The 4 Seasons of Marriage

Welcome to the Naked Marriage podcast. We are Dave and Ashley Willis, and on this podcast, we address the truth about sex, intimacy and lifelong love. And we've got a special guest joining the conversation today. She is our good friend, Deborah Faleta. She is a licensed professional counselor, a national speaker, and author. She's the host of the Love and Relationships podcast. And we're going to be talking about some of the message in her new book, Love in Every Season, and how every season of marriage looks differently and what we do to make the most of every season. I'm really excited about this conversation, but before we dive in, my lovely wife, the love of my life, Ashley, is going to. She's going to share a recent review and an announcement.

All right, so we are so glad when you guys sent us reviews, and we've been getting so many of them lately. And actually today Deborah said that she wanted to give away a free copy of her book to whoever we read, whoever's review that we read today. And we don't always get to do this, so it's very special. But today, today our recipient is named Bailey and her. Her. Her handle is Price Bailey 6. She entitled this review Best podcast ever. And she said, dave and Ashley, I am a newlywed. October 19, 2019. I got married. But I've been listening to your podcast since the spring. It started with me turning it on while I cleaned and stuff, but then I played my favorite episodes for my fiance in the car and now we listen together all the time. Thank you for giving such great quality biblical guidance. Many thanks, Bailey. Bailey, thank you so much for leaving that review. Congratulations on being a newlywed. If you could just email us@podcastomarriage.com with your mailing address, we will get you that free book straight from Deborah fa. And you are going to love it.

You're going to love it.

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Well, as we said in the intro, we are so excited to have Deborah Fileta here with us and Debra, welcome to the Naked Marriage podcast.

Thank you, guys.

I'm so excited to be here with you.

It's gonna be a great conversation.

We always have great conversations, don't we?

That's right. That's right. And you know, we're gonna talk about something that we have never talked about on the podcast yet. And so I'm so excited about this. And that's the fact that there are seasons of marriage. And in fact, that's. That's really what your. Your latest book is about. And so if you wanna tell us a little bit about that, like why there are seasons in marriage, and why don't you kind of lead us into this conversation? Deborah?

Yeah. Well, as a licensed professional counselor, I end up working with so many couples and different stages, different seasons, different experience, different things that they're going through. And one thing that I noticed time and time again with working with these couples is that just as nature cycles through seasons again and again and again, so relationships also cycle through seasons again and again and again. And the seasons, I like to kind of of tie them to what we see in nature. Spring, summer, fall, and winter, because they have so many similarities to the seasons that we actually see in nature. So those are the four seasons of a relationship. And each season kind of offers you different opportunities to increase your intimacy and deepen your marriage. So that's kind of. That's kind of the theme of the, of love in every season.

I love that. And I think that there is such wisdom and understanding these stages or seasons because, you know, especially when we go into marriage, you know, we're coming out of a dating relationship, which also has gone through its own seasons and stages, right? And then, you know, we're married, and it's so exciting. There's been all this wedding planning, and, you know, maybe some people have gotten a new house or apartment, and they're just like, everything's new and exciting. But where a lot of couples fall into some trouble is when they kind of are leaving that season and going into the next of, like, the reality of marriage.

And.

And so how would you. What would you say to the couple that has kind of gone through, you know, that. That season of rapid growth, of. Of the excitement around their relationship, and then all of a sudden, they're kind of settling into the next. What would you say to them?

So most couples go through these seasons again and again and again. And the first season is the season of spring. You know, you just got married, you're so excited about the relationship that you have. Your emotions are high, you're feeling a strong connection. You know, if you think about the season of spring, spring in nature, it's full of growth and the blossoms are blooming and the sun is shining. I don't know about you guys in Texas, though. I Think you guys probably have summer all year round.

We do. We wish we had more kind of changes in the. In the seasons, but, yeah, we do. We have a lot of sun. A lot of. A lot of sun. I'm not complaining most of the year, but sometimes it's a little hot. But, yes, spring is other than Texas.

Relationships go through this season of spring, and. And that's where your emotions are really high. I think the problem then, though, is when couples, like you said, Ashley, start moving into the season of summer. Summer is when things start getting hot. And those emotions and the excitement and that friendship and that spark in spring starts to turn into something a little different, starts to turn into heat. Whether that be the. The emotional intimacy, whether that be the sexual chemistry, whether that be that spiritual connection. Your relationship is starting to de. In this season of summer. And I think for a lot of people, this is a really vulnerable season. You've got to start shedding your layers and realizing that you have to. Realizing that you have different opinions and different ideas, and how can you actually achieve intimacy emotionally and spiritually and sexually? You're working through a lot of stuff. Stuff in the season of summer. And I think that can be hard for couples to navigate.

Yeah, definitely. I mean, I'm thinking back to our own marriage kind of like that, going through those seasons. So I know what that feels like. And, you know, it is like, it brings on some unique challenges, especially when you're going through that the first time, because, you know, you're so specific in your book about how this is a cyclical thing. Like, we kind of go through this multiple times. And, you know, when we're newlyweds and we're experiencing spring for the first time, it's exciting. And then we go into that summer. You know, it can be just like the heat in Texas. I remember our first summer in Texas. It was like, whoa, this is crazy. Like, this is so hot. And in the same way, in a relationship, like you said, I think that especially in our culture, we so resist being vulnerable. But, you know, from what you're describing, I mean, it's something that is essential to really. To really win, so to speak, in that summer season.

It is essential. And not only that, but the heat of summer, it can either burn you or it can strengthen your marriage. I mean, learning to connect on all those deep layers. My husband and I went to a glassblowing class for a date night, and it was super fun. But one thing that we really noticed was, like, you need some really high heat in order to melt that glass and shape it and form it. And I kind of liken the season of summer to that same heat. It burns in a way, but at the same time it can mold you and fasten you into one like nothing else can. So it's a really important season to understand and to be honest. These seasons are important because if you don't recognize these seasons, you're going to miss them. You're going to miss the opportunities to deepen your relationship if you're not looking and actively searching out what you can do in each season.

And I love that. Yeah, and there's so much wisdom in that. I mean, even in just like natural seasons, I think we're kind of trying to teach our boys that you can't, you can't dress like it's summer when it, it is 20 degrees outside. You have to, you have to dress for the season. You have to like go out prepared for what's going to happen today. But I do think sometimes in marriage we do that. You know, we put on our summer clothes and it might be a winter season and then we're wondering why, you know, things feel cold or we. So what is your advice? What is your advice for those folks who maybe are having before we kind of jump into the other seasons, but just difficulty in recognizing or transitioning in between one season and the next. Like, how do you, how do you encourage that couple to recognize where they are and then make the adjustments necessary to fully embrace the season that they're in?

Yeah, that's such a good question. Well, each season kind of comes with its own characteristics. Each season comes with its own topics that tend to kind of rise to the surface. And I would say the season of summer comes with the theme of intimacy. And whether that be emotional intimacy, which is, you think it's a no brainer emotional intimacy when you're married, but it's not. Emotional intimacy is something you have to work towards. You know, one, one of the things that I compare emotional intimacy to is a spider's web. It's tiny, tiny strings of connection. And when they're put together, it turns out to be this very strong, elaborate web that ties you together. You've got to be intentional about connecting those emotional strings between each other, whether it be through the things that you have in common or the things that you don't have in common. And learning how to interact with your spouse, learning what, what works for them, learning what explains and, and communicates love to them. And then intimacy sexually. I mean, I'm sure you guys have all Kinds of episodes on this podcast about sexual intimacy and the important.

It's all Ashley wants to talk about ever. It's just always on her mind.

I believe it. I believe it, Ashley. And, you know, and learning how to deepen that part of your life. So maybe there's sexual intimacy or sexual struggles that you need to bring to the surface, or spiritual connection, you know, the intimacy of spiritual connection. So really, the big picture theme of summer is taking inventory of your intimacy and what you need to work on, what you need to change, what areas you're doing well in and where you need to grow.

I love that. And that's all those things come to my mind again. It's going back. And I love the image of the spiderweb. I just. I am going to use that and say, our friend Deborah Felada, please do. She knows what she's talking about when it comes to intimacy. That's just such a beautiful picture. And it also shows how much it takes to. Time and effort. It's not something, like you said that I think a lot of times we're under the impression like, well, we just love each other so much. It's just going to come naturally. And it's like certain things come naturally, but then you have to work at it. It's just not on autopilot. You have to make that effort.

You're absolutely right.

And like that weaving the web. It's a tireless. It's a very intentional, intentional, intricate, detailed effort. But then once you do that, and if you don't give up and you keep on doing it and making it stronger and stronger, and it's this beautiful picture of intimacy. And so I just love that. And I wanted to talk more about kind of the next season fall. And, you know, in your book, you talk about how this is where the true colors, you know, the relationship, begin to really shine through. And this is where vulnerability really comes through. And this can have, you know, lots of good things that come out of that, but it can also kind of have some hard things that come out of it. Right?

Yeah. For real. I mean, conflict and communication are the themes of fall. Because, you know, when we look at the season of fall, all of a sudden the green leaves are changing. And it's like, oh, wait, I thought you were green, and now you're not green anymore. And, oh, all of a sudden, now the leaves are completely falling. And that is kind of what happens in a relationship because you get to know this person deeply. Once you've kind of traveled through intimacy, now you're like, okay, wait a second. We're two different people with two different opinions. And the more you love each other, the more real and difficult conflict and conversation can become, you know, because the things that you love about that person can also be the very same things that drive you crazy about that person. When all the green is gone. And you know, one of my favorite chapters in this book, I talk about seeing an hd. And what I mean by that is sometimes in marriage, the little things that bothered us or the things that we even thought were cute, you know, like, oh, it's so cute that his apartment is just like a bachelor pad. Now all of a sudden in fall, you're like, this guy is atrocious. This is messy, a mess.

You're an animal.

You're an animal.

The things.

The beautiful green of summer is gone. And now it's replaced with all of these bright, vibrant colors that you've got to learn to deal with and you've got to learn to understand. And sometimes we can. Well, what I say in love, in every season, we can see an hd. And what I mean by that is we see more than we should see. Like, we're over critical and our eyes don't miss a thing and we're just ready to pounce each other when the other person does something wrong. And that's what can happen in the season of fall. Like, there's so many colors that you can really be blinded by how to do relationships in a healthy way, if that makes sense.

No, I love that. And the colors are so beautiful. But like you said, when we're just hyper focused on the one little thing that's wrong, it can really derail our relationship. And I wanted to ask, as a professional counselor, is this when you generally like the season that you see people coming to your office saying, like, we.

Need help, you know, unfortunately, usually they don't come in until they get to winter.

Till winter. Okay, that's interesting.

Summer would be a great season to come in for counseling. Fall would even be a great season, right? But the problem is people don't come at the first glance of conflict, right? They come when they feel like they're. They're done and there's nothing more they can do. And then it's too late. You know, not that it's too late, meaning God can't restore it, but maybe, man is it harder to restore something when you've waited far too long to actually start maintaining and working on something. So if you're in summer and fall right now and you're struggling with something. This is the perfect time to get yourself in counseling and start working through some of this hard stuff.

I love that. And you're hearing it directly from a licensed professional counselor. And so I love that because like you said, it's not that God can't do a miracle or that God can't respond or what has been lost, but there's a lot more damage that you're bringing in. You know, you're. You're just harden hearts, you know, and so I want. That's a great way for us to kind of go into what winter really is. So you've been in fall, you're having conflict and learning how to navigate that, learning how to communicate. But what happens in the winter season?

You know what's more dangerous than the heated conflict and the. On all those blazing bright colors everywhere is when you start to find yourself feeling like you don't really care anymore. Winter is the season of apathy. And it's like the emotions have cooled down, the bad emotions and the good emotions. Right. And you just kind of feel like you don't care. You just want to disattach. You just want to withdraw from the relationship and, and you feel this coolness go over your life. And coolness can be a good thing. When we talk about familiarity and comfort with the other person, there's. There's a lot of positive things that can happen underne the surface in the season of winter when it comes to feeling a deep comfort with the person that you're married to. But then on the flip side of that is the coolness of apathy. And I liken that in the book to frost. You know, it's really interesting that frost can be considered a natural disaster, and not because it's crazy like a hurricane or a tornado, but if frost affects a farmer's harvest, you know, before it's time to harvest, if there's an early frost, it can kill those seeds. It can freeze the ground and just destroy it without anyone even realizing it. You go to bed, you wake up, and it's like all of a sudden the frost is there. And that's sort of what can happen in our marriages with apathy. Apathy is kind of this slow, quiet monster, and all of a sudden you feel. You look at the other person and you just don't feel. Feel like you have an emotional connection or an attraction or desire. So that's kind of what can end up happening in the season of winter.

And that's so good. We always do a question at the podcast, and normally not quite this early, but we have a question that I think ties in beautifully to that winter season that you were talking about. So it might be a good time to go ahead and read it and get your input on what this could be. So I'm going to read today's question and then we're gonna have Deborah Faleta. I was saying it wrong for a long time. Deborah, I just wanna apologize for your whole life, but Foleta is actually much more beautiful than the way I said it. I think.

I thank you.

Let me, let me insert a joke here. My husband said we should name our first son save some so he could be saved some for later.

Oh, yes. I love that.

Thankfully, I vetoed that.

You know, me and your husband would get along.

I bet you would.

That's a legit dad joke.

I love it.

Dad jokes are my spiritual gift. All right. So I'm going to read a question. Thank you, by the way, to those who send in questions@nakedmarriagepodcast.com or reach out to us on social media. And today's question just beautifully fits in with this theme we've been talking about and specifically that winter season. So I'm just going to read this question and then we'll dive in and continue the conversation.

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Question says is there a time when it is appropriate to draw away or draw back a bit from expressing marital needs or concerns? Perhaps for a time to suppress your own thoughts and needs because of the space and time that your spouse is moving in? If they're dealing with a number of things such as that expressing discontent with the Marriage, relationship, would it be too burdensome for them? And then they conclude by saying, love your podcast and your advice. Thanks so much and thank you for that question. So, Deborah Ashley, what are your thoughts on this person who sounds like they're in kind of that winter season, and maybe there's a disconnect?

Absolutely right. That is such a good question. You know, I'll chime into this because I feel like from my perspective as a licensed counselor, there is a difference between pulling away and setting boundaries. I would say pulling away, when we word it like that, is not necessarily the healthiest alternative because you're just kind of putting space between you and your spouse. But the boundaries is a better option where you're drawing lines and saying, hey, this is what needs to happen. This is where we're at. This is how we can protect ourselves. Yeah. You know, in, in the season of, you know, once you get to the season of winter and you start feeling like there's no hope, you've got to remember that spring always comes again. There is always hope for spring to come again. And if you are going through the season of spring for, for the first time, maybe in your marriage or for the second time, what spring looks like is it's the season of planting. It's the season of planting new seeds. Even when the ground has been hardened, you can still plant new seeds. And the seeds that you plant in spring are going to reap a harvest later. So, so, so you can get out of winter any day you choose by starting the process of planting new seeds. And what I mean by new seeds is the actions that you are going to choose to take, the boundaries you're going to choose to set, the affection you're going to choose to display, the communication you're going to choose to have. All of these things are planting new seeds that will ultimately grow and reap a harvest later on in your relationship.

You know, I love that picture. I was actually going to ask you, you know, where do you go after the seasons, like, when you reach that winter point? And you answered my question. Like, it, it's, it's the hope of spring. And, you know, there was a movie years ago, and I think it was called like, like the, it had something to do with spring. And it was basically a couple. I'll have to look it up. We'll put it in our notes because I will find out what this is called. It has Meryl Streep in it, and it was so good. But it was basically about this, like, where a couple is stuck in that winter season for a very long time. And this couple gets to that point where they're like, I just don't know. I mean, we've been married for, like, 30 to 40 years. I just don't know if we're gonna last because we've just kind of been in this winter season so long. But what they do is they step out, they get help from a counselor who happens to be Steve Carell. So I'm remembering the actors. I can't remember the name of it. I'll find it. But it just ends up being this time where it's very hard, and it's very like what this couple in this question is describing, where they're pulling away, and they're kind of growing at different rates. But what they do end up doing is exactly what you're saying, Deborah. Like, they start planting and also, you know, allowing themselves to be filled with the hope of spring. And I love that because it does look so different when you're a retired couple, as opposed to spring when you're newlyweds, you know, and there's so much joy there. And I love how you talk about this in your book, because there's always hope, even when we feel like we're freezing, even when we feel like we've been frostbitten. And it's just one of those things where I think it's so good knowing that there is hope and knowing that there's things to look forward to and that we can go.

And speaking of the word hope, sweetie, our amazing producer Brittany Wilcox, found the name of that movie, and it is Hope Springs.

Oh, my gosh.

I knew it had Hope Springs.

I knew it had both of those.

My mind is blown right now.

Hope Springs.

Thank you, Brittany.

And, guys, it's a really sweet movie, like, just about these seasons and just kind of living, you know, seeing that winter to spring demonstrated as an older couple. And, you know, and, like, even with this question, and it's like, my heart kind of hurts for this person, because I can tell they truly care about their spouse, but they're also wanting to pull away. And I love how, Deborah, you're so right. I mean, pulling away and setting boundaries are very, very different approaches, because I think what happens when we're like, I'm just gonna just pull back a little bit is we just end up disconnecting altogether.

Exactly. And so many times when couples are struggling, they go from A to Z. It's like we're really struggling. So now let's figure out, like, how do we pull apart how do we separate? How do we. What do we do next? But I always challenge couples, make sure you have done B through Y before you jump from A to Z. There's so many steps you can take in the middle to help you get to the next season. And like you mentioned, getting the help of a licensed professional counselor is extremely important. Having mentors to come alongside of you and people who you're sharing with your marital struggles is also really important. And, you know, if you're married to somebody and you don't feel like they're ready to make those changes, you start making those changes. Sign yourself up for counseling. Go by yourself and begin learning how to heal from the inside out. Because when you get healthier, your relationships will ultimately get healthier as well. So even if it's just you doing the work, you continue to do that work and you trust God with. With what you can't do.

I absolutely love that that is the truth. You can always. There's always something we can be doing. And even if it is getting that individual professional counseling, it's moving us forward.

It really is. This has been such an important conversation. And Deborah, I want to give you the floor to share any last words in just a minute. But before we do, I want to make sure that our listeners know about this, this great new book that you've got coming out available everywhere January 14th. And it is called Love in Every Understanding, the four stages of every Healthy Relationship. And Deborah uses her many years of counseling experience and the years of ministry that she's done, plus her own marriage, to really, really help unpack this conversation we've been having on a much deeper level. And I really believe that this could be such a helpful resource for every couple that's listening. You can also connect with Deborah and the work that she's doing on her site True Love Dates and it's so good, y', all.

And follow her on Instagram. She's always putting some great information out there and really practical, awesome advice that you can. You can use in your marriage. And, Deborah, we want to give you the last word. So what else would you like us to know before we go?

Oh, thank you guys so much. You know, the one phrase that keeps ringing true to me as I'm, as I'm talking about the message of this book is that the quality of your relationships affects the quality of your life. And I just want to make sure that people realize they don't have to settle for bland relationships. They don't have to settle for being stuck in a season for life. I mean, seasons were meant to be cycled through, not stayed in. And you can keep cycling through these seasons, keep being intentional, keep being deliberate. And every time you cycle through, you get to a better, healthier, happier place in your relationship. So I just want to leave you with that word of hope.

I love it. I love it. Well, thank you guys so much for listening. Deborah, thank you so much for talking to us today. It's just been awesome.

Thank you, guys. I love you and Dave and what you guys are doing for marriages across the country. I just appreciate you guys so much.

The feeling is mutual.

Yes. And audience, we will see you guys next time.