Real Estate InvestHER: Entrepreneur Liz Faircloth on the Power of the Pivot

Coming up on Wings of Inspired Business.

I literally quit my job 6 months before the market crashed. So we had a lot of obstacles ahead of us, you know, and what we learned through that market crash was that the buildings that we had flipped, we're looking to flip, quickly became rentals. We were flipping, we just couldn't flip them, right? So yeah, we made them rentals and we did fine with it. We held them for a long time. We paid down the mortgage. It just wasn't in our business strategy, but we pivoted and the building kind of maintained its own and was stabilized.

If there was one lesson business owners learned during COVID it was the necessity of the pivot, that there's much in the market always beyond our control. So it makes sense to always be thinking ahead with multiple strategies, whether you're an entrepreneur or an investor like my guest today, Liz Faircloth. Liz has built a $60 million real estate portfolio, and she's on a mission to help women get good, really good at investing. Hi, I'm Melinda Whitstock, and welcome to Wings of Inspired Business. I'm a 5-time serial entrepreneur. And the founder and CEO of the social podcasting app, Podopilo. And here on Wings, we share the inspiring entrepreneurial journeys, epiphanies, and practical advice from successful female founders on every business topic across every industry across almost 700 episodes now. So you have everything you need at your fingertips to build the business and life of your dreams. Wings is all about women lifting as we climb. So share the love by sharing Wings with an entrepreneurial friend, so they can also accelerate their dreams. Today we meet an inspiring entrepreneur who co-founded her residential and commercial real estate business, the DeRosa Group, with her husband back in 2005. They both weathered the 2008 economic meltdown and the COVID pandemic as well to grow its asset value to $60 million. Liz Faircloth says she's on a mission to transform lives through real estate. And helping women transform themselves into savvy investors with her real estate investor community and her podcast. Liz will be here in just a moment. First, if you love podcasts and wish you had an app that matched you to the exact right listens around what interests and inspires you and your friends without having to lift a finger, then Podoplo is for you. It's the interactive podcasting app with recommendations from 5 million audio and video podcasts and an easy way to share and discuss with friends and hosts. Take a moment, download Podoplo, connect with me there, follow Wings, and use the comments feature to interact with me and my guests. And if you have a podcast, get it featured right now on our home discover screen for free. And access time-saving ways to grow your reach and your revenue. That's Podoplo, free to download in either app store. Liz Faircloth is the co-founder and CEO of the Real Estate InvestHer community, co-host of the Real Estate InvestHer show, and recently published InvestHer's first book, The Only Woman in the Room: knowledge and inspiration from 20 successful real estate women investors. The Real Estate Investor Show is part of the BiggerPockets Podcast Network. It's a family of podcasts that's generated more than 110 million collective downloads across multiple industries. The BiggerPockets Real Estate Podcast is the number one real estate investing podcast, and it offers a community of over 1.8 million members. The Real Estate Investor Show can be found in the top 25 of investing podcasts and the top 50 in business podcasts. So when Liz isn't busy podcasting or flipping properties, boosting passive income from her rental income, or adapting properties to market demand, she spends her time empowering women to live a financially free and balanced life on their own terms through her Real Estate InvestHer community platform, hosting some 40 meetups across the US and Canada, and an online community and membership that offers accountability and mentorship for women to take their business to the next level. Today we talk a lot about the real estate market, lessons Liz has learned along the way about savvy investing, why women tend to be more cautious investors, yet when they jump in, they outperform men in real estate by 40%. Plus, how to overcome the pernicious perfectionism that can hold us back from playing a bigger game and much more. So let's put on our wings with the inspiring Liz Faircloth.

Liz, welcome to WINGS.

Thank you, Melinda. So great to be here with you.

Yeah, well, I'm always excited to talk to anybody who can build a $60 million business. You have commercial and residential properties all over the East Coast. The first question that I can't help but ask is, how did COVID affect you, particularly on the commercial side?

It's interesting. I would say COVID was, for some of our buildings, the best thing that happened. And for some of our buildings, I would say it was more of the same, if you will. Why I say that is some of the buildings that were struggling prior to COVID, we have a couple assets in areas that were struggling and where we got our start, if you will, in up-and-coming cities that just didn't turn around, if you will. And they stabilized. We had a commercial building with a bunch of small offices and small office users, that kind of held its own, didn't grow during COVID certainly. A lot of people were not going to office buildings. So obviously that was affected, but it was neutral, if you will. It kind of held its own. We lost a couple of tenants. We actually gained a couple of tenants who wanted to start their businesses as we kind of got out of COVID Where our buildings actually thrived was dependent on the market and where our buildings were situated. So For example, we have a building outside of Philadelphia in a little boutique town, a little artsy town called Lancaster, Pennsylvania, cute little town and very art-centric town that has transportation, has trains, that has a lot of different jobs for professionals. That building thrived during COVID Our occupancy was high, the rent collections were high. It's a 49-unit building. So that did great during COVID It actually did better than even prior to COVID. I think there's a lot of reasons for that. I think depending on who you were renting to, your tenant profile, if you will, the tenants you serve, you saw a difference. If your tenant base was professionals, they were working from home, they weren't going to be moving, their jobs stayed stable, they just worked from home. So you didn't see a huge job loss in that sector. In our tenant base that were folks maybe working at different jobs in the restaurant sector or in the different sectors that were very affected, then you saw a hit. You saw a little bit of an effect. So it has a lot to do with the market and who you're renting to. Interestingly enough, really quick story is one of our buildings in North Carolina was struggling. We were just getting occupancy up. It was a big turnaround. It was a 200-unit building. And just had a whole new rebrand. You're rebranding the building, you're rebranding the tenant base. When we bought it a few years ago and we were rebuilding it, that's the kind of stuff we buy is really dilapidated image turnaround type of buildings. And what was interesting there was that as soon as everything got shut down in March, when COVID hit, everyone around, every other building around stopped showings. And we very quickly moved to virtual. And so we picked up the amount of tenants we picked up and the occupancy. We're at 60% occupancy. We're at 98% occupancy right now. And we're actually selling the building and it's just performing amazingly. It's just the right time to sell. We've held it for 3 years and we're going to be doing very well for our investors. But my point in saying that is that we moved very quickly. And I think any investor, anyone during COVID who didn't move quickly and adapt quickly, I think it was affected negatively. So I can't take the responsibility for that, but our team who we built did, and I'm grateful for it, right? Because we were able to thrive during COVID with that particular building as well.

When there are adverse circumstances, there's always opportunity for entrepreneurs. And you mentioned moving very quickly and nimbly and folks who, you know, could pivot quickly in that context, no matter what industry they were in, or folks who saw an opportunity to do something new. Like you mentioned, virtual showings and whatnot, obviously are going to be ahead of the game. I mean, we hear all this publicity now about, you know, the great resignation and companies, you know, are they going to demand that their employees go back to work? It looks like most employees overwhelmingly want to stay at home. And so is that affecting your portfolio at all in terms of what's commercial, what's residential?

Not really. Not in a negative way because we are heavily in residential. So again, you could slice and dice that. Obviously when you're buying a large asset, it's actually considered commercial. But in terms of the type of assets we buy really are all residential from the perspective of people living in the units. We don't buy a whole lot of just purely office commercial. We never did. We have one asset, quite honestly, in our whole portfolio that's strictly commercial. If anything, we do some mixed use, so commercial on the bottom and residential above. But yeah, the building that we've had the most trouble with has been purely commercial. So we weren't really buying a whole lot of just commercial before COVID and we're still not. So I think there's an opportunity there though, quite honestly. If you could redeploy a lot of these office buildings that are vacant into creative use space, I mean, I think there's an enormous opportunity there. We're just laser-focused because that's an issue we had early on where we got kind of like shiny nickel syndrome, and you get a little defocused, if you will. So we're pretty laser-focused now. So it'd have to be this amazing opportunity for us to turn our heads, if you will. But I think there's an opportunity there in the marketplace right now. If you can actually take these buildings that are— I mean, you could probably get a great deal for them. People are looking to sell them, especially people that are not going to be moving back into offices anytime soon. And redeploy them into maybe multifamily or something that is needed in that area. I think there's an enormous opportunity there.

Absolutely. So you started your company in 2005, which means that you were building it, you had to weather the whole meltdown of 2008.

And so tell me— Oh yeah.

Tell me some of the biggest lessons that you've learned along the way, because of course COVID wasn't the first I guess downturn or challenge that you had to face?

Yeah, no, absolutely. And you know, it's interesting. I think in so many ways that when you, when something tough hits and especially when we were newer in our business, we, you know, we were a little naive. We took some risks that we probably shouldn't have. So I don't know if I would say in 2007, 2008, Melinda, that we were like poised for this amazing growth, and then the market crashed. To be perfectly frank with you, we were really getting our feet on the ground, figuring business out, figuring entrepreneurship out, figuring investing out, and then the market hit. So at the same moment that the market hit, I quit my job. So my husband had quit his job when we got married in '05 to start full-time and as a business owner, and I kept working in consulting and management consulting. So I literally quit my job 6 months before the market crashed. And so here we are, both of us like, okay. And at the same time, we bought a commercial building. That very building I was just telling you about was the building we bought and it was vacant. So we had a lot of obstacles ahead of us. And what we learned through that market crash was that the buildings that we had flipped, we're looking to flip, quickly became rentals. And that was a great lesson for us. And it's a great lesson for anyone listening in that To have multiple exit strategies in real estate is so important. In other words, okay, I want to buy a vacation rental. Everyone wants to buy a vacation rental right now, right? Everyone wants to buy a short-term rental in this beautiful area and then rent it out to people and make a whole lot of money. Well, great, but wouldn't it be helpful if you're analyzing that opportunity to make sure it also could work as a long-term rental? So I always say that was a great lesson for us to really analyze to make sure you're analyzing buildings and making sure you have multiple exit strategies. So when we bought these buildings and where we got our start in Trenton, we were flipping, we just couldn't flip them. We couldn't flip them at the price that we needed to, to make it all work because the market crashed. People weren't buying houses as quick, or homeowners weren't buying as quickly there at that point, obviously, not like we've seen with COVID completely different. So Yeah, we made them rentals and we did fine with it. We held them for a long time. We paid down the mortgage. It just wasn't in our business strategy, but we pivoted. The commercial building was vacant. It was a 10,000-square-foot building and we thought we would get one tenant and that didn't happen. So we really quickly pivoted and quick story, just looked around and said, "Okay, what's the needs in this community?" And the need for a small office, like a 500-square-foot office, was needed. So we quickly made a 10,000-square-foot building into about 20 single-use office space. Before shared space was kind of cool or popular, we just did that, quite honestly, before it was a thing. And yeah, and the building kind of maintained its own and was stabilized. So this past time, right, then you compare what happened in '08 to what just happened during COVID Completely different in that the market became so much hotter in a sense, especially multifamily, which is our niche. That wasn't the same impact in '08. So with COVID what we found and was interesting too is that everyone out of anyone, any investor, all these different companies were coming out of the woodworks looking to buy multifamily because maybe the markets they were in weren't as favorable as multifamily was. So It was already pretty crowded. Everyone wants to buy multifamily space to like, wow, look at all this competition and we're somebody who'd been in the business for 15 years. So we analyze, just to give you a context, we analyze 200 deals this year and we've closed, I think, on 5. So the amount of competition that's flooded as a result of COVID has been enormous compared to '08. That was nowhere near the same type of impact. So it makes you work a little harder. It makes you grow your team, makes you get a little more creative, makes you get a little more focused, which is all good things in business. So yeah, and we're closing on a number of buildings right now. So our business is growing, but it does take some pivoting and some re-looking at what you're doing and maybe shifting some of it too.

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So for all the people right now that are thinking, yeah, you know what? I'd like some passive income. I'd like to be able to enter into this real estate market. And then there's all sorts of uncertainty, I guess, in the economy or people want to— So what are the first things that people really should be thinking about? Like if you go back and think about where you were when you were starting out and mistakes you made, what would you advise somebody? Say they have a little extra cash or they've had an exit in their business, they want to start getting their mind across the real estate business or whatever, what's the best way to start and what are the pitfalls to avoid?

Yeah, it's a great question. In so many ways, so many people I think watch these shows and just jump into figure out what market do I want to buy a real estate property or should I buy a vacation rental? People get too specific too soon. And I always say, Let's take a big step back. What are your financial goals? Are you looking to replace your job? Are you looking just to buy a rental so you have additional retirement cash flow? I mean, there's so many reasons to invest in real estate or invest in anything. So the clarity of your goals, I think now as well as in 5 years, will dictate the strategy you go after. And I think so many people just jump into something that because they think it's going to yield them the results they want, yet there might be a simpler, easier, more focused way to approach it. For example, there's really two ways to invest in real estate. You could do it actively, like you go buy a duplex and you put the down money down, you put the money into the property by buying it, whatever the percent is, 20%, and you find the tenants, you get the property manager, you're managing it, right? You're even overseeing it. You're in essence the investor. You can also passively invest in larger deals. That's really how we built our company. We have over 200 investors and so many people who are buying larger assets are doing it with a lot of people. They don't have just a few million just laying around that they're going to buy all these buildings by themselves. They're syndicating, they're pooling money together. Very legal thing to do. You have to use an SEC attorney and all that good stuff. So my point in saying that right now is so many people, when you ask them, "What kind of returns are you looking for?" What are you looking to— What's the reasons you're doing this for? They could probably passively invest the same way so they don't have the headache of learning the business. Or they're like, "You know what? I love the idea of buying properties, fixing them up, and renting them out." Well, then that's someone who would do this actively. Two different strategies, two different learning curves. And I just think people go too quickly down one path or the other and they haven't really thought about their own goals. And their own kind of like what they're looking to achieve, to be perfectly frank. So for the person who's got some extra cash and says, "Okay, I want to buy this property. I want to buy property so I can have more money in retirement." You have to then look at an area that, and how much time do you have? Maybe they have like tons of time and they're looking to put the sweat equity in. I know a lot of professionals who don't have that kind of time. They have young kids or growing kids. So therefore, you might need to find a property that doesn't need as much work. Well, you might have to spend more money on that property. So again, where people want to go will dictate which strategy they may want to take. And also, what return are you looking for? I mean, passive investors can make, say, 8% to 10% on their money or higher. If you do it yourself, you might be able to make more money than that. You're also going to need to spend more time. So you're trading time and money all the time, and you're saying, okay, What makes sense for me and my family today? Also, what makes sense for my family in years to come? Me and my husband wanted to literally do this as a business, very different than someone who might be in a position that's like, you know what? I just want to make a return on my money. I don't want to learn the whole business. I don't need to learn construction. It really depends on where that person, what stage in life they are, and what they're looking to accomplish. So I know I'm skirting your question very directly, but I'm doing that for a reason because we get that question so much in our community. And I'm like, hold on, hold on. Okay, let's not worry about market yet. What are you looking to accomplish here? Why real estate? You know, and there might be other avenues too that you might need to explore.

So that's all really good advice. And I think it's so important. I wanted to talk, Liz, about your experience as a woman in this business too, because of course you wrote a book so long ago called Only Woman in the Room. That's a big clue there. Only Woman in the Room: Knowledge and Inspiration from 20 Successful Real Estate Women Investors. So is it different for women? How is it different for women?

Yeah. So we actually published that book and I was a contributing author. And it's so interesting. I, you know, here's the context I'm going to give you. I have always worked very well with men and, you know, there's so much value to working with so many different types of people. So I'm just going to put that out there as I'm about to launch into some other thoughts. I will say though, so many times in the investing world, and I'm not sure about stocks and other different types of investments, but I can only speak to real estate because that's the world I come from. You go to these events, you go to these meetings, you go to these conferences, and you are the only woman in the room, or you feel that way. And what always happens is that a lot of people will come up to you and people are very nice, but they'll say, "Are you here with your husband?" Or they'll say, a lot of people will have said stuff that just is just very presumptuous. I mean, yes, I was there with my husband, but I got my husband into investing. He didn't get me into it. So I think there's a lot of assumptions. My business partner, Andresa Guidelli, in the InvestHer community, loves construction. She ran all of our construction projects. She knows more about construction than most people I know. But yet when she went there, contractors would say, "I don't know if you're ready to make the decision. You might want to run this by your husband." And she said, "I know more than my husband about construction. Why would I run that by him?" So I don't think we're looking for stereotypes. I don't think we're looking for women are better than men. I think women want to feel like they're treated equally. I think women have an enormous amount of advantages in the investing world. Statistically, as I've done research, women actually— I think Wealthsimple ran research, but it shows that women actually outperform men by 40 basis points, something in that realm. Oh, interesting.

What do you think is behind that?

But here's the second statistic that they say: women invest less than men by 40%. So what I think the case is, and what, again, I'm not an expert in women, but I could just say this running a women's community for the last 3 years in Women That Invest. So women are naturally more cautious. They're more conservative. They may pull the trigger. They may take a little more time to pull the trigger on an investment decision. But typically when that investment decision gets pulled and that trigger gets pulled, it's the right one and they do very well with it. So that's just my 2 cents, my completely 2 cents, not a research reason, but that's just what I see. I also think there's so many advantages of being a woman in this business, dealing with homeowners, talking to people and creating win-win situations, pulling a lot of constituents together. Investing is a multi-level kind of business. It's not like you just deal with a contractor. You're dealing with contractor, you're dealing with a homeowner, you can be dealing with the lender, you're dealing with your accountant. You're not literally dealing with one person, just like any successful entrepreneur in a certain business. The investing world or the real estate world is the same. There's multiple constituents. I've seen women thrive when they're in that space. And so yeah, I don't certainly have all the reasons or answers, but what I can say confidently is that I don't think it's about, oh, I don't want to be the only woman in the room. I think women want to feel like they're at the table, they're in the room and they belong there. Not only do they belong there, Melinda, but they are the keynote speaker. They're not just on a panel talking about women in investing. Not that there's a place for that, because obviously I have a women's community, we talk about the impact, but then let's just talk about women investing, right? Women buying a multifamily. It's pretty obvious she's a woman, right? So there's a balance of all of it philosophically. And I just see so much value of moving beyond the constraints of what women are dealing with. I also see the need for this, Melinda, because women got hit so much harder during COVID than men. So, you know, from a job loss perspective, from a decrease in pay perspective, then you deal with homeschooling, you deal with the whole household impact of a family. Statistically, I think the unemployment rate for women versus men, I mean, women took a hit so much more than men did. And put that on top of the whole idea of wanting more freedom in your life, right? Your job has changed or you want to stay home with your kids. And I feel like investing gives that, the real estate world gives that ability to do that. So, I don't know if that helps answer some questions, but I just, yeah, I really believe that women have a ton of advantages and we just can't do it alone. And that's really why we created our community. It's a lot to do on your own. It's overwhelming to do it on your own.

Oh, absolutely it is. I mean, You know, it's an interesting thing, the differences between men and women. And of course, this comes up in this podcast in the context of all sorts of other industries as well, where, say, depending generationally, we've come up and we've been the only woman in the room, in my case, in tech.

Absolutely. Yeah.

Profoundly the case, right? And what are the things that stand in our way? But what are the things that are unique unique. Like, you got us with unique leverage that if we just doubled down on. So often we'll talk about things like where women sometimes don't know deep down, subconsciously know our own value.

Yeah, absolutely.

Underprice ourselves or give in too easily or to put ourselves last or those sorts of things. I mean, how does that all play out in, in real estate? Is it in, in evidence or not so much?

Or— well, you know, it's funny, I— we have a We have mentors part of our community, and one woman teaches about creative financing. And it's so fascinating hearing her talk. Well, I asked for— There's a strategy when you're buying a house, you don't necessarily have to— You can have the person who's selling the house pretty much hold paper. So in essence, they are financing the house, but yet they're holding the— They're in essence the mortgage, if you will. But it's private. It's the homeowner who's selling the house to, say, Susie. So Susie says, "Hey, is that something of interest?" It's a whole strategy in real estate where you can buy fourplexes and duplexes and single families through this technique called seller financing or owner financing. And she's a master at it. And she is not a shark by any means. She is a lovely person, very grounded person, but she has this absolutely amazing quality of really serving people and creating win-win solutions. And I see that in so many women. They're not just out for themselves. I don't know how else to say it. And maybe I am biased because I run a women's organization, but I just see it so much in women that they want to serve, but they want— Obviously, there's people who are a little more self-serving, but a lot of the women I come across with that are very successful in this business are just creating win-wins and they're amazing at it versus other investors who are quite honestly out for themselves only. And that they're the ones that don't do as well. And there's a lot of great men who are investors, please. I'm not saying they're all out for themselves, but in my interactions in my work in the last 15 years, I've interacted with a lot of investors. A question that women never ask is, "How many doors do you own?" And that's a question I get all the time from people and a lot of men in particular. And it's like a bravado thing, like an ego thing. And yes, I'm going to put that in my bio. Yes, I can tell you how many doors are company owns, is that the first thing I'm going to tell you? No. Because is that underselling myself? I don't know. Or am I just looking to connect with you? And I think women bring that quality to the table. And I think it's a quality that's so needed in investing. It's so needed in the world we're in of buying and selling properties and bringing people together. And like I said, the creative financing part. Some of the women that are in her particular group or in her mentorship group, We don't— sometimes we don't know the things we could even negotiate. And I'm like, like I was on a call last night about mortgage lenders. We had a call with our community as a free webinar. And, you know, a couple of the presenters were like, you could totally negotiate this, this, this, and this. And I'm like, I didn't even know you can negotiate 2 out of the 4 things they said. I was like, why is it that we sometimes just follow what we think needs to be followed versus kind of like asking for what we want and need? And I think women could do a better job at that. I mean, I can do a better job at that. I can only speak from my own world. And I am doing a bit. This leading a women's community has caused me to say, where can I learn and grow as a leader and as a person? And I am constantly doing that, whether sometimes I like it or not, or I'm stubborn or not. But I see myself doing that more as I encourage these women and the women in our community to do things. I'm like, yeah, and I gotta take my own advice. And I'm gonna go out and do X, Y, and Z and stop underselling myself. I don't know why women do that, but I, I am on a quest to ensure that women stop it. And certainly my 4-year-old will hopefully do that less than I did.

Exactly. You know, but I think it's interesting when women really join together to support each other, we can really help each other more than if we're isolated.

Yes. Absolutely.

And yet I find a lot of women tend to self-isolate in entrepreneurship, or like, I don't know whether it's just like a, I'm going to prove my competence, I'm going to get all these things done, I'm going to hit all these milestones, all these goals, and you're toiling away while the guys are out building relationships, or which is really what makes business run. And ironically, something that women are actually good at doing.

Oh, absolutely. And it's also like, you know, I, my management consulting work was in the personality assessment field. So I actually was an expert for a decade, or I still have it in my head of personality styles. And something I see so much is women who are naturally very— they are naturally very good at like, okay, where are you? Where am I? How can we come together? But then you have women who are very scientific or would rather just kind of be more technically looking at analyzing a deal. And I'm like, if you just ask some advice over here, you would get to your, you would get to your results so much faster. So I think in so many ways, I think women beat themselves up for things that they're not. And we don't go all in, like go all in and who you are and learn to adapt. Maybe that's a human thing we need to all do. But I think I see it so much with women where we do beat ourselves up. If I'm, I'm the introvert and I really should be doing this, or I'm more of the idea person, but yet I hate processes and systems, or whatever it is. And I think I just see women constantly thinking about what they don't have, what they're not, versus what they are and their greatness. Because every woman I talk to, I feel like has something great to offer in this business or any business. And I see it, but they don't always see it. And I'm not sure what that's about, to be honest. That's a whole other, right? Topic. It's a messaging. I don't know. I don't know exactly what that is, but so many successful women, like successful women that I talk to that are running very successful investment companies, will just talk like they own a property. I'm like, "Wow, what is that?" Because they're amazing.

Liz, I love that you really put together this community of women investors with the Real Estate Investor community? And what are some of the ways, like how does that community work? Who's in it? What's the benefit? How do you join? All the details about it.

Yeah. So a few years ago, just in a nutshell, when we were, me and my partner Andresa Guidelli, were pretty much coming together at a Panera Bread, we would be looking around and being like, "Where's all the women investors? We want to connect with them." Because we're actively flipping and doing projects together. And we Googled it and there was nothing, you know, and just like entrepreneurs, right? We see a need and we say, you know what? We're gonna start a podcast. We're gonna start a podcast where we interview.

Oh, so the podcast came before the community?

Yes. Yeah. The podcast came first and we started interviewing women. And I was told early on that we would run out of women. There's not that many investors by a man. And I was like, no, we won't run out of women. And I'm like, we haven't run out of women 200 episodes later. But what's fascinating—

Oh, I got told the same thing about women.

Are you serious? Yes.

I'm at 650. 55 the day that we're recording this.

Wow.

And everybody told me, oh, there, there are not that many women who have 7, 8, or 9-figure businesses.

Isn't that funny?

I'm like, watch me. I mean, I mean, there are. And the fact that we're sort of hidden in plain sight, I think is an interesting thing, but it's funny that we had the same experience.

Oh my gosh. It, um, I just kind of laughed it off and I'm like, I'm going to prove you differently. Yeah. In, in terms of our community. So that kind of segued into like, we want to get into conversation with people. And we started a Facebook community about 2 years ago. We have over 8,000 women in that community and it's free and women post questions and it's not just for new women investing, but experienced women who are just doing this alone and they want the camaraderie of like, "Hey, how did you deal with this lender? And how did you deal with this pivot? And I'm experiencing this." It's a very supportive group. We man that group like hawks. I mean, we do not let spammers come through.

Like a mastermind really in a way? Yeah.

Well, that kind of led into a mastermind. So, as we started to do all these free things, Melinda, and just free communities, we started this as a passion. We didn't start it as a business. We started to see women asking for more. And that's one of the things they wanted. Can you coach us? And Andresa and I looked at each other like, do we want to build a coaching program? That's not really our thing, but what can we do? So, we decided to create a membership for women, experienced women, 5 to 10 deals or more that they've done under their belt. And really for that woman who doesn't want to go in this alone, doesn't want to run their business alone. And we have monthly masterminds where we come together to support each other, put each other on the hot seat and say, "Hey, what's getting in your way of creating the wealth you want or the deal you have under contract?" And then we have— what's neat about it is we said there's so many of these programs out there, Melinda, and I'm sure you see it, the gurus at the front and they are the people that everyone goes to. Andresa Guidelli and I said, if we're going to create something, we want to create something. There's a lot of— there's a collective genius. Literally, there's the master woman who talks about creative financing, and there's the master woman who talks about transitioning from small to large multifamily. There's a woman who talks about short-term rentals. I don't know short-term rentals. Why would I talk about short-term rentals? I know multifamily. So I guess my purpose, my point in saying all that is that that membership Really, the point of it is accountability, is knowledge. So they're each part of these tribes, these mini accountability groups. We call them pods. And they learn from someone, but then they're accountable to each other. And they're learning, but they're also in community, small groups. And then we have mastermind sessions and we have masterclasses. And it's just really to support women along the journey so they create the wealth they want to create in the way that works for them. Because big is not always better. And more is not always better. And we really, really, really focus on the self-care element. So we always say we empower women to live a financially free and balanced life. And I know there's no such thing as balance in and of itself. It's nonsense. When you're doing one thing, you can't be balanced in everything. However, I think most women do want a balanced life holistically, and that's what we stand for. So that might look like saying no. And how do you take care of yourself emotionally, physically, mentally? We talk about that stuff on our podcast. We talk about that in our community. And we're teaching investment strategies, but that stuff is just as important and quite honestly more important. You can make money, you can buy a property and be doing great financially, but you are drowning in guilt or drowning in just not even taking a break to have lunch. So we talk a lot about that stuff and that's the kind of community that we're building is not just the financial side, but the holistic side. We get deep. We ask women to think about themselves when they're at their funeral and are they living the life they want that will move them towards the goals they have, or are they just going through the motions? So that's what we're doing on that side of it. And that's just, we take it pretty seriously because we really want to help women in that way. It's not just the superficial, like, learn how to flip a house. Yes, we're going to talk about that. Yes, we're going to talk about the core real estate 'cause that's our foundation. But if you don't talk about the other stuff, none of it really matters.

I think this is so true. And I think it is one of the things that separates men from women in business, although men are becoming more inclined in this way as well.

Agreed. Yeah. Agreed.

It's so important. 'Cause what's the point of being an entrepreneur if you don't like your life? If you're just swapping a job for then enslaving yourself to your own thing, right? Why?

Right?

And you're taking on all the risk and all of that and not enjoying it. That's no good. And so, and, and it's vital for women. I've seen so many women over the years, um, you know, just overdeliver, get into the kind of hustle and grind mentality, putting themselves last, perfecting everything. And they get to the point where they're sick, like they literally are burnt out or their adrenals are shot or what, whatever it is, sort of in their 40s. And it doesn't have to be that way. So the self-care piece is absolutely vital. I think, you know, we have to invest in ourselves as much as we do in our companies.

And we really have to, like, as, you know, my partner Andresa and I talk a lot, we're very authentic and very transparent. And I think that's just who I am in my life. Like, I'll meet someone and we'll talk about the meaning of life together. That's just kind of who I am naturally. That's not really an act at all. But I really am very mindful to share my struggles with our community. And, and I don't want them just to see, oh, her and her, you know, her and her team have all these properties and it's so easy. And no, here's all the stuff that happened, and here are all the struggles, and here's what I'm dealing with now. I'm like, I'm very open. I, I, you know, I think therapy is, is a must for people. I just started— honestly, I just started seeing someone at 43 years old. I'm like, how did I wait this long? You know, I just got to the vital. I, and I got to the point and I'm part of a mastermind myself and I'm considering a coach. I'm like, all those things are necessary to help me be the best version of myself. And I found myself like, here I am leading women and I have a really great life. I'm a very happy person, but emotionally I could really use some space for myself, you know? And I felt very depleted. And I think it took getting to the point of like almost in my mid-forties to realize that. And I'm very open with, with the women in our community to say, don't wait. You got— and that's why we have the community we have. But as I'm pouring into women, right, I, I need to get poured into as well. And I'm like, I'll serve, serve, serve, serve, and the rest— at the end of the day, I'm like, oh my God, I'm depleted. And I'm like, what kind of leader am I if I'm not taking care of myself?

I don't know an entrepreneur who— a female entrepreneur who hasn't gone through this in some way or another.

Yeah.

I really hope younger generations don't have to do this to themselves, right? I wish I'd known so much of this much earlier in my entrepreneurial career as well, but better late than never.

And I'm learning. I'm still learning.

I want to make sure everybody knows your podcast as well and how to find that. So it is called the Real Estate InvestHer Show. It's part of BiggerPockets Podcast Network. And of course, If it's a podcast, it's on Podopolis as well. So invite everyone to check it out there. We can have a conversation about all of this as well. And Liz, what is the best way to find you and connect with you if there are any real estate investors or folks in wanting to be part of your community? What's the best way?

Yeah, sure. I mean, we have so many different— one thing we didn't get a chance to talk about was we have meetups. We have free local meetups across the country. We actually have 53 of them right now. And our goal is to have a meetup, an investor meetup in every geographical area of the world.

Anything in Santa Monica?

Nothing in Santa Monica yet, but hey, if you know someone.

If you need something in Santa Monica, yeah, I'll show up.

Yeah, I love it because our goal is to have that local connection for women. So the meetups as well as like our Facebook community and our free membership and even our Strive membership, any of that is, you could find out on our website, therealestateinvesther.com. But we put content out weekly on our Instagram. It's @therealestateinvesther, H-E-R. If you literally have any questions, you have a lot of successful women who obviously listen to this podcast. Seriously, if there's some questions, shoot them over to me. I'm happy to help. I'll give my email too. It's liz@therealestateinvesther.com. But lots of ways we're constantly giving out content and more than content, community. And that's really what we're in the business of is creating that safe community for women to thrive.

Fantastic. Well, thank you so much for putting on your wings and this.

I love that. Well, thank you so much for having me, Melinda. It's an absolute pleasure and, uh, and, and certainly appreciated the time and appreciate the opportunity.

Liz Faircloth is the co-founder of DeRosa Group, a $60 million real estate company. She's also the CEO of the Real Estate Investor Community, host of the Real Estate Investor Podcast, and author of the book The Only Woman in the Room. Be sure to catch her podcast on Podobolo and also connect with us both in the comments section of Wings. That's it for today's episode. Thanks for listening. Head on over to wingspodcast.com and subscribe to the show. When you subscribe, you'll instantly get my special gift, The Wings Success Formula: Women Innovating, Networking, Growing, Scaling. Is the Wings Wings of Inspired Business Formula for daily success in your business and your life. And when you go to wingspodcast.com/win and post a review to Apple Podcasts, you'll be entered into a drawing to win a once-in-a-lifetime VIP opportunity to mastermind with me personally to grow and scale your business or launch a profitable podcast. That's wingspodcast.com. And don't forget to download Podoplo, the app that makes listening social and podcasting profitable for creators. On Podoplo, we surface quality podcasts for your specific interests from our library of 4 million+ shows. You can connect with friends for meaningful conversation and win rewards. Words available for free right now in both app stores and more at padopolo.com.