152 - The Importance of Communication and Value in the Home Improvement Industry with Garage Living's Aaron Cash

Welcome to Listening with Leaders. I'm Doug Noll, lawyer turned peacemaker. I teach executive leaders how to listen to emotions rather than words so that they can become the leaders everyone wants to follow. And I teach those same leaders how to be authentically present, available, and connected to their families despite being insanely busy. I have learned that we are 98% emotional and only 2% rational. Learning how to listen to emotions is, in my experience, the foundational skill of life. Stick around to the end of the show and I'll reveal how you can be on our next guest in 15 to 20 minutes. So let's get started.

Aaron Cash, welcome to Listening with Leaders. You are the co-founder and president of Garage Living, found at garageliving.com, and you're in the, the business of remodeling garages on a franchise model. Thanks a lot for showing up.

Thanks for having me.

So tell us a little bit about your backstory, how you got into this business. Yeah.

So before we started the business, I was fortunate enough to have a couple of positions with large multinational marketing organizations. And it was one of those things where you learned where you didn't want to be. Versus sort of where you wanted to spend your time. So I quickly recognized that the large corporation perhaps wasn't the best fit for me and I was interested in sort of carving my own path. Some people get that entrepreneurial bug early in life, some people, you know, get great experience in the corporate world and then transition. For me, it was something I wanted to do sort of right out of the gate. So after I graduated from business school, that's That's what I decided to do. And a couple of friends, classmates of mine and I, we went to visit a contact that one of us had in the Chicago area. And that contact was in the metal fabrication business, had worked on some consumer products in the past and sort of gave us some exposure to garage storage organization. And home organization in general. And that was at a time when HGTV was exploding. DIY was all the rage. Home Depot was opening up a store every day in North America. So the category was just, the category, our category was in its infancy, but home improvement in general was just on fire. And so this seemed like a great opportunity to really explore something that was, relatively untapped. And we thought originally, this is fantastic. This gentleman has a product line, we're gonna distribute it and we're gonna get a golden ticket as soon as we, we get a purchase order from a large retailer, which was an interesting lesson because those large retailers, mass markets, take risks on categories that aren't proven or things that they think will be a demand, but they don't have the consumer demand yet. So we got a lot of nos and we decided to change gears and pivot and really build a model, model that went direct to consumer. And that's sort of how Garage Living was born and how we have evolved since those very early days.

So in the beginning, were you guys doing all the sales and installation work yourselves?

Yeah, it was, it was quite interesting. You know, we had 3 business school students that I think of the 3 of us, I was probably the most handy and that, that was limited to doing some projects with my father on weekends and things like that. Definitely was not a carpenter, had limited exposure to a lot of the tools that we would need. But I was willing to learn and figure it out. And so yeah, we did all the sales. We quickly hired some staff to do installations professionally. But yeah, we had to figure it out right from day one. And, you know, that was a lot of fun, a lot of hard work, but a lot of fun at the beginning.

And at some point in time, you pivoted to a franchise model. Tell us about that.

Yeah, so we spent about 10 years really understanding and growing our business. We did end up doing a lot of distribution of products that we developed and contract manufactured for ourselves from overseas. And around 2009, 2010, we sort of spun that off because it really had taken on a life of its own. And it was at that, that sort of that turning point that we decided to refocus on, on garage living and really reinvest our resources and build it, and with the focus of expanding geographically. And so by 2015, we had done all of our legal documents or disclosure documents and enough research that convinced us that a franchise model was definitely a great way to expand in many different markets across North America. And, you know, as we sort of round the corner for 2023 and 2024, we're just over 50 franchise units. And, you know, we're looking to double that size over the next few years. So it's been a very exciting ride.

Tell us about your typical franchisee.

Yeah, so it's evolved a little bit over the last number of years. You know, there was a time when we were bringing in a lot of individuals who had come from the corporate world with a sales and marketing background and wanted to build a business on their own. And that's still the case a lot of the time. We do get people that have worked for others in a construction-related field where sales is obviously something that they're very comfortable with. The installation side, the construction side, for the most part can be taught and we can hire great team members that can complete that side of the business. But, you know, working with people, marketing, you know, understanding what it's like to take a customer through an entire journey is really the critical, the critical experience and skills that we look for in our franchise candidates.

So you got what, 50 or so franchisees now? Franchisors? Yeah. And I think the magic number I've heard is you want to break 100 and, you know, you hit the big time.

So it really depends on what model you have. You know, if you're talking about service restaurants, you know, 100 will not cut it. You need real volume.

Right.

And those groups and those brands tend to get big real quick. For us, it's a bit different. I mean, our volume and our average ticket is much higher than, you know, obviously going and get a burger and fries or, you know, maybe a burrito is more popular these days. But it's a different business model altogether. In home services, I mean, the 50-unit mark is significant. That being said, we still got a lot of runway. We're now in 3 countries. So we were successfully launched in Australia this past year. Which is exciting. So we're now in Canada, the US, and Australia, which is very interesting markets.

So as president, what are your typical day-to-day duties and problems that you have to solve?

Yeah, it's a great question. I mean, I feel like there are a lot of different challenges that I get involved with on a day-to-day basis. You know, looking back over the last 3 years, it's been a wild ride, really. Really since COVID started. I'll take it back a second even farther in that when we were operating our corporate franchise location, which we still do, my partners still run that business and it's our single largest unit here in Toronto. You know, we were very much in, you know, operating the business on a local level and we were satisfying each customer one at a time and working on all of the different elements of marketing to generate more leads. When we grew, we created an entirely new business. It's a, it's totally separate operation. It has an infrastructure to support other business owners with a marketing department, a finance department, supply chain and everything else required in order to build something that supports other businesses. So my day-to-day obviously has changed and in the last year as we've grown and built out our infrastructure has definitely become become a little bit more strategic. I try and do my best to have amazing team members that take care of some of the more day-to-day, in-the-weeds type of tasks. I roll up my sleeves as much as I possibly can and need to. So I always tell everybody I'm not too good for anything, whether that's loading a truck late in the day or, you know, accepting a shipment or, you know, figuring out a challenge with a an order that has to go somewhere, I'm happy to take care of that. But we've worked very hard to build a team that has increased our efficiency and productivity and improved the level of support for our franchisees. So my day-to-day now is really working with our department leaders. I still do a lot of our franchise development, meeting with new candidates, working with our youngest franchisees as they get out of the gate. I work a lot with our operations department in terms of helping them to assist our franchisees to get to the next level. And I spend a lot of time in our marketing as well. You know, we do a lot of great work with our digital marketing and improving our systems and our IT to maximize our marketing spend and generate as many leads as possible for our franchisees. So that's, Typically, and in the finance role, I mean, you know, I'm working on our plans and looking at our budgets often. So that's sort of what my day is in a nutshell, if I can sum it up.

It sounds like a full day. What do you think the biggest challenge is for your franchisees and for the business in general?

So I would definitely say there's two, which is really interesting. The first is market awareness. You know, I explained a bit about garage living and the garage transformation category. But in many places where we don't operate yet, there may be a local company that, that does work like we do in the same category, I should say. And there may be another small franchise brand also in the local area. But by and large, there is still an enormous segment of the population that has never heard of the work that we do. So Our, you know, one of our biggest challenges is really to create more market awareness as we get into a market and, and really explain to people not only what we can do, but what the value of the garage is, you know, if it is finished and if it takes on a different purpose. And then the second is obviously brand awareness, you know, it's a challenge, but, you know, one of the, the major benefits of joining a franchise brand is that you get out of the gate very fast and we have a lot of the tools in place in order to create that brand awareness very quickly. So, you know, it's exciting once we launch a new market and we launch our campaigns, we're generating leads within days.

Wow.

And so it's, it's pretty exciting.

You do any new construction workers at all remodeling?

No, it's, it's both, you know, given sort of where we sit from a positioning perspective, most of our new construction work is oftentimes in custom home builds. And that's great because we work with a lot of custom home builders and architects and designers that become, you know, partners, business development partners, or trade partners rather, that we regularly get referrals from. So that becomes a great source of repeat business for us. And, you know, they're often working on fantastic projects. Some of the larger-scale home builders, you know, in the States they call it track homes or large subdivision homes. It's still fairly low on the adoption curve just in terms of all of the other areas of the house that potentially a lower-value home may look to, you know, think about where they want to put their dollars. You know, this product's not for everybody in that You know, people really have to prioritize where they're spending their money, and, and that's okay, and that's, that's important. And, you know, hopefully one day we'll be everybody's customer, but, uh, it's not typically, um, uh, for everybody at the same time.

What, what's the basic price range that people can expect if they want to have you guys come in and redo the garage? Or do it—

that's a great question. Yeah, and, and we often talk about, um, sort of our overall project size, um, and, you know, I can, I can, you know, share it from two perspectives. One, in that, you know, over our project size typically starts around $10,000 and then can go up well over $100,000. And then there are, you know, elements of our projects that can be, you know, far lower than $10,000 and they may just be, you know, working on the floor or doing some organization and we can do elements of that. But our overall project size when you're talking about something full scope, it starts at around $10,000.

I was— That being said— Go ahead.

Oh, sorry. That being said, I mean, you know, that $10,000, if you think about it on a per square footage basis, when you're talking about a large garage space or a garage space in general, is exceptional value compared to a, you know, basement or kitchen or bathroom that, you know, cost, you know, many multiples of $10,000. So we always talk about the space and how valuable it is and the opportunity there.

So I would imagine the cost per square foot is a lot less than doing a kitchen or a bathroom.

Significantly less.

And, but, and I saw some of the pictures on your website at garageliving.com, and I mean, they're drop-dead gorgeous. They look like showrooms.

Yeah, they can be. You know, we always, like most companies, we want to show our best and, you know, give everybody the inspiration into what the garage can become. A lot of our projects, though, are, you know, a combination of that showroom look but also very functional. So, you know, we will have customers who have a collector or an exotic car or just a number of cars that they love. We also have our— probably our largest customer segment is just our families who are busy families who may have children who are sort of in their prime, you know, school age. And they have sports equipment and they have, you know, shoes and boots and they have everything under the sun that needs to be stored in the garage, from bikes to, you know, holiday decorations and, you know, everything else in between. So it is somewhat challenging at times to, you know, really create a space that's very valuable, that's an extension of the interior of the home, and that's also consistent with their lifestyle. And that's really what we also work to, you know, communicate in our messaging is that, you know, the garage space can be consistent with the rest of your house. It can be an extension. And it is about, you know, the lifestyle that you live and creating a space that's consistent with that.

So you've been doing this for a number of years now. What is it that gets you excited every morning you get up and go to work?

So, you know, it's, it's changed definitely. I think, you know, when we were starting off earlier, it was really just about, you know, finishing that project. You know, that's one thing that's really exciting for myself and, and a lot of our franchise partners is that, you know, our projects don't take a long time to complete and getting to see that project from start to finish is extremely rewarding. And then, you know, being able to share that with the client in terms of their overall experience and, and, you know, their, their overall joy when the project's complete and they get to use the space, that's definitely exciting and gets us moving. For me now, it's really about supporting the wins of our franchise partners and helping them overcome challenges that we've experienced before and leveraging all of the tools that we have at our disposal and our experience to help them to grow faster. And, you know, really avoid as many hurdles as possible. So, you know, when I'm able to, you know, coach someone or work with our team to help them coach someone to avoid a problem or to, you know, figure out a solution to something that we've experienced before is a lot of fun because that's why we worked with, you know, or decided to go the franchise route. We wanted to leverage our knowledge And every day I'm excited about the opportunity to do that.

How do you—

do you manage—

do you have to manage conflicts or disputes with customers and franchisees, or do they— is that something that franchisees have to deal with on occasion?

Yeah, so typically a franchisee would deal with their client directly, but it's not unheard of that we may get involved even at the franchise partner's request. To say, listen, I'm having trouble dealing with this client. They have an issue with this or that. And it's very easy for us to give them a call or have a call together and say, you know, we just want to make sure you're satisfied. What can we do to solve this issue? How do we go through the motions in order to make that happen? And, you know, sometimes it's a very easy challenge to overcome and other times It's very difficult to satisfy a homeowner, and we do our very best to do that and, you know, provide the support to our franchise partner to not only get past this one project, but learn from this experience and, you know, be able to manage it on their own any time in the future where they have something similar.

Right. You know, any time you're doing it B2C, you're going to have people who are going to be unhappy no matter how good you are.

Yeah, absolutely. You can't Yeah, and you know, it's interesting, we have sort of a saying that we use when we're in our sales training that, you know, if you share or set the expectation that things are gonna go right 100% of the time with the client, you're always going to, or you're likely to disappoint someone. However, if you set the expectation that Regardless of how things go, that you're going to be honest and upfront and you're going to come to the table with a solution to a problem, you're likely to satisfy that client 100% of the time. And we really, you know, use that to demonstrate that, and that, you know, that's part of home improvement and part of home services is that there's things can go wrong. You know, you can discover something that you didn't know was there, or you can encounter a challenge that may be completely unrelated to your work or the project, but how you handle that and how we conduct ourselves and, you know, how we pride ourselves on integrity really makes the difference between, you know, someone who is leaving you a 1-star review and calling our office and looking to speak with someone beyond the franchise partner to really just, you know what, a review that says, you know, we had this issue, they were professionals through and through and were thrilled with the overall result despite having to deal with this. Yeah, so, um, there is a— there's definitely two ways to handle conflict, um, or disappointment. And, uh, we always, you know, really focus on— oh, sorry, my screen went blank. Um, we always focus on, uh, uh, you know, the best way to do that is, is just to be honest and upfront and, and communicative.

Well, that gets us to the title of the show, Listening with Leaders, and I'm always interested in learning about from your perspective, how important is listening in your business?

Listening is much more important than speaking and sharing in most cases, whether that's with our team here, our franchise partners, it's critical. We need to understand what someone else is experiencing how they're feeling. You know, we've done a lot of professional development, and so we use a number of different strategies and tools to separate feelings from emotion— or sorry, emotions from facts. And, you know, once we can, you know, name the emotion and really call it out and provide empathy, we're able to, you know, determine exactly, you know, based on the fact how we deal with a situation, right? And so, uh, but listening and understanding and being empathetic is critical to solving any problem that we have, right?

I teach both my academic students, my graduate students, as well as all of my clients, de-escalate, then problem solve. And the de-escalation process sounds like something that you guys have figured out, and that is that you ignore the words and pay attention to the feelings. And when you validate how people feel, they calm down. And then all of a sudden, you can have that conversation that transforms the problem into something really amazing.

Absolutely. And, you know, the best example of this is, you know, I think this is probably very common with small business owners or new business owners where they think they're not making any money because their bank account has less than they thought it should have in it. And, you know, um, that's a feeling, right? You know, I'm not making any money, there's no money in my account. And, you know, we say, okay, you know, I understand that it feels like, you know, you're frustrated, you think you should be further ahead, um, you feel like you should be winning by seeing those dollars stack up. And, you know, that, that is important to, to be able to see, obviously, um, you know, bank account grow and not being tight on cash flow all the time. But, you know, have you considered the investments you've made recently? You know, are you sitting on a ton of inventory? Do you have a ton of receivables? Like, where is your cash parked? Because if we look at your profit and loss and your cost of goods and your cost of labor and your overhead, yes, you're profitable. You just may be taking that cash flow and, you know, paying down loans or, you know, buying a new or investing, putting a deposit on a new vehicle. Or building your inventory because you have a large project coming up. So again, and you know, people often look at their bank account as a litmus test for success. And while it, you know, it is true over time you do want that cash to accumulate, it is not necessarily, it's not a sign of success or failure. And so really understanding that when someone is very emotional about their success and their general financial health, is something we have to cut through often and peel back that onion and sort of say, okay, let's take a look at this from the— because the numbers don't lie, right? And so the numbers have no emotions attached to them. So, you know, when you sort of connect those dots after you sort of have, you know, really made someone comfortable that, you know, you understand what they're going through, it's a very productive conversation and it leads to a different understanding of of, you know, some of the basics of financial performance.

Absolutely. Yeah, it sounds like you guys have really dialed it in well. Good for you. So what is it, Aaron, that you think is unique about you that you bring to the table that has added to the success of Garage Living?

Sure. So, you know, I don't think that I'm the only one in the world that could do what we've done. I mean, there's lots of great entrepreneurs out there. I've got great partners. That's definitely something that has has been a factor in our success. We've been a strong partnership group for 18 years and, you know, we're very much a family. We've reinvested in our business. So, you know, we've made sure that we have constantly been reinvesting in everything we've needed in order to get to that next stage. But in terms of my skillset specifically, You know, I think that communication is definitely a strength of mine, and I'm willing to have tough conversations. But the overall approach that I take most times is, what's the— how are we both gonna win? You know, when I'm talking either to a franchise candidate, a franchise partner, some of our staff, the outcome always has to be a win-win. And that's, you know, whether you're negotiating something, If you take too much off the table and the other person leaves feeling like they lost, that's gonna lead to a short-term relationship. And maybe certain business deals make sense that way. And that's how it has to be in order for one company to achieve their goal. But when we're talking about long-term relationships, partnerships, it always has to be beneficial for both sides. And so, you know, we try and ingrain that into our team members so that they communicate that way with our franchise partners and our vendors and our clients. You know, that's also how we communicate value in what we do. We're far from the cheapest company in town. You know, in many cases, we may be the most expensive, but there is inherent value in what we do and how we operate and the products and services we provide.. And, you know, again, it has to be a win-win. So we're gonna provide that amazing level of service and the quality of products that you can't get elsewhere and that overall phenomenal customer experience. And it comes at a price. And, you know, most times most people are happy to pay more for what they want and the value that they're going to get from it. And so I go back to that philosophy and I think that that served me very well.

I will always pay more for high quality, high value service. Always. Yeah.

I mean, most smart people will. You can ask. Yeah, I think so too. And there are times when I've said to myself, you know what, I paid too little. You know, I think about a choice I've made or about a purchase I've made and I think to myself, yeah, you know what, I paid too little and it's not like I saved money and I benefited from that. It's just that what I got is, you know, I got what I paid for, and, and it was, it was perhaps a mistake. But sometimes people feel like they paid too much, and that, that's okay too. But it's all about really communicating the value. And most times when we do that and we do our job effectively, we have clients that feel like they, they've been very well taken care of.

Excellent. Well, one more question, then I'll let you go. What's one thing about yourself that we would never know about? Unless you revealed it to us.

The easiest thing that comes to mind is my wife's name is also Erin, but spelled differently.

Erin, like an Irish Erin, E-R-I-N or something like that. Erin and Erin, that must have been an interesting wedding.

Yeah, it was the butt of many jokes, but yeah, it worked well for us.

Well, good for you. Well, Erin, thank you so much for your time today. I've really enjoyed talking with you. I know my audience has gotten a lot of great insights from you. Thank you.

Thank you so much. Have a great day.

Doug Noll here. Thank you so much for listening to Listening with Leaders. If you are a successful executive leader who would like to be on this program, please visit podcast.dougnull.com/podcast. If you got something out of this interview, would you please share this share this episode on social media? Just do a quick screenshot with your phone and text it to a friend or post it on the socials. If you know someone that would be a great guest, tag them on the social media to let them know about the show and include the hashtag #ListeningWithLeaders. I love seeing your posts and guest suggestions. We are regularly putting out new episodes and content. To make sure you don't miss any episodes, go ahead and subscribe. Your thumbs up ratings and reviews go a long way to help promote the show and mean a lot to me and my team. Wanna know more? Go to my website, DougNoll.com, or follow me on LinkedIn, Facebook, and Instagram. That's @DouglasEnoll. Thanks for listening, and we'll see you on the next show.