Ashley's Parents

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Hey. Welcome to the Naked Marriage podcast. We're Dave and Ashley Willis, and on this podcast, we undress the truth about sex, intimacy and lifelong love. And that lifelong love part we're gonna be focusing in on today with some very, very special guests here in the studio. If you're watching this on YouTube and you're able to see us right now, you can see that we've got company with us.

Yay.

Two of my favorite people, Jazz hands. We're gonna tell you who these amazing.

People are in just a second and.

But before we dive in, my love.

Why don't you share a review?

We thank you guys for leaving reviews on iTunes, Spotify, YouTube, wherever you're listening or watching. Those reviews mean a lot to us and they help other people discover the podcast.

So we like to share them here.

We do. And so today's review is from Petersen Fam in Germany. So I have to share one from Germany. It might be our first one, but thankfully they wrote it in English and they entitled it my favorites. Five stars. Thank you. And they said, we attended the XO conference in Colorado Springs and there were my favorite speakers. Now that I can't stop listening, now I cannot stop listening to them across all their platforms. I love their relationship advice and the way they love and respect one another. Well, thank you all so much and thank you for coming to our XO conferences. And thank you so much for leaving this review. If you have not yet left a review, please do so. It's the best way to let people know about this podcast. And also a little side note, if you, if you want to join us at one of our EXO conferences, go to exomarriage.com and you'll see everywhere we're going. Well, without further ado, we are going to be interviewing my parents.

Yes.

Bill and Mary McCray in laws. Yes, Bill and Mary. They are extraordinary, fun, amazing people. And we're going to have so much fun today. We are well let's.

Let's dive in. I know.

I'm so excited. I just can't wait. So let's dive into today's episode.

Well, I am so excited to have two of my favorite people in the whole world here on the podcast today, and that is my parents, Bill and Mary McCray, and they are so much fun. Welcome, guys, to the podcast.

Thank you for having me.

And, you know, when we talked about doing this, I called my mom, and I was like, mom, we want to have you guys on the podcast. And. And she's like, well, what are we gonna talk about? And. And Dave and I were like, well, my goodness, you've been married 41 years, which is such a. An amazing thing. I mean, not a lot of people can say that these days. And so we just want to talk about how you can stay married 41 years and kind of your best advice.

Yeah.

And we're thrilled that you guys are here. Like, this is surreal for me. Like, we're here. Bill and Mary are here, and this is. We. You know, this is just. This is fun. Like, it's just. It's just fun that you guys are here. And we. We love you, and thanks for being here. And so rewind the clock a little bit and tell us, like, when you were first getting to know each other, what first drew you to. To the other? Like, what's something that you noticed in the other. In each other that said, you know what? I'd like to. I'd like to get to know him or get to know her a little bit better? Well, what was it like back then?

What do you think.

For starters, for starts? Well, I was dating Mary's roommate, and.

I was engaged to another guy.

She was engaged to another guy.

So.

I was broken up with my girlfriend. Her roommate, and her fiance moved out of state for a new job. And I like Mary, and so we did some stuff together, actually, when we were dating, we. I think we went on double dates together a couple times.

We did. So we would go over there.

Yeah.

And he said he was waiting for all the things to fall.

But anyway, there was something about Mary that appealed to me, and I knew that, you know, I'm gonna, you know, move it on her, and.

Well, you knew the guy was a jerk.

Yes, he was a cheater.

You knew the guy that she was with was a jerk, and eventually he was going to show his cards and. And she was going to realize he was a jerk, and he was going to be out of the picture. And so you were content to be a Friend, you know, until. Until that happened. And then when it did and the dust settled, you were there to be.

Like, Bill and I would go on friendship dates during the week when Mike wasn't there, and then he. He would come home on weekends. And then Bill started calling me on weekends.

Of course, for her, it was friendship.

Yeah.

You know, I had different idea.

You've always said, yeah, you want to be your friend.

Yeah, he wanted to be your friend and. And more down the road. So he was. Well, you two are such a great match. And one thing I love about the two of you is the way that you. You partner together. Like, you know, you guys do so much together. You know, whether it's fixing, fixing houses, or, you know, you're just. You compliment each other's strengths. And I think that that's like, you know, so many couples, it's like they, they're, they're. They're away from each other, you know, all the. All the time. You know, it's like they go out of her way to just not do things together. But, you know, you guys, you seek out opportunities to partner together and play to each other's strengths, because with the houses in particular, you know, Mary's a gifted designer decorator. Bill can fix and build anything.

He can do it all. Poor Ashley. She thought all men were like that. So when we got married, she was.

Convinced I was going to be able to do all the stuff her dad can do. There's no man on earth.

Like, it's.

It takes like 10 guys to do what. What Bill can do, and I can't do any of that. So, like, she's the handy one. I've learned a little, but.

You've learned a lot.

But.

But, you know, I don't have that skill set. But when you two get together, just between the two of you, you can build a whole house, and you can, you know, make it beautiful and. But, you know, talk about what you've learned over the years just by that aspect of partnership. I mean, marriage itself is, of course, a partnership, but you guys have taken it a step further, and you've, like, partnered in a lot of different endeavors and a lot of different work. And what's that look like?

I think when you're married as long as Bill and I have, you have to, you know, keep dreaming. You have to keep the dream alive.

Yeah, that's good.

You have to keep searching for things you enjoy together. And we love flipping houses, redoing houses, airbnbs. I'm a realtor, and he helps me with that too. You know, those signs can't get in the ground by themselves.

Hang with her open houses.

Yeah. Just keep her safe.

We just kind of do everything together. We just like it.

You know, it is funny though, I was thinking about something. We were out somewhere and it was a parent of one of our kids friends and she made a comment. She said, you are always together because what you know, you know who I'm talking about. I can't, you know, whoever she was. But I don't remember. Which was to me was a compliment.

Oh yeah.

I'm proud to say that we are always together and have common interest and you know, strong bond.

But we have totally different personalities. You all know that. Bill's very reserved, I'm very outgoing.

But I love it because you bring out each other's strings.

Right.

Without trying to change the other. You know, you compliment each other so well and.

But he such a good person.

Yes.

You know what I mean? He has the heart and that's what.

I get heart too, Mom. Well, thank you.

But that's what I noticed most. You were saying what drew me to Bill? Well, I had an MGB and Bill went out to the parking lot and he goes, well, oh, I'm sorry. It's a little sports car. And his little ex girlfriend had one too. Mine was newer but. But somebody broke into mine, you know, cut the.

The conventional top.

Yes. Stole my stuff. And I'm like, what am I gonna do? Because when I was single I lived on maybe $3 if I didn't date. You didn't eat.

Yeah.

So he went and got stuff and fixed it all for me and put.

It in, which he still does till this day. I know we were just talking guys like my parents own Airbnbs. And then of course they have their own home and in one week they had an air conditioner go out, a washing machine go out and. And both of these things were like 20 plus years old. And my dad never throw anything because they don't. I was going to say my dad, he's so good at just figuring out how stuff works. Like that's how your brain works, dad. And it's so cool. We have a couple of our kids who are like that and we just get that from me, I love it. But dad of course is fixing it, you know, and 20 year old front.

Loaders and I'm ready to get a new. And he's like, Mary, the motor on. This is only $20. We're going to fix it. I said, I'm still getting a New washer and dryer. I'm still getting it.

So you got to work it out, right?

I know.

And you know, speaking of financial stuff, I want to say this like I've watched my parents, you know, we've always had more than we needed. But I know that you guys just, in what you've told me, have gone through lean times.

Oh my goodness.

And my mom, you know, actually was a stay at home mom for many years. But I always, and Dave said this before too. She was really the Proverbs 31 woman though, because when, when we needed extra money. And my dad has owned his business for many, many years and he does very well with that. But if they ever needed something extra, because my sister and I did expensive activities like dance and competitive dance and competitive cheerleading and that involves cheerleading teams. Yeah. So we had. That's why they needed the extra money. And I know that my mom, she would just come up with stuff to do and my dad would support her in that. Or together they would come up with.

A hair bow business where I would sell like 350 hair bows to a closed community at a dance thing where there's like 2,000 kids. So. Hey.

Yeah. And she would always kick in with ideas to make money. So like at rehearsals we set up a thing to sell hot dogs and candy.

Yeah. Yes.

I mean anything. Anything to make an extra dollar.

Daddy videoed the things and we sold videos.

Yeah.

Also I would video. I would video the. Well, you know. Yeah, I would video the.

We were allowed to do it.

Yeah, of course.

And then sell videos to the parents.

Yeah.

This is before anybody had cell phone videos and all this stuff.

Now this was like the big old on the shoulder camera.

Yes.

Yeah. And, and you had the, the understanding with your electronics background of how to like mass produce tapes and edit and do all that. It was a skill set people didn't have. But YouTube's hard work and resourcefulness is really something to learn from. You know, I think especially, you know, one thing I think with, with more recent generations, even our own kids, you know, it's like the minute that they face hardship as a generation, it seems like there's this tendency to say like, oh, well, that's not for me or I'm just not going to go any farther because that's hard. But with you guys, it's like whenever you did face a hardship, it's like you just found a way. It's like, well, this isn't a dead end. This is a challenge we're going to figure out. And and we're going to get through it. And you always did. And I think that, that resilience and resourcefulness is something that we can certainly learn from. Yeah.

And I know your family's taught you the same thing because they've done a lot of the same thing. And we're hoping to interview them very soon, too. But I know with mom and dad as a kid, being in a house where you just. That's what you did. You figured it out. You all really challenged me on that. And there's been times throughout our 20 year marriage that we've had to be, you know, scrappy. And I think it's good. I mean, you got to have happiness sometimes and depend on yourself. Right. Well, you have to know that you can do things, you know, and, and it's like, you know, I mean, it's. You got to get through it. And, you know, what would you say? They've been married 41 years. What would you say are some things that you've learned about each other, like, throughout. I mean, I know there's a ton of stuff, but like, that you've really learned or about marriage in general, you.

Know, for those listening and they're like.

Well, I want to.

We've got great friends that are also married and they can both attest to. Sure, you're in love when you get married, but after you've been married 40 years, you really are in love.

Right?

Yeah, it's a, It's a, It's a different kind of love. It. I mean, love grows in, in different ways and you just become more bonded.

Yeah.

It may, it may start as a visual, physical thing in the beginning, but it becomes a, like you said, like a partnership type thing.

And it's a deeper love, a richer.

Friendship, more meaning, more experiences together, more meaningful.

Yeah.

Well, when you raise children.

Right.

My goodness. I mean.

Oh, the children certainly make.

That was very fun.

It was.

What? No, but I know it's hard, too.

It's. It's hard, but it's.

We weren't always easy.

It's fun. Yes, you were. You really were. And you were very fun.

Oh, well, that's sweet. Well, mom and dad were always very involved parents like I, and that's something that Dave and I really hold dear. And really, even though we travel for work, as many of our listeners and viewers know, we really try to be at all the events because, you know, that's. We grew up with parents like that and we want to be, we want to be there. And I know for me, as a, as A kid. It meant the world to me. And I know that's not easy now that I'm a parent. That is not always easy. I mean, especially when you have multiple kids and you have all these activities. But, you know, it's. I feel like too, though, through that. I mean, because we were busy kids.

Yes, you were.

How did you all make time for each other? I mean, because I know we were, like, crazy busy when. I'm not exaggerating, am I? I mean, we had something almost every night of the week.

Sometimes more than one.

I mean. Yeah, exactly. How did you all do that?

Like, how did you just try to plan it?

We'd be sitting in the den watching tv, and you would get out of bed and sneak.

She was very little.

The living room and be peering through.

The door, laying in the floor, and.

We could see the reflection of me doing.

Yes.

In the fireplace glass.

So we would just.

We've had kids do that, too. Yeah, but just having that time together at night, I think making it a priority.

Yes.

Because I hear, you know, we hear from so many couples where they ask that question. They're like, how do you. Because we want our kids to have things they're involved in, obviously, but we don't want to do it.

We would always go to Lowe's every Saturday.

Yes.

Not really. We would tell the girls we were going to Lowe's and we would go out to lunch. Because if we said we were going out to lunch, you would say, I'm going to.

Yes, but we hated Lowe's back then.

They did.

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But you know something that happened in our house, that was so sweet. This week is, is Ashley was talking about sweet memories from growing up. And. And she said she's like, let's watch a movie. Yeah, let's watch a movie that reminds me growing up. And she said, let's watch Supergirl. She said, because I used to watch 1980s and I would make dad hold me up like Supergirl and fly me all around the house. And it was this really sweet memory she was sharing. And then, and then we sat down with our younger kids and we watched Supergirl. And Chatham, our six year old, his eyes were just so wide watching it. And she was telling stories the whole time about when she was that same age. And it was this precious, like, moment of, like, bonding and building on that rich heritage. And then I got to pick up Chatham and fly him around. And it was just a really sweet moment that was rooted back in some of those precious memories from growing up.

Yeah, it was. Because that movies, it's something in our family that everyone likes. All of our kids enjoy movies. And that was the same in our family.

Okay, but you all have to remember that we didn't just turn on Netflix. We had to go to a video store. And everybody got to go in. It was a family affair.

Tell the young people what a video.

Store is, because that's where you go.

Select your VHS movie and then you select popcorn. But we wouldn't buy it there because it was too expensive. So we would go and pop our own and, you know, do all that. And you'd have your little friends spend the night. And they always rented the same movies. What were they, Ashley?

Well, which season of childhood?

Well, something in the attic. What was that movie?

Oh, my gosh, you guys.

Secrets in the Attic.

Children in the Attic.

Attic.

It was Children in the Attic. Right?

Sounds like a great line. This.

No, this is all what? This is always a big movie. This is before they did the ratings. You know, you didn't, you didn't know if it was peach. I mean, I saw the Graduate in fourth grade. Mother thought, oh, Dustin Hoffman graduated from high school. This ought to be great.

Pretty racy.

Oh, my goodness. It was the first time I ever saw Body Parts.

And I'm like in fourth grade going, whoa, somebody. The rating system was a little more vague back then.

So now in the 80s, it was even in the 80s.

Well, PG movies from the 80s, like, you go back and watch them. Movies that I remember watching as a kid, like, it's not a big deal. And then I'll go back and like, start watching a PG movie with my kids.

From the 80s. And I'm like, how in the world was I allowed to watch this? You know, PG meant a different thing.

Yes.

I'll never forget. We love the Michael J. Fox movies. I'm drawing a blank.

Back to the future.

Back to the future. So we start. We're like, we've got to introduce this to our kids. And I want to say our two, you know, eldest kids who are now in high school, they were, what, like 10 and 8 at the time? And we're like, they're ready for this. So we were going strategically through it. There's a little, like, a little bit of language. And we would kind of, like, know when that was coming. Well, then we get to. Was it the second one? I'm trying to think. And there's a hot tub scene.

Yeah, there's some stuff in these.

What?

Like, we literally are, like, poured through this. It was like, really? You know, they don't actually remember. That's my butt.

I'm the one that introduces the children to all movies.

Right.

That's why they want to go stay with Nana.

Thank you, Nanas.

She. She.

Not really bad.

No, no.

I know.

They would be a little bit of like Deuce Bigelow. I thought every boy needs to see.

Deuce Bigelow. Oh, my gosh. Our producers are laughing like, oh, goodness.

So if you're not sure what that is, don't Google it.

Don't Google it.

Oh, it's hilarious. And it does have.

It does have some redeeming qualities, I guess. You know, we did have a lot of questions after that movie, and I was like, mom, I wish you had called me. And.

Yeah, no, Cooper, no.

My 10 year old told me and said, dad, what's a gigolo?

And that started.

That started a fun conversation that I.

But it was.

But we digress.

We digress. You know, so. Oh, good. Good times.

You know, we go ahead, what we're going to say.

I forget what I was gonna say. I was just thinking back so many memories.

I know.

Memories.

I will say this on a different note.

I'm wearing. If you're not watching YouTube, you can't see this. This little, like, sweater thing that's so nice and so comfortable.

Because when I look through my closet, nearly everything I own, either my mom or Mary or Ashley got me.

I don't think I have one article.

Of clothing that isn't from one of you three. And so looking at what I have today, like, every bit of this is from the two of you.

I got the shirt mom gave me.

The shirt you got me, the sweater.

Your mom probably got the jeans.

I'm just.

What's so wonderful about buying my son in law's Joe too? They love everything you get them. They jerk the tag off and stick it right on. What do you think they're ready to wear?

No, we're grateful.

I'm like, all right.

And mom always, she loves it. And let me just say this about my mom and then I have a more important question than this. But my mom and your mom, I have to say, are like literally professional Goodwill shoppers and Simon source shoppers. It gives her like a high.

I don't going to Goodwill. When you get a good hit at Goodwill, it's like, oh, I need a cigarette. But I don't smoke. But I love it. I just, I just got a $1200 comforter scent for the current. Well, probably $10.

I mean she loves it.

I mean that's. It is amazing. I, I love, I love listening to when you and my mom. I love like shopping together.

I mean we truly love each other. She is fabulous. I mean when we fly down, when Ashley and Dave, we'd come to Dallas, we wouldn't even know when we left and when we arrived because we were chattering the whole time.

No, they have a great time.

We love shopping.

Really a big blessing to Dave and I. Like, we really love that. We do.

What's your question? You had a good one.

Yeah.

So this is a more serious. You know, every marriage in every season goes through hard times. And I know, and I don't know the details of that because I'm your kid. But like what, what would you say really would get you through those hard times? Like would make you dig deep whenever. Any kind of hard times.

You mean health in marriage?

Well, anything.

Yeah.

Tell us about your past. I've seen that.

I know about this past year. I had four hospitalizations, two surgeries and a broken foot. And the broken foot was non weight bearing for eight weeks. And since I had had both knees replaced. Yeah, I'm falling apart. I couldn't use one of the little scooters to get around because you couldn't bear weight on your knee. So I was in a wheelchair. You all have the most empathy for anyone that has struggles getting around. I couldn't have done anything without daddy.

Yeah, I mean, well, you should learn what handicapped people go through.

Oh my goodness.

You just have a whole new open.

The door for them if they're in a. Please do. I mean it is, it's trying. And plus your mental State.

Right.

You're confined, you know, with COVID and then all this stuff, it wasn't fun.

Let me ask you this, because I know, dad, when the knee replacement happened prior to Covid, like probably four years ago, but I know that there's things like bathing and helping to the bathroom and those things that are hard for both of you. I mean that, because that's a whole new level of marriage, you know? How did you navigate that?

I mean, it. It's a learn as you go thing, and it becomes very intimate.

Modesty. Modesty's gone.

Yeah.

Modesty's gone.

Yeah.

And it's. I mean, the things daddy had to do, which I won't write because was right.

It's serving each other carry, you know, carrying each other's burdens. Um, that is. It's. It's a privilege. And watching the way that you two done that for each other in different ways, it really is. It's. It's. I know. It's not fun, I'm sure, but coming out the other side, it bonds you even closer, and it's something beautiful to see. And I hope that, you know, when we come to those kind of challenges, you know, in our health someday or whatever that looks like, that we'll follow the example that you guys have set and the way that we serve each other through that.

Yeah.

So, well, let's. Let's.

Let's kind of transition here, because I'd love to get you guys input on whatever today's question is, which, again, none of us know.

We end every episode with a question from a listener. And thank you guys to those who send in questions@nakedmarriagepodcast.com and we haven't seen this, so we're just going to read it and then talk about it for a bit as we wrap up. So my husband is ready for kids, but I'm not there yet. He's so patient and wonderful and would never push me into anything. I love him so much and want to have a family with him someday, but I have a lot of fear about being pregnant, hopefully delivering a healthy baby and trying to be a good mom. Are there ways to prepare my heart.

And mind and maybe even my body.

To be a good parent before it happens? How do I talk about this with my husband? So thank you. Great question. I think most couples, you know, in one way or another, have to kind of wrestle through some version of this.

Question of when do we have kids?

And maybe one spouse is more eager than the other or one's more reluctant and you know, especially when you have kind of very kind of specific concern about, I'm afraid I'm not ready. I'm afraid I'm not going to be a good mom. I'm afraid about how my body might respond and all of those kind of very natural concerns. But then at the same time, we don't want to live in fear because it's a leap of faith that's always worth taking to start a family. But.

There'S a lot to this. And so I just love to hear what you all have to say about it.

Well, and I would love to hear what mom and dad have to say, because one of her anxieties, for lack of a better word, that she might be having that I think a lot of women have but don't voice is the fear of, will I be able to carry this baby to term? Am I going to have miscarriage? Because one in four women have a miscarriage, and I've never actually experienced that, but my mom has. And I know that you had me, then you were pregnant, and you lost that baby, and then you had my sister. And I bet there was a lot of anxiety before you got pregnant with Morgan. So what would you say to someone who's going through that?

I wouldn't get pregnant with fear.

Right.

I would look at pregnancy as a blessing.

Absolutely.

And the whole time, I mean, I couldn't wait to get married. I wanted five kids, a station wagon, and two dogs. Daddy says it was a mistake, but he threw out all my maternity clothes after Morgan.

He was just ready to be done.

He said two is all we can handle. So I just keep getting dogs.

I have three children are a blessing. And when we first married, Mary, your mom said she wanted five kids in the wagon. And of course, I'm thinking that'll change once we have a couple of kids.

It didn't.

I still wanted them, but no, we, you know, I mean.

But now you got five grand, two.

Wonderful daughters, five grandkids, and I love it.

Yeah.

But, like, I'm sure you guys talk through that because you were on different pages, you know.

Dad, we talked through it before we got married.

Right.

Which is important. I never. I mean, I'm pretty open. Everybody knew I wanted children. Not.

But timing wise, you all got pregnant pretty quickly after you married. Were you both on the same page about that?

Oh, yeah.

Oh, okay. So, like, to this couple, because I know that I think you were more eager to get pregnant after we were married than I was, because I can kind of relate to this.

Yeah.

This is A little bit of a.

It's very much our story. I knew I wanted children, but you were like, let's go. And Dave, too. I think that you're more. You are more of the risk taker than me anyway. Not that I'm not. Not like, oh, this is like a risk. Let's roll the dice. But, I mean, there is, you know, because you don't know what's going to happen in your pregnancy.

Stepping into the unknown.

Yes, That's a better way of wording.

And life is full of moments where we have to step into the unknown.

And maybe the biggest transition of stepping into the unknown is going from not being a parent to the moment you become a parent. In a lot of ways, it's a bigger transition than the transition of getting married in the first place.

Because now the two of you together, you know, you've.

You've made this little person, and you're, you know, you're responsible for them.

And your life is forever changed. And in many, many good ways, but really in every way imaginable, life is different. And it's a rich blessing. And I'm so, so thankful for our kids. They are indeed a blessing. But, yeah, she might be going through.

Everybody brings into a marriage or into a relationship baggage from how they were raised.

Yeah.

Maybe she didn't have the best childhood.

Maybe.

Yeah.

You know, maybe her parents, you know, we're divorced or separated or. Right. I don't know. You know, so her. His reflection is different than hers.

Right.

And so they just have to kind of lean on. She needs to share with him. I'm afraid. You know, I tell Bill all the time, I'm afraid, don't leave me.

Yeah.

Like, when I had my knees done, I said they were wanting him to go, and I'm like, I need you.

Like, in the hospital.

Don't leave me.

And maybe that's what she's scared of, is like, maybe he'll. You know, maybe I'm gonna repeat some of the scars of my past, or maybe he won't want me anymore. Cause she said her body. And I think a lot of women do not voice this, but they don't know how their body's gonna respond to pregnancy and then to postpartum. And they're worried about those changes. I mean, and what. My sister went through that, and it really. Gosh, she ended up getting Bell's palsy, too, in her pregnancy, at the end, after she delivered, which that brought on so much anxiety. And so maybe she's heard stories like that. I mean, thankfully, my sister's doing great. But there is a stuff. So, yeah, I agree with my mom and what David said, you got to talk about it. And I know, guys, we just say that all the time in this podcast, but that's the key to a great marriage, is communication. I mean, a lot of issues that come up in marriage have to do with us not being willing to get vulnerable. And to be honest about it, and I would even say too, I mean, we need to pray about these things. You know, I don't. I. With mom saying don't get pregnant in fear, I mean, sometimes pregnancy happens and we weren't necessarily planning on it, and that's still a blessing, but there's maybe some fear because it is the unknown. And so you have to walk kind of that. That way together. But if are trying to plan and, you know, you're kind of trying to figure out, when do we have this baby, you know, I would just say really pray about it. And I think God's going to bring you to the same conclusion. It's kind of uncanny how he does that. He gives peace to the couple. And it might be that he gives you peace to have a child sooner rather than later, or it might be that he, you know, he kind of makes your husband realize, like, I need to really support my wife and her trying to process these things before the pregnancy. But I want to say this too. You can't possibly know all there is to pregnancy and childbirth and raising children. None of us do. We don't know how any of it's going to go. There's never a perfect time. But I'm telling you that when you lean into each other and you really kind of just give it to God, he is going to support you through that. And there are many times I was scared after our second child ended up in the NICU with, I guess, an issue called pda. You can look it up, but it has to do with his lungs. And I will say that I was really apprehensive to have a third child after that because it was such a traumatic experience of him being having to stay in the hospital and us leaving and not knowing at the time. I mean, in the beginning, they weren't sure he was going to make it. It was very traumatic. And we actually took a long time before our third child. And I think a lot of that subconsciously was because that was so hard, you know, and there were some other issues with Connor, and he's. Thank God he's healthy today. But it was, you know, I think we all have to, we just have to be patient with each other and have a lot of grace because having a child is a big deal. I mean, obviously. So I really appreciate your honesty in this question and we just will be praying for you guys and, and I just encourage y' all to really talk honestly and openly about this.

So.

Good.

Such good advice. But before we wrap up, I'll give.

You just a second to think about it.

I want Bill and Mary to each chair.

One piece of marriage advice. Doesn't have to be, you know, like the world's biggest earth shattering marriage advice, but just one simple thing that you.

Think couples could, could do that would make a difference in their marriage. And while you're thinking about that, I want to say thank you again to, to this lady who wrote in this question. And just to say that, you know, we're praying along with you and all those who are making this big decision about when to start a family, when and if to have, have that next child. But also, like Ashley talked about, to embrace the element of faith that goes in with any of these decisions and know that God is with you and he's never going to lead you to a bad place.

And you know, that child is going.

To be a blessing from the Lord. The Bible tells us that. And we can hold on to his truth even with all the uncertainty that.

Comes in those moments.

But like we said here, talk about it and pray that God would lead you both to a place of unity and peace on the decision. And yeah, I think with all parts.

Of marriage, that's, that's usually the place to start.

Yeah, absolutely.

All right, before we wrap up, guys, give me one. One piece of marriage advice. We're ready.

I think you should always remember that your spouse chose to be with you and treat them as good or better than your friends. You know, try to. And I.

And you're a great friend. Like, you're, you're saying that like you're, you're a wonderful friend.

I love my friends. Yeah, very much. They're very important and Bill is very important. And I think your spouse has to be important to you.

Absolutely.

And you should want them to be happy. You know, nothing makes me more happy than finding Bill stuff and bringing it home. I don't think he, he didn't even really realize what size shoe he wore because in the 41 years, he's never bought a pair.

Now he's a, he's a male model. I mean, like, he's.

She makes me look my best.

He doesn't buy Anything.

I don't buy anything either. What size sho do I have?

I know, 11 and a half.

And Bill even had the guy at the store measure him and he, he said, I know I'm a ten and a half. I said, Sweetie, haven't been at ten and a half for 41 years, so let him measure you. And he measured an 11, which I've always bought him.

So yes, even I knew dad's shoe size. I know.

He just, you know.

All right, dad, what's your advice?

Well, I was going to say something similar, what your mom said, but just like, remember, after years of marriage, you have to remember why you married to begin with.

Yes. Yes.

Because you know that's the person you chose and you'll have fights and arguments and you have to be patient and forgiving.

Yeah.

And that's my advice.

That's so good, Honestly, that, yeah, you guys are awesome. You're the pros.

41 years couldn't end on a better note. Bill and Mary, we love you guys. Thank you for all that you do. Love you and it's a privilege to be your son in law.

Yes. Love you guys.

I love being your brother and it's.

A privilege to have you guys watching and listening. Thank you so much for tuning in. So do us a favor, leave a review. It helps other people discover this podcast and, and we also read those reviews and they mean a lot to us. And share this with somebody, text it out or share it on social media. And when you do that, you partner with us in helping spread an important message that build stronger marriages. And so we appreciate you guys being part of this, this global online community, the Naked Marriage family. God bless. We'll see you next.

Time.