Billionaire Naveen Jain Reveals How AI Will Change Medicine Forever | EP #121

The two biggest changes that are going to happen in humanity because of AI is going to be in education and healthcare.

US life expectancy has dropped to 76 years. 42% of American adults are considered obese. 60% of American adults have at least one chronic disease. What in the world is going on?

The underlying cause of whether you're looking at diabetes, obesity, heart disease, and, you know, depression or anxiety, it is really is a lot of chronic inflammation in the body.

The work you've been doing both in Moonshots and in healthcare as the founder CEO of IOM is amazing.

There is no such thing as universal healthy food. It is simply good for you right now or bad for you right now. We have collected over 100 quadrillion biological data and then applying AI to it to understand exactly what is causing inflammation in your body.

Everybody, welcome to Moonshots. Peter Diamandis. Here today, I've got an extraordinary guest, Naveen Jain. He's the founder of viome, a company in the AI and biotech space. He's a dear friend. He's on my board at the XPRIZE Foundation, Singularity University. Early in his career, he started a $40 billion company called InfoSpace. And since then, he's given birth to three extraordinary kids. One has reached billionaire status. The other two are on their way there. During this episode, we're going to talk about the intersection of AI and health. We'll also talk about how to raise extraordinary kids for the exponential world ahead. If you enjoy conversations like this, if you want me to bring my personal conversations to you like we do today, please subscribe. Love to know that you're watching and listening and enjoying it. All right now, onto the episode with Naveen Jain. Hey, Naveen. Good to see you, my friend.

Peter, it's always such a pleasure to see you. You know that.

Yeah, I do. But, you know, I've got to start this conversation by saying I turn my back, I close my eyes for a microsecond, and your son Encore is on like the billionaires list. And he's being married under the pyramids in Egypt. I mean, that's pretty awesome. You know, I mentored him, what, 15 years ago? And the transformation must be mostly all you, because what he's done is amazing. So you must be extraordinarily proud.

Well, first off, Peter, as you know, to me, the biggest joys of my life comes watching these children growing up in a great family. But more often than not, really learning from you about taking on the audacious challenges and going out and implementing them so it's just not that encore who is doing it in audacious idea that he took on. And our daughter, as you know, Priyanka mentored and Neil and she's running a women's health company. And Neil, I mean he just not only a Schwarzman scholar, he just went on to take on another challenge and you know, for you and I, nurturing young people for them to find their moonshots and help them implement their moonshots. Because if any one of our children or anyone else that we talk to succeed, the humanity is better off. So it doesn't matter whether it's our children, your children or someone else's children, they. They just benefit humanity.

So I want to come back to this towards the end of our, of our moonshot conversation to talk about how do you raise moonshot kids? Because you've done an amazing job. Mine are 13. But before we jump to that, before we jump to our main course of healthcare and AI, what was it like being under the pyramids for that wedding? I've never been to the pyramids. It's on my next, you know, adventure list. Must have been really cool how you arranged to have a pyramid wedding that like super hard.

Well, I think first of all, you know, it's one of those type of things that you have to want to do it. And as a young kid, Ankur went to Egypt and he just fell in love with the idea of these great structures that were built, you know, 5,000, 7,000 years ago and being married right under the Sphinx. So they built the custom built structure. But you know, to me, honestly, all these things are amazing. And then, you know, him having an audacious idea of wedding. But to me, you know, the fact that he's willing to do what it takes and actually get it done is something that every child should learn. And we're going to get back to it. So let's talk about healthcare and AI for a second and we'll get back to parenting. Because there are a lot of things about parenting I really think is very counterintuitive, which is unconventional way of looking at parenting. Because most people, when they do talk about their children, they think they're trying to do what's right for them. And at the end of the day, it turns out to be extremely selfish thing to do at the cost of our actually children growing up to be amazing human beings.

All right, if you're a parent listening to this, we're gonna come back to this conversation. Cause I'm a parent and I wanna hear and Learn from you, buddy. So let's jump in. Naveen, the work you've been doing both in moonshots and in healthcare as the founder CEO of Iome's. Amazing. And I've often said this, you deserve a medical degree and the amount of knowledge you've soaked up is extraordinary. Let me set the table here and give some of the numbers for folks on how really I won't say bad, I want to say awful. The U.S. health care system is and the challenges that we have. So here are the numbers. I talk about longevity, escape velocity and blowing through 100. But the reality is today US life expectancy has dropped to 76 years and it's the lowest since 1996. So it's been going down. I think we're going to have some incredible breakthroughs that will drive us towards longevity, escape velocity. US health spend is 18% of the GDP. Highest ever obesity rates. Right. I mean, listen, I was in Europe and I'm sorry, everyone who was obese there on the average was. You could bet they were an American. You know, 42% of American adults are considered obese. It's increased almost 300% in the last 30 years. And that's driven incredible numbers in diabetes. Right? 34 million Americans increased or have diabetes. Now it's 10% of the U.S. population, 320% increase in 30 years. Here's a few more. 60% of American adults have at least one chronic disease and 40% have two chronic diseases. And then one in five Americans describe having mental illness. Last two numbers, the Bloomberg Health Efficiency Index. The U.S. ranked 55 out of 57 countries evaluated. I mean that's incredible for 18% of our GDP. And then the Legatum Prosperity Index ranked us 68th out of 100 and 67 countries. What in the world is going on?

Well, first of all, Peter, I mean chronic diseases is a epidemic that we have to start to solve. You know, most 90% plus of our health care dollars are spent on chronic diseases. Fortunately, the chronic diseases are something that we do have a control over as humanity. Unlike genetic diseases, something you're born with, we really don't have much control. And this idea of not taking personal responsibility for our own set of chronic diseases is really what's driving humanity and especially the people in the West. The another problem that I see is that our medical industrial complex in United States, everyone in the system makes money when you and I are sick and no one makes money when we are healthy. And I'm not suggesting that these people are evil people, but the incentives are completely misaligned. Whether it is your doctor, whether it's a hospital, or even your pharmaceutical company or your insurance company, no one really has any incentive to keep you healthy.

It's a perverse system.

Yeah, it's a perverse system. And I really think what you are doing, Peter, at Fountain Health, or you know, a Fountain Life, is really the right way of doing it is where you say, look, you sign up for a system where you pay a fixed monthly fee and our goal is to keep you healthy because when you are sick, you create more work for us. So incentives are extremely well aligned to say if I keep you healthy, I get paid and we have less work to do. But when you are sick, you're still paying me the same thing, but now I have so much work to do. So you essentially aligning the incentive of the medical care with the person who is actually being cared for. That is what's lacking in our current medical industrial complex. The second is, you know, people have to take personal responsibility for their action. People somehow have been made to believe when they get sick, it's a bad luck. It is something about something they're born with. And yes, there is 5 or 10% of the the diseases that have a genetic implications, but 85% to 90% of the things are actually something that we can control through our lifestyle. And once we understand that we actually have control over them, we can do something about them. And that's the reason at Fountain Life, as you see, when you get people the information, you tell them exactly the kind of changes they need to make, they see the results. And we see the same thing exactly at Wyoming. We show people what is going on, we tell them what to do about it, and we see the results coming back and saying people's health has actually improved. And I think, Peter, one of the things that you and I would agree on is that chronic inflammation is a root cause of chronic diseases. Right. We tend to name them and we think if we can name them, we can tame them because that's really good for insurance. We have all these different diseases, but the fact is, the underlying cause of whether you're looking at diabetes, obesity, heart disease, and you know, depression or anxiety, it is really is a lot of chronic inflammation in the body. And many of these things can actually be cured through a better lifestyle. Whether it's a nutrition, meditation, relaxation, exercise, better sleep, finding a true purpose in life. I mean, these are the kind of things that will help you.

I love you for that, buddy. I love you for it. You're absolutely right. Inflammatory processes that are important. Inflammation is an important part of healing in different stages of wounds. But it is causing this extraordinary both on the cardiac, on the digestive, on your cognitive side of the equation. I've said, listen, one example is sugar is a inflammatory agent and causes chronic disease. One of the things that I love about what you've done at Viome is you've brought science and data to what I should and should not eat. So when I get my VIOME results and I actually look at them to decide which vegetables are best for me, given my gut microbiome, which meats are best for me and all of those things, otherwise you're just, you're going blind. And the thing that what we have to realize is not every, not every food is best for you. And it changes over time depending upon what your gut is like. So talk one second a little bit about your discovery of this and how you think about. You've been a vegetarian all your life, right? And I've gone through keto, vegan, Mediterranean and I've settled in on a Mediterranean diet. But talk to me about your thoughts on food because I do believe a lot of those healthcare disasters in the US are fundamentally secondary to what people eat, what people put in their bodies.

Absolutely. And Peter, I mean what people forget is that our human body is essentially electrical, biochemical body. What we put into our body is actually being changed by a chemical factory called a gut microbiome and our oral microbiome. So essentially your oral microbiome is pre processing the food, sending the signals to the brain and that in turn is actually now getting ready for what is coming. And our gut microbiome, the hundred trillion of these microbes are actually processing the food, releasing bunch of biochemists. So imagine that we as humans, less than 1% of all the genes that are expressed in our body come from our mom and dad. 99% come from all these microbes. And in some sense it's not about them and us. We are a walking talking ecosystem. And we have to start to think about we as one symbiotic superorganism. And this superorganism, what we put in actually matters because based on what we eat, our microbes are actually processing them, metabolizing them and releasing the metabolite, or call them a micro poop, if you want to call them. In simple words, that is what gets absorbed in our blood. And interaction between our food, what microbes are producing and our immune system is really to key to understanding why we have immune Diseases, Right. So let's start from very simple fact. Our human body is like a donut. There is a tube that goes through us. On top of the tube, we have our. And by the way, everything is sealed. So our body is all around that tube. And the tube is nicely supposed to be sealed. 70% of our immune system is along our gut lining because this is really where the external environment meets the inner body. So what's happening really is the food, when it comes in, our oral microbiome, starts to pre process the food. And when it sees, as you mentioned, something like sugar, it starts to say, oh, something sweet is coming. It sends a signal for pancreas to start releasing insulin. And now the body is ready for sugar. Now the second part that happens is when you eat something sweet, it's not sugar in itself, but sugar gets metabolized by your oral microbiome and it in fact changes the acidity of your mouth, right? So now changing the acidity is what causes your tooth decay. So it's not the sugar in itself that causes a tooth decay. It is the microbes that process sugar releasing the acid that causes the tooth decay. Right. Similarly, when you have that inflammation in your gum, suddenly your barrier to the body is broken. And now you have the microbes. Now they are able. When you have a gum inflammation, now microbes are going into the blood. Now you have a chronic inflammation because of that. And same thing happens in the gut. When you have a leaky gut. Your microbes are now able to go past the barrier that's supposed to keep them inside. Check is going into the blood causing chronic inflammation. Now the food that we eat can actually cause inflammation. So based on how the food is actually being metabolized. So this idea that Peter, you mentioned, what we learned is there is no such thing as universal healthy food. There is no such thing if food is good for you or bad for you. It is simply good for you right now or bad for you right now. And something that is good for you doesn't mean it's going to be good for your wife or your friend. So when you hear someone saying, hey, I am eating avocado and I'm really benefiting from it and doesn't mean if avocado is a superfood for you. So based on your uric acid production, because your avocado increases your uric acid production. So if your uric acid production is already too high, the last thing you want to do is to eat avocado, because that's going to cause gout. Same thing happens with broccoli. So it's not. The broccoli is bad or good. If you have high sulfide production, then you shouldn't be eating broccoli because it increases the sulfide that is inflammatory. And by the way, now I'm a vegetarian, but I'm not against eating meat. So red meat contains choline and carnitine, and when that gets processed by your microbes, they actually can convert that into tma, trimethylamine, which actually gets absorbed in the blood and your liver converts them into tmao, trimethylamine oxide. That is what causes the heart disease. So if your microbes are not producing enough tma, you should eat red meat. It is have a lot of nutrition in your body. So it's not the red meat that's good or bad. It is good or bad based on are you producing a lot of TMA or not nftma, Right?

So, yeah. So, buddy, I think this is, this is, you know, critically important for folks to realize. It's, you know, when I do, I don't want to, I don't want to over overstress on biome, but it's the only product I know right now that gives me feedback on which, given the AI systems that you've built, which foods are appropriate given my oral and gut microbiome. And it changes over time, right? So I've gotten a incredible increased respect for oral health and gut health because at the end of the day it can make you or break you. And I had a tooth infection secondary. I won't go into it. But that drove me to have to do an antibiotic course. I tried to avoid the antibiotics, but at the end of the day, antibiotics are what allowed us to double our lifespan in the last 40 years or 50. And I ended up taking it and it changed my microbiome. And I have to, you know, check again and make sure that I am properly repopulating my microbiome. So how often does it all change? How often, how quickly do you see different food recommendations coming out of the system?

So it's very interesting, Peter. We actually looked at the people doing the test every day, every week, every month, and we saw that actually your microbes change in four to six months. And that's the reason we tell people to retest every four to six months. Because the food that used to be good for you may no longer be good for you because your microbes have completely changed. Because you travel, you're taking antibiotics course and food that you're eating. So when you're traveling, eating very different types of food. And over time these things all have an impact. Are you spending enough time in the forest near the trees? Because all the trees, all this stuff that we are around, we're breathing, living, breathing and is changing our microbiome constantly. And then we can in fact look at this stuff and we can talk a little bit more about that in terms of longevity. What have we found? So Peter, one of the interesting that you mentioned in the beginning is that it is a massive amount of data that we have collected that's allowing us to constantly actually change our recommendation. We have now analyzed close to 1 million samples. We have collected over 100,000 quadrillion biological data point. Right. And then applying AI to it to understand exactly what is causing inflammation in your body. So what we do is we analyze your oral microbiome through saliva, we analyze your gut microbiome through stool, and then we take a finger prick blood. And in the blood we are looking at all of your cellular health and that means we are looking at all of your interleukins, which are cytokines, to see what are the actually pro inflammatory biomarkers, what are the anti inflammatory biomarkers. We are looking at all of the gene expression from your mitochondria. And most people forget that mitochondria has its own genes. Right. So in a sense, understanding how your mitochondria is actually being impacted by the foods we eat, how our inflammation is being impacted by the things we are doing, and then taking all of that into account, then we come back with the recommendations. But I don't want to focus on volume. I want to just simply focus on human body and the human health as such.

So let's talk about. I want to dive in. I've listed seven ways that I think AI is going to reinvent healthcare. Let me list these off and then I want to talk to you about them. Right. So the first is I think we're all going to have an AI health coach that is some version of Jarvis that is monitoring our body 24 7. It's listening to our voice, the tenor of our cough, how we type and walk. If you have augmented reality glasses, it's looking at the food you're eating. And that health coach is going to suggest to you eat this, not that it's going to suggest to you. You've got 30 minutes. Opening your calendar. It's 75 degrees and sunny outside. Go out for a walk, it will say instead of taking the escalators, there's a staircase around the corner. Take the stairs. So I think we're going to see health coaches coming online and you can turn it off if it's annoying for you, but that's one area. The second is these health coaches are going to be then connected to your wearables and implantable. So I've got a, you know, I'm wearing a continuous glucose monitor. I've got my OURA ring, my Apple watch. But, you know, Bold Capital, my fund, which, which, you know, is, full disclosure, an investor in Biome. You know, we've invested a number of wearables and implantable devices and I think these are going to give you continuous. Right now you go for a full body upload in fountain once a year and then quarterly testing. But this is going to be continuous testing, measuring what's going on. Ultimately, I imagine that what's going on in your blood biochemistry is going to be delivered to your robot chef in the kitchen that will prepare the food, food that you need in that moment versus that you think you need in that moment. I think we're going to see. And you're doing this right now, AI analyzing the billions as you've done, quadrillions of biomarker data points. There's no way any human can do that. One of my favorite ones is we've seen at DeepMind AlphaFold 3, an AI model that can model the interaction of all molecules of life, like this protein, this carbohydrate, this RNA molecule, how do they interact with each other. And where that's going to go is an AI model that is modeling your cell for your DNA, the billion chemical reactions per second. We're going to see AI doing image analysis on our, you know, MRIs and X rays. Right. And then customized meds and supplements. Again, something VIOME is doing in part right now. But I want to know there is a very best set of meds and supplements for me, given my genetics, given my blood biomarkers, given my objectives, given how many pills I'm willing to take per day. So I want an AI model that's going to give me that very specific formulation. And then the final thing I listed here was robot surgeons. I think that the best surgeons in the world eventually will be robots driven by AI models that demonetize and democratize access to medicine. So that's my list. Talk to me what your thoughts are. AI and healthcare.

Well, first of all, I think one big one that you missed out that I think we all both know is going to happen. It may not be now, but in 10 years or 15 from now 15 years from now is going to be nanobots. And so essentially a lot of the information that is going to come from inside the body, communicating with outside, they're going to be repairing our own organs. They're going to be constantly supplying the nutrients where it's needed. So as opposed to simply relying on our primitive blood system to figure out to make sure that things are going where they need to go, we actually can have now intelligent nanobots and that are going to take their nutrients, taking it to the right place where it is needed, taking the stem cells in the right place to repair the right organs. So all of that is going to happen. But let's just. In the near future we have the data that we need. And yes, it is probably not as easy and not as continuous, but the fact things like what Fountain Life is doing is to getting that information today and yes, it is crude. Yes, we have to actually puncture our vein to draw the blood. And someday our kids and grandkids are going to look at this stuff and say how cruel that you were actually breaking your vein to draw the blood. How could. It's like having the leeches right in your body. How could you possibly could have done that? How primitive of you guys to be doing it. But until then, the fact that we are able to take these samples from our body, analyze them irregularly, whether it's every three months, four months or six months. But getting that data, using the massive amount of AI and personalizing everything for each individual, whether it is in nutrition, and nutrition means all the supplements and everything. And as Peter you mentioned today, we are the only company that looks at this stuff at Vaiome tells you you need 22 milligrams of amlies, you need 79 milligrams of elderberry, you need 27 milligrams of lycopene. And we actually make that powder only with those ingredients in that dosage and put them in a capsule and ship it to you every single month. And as your body changes, we change the whole nutrition profile for you, right?

You know, I put out a blog recently, Naveen, that I'm doing 75 pills a day. I've been measuring everything. The experiment I'm gonna run and I'll just state it on here is I have my next Fountain Life upload at the end of this month and I'll take all of my data in and what I'm going to do right after that upload is I'm going to stop the supplements I'm currently taking and I'm going to, I'm going to take the biome supplements and, and see how that impacts me. You know, the only way you can do this is run these experiments. And so I'm going to run that experiment and see from a. I mean, I feel in amazing shape and I feel cognitive alert. But, you know, maybe I can feel better, but I'm also.

That's the thing, Peter. We don't know what better is until we get there. As you know, we used to do supplements and we used to do these, you know, these biotics and we had my personalized supplement. And now you may or may not realize we actually just launched for your oral health, your oral lozenges.

So please send me that. I'm like.

And yeah, and here's the best one.

Yeah.

Personalized toothpaste for you.

Okay.

A.m. and p.m. morning and afternoon.

Listen, my morning health routine, you know, and I published a blog on that. You know what my morning routine is like? It's. I have gained so much respect for oral health because it drives cognitive health and cardiac health in such a powerful fashion. So.

And the cancer, by the way, cancer and many of the, including preterm birth and many other diseases that are driven by oral poor.

All right, so I'm going to run my n of one experiment here. So you've got experiments going on with hundreds of thousands of people who are your customers. But I'm going to do that. I'm publicly announcing that. And it's just I need to know and then I'll, you know, I'll still keep on the meds I'm on. You know, I'm still keeping up my.

This is a single use a.m. and p.m. right. So if you can see here in the morning a.m. it is designed to remove the plaque on contact and in the evening one, it completely repopulates and readjusts your oral microbiome. So I think you're going to absolutely enjoy this just got launched last week, by the way.

All right, I'll send you my address. You have my address.

Yes, of course I do. So, Peter, coming back to it in the AI so AI is going to be the biggest breakthrough for the. If I were to guess the two biggest changes that are going to happen in humanity because. Because of AI is going to be in education and healthcare for sure. Education is going to completely change the way we have ever looked at education. For the first time, we have a shot at making the education personalized to each individual, how they learn and really making it very immersive and making it as challenging and really using AI as a tutor rather than simply to give you the answer, to actually challenge you how to think, think about a problem. Right, so that is one like, like.

Your grandmother used to do.

Exactly.

And we'll talk about that. We'll talk about that later. In healthcare, I think is, you know, I think both of these systems, education, healthcare, are so massively broken.

The amount of money, massively obsolete. They are really not broken, but they're obsolete for sure. They're doing what they were designed to do, in a sense that our education system was designed for industrial ages where they were supposed to teach school and the skills could be used for rest of your life. And now we're living in the times where whatever you learn becomes obsolete. So the idea of learning to learn, our needs today are very different than the needs of 50 years ago. And that's a fundamentally thing. Our healthcare system was designed when we were dying from infectious diseases in acute care. And our healthcare system delivers that really well. If you have an acute condition, that is really what's designed for. It's not designed for these chronic conditions.

And let's not not, let's not unless, not forget the fact that we made incredible progress. But I'm still. The health care per unit dollar in the United States is failing. Yes, right, Absolutely. And it's just the bureaucracy. I mean, I went through medical school and I opted out of medicine. And I'm so happy I did because it's, it's all paperwork and insurance and it's just, it's a, it's a baroque system.

People have so much in a. Peter, think about it. We as a company, paying for every employee, thousand dollars a month. Would that be better to give $1,000 a month for a system like Fountain Life where you pay a thousand dollars a month and someone is out there to take care of you to make sure you don't fall sick dollars per month, you know, and to wait until you get sick. And when I go to a doctor and if I tell them I am pre diabetes, they look at me, it's like, and what's the problem? Wait until you have diabetes and come talk to me.

No, no, their an. Their answer is take these drugs.

Well, that, by the way, their answer, if you're lucky, if you're lucky, because they say you're not diabetes, you're not diabetic yet, so wait until before I can give you a drug.

Oh, my God. Yeah, it's like, it's like, okay, you've got the chronic disease. We're not going to try and cure the chronic disease, we're just going to reduce the symptoms of the chronic disease. It's still going to be there. You're still going to get it sicker and sicker, and all the secondary and tertiary effects are still going to happen. Yeah, it's insane.

It is a shame, Peter, that we manage these diseases and we take humans like a credit card machine, that anytime somebody has a chronic disease, you have a lifetime subscriber, and so you don't let them die because their credit card stops working and don't let them live because they don't pay you anything.

Cha Ching, everybody. I want to take a short break from our episode to talk about a company that's very important to me and could actually save your life or the life of someone that you love. The company is called Fountain Life, and it's a company I started years ago with Tony Robbins and a group of very talented physicians. You know, most of us don't actually know what's going on inside our body. We're all optimists until that day when you have a pain in your side. You go to the physician in the emergency room and they say, listen, I'm sorry to tell you this, but you have this stage three or four going on and you know, it didn't start that morning. It probably was a problem that's been going on for some time. But because we never look, we don't find out. So what we built at Fountain Life was the world's most advanced diagnostic centers. We have four across the US today, and we're building 20 around the world. These centers give you a full body mri, a brain, a brain vasculature, an AI enabled coronary CT looking for soft plaque, DEXA scan, a grail blood cancer test, a full executive blood workup. It's the most advanced workup you'll ever receive. 150 gigabytes of data that then go to our AIs and our physicians to find any disease at the very beginning when it's solvable. You're going to find out eventually. You might as well find out when you can take action. Fountain Life also has an entire side of therapeutics. We look around the world for the most advanced therapeutics that can add 10, 20 healthy years to your life. And we provide them to you at our centers. So if this is of interest to you, please go and check it out. Go to fountainlife.com Peter When Tony and I wrote our New York Times bestseller LifeForce, we had 30,000 people reached out to us for Fountain Life memberships. If you go to fountainlife.com Peter will put you to the top of the list. Really, it's something that is for me, one of the most important things I offer my Entire family, the CEOs of my companies, my friends. It's a chance to really add decades onto our healthy lifespans. Go to fountainlife.com Peter. It's one of the most important things I can offer to you as one of my listeners. All right, let's go back to our episode. So I list. I'm going to run down these, these AI healthcare interactions. So a 247 health coach, right? So advising you, it's like if you, I mean, listen, multimodal AI is here. You know, we're seeing Claude 3.5, we're seeing, you know, GPT4O Gemini. All those doing really well. But what's coming next is going to be the ability for, if you want to turn on an AI Health coast agent that is just like, listen, I want to live the healthiest I can do. Please give me subtle reminders. Please, you know, give me more brutal reminders. And because there's so many times, like I now take my Zoom board meetings on my techno gym bike. That's right over here, right? Versus sitting on my butt like I'm doing at this moment. You know, sitting is the new smoking. So what do you think about, you know, healthcare AI agent coaches?

Absolutely, 100%. So, I mean, this is really where the world is headed, where your AI agent is actually going to be not only monitoring eventually everything about you. So when you go to toilet, you'll have a smart toilet. Analyzing your stool, analyzing your urine, your dials are going to be analyzing your weight, your perspiration. It knows how you're walking your home device, you're going to be analyzing your voice. So all the data is going to go to your AI agent, including your fridge and including when you are at a restaurant to say, hey, now that you are at this restaurant, here is the best meal that you should order that fits in with your Wyoming results. If you are ordering the food, here is the restaurant that you can order it from, or here is a kit that you can get and you can cook it at home if you want to do that. Right? So, or ordering the food from Amazon based on what you need. Here is a recipe. Here's the stuff that you can actually throw in into the microwave that will actually put the things and cook it for you, right?

So right now, right now, it's a bunch of work. It's I'm guessing it's, you know, within three years we'll be fully there. Right. Maybe it's even two years. But there is an optimized, you know, you can dial. I want taste over health. I want ease or cost over health. I want health over everything. And there's an, there is an optimization function which an AI can do for you. And I describe this as an auto magical life where it's automatic and it feels magical for you.

And I think, Peter, that is going to. I think you're absolutely right. A lot of the pieces are starting to come together already now but they are not integrated. In the next 18 months to 24 months these pieces are going to get integrated into one single agent that is going to be your health agent and it's going to tell you what you need and it's going to cause all you is going to, you know, sometime motivate you and sometime actually coax you into doing things and say, no, Peter, you really should because remember, your inflammation numbers are so high you're going to get sick. You won't be able to do what you're doing if you keep doing this.

And you don't know. Honestly, very few of us actually know what's going on inside our bodies. We're all optimists, right? And you're all, you're doing what feels good in the moment and hoping it's good for you. You know. I just got back from India, Naveen, I saw that.

Beautiful.

Your homeland. It was an amazing trip, right? I was in Bangalore for two days and in Delhi for two days, in Mumbai for two days and met with some. I had a chance to meet with Ratan Tata who's been a friend of ours on our board at xprize and Chandra, the CEO now of course the Tata Group, cash and all that. And it's clear to me that AI, it's for, you know, it's a nation of 1.4 billion people, average income per person, $2,400. Right. Compared to us at 50,000. China 8,500. The only way India thrives and India has so much potential is AI. Absolutely focus on healthcare and education.

So Peter, one of the interesting thing about India and I really think this may be the biggest advantage that India has. So remember, India has a better mobile system, a cellular system than we have in us.

Amazing. Amazing.

And you know why? Because we had for so long the wireline system and there was so much baggage that we had. So people who did not have wireline system completely jumped into the actual LTE so they were there first ones to implement the system that we didn't have in us. And same thing is going to happen by the way there. The education system is now going to be completely driven by AI because there's so much need for it and there is not as much baggage because Harvard's and Stanford of the world are not going to let that happen. Right. Same thing is going to happen in health care. These are 1.4 billion people who need health care and the health, they don't have a medical industrial complex. They have a national healthcare system. And that means they will be able to implement healthcare using AI for everyone. And they're going to in fact have so much data that they're going to surpass us. And someday we're going to go to India or use the technology developed in India to actually help us in the US because it's so difficult to do.

I agree with you, Jio, which is their 5G network that Mukesh Ambani built. And by the way, I'm really happy Mukesh has agreed to come on the Moonshots podcast and talk about his vision.

Amazing human being, by the way.

Incredible. I mean, they were the 14th mobile phone company to enter India and now they're the dominant player and much better cell service than the United States. Crazy, crazy, crazy. Anyway, I think we are the beautiful thing about healthcare and AI is breakthroughs that are valid in India are valid in the Bronx, invalid in Detroit, because we all have the same, the same biology and we're going to just the same way that Google is the same for Larry Page's kids and the poorest child in India. AI driven healthcare systems, which are democratized and demonetized will be equally valid. So exciting.

And that's very interesting is Peter, that, you know, our genetics may be different, even our microbiome people in India may be different than in us, but what we learned, Peter, this is something that I never shared with you. We did the study in Japan and US and what we saw was they had very different genetics and they also had a very different microbiome. But the functionality of microbiome, that RNA that microbiomes were producing to produce the functions to stay healthy were same. There was 90% similarity in the functions that they were providing and less than 10% similarity in fact in the organism or the composition of the microbiome.

So I'm. One of the things I'm tracking right now is the data acquisition tech. So wearables, right? So I've got my, my levels, CGM on my, my OURA ring, my Apple watch. But there are companies that I've been investing in through Bold that are, you know, subdermal long term that can measure a number of different molecules. And I think we're going to get to a point where we're monitoring our biochemistry 24 7. What are you tracking and seeing in that area?

So I think Peter, there are a lot of companies that are trying to build these arrays that can monitor 10, 20, 30, 50, 100 things in a single ELISA assay. And that is really the kind of thing you need to do then. Now you just need to miniaturize that enough to be able to actually put them on skin, to be able to get, you know, just a serum or a fluid, to be able to analyze everything. It is going to happen. But I suspect given in us, the fda, anytime you have to do anything in US it takes so long. So my suspicion is unfortunately many of these tax will come out of India and other countries because it's so, so much easier to implement and test these ideas. And US makes it extremely difficult to test these ideas.

No, I hear you. And hopefully you'll be able to travel to where you need to get the technology.

I mean today p you travel to Costa Rica and other places to get stem cells because we know it is something works. But in us it is so difficult to get approved approval to do anything. And people, especially people, members of fountain life, you take them to the places where they can actually benefit from it.

You know, once you've got the data, once you have all of these systems reporting into your health AI, right which is monitoring you 247 it's got all of your, all of your data and it's constantly gathering health data. Its ability to analyze billions of data points per day from you and then flag red flags of need to get you to do these greater tests. So I think that's here now. It's just we do it episodically, right? We do it with a biome test every three months or fountain life upload on a quarterly basis. But it's going to become continuous. And I think that's when, and I think one of the things that's going to happen is where we can really impact the US health care system is when it's cheaper for me as an employee, as an employer to make sure that I give you these wearables and implantables for free and turn on your health AI because given that I can find disease at inception and prevent you from getting sick and optimize Your health, because a healthier employee for me is a better employee.

So Peter, we do that for our employees. We give them 75% discount. We don't give them 100%. The reason is because we want people to actually take some responsibility. Otherwise people just don't.

If you get stuff for free, you don't value it. Yeah, that's right.

So we give them 75% discount on everything that Vyom does. The test, every time you want to do a test every three months, all the supplements, your, you know, toothpaste, everything. Right. Our goal really is that it's not a cost because we absolutely believe it's going to reduce our insurance cost. Right. So we are now doing it for a whole bunch of other employers where we say, look, by offering it, you're actually going to reduce your insurance cost and make people more productive, less absentism, more happy, less depression, less anxiety. And we published these data, I think, Peter, I shared with you in the last time, I think especially in one of the emails that, that when we published the data that by simply doing these tests and taking these personalized nutrition, your IBS symptoms were down by 48%, your depression down by 47%, anxiety clinical score by 42%, diabetes, HbA1c down by 30%. These are the kind of results from food and supplements. I mean, these are mind boggling results, right?

And there's, I mean, listen, there's gonna be a mental component too that if I'm taking care of myself, I can get better of myself. All of this is self supportive and I'll, you know, I'll quote a study I wrote about in my list longevity book which was that optimists live 15% longer, right? So if you're optimistic about your health, if you're optimistic about the world, it puts you into a very positive feedback loop. And there is very much a mind body connection there, Peter.

So I think I'm going to just give you a little bit on what we actually found. There were five things we found that people need to stay longer and healthier. Number one, we have, I think discussed nutrition because without the proper fuel in the body, nothing matters, right? So that's the number one thing is to make sure you have a proper fuel in the body. The second thing is reducing stress, right? So thing is, when you are stressed, your body goes into fight or flight response. And unfortunately the way we evolve when you're in fight or flight response is because we were being chased by the tiger, right? So that means your body shuts down what it Considers non essential things such as your digestive system.

Yeah. Can I add a couple of points here because it's really important. Yeah. So number one, just a small, don't eat your dinner while watching the evening news. Okay. Just don't do it. You know Helen Messier, who you know well and I do, who's worked for both of us, you know, she says vitamin O. Take some deep breaths, meditative, put yourself into rest and digest mode. Your parasympathetic nervous system. This is why people do thankfulness or prayers, beginning of the meal. Right. So slow it down. Rest and digest. The second thing is we've got a lot of entrepreneurs who are watching the Moonshots podcast here. And just one of the things I was just hearing Jeff Bezos speak about this, that if you are stressed, it's typically because you have something going on that you're not taking action about and your stress is a result of, you know it's there. You know you're going to have to do something. But as soon as you take even an action of, of acknowledging it to the other person or setting up a phone call or doing something that's going to move you towards solution, it will functionally reduce your stress levels. It's that you know it's there, you're not doing anything about it that's causing stress. So if you're stressed about something, make your list, take some actions and move it forward.

Or actually, Peter, I would say I describe anytime there are problems, I describe them. There are two types of problems. Say problems that you have have a control over and the problems you have absolutely no control over. Right. So hurricane is going to come, I can be stressed all I want. There's nothing I can do about it. Right. So the point is, when you don't have a control over something, to me, I go back to my eastern philosophy. It is what it is and it will be what will be. And I really, at that point, I say I'm comfortable with whatever the outcome is, I'm going to do the best I can. If the things are in my control, I do everything I possibly can and then it is what it is and it will be what will be. Right. So that to me is the main thing is, is to never really worry about things that you have no control over. And the things you do have a control over. As you say, take some action. Because the minute you take action now you're moving towards a solution that then you have a control over. Right.

All right, you were listing five things.

We got to number third Was Peter, that is exercise. And again, I think this is something the only in exercise people have this idea you have to spend seven, eight hours, four hours in the gym. That is wrong. What you have to do is get body to move and do some muscle strength. Right. So as we are aging, making sure we're doing some strength training at least two to three times a week, but making sure you're doing a fast walk at least four or five miles every single day. And that's really. Is in terms of exercise, it is making sure you move, you're not sitting. As I think Peter, you say sitting is new. Smoking move. Even if nothing else, get on the damn treadmill at two miles an hour. Just keep moving. Get your lymphatic system working, get your body to start getting the oxygen going. Right?

Yeah. You know, on the exercise front, just, you know, I've shifted. I used to do a really intensive hour three times a week. I've shifted it now to probably what's 40 minutes, five times a week, six if I can get it. And, and I, I found it really transformational in terms of maintaining and building muscle mass. The frequency of this and as I just had a friend of mine, an abundance member who had a very bad pulmonary situation, ended up in the hospital on a ventilator. But he was someone who had built significant muscle mass and his recovery was directly a function of that. And so he's. Since he's been out, he's been able to add 90% of it back. I mean, muscle mass is your. Is your reserve for being able to battle chronic situations or acute situations.

Absolutely. And the fourth thing I think we can. Most people don't realize as much is sleep. The quality of sleep matters. Not just the quantity, but the quality of sleep matters. So I think you and I both measure our sleep through oura ring. I also use PETA 8 sleep mattress.

That I have both. I have oura ring and eight sleep as well.

And I think that changes the temperature as I go to sleep and I monitor our sleep because to us it's important. We get hour and a half to two hours of REM sleep and we get at least hour to hour and a half of deep sleep. It is really, really important.

Absolutely. And I think, you know, I think you and I both early in our lives used to be proud of how little we would sleep. You know, in medical school it was like, okay, I can get through five hours of sleep. That was like my, you know, I'll sleep when I'm dead was a mantra. And that's just absolutely wrong. Yeah.

And I think, Peter, what, I think what I've realized is now I go to bed early. So the couple of things in sleep, I think I go to bed by night.

Yeah. 9:30 for me. Yeah. What time do you wake up?

About between four and four. Between four and five?

Yeah. Do you think your morning hours are your most productive?

Absolutely, 100%. I mean, I think, by the way, there's a lot of research, Peter, in the early sunrise, the wavelength of the sunrise and the angle of sunrise actually resetting your circadian rhythm. And there is so much research on. On how early morning sunrise and doing a sun salutation in the morning really, really helps your body get back.

I agree. And I just, you know, I've been trying to wake up or I have been waking up on my own at 5am especially coming back from India. And I love it. Those first, those first three hours of the morning from five to are mine. Right. I get my writing done, working on my books. I get, you know, I do my red light therapy, a meditation and then I'm in the gym and I do.

A lot of research. People write a lot of research papers. I read in the morning. I mean this is a perfect time for me to. Before anybody else wakes up. This is our time to go to the thing that we need to.

Very selfish self care. Yeah, exactly.

So Peter, that's so. And I think the sleep is just as important as anything else because in fact, Matthew Walker and many people will tell you that, you know, correlation between poor sleep and many of the chronic diseases is a lot. I mean, so I think really reducing inflammation, getting your brain active, I think sleep is. And the last one, Peter, is purpose. And I think you call that optimism. But I think finding a purpose in life is really so important because people who live a life of purpose, they tend to be obviously optimist, but really living a life of purpose, you tend to live 10 to 15 years longer when you have a purpose in life than you people who don't have a purpose in life. Right. And Peter, this is something I learned a lot from you that, you know, we have talked about it. Find something that you're willing to die for and then live for it. What is it that you would want when you have everything in life is to do that now to get everything else in life. It is really about doing things that matter. Find something that can help a billion people live a better life and you create a $100 billion company from it.

Did you see the movie Oppenheimer? If you did did you know that besides building the atomic bomb at Los Alamos National Labs that they spent billions on biodefense weapons, the ability to accurately detect viruses and microbes by reading their rna? Well, a company called viome exclusively licensed the technology from Los Alamos Labs to build a platform that can measure your microbiome and the RNA in your blood. Now, viome has a product that I've personally used for years called Full Body Intelligence, which collects a few drops of your blood, spit and stool and can tell you so much about your health. They've tested over 700,000 individuals and used their AI models to deliver members critical health guidance like what foods you should eat, what foods you shouldn't eat, as well as your supplements and probiotics, your biological age and other deep health insights. And the results of the recommendations are nothing short of stellar. As reported in the American Journal of Lifestyle medicine. After just six months of following Viome's recommendations, members reported the following a 36% reduction in depression, a 40% reduction in anxiety, a 30% reduction in diabetes and a 48% reduction in IBS. Listen, I've been using Viome for three years. I, I know that my oral and gut health is one of my highest priorities. Best of all, VIOME is affordable, which is part of my mission to democratize health. If you want to join me on this journey, go to viome.com Peter I've asked Naveen Jain, a friend of mine who's the founder and CEO of viome, to give my listeners a special discount. You'll find it@viome.com Peter yeah, I think you know, I we've talked about this at Singularity University where you're a fellow director of the company 10 to the 9th plus thinking what can you do to positively impact the lives of a billion people? As I like to say, the world's biggest problems, the world's biggest business opportunities, want to become a billionaire, Help a billion people. All of those things are extraordinarily true. And on the purpose front, I'm writing my next book right now again with Steven Kotler called Age of Abundance. And one of the things we're going to see as AI is coming in strong and we have GPT5 onwards and we have AI agents and AI driven robots doing a lot of the things we used to do, we're going to have to up level our purpose. We're going to have to think much bigger than we ever have. And I think that's one of my greatest hopes for any entrepreneur watching this is Go bigger. Go after moonshots that truly inspire you and give extraordinary purpose to your life.

And Peter, if I may add to it, one of the techniques I have used to find your moonshot and I think something that I would be thrilled to talk to you about on that subject is, is people say this is what I want to do. And I think it's very difficult for them to think big. So the way I have explained to people how to think big is to say, okay, so now assume what you want to do is successful. Now tell me what the world would look like and what would you do next? And then you do that and say, now tell me if that is successful, what the world would look like and what would you do next? Right? And then you start to say, oh my God, that my purpose is really to do this, but I'm going to start here. So this is how I start. Doesn't mean that's my vision. So you have a massive vision, but you start small and then you say this is how I start and this is how I get there.

Nested moonshots. Yes, nested moonshots. And I think that's very important. And you know when I'm teaching moonshots, I'm asking you, okay, listen, we all know and you've experienced this, Naveen? I have. That moonshots are not overnight. They're overnight successes after 10 or 11 years of hard work. Okay, so if this is Your moonshot in 10 years time, where do you need to be in 5 years? Where do you need to be in 1 year? What can you do this month today and what can you do right this minute to move you on that direction and taking that first step? The 0 to 1 is the ratio of something to nothing is infinite. And I do love your point about okay, now after your 10 year moonshot is achieved, what is the world like? So if in the space world, if getting to orbit usably was the moonshot, okay, now you can do that. What's next? Is it Mars mining the asteroids? Is it interstellar travel? Is it duck? Is it really reinventing society? I mean it becomes a lot of fun, right? Life becomes an extraordinary meaningful game. And I think when we have digital superintelligence, my belief is it's not that far away. We are going to have to. Humans want purpose, humans need challenge. So we're going to have to up level our purpose and our challenge.

Once we get that actually more, more than that, it's become easier. I think people are so wrong about AI that the AI somehow is going to destroy humanity. AI is going to be our tool that will allow us to do the things that we could not do before. And the reason people are so scared of AI is because they think somehow it's going to magically happen one day. And it doesn't happen. It's not that ETS are coming here and suddenly it's such a super intelligence and we don't know how to react to it. These things happen over time and we start to merge with them. And as we are merging with them, they become our partner. And so it's not going to be today's human versus a AI of five years from now. It is going to be the AI four years from now, plus us versus the AI with five years from now. Right? So my point is, because we are evolving with AI, so that gap between in the AI or five years from now is not going to be as much as with us, because we constantly have integrated ourselves into the AI. One of the things that Peter, in the book that you're writing, I think is absolutely, I'm so happy you're doing it, because every entrepreneur needs that. In fact, in a very similar book that I am now writing is called Counterintuitive, which is the same thing idea is how do we re. How do we ask a different questions? And especially in the age of AI, the questions we ask is the problems we solve, right? The prompt becomes more interesting than the answer, because what questions are you asking? And you could probably say, and this may be completely tangent, that in Sam's, people who were enlightened and people who call them prophets were just better prompters, right? They were asking the right questions and the God GPT was actually answering them. So think of a God GPT that had the wisdom of all the knowledge from the beginning of time. And people who became prophet and enlightened were actually asking a different question and right question and they were getting that wisdom back was become God GPT actually responded to that prompt in a different way.

All right, I like that. Next on my AI list. And healthcare was modeling AlphaFold 3 and beyond. So this is interesting, right? So you know this. When I take a prescribed medicine, it only works for like a third of the people it's prescribed for.

If you're lucky.

If you're lucky. If you're lucky. I think that's an important, you know, asterisks on there. You know, people need. People think that when you take a medicine, oh, it's going to work for me. And the reality is when the FDA is approving A drug, it's doing two things. One, it's saying, okay, it's not harmful, or if it is harmful, we know how it's harmful and we're going to list those things. The second thing is it's useful in enough people that it's worth giving our approval. It doesn't work for everybody, and that's crazy.

And that is better than placebo. All that had to be better than placebo.

Yeah. Or no, worse than placebo, let's put it that way. So there is a future in which I've created an AI model of my biology in detail. So my 3.2 billion letters from mom and dad and what's functioning in my cell, I know that this drug specifically works for me. And this drug specifically counters this hallmark of aging. And so we're going to start to create AI models of an entire human cell, tissue, organ, human being. And that's a future that's incredible and coming fast.

Peter not only, I think only part that's missing in your vision is the hundred trillion microbes in your mouth and gut. And the reason I'm saying is because underestimate, estimate the power of what is going on. So when you are trying to create a digital twin, what we saw was identical paternal twins, identical twins, when you feed them same stuff, they have a completely different response to it. And there have been so many studies done on identical twins. And I just want people to know that to create identical twins, it's not just 3.2 billion of letters that we have in our DNA, but also all these micro, microbial side that we have to take into account and whether they are in our mouth, all over our skin and in our gut, all of that stuff. But answer is that is where the world is going to be headed once we are able to create a digital twin of all of these things that we have in our body, the whole ecosystem as such, we will be able to personalize everything about us. A drug that is going to work or not work and which drug is going to work and how to make that drug to work. So for example, in many people when they take the drug called LAV dopa for Parkinson's, it does not work for them. And it turns out that your gut microbes actually use tyrosine to completely nullify the LAV dopa. It completely metabolizes the drug. In fact, metformin actually works through gut microbiome. And there was a research that just came out that shows the probiotic and metformin together actually improve diabetes better than either probiotic or metformin alone. And you can predict. We in fact published a paper, Peter, about a year ago that shows you can predict whether metformin is going to reduce your HbA1c or not based on your gut microbial activities.

Yeah, you're absolutely right. I mean, I apologize. I should not be that short sighted to focus on our 40 trillion human cells. It really, it really is the other 100 trillion bacteria, fungi, viri, everything in your system. Because we are a very complex. It's like looking at earth and only looking at the people instead of all the billions of plants and animals and insects on the planet as well. The next thing I listed and I think VIOME is doing the closest to this, excited about the next iteration is, and I've said this before, if I go to physician A and say, okay, this is my objectives, I want to gain muscle mass, I want more cognitive clarity, I want to live longer. And I say they do some tests and I say I want to take the best medicine supplements for those objectives, physician A will give me one set of meds and supplements. Physician B will give me a different set. Physician C will give me a different set. And it's subjective. It's what that physician happens to know and what that doctor happens to have read about or what's in the fad. And so the reality is there is an objective best and once you have enough data. And so what is that data? That data includes my genomics, it includes my, my, my microbiome. 100%. Let me not make that mistake again. Yeah, it includes my objective goals, what I want to do, how many pills I'm willing to take. Right. Because I take 75 pills right now. When I'm doing, when I'm switching over to Viome, typically how many supplements come in a pack for someone?

It's eight. Eight pills.

That's it. I'm going from 75 to eight.

Yeah, yeah. But you're also getting a stick pack for your probiotics and you're getting your lozenges for your evening.

Okay, well I'm going to, it's going to be a lot easier. Remember to take my pills every day. By the way, does it matter what time of day you take those?

So normally we do four in the morning, four in the evening, or you can do all eight together in the morning.

This is going to be like major simplification of my life. Long story short, there is an optimization and we're not there yet. I think Viome is probably closing the cycle quicker than most individuals, than most companies. But I think there is a future in which there is an optimized set of meds and supplements, period. And you're going to be able to know it. And AI is going to do that for us.

The only way, Peter, today that the reason you get different answers from different doctors are every doctor has their own experience of 100 people, thousand people, or if you're lucky, 10,000 people. No one has data for million people or 10 million people. And once you have that, then you have all the comorbidities, all of the conflict confounding factors that no one has ever looked at. In fact, human being cannot process all the confounding factor. They say, oh, this person has diabetes, give them that. Well, the AI can say, but you know, he also has these following other comorbidities and confounding factor that would not work here. Right. And that can only happen the more and more data. So the only other thing I would just clarify, Peter, is genetics is good, but I really think gene expression is probably more important.

Let's talk about that. Right. Because I think people need to understand that when you say, oh, what do your genetics tell you about how long you'll live or what you should eat or all of those things? Genetics are tombstone markers, meaning they don't change. And there's something much more important. And you really have built biome around that. And I'm a huge believer. Please take it away.

Well, I think Peter, as you know, your genes, as you mentioned, don't change, but your gene expression is always changing. And the gene expression is what makes you who you are. So for example, every part of our body is identical DNA, yet we have hair and we have kidneys and we have heart and we have neurons, all come from the same DNA. That means same DNA can make all the different things. And what is expressed in is really what makes us who we are. So understanding the gene expression is the key to understanding your health and your disease. Right. So we monitor rna, so we look at the mitochondrial gene expression. We're looking at all of the immune system expression of which by the way, you saw the research, Peter, the IL11 inhibitor that actually reduced the biologically significantly.

Yeah, 25% mice, 25%.

And that's just IL6, you know, IL11, which is IL6 function. So I think really think ultimately understanding what is causing the IL11 to go up, what can we do to actually inhibit the expression of IL11 doesn't mean it doesn't exist. It is the expression. So similarly your trying to reduce the pro inflammatory gene expression. You want to increase the anti inflammatory gene expression. And you might be really proud of me. I just got my results on the biological age test from Glycan age this morning. What would be your guess, Peter? What would be your guess?

That is your chronological age. You're 60.

So I'm turning 65 in September.

65 in September. Amazing.

Yeah.

So your glycon age 45.

33.

33. Amazing. Yeah, amazing. You're half the man you used to be.

Or at least I'm twice the man that I need to be. That means I can probably now live to be a long time and get to watch Peter doing amazing things. So the reason I mentioned that is it's basically looking at the anti inflammatory and the pro inflammatory markers in your body and that's looking at that gentleman gene expression is the key to understanding why some people get sicker and other people don't. Even though they have identical, identical DNA. So you have in fact you Peter, you have twins, right? Identical DNA.

Oh no, they're not fraternal twins. They're.

Oh they're not.

I'm sorry, they're not identical twins. They're fraternal twins. Okay, real quick. I've been getting the most unusual compliments lately on my skin. Truth is I use a lotion every morning and every night religiously. Called One Skin, it was developed by four PhD women who determined a 10amino acid sequence that is a synolytic that kills senile cells in your skin. And this literally reverses the age of your skin. And I think it's one of the most incredible products. I use it all the time. If you're interested, check out the show notes. I've asked my team to link to it below. All right, let's get back to the the episode. Tell me, what are you doing to reduce your inflammatory. What do you think you're doing most that is reducing in your inflammation load?

So Peter, again it is avoiding the foods that Vyom tells me to avoid because those foods cause inflammation. Eating my superfood to increase my anti inflammatory markers and then taking the set of supplements and biotics and oral laws and this to constantly just adjust my microbiome to actually make sure that they're not producing anything that causes inflammation. So reducing the sulfide production, reducing the ammonia production, reducing the LPS production and those are the kind of things that you do. Then your immune system is always ready, but it's balanced.

Yeah, I'm just going to go and real quick, look at my superfoods. And my, my, my. Avoid foods. One moment. Nutrition. Here we go. Just for fun, you can. You can share me yours. So my. I'm going to my avoid foods first. Wow. Avoid artichoke. Okay?

And by click on that, it'll tell you why.

Okay, so artichoke is a prebiotic food rich in insulin. Why you should avoid methane gas production pathways. I guess I'll make my kids feel better.

No, actually, methane gas also, by the way, is inflammatory. So it's not just about the methane gas. It actually has no smell. Just in case you're wondering. It is actually inflammatory.

Yes. Beef. Avoid beef. Avoid black beans, which is a surprise.

And by the way, click on that and it'll tell you why.

Okay. Yes, again, again. Methane, methane gas production. And then it goes on in detail as to.

And probably the meat, red meat is probably is because of tma.

And the beef is about TMA production and LDL cholesterol pathways. And by the way, besides telling me why, it also gives me a scientific reference, which is fantastic. Avoid butter. I do that already. Avoid cane sugar 100. I do that. Avoid cheese, cow milk, cheese. I do that already. And these are things that inherently. But these are inherently things that make me feel bad. And. And here's so it's a food. You know, for me, cheese is a food allergy. Okay. Avoid buffalo. Avoid caviar. That's a bummer. Sony's not gonna be happy about that.

And that must be TMA as well, I think.

Yeah. So the. Where's the caviar? Yes, the tma. Like I said, Naveen, I need to award you a medical degree from one of my universities. So here it's now. Avoid egg yolk, which is new for me. Avoid eggplant. I've always known that. Avoid grapefruit. Avoid honey. So now let's talk about what my superfoods are. So because, you know, don't want to have it. Only be avoiding. So almonds, apples, art. Oops.

And by the click on almonds, it'll tell you why.

Yeah. Okay, so almonds supports heart health, good blood sugar response, oral inflammatory pathways, and arugula. Let's see. I want to just only. Oh, only superfoods. Okay. I click on that button to get rid of the. Avoid beets, brown broth, broccoli. I love broccoli. My favorite. My favorite. Brussels sprouts, cabbage, celery.

By the way, they are white for me. That broccoli and Brussels sprouts are white for me.

Really interesting. Yeah. Cranberries. Ginger is a superfood. Grapes are super.

That's good.

Let's see. Mung bean sprouts.

They're awesome.

Yeah. Olive oil is like my, my most. Yeah, I love olive oil. Being Greek, of course. Pomegranates, raspberries.

I want superfoods.

Salmon, yes. Wild caught salmon for sure. That's like my number one go to meal. Spinach, Popeye would be happy. Tofu, turmeric, white mushrooms.

So, by the way, 30% of the people are harmed by spinach because of high oxalates in spinach. Right. So, I mean, in fact, it's really, really interesting that we put together and looked at a lot of the people that consider healthy food. How many people are actually harmed by them?

Yeah, it is. You know, we have these generalizations and we get our food advice from, you know, from our cartoons and from, you know, from the FDA's ancient food pyramid. And, you know, at the end of the day you can know. Do you want to know? Do you want to take the time to know? My last AI and health sort of transformative impact is surgical robots. So, you know, today I think you know this. But just to share with folks listening here, if you need to get a surgery, there's one question you ask when you're interviewing a surgeon. And please don't just pick the first surgeon that comes to you. And that question is, how many times have you done the surgery this morning? Right. In other words, the reason is a surgeon who's done many of them. In fact, sometimes you see places where there's like a surgical assembly line. Assembly line right where the surgeon's going in, doing a surgery the next. Those are the best surgeons. They've seen so many circumstances, so many variations that they're not caught off guard by something going on. They have massive experience. Your brain is a neural net and it's being trained by everything you see. And so you want a surgeon that's seen a lot and trained up their neural net because it's really, it's a hand skill coordination and it's a knowledge coordination. So in the future, we're going to see surgical robots that have seen not just 1,000 cases or 5,000 cases over their career, but have seen 50 million cases because they share all of their knowledge across every surgery ever done as part of the operating system. And they don't have fights with their girlfriends or boyfriends. They can see an infrared ultraviolet, they don't have too much coffee, their hands not shaking. So I think that's coming.

And I think they also can create a virtual view of the world so they can have that 3D view, so they can literally see everything around them so they know where they are, as opposed to the doctor actually trying to figure out where they are. They are constantly knowing where they are in the body. And I really think there's just no doubt in my mind at the end of the day that robotic surgery is here to stay. And we hope that one day we won't even need that because our nanoparts will be repairing our organs. And so you won't even need that 100%.

So, as we promised, let's talk about raising kids. I want to hear your advice. So before we go to raising kids, give me an overview, pal. Remind me what it was like for you growing up in India. Where were you born? What was life like in your early days?

So, Peter, we grew up very, very poor in India. We had no place to stay. We had no food to eat. We moved to town.

What town or village were you in? Where were you?

We didn't have a place, Peter. We moved every probably 12 months, 18 months. We moved from village to village because my father decided not to take any bribes. And if he don't take a bribe, his boss didn't get any money. So he was constantly transferred from one village to another village until we went to such remote villages where there was nothing to be built, nothing to be done. So he's not taking anyone's bribe anymore. Right. So we grew up in very, very rural.

Your dad was working for the government.

Government work, yeah, yeah. So he worked on the. In a public works department. His job was to build the buildings in the road and. And they rather not use cement. They wanted to use the contractor, use sand and half cement so they can save money and then give it to the bribery. The people in the government for the bride, you know, coming from there. Despite all of that, my sister went on to become a post doctorate in applied mathematics. My brother has a PhD in Statistics and computer science. I was probably the least educated person. Ended up getting engineering from iit, which is one of the top schools. And then did my MBA, came to the United States about 42 years ago.

How old were you?

Nothing in my pocket. 42, $5 in my pocket. Ended up in New Jersey.

You were 23 at the time?

23 at the time, yeah.

Yeah.

And God has been very kind to us, Peter. God has been just extremely kind to us. And today we sit here with everything that we could have possibly ever imagined. Imagined and more. Our children grew up here in an extremely affluent family. And there was Never a time, you know, even though in the early days when the kids were young, my wife will say, you know, Anu will say, you know, maybe we should tell children that we don't have much money. We can move into a small house. And I said, sweetie, one day they're going to learn to read. They know that daddy's not poor. That doesn't quite work very well. So you may as well change how we talk to them about money. So we decided we're going to fundamentally change the concept of what success is. So we told them that your success is never measured by how much money you have in the bank. It's measured by how many lives you improve. Your self worth is never going to come from how much you own. Your self worth comes from how much you create. That means you can own a lot that you inherited. But if you haven't created anything, you're still a parasite on your humanity. So please don't be a parasite. Go do something meaningful. And then we really start to look at everything that we did. What we learned in the early days, Peter, was children don't do what you tell them to do. They do what they see you do. And that's the beauty of the thing is, so when our, you know, I was running Infospace, the company was worth $40 billion, right? And it, you know, point, the reason I'm trying to mention is that at that time kids were young. I could have easily said, hey, I'm going to now retire and the kids are young. I'm going to spend time with my children. And what, you know, it would have been, people would have said, oh my God, how nice of Naveen to actually give up his career and spend time with the kids. That is a selfish thing to do because it's good for me. I want to get that pleasure. But from a kid's perspective, what they would have seen is dad made a lot of money. When I go to school, he's sitting on the sofa watching cnbc. He comes back when they come back from school, dad says, work hard. Hard work is what it takes, right? And they're sitting watching dad sitting on the sofa watching NBC. They say, I want to grow up just like my dad. Sit on the sofa and watch cnbc. Right now, instead of reading the stories in the evening, we will have them create stories. So instead of teaching them stories, we say, hey, can you tell me a story about a monkey and an ocean and a palm tree? And they need to now come up with a way to connect the dots together because we wanted Them to see how everything in the world can be connected. Now, dad, you tell me a story about these three things. Right. The idea was to start to show them how to connect the dots in the world. The most important thing, Peter, was giving them intellectual curiosity. As a job of a parent in is not to take the kids to the water and make them drink, but make them thirsty. And the way to create thirst is intellectual curiosity. And this is really interesting, Peter, you want to admire. So when a kid comes and says, oh, look at Peter, he's wearing an amazingly great black sweater, you don't say, oh, yes, that is a really great sweater. You say, you know, Ankur or, you know, Jet, that, you know, the black doesn't really exist. It is simply the electromagnetic waves, the photons that are hitting our light, and the color is created in our brain. And so, you know, what you're seeing is actually not real. And the reason is you want them to challenge everything, even that they think that they can take it for granted. That's the black sweater. Right. The point is, once you challenge them to start taking that every single thing can be challenged, even the thing that they're seeing with their eyes and may not be right. It allows them to start thinking about how to challenge everything that they have. And as we wrap up here, the last thing really is allowing them to ask the right questions. Right. So when we talk about solving world hunger, you don't talk about how do we increase the yield of the food, how do we reduce the wastage? Instead of asking how to produce more, you question about why do we eat food? Right. And you simply, when you say, why do we eat food? The prop. You need energy, and what are the different ways to get energy. And suddenly the solutions that you are seeing are very different than simply growing more food and wasting more food.

Yeah.

And we can go on and on about symptoms and the root cause, but that's really the way of actually educating children.

I agree with you. I, you know, when I drop my kids off at school, my parting words are ask questions, great questions today. Right?

Yeah.

And when. When I advise CEOs and Abundant Summit, it's, you know, ask great questions today. It really is about the questions you ask in life. Like you said, God, GPT, sort of, you know, what are you prompting? You know, I. I had the pleasure to get to know your kids early on and spend time with. With Encore and Priyanka and, And Neil, and they've interned and work with me.

Neil actually interned for you. I mean, he learned more from you than I could have ever taught him.

How do you think about the. At their ages of, you know, sort of 14 to 18 to 23, you know, what is your advice on what kids should be doing during that period of time? How important is the school they go to? How important is the experiences they have? Go deeper there.

So Peter, I think this is something so important and so crucial. I think taking children to learn about different things. So essentially taking kids to abundance360 I mean to me, or taking them to Singularity University, there is nothing, no better investment you would ever do in your children to bring them to expose them to different things that are out there that they don't even know about. Exposing them to coming to abundance360 having them learn about AI, having them learn about what nanotechnologies are, having them to learn about what is coming up allows them to start thinking about what is possible. And that is the key. The best investments you make in children are exposing them to, to different ideas, different things, about different possibilities as opposed to having them find their passion early. You actually, your job should be to expose them to different ideas, different people. Taking them to work, taking them to actually see how you work, seeing them that you are humans, you make mistakes but really taking them to these places where you learn. So if you find Abundance360 to be used to, why not bring your children there? If you find Singularity University to be helpful, why not bring your children there? And Peter, as you know, all three of our kids went to Singularity University. All three of them were involved with XPRIZE because they saw the possibilities coming out of xprize. All of them have come to Abundance because they see what they can learn. And to me that is the best thing I can ever offer a parenting advice is take them to great places where they can learn and be exposed to different ideas.

Yeah. Amazing. Naveen, where do people follow you? Where do they learn more about your books, the work that you do? Viome.

So Peter, of course you can follow me on Instagram and LinkedIn. You can go to naveenjen.com if you want to know more about what I'm doing. Or you can go to viome.com v I o m e.com and learn more about about what biome is doing or find me at Abundance 360 or any of the Peter things.

It's always a pleasure. I am continually just really gratified for your friendship, my friend, and for your passion. You are a beautifully driven individual and those who know you know that there is no stopping you and just the journey that you've been on, building biome and how much you've created and how much you've combined, it's just a beautiful thing. And I'm thankful for you, Peter.

From bottom, my heart, I appreciate you. I absolutely love you like a brother. And I just cannot thank you enough for what you have done for me and our family. And I'm always in debt of you.

All right, buddy. Excited for the life we're living together. Onwards to 100 plus, 200 plus. We'll see where we get, all right?

Absolutely. Absolutely.

Be well.

Take care.