Learn How to Garden in Wisconsin with Katie Oglesby

Welcome back to the Grow youw Self podcast. We have one of my very, very favorite gardeners in the world here today. Tell us your name, where you live, and your incredible business that's changing the world.

My name is Katie Oglesby. I live in Lake Geneva, Wisconsin, and I'm the owner of Katie Oglesby Gardens.

So incredible. And you're in Lake Geneva, and you're a gardener. I mean, I thought you could only garden, like, two days.

Prior. To contrary belief. Yes. No, we actually grow arguably. March, November through. Sorry, March, April through November.

Wow. Amazing. And it's. You're growing enough of the year to actually, like, grow a business there?

Yes, most certainly.

Okay, so we got to know. We got to know the details, like how. Tell us what a year in the garden looks like in Lake Geneva, where most people are probably only thinking, like, they want to step outside in July. Bring. Bring us. Let's, like, go through. I'll actually lead you if you want me to. Let's start with January. What does January look like in terms of getting ready for the garden?

January is obviously a little frozen outside. Right. So we're going to substitute with some microgreens and some other things that you can easily grow inside.

Okay.

But that's kind of when the planning starts. So seed ordering. February. March starts to be seed starting. And depending on the year. Like, we've planted in February before in cold frames.

Okay.

Some seeds.

Yeah. I think I saw a video, and you had. It was, like, snowing, and you lifted the cold frame in February, and it had spinach in it. So how in the world did that happen?

Yeah. So essentially, we just kind of warmed up the area. We put the cold frame on a week before, and I just started sowing seeds. Right. That spinach is super cold, hardy. We don't realize it. So spinach kale is a great thing. I've even had it semi overwinter and kind of rekindle again.

Yeah.

If it didn't make it in November. And so we love to start with greens right away because I'm sick of the grocery store salad greens.

Right. I mean, those just go straight to the trash two weeks after purchase. Okay. So February, we've got a cold frame outside, possibly already got spinach in it. And then anything new happening in March? Still snowing or. No?

Still snowing. Still snowing. So again, we're still doing some more greens. I'll be putting some carrot seeds in. We're gonna start. You know, every year's different, but we're gonna start adding more and more that we can. I'll even hoop a few areas to maximize. And as we start getting close to the end of March, beginning of April, I'll start putting some sugar snap pea seeds in and a few other things. I'm Beets.

Wow. Okay, so what does it mean when you say hoop? A few things.

Hoop. So some of the beds have cold frames. Some simply just have some PVC pipes with some plastic over it. And it's. It's sufficient enough to get things going so I can have a really early salad garden. And that means that bed is going to transform and flip multiple, multiple times throughout the year then.

Wow. So when you say plastic, what do you mean? Like a plastic bag or. Where are we getting this kind of plastic?

Piece of plastic from Home Depot or Lowe's or wherever?

Seriously, everyone can get this at Home Depot.

Everybody.

You don't have to be like a farmer to get this kind of supplies. No, it's literally a plastic sheet.

It's a plastic sheet.

Okay. And then you take some PVC pipe, make it a little, like, arch over the bed, and then do you clamp it down? Like, how do you keep the snow out?

Clamp it down. There's a piece of rebarb in it. We put the PVC PVC pipe over the rebar, and then we'll clamp it down.

Wow. So cool. Okay, so we're already. We got, like, tons of things planted, and we're only in April. You said carrots, beets, greens. Those are all in the green, all in the garden. And peas all before the end of April.

They're all going in.

And most everybody else in Wisconsin is still, like, in a parka inside with the fire running.

Yes, most people. And it's hard. It's hard to find seedlings like that. The greenhouses aren't offering things like that, which is why we don't think that they should be done earlier. And which is why we see a lot of garden fails with those cool season crops in July, because they aren't going in until the end of May and they need to go in. So then I'm going to start with broccoli, cauliflower, Brussels sprout plants, fennel, leeks, all of those things that are starting to go in as soon as snow's gone. Frost is lifted, depending on.

So can that happen in May?

Oh, it's end of April, end of April, end of April, beginning of May. I'm pushing the limits, but I love you for that. It's going in. It's going in.

I love it. Say it again. I'm pushing the limits.

Pushing the limits.

Okay, so we're in May now. And when is your. When is. You know the thing everyone talks about that last frost date. When does that happen?

You're around May 10th is usually around when they say this, but we've had it later. I mean, I'm not gonna lie. It's been. We've had snaps of that, but still, I push the limits.

And were there tears when it was later?

No, I just keep rolling. I'm like, oh, they got a little nip. Because you're gonna be okay. Yeah.

Because your garden's full, right?

My garden is full and my garden is large. So.

So cool. Okay, so we're in May. You've got everything planted now. And so when that last frost date comes and goes, what's going to happen next in Wisconsin?

So tomatoes and eggplant, all the warm season plants are going in. The last thing usually to go in is about the sweet potatoes only. Cause they don't ship them till later. So that's about the last thing that goes in for me.

You put sweet potatoes in Wisconsin in your garden in May, end of May.

Sometimes they don't give them to me until June. So it all depends on the shipping times.

June's the day seed companies. Oh, so you order sweet potato slips.

Slips. I order sweet potato slips. And just because they're, you know, they're being responsible and they don't want to have to be replace it for people that put them in too early. So depending on when those come to me, that is usually the last thing to go in. Just because it's the last thing I can get my hands on. Wow.

So most people think of summer starting June 1, right when school lets out, and before that first day of like, what we think of as officially summer, you've basically already planted every single plant in your garden, from spinach and leeks and all the greens, the beets, the carrots. And then you already have tomatoes, peppers, eggplants. They're all already there. And no one's jumped in the pool yet?

No. Correct.

Amazing. Correct. All right, so tell us what's happening June, July, August. Is it crazy town in your garden?

It's starting to come. Like, strawberries are coming, rhubarb, asparagus. Those are our early season perennial crops in Wisconsin. So I started to see asparagus as early is April sometimes. So the goal is to really think through, like, eating with the seasons and what we can bring in. So we're going to See the rhubarb and the asparagus and things like that. Strawberries are starting to come, so it's a great transition. The greens are still full. And then as those end, you know, we start to see some of our warm seed herbs can start to be cut. And then I actually start planting again for fall, so.

Are you serious?

I start to plant another round of.

Okay, what's the month when you begin planting for fall?

End of June, beginning of July.

Do you ever stop gardening, Katie?

No, I'm never. I never stop planting. You always. Your garden should never be fully planted. In my opinion, you should always be planting.

Oh, I love that. I love that. It's like every month you've got something to plant, something to tend, something to harvest. Right. Okay, so June, all these crops are coming. What's your. And is July gonna be even bigger than you've already gotten? Strawberries, rhubarb, asparagus. Those things really come full in June. Is that right? May.

May and June.

Oh, May and June. Okay. And then how soon are you harvesting tomatoes, peppers, eggplants. Does that happen before August or does it wait till August?

Depends on the season. Can be end of July, can be beginning of August. Kind of depends on the size of the seedlings that went in also. So it really kind of depends. I think some of the early cherry tomatoes, some of those tomatoes are coming a little bit early. I try to make sure that I also, when I'm planning, I have plants and variety types that are coming at different times. So I've really staggered that to maximize it A, so I can eat and two, so it's not overwhelming all at once.

Absolutely. I've been there, where you're, like, a little ambitious at the beginning and no ambition left. Like, these are all just gonna sit in the harvest basket and go back to the compost pile, which is so sad. Or get thrown on my neighbor's front porch. You've never done that, right? You've never given anybody just stuff on their front porch. Cause you had too much.

I've gifted.

Oh, gifted.

Okay.

You didn't just throw it there like me.

I've gifted.

I've gifted.

And then, you know, our raspberries start to come in July. So, like, I always try to make sure I fruit throughout the entire season.

Wow. Okay, so run us through. What's a fruit? What are the months for the fruit in terms of coming into the harvest basket?

Yep. So June would be strawberries.

Okay.

July, we're going to start to see raspberries, blueberries.

Wow.

And I make sure I have raspberries July through November, so I always have succession planting varieties through there. Then we kind of start to see some middle. I have purple raspberries that come in the middle. Then we start to see the fruit trees coming. So we have cherries. And then we're going to move into that fall season where we have the apples and the pears and again, some fall raspberries.

And this is all in your yard.

All on one acre.

And are we all salivating right now? Absolutely. I mean, that just sounds like paradise. Katie, that's incredible. How many years has it taken you to have such a long abundance of a fruit harvest? Because that's a, you know, I do kitchen garden so much, which is like, you got three months and you get to pick something. But some of these things you're referencing, they're. They're a long haul kind of food. So how many years would it. Would you say it took to get you to a place where you could have fruit? You're harvesting from your garden from May all the way till November.

So year two, year one, you're not going to see much. Right. So that's kind of the bummer. The bummer year. But year two, you're going to start to see year two, plus asparagus is more of a year three, you're going to see a little bit more. You can only take one spear per crown on year two, and that starts to increase. But we've had great harvests on year two.

Wow. How many years did it take you to plant all those things? Did you do all that at once?

That's a great question. So we started out with all the berries primarily at once, and then the fruit trees came later. That's just another, you know, it's another skill set. It's another thing to learn and take on. So the berries definitely went in first, Asparagus went in relatively early, and the fruit trees were the last to come.

Okay, cool. That is amazing. I mean, how so all in less than one acre you have fruit. Homegrown fruit from May till November in Wisconsin. In Wisconsin, where, you know, not many people think, you know, the fruit bowl of the country. You know what I'm saying?

That is true. It's so true. And, you know, it's like Memorial Day to Labor Day is kind of what's ingrained in us. And I'm like, no, don't abort mission in Labor Day. Keep going. You have two more months of fresh food. Yeah.

You're like eating bowls of raspberries. While everybody else is at the grocery store. Amazing. Okay, so wrap the year up for us. You're in. You're heading into September. When's your first frost likely to happen?

Closer to October. I start to see the first frost again. I have my second planting of cauliflower, broccoli, fennel. All of those cool season crops again got planted at the end of August. So my goal is I make sure there are a short day, cauliflower or broccoli type, and then they're frost tolerant. The kale will be fine. Most things make it. I finally got the final zap on Halloween, and that took out my dahlias and some of my other things. But, you know, there's still things growing out there. My Brussels sprouts, I'm harvesting still. I'll harvest those through Thanksgiving. Wow.

All right. And so we're all the way to. We're past the first frost. And then what's happening in your garden or what are you doing November to December?

I'm starting to kind of clean it out. So I'm cleaning it out. I'm doing some garden hygiene. We're adding new compost. I'm prepping everything for spring, so I'm ready to go.

Right.

We don't know what spring brings. It can be wet, rainy, and because I want to plant so soon, I want to make sure everything's ready so the, the beds are cleaned out. What needs to be composted is composted cold. Frames are all set and going, and I'll start to, you know, do some final preservation of things to get me through winter.

Wow. And so then it just starts all over again. Then you're back to January and you're planting some seeds inside and getting ready to build your cold frame.

Yep.

Amazing. Okay, Katie, tell me, how did you learn all of this stuff? When did you become a gardener?

So I met my husband in 2009. I never grew a thing. He had this little garden at his parents, Marina and I just started being like, let's make it a little bigger. Let's make it a little bigger. Never read a gardening book, Never watched a YouTube video. Did not know what I was doing all day. Trial and egg, all self taught. You know, I'm a tactile learner and I'm a visual learner, so I had to teach myself. And I just kept tilling up every vacant piece of land I could find, adding crops, and just learning how I wanted to do things differently.

Yeah. So all literally you learned this the hard way?

Well, I learned it the hard way. And. But you know, I think that's one of the things is people get disappointed when you have a setback in the garden. And to me, it was never a negative thing because I didn't know what I didn't know. And so honestly, it's a gift.

Yeah.

It's every lesson is a gift from the garden and you're going to be a better grower for it. And we were growing, started to grow. I said to my husband one day, let's do a farmer's market. And he's like, you've never even been to a farmer's market. What were your crazy ideas? But really, truly, that's when the realization came is like trying to figure out how to grow commercially was way different. And showing up with something new every week, which is what forced me into succession planning. I just didn't know what it was. And I thought, if we're doing it commercially, why are we not doing it in our own home garden? Oh, like, that's where is the pivotal point was kind of like, if I have to show up every week with lettuce for everybody, why aren't we doing this? Instead of having these one hit wonders, which I think is why is the deterring effect. You know, they get a bunch of everything at once. They're sick of it. And people don't really embrace what it could be.

Yeah. Yes. And so that's. So I usually say, like, the best way to get better at something is to teach it. But you took it one step further. The best way to get better at something is to do it for others. And so it's like the minute you were having to really step it up, it like brought you to a different level of gardening. Amazing. So was that your career selling at the farmer's market before you started Katie Oglesby Gardens?

No, I was working full time.

Oh, what were you doing?

So I was in the legal field for a while.

Okay.

I was actually a private investigator and I was working for PI, Katie PI And a nonprofit law firm. And then I went to more to financial services in an office. So I was literally just doing it on the weekend in the side and as a hobby and just trying to learn and grow.

Wow. What made you want to start Katie Oglesby Gardens?

So actually, final year of doing the farmer's market, I got sick. And I have this image that's imprinted in my head. And it was late one night and the headlights on my car were on and I had headlamp on and I'm kneeling in the Broccoli aisle. And I. As I'm going down the aisle at 9 o' clock at night, I'm pushing a pizza box next to me down. And that. I remember that because a few weeks after that, I got very, very sick and had a hard time recovering. I could not get answers for what was wrong with me. And at the end of the day, I started watching some food documentaries, and I thought, okay, Katie, your garden is healthy, but your own soil is not healthy. And so that's when I changed my tactic. I thought, I'm gonna go back to the garden, because the one thing I can control is how I nourish myself. The one thing that I am in control of is my food. And I went back to the garden with a different perspective and just grew for myself, grew to heal. And I thought, if I can do this for myself, maybe this would be beneficial for others.

Wow. Okay, so bring us to the. When. When did you start your business?

Started my business in 2020. It was supposed to start out as a health coaching business. And I kept thinking, but the garden was really what helped me transition. Right. And heal. And I thought everybody had this negative context of gardening because we think of the victory garden, we think of labor, we think of being bent over. And I do grow in ground, and it is so much work. And then I did see how you were doing it in raised beds, and I thought, if I can make it more accessible for people to grow their own food in a more aesthetic way, maybe this is my answer to get gardens in people's backyards, to understand the quality of food is different when you grow it yourself. Yeah. And then that's how I ended up here.

Wow.

Okay.

So did you do your own raised beds before you started your business?

We did. We had a couple. And actually, it was because we were forced to. We had poor drainage, and we had heavy rain one year, and everything was rotting from the bottom up. And so we were throwing up. I don't mean to say shoddy, but we were just throwing up stuff to, like, save the ability to be able to grow to, like, a higher land. And we put them in raised beds. And I thought, you know, but they're the mistake, right? Eight by eights or whatever the lumber was, they weren't great. I thought, oh, gosh, how do I get in the middle of this, like, learning all of that. Right. And those mistakes. And so we had some, but not to the level, obviously, of what it is today.

Yeah. Okay, so you. You did your first raised beds, and then is that when you Launched Katie Oglesby.

Yes.

Wow. So this was 2020, right in the middle of COVID Right in the middle. Amazing. So who's a client? What's a story of someone you've gotten to help since you started your business that's meant a lot to you?

Yes. So I had a family reach out to me, and it was primarily the mom, and she said, we need to change our lifestyle. We've had some family cancers, some deaths in the family, and I think it was, like, a pivotal point. They bought a bunch of acres, but they didn't know what to do or how to do it or how to start. And I could kind of tell there's some skepticism on behalf of some of the other family members. And they came to me later and they said, my kids are so happy. We can't imagine our house or property without our garden. And you are totally right. Fresh cauliflower tastes different in the store. We just didn't believe you.

You helped them grow cauliflower, Katie. In their first year.

Yes.

What the heck? That is hard to do.

So, I mean, then I was like, okay, like, this is. You know what I mean? Like, they could see the difference. They could taste the difference. I mean, capturing the children in the garden, too. Like, they're learning a skill set. Right. And some of it that we've forgotten throughout the years. And so just to see, like, the parents transition, the children transition, they're eating, and every year they're getting better and better and adding more and more and just embracing that lifestyle, and that's just something I couldn't imagine.

So cool. Okay, so obviously you're a little, you know, a little bit skilled when it comes to gardening. So teach us.

Tell us.

Like, bring me to school, Katie.

Oh, boy.

And give me the step by step as a garden consultant, Katie Oglesby. Give me the tips on how to grow, I don't know, something that's your favorite. It can be anything. If you want it to be cauliflower, I won't mind, because I've never had success there, really. But pick your favorite, like, and the people in the back, you know, that need to be. If you think there's a certain thing that's like, I'm really, really good at this, and they should be, too.

Oh, that's so tough. I mean, I love growing raspberries. Like, that's been my favorite from day one. And so I just learned we trial and error trellising. I've. I've planted them wrong. I've had a jungle.

Right.

So I'VE learned definitely how. Like two foot wide rows. Make sure we have trellising.

Okay.

Space them at least four feet apart.

The plants four feet apart.

The.

The beds, the beds, the beds four feet apart.

Make sure you have aisle space, because if you grow them well, they're gonna go wild. And that's what we want.

And we're going two foot wide beds.

Two foot wide beds.

What kind of soil?

I do a very heavy compost mixture. I'm not gonna lie. They're a shallow root plant, so we don't want a deep bed. They're literally in an 8 inch tall bed.

Oh, I love this 8 inch tall bed. 2 foot wide. We're going to heavy compost soil and we're planting one plant. How often?

Well, I push the limits again.

I love you for that.

I put them every foot. I'm like, I'm gonna go bigger.

Go home. Give it to me, Katie. I love it. So one raspberry plant.

Every foot, Every foot. And what kind of trellis you can use. We have cedar posts then. My clients ones are nicer than mine. Mine are pipe, minor pipe. We have leftover pipe, but you can do a cedar post. And we have two. Two wire lines that are running. So a lower and a higher wire.

Oh, at the bottom and at the.

Top kind of half, I'd say like two feet, two, three feet up. And then another one at least a foot and a half above.

And how taller the posts?

Posts are about four and a half feet tall.

Okay, four and a half feet tall. And how, like, how spread out are the posts?

Every 12ft.

Every 12ft. We got wires at 2ft up and 4ft up, and we got plants every foot. Okay. You told us already, like, you, if you guys missed it, she gave a big, big, huge, like, secret. And she said she's got raspberries from, like May until November. Because you have a lot of different varieties.

Yes.

So July to November.

Yep, July to November.

So how many varieties are in here? And are they all grouped together or are they all spread out?

Yeah, so I group them based on when they come because there's different pruning techniques for different seasons. Right. So let's just talk early season. Like we're using layman's terms, mid season and fall season. So early and mid are typically the same pruning techniques. So I make sure that they're in the rows, are together, or I know exactly what they are. Honestly, I recommend. This is my tip. When you're shopping for berries, always do a homegrown variety. Or a gardener's variety. When you pick a commercial variety that's high for production. I've gone and taste tested a ton.

Good.

Not good. They're not for flavor, they're for size. And they're for, you know, grocery stores. Yeah. Correct. And so I really recommend, like, ask people, like, ask the home gardeners who've had them in there, you know what the varieties are. And so I've narrowed down the varieties that I like to grow in Wisconsin. And I've trialed everything before. I'll put it in a client's garden. Wow. And so we will have them early. The middle is like the black raspberries and the purple, which are phenomenal.

Wow.

And then we're going to move to the fall. And so now we have all reds, yellows. And now there's a. There's a great pink that's come out.

Ah, we had pink. I did pink. The pink, that's the only kind I did though.

I mean, so like, to me too, like, you're having different color in them.

Oh my gosh.

It's like.

It's like a million dollars worth of raspberries in your yard. What?

Freezer's full too.

Seriously, do you know, like, how much you pay for terrible raspberries in this little bitty thing? It's like five bucks. And they're not even organic. Seriously, you have.

It's a huge savings.

It's not just savings. It's like a luxury. Okay, can you give us the pruning tips? Cause that's what I'm dying to know. For the early and mid. And then the. What do you do?

Yep. So year one, there's no pruning. Year two, we prune out the last year's cane. So all those canes that came up, they bear fruit the next year. And you can see a color difference in the cane. And that first year, if we have a nice growing season, that cane that's gonna produce the following year, sometimes we'll give you a light fall crop, so you kinda. So that's an added bonus.

Right.

And so year two, we always wanna trim out last year's canes. So you can remove em right away. Cause we want airflow within those canes. We don't want a lot of congestion in there. Um, and for fall bearing, they come down every year with the exception of year one.

Come down, cut it down to the bottom.

I take everything down to the bottom. And then canes, the fresh canes grow up and they bear that same year because they're coming so much later in the season.

Oh, so cool. And so these early ones, when you say cut it right away, meaning like, let's say it, it had fruit in July. Can I cut it down in November or I'm going to wait until like January.

You can do it in November. Sometimes we'll do it in August if I think it's pretty thick in there.

Okay.

As soon as I know that cane is done producing, you cut it. I can at the bottom.

And it's not in danger of hurting the plant.

No.

Even if I'm all the way till November and there's like, it's really nippy outside and cold and it might hit snow, it's. It's okay to have that raw cut.

Yes. I've never had any. Well, maybe I'm violating a rule, but I've never had any issues. And usually for fall, I do wait till after a couple hard frosts before I will start to take down all those fall bearing. But there's been times, hey, life's busy and we're out in January, like, shoot, we didn't get to the raspberries right. And it's. And it's been fine.

Wow. Like, I'm going to call you the million dollar raspberry woman. You just been renamed. And I am like, I am like looking, thinking about my yard. I'm like, where can I become Katie Oglesby? Okay, two more questions for you. Number one, if you could go back in time and talk to Katie when she was starting out in 2009, what advice would you give her? What's something you wish you knew on that first day you dug into the dirt?

Oh, that's a good question. Because I really, truly love all my mistakes I made. But I do wish I would have known just a little bit more about succession planting. Like, I didn't really understand. I didn't really days to grow. There was just a few things that I didn't really get. And I thought I've lost so much, like my maximizing of what I could have done, you know, things like that. But that's tough because I just, I think I am where I am because I had hard, hard lessons, but hard great gifts.

That's a quote that is worth repeating. She is where she is because she had great lessons. Right. I mean, it's funny, sometimes we despise our mistakes, but they are what makes us. I mean, you're clearly phenomenal at what you do.

I do have one mistake I made.

Tell us.

And so it was super hot in August. We were Moving. We were overwhelmed, and the garden needed to get watered.

By the way, she's only made one mistake. Guys, did you hear that? She said, I do remember that one. I made a mistake. So just wanted to point that out.

I made plenty, but this one definitely brought me to my knees the next day. And so we were too tired, and Matt's like, I'm throwing up overhead sprinklers. And I walked out the next day to a white fly infestation that I like.

Oh, my gosh.

I never. And so anytime I see over. I don't. I will never, ever, ever again do that.

But let's just point out that wasn't your mistake. That was Matt's.

Yeah, yeah, we're gonna blame him. He had that bright idea, not me.

So, anyway, okay, so water overhead.

The overhead watering, I think brought the flies. And I couldn't believe my eyes the next day. I didn't. I couldn't even. I almost was ready to walk away from it. It was such a disaster. And so I'll never overhead water like that.

Never again. Overhead. Never, ever.

I'm traumatized from that.

Oh, my gosh. I could literally talk to you for hours. I know this much about gardening, and you know this much, and you're such an inspiration. So tell us, what's your big dream? What's the legacy you want to leave behind through your garden, through your business? What's. What's your hope?

My hope is that I can transform as many properties to be as edible as possible. I just think we don't maximize what we can do, and we don't realize how much food we can grow ourselves and the impact that will have, the quality that we'll have, the nutrient density that will have on us. And so the more edible I can create everybody's properties that I can touch, the. The better.

Yes. And I just want to, like, sprinkle fairy dust on you and say, let's go. Let's do this. Because, oh, my gosh, you're changing the world. One person, one family. But so many gardens at a time. Just watching the properties that you have transformed, it inspires me. And I do this too. So tell all the people where to find you. How are they going to get in touch with you? Because clearly, we all want you to come grow raspberries for us and also want a beautiful garden like the ones you create. So tell people where to find you.

You can find me@katieoglesby.com. you can head to my website. There's a free salad and herb garden you can sign up for my weekly newsletter and I'm on Instagram @katieMoglesby.

Katie M. Oglesby. I'm going to spell it out for the people. O G L E S B Y. Take it from me, I have walked through Katie's kitchen garden and her row garden. I am not exaggerating when I say, like, I've never been in such a magical place. You are a phenomenal gardener and you deserve for every dream you have to come true. So thank you for being on the Grow youw Self podcast. You guys go follow Katie. Call her, book her. I'm pretty sure after this comes out that everyone's gonna know you as the million dollar raspberry woman. So thank you for bringing that huge, huge hack to us today. You're amazing.

Thank you for having me.

All right, go find Katie, follow her garden with her and join us next time on the Grow Yourself Podcast.