595: What to Do When Your Kid is Having Suicidal Thoughts with Rob Stein

Hello and welcome to the achieve your goals podcast, the show that empowers you to wake up to your full potential and achieve your biggest goals and dreams. I am your host, Hal Elrod and I invite you to join us each week as we share actionable strategies to take your life to the next level, as well as interview world class experts and entrepreneurs who have achieved extraordinary goals themselves. And we ask them to give you a peek behind the curtain and teach you exactly what you need to do to do the same. Ready? Here we go.

Hello my friends. Welcome to the achieve your goals podcast. This is your host, Hal Elrod and my guest today wrote a post in the miracle morning community and I read the post and I invited him to be on the podcast. I'm going to read you that post right now before I officially introduce Rob Stein. So the post was June 5, 2025. As of this recording, it's July 9, so a little over a month ago. And here's what it read. And by the way, Rob is a regular poster in the miracle morning community Facebook group. So I'm used to seeing his posts. They're usually very vulnerable and authentic and usually adding value and sharing what he's doing with his miracle morning or how he's using his savers. But this one struck a chord with me. So here's what he wrote. A while back, my son shared something that shattered me. He was having suicidal thoughts. Nothing prepares you for that as a parent. I felt like I had already lost him. The guilt hit hard. Where did I go wrong? What signs did I miss? I couldn't eat, couldn't think. I was drowning in fear and shame. But in the middle of that storm, I felt a quiet nudge. Get back to your foundation. So I did. Not to be productive, not to perform, but to survive. I leaned into my miracle morning routine. Each morning I sat in stillness. I focused each of the savers on my faith and spiritual growth. It didn't change everything overnight, but it grounded me. It helped me to go on and support my son while still function in my career and lead my family. Over time, I became the steady presence my son needed. Our conversations got deeper. His light started to come back. We began healing together. I share this not for sympathy, but for someone out there who feels helpless, who thinks it's too late, who's on the verge of breaking. Don't give up. Start with one morning. Sit in silence. Speak life. Let God meet you there. The miracle morning didn't just help me build better habits. It helped me show up for the person who needed me most. If you're struggling, keep showing up. You're not alone and your story's not over. My guest today is a purpose driven leader, coach and founder of Fathers in Christ as well as Elevate University. He is a leader, as I mentioned in the Miracle Morning Community, he is a fellow front row dad again. His name is Rob Stein and he empowers men to lead with faith, to live with integrity and to build lasting legacies. Committed to eliminating the fatherless home, he equips high performers to align purpose, systems and mindset for impact at home in business and beyond. And in today's episode, Rob's going to share his story. I invite him to share what that was like that time in his life. How he got through it as a father, how his son got through it, how his son is doing now. We touched later in the episode on the side effects of pharmaceutical drugs, which I did not expect to touch on. But he shared something that his son experienced with suicidal thoughts that helped me, reminded me of something that I experienced when nothing in life was wrong, circumstances were great, yet something we were taking might have been affecting our mental health and emotional well being. I asked Rob what to do if you're feeling like you're failing as a parent, as he felt that he was two years ago when this happened, and how he's gotten through that and ultimately ask him what to do if you are feeling overwhelmed in life in general. There's a lot of nuggets, a lot of vulnerability, a lot of heart and soul in this episode and I hope you enjoy this conversation with Rob as much as I did enjoy.

Rob, my brother, it is great to see you.

Great to see you too.

Yeah. You and I were just talking and I thanked you for your leadership in the Miracle Morning Community. It was a post that you put up a few weeks ago, maybe a month or so ago, that I read about your son and him coming to you and saying he was suicidal when he was 19. I went today to look for that post, to read it again, to just to refresh my memory, and I was reminded of your leadership. I went, wow. On a daily basis in the, you know, and for those that don't know, the Miracle Morning community is a 350,000 person Facebook group, one of, I'm sure you'd agree, one of the most inspiring positive groups and you're one of the most inspiring positive leaders in that group. You post on an almost daily basis, sometimes multiple times a day. And your posts are vulnerable. They are real. They are adding value. You are a leader in your own community. You're a leader for fellow fathers and parents. And I want to start with that post that you put up about your son. Take us back to the moment that your son opened up about his suicidal thoughts. What was going on through your heart and your mind as a father?

Yeah. So, first, thank you very much for the kind words about my leadership and the consistent posting. And that's really what I want to try to do, is help provide value. So I really appreciate that you acknowledge that. To answer your question, it was February 15, 2023. My son was away for the weekend off at college on the other side of the state with his girlfriend, visiting her for Valentine's Day. It was a day after Valentine's Day. He came home, pretty much went straight to his room. And then a little while later, I got a text message from my wife, hey, come to his room. I didn't see it. So then I get a yell from my wife, hey, get in here. So, of course, I did what all good husbands do and I came running. She sat me down, and she shared with me what was going on. And he had shared that on his drive home, he had this overwhelming thought from his brain that if he just drives into oncoming traffic, it'll all be over and he won't be suffering anymore. So in that moment, you know, he was just away. Just for context, he was away again at his girlfriend's dorm, who's now his fiance. So just some context there.

Yeah.

And he had shared with us that he was having these suicidal thoughts on the way home. We didn't know that there was any background of this. There was nothing going on before that. So my initial thought was, what happened this weekend? What happened? Did you guys break up? Did you guys get in a fight? That was where my head naturally went at first. Obviously, when he was telling us that he was having those thoughts, I was like, okay, this is like, this is not him. This is pretty serious. We got some clarity on that. He's like, no, everything's great. My girlfriend loves me. I have great mom and dad. My brothers and my sister are amazing. My family, my life, everything is good. I don't understand what's going on.

Wow.

That was when I realized, like, oh, this is for real. It's not just a little event that happened that he's overreacting to or anything like that. So just kind of. That's what initially happened and what was kind of in my head and heart at the time. So as soon as I heard that, it was like, okay, jump into action. He already had a counselor that he was seeing for some anxiety and stress with different school and sports related things. So I texted the counselor right away, let her know, hey, this is what's going on. She said, I can see him tomorrow morning. I think it was like 11 o' clock or something like that. And then about an hour later, she called me to give me a preview of how the next couple of days might go because they're obviously suicidal thoughts. There are certain protocols that she has to follow. And as being involved with her for a long time, she also knows him very closely and he has a special place in her heart as well. So during that she kind of told me, like, hey, if I don't like what I'm hearing and I'm at fear that he's going to hurt himself, I will very likely send him to the hospital because then they can watch him 24 7, they can get him any kind of meds, any kind of support that he needs, just be prepared for that. And that's not a worst case scenario, that's not a bad thing if it happens. But just be ready.

It's a proactive thing. Yeah.

Yep. Yeah. So next day he goes about 20 minutes after the, the appointment starts, I get a call from my wife because I was still trying to function and work. And at that point, you know, he was having the thoughts, but I didn't know how severe things were. My wife didn't work at the time, so like, okay, I'm going to try to work and do my thing until I need to do something different. So about 20 minutes after, I get a call from my wife and she said that they're on their way to the hospital. And Hal, I'll tell you, that hit me like a ton of bricks that I might lose my son. And I knew he was headed to where he was going to get help. But at that moment it almost felt like he was already gone. It was hard to breathe. Even though I knew he was going to where he was going to get help. It was hard to breathe. Like my world came crashing in because my kids mean everything to me.

Yeah.

So I'll pause there if you have any other questions on it.

Yeah. So he was 19 years old.

Yep.

And he's 21 now. Right. So two years ago.

Yes, two years ago. It was 20, 23. And actually so he would have been 18, almost 19.

Okay, got it. As a dad, a fellow father, I can only imagine what you were going through. What was your approach as a dad? Because certain things Right. If your child has cancer, for example, you kind of go, well, I mean, I'm helpless. I can get him to a doctor. And so now he's in the hospital, he's getting the help that he needs. As a dad, I know you're a very proactive person. I know you've. How long you're a miracle morning daily practitioner. How long have you done the miracle morning? When did you start that?

It's about seven years now. I think 2018 is so like five.

Years before this happened. So what was your approach? Two parts to that question. What was your approach in terms of your self care? Was there anything that you did proactively like that you did or that you felt you could do to help him? Or was it just, hey, I'm going to, I'm doing what I can by turning him over to getting him the help that he needs? Or was there anything as a dad that you personally took on for you to do? So what did you do in terms of your proactively for yourself, for your self care and then for him?

Yeah. So I'll give a little quick context between when he went into the hospital until when things got really bad for me personally and then when the self care really kicked in. So that was on Thursday that he went and saw the counselor and the counselor said, nope, he needs to go to the hospital. Thursday he went to the emergency room. We stayed with him as long as we were allowed to, basically. Also when you go into the emergency room for that, no belts, no drawstrings, no phones, you get nothing, even as the guest because they don't want the risk. Friday, I had basically said, I'm going to be at the hospital all day. I need to be there when all of the people come in so I know what's going on. Then the hardest next step was when they took him from emergency room into the ambulance to take him to an inpatient psychiatric hospital. It was another one of those very heavy moments as a dad where I couldn't breathe. I felt again like was saying goodbye and may never see him again. So you wake up, you go to bed, you wake up Saturday morning and your kid's not there and you have no idea how he's doing. You don't even know if the ambulance made it at that point. Saturday was pretty rough. Sunday got worse with my own mental health of basically, if, if there's a chance I'm going to lose one of my kids, I don't know if I can go on. And I had some of my own Dark thoughts on Sunday. And then there was a moment where I just heard this, like, if you do that, you can't help your kid, period. If you do what you're thinking right now, you're pretty much signing the. The end for him as well. It was kind of at that moment, I thought a couple of things. First was, okay, well, I don't want to do that. Second was, I need to grow in my spiritual journey because I don't think I can do this alone. I know I can't do it alone because at that point, I couldn't even breathe or think about it without being difficult to breathe or difficult to talk about it. This conversation right here, Hal, would have never happened even a year after. I wasn't at a point yet where I can easily talk about it. And then I'm like, okay, well, how do I grow in my spiritual journey? And then I. Something popped into my head of like, hey, I have the miracle morning structure, because I don't know what I'm doing right now. I'm lost. The miracle morning. I can now do what Hal talks about all the time of, like, laser focus in on what's the most important thing in your life. Well, I wasn't going to get a medical degree or a psychology degree to be able to help my son directly. So it was like, okay, if I lean into my spiritual journey, that's all I can do. I have no control over this. And you talk about that all the time. What do we have control over versus what do we have influence over? And we have to accept it and then move on.

Yeah.

So I said, you know what? Tomorrow morning I'm going to dive in, laser focused on my spiritual growth into the miracle morning. And that's going to be my plan. And that's what I did. I went to bed early that night, basically, so I'd stop thinking about the thoughts I was having and just to kind of numb things, like, if I'm sleeping, I'm not thinking about it, and I can wake up tomorrow morning and I know this is going to help. And. And it did.

The miracle morning is something I can control, and I can utilize the Savers practices to help my spiritual journey. A lot of people use routines for productivity. You use the Savers, it sounds like, really to survive, to heal, to grow spiritually. Can you walk us through how each component, each of the practices helped you to process and lead you through the pain and the feelings of helplessness you were experiencing?

So the previous five years of that was all about productivity and achieving goals like you talked about, in that moment, it switched. And I didn't care if I achieved any other goal ever again in life as long as I was there for my kid. So as you can imagine, the first few days were, like I said, were brutal. From the time that this happened until the time I realized, hey, I have the tools already here to help me structure and focus. So silence was really about prayer. That's what I did. I didn't do like a normal meditation, normal trying to clear my mind. It was 100% a conversation with God. I need you. I need you to help me through this. I need you to protect my son. I need you to help his heart, help his mind, help him know that he is needed and he is wanted. And then affirmations. It was really about two main affirmations. One was, I'm 100% committed with unwavering faith and extraordinary effort to growing closer to God spiritually. And then the other one was, I'm 100% committed to whatever my son needs right now. Obviously, there was more to it. I don't remember it all off the top of my head, but those were the two primary affirmations. And then visualization dove into visualization. I was really diving into one. Me growing closer to God spiritually. I posted on my social media. It was like when you pray. I did this recently. It wasn't back then, but it's relevant and popped into my head. When we pray as believers in Jesus, when we pray, you know, we're here like this, but on the other side of us, looking at us and they're holding our hand with us is Jesus. That's what I visualized then, is God being with me. I also visualized my son and his future, that he had a future, that he was going to go and enjoy life, that he was going to get past this. And that gave me some hope because I was seeing. I don't see a lot of very. Visualization at that point was really hard for me.

Yeah.

But I started to see things that I normally wouldn't imagine. So it was. It was really powerful exercise. I'd listen to either a sermon from a pastor or whatever, trying to grow spiritually. I would do exercise while listening to it and then reading 100% about reading the Bible, reading scripture, studying, doing as much as I could to grow in my faith and know the hope that the Bible has for us, the hope that being a believer has for us. And then the scribing, brother, I had to tell you, that's when I fell in love with journaling, you've seen some of the posts. That is my favorite of the savers. It's something that I do often. I do multiple times a day. And I find that is the one when you can't talk about something or when you can't even really think about it without being overwhelmed emotionally, you can still write it down. And that that lowers the emotional level for me to where I can get it out and I can start to process. So it was all about journaling. Whatever I was learning, prescribing whatever I was learning in my reading, scribing my prayers, scribing those out, what I was visualizing, journaling that out, whatever I could do to keep getting all of that pain out so that I could be prepared for whatever comes next. And that's kind of the process I took. And I'll say way more important than when I was trying to use Miracle Morning to achieve my goals, which I used Miracle Morning for years to achieve my goals. This was like in my mind was life or death.

All right, let me ask you a question. How many apps are you using for your purpose? Personal development? Maybe a meditation app like Calmer Headspace, an affirmation app like I Am, or Think Up a book summary app like Blinkist, a journaling app like 5 Minute Journal, a visualization app like Envision, an exercise app like 7 Minute Workout, and maybe even a habit tracking app to keep it all together. That is a lot to manage and a lot to pay for. What if you could replace all of them with just one app? Yes, it is called the Miracle Morning app and it is essentially seven apps in one. Hundreds of guided meditations and breathwork tracks, a full library of affirmations, plus tools to create your own visualization prompts for 10 key areas of your life. Guided workouts from 2 to 10 minutes long. Book and audiobook summaries of top personal and professional development books and a journaling tool with guided prompts. The wheel of life or a blank page to write freely. It simplifies your morning, saves you money, and helps you start every day with clarity, purpose and energy. And it's one of the only apps in this space with a 4.9 out of 5 star rating. Try it free for 7 days. Just search Miracle Morning in your app store or go to miracle morningapp.com to get started. All right, back to the show.

When it became the goal, right? It's the goal was now to take care of your mental health and to grow in your faith and to enhance and amplify your spirituality. And your connection to God in service of your family and your son, you're still achieving your goals. It's just that instead of monetary goals and trying to achieve success in your business, you know, now the goals become spiritual. It's like when I had cancer, all of my savers, my miracle morning, it's the goal was, now, oh, I have to beat cancer. That's the only goal that matters. Because if that goal doesn't get accomplished, none of the other goals or even, even a thing. I love you walking us through that describing practice you mentioned. It's your favorite of the savers. I'd love to, for you to just, just, I want to say some follow up questions for people because I think that a lot of folks journaling, everybody has certain savers that come easy to them. And then there are certain ones that they struggle with, that they go blank, that they don't resonate with. They're not sure what to write. For example, with scribing. So you mentioned that you sounds like there's like a variety. It's like sometimes you're writing down the things that you're stressed about, your fears, your worries. Sometimes you're writing, you're recapping what you're reading, what you're learning, you're writing your prayers down. Do you journal digitally with your, you know, with your thumbs or your, your fingers on the keyboard or do you write by hand?

I've done both. Now right now I'm doing digitally on my iPad with GoodNotes and Apple Pencil. And that's GoodNotes is awesome. I can actually search on handwritten text. If I want to go back and search for something, it's, it even does spell check and it will fix my chicken scratch handwriting for me. It's an awesome tool, the journaling.

So you're writing by hand though, with the apple pencil. Correct. Got it. Okay. And so when you're staring at a blank screen, this is the question I really want to ask for folks that are like, I just don't know what to write about, you know, do you have any kind of process to get the writing started? Is it just, you know, closing your eyes and going, what is on my mind right now? What's the first thing that comes to me? How do you go from blank page to moving that pencil?

So it really depends on what it is in that moment. Or actually I'm going to go back a little bit before when I really started to be okay with the idea of scribing, especially as a, as a dude. I always thought journaling or it was like, dear Diary, for my daughter, not for me.

Got it.

So not picking on that at all. Just saying that's what I was feeling. So I was seeing a counselor, and I was struggling through some stuff. A person that I care deeply about and their alcohol, and it was hurting other people that I love.

Okay.

And my counselor shared with me, like, write that person a letter. You don't ever have to send it to them. You don't ever have to read it to them or anything like that. So I wrote a letter, and it was really hard at first, but then it started flowing and I couldn't stop. I wrote pages, and I don't handwrite normally. I wrote pages and I felt like, wow, that was a huge relief. So I got some value out of that. So then fast forward to, like, how I do journaling now two different ways. So if it's really a journal about.

Something going on in my life right now, I ask myself some type of a journal prompt. Like, I ask myself a question. How might I overcome this challenge, whatever it might be? I'll use ChatGPT for a journal prompt. I also sign up for different journal prompts that I get emails on, and I go back and I look at them later, and it's like, start with that question and then answer it. And normally the answer will be very surface level. And then I follow up with a deeper question. And then when I feel like I can't write anymore, I'll follow up with another deeper question. Because I really want the growth out of it. I'm not just going through it to check a box. Like, if I'm not either moved or emotional or inspired after a journaling session, I probably didn't do it right. That's one way is I'll use some prompts. Another way, if I'm like, everything's pretty good. I think I heard you talk about this on one of your Instagram videos or something. I start with, what are the three things I need to let go of? So what's weighing on me right now? And then I will process that. I. I won't take very much time, but I'll at least like, okay, I can't change that. And I move on. Then I go into gratitude. What am I grateful for right now? I try to limit that to three things because I could be there all day if I really am truly honest on what I'm grateful for at that moment. And then what are the three things that I need to focus on today to move the needle towards whatever my goal is? I would say I probably do that one like, 30, 40% of the time if I was throwing a rough number out there. And then the last one that I try to do at least once a quarter, sometimes once a month, is from my future self. I'm journaling from today's date one year from now, three years from now, five years from now, in the mindset of what do I want to have accomplished by that future date? So it's really like a fast forward to what's Today's date? The 9th.

Yeah.

Fast forward to July 9th, 2026. What do I want to be sitting there on the front porch or the back porch or whatever, looking out over the beautiful view? And what do I want to be celebrating? What do I want my three things of gratitude to be? So I journal as if they already happened, and then I'll use that and I'll go back and I'll read that along the way over the course of the year, kind of as a checkpoint of how am I doing on this? Do I even still care about this stuff? And it helps me to stay motivated in some of those things.

I love that. So you're creating the future in the moment. Right. As if it had already happened. I love that. That was a little master, a quick mini masterclass in scribing, in journaling, you know, in different ways. And I think it also is great because I think a lot of people think you have to do things a certain way or they get into a structure where, like the three prompts that you gave, you know, that's the formula that I use a lot of three things I need to let go of, three things that I'm grateful for, and the three most important things to move the needle today. And it's like. But people will get into where they think that's the only way to do it. And what I like is that you're very fluid in your approach with all of the savers, and specifically in this case with scribing, and that you're utilizing it in different ways on different days, and there's no pressure on yourself. It's like, I love Brianna Greenspan, one of the miracle morning co authors of the the Art of Affirmations coloring book. You know, she starts her miracle morning a lot by putting her hand on her heart, closing her eyes, and just asking, what do I need from my miracle morning today? Which savers do I feel that I need? Which one do I want to start with? Right? Like, she. She just lets it come to her and she'll go, you Know what? I'm going to start reading a book. I'm going to like, literally just go straight to the R in Savers and I'm going to start reading that book. Or she's like, I need to pray or I need, you know, it's like it's letting it come to you. So what's the impact? You know, you were at a really dark place. You were scared you were going to lose your son. And then the Savers became your solution. I'm, I'm going to go to bed early, I'm going to wake up tomorrow, I'm going to do these Savers. How did that play out for you over the coming weeks and months and beyond in terms of what did that do for your mental health, your mental healing, and then transitioning to how did that allow you to show up for your son?

So, great question. And I would say the consistency was huge. Of the focusing in, laser focusing in. You talk about the wheel of life before on some of your podcast episodes, my counselor has talked about the wheel of life. It's like, what's the thing? And even in front row dads, we have pillars that we go through and it's like that is typically an indicator of where we need to focus on when that number goes down. So spiritual was the thing I decided to focus on. And having that consistency really helped, helped me to heal so that I could show up better in the fact that I was, I don't want to say calm. I was more at peace. I can't control the outcome. I hate it. But I've accepted that one day I may get that phone call and have to, have to hear what every parent fears. Yeah, every day I was seeing a little bit of improvement in him, then a little bit of a step back, then more improvement. In this whole time I'm digging deeper because I know it's a rocky journey and it could end the way none of us want it to end. So fast forward to August of the same year we took him to college. He's there two days and we're like, okay, this is kind of cool. Things are feeling decent. And then we dropped him off on Wednesday. On Friday night, Friday evening, we got a call. My wife picked up the phone, put it on speakerphone. We just thought he was calling to check in and he told us he was having the thoughts again.

Oh, wow.

Now, mind you, he's a two and a half hour drive away on the other side of the state. He's in a dorm room with people he doesn't know. He's very shy, doesn't like talking with people. So I'm like, okay. So I asked a couple of questions just to get a situational awareness of. Have you tried anything? Like, how long have these thoughts. Did it just happen when we dropped you off? Did it just happen an hour ago? Has it never stopped? What's going on? He shared with us. So I said, okay, I'm going to go call your girlfriend. So I jumped into action there, calling the girlfriend, getting her over from her apartment to his dorm so that we had eyes on the ground, so to speak.

So he hadn't called her ahead of time? She didn't. He called y' all first.

He called us first. Yeah.

Okay.

So thanks for that clarifying, because I think that's a testament to the psychological safety that we've been able to build with our kids, and that's super important. So I stayed on the phone with her, and she was coming over, and she had already been through this. She was. At that point, she was dating him for at least a year, I think, at that point. So she knew what was going on. It wasn't a surprise that he was having those thoughts again. And we. So I stayed on the phone with her until she got to his dorm. They talked a little bit, and I said, okay, I'm gonna go figure out if I'm gonna drive over to that side of town tonight. I want to see you and make sure that you're okay. I'm not gonna ask to stay at your dorm room or anything. I'll get a hotel. Whatever I say, tell his girlfriend. Keep me posted on what's going on. Before you guys go to bed, I want an update. Putting a go bag together, so to speak, and kind of looking at some hotel rooms. I had a text message. Is it okay if he just comes and stays at my apartment for the night? Like, absolutely. I think that's probably a good thing. A few minutes later, I get a text message. We're headed to the hospital. He just tried. Oh, he just tried to kill himself. At this point, I didn't know how. I didn't know much of anything. I had a. An initial reaction of. I don't. The. The reaction was a curse word that I won't say, but it was like. And then it was calm. As calm as you can be as a parent. I told my wife, like, here's what's going on. I'm getting in the car. Do you want to go, or do you want me to go? One of us needs to stay here with our Three other kids. One needs to go. She's like, you can go. I don't know that I could talk to people.

Okay.

So I grabbed a couple of things. I get in the car, I go fill up with gas, and I call and talk to them and walk them through. I found out that he had tried to take a bunch of over the counter pills.

Okay.

And he's like, I immediately I regretted doing it. I don't want to die, but I don't want to go to the hospital. Okay, well, you're either going when I get there or you're going now. You're going because you just said you don't want to die. And we don't know how much you took. Oh, it was just a handful. It's not a big deal. Well, dude, you got big hands. We can't quantify that. You need to go. He's like, okay, I'll go. His girlfriend said I made him throw up. I said, okay, this is gonna sound really gross. Go take a picture of what he threw up. Go back in the dorm room, collect the bottle and count how many are left. Because we knew it was a brand new bottle because we had dropped them off with it.

Okay.

So she told us we took 17. 17 pills. I don't remember the dose of the Tylenol, but it was 8,500 milligrams total.

Oh, wow.

Like, no, dude, you need to go to the hospital because they need to make sure that you're okay.

Yeah.

Probably not going to die from it, but you could cause permanent damage to your liver.

Yeah.

Just go. So the whole point of this part of this story, Hal, is because of the miracle morning, because of all the hard work at the most difficult time. The more difficult time came when my son had actually attempted it. And the real risk and the real fear was there. I was able to stay calm because I had put in the hard work with the. The scribing and with the visualization and all that, and I had prepared myself for the worst case, which allowed me to stay calm when it happened.

You had mentally rehearsed the worst case scenario and responding in the most proactive way so that when it happened in real time, you were able to act upon the preparation.

You did that. And you've talked about this a number of times. I accepted that that's a reality that might happen.

Yeah.

And there's nothing I can do to change it. All I can do is how do I react in the moment.

Yeah. I call it accept life before it happens. Right. Which is an accept that there's going to be all sorts of things in your life. And it can be a general acceptance. Like, for me, it was general. So the day I was diagnosed with cancer, I was like, oh, I. Okay, I've already accepted it. I've already accepted whatever's going to happen. You know, it can be a general acceptance. Or in your case, it was an actual. I'm dealing with this right now. This is the worst case scenario specific to this situation. I'm going to realize that if that happens, I can't change that it happened. Now I'm at peace with it before it happens. Okay. Now I can operate free from that fear of the unknown future. So he went to the hospital that night. You know, let's kind of bring us to today. It's been a couple of years since that time. How is he now? Did the help that he got, did that, you know, get him to a better place? Bring us up to speed?

Yeah. So obviously there's some medication, there's a chemical imbalance. He does still have thoughts occasionally. But overall, the meds that he was on helped him be able to, in his words, shoo them away fairly quickly when they would happen. He's had a couple of incidents where it's like, okay, I can't get rid of the thought. We have an action plan in place of. If you're feeling or your brain is telling you you can't come to us. Let someone, you know, that cares about, you know what's going on, they'll contact us and we'll jump into action to get the counselor to get whoever we need to involved. And this recently happened a couple weeks ago. Honestly, it was actually after that post and you mentioned that you wanted to interview me. I thought there was a potential. We were having a completely different conversation today, but he shared with his fiance. His fiance called us. I immediately texted the counselor. Counselor was able to make arrangements and get him in the next morning at the first appointment. And I went with him that time and his fiance went with him. And we sat in the room for a few minutes and then we left. He shared with her the thoughts he was having. She shared with us with him in the room after. And it was like, nope, the thoughts are back. Definitely. They're very graphic and it's hard for him to get rid of them. He needs to see the psychiatrist or he needs to go to the hospital right away. He didn't want to go back to the hospital and basically got a hold of the psychiatrist, changed the meds. Everything seems to be pretty Good. Now, he just had his follow up yesterday, so, yeah.

What came up for me, and I am no expert in this regard, but I've read enough about it, which is that side effects of antidepressants can be suicidal thoughts and suicidal ideation. Was he on antidepressants when the first occurrence happened? The first time?

No. No, he wasn't. He was on another medication. I don't remember the name of it, and I wouldn't want to say it. And just in case I'm wrong, and I don't want to freak anybody out, but some of the side effects from that could have been suicidal thoughts.

Yeah. And I can share my personal experience when I was sucked into the, you know, medical community, if you will, or that's not the right way to put it, but basically into pharmaceuticals. Right. When I had my cancer journey and they had me on more pharmaceuticals than I can count, couldn't even keep track. And it was a slippery slope. I started out saying, I don't want to do any. And then it was like, well, you need to take this. And it's like, oh. And then I got used to that. And I'm like, before I knew it, it like my paradigm had changed. We're like, I'm just listening to my doctor doing whatever he Sundays. Well, in 2019, I started a suicidal thoughts. And what you said, very similar. And this makes me wish I had some experts on the call with us right now to be able to speak to this, because, you know, we're just speaking in generalities, but I was on pharmaceutical drugs, and all of a sudden I wanted to kill myself. And you had said when your son first brought that to you, you asked him, what's wrong? And he said, nothing. Right. My friends are great, My life is great. Yet he was on a pharmaceutical drug, and he was having these vivid thoughts telling him to kill himself. That's exactly what I went through. And it wasn't until I got off of 100% against my doctor's orders, he said, oh, if you get off the drugs, your cancer could come back and you could die. And he said, I want you to stay on him as long as you can tolerate it. I said, well, I want to kill myself every day. So I. I'm gonna say that I can't tolerate it anymore. But it just. To me, it's like, as a sidebar, but such a relevant sidebar is, what are these side effects of the pharmaceutical drugs? Right. I had no other explanation. There was no circumstantial reason that I wanted to die. Every day, my life was great, yet I did. And your son, it sounds like the same thing. Do you have any perspective on that?

You watch any commercial? So I remember when I was growing up, and I think you and I are roughly the same age when we were growing up.

Yeah.

You couldn't see. There were no commercials about alcohol. There were no commercials about smoking. There were no commercials about medications. Now, that's the majority of the commercials. And you listen to any one of these commercials about a medication, a lot of them have good intentions with helping with diabetes, helping with whatever the health issue is. They do make an impact there. But then they read off the side effects, and the side effects are worse than the thing that you're trying to treat in a lot of cases. So I think there's some potential truth to that. And I think, one, I give you a ton of credit for having the courage to completely get off of all the medications when the doctors are saying, you will die if you do that. That couldn't have been easy. But obviously, you're here, so it was the right choice.

And it was a spiritual decision, by the way. It was a How tormented I was, how terrible I was feeling. And then it was literally when I would pray, and it had been for, like, six months prior, I kept getting the message through prayer, hal, your cancer is gone, and stop poisoning your body with these pharmaceutical drugs. That's the message I got. But then I would go to my doctor and I would say, hey, I'd like to get off. And he'd go, no, no, no. I go, but the cancer's gone. He goes, yeah, but we never know. It could be hiding in this nook or cranny, and you got to just keep taking it, right? And then I would reach out to my family. We don't know. Just listen to your doctors, I guess. We don't know what else to do. So it's like, it was such a hard thing, but it's like I kept getting this message, this intuitive feeling. Every fiber of my being was like, stop taking these chemicals. And it took me a lot longer than I wish it would have. You know, it is what it is. But, yeah, thank you for the acknowledgment. When I finally got off and I look at my healing, I don't look at my healing journey the day that I'm was told by doctors, your cancer's in remission, I look at my healing journey the day that I stopped putting these chemicals in my body, and I started completely nurturing my body with things from Earth you know, organic whole foods and sunlight and that kind of thing. So, yeah. What would you share with somebody that is listening right now? That is. What would you say to the parent who feels like they. Maybe they've failed their child or it's too late, or their child is suffering and they don't know what to do? What would you say to that parent?

It's a really great question, and it's a question that I asked myself a lot early on, and I still ask myself of was there anything I could have done different? Sure. Would the outcome be different? Maybe. But I took the actions that I took, and that was the path that we went down as far as. Did I miss something? Of course we missed something. I look at it like this, and this is what I told myself. I came to the conclusion at some point. It was. I look back at when my kids were newborns and I traveled for work. I'd come home after a week trip. I'd be like, oh, my gosh, I don't even know because I have twins. I don't know which one's which. My wife, who was there every day, was like, they haven't changed at all. I look at what I'm seeing. I'm seeing one week ago, and I'm seeing now totally different because I'm not there. Wasn't there in every moment, every day. My wife was like, they look exactly like they did when you left. And that was because she was there all the time. So it's the lens that you're looking through, and you're in that moment every day with your kids. So you're gonna miss things. No matter how present you are, you're gonna miss things, especially when they're not visual. Like a mental health thing. If your kid's starting to gain weight, you're gonna notice. You're not gonna notice on day one that they gained a half a pound. You're not gonna notice that. But over time, you're gonna notice it. When it's what's going on up here and in their head, you have to know that you're even looking for something. So most of us are gonna miss it. What I would say is, don't beat yourself up about it. What you do from that point on, when you kid's going through this or you're struggling with it, it's how you react and how you move forward. Put together a plan of when things fall off the rails, on how you can jump into action. Put in the work of a morning routine that can help you grow in the areas that you need to grow, put in the work for yourself. Accepting that the outcome may not be what you want. That's the hardest one and was the hardest one for me is as a parent. That one, it stings till today. That one still is hard, but I know I don't have control over it. I only have influence. If any of my kids. My. My youngest son is about to leave for Marine boot camp next week. I have no control over what happens from this point forward. I don't even have influence anymore. And he's going into a part of the service where he's not going to have a cushy desk job flying drones. He could be out in the line of fire. And I've accepted that I may get that knock on the door, because if not, I'm going to live in fear every day. Yeah, I can still live in a place of acknowledgment and understanding and knowing that that could happen, but I don't have to be in fear of it happening.

Yeah. I love this underlying theme that you've woven throughout this story, which is just acceptance that you from the beginning, in your miracle morning, it's, I'm going to accept the worst case scenario. And again, I personally just. I think back to, like when I was in my car accident and told I would never walk again. I go, okay, so the worst case scenario is that I'm in a wheelchair the rest of my life. I'm 20 years old. I do not want to, you know, I love basketball. I want to walk. I mean, I want a date. I don't know what that would be like in a wheelchair. I don't want to be in a wheelchair the rest of my life. However, if I'm in a wheelchair the rest of my life, if the worst case scenario comes to be, you know what? I'm going to be the happiest, most grateful person anyone has ever seen in a wheelchair. And when I'm speaking, sometimes on stages, I'll say, I'll just share that story and go, what's your wheelchair like? What's the experience in your life that you allow to cause you emotional pain or that you're afraid of in the future that you've decided will cause you emotional pain because you do not want it to happen, versus just accepting whatever happens in life. So I love that you shared that. Any last thoughts or let's close this out for anybody right now that is struggling in life, whether it's as a parent, whether they're feeling helpless, you know, I see your Leadership in the Miracle Morning community. It's not just around parenting. It's this very well rounded. Like you have a lot of life experience and a lot of wisdom. So if someone right now is feeling helpless or overwhelmed or they are struggling, what would you encourage them to do? What would you say to them to be helpful?

I would say the first thing that I would do is take a deep breath. Like breath work has been very helpful for me. It's been very helpful for my son. Take a deep breath because that's going to slow things down and it's going to slow our mind down. And there's another podcast that I listen to, explains the science behind it. I'm not even going to try to repeat it because I'll mess it up, but it works. And then I would personally, I would lean into some prayer, ask God to be there with me as he will, and be there with my kid, whoever it is, whichever kid it is, or all of them. And I would put together an action plan. Even if you're not going through this right now, mental health in the world is growing as an issue. Be prepared before you need it and then it's not so hard. If anybody's going through it right now, I don't know, Hal, if you put email, contact or anything in the show notes, I can give you my email address and they can email me and I can.

You can give it now and anybody can email you that wants to. Yeah, yeah.

So it's Robert Steinathersinchristministry.org Robert Stein s.

T e I n at say the last part again.

Fathers in Christministry.org Robert.

Stein@fathersinchristministry.org Y' all. Not a lot of my guests give their email addresses out and I'm telling you, Rob is one of the sweetest, kindest, most thoughtful and wise human beings that I know and generous and so Rob, thank you, man. I appreciate you so much, brother.

Thanks for having me.

It's been an honor, man. Thanks for being vulnerable and open and sharing. And if you want to connect with Rob, you can email him. You can also join the Miracle Morning Community Facebook group where he posts almost every single day and adds value and goal achievers. Thank you for tuning in today. Thank you for listening with an open mind and an open heart. And I hope this conversation was as affirming and helpful and valuable for you as it was for me. I love you so much and I will talk to you next week. Thanks for listening to learn more about the achieve your goals podcast, and to get access today's show notes, transcript and exclusive content from hal Elrod, visit Halelrod.com podcast thanks again for joining us. Be sure to tune in next week for another episode of the Achieve your Goals podcast.