Money Mindset, Motherhood & Redefining Financial Power for Female Founders! | Candice Tait
In this candid, podcast‑style interview, Candice Tait, CGMA, PhD, shares her personal journey from being the lone woman CFO in a fast‑paced London tech firm to becoming a mentor for female founders. She explains how women are traditionally excluded from money education and offers practical, trauma‑informed strategies to build financial safety and confidence. Key concepts include the "you/fuck‑you fund"—a personal reserve for leaving toxic jobs— and a simple monthly allocation rule (10% long‑term investment, 10% play, 50% necessities, with the remainder split between long‑term savings, child savings and holiday funds). Candice links money mindset to attachment styles, introduces the idea of "happy money," and discusses how female founders can shift their relationship with money. She contrasts venture capital and private equity, advises on negotiating founder pay and back‑pay, and stresses the non‑negotiable need to master cash flow and profit‑and‑loss statements. Throughout, she emphasizes the importance of role models, the "Roger Bannister effect" for breaking perceived limits, and the need for sustainable, cash‑positive businesses. Additional insights from the later part of the conversation highlight the pervasive shame women feel around finance, the importance of framing financial literacy as a systemic issue rather than personal failure, and the universal nature of finance as a funnel through which every business decision passes. Candice shares relatable anecdotes—overspending on coffee, accidental subscription renewals—to illustrate how small financial awareness can empower founders. The dialogue also underscores creating safe, permission‑granting spaces for women to start exactly where they are, fostering community and empowerment.
Chapters
Money management is something that women weren't really taught to do. I was living in London, a CFO working in the world of finance, surrounded by men. I've sat in a room and I was the one who initiated the meeting. The other person in the room was. He thought I was just there to make tea.
She learned the language of numbers the hard way. 14x exits, multimillion dollar acquisitions, and glass ceilings that cracked but never quite broke.
I have a really simple rule. Of all the money that you receive every month, you take 10% and you.
Put that into tell me about a fuck you fund.
That was my way of put money aside for the day that you just decided, I cannot do this job anymore. My boss is a dick.
Finance isn't a flex. It isn't as scary as most of us think it is. And Candace teaches us how knowing your numbers is quite the opposite.
How did all those other women with a family survive a 9 to 5? Yeah, it's not built for women.
The whole system, we cannot change a system we are too afraid to talk about. This episode is your crash course in money without the shame.
It's going to be different. It has to be different.
Because financial literacy is the second language every female founder needs to speak.
You do not have to have been born a numbers person or be good at maths at high school. That is so false. One of the most fundamental reasons why some female founders don't get funding, it's the ability to.
I am so excited to have you here because we met randomly, well, at a business conference for females, for women. So that is not that random. But we were introduced. I think we had a 60 second conversation. And in those 60 seconds, we're like, we locked eyes. It was like you and me, we are going to be talking some more. And the more I get to know you and the more I learn about what you are building and your mission, I'm like, of course, of course. We are here today. And I am so incredibly excited for you to share not just your story, which is incredible, but tools on financial literacy, fluency, the importance of it, and how to make it accessible for women. Because, you know, we were talking about this earlier. It's kind of been kind of gatekept and artificially made difficult. So we're going to unpack all of that today, starting at the beginning. I want to say, like, I always describe my previous business and my life in Amsterdam, but also partly here as like my past life. And when I read your story and when I learn about your story, it also almost Feels like a past life, like a completely different story. Because it wasn't so long ago that you were doing something wildly different at a wildly different scope, surrounded by a wildly different demographic.
Yes.
Take me back to that point in your life.
Ah, it's a, it's a big part of my life actually. So before this moment, before Founders Be county, before New Zealand, I was living in London and I was a CFO working in the world of finance, surrounded.
By men and for a big company.
Yeah, for big companies. I have worked for quite a lot of companies in the tech part of the world and because it's tech again, many men. And so being a cfo, I landed a job, I was really lucky. I landed a job with a company called Reward Gateway. And I would consider this like the life changing career thing that happened to me working for Reward gateway. I was 27 when I joined them and they were a really fast paced tech business right time as well. And they were private equity backed. So I joined at a pivotal moment when we were accelerating growth pretty rapidly. It was a big team. I joined as a finance manager, product finance manager and quickly kind of saw that the team was being run very differently from the rest of the business, which I thought was really odd. And I'll give you an example. So day I walked in, people like, super friendly, full of jeans, T shirts, like friendly smiley, right, walk into the finance department. They were all suited and quiet and I thought to myself, there's something wrong, what's going on? And so I actually had the opportunity to apply for the head of finance role, which kind of two months after I joined the business and I took it and I just went for it. And I said, I am only going to take this job if I have free rein to do what I want to do. And I remember the CFO saying, yeah, go ahead. So I redesigned the department, put in a new finance system, I deliberately wore jeans and casual clothing to fit in and I made the team kind of go to the other departments instead of sending emails to connect with people.
And so even in this male dominated, fast paced London tech bro financial world, you already started kind of softening the edges a little bit, but I think it was still quite a different reality. We were talking about this before. The systems around us, whether it's a game, yeah, it's a game. If you can't beat them, join them.
That's it.
So you learned how to play that game?
I learned really well. I learned, I did. And, and you know, before that I was working in a very corporate environment. So you know, we had to wear suits and stuff like that. And again it was learning the ropes. Like how did, how could I be really good at this? And I would, I would kind of just lean on everyone who was better than me and learn from them. And so landing this job was just phenomenal because it accelerated my career in like ways that I didn't even anticipate paid. And we grew so fast. I kind of had a lot of control over that business. We exited. That was my first exit. Private Equity exit hit 14 times multiple which is phenomenal. I mean it was, it was incredible. And to be part of that. I was responsible for the finance due diligence. I also did legal due diligence and.
It was a wild ride. That's the startup world for you.
Yeah.
Let's exit at 14x. And you know numbers. I'm sure you can be our legal due diligence too.
Who needs a lawyer? Yeah, right. That no one wanted to do it. And I was like, I kind of like legal. It sounds really nerdy. But I did like it.
And so that just kind of like propelled you into this world.
It propelled me into this world. I, you know, in parallel I still noticed that I was the only woman in the room. And this was very real for me. There were many, many events. It wasn't, we're talking. My whole career was very male dominated in finance and being the only woman. The thing is I never let that deter me.
Did you feel deterred by that? Because when I reflected back on. Because our journeys are quite similar. Well, I didn't exit at 14x. I wish I'd known you. I could have similar in the ways that hard cut between chapters and very much. You learn how to play the game and then you get to a point where you realize fuck the game, let's make my own game. I was working and operating in a male dominated world and. And I remember many situations where I guess there was like sexism but at the time I was just like, that's funny. Like I did not. There were many rooms where I was the only woman in the room and I wasn't aware of it because I was so oblivious.
Yeah. The thing that sort of grounded me to be driven and move through that always was this idea that I had to be good at what I did to prove myself, to create safety for myself. And the only way for me to do that is to learn to, to believe in myself. And so when I, and I have, I've sat in a room and I was the one who initiated the meeting and the whole. The other person in the, in the room was. He thought I was just there to make tea. So that's happened to me and I did. I made the tea, by the way. I thought it was funny and I just sort of laughed it off. But there was another situation where it was a banking event, lots of finance people and it was a room full of at least 100 people. And I looked around and it was me and another woman and then the serving staff and, and two people came up to me at that event. One said to me why are you here? And I don't even remember what my answer was, but I'm pretty sure I walked away. And the other person was like, oh hi, can I have a. Oh my God. Yeah.
And this is like, you know guys, we're not talking about the 50s, eight.
No, maybe eight years ago.
Yeah, it's. And it's now still.
Yeah, still happy. Yeah. I actually on LinkedIn the other day someone posted like a CFO photograph of like CFOs coming together for a dinner. Right. There was like two women and maybe 10 men and I. My post response was one day it will be 5050 at least because it's ridiculous. Yeah. Anyway, so moving through that I had this amazing role at Reward Gateway. I learned a shitload. I would I say to people that I learned 10 years of experience experience in four because it was. I went through two bank refinances and exit legal finance due diligence. I'd moved half of my team to Bulgaria. I'd looked after 12 companies.
Yeah but I mean the like you say, the wealth of knowledge. Because I feel like what's important is that our, our listeners, viewers, whatever are female founders or, or one day soon to be female founders in every growth stage. Some are pre revenue have been going and are multi million dollar companies. But often, and I find this myself is when you hear about these huge startups and these huge exits, it feels like something so impossible and so far off and so I really think it's incredible that what you've done is you've gotten this experience in the, the big bad world out there, the tech bro world and you're bringing that in and making that accessible and understandable and bite sizable for everyone.
Yeah. Yes. And that I think it, it is only being the last four years that I've acknowledged that my whole career, the 20 years of working in tech and for private equity backed businesses and PE houses and all of that that I actually I learned a language. Venture capitalists usually come at the stage where you're still growing and they will invest in you when you're not profitable. Whereas a private equity firm will typically only invest in you once you've hit the profitability mark and you're growing your business. And these investors are slightly different in terms of what they, what they invest, but also what they look for in your business. So when you get to private equity, you are a serial kind of founder. You, you know, your way, you've proved your business can operate out there and you can grow it and you can scale it. And when you're sort of starting off, it's, it's different. Right. Like a venture capitalist will understand that there's, there's a lot of risk involved in, in investing in a business that's not yet profitable. And so they have a different risk appetite as well. So the investors that go into private equity and venture capitalists are just different.
Right.
And so, yeah, it's a different game. I think the world of working with venture capitalists for me has only been the last six, seven years. Before that was like either corporate or private equity. So I kind of work backwards.
Yeah. I love that though.
What? For me, it's great because what I saw was what good looks like that was a baseline for me. I was like, this is where we need to be. And so now I get to work with people who are building businesses and I can go, I know what you need to do to get there. Yeah. Because I've been there and I've seen it and I know what they need.
Yeah. And I'm a big believer in build the business you want, not the business you have. Yeah, right. Like, I remember when I launched my agency back in the day in Amsterdam at my dining room table. And at one point I had my first intern and she's like, why is everything in English? I'm like, because we're a global agency. She's like, you are not. Well, like, look around where we are sitting. We're sitting in your living room. You have a baby there. Like you're trying to like, you know, move the stroller so he stays asleep during our meeting. And what do you mean we're a global agency in a, like, just plan for the business you want, not the business you have. And otherwise you're constantly playing catch up. Why would you start any smaller?
That's right. That's right. And actually one of the things I, I started doing was parachuting into companies for private equity backed businesses. And I would come in kind of after the deal had been Done and work with the CFOs that were already there, plus their finance teams. And I would tell them what to expect. Because when you're at that level and you're about to scale, you have to make sure that your foundations are solid. And I mean, you need to make sure your processes are robust, your reporting is efficient, you got the numbers ready. When that investor is calling and say, what's my cash flow? What's this? What's that? You've got to know it. And so I know how to do that. Like, I knew how important it was to have that ready because it's. So first of all, it's access to information means you can make change faster. Right.
Informed, informed choices.
Absolutely. And it also makes you look bloody hot. Right.
I love that. And I want to go back to those foundations. I want to actually, I'll circle back in a little bit about what are those foundations that we all need to know. Because it's really funny. Money and sex are two things that are like very difficult to talk about for a lot of people. And there's so much meaning that we assign to money and power that we give away because of it. So let's dive into that. But before you said something really interesting because you said, I learned how to play the game really well because I had to prove myself. Because for you, that became safety. Basically, as a trauma informed coach, what I'm hearing and also as someone who did the exact same thing I'm hearing and also because I lived it and I fell flat on my face, is that, that, that's a trauma response. That's font. That's like, you know, you have fight, flight, freeze, fun. That's just like, if I just, you know, be whatever you want me to be, then I'll be safe. So tell me what, like, what in like money is a way for all of us in this world to feel a sense of safety because we live in a world where we pay for water.
Yeah.
So tell me a little bit about your background and what really informed that drive to create that sense of safety within yourself and through the means of finance.
I grew up in a pretty dysfunctional family and I think many people can say that nowadays you're not special.
We're all traumatized.
Exactly.
I'm just, just as traumatized as a next girl. Exactly.
So I, I feel like that's pretty common. I think that.
And then what, like, sorry, what is that? It still really shapes us.
It shapes. I shaped so many decisions in my life.
Exactly. So first of all, like, let's not downplay.
No, no.
Like, first of all, it's sad that it's that common and like that does not make your experience any less relevant or real.
Yeah, absolutely. And I think there was a different version of me that because of me trying to create safety was doing different things. I was making different decisions. Decisions. Right. So for example, I, I became a chartered accountant when I wanted to be an astrophysicist. Like why I got a master's degree in business. I did my PhD in corporate finance, I stayed in finance and you know, try to save up as much money as possible. And I created what I call you a you fund. And you know, that was my way of creating safety.
Tell me, tell me about a you fund.
Oh, it's great. It's.
Because it's, it's, it's, it's more of a like internal thing than it is about money.
That's right. A you fund is really putting money aside for the day that you just decided, I cannot do this job anymore, my boss is a dick, or I need to move country, or I need to get out of this relationship or whatever it is. Whatever it is, I have money that's gonna give me safety to make that decision.
Yeah. Because that is freedom right there. The amount, the number of people I have spoken to throughout the years that have stayed in unhappy and sometimes unseen safe situations because of money. Because of money or because fear that they couldn't do it by themselves. Like that is such power to have that, that freedom to choose. And I think also knowing that it's there whether you ever touch it or not, like you go into anything, you don't go into a job because you're expecting to have a fucking moment or into a relationship or into anything really.
And so that's why I said the version of me who did that, the version of me today would say, let's manage your money. Let's create a pocket, an account that puts some money aside. And we're not going to call it a fight because I don't want to have a self fulfilling prophecy. Yes. I want to have spare money for the good stuff. I want an extra account of money that, so that I can make a good decision about my life. So I've reframed it.
I love that it's so you know how in your bank app you can, you have sub accounts and you can name it so people like, like I'm a, I'm a just a slut for language. And I believe we build worlds with our words and we like speak Things into existence, just like you're saying. And in our language, it's not even my language, but in English there is like, we call it like a rainy day fund. Right. A fuck you. So I, one of my rainy day fund is my sunshine account.
Yes.
It's not, I'm not, I'm not preparing for disaster. I'm not bracing for impact. I'm expecting the best.
That's right. What's the best that can happen? And actually we'll lean into this because it's important. But money management is something that women weren't really taught to do. And when you think of money management, you think, oh my God, that's really expensive to go get a financial person that's going to help me manage my money. Oh my gosh.
Do you want to know? It's expensive not understanding it.
Yes, exactly. And so it's actually really straightforward. In most of our accounts in New Zealand, you can go and just create a new one.
Right.
And so I have a really simple rule. Of all the money that you receive every month, you just, you take 10% and you put that into long term investment. And whether you put that into stocks or shares, shares is a really easy one to do. You keep that separate. And then you take another 10% and you put that into what I call my play account. And I have to spend it before the end of the month because what that does is it gets you into a sense of receiving and it's cycling.
Yeah, exactly.
And so rather than being afraid of money, I feel like getting close to it and enjoying what it, what it does for you changes your perception of how much you can earn. This is all money mindset stuff.
Oh, it's so huge. I heard such an interesting one around this. I'm trying to think who I heard it from so I can credit them. I, I can't remember. So if it was you, I'm sorry, I'm not trying to steal your content. I did not come up with this. But they compared our relationship to money with attachment styles.
Yes.
So you know, we have the attachment styles. If you're either anxiously attached, right. Like, oh my God, don't leave me. Like, oh, I can't leave you out of my sight. Or very avoidant. Like, yeah, yeah, nonchalant, nonchalant. Or you know, like, you know, healthy.
Like, or I don't care about money. That's exactly, yeah.
And how our attachment styles, how we relate to others is shaped often in early childhood by our traumas and how we relate to others. Attachment styles are a way to create a sense of safety in our system. So often there is a direct parallel between our attachment style in relating and our upbringing. And our upbringing, but also how we our attachment style to money. Now, the beauty of attachment style styles is that it's something you can shift. And I don't like the word heal because it implies that there's something sick to begin with or wrong. But as you learn how to relate in a more healthy way, you can shift your attachment to a relationship or to money. That's right.
Yeah. And actually, a really good, fantastic book is Ken Honda Happy Money.
Oh, is that the like. Thank you.
He is a. He's a Japanese billionaire. He wrote this book about happy money. And it's the belief around how you feel about money. And so he does this really simple exercise where you get your credit card out or like a dollar that's in your. In your wallet, and you feel it and you say to yourself, is a happy money or is it sad money? And the idea is that if the money came from a divorce, it's sad money. Right. Typically, if the money came from doing something good, like your job doing something really well, and you feel good about it, it's happy money. And the more happy money you have, the more money your. Your attachment style with money is positive. And so it's a really interesting concept. I've never thought of it that way, but it does. It does lean into women and their belief around money and how they build their business. Because the thing. You know what? I think one of the things I was thinking of yesterday was like, when did it become really apparent that actually I wanted to create founder to be counted? And there was one moment where I was talking to a female founder. I just feel like I don't deserve to be a successful female founder. Oh, right. And. And that is that, like, that little, like, person on the right side of your shoulder going like, do you deserve this? Do you deserve to have money? It's very interesting, and it kind of uncovers a lot of the reasons why I think some female founders don't take that. They take decisions based off these blueprints, I would call them, and these beliefs that they have around money. But what if you could shift that? What if every single female founder believed they deserve to be millionaires? I wonder what their business would look like.
It's a game changer. It's a game changer. And I think that's what's often said. And it's. Even though this is what I do, I do also want to preface it's easier said than done in the sense that it is layers and layers of ancestral ways of being, of programming, of continuously being just kind of pushed into, into a flow. So I, as much as I believe money, mindset or any, any mindset work is extremely important, I think that without the embodiment is where a lot of people go wrong. Look, I'll just put some affirmations on my mirror, I'll just repeat it to myself and it's happy money now it's happy money. See, Happy money. And then they don't, they wonder why it's not working. And I think there's a lot of pressure in, through some of the self help personal development world that's like if you just change your mindset, everything will be different. So let's, I just want to just preface that by like honoring that. That by itself first of all is not going to create, not going to.
Create a change, a unicorn. But I do think that we can talk about foundations, these foundations that you can create, which is to me every single person can learn them. So yes, you do not have to have been born a numbers person or understand maths or be good at maths at high school. I think that it's really sad that a lot of people come out of school and because those teachers or your exams told you you weren't good at maths, that means you'll never be good at it. That is so false.
Well, I also think it's funny that you say that because I was the poster girl for I'm not a numbers person, which is why I almost went bankrupt in my previous business, which is what turned me into a numbers person because then all of a sudden you had to be it. But also maths, like we, we live in an age with like, I mean AI, but even just the Internet and calculators that the math itself isn't what you need to understand. You need to understand the levers you're pulling. My kids are both really good with numbers and the sciences and all of that. I'm a language person. Clearly not this language because I can think of words today. But so I always struggled with that. And I have conversations with my son. He tries to explain something to me and I, I need to translate what he's saying. He's showing me a formula or something. I think he's given up by now. You know, he knows me, but I still do. You know how in elementary school are you really young? It's like, okay, John has two apples and yeah, yeah, but I do that because I'm a language person. I see numbers. I need to turn it into a story. I need to understand what they mean. Otherwise it's, it doesn't stick. I just stare at numbers. It's a language I don't speak.
Yeah.
So whether you can do the math, like, you know, there's computers who can do the math for you. You need to understand what those numbers represent.
And you've just, you've just actually leaned into something which I think is one of the most fundamental reasons why some female founders don't get funding. And it's the ability to intertwine finances into your narrative, into your business strategy story. Hmm. There are so many amazing businesses out there that have been run by women, but they just cannot, they, they don't know how to put finance at the forefront of that conversation. And when you're talking to investors, I'm sorry, but those investors are very financially literate.
Yeah. And also like that, that is not a men, women, no thing. It's like if you're speaking to investors, you're asking for money, you're, you're coming to. It's like going to a country where they speak a certain language and then.
You know, refusing to directions and you can't get directions.
Exactly.
That's kind of. You need to be able to give a reason to the investor to invest in you, of course, and you need to talk numbers. So that's really important. And it's something that I, I really love. I think that it's very important to be able to, just to explain your business and to be able to incorporate numbers into that. So I think that there's no business strategy without the numbers, if I'm honest. And so that's part of the foundations of what I think is important.
We started though, that's part of the foundations. The first part is numbers are important because numbers are what makes this world go round. And not just if you're going to investors, but any type of partnership, any type of negotiation, bank, insurance, company, whatever. You need to understand your numbers and not be scared of them and feel comfortable around them. Which I think circles back really nicely to. You were saying, this is in your personal life. You're saying 10% goes to 10, like long term investment. Then 10%, 10% goes to my play account. Oh my God.
A play which I see spend, you have to spend it before the end of the month. It's a really feel good act because if you enjoy that, you are enjoying money. I think that everyone should enjoy their money. 50 goes to what I call my necessities account. So it pays for the bills and for food and things like that. The other 30 is kind of split into. One is like super long term savings. The other 10 is for my daughter. That's long term savings. So that goes into like a long term shares account. You can ask me about that later. And I've got some picks, some share picks. And then the other bit goes into my holiday savings. So we all need a holiday. And so I do put some money aside and kind of accumulate that until we decide where to go on holiday.
So here you've touched upon something really, really interesting because that is, you know, of your income. Now I have a sneaking suspicion that a lot of female founders, especially in the early years, either don't pay themselves or don't pay themselves enough. I would love for you to explain how they should go about not just like once it's in their personal name divvying it up. But okay, so you have a business. How much of that goes to you and do you do that and, and when do you start or stop or. Yep, it's a big one.
It is a big one. And the personal aspect at that time is really it actually it's very real. Like it's very easy for me to say, hey, just put tempers in here. But you know, if you're living in a shitty little like studio apartment and you don't have that, then I understand. But when you're starting a business and you are a female founder and you don't have that much money and you don't want to pay yourself because you're living out of your grandma's, you know, basement or something, Fine. It's a short, it's a short period of time, right? You have to give yourself a goal. You have to set yourself a time frame. I think I'm very much one of those people that loves goals and time frames that I set myself and targets. So I always kind of like, I'm very pro. Okay, let's say I'm only going to live in my grandma's basement for seven months, right? What do I need? I'm here today. This is where I need to be. What do I have to do to get from there to there? And you set yourself like a couple of bullet points. Well, I have to generate some revenue. How am I going to do that? Well, I'm going to have to go spend some money on some ads. Okay. How am I going to do that? Where am I going to spend the money? How do I know if it's going to work. Well, I have to do these measures. I have these, these KPIs, right. So then you start building up. You literally start building a plan and you, you make, you make your future. You are setting the, the targets for yourself. Right. You're not letting life happen to you or is this business actually going to happen? I'm just going to let things, you have to take control of it. Female founders and I work with a lot of them that are not paying themselves a lot. And fair enough, right? Like when you are, there is this like sense of that if you are a business that's funded by investors that you shouldn't be paid like your market rate, especially when you're not profitable.
I'm like, I mean I've always bootstrapped everything so I don't know the world of investors at all.
Okay. And so it's different because.
And also I think a lot of, I think the world of founders that go through seeding and like the, the funding route is probably not the majority of female founders, at least not in the beginning.
It's actually really interesting you say that. I obviously don't work with like heaps of bootstrapping founders because my, my area of expertise is to get you skilled up to get investment. Yeah, okay. If you're bootstrapping, amazing, go for it. Like don't get investors. It sucks. Like, well that's hardcore.
I am like terrified of it. And also would not recommend. I've bootstrapped my way into a multinational multi million dollar business and I would not recommend it. I was miserable. I like was, it literally landed me in hospital. It is not, it's not, it's not fun or pretty.
It's not. But I have it's tip for those who are funded from investors who are paying themselves, you know, less than market rate. My tip to them is negotiate now that the difference between your rates day and your market rate is X and you're going to be back paid for that at some point in the future and you're going to decide on what date that is when you maybe exit or you get further investment. But make that conversation happen, happen now because when the time comes and your business is worth 10 million more, you're still underpaying yourself.
Yeah.
You want back pay, so do that. It's really, it's really worthwhile. It'll make you feel better knowing that there's some money that's going to be paid to make up for that difference that you've been suffering to get to where you're at, that'll be paid out. You can go on a nice long holiday or something like that.
I love, love that. That's really good too. And it's again, it's like planning for the business you want, not the business you have. But let's say for shits and giggles, there is a founder listening, has built a business. There is some recur. Like there's a recurring revenue. Basically, yes, it's covering the cost, but it's not paying out a salary. Is there like a, like a pie chart like you just created for your personal account that every founder should be like, ah, this much needs to go to in the business, keep in the business or to, to yourself or a long term, not fuck you fund, but if I get fucked over fund, is there such a model that you would recommend?
No, because every single business is different. I had a call from a friend of mine who bootstrapped his own business and he said to me, I have too much money. What do I do with it?
You have my number, right?
And there was only two, there's only two of them in the business and they've created an incredible SaaS platform and they have all this excess cash and they're like, can we invest in shares? Can we buy some property? Can we do some investments? So there are ways, you know, in the world of finance, what we say is this unutilized cash and what that means is like you're not, you're not utilizing that to, for the benefit of the business. It's just sitting there doing nothing.
Yeah.
And you don't want that.
So if not at these interest rates. No.
So let's say, let's say you do make an excess of cash, right. You're really cash rich. And that tends to happen when you've got a business that's in the, the SAS tech business. They have a lot of cash coming in. If you have excess cash, I would say look to invest that somewhere either you can look to grow into a new market. Right. So you, you need money to do that or buy out a competitor or invest it into shares or just something that helps you utilize that money better. The one thing that is really obvious for every single business that I've ever worked for is your cash is spent. A lot of it is spent on people. And that's just for every business really. But in today's world, there's a lot that we can do with AI and I think we should all be exploring that because. Oh yeah, there's a lot of really boring tasks that we do that we're paying people to do. We still. I think we still need people to manage AI agents. I think that's really key, definitely. Because you still need to overlook and make sure everything's correct. But I think that we could be exploring that to save and preserve more cash, to then spend it on other things to grow the business.
Yeah, I think that's a. That's an excellent point. And even when it's not a business where you're like, okay, I'm super cash flow rich. I'm like, I don't know, I'm drowning in all this money. The same is true for time. Like, it's. Time is, one could argue, a more precious resource because you can always make more money. There is only this amount of time. So I think there is. There's so much we can do these days with these tools that will help free up time and resources to allocate them where it matters.
Yeah.
So where does it matter? Where does that need to go to that freed up energy within those businesses?
Well, building growth really doesn't it? I love working with businesses that are keen to make a difference, to make a change, do something. Something meaningful in the world. I love working with businesses that are predominantly women. Yes. I really do like it. It's just different conversations.
Tell me how.
Oh, this changed me. This changed me because I. The only time that I actually got to talk to female founders was when I joined 500 Global, which is an accelerator. Well, 500 Global is a VC firm in the US it's massive. They run accelerators all over the world. And I started working with them five, five, six years ago and did my first accelerator in Saudi Arabia and I was exposed.
And there. This is only women or 500 global is.
It's men and women. Yes. But it's the first time that I started working with female founders. So throughout my whole career, it was male founders. Yeah. Male management. Some feet, some women, but many men. Yeah. And this was really interesting because these women, I just. Something just changed. I felt I could connect differently. I felt like the conversations were more real, that they were more honest. I had one female founder who joined a call and said, I got my period today. I feel like shit. And I was like, could you do that with a guy on the other side of the phone?
No. Well, you can. And it's actually quite fun because it makes them very uncomfortable. I've actually made a sport out of.
It, but traditionally different, because then what happens is there's a sense of empathy that you get from that core and just authenticity, that you can just be more sensitive and you're allowed to be. And throughout my whole career, I was like, don't show emotion. Never, never cry.
Be a robot. Exactly. And it was big dick energy.
Yeah. All the time. And it was like, I need to be on show performing constantly. Whereas when I started to talking to women, it was more about connection. It was more real and authentic and it was beautiful. And I became more myself on those calls. And it took me a while to realize this. I was like, why am I feeling so much more excited talking to women than I do with men?
Because it's starting to show how far you've actually wandered without realizing.
That's right. That's right. And I kind of built this version of me that was not me.
Yeah.
I was kind of like a bit of a man.
Yeah, exactly.
Because I had to be. I was working in a male dominated space and you have to build this set of armor.
You have to. And I think that's where the catch 22 lies as we were talking about before. Right. You kind of have to be. But we also have to be because we all keep doing it and pressing. Subscribe, subscribe, subscribe. So, yes, we have to be, but there's a point where we get to take ownership and instead of being like, yes, we have to in this world, be like, hold on, we are, you know, we're just perpetuating this storyline and we're modeling it to the next generations.
I am. I had a really funny call last week. I just started working with two incredible female founders in Australia building an amazing business. And they were like, we just want a female CFO to help us with some stuff. And I was like, I'm your woman. I had a call with a guy on the other side of the phone last week and he was like, don't be afraid to get the stick out. And after that, he just dropped off. And I was like, ladies, don't be afraid to get the stick out.
And we were like, what?
Like, it's just not how we women talk. No, it just isn't. And it's just a little bit. Yeah, it's just very different.
So how do you marry that? Because I couldn't agree more. And I think more alignment with who you are is necessary to actually co create and collaborate and relate to to others in an authentic way. But how do you marry that? And the saying, okay, this feels more real and it's more about impact and vision with, I don't know, rewinding the clock five minutes, being about it needs to be numbers and facts and we're freeing up resources for growth. I feel like they feel to me like a person, opposing forces, and you seem to marry those very well in your work where you're helping female founders navigate this world of finance. So how, how do you see that dance between the two? Because growth, for the sake of growth, it breaks. I, I have something with words today. It's, it's been all day, it's terrible. I promise you. I do speak some, a little bit.
Yeah. I think that it's really interesting, the idea that you can, with the right language and the right tools, that you can grow something and you can grow it to the same degree that a guy could grow it. Right. I love the idea that I can share my knowledge. I think that's really important. I, I don't know how, but I've always believed that there's no, there's no kind of purpose in dropping all of the experience that you've had to change and do something different. Right. So there wasn't a part of me that said, okay, I'm going to start a business, but to do that I'm going to have to forget my past. Right? No, I think my past informs who I am today. Very. Yeah, it's where I am. And so like even my PhD, my PhD in corporate finance is about how do we get businesses to be more sustainable. And I remember writing my thesis proposal and I sent it to the University of Auckland. And I remember on my interview one of the professors was like, well, it's kind of radical.
So radicals, sustainable business.
Oh no, circular economy. Me think what? And then fast forward six months later, after Covert, people were like, can you tell me about your research? This is incredible. And so at the time I really wanted to do something that was very important to me and that was looking after the planet, like doing something that left a place better than it was. And I thought initially that I had to go and study like a degree in sustainability. And actually I did start a degree in sustainability.
Oh God. And I hated it.
And I was like, wait, why do I have to start from the beginning? Why can't I just like, sure, combine the money to change the world and I know about money, so can I just do that together?
And of course, and that's, I mean, more than anything, impact driven businesses, more than any other type of business I've seen and person I've seen and interacted with, have this extra layer of belief that if your goal as a charity or a business or a person is to help out, that you should not make money because that makes you evil. Well, I know it's ridiculous, but there is this, like, you know, money is like. There's this. This dichotomy.
But let me. Let me just throw this one at you. If a person who has all these beautiful qualities and wants to change the world had more money, wouldn't they help more people?
Exactly. But it's that, you know, it's that mindset. It's that belief that it's quite stagnant.
But where does that come from? I feel like that comes from. I really like this conversation because I feel like that conversation comes from a place where people want excuses for being poor. Oof.
Tell me more.
Well, it's got to be. It's an excuse.
I will. I'll see your excuse or I'll see your hypothesis and I'll raise you up.
Raise me. Go.
I wish I had some poker chips here. Don't even know how to play poker, but I feel like that's a poker reference. I'm not sure I hear you. People want an excuse to stay poor. I think it is. If they were to let go of that excuse, they would have to face off with the responsibility of what they'd have to do to change their circumstance. So it's easier to stay in a victim mindset of. It is because of A, B, and C that I can't. I don't think anyone actively chooses to be poor. I think the poor is the. Is the. The little, like, bush behind. Behind which they hide.
Yeah.
So they don't have to see. Oh, now I actually need to step it up because if it's really up to me, that's it.
And then I have to do something about it. I. I'm all. I believe all of that. There's also this really interesting belief that people think the people with the 1% of wealth are, like, evil. Okay? Like, they are responsible for covert and vaccines and all the drama and everything. It also comes from a place of believing that money is. Is scarce.
Oh, yes. Like, there's a finite 1% of people. I mean, and I believe that. I mean, the. The irony of that especially, it's.
It's.
It's, again, money mindset. Things get fucking drilled into us from childhood. Money doesn't grow on trees. It literally does. It's paper, and they print more and more of it every fucking second. It's worth less and less every two minutes. So, I mean, it literally grows on trees. But it's that. That belief of like and that's in general, you know, when you're saying what fun to be counted is about in terms of linking arms and making that accessible and rewriting what is possible. Like the same is true for that. It's like for what I do in terms of there is such a scarcity mindset. Even in the highest echelons of entrepreneurship and foundership, there's still this idea of I get funding, you don't. If I succeed or if you succeed, then there's not less for me. And there's that it creates a, a world where people are growing up in nuclear families. You know, the idea of the village is gone. Of like asking for support or collaboration or being vulnerable or I don't know, God forbid, have emotions or have this physical response is weakness. So it's all built to disconnect us from each other, from ourselves, from the natural rhythms of the universe. It's, it's ridiculous.
But then the other thing happens, which is they also believe that the mountain is too high to climb and it stops people, brilliant people with ideas from ever starting. I think that's the sad part. And I think that if we focused, I really do believe that if we focused more on the amazing achievements that badass women are having out there, that we could, we could be lifted and motivated in a way that's different from how we're focusing, focusing our attention today. And it all comes from the Rogers. The Roger Bannister effect.
I do not know Roger Bannister effect, but tell me.
So Roger sponsors. Roger Bannister is an athlete. He ran a mile under four minutes.
Oh yeah, the four minute mile. Yes.
So since he did that, 2,000 other athletes did it.
Yeah, because they believed it was physically possible. Well, therefore it was.
Exactly. They didn't just overnight become really fast. No, they believed that they were shown away. Do you know that? Interesting. Those 2,000 are all men. And so if a woman did it, I wonder what would happen then. And so I wonder whether if we keep focusing on all these incredible women that are paving the way, that are changing the rules, that are showing us how to do it, that we are shown that we, if they can do it, we can do.
Yes, I agree. And where I get stuck is the top of the mountain versus people who feel like you say the mountain is too big to climb. I feel if we only shine a light on the stories of look, I made it. I'm on the top of the mountain. How amazing. You can do it too. Without actually, actually saying, hey, I took that road and I rested there and oh my God, I fell and I nearly didn't get up there. And this, that is what we're doing in. Well, not here. Here we're doing the opposite. But that is what we're doing in, in the world where we do share the stories. It's all hashtag, I woke up like this. This is, you know, I got an I exit. And not at you, but, you know, 14 exit. And so many millions. And I've got so many millions. And if you're sitting there by yourself with your laptop and you're like, you have your vision and you maybe have a few people remotely and maybe you've, you know, you've hit your first target, but you're like, great, like, yay, you're up there. I know it's possible. How the.
Well, and so I agree. I think that the mountain is a different size for different people at different times in their lives. I think that. I'm not saying let's only shine the light on the people that are building unicorns. I'm saying let's shine the light on all the fucking women who are doing incredible stuff like falling over, making mistakes, but getting up again, building their third business, being insolvent.
Let's talk.
Let's shine the light on that.
I promise, guys, I didn't pay her to be the ad girl for the Powerhouse Diaries, but here we are.
Thank you. And it's. But, but that's what I mean. Let's not focus on our limitations. Let's focus on the fact that women are getting up there and they're trying and they're doing these incredible things.
When it comes to financing, which is really your, your field of expertise, what are those foundations that every female founder, no matter where she is on the mountain or if she's on this speed bump down the road, just looking at the mountain, should know and understand about their business. What are the, like, the non negotiables in like, layman's terms?
The absolute non negotiable is knowing the ins and outs of your cash. Okay, okay.
It is like the ins and outs of your cash, as in, where is it going?
Spending your money, how much is coming in? And I would say that any FEMA founder starting out, like, just. It's really basic. It's like all you need is your bank statement. Just have a look at what's coming in, what's coming out, and what your cash balance is that day and get the feel.
Because don't look away, guys.
Don't look away. And don't be. Don't be that one that like signs up to all those subscriptions and you have all these costs coming out. Like, oh my God, I only looked at my cash flow today. It's been three weeks and I have less, way less than I thought. And it's because you signed up to a whole bunch of subscriptions and AI tools and all these other things. That's what I mean by like, I.
Love that three weeks is your like, worst case scenario. You're like, I didn't do that for 10 months and nearly went bankrupt. To be fair, neither my, my CFO didn't catch that either. But okay, three weeks. No. Young 23 weeks, guys. That's super long.
Weekly. Okay, so it's a really, it's a five minute task and you can do it with a cup of coffee on a Tuesday because usually bank feeds come in on a Tuesday. I would, I have a really useful cash flow tool, really simple one that I can share with anyone. Yes. If they want to email me, I can send it to them. And it all it does is helps you get control. Because what is cash? It's, it's just something that's there that you need to utilize. Don't let it run out of control. It's like, it's like you taking your kid to the, to the mall. If you don't watch them.
Yeah.
You're going to lose your kid.
Yeah.
Same with cash. So I think it's really important that you get sticky with your cash. Like keep it close. And if you do this exercise every Tuesday in the morning with a cup of coffee or something like that, I think that you will feel less anxious.
Spend a lot on coffee.
You will spend a lot of coffee. You can expense that 50% entertainment. You will, you will feel less anxious, you'll feel closer to the numbers. And honestly, if you're talking to investors and they ask you that question, how much cash have you got in the bank? If you don't know the answer, you, you're dead in the water.
Right. Right. Okay. So cash. Know your cash. What's the other foundation that you need to understand? Because if we're all swimming in cash, we're not talking to investors. Like, you need to have a handle on it.
You need a handle on it. Even if, even if you have a hundred dollars. Right. You really need to have.
No, I'm not saying, like, let's not. I'm saying we're going to investors because we want to make more wiggle room and more room to play with.
Yeah. So if you're going to investors, but also just trying to run your business. I think you. One of the really key tools for you is to learn how to read a profit and loss like really important.
Yeah.
What am I saying by that? I'm saying, do you understand why your revenue is what it is? Do you know what's driving that? Do you know that you spend how much to drive that revenue? Like, if you have a online product business, how much did you spend to get that $1,000? Did you spend $900? Okay, what is.
Or $2,000? Sometimes.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Because sometimes you have to spend money in the beginning.
And I do believe, I do believe in the principle. As someone who is always bootstrapped and nearly went bankrupt and still managed to build and sell a business of that skill, you have to spend money to make money. And I think one of the biggest mistakes I made in my first big business was I was so tight with my cash that I would just wait until I had at least the confirmed revenues coming in, signed and sealed, before I would invest. Which means I was always running after the fact. I was always chasing my own tail. I was always hiring too late or investing just after I. I had a need, but I needed to secure the funds first. And I think that is one of my biggest learnings from that first business that I may have taken too far a little bit here and there at times where I'm like, actually waiting till it's there.
So you had the money. Yeah. This is interesting. I work, I work with a couple of founders, and they're in a similar boat where they're, like, preserving their cash because they know they only have a limited finite amount. They're still trying to generate revenue enough to cover their costs. And they're like, oh, should. Should I get the revenue first or should I get investment first? Should I, Should I. You know, and they're really trying to figure that one out because I know it's. It's a lot to give away a percentage of your business to investors. It's also a lot to have to manage them. And I get that. But the one thing I'd say is speed is really important in today's world. Like, if you've got a business idea and it's a tech business, for example, predominantly tech, and. Or actually, it doesn't really matter anymore. People are building things really fast. Yeah. If you are going to just take the slow road, you risk the, you know, the business falling flat because someone else raised 50 billion and could, like, accelerate across the globe.
Right, right.
So I Think it, it's. I think you need to follow your intuition on that one. I think there's a difference between fear and intuition. I think if your intuition is telling you freaking, you got to do this now. Yeah.
Actually, one of my favorite things that I tell all of my clients and remind myself of frequently is that fear and excitement are the exact same frequency. Like we know, like scientifically proven. Guys. Don't worry, I'm not being a witchy girl. Well, I mean, I am, but not right now. That emotions have certain frequencies and we are just, you know, energy, like atoms moving, vibrating. Thank you. At a certain frequency, fear and excitement are the exact same frequency. The only thing that determines whether we experience it as fear or as excitement is the meaning we assign to it. So when, how do you know, like, oh, are you moving or not moving out of fear or is it excitement? Because anything in the unknown. Right. Is going to feel unfamiliar because it's unknown. And I think the biggest, like somatic cue I can give anyone is just if you close your eyes and imagine taking that leap, whatever that is, do you feel like somatically on a physical level, do you feel like a contraction, a like hiding away or an expansion of like, bring it on?
Yeah.
And that is, that's the differentiator. That's how subtle it is. And that's why, for example, mind alone. Because your mind can convince you. I can tell you it's protecting you.
Yeah.
First of all, your ego's job is to keep you exactly where you are because that's safe. Do anything new and it can also, especially, you know, being a high achieving, intelligent woman, which everyone here is, give you a very convincing reasoning on any angle to the same subject. And you'd be like, yeah, that makes sense. This is blue. No, this is green.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So, yeah, there is another, another way of looking at it, which is this sort of Carol Dweck growth mindset way, which is like push yourself to do something that you would ordinarily not do. That takes you out of your comfort zone.
Yes.
And I think after the exercise, I think you're right. There's an element of like, if it's, if it's contraction, then something's telling you it's probably not a good idea. But if you feel expansion, the thing that will take you to action, I feel is this idea that just fucking do it. Just push yourself. Like you don't know what's going to happen. You live once.
Yeah, I heard this story and this is not aligned with my personal belief system. But I love the story of it. Like just the storytelling element. And the story is that when we die, the version of us that we became comes face to face with the version of us we could have been. And that idea can either be very terrifying or really exciting. And I think for me, it was a very terrifying notion that, that, that could be a very different version because I didn't. I could have been all these things, but I didn't because of fear. So for me, that is something. Even though that is not necessarily how I envisioned this happening. But the. One of my goals is like the. I want to make that gap as small as possible. The. The potential, the unmet potential, unrealized potential that is here in any given moment. I want to maximize it as much as I can.
Absolutely. I actually, I use something similar, which is sitting down and writing the story. If I. If I'm on my last day, if I wrote the story from the end of my life, what would that story look like? And I think that's a really exciting thing because it means that you can pave the way to creating that life that you want to create. So very similar.
But yeah, I love that. Okay. The foundations, you need to keep a. Keep your cash tied. You read a P, L, learn how.
To read a pin out.
Right.
Okay. So P and L, profit and loss.
Yes.
Every single business has one. Yes. Okay. Some of them are really straightforward and simple. Some of them are really complex. But if you have a business, you have one, you're going to. You're going to ask you how. You have to ask yourself, like, how do those numbers get in there? That's. That's what I do. This is what I love.
Yeah.
This is like the. I will pick your brain. Any female founder that I work, I'm going to pick you. I'm going to pick every single one of those numbers and I'm going to find out, how did they get in there? Like, why did you spend that much money on X? Like, what did it do for your business? Where did it add value? What driver did it do? Did it add to revenue? Did it. Is it just the cost that you need for operations? And we dissect it. So dissect it. Because if you dissect your profit and loss, you're actually doing the hard work. You're understanding exactly what's moving through your business.
Do you know that? Do you feel that that is something people struggle with? Like, because even as you're saying it, and I'm in full agreement, I'm like, oh, like, just I. I feel this. Oh, wait, hold on, hold on. Like, it feels almost like. Not in the way you're doing it. Well, not a big job, but also, it's very confronting.
Yes. Yes, it is.
It's very confronting.
Yeah.
How do you. What is your advice for people and me. But what's your advice for people who are like, okay, fine, I'm listening, Candace. I'm doing the thing. I'm. I'm getting a handle my money, my cash. I'm going to learn how to read a P and L, and I'm going to learn how to actually turn those numbers into. I had three apples and that I gave four to John instead of, like, understand what was moving. But that can feel quite exposing. There's something kind of, I guess, vulnerable around that. How would you. I've coached someone through any resistance that comes up around dissecting that.
Do you know what the. It's actually. If you don't have someone sort of guiding you through that process, it can be quite confronting. I tell you what, though, like, do it two, three times. I will guarantee you'll feel relief. And so much more control over numbers. I only had to do it. So I had a female founder that I worked with recently, and she would say to me, oh, my gosh, this is just too much. And all I did was open up a spreadsheet, and I said, just, Just. Just wear a different coat today. Today you're gonna just listen and you don't have to do anything else. And it took two or three times, but, like, by the third time, she was like, oh, my God. For the first time in my career, she's 50. For the first time, I feel comfortable talking about numbers. And so all that means is that you can learn to do it. And it's not really that bad. It's the same as opening up your bank balance. It's the same thing. It's like understanding where your money's going. But how does it drive the business? The reason why it's a bit scary is because if you think about it, what I'm asking you is, how are you driving revenue? And that can be a bit like, oh, maybe I'm not doing it well.
I think that's it. I think people are as hard as it is to talk about money, but because we are not taught how to be financially literate, let alone fluent. And there is a shame around it, a fear of judgment, like, I should know better. I'm this old, or I might. I haven't been like, I should know better. And it Feels kind of exposing a weakness which is there for a reason we haven't been taught. So let's change that. But that's why it can feel scary.
100. I read something recently, I can't remember who did the research, but 72% of female founders cite that financial literacy was their biggest challenge. That's incredible. Yeah, that's massive. Because it means that it's holding them back from explaining the numbers to interest the parties if they want to invest. Yeah, it's holding them back from actually building sustainable businesses. So when I say sustainable, I mean companies that can maintain cash. Yeah. And, and so I think like, it's just pushing yourself through that easiness.
I think it's also, you know, especially as female founders, we, I don't know, actually, I think that's just founders. But you know, our, our businesses are our babies. Right. We, we have a vision and we often sacrifice a lot to make that happen because like founder life isn't necessarily for everyone. And I think poking at those numbers is kind of like someone going, but how many times a day do you feed your baby? And oh wait, you gave her yogurt. Oh, you gave her.
Was the sugar in that?
Was there sugar in that? Was that like organically farmed with only left handed blind mice? No.
Okay.
Yeah. But it, it feels like, you know, that that's kind of just dichotomy like, oh, you're, there's that judgment. So I think taking that away and also saying like here out loud, and you've seen this, I'm sure, everywhere, that even like as someone who built a multimillion dollar business, a multinational business, I still find that scary and I still get that like protective like energy of like, oh no, wait, no, I'm doing everything. Are you going to tell me that I've been, you know, giving my child, you know, crack or neglecting words, neglecting it, and I should know better or.
You should know your numbers better.
Exactly. So let this be this. If this conversation can be anything, let it be the permission slip for anyone listening to be exactly where they are. And that is where you start. And there's nothing wrong with that.
And I think I agree. I think there's shame is the shame amongst women with finance is really holding them back. I think it's important to say that it's not your fault, it's the system's.
Fault, but it is our responsibility to change the game.
That's right. Exactly. And so we have a choice now and that is to just push ourselves into learning. Learning More about finance, putting it at the forefront of our game and understanding it. Because it, you know, I usually explain finances, this massive funnel and everything that goes on in the business. It doesn't matter what it is. If you hire a person, if you go set up another legal entity, if you go send a product to Japan, it doesn't matter what it is. If you buy a coffee from down the road, it all funnels down into finance. There's absolutely nothing you can do in your business that I wouldn't see Nothing. So it is fundamental to, to grasp it, to understand it.
And I think when you do, it also takes that internalized toxic shame which is very debilitating and, and turns it into a hype word that I hate, but it's appropriate if I can remember it today, but into a sense of empowerment. Because once you do and once you know that you're overspending on your coffees every Tuesday because you're looking at the, at the numbers or you have 17 overlapping AI tools or you forget to cancel. Sorry, ADHD founder here. Like two week trial and suddenly accidentally committed to a yearly subscription subscription like you.
Yes, yes.
I don't know where I got those examples. That would never happen to me. Not all. They've happened to me all the time. But it makes you feel so good when you get a grip on this. Some parting words because we can do this forever. And we have dinner plans by the way, guys, like, side note, we started by saying we met 60 seconds in the lobby during a break of a. Yeah. Of a woman's event. And I invited Candace to not just come on the podcast, but I was like, oh, I'm going to this Auckland startup week dinner tonight, maybe join me. She's like, yeah, but I, I live in Ragland, which is a two and a half hour for those not in New Zealand. Two and a half fish hour drive. I'm like, oh, well, do you want to stay the night at my place? Like my daughter's not there. You can stay in her room. And I mean if we talk about, you know, the, the instant connection, I mean I might be a serial killer. She might. But I've now said it on camera. But it's, it's, that's the, the kind of connection. It would be weird if a guy did that.
It just. Exactly.
I just wouldn't say yes.
I would not say yes.
No, that sounds unsafe. Any final words? Any like finance misconceptions that must die right now. Anything that everyone listening, you're just has to understand when it comes to finance.
And funding every great business idea deserves to be successful. And I think that. I think that you, you can absolutely have a chance at raising capital. I don't believe in all those limitations. I think that you can just build incredible narrative, have a sound financial strategy, and anyone can do it. There's not one single person that cannot do it.