How Caleb Went From Burnout To Big Wins!

What do you do when your dream job only pays you $25,000 a year and you're completely burnt out from working ridiculous hours? Well, that was Caleb. Talented, passionate, but stuck. Until one bold move changed everything. He went from surviving to scaling. And now I'm going to share with you exactly how it happened. No fluff, just the real story. If you're a creative or a video business owner feeling stuck, this might be the shift you've been looking for. Caleb Maxwell from Hebron Films. Thank you for doing this today. Let's just kick straight off. Tell me a bit about your story and how you got started in this industry and what brought you to the stage where you are today.

Yeah, right. So I started this business, Hebron Films, in 2000 and a long time ago. Thirteen and I started with a business partner. We started like a lot of production companies. We were video makers and we just saw lots of local TV ads. We're based in a regional center, Bendigo Victoria, and we just saw lots of bad ads and we thought I had a filmmaking degree, my mate had a camera and a computer and we thought we could do better than that. So we literally just went around knocking on doors until we, we got a few relationships going. I bet this is relatable to a few people where you've got the skills. But like us, we had none of the business, know how, absolutely none. And I'd be sitting in meetings with potential new clients and just nodding and thinking, making mental notes of what to Google after I, after I left the meeting because I had no idea what they were talking about. But we, we just did lots of things and learned lots by making mistakes. And we got to a point in business where it seemed like we were kind of hitting a bit of a ceiling. We got to about the 250k turnover mark, 220. And we just couldn't. A couple of years in a row, we just were bumping up against that and we couldn't seem to get past it. I was actually taking home $25,000 a year in salary, which is terrible. It so bad. Anyway, Fast forward to 2020. I took over the business from my partner. He went off and did something else and then, yeah, I mean everyone knows what happened in 2020. Covid hit and it was actually kind of the best thing for us. Right? We, we joined VBA that same year, start of the year or end of 2019, and it was amazing. It was kind of the best thing for us. We, we had a lot of new work coming in and we also were Doing. I was doing a lot of learning, lots of learning, lots of implementing of new things and we just got on a roll. So we, we expanded to a team of three up until 23 and then back down to a team of two in 24. But 2020 was a massive year. We, I, as I said, I 25k a year and at the start of the year, by the end of the year, I was taking home 100 in personal salary and the, the business was. Yeah, between the 3 and 400k mark. Crazy.

And tell me about some of the, you know, what were some of the things that you didn't know that you learned in the vba, that you then importantly implemented that, that that changed your mindset and the way in which you were approaching the business because you'd had two years of consistently hitting 250 and you jumped up to sort. What do you, what do you attribute that to? What are the, what were the steps that you can recall?

I remember having lots of great ideas and no clue of how to implement them. So I felt like I was lost in this cycle of too many options. I, I had so many things we could do and we, you know, I'd go away with my team and have these great brainstorms of all the marketing stuff we could do for ourselves, but it never led to any real action. And there was just, there was some, there was something miss in my mindset or my skill set that meant that I didn't take action on anything or I, there was a lack of a plan. So that that was the first big thing. Right. Is that the foundation joining the vba, setting the foundation of where we were heading, what we were aiming for, and setting in in place some strategic goals that we could just work towards and chip away at. That really brought focus to me and the team. And then it was getting in the habit of consistent and strategic action rather than lots of ideas.

You mentioned that you had a business partner. And I speak to a lot of filmmakers, as do you. And oftentimes we think, because I've done it, you've done it, we think that we just partner with someone, it's somehow going to be easier. And it very rarely turns out that way. What advice do you have for a videographer, a filmmaker who's, you know, looking to try and build a company, go beyond just being freelance, who's thinking about working with a business partner? What are some of the things, what are some of the benefits? But what are some of the pitfalls?

I would recommend that someone who's thinking about Partnering up with someone else. You need to ask why? Why do you want a business partner? And there's, there's good business partner relationships and there's ones that are, you know, set up to potentially fail or just be really hard. Everybody's different, right. So it's not, you know, not ragging on business partners at all. But the benefits were that you could split the workload. You had multiple people working in the same direction. That's all in theory until in my experience, we grew. We were really close mates to start with and then we just grew up a bit. Right. And we, we had different ideas, we matured differently. We wanted to take the company in different directions. We had different ideas about who we were as a business and who we served and who we wanted to, how we wanted to market ourselves. So the pitfall is if you have a business partner that is just doing exactly the same thing as you are. This is my experience. We would just, we had the role, we had the same job. So at the end of the day, the buck stopped with nobody. Nobody was held accountable, nobody was responsible because you know, there's two people and it was always responsibility was always deferred to the other. And you never owned a part of the process or a part or a role in the business. It was always split two ways. It's really hard to make decisions with a 50, 50 partner. Right. You, if you have different ideas, what do you do? So my advice with getting a business partner on board, you've got to ask, is it, do I want a business partner? Because I don't think I'm enough? Preaching to old Caleb here. Do I just think, is there like a self value deficit somewhere where I think I'm not enough to be a solo writer or solo business owner? But then also asking what there is strategic reasons why you would get a business partner, do they bring something to the table that's completely different to me and could be put in a different path of the business, like separated it. It's really tricky from, from experience to, to have a bring a business partner on board who is also a filmmaker and is just, or a producer and is just doing the same thing. You are fraught with danger.

I say I, I agree with you. I've had two different businesses with two different business partners and both times it's been an absolute disaster for all of those reasons. Plus I think the thing that always, you know, I have an expression with, with creative businesses which is getting the crayons out.

Yeah.

When we, when we have an idea of starting A business, all we see is the upside. We only think, oh my God, if we just put our sources together and we do this thing, we'll both be rich, it'll be dead easy. And, and in my experience, one person always does the lion's share of the work and the other person has a, a bit of an attitude about being asked to do things and it causes an awful lot of friction. And, you know, there's a couple know who, who do have a business partnership and they are, they work very well as a business partnership because one just does sales and one does the creative, and that's a great mix. But I still know that that business, there's some challenges because you're, you're suddenly not able to be in control of where the money is spent, how the money is distributed. And oftentimes in business partnerships, both business partners want a, a lion's share of the salary. And if the money's not there, you can't take it. But that doesn't stop people drawing money. And I've had business partners draw money out of a bank account without my knowing. I've had other business partners who have literally thought they were the brand and all they had to do was show up. And yeah, it's definitely a very messy situation. What I would say is if you are going to go into a partnership, you must draw up a partnership agreement that lays out every aspect of what happens if one of you dies. What happens if one of you wants to leave the business? How are the shares distributed? My personal preference is to own 100% of the shares and work with strategic partnerships, joint ventures where you do profit share or you do some kind of other benefiting kind. So, moving on from partnerships, I'd love to know some of the lessons that you've learned along the way in running your business, because I think inside the vba, we talk a lot about this. The business journey is just super hard. It's super challenging. And just because you've done well one month doesn't mean you're going to do well the next month. What are some of the lessons you can, you know, reflect on that, that you'd be happy to share for someone who's perhaps in that earlier stage of business?

Yeah, look right up the front. I mean, I've had so many lessons learned over the journey and they'll. You never stop getting lessons or problems present or opportunities or challenges that you never, they never stop. You just, I've found you just develop the muscle of being able to solve them better. It doesn't get easier, you just get quicker at solving problems. The start was really about transforming the way I saw myself and my role in the business. My first employee that I hired, it was a disaster, absolute disaster because I was, I was just a, I was an operator. Like I was just a doer in the business. I was just a cog in the wheel. Like I was producing videos. And I hired this guy because I needed some help, right? I had too much work on and then I just expected him to be me and just step into the business and do so. There was a big, big learning curve that I had to go on in how to manage people. And that is very different to you can't just bring someone into the team and expect them to be effective. Like you've got to set them up to succeed. And there's a whole, that's a whole conversation itself, right? But the, I reckon some of the key learnings and lessons that I had at the start were just being more strategic. Like we talk about the big things like niching understanding your customer and probably before that is just owning the business side of your business rather than trying to, trying to, you know, continually look at yourself as a creative only and avoiding sales, getting good at sales, getting good at numbers, data. Those are things that I avoided because I thought now look, I'm a creative, I don't need to be good at those things. But if you want to scale a business, you've got to make it a business. You know, we, we. I went through a process of, guided by the VBA foundations of identifying where the money was coming from, finding out how, which type of client I wanted more of breaking down the profitability of projects and then going through a process of presenting and speaking to my ideal client more effectively so I could get more of them. And so, you know, there's a whole range of different that looks different across your whole business from your website to your, to how you communicate in a sales conversation, to processes and systems. But that was some of the key learnings that really laid the foundation for us to scale.

I'm also curious about the topic of money. I've observed that and you know, I both spoken to a lot of people potentially looking to join the VBA and had pre conversations. And the thing that keeps coming up rather consistently, consistently is this expression when I ask the question, how much money do you want to make? And almost every single time the answer was something along the lines of, well, I don't want to be greedy, I don't want to be a millionaire or anything. But just enough to be comfortable. And I think that that's an interesting topic. That's first part of the question. Second part of the question is when you, as you have, in the time I've known you've gone from just you and Sammy to, to you and Sammy plus three children.

Yeah.

Your priorities change and so, so does your, I think, attitude towards money. Can you talk a little bit to that, that sensibility around why we, why creators have such a fear of money. And then the second part of that is, you know, what happens to you when life starts to become very real and you start to bring humans into the world?

Yeah, yeah. It was all very well and good to make 25,000 when, you know, I was living with me and Sammy were, you know, we were just on our own and cruising, cruising through life as younger people. But yeah, life gets real pretty quick. And money's. Money's a great subject and there's a lot of emotion, family, culture, history that plays into how you treat money or how you talk about it and how comfortable you are talking about it. I've got really, really comfortable in talking about money because I see as just a tool what it is. You know, there's a, A great wise passage that says the love of money is the root of all evil. And there's. There's this perception that people can have where they're kind of avoiding talking about it or they avoid thinking too much about it. And yeah, there's probably a lot of psychology that go. Could go on with that.

Well, I think also on that, that particular passage, people get confused by what that passage means.

Yeah, they do.

The love of money is the root of all evil. Yeah.

It's not money, but money.

But money's a fuel Source.

Yeah. It's 100% required if you want it. If you want to scale a business to whatever level, like, even. Even if you think. Look, I just, I reckon I said that, those words to you, Dan, on, On our call. Incoming call in the VBA when I first started. Look, you know, it's the answer you give when you don't know what to say. Like, you know, I don't want to be greedy. I don't know, maybe this, maybe that.

Probably because you haven't really ever thought about it in the time. Because I think in video we. We often see, like, I get to do what I love every day. So I do it, I do it for free. But of course, that's not a scalable solution.

It's not sustainable either. Like, I put a lot of Energy, a lot like all of my energy into growing my business in the first couple of years at the sacrifice of my life, at the sacrifice of my relationships and my friendships and my. And it was, it was terr. And I had the energy for it and I had the enthusiasm for it. But as soon as you like, it doesn't have to be many years of making 25 grand before it grinds you down and you are burnt out. Like you've got no more creative energy to put in. And you know, suddenly the thing that you really loved doing, you hate it. You have to go to work every day and make videos and you got into it because you loved it, but now it's the thing that you don't want to do and you avoid thinking about. I've been through those cycles where I just hated coming to work. I didn't want to come to work. So you can't, you can't think. Look, you know, I. You'd only do it for free if you were getting an income source somewhere else. You know, you need the money. You need it, you just need it. And the journey I went on was really owning that and understanding that money is an essential fuel source and it is just a tool. Like if it's, if it's in its right place, then it'll serve, it'll serve you. But there's so many people out there that are serving money. They're just, they're literally either they are not treating it with respect or the attention that it needs to actually for them to gain more of it, or they're just tied to it and they're all about it and they're a slave to money. So you can't be in either of those camps if you want to actually win and grow.

Now, when it comes to, you know, working with someone like myself in the vba, a journey you've been on for, I think over four years now. I remember when we first met, you told me that your business partner was very anti coaching. He just saw no value in coaching. Whereas you have been in the army, you're very involved in the church. You've, you've, you've been involved as a coach and a leader and, and I think you had a different view.

Yeah.

But I'd love to just address this topic because coaching has an investment in time, effort, mindset and financial. Yep. And, you know, I don't want to avoid these conversations because, you know, it's. The VBA is not free. It's, it's, it's less than you think. And more than worth it, in my opinion. But I'd love to hear from you. Someone who is making 25 grand a year, who is, who is going to invest a significant sum in a certain degree of unknown quantity. I mean, you didn't know who I was from a bar of soap. It was your employee, Bailey.

Yeah.

Who saw something I posted on LinkedIn and said, I think you should check this guy out. So talk to me a bit about that journey. You know, what were some of your thoughts and concerns? What were some of the things that you were worried about? You know, what is really going through your mind when, when you're in this kind of position of stuck, need some help, not sure where to go, and you're going to invest the cost of a camera and, and some into some coach who's, you know, promising to help you solve all your problems.

Yeah, well, to start with, we. I had to go through a journey of trying to do it on my own before I could realize that I needed help. And I got to that stage and like you said, my business partner. Yeah. For one reason or another. I don't know, pride, I don't know what it was. Just didn't want to. And so I, I was looking, I was open, I was keen. And Bailey, Bailey found, you know, and even though I knew I needed help, I knew I couldn't do it on my own anymore. I tried it enough and it wasn't working. I needed some external input. I knew the value of coaching through, like you said, the army and having church and discipleship. I know what the power of having a mentor or having a leader speak into your life and help guide your decisions and help you avoid mistakes, future mistakes, all that kind of stuff. But even, even then, like when I had no idea what, what the VBA was gonna cost, but we came along to one of, one of your in, in person events that we got the opportunity to. I'd listened to your podcast, actually. What was one of the first things I did to check out, you know, who is this guy? Den Lenny. What. What is, what value is he gonna be able to bring to our business? And I just got so many. I really resonated with the way you saw the world, the way that, what you were sharing and speaking about in terms of guidance and the way you saw business. And you spoke directly to me. Right. Because video business, I was a video business needing help, and you're a video business offering help. So the challenges that I had to overcome, really, even though I wanted a coach, was still a commitment and A decision to be vulnerable, to be open to someone coming in. There's a bit of fear attached to and a bit of self consciousness attached to the thought of someone coming in and telling you you've done it all wrong and you've got all these issues. And my business was a mess and I knew there was lots of issues, but there was an apprehension to opening that up and showing someone the mess. That was one thing I had to overcome. The money thing was big, right? Because I hadn't, you know, we bought cameras and stuff and that's an easy thing for video people to do is buy gear. That's easy, easy, easy that buy gear you can't afford usually. But the thought of investing in myself, that's a lot deeper. That's a lot deeper and it comes with a lot of emotion. So there was a bit of a process I had to go on and you actually led me on that beautifully of going like, well, if I don't do it now, when are you going to do it? You know, if not now, then when and you know, if, if not then, then who? So I, I eventually just took the step and it was a bit of a leap of faith, right. I couldn't, I couldn't necessarily on paper, afford. Didn't take long to, for the revenue in my business to increase. Like you, you look at it, I looked kind of how, how long is this going to take me to get a return on the investment and actually was a lot quicker. Like we, we had a few big wins early on, reduced expenses, sharpened up. Our operation was open to you seeing the mess and getting feedback from yourself and others in the group and, and it paid itself off in no time.

And you know, I think, I actually don't know, I think it might be what, 2024 and you joined, I think 2019. So that's the fifth year of U.S. working together and for anyone watching this beyond the first year in the vba, there is no tie in, there's no commitment other than a monthly fee. And, and I'd love to ask you because, because I, I actually don't mind if someone watching this coaches with myself. You are, you know, the video mentors or, or goes with someone else. I know with pretty much everyone in the industry, they all offer something different and if I'm not the right person for you, that's totally cool. But I think it's important that you get some kind of coaching. But you know, we've become great friends but as I say to people when I'm talking to them, about the program. I've become great friends with these guys, but they don't pay every month for a mate. So I'd love for you to share. Why are you still here? You know, why is it after five years you, you still choose to, to be part of this process and still invest every month in, in being part of that? What, why is that? I mean, are you crazy? Like, people will be asking themselves a question. Surely you've learned it all by now. Why would you continue to keep going? You know, he can't be a very good coach if you're still there five years later.

Yeah, and it's a really easy, I've actually had someone say, oh man, that's a really easy perception to shift because people are so focused and they expect that there's a destination that they're going to get to and then they're going to have everything sorted, they're going to know everything, they don't need any more help. That's just not the case. Like I said earlier, you never stop getting problems. You will never stop learning. And if you do stop learning, then that is your downfall. And I experienced it fairly recently. Six months ago, I got to a stage where I got a little bit complacent and things were working really well. We made half a million dollars in annual revenue. And you know, I'm just like, it's all high fives and bum taps all around. Then I just took my eye off the ball of learning. Like, what else? What are my weaknesses? What do I need to develop? What do I need to continue with? And look, I ended up in a, in a absolute ball of misery, little, little puddle of mess. And, and if I hadn't have had the vba, the community around me during that time, we had some economic, environmental shifts that just exposed some of the weaknesses and flaws in how I was running business.

In our business structure, just for context, you had two or three projects that were dialed in, deposits taken, they were all good to go and they got delayed by two or three months each. And I think it's important to mention that even when you've got the projects locked in, things can change out with your control. And I think that's what you're about to talk to is the fact that I just wanted to mention the detail. Like this wasn't some crazy ball dropping exercise. You bought a bit of gear when things were good and you were like, we're cool because January sorted. And then January became May.

Yeah, it was terrible. Yeah, it was really, really terrible. And it only took A few things to happen for everything to change. The upward trajectory that we were on was suddenly a downward trajectory and I wasn't prepared for that. And look the, I've learned a lot of lessons through that. But I knew before that that journey in business is just that it is a journey. And like in life, if you, if, if we didn't have a guide, if we didn't have a community to walk this journey with, then we're just exposed, you know, we're just, we're just a bit more vulnerable to what we can see. And so throughout my whole, you know, we, we connect weekly in a group coaching call. You're on hand. We have in, in the elite program, we have in person events like there's so many connection points to one bring me accountability to get an outside perspective on the choices that I need to make every, you know, regular choices throughout business and opportunities. I get to bounce those opportunities off a group of people that able to give me external perspective. It's like I have my own board kind of thing that all understand video business and they're all on their own journey. You have walked the journey and are now guiding others. So this idea of why would you still need a coach? I'm never going to stop needing a coach. And it's not because I'm deficient or lacking in any major way. Every single person needs journal perspective brought to their, to their life. It's just, that's just who we are as people. Right?

Yeah. And I still have a coach. You know, I will never, I don't think there's been a year in the last 14 years where I haven't had a coach or mentor who I've spent probably in excess of 20, 30, $50,000 a year with. And if you haven't invested in yourself, it won't make any sense. But I'd love to just talk a little bit about this notion of community. You know, the word community is banded around a lot and you know, there are different types of communities. You know, there are communities on Facebook, free groups on Facebook where freelancers get to talk about, you know, how bad the rates are. And, and I've observed, and again, no judgment, but I've observed a little bit of, you know, the herd saying there's no work. And everyone's like, there's no work, there's no work, there's no work. Everyone believes there's no work. It's like watching the news. I'd love you to just share a little bit about your journey in. We have three communities we have a free community, we have a hub level community and we have the elite community. Can you just talk a bit about what you observe both as a coach in some of those lower tier communities and also as an active contestant, if you will, in the elite journey?

Yeah. There's a couple of unique elements of the communities and it's shared across the board in the. It reminds me of when you're talking about the herd mentality. I can just imagine like a bunch of, and no disrespect intended, but the bunch of dodos from, from Ice Age running around just jumping off cliffs blindly. If, if you are surrounded by people who, who are just seeing the downside, then that's all you'll see. It's the downside. But, but the VBA communities are growth communities that we're all in here on a growth journey and we're committed to that. And that's like a prerequisite to coming in. Right? You need to be one who is willing to take action and you need to bring some positivity and some contribution. So the contribution element is really, really important. For me, creative communities can sometimes, how do I say this? We, we can sometimes be a bit self conscious about competitors. So, you know, when you see someone, someone else in your industry or even in your area doing really, really well, there's an opportunity from, for comparison and for a little bit of envy or you know, you know, everybody will relate to this. Right. But that's not present in the vba, which I just think is wonderful. It's remarkable. We all make a commitment to contribute to the group and really celebrate each other. And it's a culture of the, the saying a rising tide lifts all ships. I my ability to celebrate someone else frees me from comparison. Even if they are an equivalent type of business in my area, even. It is truly remarkable. The distinguishing factor for me, for the community is the fact that we don't have competitors, we don't treat each other like competitors. We're collaborators, we're friends on the same journey. Me, we're all very fairly similar, eerily similar in some of our life stages and things. But we're all going in the same direction and we love it when we see each other succeeding.

I think it talks to the abundance culture which, you know, that is fostered inside the community. And I think what's important to mention is that I created the VBA communities for me because when I was building my business I had to go to, you know, different coaching programs that were generic in their nature and one of the great things about attending lots of different seminars, coaching programs, masterminds, is you get to see how the things that you like and the things that you think. I'm not sure that really quite gels. And so, you know, there's, there's, there's, there's one of two routes you can take. One is go and find the program that best suits you or want to start your own. And I was given advice to start my own because at that time there was really only myself and Ryan Corll who were doing anything remotely coaching related. And the first thing I did was we, we went on each other's podcasts and we hung out. And it's like, because some people will like Ryan, some people like me, and, and, and, and like, we've, we've always both said, you know, the, the, the purpose of us doing this is to get more people to invest in themselves. And that's our purpose. So I think that feeling of purpose is very strong. And yeah, I'm just wondering, you know, for someone who's maybe watching this and they've never heard this frame purpose or, you know, culture, how does, how does being in an environment like that benefit your bottom line? How does being in that environment make you a better business owner, make you serve your clients better? Can you tell me a bit about, about that notion?

Definitely. Well, there's the funny thing that we do in business where we separate the business and running the business from ourselves a little bit. You run into that, that notion. But what's really required is personal development. And you know, we know that having. I know that having been on this coaching journey and in the community, we talk to lots and lots of different people. They come in for the, the business skills and often stay for the community and the personal development that they can see happening within themselves. So, so that is a really, really key element of growth, from my perspective, is the requirement and the understanding and the embracing of developing personally. And that has an enormous impact on the bottom line because you can't separate your business from who you are, from yourself. And if you can continually develop, the business journey is just full of areas for improvement. Right. There's just so many. But as you make some of those improvements in the way that you like. Sales is one of my favorite things. Right. But sales comes with a whole lot of, a whole lot of baggage with a lot of people. They don't want to come across as sleazy or they don't want to come across as, as attached to money. They're creatives, they Just want to make cool things. But as soon as you redefine that perception within yourself, then you're going to make more sales. And there's the bottom line. Everything that we do is in, is in pursuit of growth. But it's not all, you know, superficial skills based stuff.

It's such an interesting point you raised because I'm still on my journey. You know, I don't have all the answers, but one thing I've noticed and one thing that I found the VBAs encouraged me to do is be more me and lean more into the areas that perhaps I might feel a little bit left of center when it comes to running a business. But I know from my own journey they're absolutely integral. And that's something that I find to be very interesting. And I think that, you know, a lot of videographers when they're starting out almost feel like they've got to be a character, they've got to perform in a certain way. But actually how have you noticed that? Becoming more you and leading with that in your marketing, leading with that in your personality that you have when you have business conversations. Tell me a bit about that. How has that benefited you?

Yeah, I've actually noticed and have said before that I think we're in the age of authenticity. People, people can smell marketing BS a mile away. And like the things that people have done that worked, they're not working anymore. People just want to connect with other people. People, they just want to deal with someone who's going to show up as who they are and not have this business facade on. And so I, I lean all the way into who I am and I just. One of my biggest goals in every interaction I have in business is to connect with that person. And that's, I reckon that's one of my superpowers in, in that's helped grow this business is because people just work with people they like and they want to hang around, right? They, if you connect with someone, you push past this business facade thing and you get, you get a real genuine connection and a human connection, they're just going to want to work with you and they're going to find a way to do it. And so yeah, the, where being authentic is one of the most powerful things you can do because there are so many people who are not being authentic and it's not detracting from anyone else. There's only one Dan Lenny and there will only ever be one. So you know, that's the way to uniqueness, right, is just be more you and that's the way I see everybody. Like, there's only one Caleb Maxwell. I don't need to be trying to be anyone else or be, you know, the picture of a perfect business leader that I think is external. I just need to be me, and no one else can do that.

I agree. And I. And I love you for who you are, and I see that with. With absolute heart. I think one of the strongest cultural values inside the VBA is love. And love is not something people tend to talk about in business.

No. And I don't want it. I don't want people to get confused here. It's not like. Like, we've got some very financially successful businesses in the group. We talk about money all the time. We are talking about specific business things, you know, practical things. But you're right. Like, there's something different about the VBA in that we also talk about all the other things, because a business, it's a holistic kind of approach that we have to business. We don't just treat the business and then, you know, your family, your personal life, your thoughts about yourself, your perceptions of the world are all over here. It is intertwined, and it is so integral to treat a business journey in a holistic way so that you can, you know, that's why we start the VBA process with a vision board. We set the vision of where we want to go so that we can attach our direction and our desires to something tangible and we can actually give that a frame of reference. We can bring it into the world rather than just saying, saying, look, we want to. We want to make a million dollars. What do we.

Why.

Why would you want to do that? So we. We set that in front of us and we lay it out in the real world and go, this is what I want. This is what I want on paper. And then we build from there.

A lot of members in Elite certainly are either married or in committed relationships and are either buying their first home or starting a family or, you know, evolving their family. And I'd love to. And I've been lucky enough to meet Sammy on a couple of occasions and. And little Quinny. You've had two more since then.

Yeah.

But I'd love to know what Sammy thinks of this and you in this journey because she's the person you are closest to in the world.

Yeah.

And our wives, partners, they're often the ones who have the greatest love for us and want us to be safe. But also, it can be a challenge being married to someone running a business because you never really switch off.

Yeah.

I just wonder if you've had conversations with Sammy. She said things to you about your journey inside the vba?

Yeah. What.

What has she observed over the last four or five years?

If I. If ever. Ever I talked about, which I never have, but if I ever I talked about, maybe I should, you know, leave the vba, I don't think she'd let me. Sammy. Sammy loves me, thank the Lord. But she knows me, and she knows all my weaknesses and. And I can. I can come across with a very positive front, but she knows that the VBA knows me. You know, they're the. They're who keep me accountable, my community, you know, me, all my good bits and my bad bits.

So we celebrate all of them.

Yeah. Yeah, that's right. And it's all okay because everyone has them, right? Everyone is a. A multifaceted human person with lots of, you know, lots of things going on. Sammy. Sammy really appreciates that. That she's not the one that cops all of the. The whole. All the struggles. Because while it's not easy, maybe being married to a business owner, it's probably not easy if they don't have another outlet where they can process things, where they can share the challenges, where they can vent, where do all that kind of thing. If. If you don't have someone like that, if you don't have a community or someone who gets it, that you can let all that stuff out on you, most likely letting it out on your. Your significant other, which is just no good. And that's probably where it becomes hard. So Sammy's like, please. You know, she's on Team VBA all the way. Because she's like, you know, that's. Those are the guys that you can process everything with. I don't need to know all of the challenges, and that's sometimes really not welcome to know really stressful situations because she doesn't need to share and carry that burden. That's mine to bear. But I. I equally need help with that. And that's where the VBA comes in.

Yeah. That's awesome. Just to sort of wrap this up, what advice would you give maybe younger Caleb or. Or a version of a Caleb who's sitting out there in the Internet just now, who's running a business, who's. Who's having some challenges? Are there any. Is there any advice or perspectives you would share with them, knowing what you know now, having gone through this journey for five years and what. That's how that's enabled you to become the version of who you are today.

Yep. Yeah. You. The journey in. And I've had the opportunity to see a lot of other members in the VBA video businesses do really well and grow really well. And I've been able to see it in myself. The ones that do really well are the ones that are committed to changing. They're committed to uncomfortable and consistent action. And advice I would give is you need to lean into change. You need to be okay with being uncomfortable and doing things that are hard and change. Because if you're too precious about things or you know, you think you always know best, take a. Take a pill of realism and suck it up and go, look, if I'm going to get help, I need to submit to the advice that I get. I need to be humble and I need to take action on what I'm being guided to do. So the things that helped me the most, they were really simple. Like the things in the foundations kind of area of the vba, they're pretty straightforward, but they still require you to, to show up and to take action on them and just do it quickly. Like, that's the best advice I can give is once you, once you're given a direction or given a piece of work to do, just get in and do it and become okay with being uncomfortable, because that's just part of the journey.