283 - The Journey for Building a Resilient Hotel : Creating a New Standard in Extended Stays with LivAway Suites' Kevin Dailey

Welcome to Listening with Leaders. I'm Doug Noll, lawyer turned peacemaker. I teach executive leaders how to listen to emotions rather than words so that they can become the leaders everyone wants to follow. And I teach those same leaders how to be authentically present, available, and connected to their families despite being insanely busy. I have learned that we are 98% emotional and only 2% rational. Learning how to listen to emotions is, in my experience, the foundational skill of life. Stick around to the end of the show and I'll reveal how you can be on our next guest in 15 to 20 minutes. So let's get started.

Kevin Daley, welcome to Listening with Leaders.

Thank you. Appreciate you having me.

Tell us a little bit about your company and your position in your company and your backstory so we can get into finding about what makes you tick.

Okay, company is LiveWay Suites. We are a brand new independent hotel brand. We are specifically in the extended stay segment of the hospitality or hotel industry, and we consider ourselves to dig in a little deeper in the premium economy extended stay market. So we're not like your traditional transient hotel where guests will stay 1, 2, maybe 3 nights maximum. Our guests typically stay 14 or more nights. Wow. In some cases, weeks and even months, just depending on what brings them to the markets where we have hotels.

So there are other extended stay, uh, hotels out there.

Oh yeah.

What got you interested in doing another one, and what's the differentiation?

I originally got my first taste of extended stay about 20 years ago and really understood the unique differences. As I mentioned, not only the guest base is different and their length of stay is different, but also the operating model is quite a bit different and quite a bit leaner, if you will. And so it is really a specialized segment of the industry that does take— there's a bit of a learning curve, a bit of a ramp. Yeah. And fast forward a few years beyond 20 years ago when I first became associated with the segment, we had the economic crisis of '08, '09, 2010, and then we had COVID obviously. Both really hit the overall industry very hard. Mostly the transient side, those hotels, the Hamptons, the Hiltons, the Hyatts, where guests stay a couple nights. They were really struggling. And during both economic downturns, the extended stay segment was very resilient. And COVID really proved the concept where, like many folks in the workforce, they had the luxury of Zooming it in or Teams meeting or meeting virtually, and they went remote very quickly and for extended period of time. The essential workforce didn't have that luxury. So the construction workers, there were still highway projects going on and Buildings being built, all kinds of development didn't stop. It slowed, but it didn't stop. Traveling healthcare providers, traveling physician assistants, doctors, nurses, they were in such high demand during that time and they were in markets working in regional hospitals and local hospitals for months at a time during 2020 and 2021. Obviously that's a core business. Segment, if you will, for extended stay. So I think the idea that the segment was so resilient, both during both significant economic downturns where the rest of the transient part of the industry was really struggling quite a bit and we were so resilient, it really got us thinking that, you know what, there's space in extended stay. Demand is so strong and supply is so limited. In the extended stay segment that there's room for a new brand. And so LiveAway Suites is a, is an independent startup brand. We're not affiliated with any of the major hotel companies that I'm sure you've heard of, the Wyndham family of brands and Choice Hotels International. We are strictly independent and not affiliated, and we're a single brand focus. Like Wyndham has 20+ different brands. Choice has approaching 20 different brands. LiveAway Suites is a single brand focus with that single brand in mind.

And what are your current markets?

We're all over the country. We have not yet opened all over the country, but through a master development agreement with West 77 Partners, they have plans and a clear path to get to 50 hotels either open or under construction by the end of 2026. Which is a very aggressive development ramp but very achievable. And so currently we have 7, actually 8 hotels under construction. We've got our first hotel open. All of our brand— all our hotels are brand new, ground-up construction. So it, as you can imagine, it takes a minute to get from the beginning of, uh, 3 years probably. Yeah, most of that is, is the entitlement process that takes a bit. But West 77 can build a LiveAway Suites, 126 keys in about 13 or 14 months.

That's pretty fast.

Once ground is broken, they have a very streamlined, very efficient construction process and a prototype that is, is basically rinse and repeat. Our prototype is 126 rooms, all suites. We have a combination of king suites and double queen suites. And when I say suites, each suite is equipped with its own kitchenette with full appliances. So as I said before, guests stay at a LiveAway Suites for 14+ nights. Most of those guests go to the local grocery store and they go out for every meal. They actually cook in their rooms.

Company that's doing the building work, is that a development company that's going to own the hotel and lease it to you, or is that the model, or you guys are just paying them to build and You're going to own everything.

Now they're separate entity. They are developers and they have a construction company that is a subsidiary of West 77 Partners. But they are— West 77 has been developing extended stay hotels for over a decade now. Mm-hmm. LiveAway Suites, where I'm part of that team, we are completely separate as a brand.

So do you— I'm just wondering what the relationship is. They build the hotel. Are you Do you purchase the hotel from them in the real property or—

No, we are— Le Roy Suites is a brand.

Okay.

We franchise just like a lot of other hotel operations. Correct. And in a lot of cases, West 77 has a third-party management company operates the hotel. So West 77, think of them as the developer, the master developer. I represent just the brand and then management through West 77's relationship with their third-party operator. Actually manages and operates the hotels.

That's pretty— that's a pretty sweet deal for you guys because it's not nearly as capital intensive as—

as a brand. Correct. Yes.

So you can develop the brand. The brand has value. People pay you a fee for the branding. You do all the marketing and make sure that everything across the country is uniform.

Correct.

A Big Mac in L.A. is going to be seen as a Big Mac in New Hampshire. It's the same.

Exactly right. You're exactly right.

And so you're just making sure there's quality there and then you guys get paid to create the brand, market it, and make sure there's quality control across the system and consistent brand standards.

You're absolutely right.

Absolutely.

Wow.

So you've got one open and you got 50 on the books.

That's—

Yeah. Yes. And we'll open 3 more here before the end of the year.

Mm-hmm.

And we'll have, call it between 13 and 15 hotels open and operating by the end of next year. And then the path just accelerates into 2026.

How do you go about deciding where, where there's going to be a good market fit, good market?

That's a great question. There's an independent research and analytics firm by the name of the Highland Group, and they specialize exclusively in extended stay development, supply demand. And so West 77 brought the Highland Group in about 2.5, 3 years ago. And they developed some 25 KPIs that they used with markets all across the country. And they came back to West 77 using those KPIs as indicators and recommended up to 100 different markets for West 77 based on their knowledge, their analytics, and their understanding of supply demand throughout the country. And so West 77 took that list and pared it down to those 50 sites that I was referring to. And that's basically how those markets were identified. And then West 77 works with a real estate brokerage firm.

Of course.

And they actually within those MSAs drill down to actual sites.

So that gets even more curious about this. So did West 77 reach out to you guys and say, create a brand for us? Or how did you, how did you join hands with them?

We worked together to develop the brand.

Okay.

Quite frankly, not uncommon with new brands these days, but yes, it was much, much along the lines of a collaboration in terms of developing the brand.

So the people at West 77 had the concept of getting in, doing more extended stay hotels, and they bring in LiveAway, which is just a nascent little organization saying, what can we do with this? Let's imagine what this is going to look like.

That's a very good way to describe it. Yes.

Okay.

And you know what? That I think is the best way. As I mentioned, West 77 Partners has been developing extended stay hotels for over a decade. And one of our taglines at the brand is for developers, by developers. And the by developers part really is the experience that the West 77 development engine brings to the brand because we want to be the brand is a little unique in today's environment where a lot of the big brands really are heavily fee-intensive and are really interested in developing the brand and profiting at brand level in a pretty generous way. LiveAway Suites is a little different in that our mission, our sole mission, is to do our part to make the real estate wildly successful. And that's where the for developers by developers comes in. We are really— LiveAway Suites is developer-centric in our approach, which I think is refreshing, quite frankly, and a little unique in today's environment.

So your focus, the focus of LiveAway Suites, is to make that property as profitable as possible with the management team that the developer brings in, saying this is how you're going to make money on this thing.

Absolutely. We partner with the third-party operator. We've partnered with West 77, and it truly is a collaboration.

And how's it work? How's it working out so far?

So far, we, as you might imagine, we have projections and pro formas and how we'd want our first round of hotels to ramp up. And with our first hotel in West Jordan, Utah, which is the Salt Lake City MSA—

who would ever think of that? West Jordan, Utah?

It's a subsidiary, or it's, uh, in the MSA of Salt Lake City, right in the valley. And we're ahead of our target 2 months in. This is our second full month in operation and we're about 10 percentage points higher than our original projections.

Good for you.

We're pretty excited about that.

So, Kevin, you've been doing this for a while. What is it that gets you up in the morning and gets you excited to go to work?

For LiveAway Suites, for me, I'm a 35-year veteran in the industry with brands that you would definitely recognize. For me, this was an opportunity to create something from the ground up. Create something from scratch. So with all the big brands that I've been lucky enough to be affiliated with and work with, they were pre-established long before I arrived. Brand standards pre-established. I had nothing to do with them. It was my job, my job as an operator to execute on those brand standards.

Right.

But really, as things were tweaked, obviously my input was encouraged, but it had been established. Brands like Red Roof Inns, Motel 6, right? WoodSpring Suites. La Quinta Inns and Suites. I spent 15 years there. Very well-established brands. This was an opportunity for me to come in and create a brand from scratch and collaborate, as I said, with West 77, collaborate with the third-party operator, and really create something. And that gets me up in the morning.

It's, it looks to me the passion is coming out of you. Yeah. Creativity and the entrepreneur and all of this stuff. You've been a corporate guy for all these years. Now all of a sudden, you get to do your own thing.

That's exactly right. That's exactly right. Long answer to a short question, but that's really—

I totally get it. That's gotta be really exciting for you. And what a shift in your career. It's what I did. I had a 22-year trial career as a civil trial lawyer, very successful, and quit, gave my firm one week's notice, and to become a peacemaker. Wow. Something very different.

You certainly understand.

Absolutely.

You know, I made, you know, you make 35 years worth of mistakes. With other brands on their— learn from those mistakes. And I had an opportunity to incorporate something from the ground up and eliminate those mistakes.

So when you look back on your career and now you look forward to what's going on with LiveAway Suites, what do you think it's unique about you as an individual that's going to make— that makes this all successful?

I think the various experience I've had working on both the brand side the operations side. And one thing I didn't mention, there was a period of about 4 years where I led a third-party management company as an entrepreneur, as an owner in that company. And we were actually the largest hotel operating company in all of the Choice family of brands. Not just— we had 120 WoodSpring Suites, economy extended stay lodging. And so I think just my background on the brand side, on the operations side, in the corporate environment, but then also the entrepreneurial opportunity I had at that management company brings a kind of a unique skill set to the LiveWay brand.

And, and what about you as a person? What do you think is unique about you as a human being?

I haven't figured that out yet, to be honest.

I'm putting you on the spot, Kevin. Yes, you are.

I mean, you've got—

you obviously have great charisma. You have a great passion for what you're doing, obviously experienced. There's something about you that makes you unique and successful. What do you think that is?

I don't think I'm, um, a rocket scientist, to be honest with you. I just think it really centers around treating people with respect.

Okay.

And I know we're, we'll be talking about listening here.

Next question.

In a, in a little bit. I gotta be honest in full transparency. I don't believe that was a skill I inherently had.

No.

Was first starting out.

No.

In my career and certainly in this industry. I think as a leader, you need to have the ability to articulate a point. You need to have the ability to communicate with various levels in the organization and the traveling public in the hotel industry and the service industry. But listening for me was not a natural skill, and it's something I'm still working on to be be completely honest with you, but it was learned and developed over time.

Here's the thing that most people don't realize. We're never taught how to listen.

Yeah.

Think about it. As children, we're ordered to listen. As students in school, we are ordered to shut up, pay attention, and listen.

Sure.

When we're getting into the workplace, we're ordered to listen. Nowhere anywhere in our development as a human being are we told how to listen. And so it's the most fundamentally one of the most important interpersonal skills that we can have.

Yeah.

And yet it is completely neglect, neglected in terms of formal teaching. And that's because most people just assume that because we've got two ears and we can speak the language, our language of origin, that we can hear and listen and understand.

Right.

And nothing could be further from the truth.

And I think you make a good point there.

Every conflict that I get involved in as a mediator and peacemaker is almost always caused by people don't know how to listen, or their need to be heard is so great that they can't possibly listen and meet the need of the other sides to be heard. And so you get this tectonic plates coming together and boom, big explosion, argument, fights. And that's what causes it all.

Makes sense.

Yet once you teach people how to listen properly, the fights and arguments go away. That's why I promise my all— the commitment I make to my clients when they come to retain me to teach them this stuff is learn these skills in 8 weeks, you'll never have a fight or argument again in your life with anybody. Not your grandkids, not your spouse, not your Children, nobody, anybody. You'll never have, you'll never have a fight or argument again. And it's true. It's really masterful the way it works.

Makes perfect sense.

So, so tell me about how you obviously went, you're in the process of, we are always evolving our listening skills. Tell me how you went about figuring out the importance of listening.

For me, it started with keeping my mouth shut more. Quite frankly, at its basic level, right? Don't always have to be the person filling the room speaking all the time. So that was my first step along the learning curve. The other, to be honest, I had early on in my career, I remember having challenges where, you know, depending on how verbose the person was I was listening to, sometimes it was a challenge and frankly still is to stop thinking about my response while that person is talking, or how I'm going to answer a question or address their concern, right? Being disciplined and stop that thought process as I'm listening, quote unquote, and truly just engage and truly try to understand where the person's coming from. And when they're done, then articulate my response or my addressing their concern or whatever the conversation may be. That, for me, particularly with folks that tended to pack several questions into the conversation without me interjecting or interrupting, that's a challenge. And quite frankly, still is today.

So try this.

Okay.

When you're listening to somebody who's bloviating like that—

like I just was?

No. Like I was, like I used to as a lawyer when I was practicing law. Ask yourself, what is this person experiencing right now? What are they— what's— what is he or she feeling? And then when they're done talking, just tell them what they're feeling. You're really— you're anxious, you're worried, you're concerned, or you're excited, or you're frustrated, you're pissed off. Yeah, one or two words, and then watch what happens.

Yeah, it's almost like you're validating.

It's not almost like, you are validating.

And I feel good as to speak.

Absolutely. And what brain scanning studies show is when you validate somebody's emotions, they immediately calm down and they stop talking and now they can problem solve.

Yeah. No, I've experienced what you're describing. I'll liken it to you're in the service industry from time to time, service breaks down.

That's right.

And guests become upset with an experience that they've had at your hotel, in my case.

Right.

And really I try to avoid saying, I know how you feel.

You cannot use an I word, right?

Because I truly don't. I didn't have their experience.

Exactly correct.

We used to say you can't not have an experience. I know that's a double negative, but it's true. You either have a positive experience, you have a negative experience, or sometimes you have a neutral experience.

That's right.

In either case, you're having some kind of experience and it's yours. It's not mine.

That's right.

As the listener, you're very rare because when I teach, do not use I statements.

Okay.

When you're listening, and I think you're the first person on that I've interviewed that said, hey, I've learned not to use I statements because I made that mistake.

35 years of mistakes, and that sometimes makes the person even madder.

That's right.

You don't know how I feel. So I try to say something like Wow. The fire alarm went off last night at 2:00 AM. You were asked to evacuate the building, to stand in the parking lot until the fire department arrived, realized it was a false alarm, turned the alarm off, and you came back in. That's your experience. It's not mine. But I can say something like, repeat what I heard in my own words, validate.

Paraphrase, right?

And say something like, I can understand How that would you—

don't even use an I statement there. Just said that was really frustrating and it really pissed you off and you're really worried and concerned because you got a big meeting tomorrow morning and you got to get your sleep and this thing totally disrupted you.

Even better. Yeah, no, I get it.

And just recognize their emotional experience and validate what they're feeling.

And I have, to your point, I have physically seen people diffuse almost immediately.

My, my fourth book, De-Escalate: How to Calm an Angry, Angry Person in 90 Seconds or Less. To your point, you immediately de-escalate people when you tell them what they're experiencing with their feelings. Yeah.

No, it makes perfect sense.

It's amazing. It's just amazing. So you got probably 10 or 15 more years of active life in, in your career ahead of you as you take Live Away and Build It Up. What's the big plan?

If my wife has anything to say about it, I'll never retire.

Hopefully it's a little bit longer than that ramp.

No, I love what I do and part of a very exciting journey here. We're just getting started at LiveAway Suites, and I'm very excited what the future will bring. And with West 77 being the master developer and their plans to get 50 in 3+ years when they're all new construction, that aggressive plan is exciting. And we haven't even started to open up franchising to other—

which is another possibility.

Yeah, which I see down the road, maybe sometime this time next year, if all goes according to plan, we'll start opening it up. And one of the things we didn't want to be as a brand was speak to a developer and say, do this because we say it's a good investment for you. And you're—

we got these 50 hotels that are making buckets of money.

That's exactly right. I would love to be in a position where we, with West 77's permission, we approach different franchisees, different developers, and say, don't do this because I'm telling you it's great. Here's what the first 50 did. Here's how quickly they ramped up to 70+ occupancy.

And here's, here's, here's the hotel that's doing the, the best, and here's the one that's doing the worst, and here's the difference.

Here's right. And here are the KPIs that, that West 77 used to find sites and identify MSIs, MSAs throughout the country that are great markets for this product.. And that's pretty exciting to me.

I can—

no one else, quite frankly, Doug Noll is doing that in my space.

Yeah. No, I believe it. It sounds like a really exciting opportunity for you. One more question, Kevin, I'll let you go. What's one thing about yourself that we would never know about unless you revealed it to us?

Wow. Perhaps, and I've said this for quite some time, I, I consider myself a leader by trade. Who just happens to have been fortunate enough to work in the hotel business for 35 years. And, and that's truly how I, I look at what I do. And with a growing brand like this, you can imagine we're going to be adding team members pretty rapidly in the early part of next year and beyond to support the growth of not only West 77, but future partners. And to be in a leadership role in that journey is quite exciting, as you might imagine.

Wow.

I'll tell you one thing that I've learned in doing all these interviews over the last couple of years. The one thing that I hear over and over again is the ability to scale depends on your first 5 hires.

Hmm. Yeah.

Because what you need to do is hire people who can spot talent because they're not gonna be able to do the job. They can do the job right now with 2 or 3, right? Things. But when you start scaling, they need to hire people. And do they have the ability to spot talent, recruit them, train them, and engage them and develop them? That is the secret to the ability to scale. And I've heard this from tech entrepreneurs in Silicon Valley over and over again. And the ones that don't do it can't and won't. So it's all about, you're in that process now where you're gonna start scaling and looking for people that can not only do their job, but they can also spot other people who can do the job and bring them in.

Yep. No, I agree completely.

Kevin, this has been a great conversation. Thanks so much for your time today.

Yeah, thanks for having me. I really appreciate it, Doug. Appreciate it.

You're welcome.

Doug Noll here. Thank you so much for listening to Listening with Leaders. If you are a successful executive leader who would like to be on this program, please visit podcast. Doug Noll, DougNoll.com/podcast. If you got something out of this interview, would you please share this episode on social media? Just do a quick screenshot with your phone and text it to a friend or post it on the socials. If you know someone that would be a great guest, tag them on the social media to let them know about the show and include the hashtag #ListeningWithLeaders. I love seeing your posts and guest suggestions. We are regularly putting out new episodes and content. To make sure you don't miss any episodes, go ahead and subscribe. Your thumbs up ratings and reviews go a long way to help promote the show and mean a lot to me and my team.

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