The Strength Of Your WHYs: Finding A Better Way To Success With Raymond Kemp

Welcome to beyond you'd why Podcast, where we go beyond just talking about your why and actually help you discover and then live your why. You see, we believe that knowing your why, that driving force behind every decision you make and every action you take, is the essential first step to really knowing yourself. It allows you to move forward faster and have a bigger impact. If you're already a fan of the show, then you know that every week we talk about one of the nine whys, and then we introduce you to somebody with that why so you can see how their why has played out in their life. This show will be more powerful for you if you've already discovered your why. If you still need to do that, head over to whyinstitute.com and discover your why today. It'll only take you about five minutes. Now let's meet today's guest. Welcome to beyond you'd why Podcast, where we go beyond just talking about your why and actually helping you discover and then live your why. So if you're a regular listener, you know that every week we talk about one of the nine whys, and then we bring on somebody with that why so we can see how their why has played out in their life. And so this week we are going to be talking about the why of better way. So if this is your why, then you are the ultimate innovator and and you are constantly seeking better ways to do everything. You find yourself wanting to improve virtually anything by finding a way to make it better. You also desire to share your improvement with the world. You constantly ask yourself questions like, what if we tried this differently? What if we did this another way? How can we make this better? You contribute to the world with better processes and better systems. While operating under the motto I'm often pleased but never satisfied, you are excellent at associating, which means you are adept at taking ideas or systems from one industry or discipline and applying them to another, always with the ultimate goal of improving something. And so today, I have got a great guest for you. His name is Raymond Kemp. He is a highly experienced senior executive in leadership and human resources. He has over 10 years of experience at the highest levels of of the US Navy as the Fleet Master Chief of Europe and Africa. In his duty assignment, Raymond directed and influenced over 56,000 service members, civilians and contractors, and family members across the European and African continents. He revolutionized naval leadership education by creating the seminal document Laying the Keel with an emphasis on character and professional competency. More than 30,000 senior enlisted trainees were impacted by this document, widely Recognized for his exceptional leadership skills, Fleet Master Chief Kemp has received honors from the Office of the President of the United States and the Department of the Navy. He was most recently appointed by Joe Biden to the American Battle Monuments Commission. Chief Kemp, welcome to the podcast.

Thank you. Thank you very much. It's a pleasure and honor to be here with you, Gary.

This is going to be a lot of fun. I have actually been looking forward to having you on the podcast for a while. So I'm glad we finally get to do this.

Yes, indeed. Yes, indeed. I've had the opportunity to be connected to the Y Institute for, you know, going on seven months, I guess now. And it has been an honor. I've been watching. I was like, I wonder if I'm going to ever get on to this, the podcast. So here we are. I'm excited about it.

Okay, so take everybody back.

For those. Those that are listening and can't see you. How tall are you?

I go about six one, probably 230 pounds of just twisted steel and sex appeal.

I have my fair share of time in the weight room and on the track.

Awesome. Ok, so let's go back now. Where were you born? Where'd you grow up? What were you like in high school?

Yep. So I was born in the great nation of Texas, raised in Oklahoma. In high school, I ran track and played football. But I was really, really thin growing up. I mean, really, really thin. If the wind blew hard, I could feel it. And. But I was lightning fast. And so thankfully, track and being a cornerback. Cornerback on a football team in Oklahoma, where that is absolutely the sanctuary in Oklahoma and Texas, both things worked out in my favor. But I was really kind of shy, kind of finding my way. Maybe because I was thin and I had a bit of a speech impediment, I had a lot of ideas, but not necessarily a voice. And as I made my way into the Navy, well, things. I joined the Navy 30 days after I graduated high school. And so things accelerated pretty darn quickly.

Yeah. So why the Navy?

So I had an uncle who, you know, again, I'm born in the 60s, raised in the 70s. And so in those days, I vividly remember 60 Minutes talking about stress and hypertension and my aunts. And I had seven aunts. And they would get up in the morning, they'd be going off to work, but I had an uncle who would be at home. And summertime I'd go over to this little town called El Reno, and they'd all go off to work. And I thought to myself, I Don't want that stress. But my uncle stayed there with me and my cousins and he would say, boy, go on out there and pick up some twigs underneath that tree and bring in some baby carrots. And I thought, that's the job. And I didn't realize that he had served. He was a month report Marine, served in World War II, Korea and in Vietnam. And he had retired from the services. And once I realized that that was his, his way to make ends meet and he had retired, I was like, okay, well, I want to do that. And when the recruiters came to the school, I took the Armed Services Vocational Aptitude Battery test. I did pretty good on it. The Navy had a great offer, promises to see the world. They had some Gucci uniforms. And so easy decision for me.

Seemed like a better way.

Absolutely. Definitely a better way than to, you know, because I was pretty decent. Football, really good at track. I had a couple offers to go do some things in school, but I, I was kind of tired of school. And it wasn't that I wasn't good, I just didn't like it anymore. And so there was definitely a different opportunity, a better way. And there I went.

So what was it like going into the Navy at that age? And at that time, it was really.

You know, when I, when I was making my way through, and I just want to be very clear about this. When I was making my way through Gary, it was just what it was, it was.

It was the early mid-80s. And you think about leadership in the Navy at the mid level and higher levels is once you've gotten to the 15, 20 year mark. So I joined the Navy in 1986. Those leaders there had joined the Navy in like 66 or in the late 60s, early 70s. And so that means that they were living through the civil rights era, living through just a very grotesque social climate in America at the time, you know, for somebody who was black like me. And so when I joined the Navy, to me it was just what it was again. Born in Texas, raised in Oklahoma. I had been called all sorts of names and had been treated various different ways, but I just learned how to survive. And so when I joined the Navy, I became a data processing technician, went to my first ship, which is an aircraft carrier out of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, and my first interaction with a master chief, right, 1% of the Navy. Now, I had never seen one in person, but my first interaction with one was to check into the ship. I'm expecting to go into the automated data processing center, which is where all the computer dudes went and he told me, he said, you know, I just don't allow any niggas in a computer room, so you are going to go over here and do this manual labor. And that language to some people might be shocking, but to me it was just language. My aunts, my mother, my grandmother were just fierce angels. And they told me of this rhyme, you know, sticks and stones may break my bones, but words have never heard me. So that language he used meant nothing to me. And I had been told that the Navy and the military was a meritocracy. So I was like, okay, where do I go? And once I found out where I went, I just went in and just did my absolute best, regardless of whether it was what I was trained to do as a computer technician or not. And ultimately it ended up working out where I made my way into the automated data processing center and just crush, grooving, body moving after that.

So how long did it take you to get to what you went there to do in the first place?

So in, in those days, it was common to do, you know, some temporarily assigned duties. KP duty is probably what it was, what it was called in the olden days, but for me, it took nine months. Okay. Supposed to be a three month event, but for me it ended up being a nine month event. But during that nine months, you know, what he meant for my bad actually worked out for my good because my, my goal was to go in, make E5, and then retire and go back to Oklahoma. And so because he has sent all of the other blacks into that particular division, then as soon as I got there, I was like, wow, there's a, there's a E5 right there. And if he can do it, then I know I can do it. Matter of fact, he'll probably help me if I'm, if I can ask a question. And he showed me the way, and that's exactly what happened. So by the time that nine months was over with, I was already, you know, fully prepared to make the first advancement in my career. And I did ahead of my peers. And as they say, I was on my way.

Okay, so you went from doing KP duty to doing data processing or data processing, right?

Yes.

And then how long were you there?

So I was in the data processing field, information systems technology field for my, let's see, for my first, just about 20 years. Oh, and then I transitioned to, into the command.

Path of the Navy. But that first ship, I was there for four years. So from 86 to 90, I was there. I did some time in the first Gulf War, which started around 1991. And I was stationed in Washington D.C. at the time. And I really hopped around the globe. My first tour of duty was the boot camp in San Diego. But then from Philly back to San Diego to Washington D.C. alameda, California. I moved around a lot.

Okay, and so 20 years in the IT field and then you set into leadership.

Correct. So in the Navy, path is you. You're either in your technical field or at a certain rank you can transition to just strictly a leadership field. And for me, at the 2024 year mark, I transitioned from the information Systems Technician Master Chief, which was the absolute. What was the top of the field at the time. I was stationed in the Pentagon. And then I transitioned to be a command master Chief. And I had the opportunity to be selected to go to the Army Sergeants Major Academy, which is a full school year out in El Paso at Fort Bliss. And then I went to my first ship as the command Master Chief. And so what that means is that the command master chief and the commanding officer, executive officer, are the triad of a command. So the three who are in charge of the fighting and training and the administration of the ship. Wow.

So is it common for someone to go from KP to Master Chief?

The. Well, the KP was just the very beginning of the career. And so that, that nine months worth of.

Of training, you know, and that nine months worth of, you know, basically hard labor because I was painting walls, I was pulling tile up off of the deck on the ship and re. Putting tile down and replacing desks and racks and things like that. Lots of miscellaneous, just heavy, heavy, heavy labor stuff. That was just the beginning of the career. Once I transitioned into the computer room after that nine month period, I was able to stay within there and then maneuver within the information system technician.

Responsibilities to the highest levels and then at that point make that transition. But I would say no, it's not common because only 1%, according to Title 10, U.S. code, Title 10, the law, only 1% of the Navy can be master chiefs, period. So it's uncommon to make it to master Chief. And then once we get there, it's about 330,000 people or so Navy. So that top 1%, there's only 600 that are command master chiefs. So it's pretty uncommon.

And why didn't you quit right when you weren't given what you wanted, when you were told to do something you didn't want to do and you were told in a way that wasn't nice, why not Just quit.

Well, you know, Gary, I'm from a group of people who taught me the value of hard work and who also let me know that I'm always representing somebody other than just myself. And so quitting was absolutely not an option. And I'll tell you very frankly, there was not necessarily a point in my career where I was thinking about other people, but I was oftentimes thinking about there's definitely a better way for me to get into a position to have some impact and influence over this organization. And from a division, departmental level, on board the ship to the entirety of the ship, and perhaps even a fighting force I was seeking after that. And I definitely knew that I wanted to have an influence. But when I got to the 20 year point, the time that I could retire, I was 37 years old. I could retire, get a good pension and go back home, but I still have things to do, I realized that I could go higher.

And so what was the transition like going from it to leadership?

Well, thankfully, because the pathway in the Navy had given me the exposure to more than just it. So by that I mean imagine I was on an aircraft carrier. We had approximately 5,000 or so people, and amongst that 5,000, maybe only about 100 to 200 working combat systems. Well, as a duty section leader, meaning that so when the ship pulls into port, whether it be overseas or at home in America, there has to be a small contingent that stays on board the ship just in case there's an emergency fighting fire is get the ship underway in the event of something is catastrophic as 9, 11, be able to put the ship out to sea and then go fight the ship at sea. So I'd have the exposure as a duty section leader to all different ratings, all different professional responsibilities on board the ship. And I enjoyed that. And I enjoyed having the impact and influence on other professions than just information systems. And so I knew I wanted to go to a higher level. As a matter of fact, the day that I got advanced to master chief, my ship's command master chief said, I want your package on my desk on Monday. It was a Friday, your package on my desk on Monday. No excuses, you know, so on and so forth, because he too wanted me to go into that rating. Once I, once I made that transition in and had the opportunity to.

Use my own kind of intellectual agility to help people solve their problems at a higher level. It was very, very satisfying, though. It was extremely challenging. It was very, very satisfying because my perspective, because of my background and because of my job was just different than Other. Other. Other jobs. So as an example, an aviation ordinance man is someone who builds bombs, loads them on aircraft, we launch those bombs, and, you know, they, they. They do what they do. The information system technician has. Has a different processing level of, you know, troubleshooting problems and things like that. And so when I had the opportunity to share, you know, this different perspective with these other jobs, then it was fulfilling to see them grab ahold of those ideas and realize. And I didn't even intend this, but realize there is a better way.

Yeah. So, okay, so you were a master chief. Well, you were in leadership for how long? And a master chief for how long?

So I was a master chief. Let's see here. So I was a master Chief for about 11 years, and I was in that leadership position for that same amount of time.

Oh, same time. Okay. So what's it like leading in the military versus now you're out of the military and leading in the civilian world?

It's not very much of a difference. I say that the difference truly is, Gary, is that there's different risks. Of course, life and death is the absolute real thing in a combat environment and on board ships. And also there is a greater measure of obligation given when. For an enlisted person. So by that, I mean there's just a higher level of loyalty built into. I will stay here, without question, for at least four years until I transfer to another command or until I have met my obligation and I get out of the Navy. What we know now is in the civilian world, there is just not that same measure of loyalty to an organization without some leadership built into it.

Well, this is something that cross. So it's interesting that we're having this conversation now because last weekend I was playing some golf with a friend of mine who is a colonel here at the Air Force base, and he's about to get out in the next few months. And when I went to visit because I did some work with the Air Force here, I found it interesting how he was able to talk to his people, you know, his. That. That he was in charge of. The word choices were not necessarily what I would expect in the private world or in the civilian world versus what he was able to say, you know, you could order someone to do something as the leader, whereas in the civilian world, it's a different conversation. At least that was my perspective. How do you. How do you feel about that?

Very true. And depend. There is definitely a difference in the way we communicate in the military than in the civilian sector. But also, that goes to a couple things you know, first and foremost, there is an expectation of a measure of aggression. There's. There's an expectation of honor, courage and commitment and dedication to the mission that you're assigned to and to the organization. Whereas in the civilian sector, there may not be that same measure of obligation. There may not be that I'm all in, you know, I'll die for you in there. And so because there is a disparity like that, then there is a lot more influence that has to go into the leadership rather than just by order of. And so there, I think the hardest challenge is the biggest challenge, I would say, for myself and those like myself who are turning to certain rank, even with that colonel, is they're learning the language and learning that, you know, I have a certain level of care that I will be able to express to you, you know, through language, but also in the way that I treat you, that is with dignity and respect, which will generate some momentum. And what I have found, at least as I've talked to others who have decided to go and work in civilian. In the civilian sector, what they have done is they've realized that, okay, sure, my language has to be different, but my heart doesn't. I can still lead with my heart. I can still let somebody know that I'm all for them, and then I shift my language, and then that same measure of influence is in place, and then they can still lead the way.

You know, I asked him this question when I. After I went out to work with them, because it was so odd for me. I haven't been in the military. So we went and had lunch, and he walks in the room and everybody stands up and he walks to the front of the line and he gets his food, and, you know, I'm right there with him. And. And it's an odd experience if you're not used to that. And I said, how do you handle. You know, you're in here, you're the guy, and you go outside of the base and nobody knows, and you don't get that same kind of treatment. What is that like for you mentally, to be the guy in there? But nobody else knows that, right?

Well, you know what happens. And each service does it differently.

There are some folks who believe that leaders should eat last and all their troops should get their food first. They should ensure that they are taken care of. Then when they come in and their troops, their sailors, their airmen, soldiers, submarines, see that they allow them to eat first and that they're eating last, that generates a certain measure of sanctity. Within the organization for the Navy, and I'm sure for the senior officers in the Air Force, what ends up happening is that they're continuously reminded, buddy, you are just a man. You are just a man. There's a trusted agent that they have that is close to them that reminds them that they are not a God, as the stoics would say, you're just a man. And so that when that transition takes place, then they are. We are able to make that transition, realizing and knowing that only in certain environments will folks, you know, stand. Only in certain environments will people, you know, make a hole so you can get by. You know, very interestingly, my. My aunts, I'm telling you, my. My aunts, some of the fiercest ladies around, and they came to visit. I'm 20 or so years into the Navy. Ship is in there. They're going to see Oprah Winfrey's. She had a play on Broadway. My ship just happened to be in town. They're like, oh, we should go by and see Raymond. And so they come to the ship, the line. We've got about 10,000 visitors per day. The line is literally a mile long. I tell them, tell the taxi cab to come to the street. They come to the very front. And again, they've been with me my whole life. So we took some photos or whatever, but it was the first time ever, ever seeing me in uniform and in my workspace. Now, the line is probably a quarter mile where we're standing, maybe about. Maybe. Probably a par 5, you know, from where we were standing to get to the pier. And I put my hand on the sailor's shoulder, and I was like, hey, Shamay, you mind if we get by? He looks over his shoulder, he sees this man. He's like, oh, heck, yeah, master chief, no problem. He says, but hold on. Would you take a picture with my mom? I was like, sure. So I click, we take a photo, and then he just shouts, make a hole. And hundreds of people just literally move out of the way. And my aunts are looking at each other like, what in the world is going on? But they stepped into character. They didn't slow down at all. Step right in between everybody, and made our way up to the front. The thing is, Gary and I share that kind of long story with you, that we realize that it's only in those environments where that takes place. Not at the grocery store, not if we go to Ruth Chris or anything like that, but only in that environment. And so that transition in the workplace, though, is a bit tough because in the workplace, you expect people to bow down to that measure of service that you have gotten before, especially in a meritocracy. And so that transition into the workplace and those folks not maneuvering that way is somewhat of a challenge for military members. Yeah.

So let's talk for a minute about laying the keel.

Sure. So the. So you think back to the days when we were building wooden ships, and we still build ships, but that one hard piece of wood that went down the middle is the keel. And then we build out from there. What we had done in the Navy is we had kind of gotten away from the fundamentals of leadership in a step by step way to growing and building. And so in laying the keel, and it was. There are several different portions of the document. I wasn't responsible for the entirety of the document. I was responsible for the initiation. So for the senior enlisted portion of the document. And what we did is we very methodically built out leadership waypoints for sailors as they make their way through their career. And so whether it be Sailor 360, which was a very specific educational program that they went off site to learn.

To a means of, when you get back to your command, continuing that conversation. And so the lay in the keel document itself was basically the formality of building out a sailor individually all the way throughout their career, career. So various different waypoints so that they would be soundly built to make their way to those senior positions.

Sounds like it's something that would be good for businesses as well.

No doubt. I mean, especially in the day. Because, you know, these days there's a. There's. It's important for there to be some measure of hierarchy, though. We seem to be seeking after very flat organizations.

And it's, I think it sounds kind of, you know, seductive to have a flat organization where everybody just seems to be the equal. But there's got to be some structure there. And whether you have a very young person who comes in, let's say, to NASA who's got innovative, you know, great ideas that are, you know, literally rocket science. Sure. You know, that is absolutely important. And those folks have to, it's just smart to train them in such a way where one, they know how to talk to people and two, they know how to put those structures in place so that they can, in a very balanced way, award and celebrate those things that are done properly. And so I do, I agree, in the civilian sector, it'd be very useful to ensure that people, as they make their way towards the C suite or towards the executive suite, they have the proper training to maneuver in that space once they get there.

So how do you now you do leadership training, right?

I do some training and also some coaching. But the majority of what I do is I just kind of, I come in and I talk to them about leadership and every now and then that leads to. So exactly what do you mean by the ABCs of leadership? And then I can talk to them about attitude, belief and character and how to grow those leaders in a, in the fashion that you want them to lead the company.

So how do you define leadership?

I would say that leadership is the willingness to step out and be the example to, to walk that mission, vision and guiding principles in such a way where others are willing and able to follow you.

And so how does.

Is leadership something you can learn? Is leadership just something you either have or don't have? What have you seen?

So it's been my experience that much the same as, you know, my daughter Mahogany is just an uncanny skill at throwing a football. She's got a flat out canon and it's not something that I taught her. I mean, she's got some decent DNA, I guess, but it's not something that I taught her. She can just absolutely, you know, throw a very tight spiral a great distance. Leadership in the same way, there are some people who have a, an ability to communicate with others in such a way that it inspires confidence. And there are some folks like myself who may not have started with a high level of confidence, but grew and developed it based on experience and then became leaders. So oftentimes there's argument between, you know, do you build leaders or are they born. And I would say both. There, there are some who are born into it and they can become better. There are some who may not necessarily be born into it, but we can develop those leadership traits that help them get there.

What was the biggest turning point in your life or in your career where you said, you know what, now I'm a leader. Because I. You said you were shy, didn't feel like you had a great speech, and you went into the military and at some point you had to have become a leader. What was that turning point for you?

For me, it happened really, really early. Gary, what I didn't mention is that growing up in elementary school and high school, I played sports. And oftentimes because I was my athletic prowess, I was somewhat of a leader. And I wasn't necessarily always a team captain. But once I joined the Navy, I was four days in and they told me, hey, you're the sixth Squad leader. And they told me in boot camp that Navy means never again volunteer yourself. And so I was like, what squad leader? But sure enough, I was responsible for 20 other folks within my boot camp company. And it was at that point that I realized that even though I may have this slur, this lisp or whatever name that other people might give it, I've got to get over that and I've got to help these people on my team understand, you know, how to be, push up, shine boots, things like that. But it was at that point when the leadership was kind of thrust upon me that I realized, okay, well, this is just what my life is going to be and I'm going to lead the way the whole way. And that's exactly what happened. So at various different levels throughout my career, there was a time where I was assigned to do something where I didn't fully know what that, whether it be a technical thing or whether it be a war fighting event, that I didn't fully understand how to do it specifically, but I absolutely understood how to tap into the people who did and build a resilient team and then fight and win.

So how do you do that? How do you tap into the people you have and build a resilient team?

First thing that has to happen is that you express a level of care. It's become common to say that people really don't care how much you know until they know how much you care. And so when you're able to express that measure of care, that creates a measure of trust, because trust is super important. The next thing would be attitude. You know, I come from an environment where they say that your attitude determines your altitude. And so with a good attitude, a positive outlook, then you create an environment.

Where the folks in your stead, they realize when you care about them. Two, you have a solid attitude, but it's not just a good attitude. In spite of it all, it's because you studied. It's because you have prepared. The next two things I would say are belief and character. So first of all, belief comes when you have studied, when you have surveyed the territory, when you have helped people understand that, hey, look, what we're doing is a righteous event. What we're doing is something that needs to be done. And then of course, doing those things with character, that is, when no one else is looking, people know that you're giving it your all, that there is honor, that there is integrity in what you're doing, that creates that environment where those folks that are working with you, no matter what Their background may be, no matter what the differences that there may be between you, that you are someone who is trustworthy and people will follow after that.

And that's the ABCs correct attitude, character. Yeah, it's almost like.

C. ABC, just.

Right, right, right. Because that level of care is. Is the. Is the first step in building trust.

I know you mentioned one time that because of your stature, because of your size, you can be easily misinterpreted.

Right, Richard?

So how have you overcome that?

Well, I'll tell you, if I would have known.

The language of my why, how, and what, that would have certainly helped. So in uniform, I was Normally the last 10, 15 years of my career. I carried probably between 250, 260 pounds. So I was kind of hulking in my presence. And I used to tell people that, you know, coercion is a solid leadership. So if I would come into a space, you know, you know, the thermostat is. I definitely have my hand on the thermostat, just on my physical presence. And because of that, it made some people uncomfortable. But I'll tell you though, if I. If I had the language of look, I am truly, truly just here to find a better way. And the way that I'm going to do that is by challenging the status quo and traditional thinking, which may feel a bit intrusive, but I assure you that what you're going to feel when I leave is that there has been a contribution made to everyone who works here and to the greater good of the mission of this particular organization. I didn't have that at the time, and so I just had to prove it. And so I would enter into a space, I would go in and I would talk to people, especially as the inspector General for sailor programs for the Navy. It was oftentimes intimidating. And so I would come into a space and look to establish that level of care and the sincerity in that would allow me to prevent the misinterpretation or the unexpected coercion.

So now you've been out how long?

Retired in 2019. So coming up this. This summer will make three years for me. So two and a half years so far.

And how's the last two and a half years been for you?

It's been interesting. It was a little clunky in that I spent about a year in Virginia, and then Covid came and I wasn't really sure exactly what I wanted to do, whether I wanted to, you know, go work for another organization or just start, you know, chem solutions and do that full Time, which is what I did choose to do. But it's been exciting and it has been very rewarding and fulfilling because to, first of all, to be an entrepreneur is super duper challenging. But then to connect with good people and find out information that just helps me become a better person, you know. So when I connected with Dan, when I connected with Lisa Schermerhorn and got introduced to yourself and to the Wine Institute, and my life accelerated in a way that I can kind of see inside myself. And I'm thinking, oh, I just can't wait to share this with others. And so it's been an exciting time, that's for sure.

Yeah. So now with Kemp Solutions, who would be your ideal client? Who are you looking to work with?

I would say that diverse organizations, not necessarily trapped into particular industry, but a diverse organization that is looking to build their resiliency and loyalty within their organization are the exact right folks for me. I can talk to them as a leadership expert and help them maneuver between the challenges that we have been making our way through this last 20 months. Whether it is the social injustice and reform that we're fighting through in society or whether it be the pandemic. Those organizations, they're looking to build strong teams in that environment are the right ones for me.

Okay, so I'm going to give you a challenge. You didn't know this was coming, but this is a common scenario that I hear and probably people listening to this right now might be, you know, they could be experiencing this same sort of thing. But we're taught in a lot of the leadership courses and experts now about there's five generations of, of work people in the workforce right now. Right. And so they all came from different backgrounds, they all came from different experiences. You've got more women, you've got more minorities, you've got a lot of diversity. And so everything's diversity, diversity. But with that comes a lot more unknowns.

Sure.

And how do you handle working with a 50 year old versus a 40 year old versus a 30 year old versus a 20 year old? And sometimes we're taught to, oh, you've got to know everything about each one of them to be able to handle their different issues. And it almost feels like you're babying them. You know, you got to baby your team in order to get them to do anything. And it doesn't seem like it works very well.

Right.

And so the gentleman I just on my this morning I was met in the parking lot by a guy that says, hey man, I really got to talk to you. I tried that route and I watched it happen and it's kind of backfired a little bit on him and now he's almost feeling like he wants to go the opposite route where it's just like, I don't want any babies on my team. I don't want to have to deal with all your crap. I don't want to have to know all the stuff going on in your life. I just want you to come and do what we need to have done.

What is your perspective on that?

I am not a big fan of hand holding. I'm not a big fan of spoon feeding. However, I realize that there is a time to hold hands and there is a time to bring that spoon to someone else's lips. I absolutely do. I would say that when an organization has a standard, when they have a standard that everyone is clear on, look, there are the bedrock foundations of our company. This, this and this. We shall do our level best at all of these things and that's who we are. Not necessarily seeking to over diversify, you know, the forest, not necessarily seeking to ensure that we have, you know, this smattering of people throughout the organization. But what we do have is a standard of people. We have a standard that the organization is going to work towards as a whole. And when the organization realizes that, especially at the head, when you're doing things in goodness and in order, when you're doing things with character, they'll trust and know that no matter what the face of the organization is, they'll know that the standard is maintained.

Knowing every single thing about a person I think is depending on the size of the organization is certainly challenging. But as we just talked about a moment ago, expressing a level of care beyond just the cursory how was the weekend? How are the kids? And knowing the kids names and things like that, when you're operating with sincerity, that is when people realize that it is true. That is when that that trust goes beyond the formality of the organization. I would say, Gary, that it's not necessarily an overabundance of babysitting and hand holding and spoon feeding. What it is, is a true expression of what the company's mission, vision, their guiding principles are the standard at which we're going to work within the organization. That is what's going to draw people in and it's going to draw and build that loyalty as well. I'm with you. I'm somewhat disappointed in what some leadership experts are saying. The same thing you're talking about. I have to know the intimate details of every person and being drawn into those things. No, what we need to do is let people know what our standards are, adhere to those standards, do our absolute best, and then keep it pushing.

You know, that's a great answer. And that's. Like I said, you didn't know I was going to ask you that. But to me, the part about setting the standard, living the standard, being the standard, this is the way we do things, is so valuable because that oversees or overshadows everything else. And if you meet the standard and you're. You want to be part of this standard, you're in.

Right.

If you don't want to be part of this standard, that's okay too.

Right. There's other opportunities for employment in other places.

Yeah. And what I noticed with the one that I was talking about, they have some really high standards, but I'm not sure the leader lives the standards.

Visibly.

And see, that's the thing too, is that when.

The culture comes from the highest level of leadership, the climate comes from that frontline supervisor. And so the highest levels in leadership need to ensure that those frontline leaders understand and know that they're not just talking it, but they're walking it and talking it, because those frontline leaders are the ones who can convey to the rest of the workforce. Look, I know for sure that the leadership is doing these things, even though you may not see them, because what happens is you build some synergy in the relationships. And you're right, if the leader, the highest level of leadership are not doing it, then the culture is going to be a little shaky. Yeah.

So, Raymond, if there are people listening right now that want to have you come speak, want to have you come work with their teams, work with their companies, mentor them, what would be the best way for them to get in touch with you?

So I have a. My website is www.kemp solutions.com and I am on all social media platforms at Raymond D. Kemp, and on LinkedIn is Raymond D. Kemp Senior. And I'm available.

That's great. Hey, Raymond, thank you so much for being here. Sorry to put you on the spot like that, but. Yeah, I figured you probably would and that was a better way that you came up with. So thank you so much for spending the time with us and I look forward to working with you and staying in touch with you as we go on our journeys.

Same here, Gary. Look forward to getting you and Dan on the links, too. I understand both of you all play.

Yes, we do. We'll get. We'll get you there. Or over here, one of the two. It'll be fun.

Excellent. Good to go.

Thank you. Raymond, what's the best piece of advice you've ever been given or the best piece of advice you've ever gotten?

The best advice that I was ever given and I continue to give to others comes in the form of 10 two letter words. 10 two letter words that will make you a better man, a better woman, definitely a better leader. And those words are, if it is to be, it is up to me. If it is to be, it is up to me. It is a bit of a mantra that I live by. I am not looking for a handout. I am looking to make my own way and I am looking to help other people do the same. And so I was told that, you know, some number of years ago, as I was kind of fighting my way through some challenges in advancement in the Navy, and it has worked out in my favor. I think everyone could use those 102 letter words. If it is to be, it is up to me.

Love it. I'm going to write it down. Of course, we've all heard it, but living it is something totally different, right?

Totally different, absolutely.

How were you able to live that?

Well, I'll tell you. There was at one point there, so I came up and get a bit of an inferior school system. And so to take the. So the Navy determines your capabilities with your professional capabilities through a written examination. And the school system that I went through didn't necessarily prepare me for, you know, multiple, you know, choice tests, certainly not worded in the way that I was given. And so what I realized that, okay, the way that, you know, the rote memory, you know, techniques that I had been taught weren't necessarily the best ones for me. And so I had to shift into, you know, using flashcards and other, you know, diverse means of preposterous preparation. And when I realized, okay, there's not just one way to do things, there's many different ways, then I realized, okay, well, I've got to make sure I do my own due diligence and do my absolute best when it comes down to everything I put my hands to if I want to be successful. And that was it, you know, in spite of what anyone else did or obstacles that were in front of me, it was just about effort. It was persistence over resistance, really.

I have another question I wasn't probably supposed to ask, but it just kind of popped in my head and I want to ask you.

Sure.

You didn't have it easy. You weren't given Everything that you got, you had challenges to overcome. You had people that didn't treat you nicely. You had a lot of stuff that maybe wasn't right. But how did that shape you? Did it shape you? Did it end up.

I mean, obviously it didn't destroy you.

Right.

Right.

Do you think it's. I guess where I'm going is, you know, in today's world, we try to take every. Everybody's offended by everything, so you try to take every offensive thing out of life so that they have a perfect upbringing. And I wonder if that will end up being a good thing.

Well, you know, I think that there is. I didn't grow up in an environment where everybody got a T shirt, everybody got a trophy. I grew up in an environment where you had to earn what. What you got. And I think that because of that, even when it was just absolutely unfair, I mean, just systematically unfair, that there were still some good things that came out of that, you know, that. That master chief I talked to you about, when I first joined the Navy, he was throwing dirt on top of me. He just had no idea I was a seed and I was going to grow into the tree that I became, by the way, and bear fruit. And some of that fruit I'll never taste, but still bear fruit so that other harvests could grow. I do believe that there is something wrong when we try to totally avoid offending. We try to totally create some environment that is one where people don't have to come against some controversy and come against friction. And I believe that that friction that I went through was what I needed to grow and be built into who I became. And just the same as I believe that there is.

It'S okay, you know, in the overall, I think it's okay for there to be some measure of friction, you know, some measure of disagreeance. I think that when we can come together and reason one to another, there is great value. There shouldn't just be, you know, abuse as we have seen throughout American history and beyond. But, yeah, it didn't destroy me. When I look back over the challenges that I overcame, they created me into who I am today.

Awesome. Thank you.

For sure.

For sure. Yeah. When we don't have to put this. So we don't have to put this onto the podcast. But it just became so obvious to me as I was listening to your story that, you know, what we do today with some of the young people is. I don't know that it's good. You know, there's. Everyone's got to be pampered and babied and don't offend them and don't say this and don't make them do that and don't expect this. And you're like, golly, that's what makes you. That's the. That's the. That's what makes you into who you are going to be.

It is. And, you know, I'll tell you, I mean, you know, very frankly, Gary, some. When I look at my. I have four children, three girls and a boy. And when I think about, you know, some of the challenges that I just intentionally put them through, it was so that they would know by that. For example, there was a boys and girls club that was not too far from my house in Virginia, and it was the hood. I mean, we didn't live in the hood by any means, but this boys and girls club was full of them folks that were from a supremely tough environment. But I used to make the kids go there after school, even though they didn't really have to, because I wanted them not to be surprised by what it's like when it's hard. You know, don't be surprised by what it's like when, you know, somebody comes up and starts talking about your mama. Somebody walks up and punches you because, you know, you've got some clothes that they wish they had, whatever the case may be. And I think for them, they didn't understand it at first, but then when they realized they were okay to maneuver in that space, I thought, well, there's some value just in knowing how to deal with that. And what has happened is they're now adults and they're kind of making their way. I think to myself, well, shucks, that worked out pretty good because they don't fold up every time somebody raises their voice at them. They don't fold up because someone is juxtaposed to whatever their perspective may be. They're able to stand and defend their thesis. And that is just supremely important. And when we create that giveaway environment that don't offend environment, then we make people into pushovers later on down the line, which will have an impact, I think, on our society. And we've got to get that right soon.

I do. You know, when I'm going to hire somebody, I ask them, on a scale of 1 to 10, how easily offended are you? Because I want to know, and I don't want to hire somebody who's easily offended. And if they say I'm a seven, I'm not easily offended. Okay, well, what kind of things might offend you?

What a great question. Yeah.

Because you want to know. I don't want to say some. The odds that I don't offend somebody. How it's way more likely that I'm going to say something that's going to offend somebody sometime, somewhere in some way. Don't you think?

Right. Oh, yeah, no doubt. No doubt.

You want to lose Kemp Solutions because you said something to somebody you didn't know would offend them. Say what?

That's so true. That's so true. Especially when it is, you know, some cultural boundary that I didn't even know I was stepping across. You know, that's. Come on, man. I mean, I can't hold, you know, against somebody, you know, some color that they're wearing or whatever the case may be, just because it's. That's a thing where I'm from. That's tough. But.

So that's something that you might consider adding to your little repertoire. But I said. I asked him, I said, okay, where are you on this scale? And they'll tell me. And if, you know, if they're like three, you can offend me with just saying, hi, I'm not hiring them.

Yeah, for sure.

But if they tell me, it's this. Okay, well, what. Give me an example of what I could say that would offend you so that I know. And the reason I'm asking you is for this specifically, because I will offend you at some point, and I just know it. There's no way around me not offending you. I'll say something.

Yeah.

And I want to know how you're going to react if you get offended by something I didn't even realize I said. Right. So you just throw it out there.

Yeah. What am I, left, right lateral limits with you? You know, what, what, what. What are the extremes? You give me an example. What would be offensive? And then what do we do once we get to that point?

That's a great question, because it's gonna happen. So, anyways, great job. I enjoyed having you on. You did really, really good. So you're going to enjoy listening to this. I think it'll be good for you.

I'm looking forward to it. Gary, thank you again.

All right, man. Good to see you.

All right, you, too. Take care.

Thanks, Raymond. So it's time for our guess, the why segment. And for this segment today, I want to use somebody that a lot of people know, especially if you're into sports and you followed Tom Brady and you followed the New England Patriots. I want to know what do you think the why of coach Bill Belichick is? He's the one, you know, he's always in the hoodie. He's known as the guru in football. He's won the most championships of anybody. He did have Tom Brady on his team, you know, and there's the debate of is it because of Tom or is it because of Bill? But he is known as a great mind in the football world. So what do you think his why is? I think his why is make sense. I think he's able to make sense out of complex and challenging things and help people get unstuck and help him move forward and be able to zig and zag and make adjustments on the fly really easily. And so that's what's made him into a great coach. What do you think? Let us know if there's an area for comments. Let us know what you think and if you thank you for listening. If you've not yet discovered your why, you can do so@yinstitute.com you can use the code PODCAST50 and get it for half off. If you love the beyond, you'd why Podcast? Please don't forget to subscribe below and leave us a review and rating on whatever platform you are using to listen to our podcast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week.

I really hope you enjoyed today's episode and that through today's guest, you heard how important it is to know your why and how impactful it can be in your life and the lives of those around you. Be sure to head over to whyinstitute.com and discover your why today. Remember, the more you know about yourself, the more you'll know about others. I'm Dr. Gary Sanchez and I'll see you on the next episode.