211 - A Symphony of Success: Navigating Chaos in Small Business Finance with Chamberlain And Good Company's Ashley Chamberlin

Welcome to Listening with Leaders. I'm Doug Noll, lawyer turned peacemaker. I teach executive leaders how to listen to emotions rather than words so that they can become the leaders everyone wants to follow. And I teach those same leaders how to be authentically present, available, and connected to their families despite being insanely busy. I have learned that we are 98% emotional and only 2% rational. Learning how to listen to emotions is, in my experience, the foundational skill of life. Stick around to the end of the show and I'll reveal how you can be on our next guest in 15 to 20 minutes. So let's get started.

Ashley Chamberlain, welcome to Listening with Leaders. You are the CEO and founder of your company, which is called Chamberlain and Good Company, which can be found at that name chamberlainandgoodcompany.com. You're providing financial services of all different kinds, including bookkeeping and accounting and tax planning and basic business services to small businesses. And you provide these both virtually, presumably around the world, and also locally because you're right on the Kentucky-Indiana border. So welcome to the show.

Thank you so much for having me, Doug. So excited.

You're welcome. Let's start with a little bit of backstory. Tell us about yourself.

And how you got into the business.

Sure, of course. I actually reign from Athens, Georgia. My family and I moved over here for a job offer that I had several years ago, and to be an accountant, that's always been my trade. I've just always been really good with numbers. I didn't really know what it would lead to. I just knew I was good with numbers. So we moved over here, we packed up our little family of two boys my husband and I for the job offer, and we didn't know anything about the area. So my husband and I just rooted ourselves, quickly learned that I was not really meant for corporate for a few reasons, but one of them being the schedule was really tough, especially as an accountant. An accountant finds themselves working very long hours. It's the norm. And as a mom of young children, it wasn't really ideal for me and it didn't feel good. So I moved into more of a small business accounting role and just fell in love. I loved working with the owner in an intimate setting. Um, so I ended up getting to a point where I thought, okay, I can keep doing this for the rest of my life, or what's next? Started my own business and it's just It's been a wild ride and I feel like I could not be doing anything else. I have two boys and I would say they very much benefit from it as well because they have a very present mom. My husband is a local musician and he also has a very present fan and wife. So here we are today.

Wow. So you, are you a CPA?

I'm not a CPA. I am, so it's an EA. Yeah.

Okay.

I don't know. Okay. Some people are like, what does that mean? LMNOP.

You have an MBA?

Yes.

So you have an MBA and you're an EA. Okay, great. And describe the kinds of services that you're providing to your clients now.

So the most common services that we provide is bookkeeping and all full cycle accounting, which can be your accounts payable, accounts receivable, payroll. Taxes. We do file taxes, tax returns. We help strategize when it comes to planning and cash flow management. We're basically helping you take a hold of your cash, which is one of your most precious assets in your company.

And how would you describe your typical client?

Oh, that's such a tricky question because every single client is so different. They're all so unique, but I guess some of the commonalities would be they're making anywhere from $100,000 to $1 million because a small business, people think, oh, they must not be making a certain amount of money, but that's not always what a small business means. So revenue-wise, it ranges. But another commonality I find is overwhelm. So they come to us as a reactive state. They're coming to us saying, 'Oh, I am so overwhelmed. I am cramming all of this stuff into a night, one night a week, or a weekend, or the end of the month. I'm— things are falling through the cracks.' Or I hear, 'I've asked my wife to help me and now she's not happy with me and I need help. I don't know where this money is coming in from. I don't know where it's going. I don't know how much I'm actually making.' And I really wanna focus on why I started this business, which was not accounting. And that is probably the most common foundation of all of my clients.

And, and how do people find you?

Word of mouth?

So, uh, word of mouth is a big one. I am, which I actually didn't think it would be this way because when I started my business, I was still working as a CFO of a local construction business. Mm-hmm. And I was heavily putting into an online presence. Because I didn't have time to in-person network. But shockingly, here we are today. Word of mouth is my biggest way to get a client. I'm part of a local BNI. So BNI is a really big one for me. But really clients lead to other clients. They say, hey, this is my person and they're great. A lot of people come in through our website or social media because we do pour in a lot. But really CPAs is another big one. So people look at, oh, this person's doing the same thing as me. I think they're competition, but I've never looked at it that way. I've always said, we're doing the same thing, but that doesn't mean that every client is gonna be right for me and right for you. So if you need help, I need help, let's work together. And I've had so many referrals from local CPAs, local EAs, and we just pass them back and forth. And it always ends up working out really well. Wow.

So what is it that gets you up in the morning, gets you excited to go to work?

Oh, so many things. It used to be, I used to call them my high vibe days because there's this sense of freedom that I used to be able to look at my planner and say, what do I want to do? What makes me feel good? When am I the most creative? Which is a very slim time as an accountant during the day when it comes to creativity. Waking up in the morning, I know I get the choice to be able to do the things in a way that I want to do them. That to me is just, it's so precious. But the other big part is my family. Before working at a job that required so much of my time, and I loved it, Don't get me wrong, I loved it. I was grinding for it. But now I get to wake up and I get to drive my kiddos to school. I get to be the last face that they see before they get out of their car, or out of my car, before they start their day. That's just really— there's just nothing like that. Nothing like the, "See you later. Have a good day." And that really— nothing can touch that. So that is what gets me up every single day.

So it, you, what I'm, it's freedom.

Freedom.

That's what gets you up in the morning is the joy of being free, of making your own choices, of living life on your terms and not having to have a structure dictated to you by somebody else. You get to dictate your structure.

Which is crazy because by instinct, by nature, I was always very routine. I, I thrive in routine. I love a schedule. I have several planners for different reasons. They all serve a purpose, but when it comes to the freedom, it— don't get me wrong, owning a business, as your audience knows, you don't feel like you're free. You feel like, oh, I got to do this thing and I'm not free. I've got— I have to do all these things. But if you stop and think about the things that you choose to do, It really just opens up a whole new conversation because yes, during tax time, I definitely don't feel like a free person. I definitely feel more weak. Chained. Yeah. I feel a little chained, a little bit. Right. But the freedom of choice is a big reason that I started this in the first place. I wanted to be able to choose where my time was spent and where I showed up. So yeah, freedom.

You mentioned earlier that you were the CFO for a construction company. Do you provide fractional CFO services to your clients?

I do. I do. The capacity isn't as— because so much energy goes into a fractional CFO client. And actually the company that I was working for when I started this business, they are one of my fractional CFO clients. I took them with me, but I give them so much time, energy, and resource that I intentionally only keep a handful of those clients to make sure that I always provide top-notch customer service response time. But it is one of my, one of my sweet spots. I love going in and helping in every kind of way possible.

So what is it, Ashley, that is unique about you that you bring to the table that makes you successful?

Oh, I thought so much about this, especially after I watched your videos that were so helpful. Because accountants tend to, we tend to live in a box, a very comfortable box, a black and white. Here is what we provide. It's all about the numbers and this is what you're gonna get. And when I came into the business owning world, I didn't realize I was doing this 'cause I was just showing up as myself. But I feel like throughout working with other clients and getting that feedback, I was told, wow, you are not like anyone I've ever worked with in a financial space. And I would ask, why is that? I'm just doing what I've always done. And I was told it's because I show up and tell people exactly what they need to hear, not always what they want to hear. I've worked in construction most of my accounting life, which comes with a certain language. If you will, a certain, certain just abrasive attitude. So I want people to succeed. I want them to be profitable. And sometimes the business owner is the biggest obstacle. You sometimes, they are the ones that need to make the biggest change and their employees are not gonna be the ones to tell them. Their employees are going to walk on eggshells. They're gonna do what they're told and they're gonna keep going. Then I come in and I'm like, listen, Jerry, I can appreciate what you're doing here, but you are making these people miserable. And it just changes the game because they're like, huh, no one's told me that. That is interesting. My wife said I'm great. I don't know what you're talking about. And they just, they need to hear the hard things. And know, look, I, I see what you're doing, but you're your biggest obstacle. Let's do this and try to see where this goes. And I've realized that more business owners want that transparency. They want people to feel like they have a partner in this versus another employee. And when I show up, I'm gonna hold your hand through it, but sometimes I'm pulling your hand. I'm not friendly holding it all the time because I want every single business to be successful, whatever needs to be done. And it's not easy. Change is so hard. So I think that is what I'm gonna say makes me shiny because people like seeing the owner show up, which was another big thing. When their accountant shows up at their office, sometimes in a shop, sometimes in a garage, sometimes in a restaurant, they're like, what are you doing here? I've never had my accountant come to this dirty shop and I'm like, why do you think I have steel-toed boots on? I figured it was gonna be a bunch of dirt all the way up to my ankles. It just, they need someone on their level and, and I'm just here for it.

Wow.

So what makes you unique is your honesty and your ability to speak truth, even if the people don't want to hear it.

Yeah. And I, I think there's, in a world of, in a world of AI, in a world of so many changes, the internet going just bananas, people want authentic relationships. They want to feel genuine conversation. They want someone to look them in the eye and say, I'm a real person. You're a real person. This is a relationship. Let's be successful together. Not fancy words. The emails are nice with all of the, the campaigns and the emojis. And don't get me wrong, I love all that stuff. But it's the authentic showing up that really counts the most, I think, in the end.

And that is a perfect segue into my next question about the importance of listening in your work. Tell me about that.

Oh, important. So much is said without being said. One of the questions that I ask when I am in a strategy call, when I'm in a consultation, when I'm seeing if it's really a right fit fit for both of us, one of the first questions I ask is, tell me what your ideal day looks like. What do you want your ideal day to look like? And the answers, they shock me every time because I will— I know what their day looks like now, and it's, I'm working 12 hours a day, and then I go home and I do this, and it's crazy. And then their ideal day is the opposite. And it's finding the holes of, okay, I see where you wanna go, what's in the way? And trying to figure out what can change for them without them asking for it. Trying to figure out, okay, they're, they initially came to me for this, but what I'm hearing is you actually need this. And when I say that to them, They're always taken aback. I didn't think I needed that. And so I have to say their words back to them. I hear you say that you actually only wanna work 5 to 6 hours a day and that you want to be able to show up for your kids, or you want to be able to walk your dog in the morning. All of those things require you to take action in this area. But that's just what I'm hearing. So repeating back what they're saying, using those listening skills, is this just— it's the gold because they feel like, oh wow, she actually just used my own words against me and it feels weird, but sounds like it's exactly what I need.

What do you do when you run across people who are not good listeners, which is probably frequent?

Why you're laughing?

Yeah, it actually It does happen a lot, and it, it's very, it's very difficult because when I'm just— I have alpha energy. I'm the oldest of 5 kids. I've always wanted to be in some kind of leadership role. I like leading a team. And so when I am met with, I'm gonna say, my equal, and they don't want to listen to really any suggestions I'm making, very quickly I know this is not gonna work out because our, my job heavily requires a mutual respect, a mutual listening, a mutual giving and getting, because I'm, I'm not gonna help you with success if you're not taking any of my recommendations and doing it. So it's gonna look like I'm actually not helping you. If you're not doing the things I'm telling you to do, then that's not good for either of us. So normally it's, okay, I don't think that I'm going to be a good fit because it sounds like you already know what you want. And I don't think that this is going to be it. Here's a list of people that might work out and I just refer them to someone else. I never like to leave them empty-handed, but I don't want to bring anyone in that I just have that gut feeling. This is not going to work out.

Do you often confront situations with your clients, small business people, where they've got chaos in their business, they've got fights and arguments and conflicts and unreasonably irrational people that, and they've just pulled their hat because they don't know what to do about it?

Yes, very, very often, because it's a, when they come to us, it's like I said, it's, they're reacting to stress. So they feel this pressure to do all these things because they're a business owner and they're supposed to do all the things. And they're reacting to that stress by coming to us and they feel like this is a last resort. Something's gotta change. There's a lot of chaos, which I do understand. In the beginning when I started my business, I was everything. I was every hat and it made me hate my business. And that was when I stopped and said, how can I make this better? Because I don't wanna burn it down. How can I make it better?

What do you do to shift?

What do I what?

What did you do to shift?

Oh, I told myself I was gonna burn it down a lot of times and then I didn't, but I had to do a time audit, which the word audit I know is so icky. It sounds so terrible, but I had to audit my own time, which is what I tell business owners that say, I can't afford to outsource, or I don't have time for onboarding. I don't know if I need to hire a bookkeeper or an accountant in-house, or if this is the route. And I always say, after they've told me their ideal day and they're still not sure, I'm not a great salesperson. I'm just really not. I, I, I don't really enjoy it. So I say, I'm gonna have you do what I did, which is called a time audit. And I want you to write down everything you're doing throughout the day. And I want you to look at that after a week or 2 weeks and tell me, what do you like doing? What do you hate doing? What do you find yourself putting off until the very end, until it's almost ridiculous? And I want you to think, what can I give to someone else that's gonna give them opportunity? It's gonna be done faster, probably better, and make you just a little happier. And that's what I did. And I found a lot of the stuff I was doing, I didn't like doing, which shocked me because I was just doing accounting. But in the beginning I was doing a lot of accounting and it was burning me out. And so that was when I hired my first employee and she changed everything. She greatly opened up time that I could devote to other things. And I found a joy in the other things that go with running a business. I never thought I would. I never thought I would want to go on podcasts and talk about myself. That sounded just ick. Uh, I'm a background person. I'm background dancer, singer, not a frontline person. And hiring that employee changed my mindset. It changed my efficiency, my customer service. I started making more money because our capacity grew. She was able to greatly handle client fulfillment, which led to me hiring another person. So one good thing led to another good thing.

And you slowly grew the business.

Yep. Yep. With the help of— she's still with me. She is one of my best friends. And then hired another friend and they're still with me and they just help me grow every single day.

Good for you. One more question and we'll wrap it up. Ashley, what's one thing about yourself that we would never know unless you revealed it to us?

That's tricky because you can probably tell I'm a pretty transparent person. I would say people, when it comes to doing accounting, stigma is I show up to work in a collared shirt. I, you know, in my desk I have really thick framed glasses and I just type like this and that I don't have any creative space and that could not be more untrue. I think I had mentioned to you when we were first chatting is my husband is a musician, and one of the first things that brought us together when we were becoming friends was music. And I actually— him and I write songs together. I play. Yeah, we really enjoy writing together. We sometimes play together when he plays locally after a drink or two. I will go and sing with him. Background singer for sure. But, but I do enjoy all things music. I find so much passion in that creative outlet, and I'm so lucky that he finds equal, if not more, passion in it because it helps me get all of that out.

How fun. Yeah, that's great. Ashley, it's been a joy talking to you, and I wish you all the success in the world going forward. Thank you so much.

Thank you, Doug. Appreciate it.

Doug Noll here. Thank you so much for listening to Listening with Leaders. If you are a successful executive leader who would like to be on this program, please visit podcast.dougnull.com/podcast. If you got something out of this interview, would you please share this episode on social media? Just do a quick screenshot with your phone and text it to a friend or post it on the socials. If you know someone that would be a great guest, tag them on the social media to let them know about the show and include the hashtag #ListeningWithLeaders. I love seeing your posts and guest suggestions. We are regularly putting out new episodes and content. To make sure you don't miss any episodes, go ahead and subscribe. Your thumbs up, ratings, and reviews go a long way to help promote the show and mean a lot to me and Wanna know more? Go to my website, DougNoll.com, or follow me on LinkedIn, Facebook, and Instagram. That's @DouglasEnoll. Thanks for listening, and we'll see you on the next show.