Faith, Leadership & Working Dogs with SFC Barratt | SOURCE

Hey, I want to welcome everybody back to The Source Podcast. This Friday we have an amazing guest that's with us. We're in a unique situation right now because we're both traveling, but we made time to bring everybody together even though we're in a unique place. We're going to make it work one way or another, right?

Yes, sir.

All right. I'm here with Cody Barrett, a good friend of mine now, and somebody that I've grown fond with to the point that even after meeting him and listening to him talk and share not just his story, but his knowledge and seeing how he deals with the people he's in charge with, it hit me like a ton of bricks that we need to do a podcast on leadership. I couldn't have picked a better person. Fast forward a few weeks and we're here.

Yes, sir.

We made it work, right?

Yes, sir.

So we just happen to be in Columbia, South Carolina. Traveled, we both traveled, met kind of in the middle.

Yeah.

And now we're here ready to get this show on the road in a pretty busy lobby. So avoid all the excess noise. Cody, tell us a little bit about your story, like a little bit about your background and Where you're from, how do we end up here today?

All right. Born and raised in Defiance, Ohio. Joined the military straight out of high school to be a military police officer. The plan was 5 years, get free college, and go be a civilian cop somewhere. That was it. Didn't come from a military family or anything like that. Had some family members who served, but nobody who has served to the extent that I have at this point. As I was going through basic training, they call it OSUT, One Station Unit Training, where you do your basic and advanced individual job training all in one to be an MP.

Yeah.

They came into my basic training company and they were like, hey, who wants to be a dog handler? Everybody raised their hand. I was like, that seems pretty cool. A little hesitant just because you don't know ever what you're signing up for. You're taught when you come in the military, be careful volunteering for things. I raised my hand because I grew up with dogs. So we used to have hunting dogs. It was something that I really enjoyed as a kid. and I had a drill sergeant at the time who was a former dog handler. Okay. He was talking us through the whole thing. And so I raised my hand. There was probably about 60 people and they were only taking 10.

Wow.

At that time they were only taking 10 cuz they were trying to get all of these junior level soldiers to fill the ammo up. They were pretty selective on it. They looked at your line scores. The big one was the GT. I was always good at PT, so that's one of the reasons I got selected for it. Fast forward, I finish up my AIT to be an MP. I go through dog school down in, uh, San Antonio and then get sent right back to Fort Leonard Wood to be a dog handler. So did Fort Leonard Wood as a handler, deployed a couple times out of there, did Alaska, both installations in Alaska, Fort Richardson and then Fort Wainwright. Uh, went to Fort Bliss, which was my first duty assignment where I was no longer physically working a dog. I was just in operations at that point and had a really good mentor there that kind of opened my eyes to different types of leadership, completely different than my style at that point in my young career. Yes, yes.

Okay.

And then got my first chance to be an actual kennel master over in Iraq in 2022, promoted while I was there. Now I am the kennel master at Fort Leavenworth, Kansas, the 67th, which is where you guys come to do the tracking course where we met and really got to know each other. Yeah, would not have expected myself to be here almost 13 years later as a kennel master. But, you know, coming up in K9 in the, specifically in the Army, you, you see your kennel masters and that is the highlight. That's the goal. That's, you know, when you're really obsessed with working dogs and stuff like that in the Army, kennel master's the best job you can have. And so as I got used to the Army, that was my goal. I wanna be a kennel master. 'cause you have so much influence. And so, yeah, that's where we are now. It's been a journey for sure.

I heard you say that, you know, when even a few weeks ago where you said you, you really have the best job right now where you're at, right?

Absolutely.

And, and you echoed the point that you have the opportunity to influence soldiers right now.

Yes.

Absolutely. And that's your love, your passion.

Yeah, that is, that's truly my passion. Since CalMaster, you, are responsible for the entire operation. You have leaders in life no matter what you're doing. And that's in this position as CalMaster, you can have so much influence, good or bad, on those people who are assigned to your organization. So for me, the goal is always to have the biggest impact on the most amount of people that I can have. That's what that is. Okay.

Nice. Obviously, we started this by telling everybody this is a podcast. Today's episode is about leadership, and, you know, it's important that— because there's— I guess it's important to understand that there's a lot of different styles out there, and I don't think there's one handbook that tells us step by step how to do that. First and foremost, we want to leave somebody today with some points they can apply. Maybe they have an opportunity to be a leader, or they're already in a leadership role. I've seen firsthand your leadership style. In my long career, a lot of different leaders I've worked under, been influenced by, or even came in contact with. But even from the MWD program, I've seen a lot of kennel masters and been privileged to see how they run their kennels. We're here today because I saw your style. I saw how you deal with your soldiers. I'm in a unique position because I hear soldiers that are not around you. And what they say. Most times they get comfortable with us after spending countless hours training or a month with people, and they begin to tell you things and express their opinions. Because of that, I know what I was seeing wasn't a show, but truly who you were. And I also saw your heart, and that's important to me. That's the type of people I gravitate towards. And I think we can all say that we gravitate towards a certain type of person because we have a connection. And that was pretty instantaneous. Right? It's not hard to forge a relationship when it's people that are like-minded. And that's what I got with you really quick. Was able to build a relationship and start to build upon that and really get to see and hear your thoughts, even when it was just me and you talking. That's why we're sitting here today. But I wanna start off with you defining what you see as leadership. How would you define that word leadership?

I think that changes as you grow older and gain more wisdom. If you would ask me that question just 4 or 5 years ago, I would have given you a different answer, but I truly think it's setting the standard that you want and living that standard, right? It's not just telling people what they need to do, but you're also living that, you know, 24/7 in the work environment, out of the work environment, and it's building solid relationships. With those that you work with, getting to know them. It's not just being a leader and a manager or supervisor, but to truly be a leader, you have to set that example. You have to bust your tail every single day and you have to care for the people that you're leading. It's not just a job when you're talking about leadership. It's something that you have to live out every single day, no matter how you feel. Actually, it helps to have a passion for it. Building those relationships and truly having empathy and care for other people, I think that's what leadership truly is to me. Being able to work towards a goal as a whole and motivate everybody to focus on that. But at the same time, you know, everyone's at a different spot. Leadership to me is being able to meet people where they're at, to get them to work towards that goal as a whole and as an individual.

Which is pretty unique because you don't hear a lot of people come from that perspective per se. A leader can take on many different forms and different styles. But it's not often that you hear a leader really say that they're doing what they do because they want to influence and make others better. Really, a lot of perspective is, well, how can my people make me better? Although we want to say, okay, we're going to lead from the front. Sometimes that's a dictatorship. Sometimes that's through other forms of motivation. But that unique perspective that says, I just want to make this person better and get that buy-in from everybody else. Without necessarily using force or compulsion? How do you navigate that role to build those relationships so people truly trust you? Because if they trust you, they're going to follow you to the ends of the earth. Which leads me into— because I know you, and a lot of people listening to this may not know, but you're a Christian. And so how does your faith pay— play into that role as a leader?

Yeah, so like I said, it's all about growth. I've always believed in Jesus Christ, our Lord and Savior, but it wasn't until the last 2 years where I was, I was always passionate about leadership as a whole. And I just was always trying to look for how can I be a better leader? How can I help my organization? How can I help this kid or that soldier or whatever it may be? And it wasn't until, you know, I truly, you know, stopped focusing so much on that leadership stuff, built a relationship with the Lord and those kind of characteristics and values and beliefs that, you know, we as Christians are supposed to have kind of molded me into the leader that I am today. And the biggest one, like we were saying before, is the empathy, right? To truly caring for people, understanding where they're coming from. That's the biggest part because my faith is everything, right? That's number one priority in my life. And so when you focus on that, the Lord gives you the desires of your heart, right? Especially if those are going to bless other people and show other people who he is. Trying to live day to day, and I'm not perfect. I made many mistakes coming up as a leader, but being able to realize that and accept that I need the Lord to do the things I'm passionate about and do them to glorify him. So I think that's how I navigate it, just putting him first and seeking him out for wisdom. I'm not going on my own beliefs or what I think is the right thing for whatever situation.

Or your emotions.

My emotions, right? Not being a reactive leader or quick to respond, but seeking out the Lord for wisdom. That's been huge for me and molded me into who I am today.

And I think that's what a lot of people don't understand, right? Like, I didn't realize how bad I really was until I found Christ. I was a great community person. I served my community in law enforcement. I did my job well. I was a go-getter. I tried to stand up above everybody else with stats and everything else I did. Um, I was moral, but the biggest revelation to me was the way that I looked at people. Everybody's bad. My goals were to get the stats place people in jail, do whatever it took, step on whoever I needed to raise my position. And I had no empathy or sympathy for anybody else. And I think once the Lord came into my life, I figured out that, man, I'm—

my heart—

and I use this term, but this is the way I see it in my own head— that my heart was black. It was as rough as it got, right? It wasn't until I found Christ and I realized how bad I really was. It wasn't from the outward appearance. It was really how I started caring for people and how it really made a difference on how this person felt in a way that I may have spoken to them or the way my actions may have influenced them. But also from a standpoint of running a business that, you know, it's not really about how much we grow in profit, it's how much everybody else around me grows. Personally. We've got to have professional growth, but we also really need to be focusing on our personal growth. And as a leader, I feel like if we don't do that and we don't inspire people to do that, we're no better than anybody else that they would work for, they may have in their lives. We need to really push because that's what Christ gives us. He gives us a different heart. For those that don't understand what that means, You can't until you know the Lord, right?

Absolutely. That's a thing that we've talked about. It's not the cool thing. It's not the popular thing. It's something that you do on your own. My job as a Christian and as a leader is to set that example for other people to ask, how is he like that? How is he able to do all of these things that he's doing? How is he able to stay so calm all the time? It's because of the Lord, right? And it's something everyone's got to figure out for themselves. Long before I was saved, And I mean, I had my wife, I had other people around me who cared about me trying to tell me these things, and I just did not want to do it. I was trying to do everything on my own because I was like, there's nothing that I can't accomplish. And that's not a terrible mindset, but at the same time, the word of God tells us that we are supposed to lean on the Lord. What you think you can accomplish without him, you have no idea what you can accomplish with him. If I could count the times where I thought I knew what the right thing to do was and the Lord kind of just shook me and took me in the complete opposite direction and ended up being the right way, I wouldn't have ended up at Fort Leavenworth in such a great organization that I'm in now and be, you know, reassured that that is 100% where I was meant to be at this time in my life. Realizing it's not about me as the leader of the organization. It's not about you, right? It's about It's about the success of the organization. And if the people in that organization are successful, then the organization's gonna be successful. So, you know, really honing in and focusing on taking care of people, loving people. We're all come from the same God. We're all created by the one true King. And you know, when you realize that, like it changed me. Before, you know, the way you talk to people, man, I would never have talked to people like that if I truly knew the Lord.

Yeah.

So like there, there's people who know me from before my BC days. They're like, what'd you call it? BC days, before Christ, right? And you know, they'll talk, oh yeah, I know him, he's super mean and he's angry all the time. I'm not that person anymore, and the only thing that I can credit for that is the Lord. Yeah, because he's given me a new heart and softened my heart. It doesn't mean I'm a soft individual because I believe God, but He's just given me a new way to look at things, a new way to look at people that, you know, you got to meet them where they're at and make them successful.

It's funny that you bring that up because you say the Lord gave you a different perspective and a way to look at things. Coming up, I didn't come from money, started a business with a shoestring budget, scrapping, pulling out from me, and the amount of miracles that were performed to get us to where we are today. I met a man from Leavenworth that I would have never met if it wasn't for dogs and this whole orchestration of pieces getting put together to get us to sit right here and be able to talk. That's a miracle in and of itself. But on top of that, just the things I saw in my life that nobody else would ever believe, and they would attribute to miracles or luck, right? Now I know exactly where all these blessings came from and the reasons why I had turmoil and had to get over some hurdles. But the perspective of how I look at things, I struggled a long time, especially starting a new business with depression and not being able to cope with the many things we get hit with as a leader. And I say as a leader, you know, in your situation, you're getting hit from top and bottom and the sides, but how you deal with those things and the perspective that you gain from Christ is vastly different than I think everybody else would teach you how to deal with those. I've heard everything from just, hey, be a man, you know, stick it out, or suck it up is a phrase that I hear often. Just get over it or just don't worry about it. But human nature is we're going to worry about things. I just think back to all those times the wife and I were having a conversation not too long ago, and it was about something going on and it wasn't the best situation. And I told her, what is there to worry about? Everything gets taken care of. Just turn to prayer and who we trust in most, and everything works its way out. It always does. And that's exactly what happened. Yeah. And taking some time and not allowing anger and emotions to take over. I have a thing— Simon will laugh about this when he hears it— of a 24-hour rule. Anything that gives me a little bit of anger or pushes my buttons, I always take 24 hours before I answer an email, before I make a phone call, just so that I can gather my thoughts, get my emotions out of the way, and address things in a way that's level-headed, if you will, right? Yeah, because I don't want to show in ways that doesn't bring light to him. And even in business, sometimes it's not the most popular decision, especially when you talk about numbers and stuff with business, but It's always served me well to go that way.

Yeah.

In your experience, you saying that brings a lot to me as well and triggers a lot of things in my head looking back over the years on really doing what, what he would have us to do, seeking that guidance from him.

Yeah. And it's all about having faith in him. That's what the whole Christian belief is in, is believing in the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. It's funny because, you know, we are licensed for our church and our parlor, and last week when we were talking about the Bible. I pulled it up, Matthew 6:34. It says, so don't worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will bring its own worries. Today's trouble is enough for today. We were talking about that and what that means, right? Because that's the thing about reading the word of God is trying to figure out what does he mean. To me, it's like it's all about faith, right? Having faith, put your faith in the Lord. He's going to take care of whatever it is to come, right? Deal with today. I mean, that alone as a leader, right? You can't worry about what other people are going to say. You can't worry about how we're going to make this happen. You just got to believe in what the Lord has given you, what wisdom and guidance and opportunities he's given you, and that he's equipped you, right? Just like when he sent out the disciples and they didn't feel like they were ready. You just got to have faith and seek the Lord for that wisdom.

That's great. 100% resonates with things that I've dealt with, and it's not easy being in a position where people depend on you. And I know a lot of people want to open up businesses or be in your shoes, and the position is just a position, right? But it's not all celebrations and glory. We can make Facebook posts. Yeah. Show it on Instagram, all the great things that you're doing. But there's a lot of things that go on outside those posts and those things that the outside world sees.

And I'm even guilty of it when I was a young dog handler looking at my leaders like, oh, I wouldn't have done it that way. Or they're not doing anything. They don't care about what I got going on. Unfortunately, that might be the case some places, but I know there's quite a few really good leaders that I associate with program, people who have gotten out that, you know, they're the hardest workers in any organization that they're in. Sometimes it's just because you can't see what's going on doesn't mean that there's not stuff going on behind the scenes. So, and it's funny because some of my soldiers sometimes will talk about, they don't understand how everything around us can seem like it's going wrong and I'm so calm. And that's just the Lord. I used to be the one who was running around worrying about all of these things that need to get done. And you know, there's just a sense of peace that comes with it when your faith is in the Lord.

A peace that you can't explain, try to put into words. All the chaos around you and it's just like, shit could be on fire. I'm good.

Dancing.

That's a good word. So here's a number one question for you. Are leaders born or can we create leaders?

We had, we talked about this before and I've been thinking about it. I knew you were gonna ask me this one. Simply put, leaders can be built. We, we, we take that term born literally, like from the first day of life. There's things that happen to you throughout your life. How you view those things or react or recover from them all go into who you are at this point in time. That's why I lean more towards the built thing. It's all about how you embrace the adversity, whether you're gonna get something out of that situation or opportunity, or it's just gonna pass you by. So I think it was a constant building process. It's something that you have to be ready for, embrace, not shy away from. Because we all have a story that got us to where we are. But I think the big difference is that resilience and how you respond to those things that happen to you throughout your life and use them for good. They can go into being built into a leader.

Okay.

It starts before, you know, for me, before the military has to do with how I was brought up. And the challenges that, you know, I went through and everyone's got one of those stories, but you know, I can look back and, you know, that's all what made me to who I am today. I would say definitely leaders can be built.

I like that perspective. As I formulated these questions, you know, I had to reflect a little bit into what I believe too, right? I think there's certain Certain characteristics and certain personalities lend to that, but I think you're absolutely right. You're not naturally a leader. You take those experiences that you've had and built that into where you are today to be that leader. I can see that perspective because of those experiences that we deal with and taking from the good and bad, right? I've had great leaders. I've had not so great leaders. I don't say they were bad because I learned something from them. Maybe something I won't do or something I saw that negatively affected my personality or someone else's personality. But at the end of the day, I learned something from them, so it was worth it.

Yeah, absolutely. I've done tons of those experiences.

But you were acutely aware of the learning experience you, you could take from it versus just brushing it off and not learning from it.

Yeah, I think it's a waste of time if you find yourself working under someone who you don't feel is a good leader and you feel like there's nothing you can learn from the situation. Yeah, you're wasting potentially years of working with that person. Then looking at it from the glass half full, there's something I can learn from this individual. And as harsh as it might sound, it's, but it's what I don't want to be or how I wouldn't handle a situation. Right. And I'll say there's also sometimes when I look back on, you know, my career and there was times where I said that, and at this point in my life, due to life I understand where they were coming from. And I think that's a super important perspective when you're looking at those appointed above you. Everyone's got a different perspective and you might not always understand why they made the decision that they made or acted the way they acted, but trying to understand that and reflect on it, sometimes you'll be given some insight into that and some wisdom on that. So I think that's super important. You know, take something from everybody and you can take it from multiple people. There's good and bad things from certain individuals. Even myself, I would hope that people can learn from. If I have someone that I'm working with or someone I meet that doesn't like me, that's okay. Not everyone's for everybody, but hopefully you learn something. Hopefully you learn and you develop yourself over, hey, I don't want to be like Barry, and that's okay. But if you can't waste that time, that's precious time that you're not going to get back.

So you wouldn't recommend just complaining all the time and not taking in what's being either learned or taught or, you know, whether it's intentional or by accident, because I see so many people spend their time complaining or griping about something versus contributing to either the success or learning from the situation. And it may not be the way I would do it. However, again, like you said, there's something to learn, right?

You gotta be the change. Coming up through my career, I had a few good kennel masters who I emulate myself after and try to take certain, not everything from that they did, but certain things that I'm like, man, that's a great leader. That's a great kennel master. Take those little things and apply them to myself. Complaining, you know, be the change. If you don't like it, bust your tail, do what you think's right. Get from, in the Army, get promoted. In the civilian world, get promoted. Start your own business and be the change that way. Hope change comes from the top, right? So I think when you take it that I'm going to make a difference by not just sitting here and complaining, but, you know, doing the things that I need to do, whether it's the Army that tells you you need to do these things to get promoted, or you identify them yourself, right, during self-reflection. You got to do those things to be the change so that way you can get into that position and make it better for other people. So that was a big thing for me throughout my career, striving to get to where my goal was to be a kennel master so I could be the change. Definitely guilty of complaining from time to time. Um, but you know, I think as you grow, grow older or you, you self-reflect, you realize that's not making anything better.

Yeah.

I tell my guys all the time, sphere of influence. We all have a sphere of influence. For me, it's the entire kennels organization. You have your sphere of influence, if that's a team leader in a kennels or a squad leader, take care of your sphere of influence, be the change there. Um, you know, take care of those people in your sphere and everything else will take care of itself. Those individuals that work for you will remember that. They'll remember that 5 years down the line when they're reaching out to you for advice or when they're your peer. Complaining doesn't help any of us.

Whether you're in a, by title, a leadership role, you're not, like you said, you still have a sphere of influence around. And what are they gonna remember you for? Oh, that was the person that always complained about everything. Or on the flip side, oh, that's the person that always gave the good advice and always stayed positive and looked at things from a different perspective and encouraged us to look at it from a different perspective. Back of. You're absolutely right. That's what they're gonna remember. One day they're in that leadership role and what do they remember you at? You're BC, right? You're before Christ then. And then they get to know you and they're like, oh man. So that memory of you is hard to change.

Yeah. And it is, but you, you can't live in the past. You can only, you can only continue to develop and get better and try to be a difference where you're at the time. If those people wanna come around and give you the opportunity to see you from a new light, then then that's wonderful. But if not, don't worry about tomorrow. You can't worry about what's in the past. Don't look behind you. You gotta continue to develop yourself and move forward.

That's absolutely right. And when you talk about the sphere of influence that you have as a kennel master, uh, and again, I'm talking from experience, a lot of these listeners don't know you, have never seen your kennels, never seen the people that you work around every day. And by no means am I saying you're perfect or I'm perfect or anything of that nature. So I don't want to come off in that sense, but again, I've seen it firsthand. And when you are in that position, it's hard to build rapport, it's hard to build good morale. How does Kody go about building a good rapport with the people that fall under his sphere and building that that rapport and that trust that comes with that?

I think it comes, one, your quality and your commitment to your work, to your organization and to the individuals in that organization. People aren't stupid. They can tell when you're genuine and you care. And that's a big key. You gotta be genuine, right? Because, you know, they'll quickly call a spade a spade. From that point, it's hard to dig yourself out of that hole. You truly have to be genuine. You gain that trust in them. Through hard work, through taking care of their needs. Uh, in the Army, that's, that's a big thing about leadership. You gotta take care of soldiers. You gotta take care of people because they're the ones that are out there. I don't do nothing, right? I, I just make sure they're taken care of so they can do the work a military no-counselor gets credit for.

Yeah.

So, you know, being, being that genuine leader, you know, not— the big thing I found is not treating them like they're just work. We break bread together. I invite all of my soldiers over. Open my home to them. It's not a requirement, but I find when the people who work, I don't like saying for me, because we're a whole organization. We're all part of that and we just have different levels of responsibility, but we're equals, right? The only thing that separates us is our pay grade and responsibility that they tell us I have to do X, Y, and Z. But when they can see you from truly who you are, right? In your, out of that work element, in your home with your family. That starts to build that trust. When you show concern for them and their family and the things that are important to them, I think that also starts to build that rapport and that trust and just going an extra mile for people because it really is all about the people. So you have to take care of the people to make the organization successful.

Well, I'm a person of observation. I've learned a long time ago, whether it be dogs, people I work with, handlers, other trainers. I'm a person of observation. Rather than being involved in everything, I sit back and watch and listen. I've trained myself to do that. I may be engaged in this, but I'm listening to what everybody else is saying. I'm watching the person on the other end of the training field and what they're doing when they don't think I'm watching them. I've always been that way. Some of the best trainers that I've ever hired or had the opportunity to work around are ones that I watch from a distance and see what their character is. What do they do when people are not watching them? What do they do without being asked? How do they talk? How do they react? And most times I just follow those memories. Sometimes it's not something I take action on or that you know, it's meant to get somebody in trouble or to talk with their supervisor, but it's just to really see what is that person really like. Because when I'm talking to them, it's a different picture. People put on their makeup and they look really pretty, right? But what do they look like when they wake up in the morning without all that? And I say that because I'm going back over my memories. Week 1, Friday afternoon of a tracking class, we get back to the kennels and I see everybody from the lowest ranking person to the kennel master scrubbing a trailer and a dog kennel, and everybody's fully involved, everybody's chipping in. Nobody's saying anything. Everybody's just getting things done. That's how you see the leadership in an organization. When you see things late on a Friday afternoon, nobody's complaining about going home. Every single time that I asked handlers at your kennel, hey, we're going to train a little bit late tonight, I guess we have to, it was— everybody was fully involved in that. I know that's not generated by them. It's a direct reflection of leadership. Because if you allow people to be lazy, if you don't set the standard from the top, there's always resentment that I have to do this. The right answer is yes, because I have to do this, versus the buy-in to go, yeah, let's train all night, let's do whatever it takes, let's clean this trailer, let's whatever. But that's because there's great leadership leading from the front. You were not in the office while everybody else cleaned the trailer. Yeah, Sergeant Styles wasn't in the office while everybody cleaned or found an excuse. Look, Sergeant Styles had a lot going on outside, but there was never a moment you guys weren't fully involved in your soldiers. That gave them a different light because you led from the front. And I think that's something that we miss oftentimes, is listening and watching people from a and looking for the minute details that make these people great. So when I saw a leader in front of me, I recognized it without anybody saying anything. I already knew, and I hate to admit, but I had to talk about you behind your back because, you know, that's usually not a good thing. But everybody had an opportunity to tell, and it wasn't anything you said to me. It wasn't that Me and you got along. That was week 1. But those are the small details that I see in an organization when you don't hear the sighs, you don't hear the grief that, oh, we got to put in a little bit of extra work, or, oh, we got to clean this. It was expected, and everybody jumped in and knocked it out and got it done. Yeah, that's a small thing, but to me, that's huge. Yeah, because it really shows How they're being led based on that, because I've seen the opposite end of the spectrum as well. And that's also very evident when they're not being led or people are not being led the right way, but I seen it the entire time. So it just wasn't an anomaly. English is my second language. Just joking. But my point behind that is I don't care. Cause I'm not an English major. Let me say this again. Don't talk about my misspellings though. I don't, I don't care. I trained good.

Yeah. Done.

It's like a dog, right? You watch a dog and you see their natural drive, tendency. You put 'em with a great handler that leads them, they just excel. But we gotta talk a little bit about discipline too, because being a great leader, you didn't go around giving everybody candy or buying their dinner every night or patting 'em on the back and saying it's okay to lose. Matter of fact, I heard quite the contrary. You were probably the one that was very competitive, right? And so, and at times you had to, you know, lay some discipline down too, right? Absolutely. And from your perspective, being a leader doesn't mean that you're soft, does it?

No, not at all. There's time and place. So like you said something that I've been thinking about a lot about observing people. You gotta get to know people. We have the unique opportunity in kennels to work in a small, close environment, whether that's a small kennel or large kennels. You get to really build good relationships with people. You get to find out what makes them tick. When you do that, you can truly— I like to say I'm good at, you know, figuring people out. You can figure out where to apply pressure and where not to, when to apply pressure, when to take the pressure off. You can know when someone's having an off day, maybe that's not the best time to put the pressure on them. Some people, you know, pressure works. Some people pressure doesn't work. I have all different ends of the spectrum in my organization. I had a leadership epiphany when I was a young sergeant and—

Can you spell epiphany?

Hey, sir. I had a leadership epiphany and I was very, you know, young, immature at that point in my career and thought that my way was the best way, that my way was the only way. And so I had an incident where a soldier, I had gone to my countermaster at the time, and was basically like, I can't work for this guy. He's crazy. Right? He's yelling at me on the phone.

Talking about you.

Yes. Talking about me. Thinking back on it, I was like, that's wild. Like, it's so hard for me to get to that point now. But in the moment, I got some feedback from that countermeister and he was like, hey, maybe you need to try a different leadership style as this individual. And I immediately took offense to it. My first thought was like, that's insulting. This has worked with everyone else from what I know, it's gonna either— it's that individual's fault that they're not conforming. I took offense to that at first, and later on throughout my life, I really started to realize, no, I was wrong. Different people require different approaches.

Okay.

If the goal is for us to be successful as an organization, it's easier for me to get to know my people, which is a good quality to have as a leader. To get to truly know the individuals you're working with and approach them in a way that they're going to be successful. If people are successful, the organization is successful. So yeah, that was, that was something that kind of like I still apply to this day. And it goes back to when to enforce discipline and how, right? That's different for everybody depending on what the situation, because there's policies and procedures that we have to follow. And that's, you know, everyone, everyone follows that standard. Um, but you know, there, there's some other things we get complacent at times and you know, there's times when, you know, they gotta know that you're for real. Um, and so, you know, that's some of the situations of what you saw when you guys were out there.

Um, yeah.

Um, they think, you know, you are the standard that you accept. You become the standard that you accept. I was telling a kid today, uh, who, uh, was working as a dog going through CERT, when you you accept one standard from this dog, same as a soldier, same as anyone who works for you, that's the new standard. If you accept that heel to be a little bit off because you're like, ah, it's good enough, that's the new standard. And then it slowly becomes sloppy, right? And we don't ever want to get to that. Something you guys said when you're out there at the track course is like, you can't, you're never going to be perfect, right? But you should train into a try to achieve perfection, right? Whatever that is for you. Practice makes perfect. If you expect a high standard of yourself, then, you know, especially as a leader of an organization, other people are going to see that. And at that point, there's no excuses. You can't hold other people to a higher standard than you hold yourself to. And that comes from self-reflection, admitting that you're not always right, and making those hard changes about ourselves. So in our organizations, like the county Master is the standard, and you can see that everywhere you travel to. You see it in the culture of the organization.

Sure.

And that's a big thing for me, is the culture, right? Create a culture where people want to be, create a culture where people want to achieve what their best— that comes through having a high standard. I hold myself to a very high standard in everything I do, and I think that's something my soldiers see, soldiers around me and my peers see. If he holds himself to that standard, then I need to raise my standard or meet that standard. And that creates a really good environment. And then as a leader, you're identifying that and helping those people get to that standard. Everyone also has different— see, like, if you're at the top of that organization, you're achieving things at a high level, holding yourself accountable, taking ownership of that organization, good or bad, then, you know, the members of that organization see that and they want to be better too. And that all comes back to culture.

I think you said something that really sticks out in my head where you recognize that not everybody can meet your standard. They may be able to exceed you.

Yeah.

But there's different levels, right? But the key is still aim to make that person better than what they may feel they can be. Yes. A great quality of a leader is recognizing that everybody's not the same. Because of that, if this person is not there, you're aiming to raise their abilities or their standards to a whole level and influence them in a positive way. Sometimes that is discipline, but as you said, discipline comes in many different forms. Some people take, you know, punishment, like, you know, you gotta go—

I was that person—

go get you, right? Yeah. And then some just need a, hey, meet me in my office.

Yeah, I think that what you just said comes from when you build those relationships. Because then, you know, I know if they know that I'm disappointed in their actions or how they handled something or their lack of effort, they know I don't have to say anything to them. They know that they're better than that because I've got them to believe that they're better than that because they are. I don't just say that because I'm making them believe they're better than they are, but I think they know. And we've had conversations one-on-one that they are pushing themselves hard enough. They can achieve give much more than what they're giving. You build those relationships and they can just tell, right? And most of the time they'll come to me and they'll be like, hey, sorry, I gotta talk to you for a second. They'll be like, hey, I just want to apologize. Or when I'm saying, you don't apologize to me, just be better next time, right? And I say that because I know they can take that wrong. But again, that all comes down to the culture we create in our organizations. Something to be proud of. Right? But putting, uh, so much more effort if it's for something that you're proud of.

Yeah, I mean, I look at the grind that I do every single day. The focus is not putting in the grind, it's based on the reasons why I want to. I think about why I love what I do every single day, and it is the people I work around. I have a privilege to work around the people that I work around, and I truly I 100% believe that, that I have the opportunity to do that every single day. It's a blessing when not very many people get to go to work every day and love what they do. Absolutely. We're here talking late in the evening, travel, but we love what we do. The number of people that I know that actually love what they do is fewer than the ones that do it because they feel like they have to. We talked about the sphere of influence and how you build rapport. What does mentorship play in this big picture of leadership?

For me, mentorship was something that I didn't really— it's not something that is really talked about a lot within our program, but it's something that I learned a little bit later in my career. The importance of having a mentor and being a mentor, right? But it's unique because it's not, it's not the same as leadership. Usually you're going to a leader for mentorship. You have to share the same values. I 100% believe that you have to share some of the same qualities when it comes into mentorship. And because it's, it's almost like it's a relationship that only works if both people mutually agreeing. And putting in that effort. That's why finding somebody who shares the same values, the same work ethic, the same beliefs, somebody that you aspire to be like, and having that conversation, because a mentor is the one who's going to tell you the, you know, you don't got it all together all the time. These are the things you need to work on, right? You have to be able to accept this person's constructive criticism at times. If you lack mentorship, you're going to be missing out on a huge opportunity. Opportunity to grow as a leader, as a person. It's something that we don't really do a lot of. Sometimes it takes too long to build that relationship, but it's something you need. If you don't have one, you need to seek one out. It is a mutual relationship. If you're going to be my mentor or vice versa, I need to have that. That question has to be asked because that, that's, I mean, at least any, I think any mentor that's worth asking that to. They're going to put their time and effort and their heart into it because they want to do better. If you're not getting that, that's just, that's just a supervisor. This is somebody who's checking on you, holding you accountable, and making sure you're doing the things you need to do to achieve your goals.

The crazy thing is I don't think we use that enough. Oftentimes we find ourselves in a bubble where we say, well, I'm leading Again, this could be a sports team. This could be a small group. This could be a whole organization, right? And we find ourselves at the top and then we find ourselves being a dictator versus being that compassionate leader that understands that I don't have all the answers. Not only makes me better, but also challenges me to continue to push and strive to be better than I was today. And, you know, at the same time, those that are not scared to chastise me either and give me the discipline that I need sometimes to keep me in my right and left limits, because sometimes we get too big for our position, right? Which brings us into the moral aspect of what we do, right? Technically, there's no one out there every day watching you, right? There's nobody checking in on you. There's nobody that's checking your time clock, making sure you're there in the morning at X amount of time. Matter of fact, you don't even really have to show up to PT or do any of that if you don't want to.

That's correct.

I think you could probably leave around noon if you wanted to, but obviously you don't. So how does those morals and those ethics come into play, not just as a leader, but also, quite frankly, as live with what's in our heart, right? And what Christ plays the role in how you dedicate yourself to your organization.

I think some of that comes from, I was built up to, you know, well before the Army. That comes down to what I was, you know, what built into me, uh, in my work, competitiveness and drive to make my organization whole and, you know, make all of my coworkers, my soldiers successful. And then when it comes to my faith, doing everything with excellence, doing everything unto the Lord. If I think that the Lord would not be happy, he knows what I'm capable of. If I'm not constantly striving for excellence, then I'm falling short of the mark. And it's something, it does come from that relationship with faith, my faith. And I think it's that competitive drive, that desire to be the best that I can be. And, you know, just trying to win every day. So I think you just gotta have that self-drive because like you said, a lot of times there's no one there to watch. What are you doing when nobody's watching? And then you were talking earlier about that. I had a coach in high school who used to call it fish eyes. Fish have their eyes on the side of their head and fish eyes is when somebody's just slacking off and they're looking to wait till when the boss is watching to do the work. Yeah. Um, so he'd always call that people who have fish eyes, right?

I like it.

Not working until the boss is watching. And that just comes from the drive that we build into ourselves to be successful, to push ourselves, to see what we're capable of.

And you say drive relates to dogs. We say that's what's in the dog's heart. That's their drive. And, but it, it really equates to you as well and us in the sense of if you don't feel like you're giving your duty 100%, you're gonna hold yourself accountable for that. You're gonna check yourself. I often say that I go by what's in my heart, and that's really one of our core values with CCU. To do is do what's in your heart. Because if we truly do it with what's in our heart, how can we ever go wrong? If I feel like— just give you an example— as a company policy, we don't pick up a dog for a client unless they pay us. But we had a staff member that says, I just feel like the best thing to do was just go pick up this dog for this lady. How can we hold them accountable for that? Because they use their character to make a judgment. Oftentimes we have this feeling that we're not giving our all, or we talk to somebody in a way that we shouldn't have, but we don't fix it. I think if you have the right heart, it's going to guide you the right way. Some people are okay with that, having fish eyes, but that doesn't sit well with me, that I'm not living up to the expectations I hold for myself without anybody else holding those for me. Me. Not to say I'm always right, but we all have that feeling at times when we're not giving our all and we check ourselves. Yeah, it's important.

I have a responsibility to not only set an example for my organization but my children and my family. That drive and desire to be the best I can be every single day keeps me going too. So, you know, that comes from the passion that we have for what we 'cause it's easy to take a day off and you're not very passionate or bought into what your, uh, organization's doing. But the days when you're tired, when you could just sleep in, when you could just take the day off, that's when you gotta fall back on those morals and those values.

Yeah.

To be like, hey, I, I just gotta get up. Just gotta keep going.

Yeah.

Because it, I don't feel great every day. Everyone doesn't feel great every day. Uh, but you just gotta find that motivation. Motivation for you and use that to kind of stoke the flames and keep going.

I was thinking about when I was there at work training and I remember the day that you felt like you had Lyme disease.

Yeah, Brandon's gotten my head a little bit, you know. He's a survivor of Lyme disease.

I just wanted on record that you went to the doctor for that, which I would have never done. I would have just ate mud or chewed my fingernails and got better, healed myself. You actually sought medical attention for this?

Yeah, I had to listen to the wisdom of my wife at that time. She said that I don't go to the doctor enough.

And what—

phantom Lyme disease. I like to say my genetics beat it. My genes couldn't survive inside of me.

Oh yeah, yeah.

I probably had it. It just didn't fix.

I mean, that's part of being a leader, right? Just having superior genetics. I thought it was important for us to, you know, give our listeners that, you know, because if you don't have good genetics, You'll get Lyme disease.

I'm scared just listening to this.

But I like the way that you flipped it around too, because your fear of not being able to eat meat fueled your way to try to make sure you didn't have Lyme disease because that would've been a problem too.

Yeah. That would've been a career ender fueled by red meat.

Yeah. That's right. We're gonna have some lobbyists that are gonna take offense to that.

Yeah.

That's fine. Just letting you know, you're probably gonna get bashed. Yeah. Okay. I hope you can take it. Okay. Now working in the type of environment that you work in, but also not just in that kennel environment, you've been around for a while. So even coming through wartime and all that, is it hard? Because I'm going back to my law enforcement days and I'll give a quick story about a good friend of mine. Tiff, before I was saved, Tiff used to always preach to us, right? We called him preacher. Every moment he had, he brought up the Lord. I remember telling Tiff, like, hey, Tiff, come on now. That's enough. But he always stayed consistent on his values. If we were cursing, Tiff would be like, hey, man, calm it down. And he did it in a loving way. But my point behind that is years later, after I was saved, I called Tiff because I really appreciated the fact that he always stayed consistent, even when we gave him a hard time. Tiff was a friend of ours and we could give each other some banter at times. And Tiff didn't take it personally. I think if someone else would've said some of the stuff we said to him, it would've been a fight just the way Tiff was. But my point behind that was I was so thankful that he stayed consistent in that image of Christ, even through the environment that he was in, which was the law enforcement environment. I'm not saying that law enforcement is a breeding ground for heathens or anything of that nature, because the law enforcement that I came accustomed to over my years, they did have morals, they did have standards, but they weren't necessarily Christian. And I meet people now, whether it be people of different faiths, Buddhism, just different religions around the world, right? A point behind this is, is that How do you navigate being a Christian in the environment that you work in every day? How do you marry that up, I guess, is the question, because it's not the, you know, you're not working at First Baptist of wherever. You're in an environment that we don't necessarily see the best things of the world. And you've got people from different parts of the country, different beliefs. I mean, you're navigating a melting pot of different things that most people are not experienced with, right?

Yeah. I think the one is staying focused on the things you do share in common, which is we're all part of the same organization with the same goals, the organization being successful. So keeping, keeping those shared common goals, you know, as the forefront of what we're all doing, respecting other people's, you know, values. Values and beliefs, right? It does me no good to show hate to somebody because they don't believe the same things that I believe. I'm not called to do that. I'm called, you know, to love everyone the same, provide everyone the same leadership regardless if they are different from me, regardless if they've burned me before. I'm required to, not only by my duties and my job, but by my faith. I need to show all those people the same amount of love and appreciation it's not going to benefit the working relationship or the environment. And then two, one, just standing on my beliefs and standing firm on those because I know people are going to judge that. People are going to talk about that, persecute that, but being faithful through all of that because I know the truth and sharing that, being understanding of other people's values. We all come from different backgrounds. We all come from different different walks of life. We all have different experiences, you know, just because, you know, I was one at one point not in this business, this mindset, belief, or position. That doesn't mean down the road this person couldn't also be that, and I couldn't— I could be the example of why they did that. Staying truthful and understanding that everyone's at a different point. Yeah, but trying to find those shared values, I think that really helps to focus on the goal at hand. Hand.

I think that's great. And that's why I brought up the story of Tiff, because I figured, you know, use your core principles, which is love, you know, love everybody. And that's what Christ teaches us. Yeah, we all have faults. None of us are better than anybody else. And I think that's what a lot of people, especially if you're not a Christian, believe, because that's what I believed, right? I believed that I had to get myself right before I could step into a church church with people that were better than me. Little did I know we all needed help, and we still do. And that's the point, to really love others. And you've mentioned several times about your heart. You know, those are things that people can't physically see sometimes, or, you know, put their, their hands on it. But I used to say that about a trainer of ours that we had, a good friend of mine. He just had a way of pissing people off all the We could say the exact same thing and they would get mad about him saying it, but wouldn't get mad about me saying it. And, but what I would always say is, but I know where his heart is with everything he says. His heart is in a place that he cares, and that's why he says what he says or does what he does. But it's hard to get others to buy into that sometimes. Absolutely dealing with different backgrounds of people coming from different beliefs, it's hard as a leader or could be if you don't have the right heart because your prejudices, whatever they could be, would weigh into your decision-making. It shouldn't as a leader. Going back to our ethics, going back to our devotion to the organization and then Secondly, going back to what's right and what's in your heart. I think your faith guides a lot of that, or most of it, right?

Yeah, I think if you focus on the shared goal, people put their differences aside and work towards that goal together. And being able to encourage people to speak their mind or openly communicate where they're at or what's going on. That's definitely something that helps when you deal with all walks of life, having them know that their opinion matters, whatever they have to verbalize or communicate, it matters, right? And it's taken into consideration, but sometimes that can burn you. Sometimes they just have to also understand, and you set that through, you know, your actions that, you know, your opinion matters, but just because we don't go that route, it doesn't mean you haven't been heard or, you know, that it's not the case. Just having— ensuring that people understand that is, uh, a lot of big points, right?

Hey man, we're navigating this, we're killing this despite all our distractions. We're working on our distractions while doing this out in the field. Yeah, I mean, you beat Lyme disease, what else can be expected? But that's great genetics, great smiles, perfect hair. For those only listening, Barrett has perfect hair. Everybody says it. Yeah.

Now he's heard me too.

Yeah. So, great. Everybody, all the audience say they agree. The one audience member we got. I forgot to tell everybody, we are doing this in front of a live audience, by the way. That's great. Let's get some applause here. Now, looking at advice that you would give to someone that aspires to be a leader, they could be a young person or young in their career or young as being a leader in general. What advice would you give them? What piece of advice would you give them?

First one I would say is invest in yourself, right? That whether developing yourself, whether that be getting a degree, educating yourself outside of your specific job, invest that time, effort, money, whatever it is to make yourself better, right? I think I was saying, try and get 1% better every single day. Over time, that builds up, you know, that has equity in it. So investing in yourself, I don't think you can ever go wrong there. Second thing I would say is have a standard. To have a standard is built on a strong foundation. You know, there's going to be many people throughout your career who are going to try to get you to bend that standard. And the sooner you build, you figure that out, the sooner you start to build that foundation, the easier it is going to be to stick to that standard and hold yourself accountable. The third thing I would say is take care of others. You have to take care of people, especially as a leader. I mean, what else is it for? Take care of your people is— sometimes people have different definition of that. I don't mean take care of your people as in give them everything they want and make sure they're smiling and they're, they got a full belly full of food, whatever. But, you know, take care of people is ensuring that they're getting the best training they can get so they can be prepared for whatever it is to come, ensuring that they, you know, physically, mentally, financially are, are taken care of so they can focus on their training and job. Invest time in them to, to develop them, bring them with you, because your goal should be is to be training those that are under you to take your job. A lot of people shy away from that, but you absolutely have to prepare people to take your job so that when they're there, they can be better than you were. Um, because they started so early. Investing in your people, taking care of your people. That would be the third thing.

All right. 3 great points. I think that anybody that employs those 3 things would be successful in anybody's eyes. Especially looking back at the ones that I would deem have failed me as a leader. Not that I didn't learn anything from them. However, they did not possess those qualities. They did not possess that vision of taking on ownership of other people. They took it as an opportunity to be left alone, to isolate themselves, and to not have to answer to as less people as possible, right? Versus investing in The ones that they were surrounded, you know, were winding it down. But there's one last thing I want to ask you, and if there was a legacy that Sergeant Barrett left for people to remember him by, what would that— what would your hopes be that that would be?

I think the first and foremost is that I glorified God. That's the most important thing to me in my life. I would say that goes along with that is that, you know, I gave 100% every single day. I set a standard and I believe in leaving an impact on them, whether they end their career in the military or they continue. I think that's like the ultimate reward is when you instill something in people, whether through your actions or presence. That they try to emulate. So Max and being— seeing that type of leader who set the standard and gave them an example off of, a positive example, I think that's, that's ultimately what for me in the legacy that I would hope to leave.

Nice. I love it. Hey man, we've been at this over an hour. It doesn't seem like that long. Yeah, just having a conversation. Which is great. We started this off by saying we traveled, we got together, we kind of met in the middle. It was well worth it in my eyes. For one, I love seeing you every opportunity I get to meet with you. I know we text a lot and talk. If I was white, I'd look like you. I would hope to look like you.

Oh, nice. Yeah.

And if you were brown, I hope you would hope to look like me. Yeah, yeah, I'm gonna get a tattoo like yours. You send me a picture, you know, I'll do my other arm in that. So it's great to meet great people though, and in all sincerity, it's not often that you make instant connections. We had similar friends and we're very like-minded. It's easy to get along with people that are like-minded Contrary to what people may see, I'm pretty private. I keep a select group of friends close to me and that's about it. And a lot of times we're so busy that we get caught up in what we're doing and we don't get to talk. But I always say true friends, we pick up like we never left off. That's how I always feel when I talk to you, when we text, we're able just to message each other real quick. That's— where friendships are built, and I really enjoy that. And I appreciate you. I appreciate the things you share with me. I appreciate the fact that I know you and consider you a friend. So I appreciate that very much.

I appreciate you having me on. Never would have thought this would, uh, be something that would happen, but, you know, I'm honored to be here. Thank the Lord for giving me this opportunity and for your friendship. It's been real.

The hopes of what we do with Source is that we provide one thing that somebody can learn from, right? That they spend the time to listen to the content that we put out or the things that we want to bring to others. It's, you know, really I want to give people the glimpse of what I got to see, right? What pours into me every single day. Elevating myself, surrounding myself with good people, like-minded people, but most importantly, people that inspire me, people that I listen to talk and I'm like, man, that's great. Let me put that in my pocket. Let me use that one day. I need to continue to invest in myself. Through this content, we're not here to entertain. We're here to teach lessons. We're teachers at heart.

Yeah.

From day one, we just wanted to train dogs, train handlers, and invest in people to make them better. Dogs gave us that opportunity. But that was the ministry. That's what brought me to meet you, meet our one cast, one audience member here in Madison. It's the first time she's been mentioned on the podcast. First time she's been in Columbia, South Carolina. I got to share some stories with her on, you know, the many years I spent in Columbia, South Carolina. But I bring it back here to meet a good friend of mine and to give our listeners a glimpse of what I got to experience and learn. It was just how do we pack all this in a reasonable amount of time that people don't have to listen to 5 episodes to, to get what you have to offer and the knowledge. It's unreal.

Yeah.

All right. I don't think you can get this type of content or knowledge from years of training in a short period of time. They get to hear A man that's built to where he is right now and having such a positive influence on the people around you. It's amazing to see. I'm just waiting on the next 13 years, maybe 30 years of your career because I'm cheering you on, man. So I wish I could work for you. Can I enlist now? You could. Am I too old?

No, I got you. I'll sign a waiver.

I would love to work for you. I enjoy training with you. Even sharing dog knowledge is great times. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for coming on, knowledge with everybody else.