay it out and look at it and understand it, then that's how you get through it.

It's totally gone.

Yeah. And then you're just like, wait, are you him? Are you him? Are you him?

That's exactly. Which is very different in this restaurant.

Yeah.

This grocery store. Exactly.

Versus, like, no. Ew, gross.

And yeah. And when you're showing up with that amount of excitement, you're really attractive.

Exactly right.

People are like, who is that?

It's so different. And that's true for me dating. It's also true. True for you. To your customers. When you believe that. That's right. To me. To my customers, I'm very attractive. It's kind of fascinating. Right. To my target audience for the life coach school. I'm a very attractive, eligible woman. Right. That they want to learn from. And when I'm, like, not believing in myself, I'm not attractive to anyone who possibly doesn't want to date me.

Which is how I'm thinking about it. So that's interesting for anyone. So, like, how would I apply that to. Well, I'm not completely unattractive, and I'm not completely. Like, there are people that are, like, attracted to me. So how do I explain that if I'm, like, way too much for anyone to handle?

Yeah.

Right. And then working from there and admitting that to yourself. I think that's the thing.

And now that you've had that shift, you can find all the evidence in the world.

Yeah.

For why it's obvious that there's gonna be a line of these really good six, five dudes that make a lot of money, that want to.

Well, it's obvious to you, but, like, for me, I'm just starting to believe.

Right, so that's a good point. So it's obvious to me you're just having that realization. So you don't believe it totally yet.

Not at all.

But you believe it a little bit more than before.

And I know the work I need to do.

Well, okay, I need you to comment on that, because my insta. My first reaction is, once I have an insight, I should believe it all right away. And when I don't, then it's like, feel crappy. Feel crappy.

Yeah.

So what do I do about that?

It's like unveiling your own insecure thoughts, your own noise in your mind. Like, you're just revealing it to yourself. And I do think, like, for me, like, right now, seeing all those thoughts that are present that are preventing me from being able to show up the way I want to is, like, what I want to do is just, like, tuck them Back away, right? Like, oh, I don't think that. Oh, that's ridiculous. I don't want that. And you have to do the opposite, right? You have to open that up and be like, what's that about? And when I think that way, how do I feel? And why am I thinking that way? And do I choose to think that way, too? And knowing that I will make a choice not to think that way. And then I'll wake up in the morning, I'll like, see, I knew it. Everything sucks. Right? And then I'll have to do it again and again and again, again and again. And what happens? This is like our Abraham moment. What happens is once you make that shift from letting go of the noise to actually believing, then the dude will be there. And I'll think, the reason I feel better is because the dude is there. But the reason the dude is there is because I feel better. Boom. That's the opposite of what it is. And I'm like, oh, once I met him, then I felt better. It's like, no, I'm the one that creates. Created that for myself. And then he could be visible to me. Yeah.

Because, like, given the same scenario, if you don't believe it, you will do something to repel that person away.

Yeah.

Like, you will believe up. You will find a reason to cast him away. You will believe I won't even worthy see him.

When he walks up and says, hello, I won't even. I'll be like. Because it's like the difference when you're swiping, if you haven't been on those apps, this is what happens. You swipe left. If the guy's, like, unattractive or you're not interested in him, and you could. The whole time I'm swiping, I could be like, see? See, there's nobody. There's nobody. There's nobody. Or I could be like, he must be here soon. Yep, he's coming any minute. I'm going to see him. Right. So it's all in the way you're thinking about it as you're doing. It could be the exact same action, Going on dates, meeting guys, swiping on apps. But it's the attitude you have. And it's the same with business. You may be doing the exact same action, running ads, running funnels, showing up on podcast, but. But when your belief system changes, the results change. Yeah.

I mean, a good example of that is I don't write an email to my list every day, but it's one of my favorite things to do. Have a cup of coffee and write an email to my list. And some emails have made $100,000.

Yes.

Some emails have bombed.

Yeah, yeah.

Right. And I'm not always promoting. I'm usually not promoting something. But like you've had both experiences and when it bombs, I think it must be the copy I must have had.

The audience must be in a bad mood.

That's right. I must have had a crappy subject line. It must be a. Like I need to pour into the copy and figure out what I said wrong.

Yes.

But the truth is when I show up and just feel really confident in whatever it is that I have to sell, I don't have to have any copy. It's. And it's like, it's.

It's sexy to your customers. That's what it is. And they want to be a part of that. Listen, I know this is true for me and my business. My belief and my certainty develops an authority in my life that people want for their lives. And it can be contagious. Right. It's so attractive. And so what we think, the work we think we need to do is go out there and take a bunch of action. And we're right about that. Like, I'm going to have to go out there and introduce myself to people. People and actually get out of my house and do all of that. And that's important. But the most important work to do is the work you do ahead of time on your mind. Because I can go out there and go on a bunch of dates and if I have a thought the guy doesn't exist. I'm never going to meet him. And if you go out there and do write all the emails and do all the podcasts and do all the photos and you believe you're never going to make $50 million. You won't.

That's right.

That's. That is it. And it sounds so simplistic, but it's the absolute truth.

Yeah. Like, I did not believe that when we met four years ago. Right. Which was why our first ever recorded conversation, I was just like, we were.

Like bantering and I was like, I.

Just need you to keep talking. But, but I have come around because I've seen evidence for it in my life that like, my beliefs, like, at the very minimum, beliefs drive my actions. Like, at the very least, I don't, I don't know if there are woo woo things that happen out there. I have my opinions, but like, at very least what I believe in and how I feel about it drives my actions and creates different results 100%. And so I now have come around to your original points that the belief is more important than the how.

I mean, there's no arguing it. The how still is there. But the difference between. It's like the difference between going after one how versus having a belief and letting the hows be infinite.

Yeah, yeah. Because you only really know the how once you've done it. It's so crazy. And then everybody else and then the younger versions of me are like, wait, tell me everything that you did there. Yeah, yeah.

And it's like, listen, how I actually did that. Like, I couldn't have guessed how I was going to do that when I started. Like, you look at most incredible things in your life, how you actually end up achieving them. You couldn't have had a map for no way. And it doesn't mean that you don't study and you don't get direction and you don't learn and you don't develop skills, but you do it in a way that you allow for all the strategic byproducts to lead you in a new direction to get there ultimately.

Right. I'm thinking about. Been putting out a lot of content on YouTube lately. Yeah.

Yeah.

And our friend Alex is putting a lot of content on YouTube. And I've been doing it longer than him, and he is starting to grow faster than me. And just spending the last few days and I've been analyzing this and I realized that if I have a YouTube video that bombs, I use that as evidence to say, oh, this audience isn't going to grow. Alex is just like, I'm going to create another great video. Right. And I am, I am. I'm getting there to that understanding. But I realized that he just embodies it and he's starting to have that exponential curve kick with all of this growth.

And I.

And I realize now that that is another area. As I think all areas now, after this conversation, are just models to reinforce the beliefs that I already have.

Well, and I love that example, actually, because one of the things that people will point out to me and notice about me is when. When there is someone who's making more money than me, who has more subscribers than me, who does better than me, I'm really genuinely excited for them. I never use other people's incentives, success against myself. And I'm super competitive, too. So it's kind of this very weird thing that, like, people will say to me, how can you talk about how great you are and how much money you have all the time? And how, you know, amazing you think you are, and I don't hate you. How is that even possible? Right. Like, why am I not, like, disgusted by you? And I explained to them, I'm like, it's because I think I'm amazing, but I also think you're amazing. I don't think I'm amazing. And you're not. And arrogant people think they're better than other people. Right. So when I look at Alex and what he's doing on YouTube and he's, like, totally killing it, I think a lot of people will be like, what is he doing? I want to do more of that so I can keep up or do that. But it's kind of like Alex is in his lane doing Alex's thing, and I'm in my lane doing my thing, and I may never have as many subscribers, and it doesn't matter at all because I believe in my goal and I believe in his goal for him, and they have nothing to do with each other. Then you can just celebrate everyone.

Yes. Right.

And I think a lot of people use other people's success. I don't see you doing this often, but I see a lot of people using other people's success as a way to defeat themselves.

Yeah. Well, they see it as reinforcement for them falling behind.

Yes.

Or them being a loser or only one to win.

Yeah. Like, as if we're all in a race. But, like, when I look at Internet marketing, when I look at online business, I'm just like, there is so much opportunity. Like, we're just scratching the surface of this. Everyone can win. Everyone gets a million. Everyone gets 10.

Right.

Really? I mean, when you look at, like, all of the, like, software companies in Silicon Valley and the number of those companies and how the ridiculous amount of money that's over there, like, we're just, we're just little babies. Like, and so I think we went, when we all make money, we all win.

Yeah. So, but that is you reinforcing your belief that there's abundance and everyone can win. And there's always growing. Right. And some people will look at it and say, see, they're growing. I'm not. This reinforces me just staying where I am, which is why I think most people never get rich or even close to get rich.

A hundred percent. Yeah. It's like when someone says, you know, like, even I think Layla was saying to Alex, like, the world doesn't need another weight loss bullet book. Right. There's so that's already been done. I, I, I'm like, that is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. It's like someone saying, the world, the world doesn't need another doctor. Well, of course, there's so many doctors. And we need another one. And we need another one. We need everyone who wants to be a doctor to be a doctor. And we need everyone who wants to write a weight loss book to write a weight loss book. And there's enough success for everyone to have a little piece like, all the doctors can be rich. It's not like, well, that doctor is a surgeon. What now? What am I gonna do?

One. So I can't.

What am I going to do now? I guess I'll just go and, you know, do something else. It's like, no, we just. Why do we think that way? Especially when it comes to people making lots of money or having lots of followers, subscribers, that sort of thing. Like, oh my gosh, you have 100,000 subscribers. Like, this is what people say to me. I'm like, I do. I don't even know what that means. Like, that's not important to me at all. And there's so many more people that have so many more subscribers than I do that don't. Aren't as successful as I am. And I guess it depends on how you define success. And that's important, right? To know.

I think you just like everything we're talking about. You can choose which perspective you're gonna have on someone else's results. If someone is successful, you can see it as evidence that success is gonna happen or to the. Or to the opposite.

Yeah, totally.

And our friends are back. So, Brooke, this was the best podcast ever.

Ever. Later.

Okay, in men.

I will send you all the DMs.

Thank you. Ryan Moran, you're the best.

I love you.

I love you too.

If you found value in this podcast.

And you're ready to go Deeper, here.

Are three resources where we can help you. One, you can grab my book 12.

Months to 1 million on Audible or Amazon.

It has over a thousand reviews and it's the playbook to building a seven figure business business.

Second, you can join our community of entrepreneurs who are following a plan to build a 1% net worth by building.

Businesses and investing the profits, you can.

Get plugged in@capitalism.com 1. And third, if you're looking to go deeper and build a seven figure business that you can sell, you can work.

Closely with us inside the capitalism incubator.

And you can get on the waiting list and find out what we do over at capitalism.com Inc. That's capitalism.com Inc.