584. "My business is at a crossroads. How do I push it to the next level?" | Coaching Session

A lot breaks on our way to doubling our revenue. And they're like, how we've been doing it up until this point is actually not sustainable. And actually we couldn't hit our goal last year because our operations and our systems weren't in place. So it makes a lot of sense. You're totally, I'd say, in the right place for growth, so don't worry.

I hope so.

It happens like every single time, you know, like we're able to get it to a point and then it has to change again. Hi, I'm Jacqueline Snyder and this is the Product Boss podcast. I've helped launch and grow thousands of product based businesses, even one of my own. And over the last 20 years, I've seen behind the scenes of businesses just like yours. Whether they are makers, manufacturers, artists or food and beverage businesses. I have spent so many hours studying it all. I've discovered what makes them successful, what are mistakes they could avoid, how did they turn an idea into successful business? And what are strategies they have used to make more sales and be discovered by more customers. This is what this show is all about. Whether you're just starting out or you're looking to become a million dollar product boss, I'm here to give you the permission to chase your dreams no matter how big or small. All you need is the right mindset, a little courage, strategy and support and you too can be the next million dollar product boss. Let's do this. Hey, Prague boss. So today we're back with another coaching call, this time with Virginia of Swoop. She's a multi stream machine student who's taken this side hustle to a quarter of a million dollar business and she's looking at growing to half a million dollars this year. In fact, she just joined our inner circle mastermind. Now we're looking at big numbers and big growth, but. But with that comes some big complications. We'll take a look at what's no longer working for her in this stage of business and how she can hit her revenue goals this year. Let's get into it. Okay. Virginia, welcome, welcome. I'm so excited to get into this coaching call with you. I've known you what it feels like since the Product Boss started. You're a multi stream machine student, right?

Correct.

And you've been in a couple of our other programs and so I'm glad to be able to like connect with you. It feels like every few years we get to connect. On this coaching call, we're going to kind of dive deep into where you're at. But before we do, tell me a little bit about swoop. Like what? Swoop is what you sell and where you're selling.

Yeah, I am a nurse, which is kind of how all this got started. So as you can imagine, working a 12 hour shift is not very easy. I've spent most of my career in the emergency room, which I think in some ways is even, I don't want to say more stressful. They're all stressful, but the amount of moving and pushing and pulling and all the things we do, it is next level. So anyway, one of the problems I was having was I couldn't find a bra that I love to wear to work. And so bralettes I just felt for 12 hours weren't supportive enough and sports bras for 12 hours were just too tight. And I do think that both of those bras have a time and a place, but for a 12 hour shift they just weren't awesome. And so I designed my own. And so that was four years ago. This kind of just all happened. It wasn't really on my list to become an entrepreneur or to start a business. But after that first year, after I had made them for some friends and word of mouth and everybody kept coming back and going like, oh my gosh, this is the perfect work bra. I hired my first employee a year later and now I'm up to eight. So we've grown quite a bit over the last four years and that was kind of the start. Now we've kind of moved into bras, underwear, shorts, pants and tunics. Bras and tunics now are our best sellers. And as you always tell us, I do try to dive deep into our best sellers. So we try to keep those going all the time.

Why do you think they are your best sellers?

One, I think our bras, you know, I'm a little bit biased because I created them and make them, but I just think that they are perfect all day everyday bra. So I feel like the number of repeat customers, and I want to say I think our repeat customers is around 40%. And so they just keep coming back for more. And then our tunics, I think it is the shape of our tunic, just give every sort of body shape a really nice look. Which is one of the coolest things is when I watch all different body shapes try them on, I'm just like, wow, that just looks amazing on you. And wow, that just looks amazing on you. So I think that's one of the thing that people put them on. It just looks really nice. And then plus we have these side pockets. Pockets instead of a belly pocket, which I think people have really liked, because, you know, belly pockets, I think, you know, oftentimes things fall out or just make your stomach look more bulgy. So having the pockets on this side, I think, has been a nice feature.

Awesome. Amazing. Okay, so you've come a long way, because I know when we last worked together, you were just really doing the bras and bralettes. And now I'm looking behind you, and there's like a. It looks like a whole beautiful collection of printed garments.

We've come, so. And I owe it all to you. Maybe not all, but I owe a lot of it to you. That's for sure.

You owe a lot of it to you. But I'm glad that I was able to help guide on the outside of it all. And you're up in Alaska, so that's not easy.

No, not easy. I think, you know, probably the hardest part about being in Alaska and manufacturing in Alaska. We manufacture here in Alaska, and we also manufacture overseas is fabric sourcing. So my fabric shops basically go. I have Joanne's fabric, and I have a quilting shop. So when I'm trying to bring on a new product or if we're trying to rethink something that we're already making, the idea of, like, touching things, it's just really hard. We've kind of wanted to dive into wools and make a wool sports bra, and it has taken us. I don't know. I've just spent a lot of money ordering fabric out of state, and by the time it shows up, it's just like, the second I get it out of the package, I'm like, nope, this isn't going to work. Nope, it's not going to work. So that's been a big challenge and shipping, because people don't want to ship to a lot Alaska, so that can be challenging as well.

Okay, so if there was like a screech break sort of sound effect, I do that for a sec. Because where are we getting our fabric? Are you getting them from Joanne's? Are you sourcing wholesale? No.

Yeah, we wholesale. So, yeah, no, we've been wholesaling. But, you know, sometimes, like, you know, and again, I always have to say this, like, my background is in nursing, not in fashion design. And so I kind of learn as we go. But oftentimes when I see a fabric and I touch it and I'm like, what?

Wow.

Like, I just love the touch of this. And then trying to think about what kind of product we can make out of that. That is like where those fabric stores and fabric sourcing, I think, really come in handy just to be able to touch things. But no, we do. We wholesale all of our fabric right now. We've been using a place out of Canada. And then we also use Spoonflower quite a bit, who's out in North Carolina.

Okay. Now, Spoonflower, as great as they are, I think of the size business that you wanna grow to, it's very, very expensive. So that's probably a separate thing. And thinking about how you're making these things, right, like you had the ideas, you keep coming up with, like the ideated section of it. But then when you make it, we have to really think through the design, development, production process. But also it comes down to how much it's going to cost in terms of raw goods, to wholesale prices, to retail prices and all that. But absolutely, when asking you sort of what your biggest struggle is right now, what. What do you find to be your biggest struggle in business right now?

So I really feel we're at a crossroads. So I think it was really easy to start this business as manufacturing here in Al, Alaska. And I think it's great to have that option. But it is a lot of work. And there are a lot of. I'm going to say there's pros and cons to it, but I do think often the cons outweigh the pros, at least at this time for us. And you kind of nailed it. One is the cost, which I always find it interesting. We get asked all the time, like, where's your product made? Where's your product made? And then I'll say, oh, we make it here in Alaska. And they go, well, it's just really expensive and I don't want to buy it. And it's like, well, this is how much it costs to make clothes in the U.S. i think that the U.S. is getting there, and I do think that there are options here in the US But I have also. I just think it's really important to make a quality item. And sometimes in US versus overseas, I still think quality at times can be better in other places. So back to your question. It is really expensive to manufacture here in Alaska for all of those reasons that we just talked about. And so now we're at a crossroads. What do we do? Do we keep manufacturing here in Alaska or do we take our manufacturing elsewhere so we can grow and outsource, you know, what we're doing? And I just feel our demand for our products at this point. We keep up. But it is, I feel like oftentimes we're, we're, you know, on this like really close fine line between not keeping up with the demand.

What's the size of your business right now in terms of annual revenue?

Last year? So we've doubled every, just about doubled every year we've been in business. So last year we were about $50,000 under hitting our 300,000 mark in revenue. So 300,000 was doubling. We came in at about 250. I feel very confident in saying this. The reason why we didn't hit 300 last year was, is because we ran out of tunics for quarter four and again back to manufacturing here my seamstress who makes our tunics, I don't know if she had Covid or what, but she wasn't feeling really great through quarter four. So our production of our tunics went way down. I did find a backup person but it was a little bit too late in the, you know, big scheme of things. So we were down a little bit. So this year I'm hoping to double. So I'm hoping our revenue will be 600,000 for 2024 and then I'm hoping 2025 will be over the million dollar mark.

I love that. I love that. I mean when you joined Multi Stream Machine it was like side hustle.

Yes. It's not a side hustle anymore.

Quarter of a million dollar business. Yep. And you're working backwards not hitting that goal. But you're a quarter of a million dollar business. You want to get to half million to over half million this year. And then we're thinking about million dollars which I love this. Now these are huge quantum leaps. Not every year doubles. Right. Then a lot, a lot breaks on our way to doubling our revenue. And you're kind of at that point I usually see this 300,000 mark things and systems start to break. So it makes a lot of sense as to why you're asking about this part of it. Because you're like how we've been doing it up until this point is actually not sustainable. And actually we couldn't hit our goal last year because our operations and our systems weren't in place. So it makes a lot of sense. You're totally, I'd say in the right place for growth. So don't worry.

I hope so.

If it wasn't falling apart then we'd be. No, it happens like every single time, you know, like we're able to get it to a point and then it has to change again. Virginia's company has been growing fast. Going from a small side hustle to a quarter of a million dollar company with employees and everything. I mean, I have watched her grow from, you know, just joining one of our challenges to joining Multi Stream Machine to taking this small business to quarter of a million dollars. And now that she's in my inner circle mastermind and I get to work with her, it is just so incredible. I am so proud of her now. What she's done to get to this point has been working. It has been working, but it was working until it wasn't. So she missed her sales goal last year and it seems like her current processes aren't going to get her to where she needs to go. And as they say, what got you here won't get you there. It's natural for things to break as you hit different stages of growth in your business. That just means it's time to step back and look at the foundations of your business to see what changes need to be made to support your business that you are growing. Talking about distribution, what are your sales channels? How are we selling this stuff?

That's I think one of the things I get excited about because I do think that there are some sales streams we haven't tapped into. Amazon in particular. I know maybe different people have different opinions on that one.

But, but how are you currently selling?

Currently we have a website, we do a lot of in person markets. We have an Instagram shop and we are on TikTok, although that's something as of this month we're trying to build up and be more present on there. But currently website, in person markets and Instagra.

So what would you say if we did a revenue split, you know, out of a hundred percent of your sales? How much is website versus in person.

Versus social to make it easy? I would say 50% in person, 25% website. And then I also forgot we're also on fair for wholesaling and then 20. So 25, 25 and 50%. Our biggest revenue is in person markets right now. I think our website and social media avenues could be better. We're just still in that phase of trying to get in front of more people right now. Up until 2023, everything we've done is organic. We've never paid to like run an ad or paid for PR help or anything along those lines. So I think, you know, that's been big on our radar this year to try to help. You know, I feel like we have a sustainable business. We've had enough back to the repeat customers, like, I have enough faith in the business that this can go somewhere. And so now I think it's worth trying to put more efforts into delegating some of that stuff to people who understand it much better than I.

Okay, well, you still have a lot of room to grow, like you said. So now you're telling me that you are doing like $125,000 in person. Are these markets like, what does that look like?

They are markets. They're in person markets up here in Alaska. I have gone out of state too, and we've been successful out of state. But it's a lot of work, as you can imagine, flying down with product and hotel rooms and car rentals and all the things. And we have had success and maybe we do that again this year. But we have so many market here in Alaska during the summer into quarter three and four. I mean, there's basically one every weekend. And so it's pretty easy to show up at that. I think also the amount of shopping in Alaska, there's not that much shopping. So as far as, like women apparel goes, it's nice to show up at these places because it just gives, you know, some shopping, you know, options that they haven't necessarily had.

Okay, so if we want to expand and double, how are we going to double the revenue based on the way you're currently doing it or adding in another revenue stream?

My thoughts are this is. I think there's still sale channels I haven't tapped into. So Amazon, for example, I think that would be a really good one for us. I think building the website, the thing with the markets, and I know you've had other people say this, they are truly exhausting. And if you start to take like out of state markets, I mean, you could literally do a market and every single weekend and feels like a fomo, right? Like, oh, if I don't do this market, like, how much money could I have made? But sometimes it's like, man, I have to look after myself. Like, it's just a lot of energy, a lot of time. It's physical. It's like setting up your booth, taking down your booth. And I think that there's a time to charge and go hard on those. But I also think sometimes ones that I really sat down at the beginning of this year and looked at the revenue that I'd made from markets over the past couple of years and I crossed some off the list, I was like, if I'm not making X number of dollars, which is us, for me, around that 3,000 mark a day. If I'm not making over 3,000 a day, I don't think I should be there because that's more time I could put into building social media or trying to get more followers and more, you know, email content and things like that. So I think tapping into more influencers to try to gain followers in our social media platforms would be huge. And then after that, we are unfair. That's kind of, I don't know how you get to be seen more on fair. I'm sure there's like some things I could do. Changing videos and things make that platform a little bit better. But I think diving into Amazon, I think more influencers, those are kind of our two best options for doubling that revenue.

Okay. So before we add on another revenue channel, I think that we should dig into the channels you already have to make them stronger. Yep. So what I hear from you is that your stuff does do really well in person. People will walk by, they'll see it, they're attracted to the colors, the styles, whatever it is, and some form of salesperson, whether it's you or team member, whatever is selling them the product. So by you telling me that and giving me that kind of like clue and remember, success leaves clues, it would tell me that your stuff would do better. Wholesale could be an easier one for you to grow versus you thinking about, should I add on Amazon right now? Because Amazon is still going to require you to learn this new platform. And listen, you've got multi stream machines so you have lifetime access. You can come back to this. But the revenue streams you already have, you've already diversified. Did you start with just in person before you joined multi stream machine? Like what did you started?

Yeah, when I started with you, we were just doing in person markets.

Okay, so you've already added in other sales channels. Now I think the idea is like, how do we optimize those sales channels? We're seeing that in person drives 50% of your revenue. We're looking at wholesale driving 25%. And let's say we split direct to consumer online 12%. 12% between social and website. We can squeeze out more out of this Lemon. Right. Like if they're not done, they're not squeezed. They'll never actually be squeezed all the way versus it's going to take a lot more effort and time for you to do Amazon. A lot more team and quantity which like you said, you need to kind of work out manufacturing a bit before. Also, if you're going to try and grow wholesale, Amazon might not be the place for you to go right now either.

Right.

Okay. So let's talk about this idea of increasing these, these channels so wholesale fair is not the only way. In fact, I don't love fair. Yeah, Fair to me is like Etsy. It's a very easy way for people to get online and start selling to people in a certain way. So like Etsy is for people who are makers and they don't want to build a website and they kind of want a built in customer base. And so Etsy facilitates that. Etsy disrupted the makers markets because they took the concept of an in person market and brought it online. So it allowed for people online to discover handmade goods. Now fair, which I've known fair since before it was called something else, like two words I forgot right now. But fair started out that it was actually a place where subscription boxes could find little trinkets. It was less of this huge wholesale platform. But how they disrupted the market was this concept from the way that I started in this business was that I had to find a sales rep. Either had to go to a showroom, I had to be at a trade show that could cost me five, ten thousand dollars a trade show. Or I'd have to hire road reps or rep groups and they would represent me and then they would have the connections with the stores. So fair disrupted the market by saying, you don't need a sales rep. We're just going to connect the maker of the manufacturer to the retailer. Now everyone complains about the price. Stop complaining about the price. I'm not saying you are, Virginia. I'm just saying if anyone out there is hearing me, I paid a thousand dollars a showroom and I was in multiple showrooms, like East Coast, west coast, the south. I paid 5, $10,000 for markets, I had to pay for the booth, I had to pay for travel. I had sales rep samples all across the country and I paid them 15% commission.

Yeah.

So when everybody complains about these commissions and how expensive it is, it's because they do not understand how wholesale operates. And this has always been. And I think they've recently changed in going from like the 25% for the first deal for you, like the first connection, they've changed it, which is great because they know that 25% is not sustainable.

Right.

But 15% commission is pretty appropriate. Back in the day, like if I go back in my day, 10% was usually what you did. But then as more and more small brands, as more and more people are able to become entrepreneurs in this space, they started asking for a higher commission because of more work they had to do to establish a brand in these retail shops. So what I think, what I don't love is that people think that this is the only way to sell wholesale. It's not is this another tool in a tool belt to find retailers or to transact with retailers. But it is not. Wholesale is the way that wholesale is normally operated. So for you at this point point to become a half million to million dollar business, you're going to probably want to go back into multi stream machine and go through how I teach you how to find the stores and the buyers and give you the templates and give you all the things to talk to them about. You may need a team member to do this for you, but fair is like a secondary part. Great, you can be on fair, but if we start to think about manufacturing overseas and things like that, you don't have it all in house, you don't have it local to you. Per, let's say just talk about the bras you're going to need to order. You know, let's say they're like it's a hundred piece minimum per bra, per print for example. And you're going to have to go and order it months before you ever ship it to stores or to your customers. So we can't live in a fair world where fair is like oh, you got the order today and you're shipping it out tomorrow. That's more of like an immediate on hand. But when you're thinking about manufacturing, you really need to have better production calendar timelines. And so I think it's going to be a tool in your wholesale tool belt. But then I'd like you to back it up. And if wholesale is going to be how you grow, it's more in line with selling seasons, taking orders and purchase orders. Then you go into production and then you ship it when it's due.

Yeah.

Does that make sense?

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. So it's. Yeah, exactly. So I'm just kind of a step ahead. It's like I'm already getting orders from our wholesalers but the items are still in production at the time. So that way when they arrive, then they're ready to go out.

Typical how wholesale works. Let's just go from you, like I know a lot of people are makers and, and even the way you've been doing it, you're like, oh, I got an order, I can maybe I get my sewer to make it up for me in the next Two weeks.

Yeah.

But typically for manufacturing and for people who are makers that need to eventually, when you start to scale, you need systems in place. Right. You need operations. Your team needs to know, like, what am I doing now? What is process for this whole thing? So for you, as an apparel, you are a manufacturer, you're an apparel manufacturer, what would typically happen? I'll just give you an example. In September is market. Right. Like, if we think about when the fashion shows happen, like New York Fashion Week, it's completely aligned with sales markets. So why New York Fashion Week happens in September? And this is for anyone selling accessories, jewelry, apparel, all the buyers, like, that's why we see it as like New York Fashion Week. I'll just give that. Because there's Paris and London before it la comes later. It's a whole large season. But September is when they're selling. Spring, summer of the following year.

Okay.

So September, October, November, December, January, February is usually the delivery date. Sales are happening six months before they ever hit the store.

Isn't that crazy? It's just so crazy to me.

This is the world I've lived in. So let's say you were working with China. Yeah, I have no problem working with other countries. We've made it harder in the U.S. to manufacture. And you're not even in the lower 48. Right. So it's just I have other clients in Alaska and access to the talent that you need or the facilities that you need. It's just not there. It's just not part of it. So six months ahead is when they're selling. So let's say I started selling in September. I would usually have about two months to sell to go through all the markets. New York, Louisiana. The South, San Francisco, Atlanta, all the places. And I usually cut off sales around November 1st. And then I would be placing my order with a manufacturer, and I have about two and a half months for them to manufacture and ship it back to me.

Okay.

And then I get it back, and then I ship it to stores on their delivery dates. And you have this all in msm, where I go through line sheets and all this. So you can really dig into it. But why I'm saying this is that if we want to scoot you up into wholesale, as a fashion designer, I'll just tell you I would design a year ahead, meaning I'm sourcing and I'm coming up with prints at least 10 to 12 months before. So next March is selling fall. So right now people are selling fall of 2024, fall of 2024. Okay, selling it. And we have a selling cycle. I will add that in as a freebie into this episode.

Oh, that would be great.

Yeah. And then we'll get that to you too. It's like a freebie that we have for our community. So we'll add that in. So it'll be in the show notes. What it does is like right now I'd be selling, which means I had to design and source and get all the prints done and all that already last year it was design developed. I had my samples. My samples are selling wholesale right now. Then I'd be going into production over the summer and then it would be shipping the stores. July, August, September, October. One of those pieces that typically breaks as a product business scales is the manufacturing timeline. The bigger you get, the further ahead you have to be when ordering product. This can be really hard to wrap your head around when you're new to it. But even successful businesses run into this problem at some point. Well, actually quite often. And we even have a freebie for our community, which is the product boss's selling cycle to get ahead of the seasons and the holidays and get your marketing aligned. So you can check out that freebie in the show notes. I dropped it in there. So you can get it totally for free. Just grab it yourself. Click on the link. Hey, hey, product boss. So if you are a six figure multi six figure on your way to seven figures or even cross that seven figure mark. Product boss, ears up. Now. Listen. I was recently in a session with one of my masterminders in the inner circle, which is Julie. And she said, jacqueline, I literally feel like I am building a castle on top of IKEA furniture. And I added that IKEA furniture has a few leftover screws that you don't know where they go. Right? It's this thing where you're building something amazing and beautiful, but you're so afraid that at any moment it could all come crashing down. And that's because a lot of times as we're learning, as we've crossed that six figure mark, we've hit multi six. We're heading to seven or even cross seven. We're still just figuring it out, right? We're still figuring out how to do this, how to scale the business, how to grow a team, how to be with our families and spend time doing the things we love, how to manage these amazing opportunities that come our way, how to keep leaping and growing. But the thing is, is that you can't expect us to know this and do this all on our Own people aren't meant to do this. And I'll tell you, the biggest shift and change that I ever had in my business was a decade into running my business by myself alone, complaining to my husband and he could not help me. And then I found a coach who told me she had a mastermind and I joined it. And finally I felt like I could breathe. I felt like all that pressure was off of my chest and I was like, finally people I can talk to who just get it and who just get me. So if you have crossed that six figure mark, if you're in the six figures, multi, six, seven figure business and you are looking for that relief and that support and that strategy and to be surrounded by other product people doing the same thing that you want to do and going in the same direction, then I invite you to join me inside of the inner circle Mastermind. Yep, this is my inner circle mastermind. It's the thing I love so much in this business. I've been doing it for the past seven years, working closely with those of you inside of my masterminds. And so this is for you if any of this has applied and I'd love to see your application come through. So right now we're taking applications for a limited time. Once the spots fill up, they're full and you'll have to wait for someone to drop out or for another cohort to come up. So if you are interested in enrolling, all you have to do is head to the productbossmastermind.com get that application done. It takes just about five minutes and then I will review it, my team will review it and then we cannot wait to get back to you and see you join us inside. So now back to the show. As you start to think about transitioning into the wholesale, you're probably going to want to work on getting your calendar bumped a little bit further up.

Yep.

Because if you're going to take your manufacturing anywhere else, you're going to have to work on a longer lead time. Okay. And now this all started with talking about fair. The reason why is fair has established it like immediately. So what immediates mean is that we have excess inventory that are immediate, that are available to be immediately bought. So if it was normal times, like let's say you were offering the way I've been talking about, a store comes to you today and they're like, hey, Virginia, I'd like to order from you. You'd be like, great. Here's my open to sell form. You have a sheet that tells you Everything you have open to sell that is available for them to buy wholesale from you. Yep, that's it. It's the quantity you have because you've already done the production on it. Otherwise, they can place an order today for whatever your next delivery is in the timeline. So Fair operates more like an immediate. Why it's not sustainable long term is you all can't sit on. You will not be able to sit on a million dollars worth of product and cross your fingers and hope that someone comes and finds you to buy wholesale from you. It's better to work ahead of time so that you can take orders and then go into production against those orders. Why? Let's say one of your prints totally flopped. It happens, and I say flops. Maybe two stores buy it, but you've sold to 50 stores. That's when you get the chance to say, we're going to drop this print because not enough people are buying it. We can't buy into the minimums that are needed. So we're actually going to drop it. We're going to call the two stores and we're going to tell those two stores, hey, we're actually not going into production on this. But everyone's loving these prints. Would you like us to move your order into these prints? So it's a process of back and forth. And this is what I learned working for really big companies. And one of our biggest buyers was Neiman Marcus. And if Neiman's didn't go for what we were selling, we actually dropped it out of the collection. Because they were such a majority buyer of our wholesale. Yeah, yeah. And it was in lingerie. Does that make sense? Do you have questions?

Yeah, no, that makes sense. You know, it's kind of interesting as, like, a maker, too. And I'm sure you've been in there. It's like, you know, you're so far out, you know, and then as you're showing these things to Neiman Marcus, like, how do they decide which they like and which they don't like? I mean, I feel like it's just people like us trying to make those decisions as well. What? You know, I mean, what people are gonna buy?

No, not necessarily. I mean, yes, it's all people, but the reason you would be a buyer for laundry at Neiman Marcus is because you completely understand who your customer base is at Neiman's. You know exactly what they want to buy and you know, the colors and print. So when I worked for Cosabella, we knew what LA would buy. Like West Coast LA would Buy younger looking, smaller prints.

Right.

New York bought solids. They did not want the prints.

Right.

And then we were based out of Florida and Miami, which this was an Italian company I worked for, but they were based out of Miami. And then that was like bright colors and very like European and Latin kind of mixed together. We knew who our customers were and we knew the location. So we still had a mix because we were a big company. We were like a $25 million company at that point. So knowing who your customers are now you have a solid print company and people like prints and you might not even be a coastal. Your company might actually be better equipped for like the outdoorsy. Like Colorado.

Yeah.

Parts of Arizona, the middle of the country, not necessarily the trendmaker coasts. Right, right. Because New York and LA are very specific. Or like Oregon for example, based on what I know because I've worked for years with another big Alaska company. Like a woman owned Alaska company that's in Prince. It's more that REI Outdoor Realm and you may go more. I know we go for nurses, but she still has that aspect to it.

Yep, yep.

So just kind of repeat back and what I hear you saying, it's almost like this working backwards. Right. So trying to tap more into the wholesale and identifying, you know, Neiman Marcus for example, that that's not my soul mate. Like, yeah. Not my customer. And I'll use REI because REI would be potentially a really good partnership for us. And so then, you know, working a year out, then I can kind of sit down, decide, hey, these are the stores that we want to target for a wholesale relationship. And then to start working backwards going like, okay, these are prints or colors or things that would be appropriate for those type of stores also based off of like where they are located. And you're right. Like, you know, I think a lot of the outdoorsy sort of things, I always think mid mountain west coast sort of thing.

Yes. We're not going to kill the Alaskan in you. Right. Like it is innately part of the culture of where you are and how you operate. So we're not going to somehow take this Alaskan company and make it something that's a New York LA vibe. Right. That's not going to happen. It's not in the DNA of the company or the brand.

Correct.

So we have a new program coming out because I've seen everything we're talking about right now. Yes. Multi stream machine is amazing with like helping you get onto more sales channels and you've done it right. You've increased your revenue and through of the all you've shown up to so many of the things I've taught live and been in other programs with me, what I realized though is there is this gap. There was a gap between people coming up with an idea and making the product and then they jump all the way to sales. But there's like this huge foundational aspect that skipped. Yeah, I'm getting a head nod a yes on that.

Yes, yes, absolutely.

So no matter what I give you in terms of like, these are all the places you can sell, this is how you can get more eyes on your business. Without ads or because you've done it organic, you've done a lot of what's in msm, but what's happened is that you've built the company without this foundation that will allow for like the longevity. So in this make it stage, because you've got the ideas, you've done that. But in the make it stage, I think, and especially now is, you know, whether someone is just starting out and let's say you were just starting, this would work for you, or you've started and you're like, you know what, in order to scale this, I need to refigure out how I make this product. Am I going to manufacture it? What is my schedule and timeline going to look like? Because what you're asking me about is for you specifically, there's design. So there's design and so there's product development section. Then there's a pre production stage, production stage, and then the post production, which is when we're going through quality control before it ever gets shipped out to stores or to your end customer. So there's that part Julie, who's in my mastermind, she phrased it like she's got a. I don't know if it's almost a million dollar company. And she's like, I feel like I'm building a castle on top of IKEA furniture. And I was like. And missing a couple screws. You're not sure if it's all gonna fall. Yep. Yeah, I can relate. Yeah. So that's the thing. Like, you've done amazing getting to this point. But before we break it again, like you're. It's breaking a little bit because it needs to break. We need it to come apart, to put it back together, to make that next leap to where you're at. So that's why I think it's this idea of it'll work for people at any stage, because even you at a quarter of a million dollar business, which some People are listening to like, I would die for a quarter of a million dollar business. You're realizing to make that next jump, we need to stabilize and build like a more solid foundation in a way that I haven't taught before in any of my programs. So I mentioned this before. But it's natural for things to start breaking as your business grows. In fact, it's a good thing. Once you see where the cracks are in your foundation, you know exactly what you need to start looking at to move forward. Whether it's your marketing, manufacturing or branding, you'll continually be revisiting the core aspects of your business to adapt to new growth. I mean, this is part of the reason I think that Virginia decided to join the Mastermind, right? She's in the inner circle Mastermind because whether you're just starting out or your years into a successful business, you'll want to be surrounded by other highly motivated product bosses at the same level that you are to develop new systems, new strategies, more support, expansion, community, mentorship that are specific for your business. Now Virginia did this when she decided to join Multistream Machine when she was a baby business, when she wasn't really there yet with her revenue, when it was a side hustle. She's like, okay, the community and the mentorship I need that works for my business right now is to be in a do it yourself program. But as the years have progressed, she is ready to push herself, right? She's ready to push herself past those boundaries. She knows that she wants that mentorship. She knows that she wants to have community that's a close, tight knit, small group of people that are doing the same things as her with the same sort of big goals as her. And she knows that she wants that expansion, the expansion of whether it's trainings, expansion to things, think bigger, expansion of what's possible, just all of it. And that's why she joined the Mastermind. So if you're in that six figure, multi, six figure, seven figure range and you're like, oh, this sounds just what I want and I want a mentor like you. I want that community, I want that expansion. I'm putting a link in the show notes just to make it really easy so you can get more information and get an application in for the product boss inner circle and that's the product boss mastermind.com just to make that soup super easy. Backing up into your manufacturing, working with a longer lead time. So I'll get you the selling cycle but it will take you going through like a pre production, production schedule. Will help you start to think out so that when you are going to make this leap. So right now, maybe you're still keeping your manufacturing in Alaska, but when you're ready to kind of make the leap or you're learning and you're going to have to find the resources for you, and there's going to be a lot longer of a process. But you know that. Let's say you do get an opportunity with rei. You will be able to fulfill that, and you can get a better margin on the product.

Right.

Because here's the deal. LA, last I saw, makes 5% of the world's garments.

Wow.

But we've raised our minimum wage to $17 an hour, which is bonkers for other places. $17 an hour. You cannot get a person to sew more in an hour just because you paid them more. So it's going to cost so much more money to manufacture in la, which sucks, because as much as I think people should have living wages and it's so expensive to live here, it's actually going to boot manufacturing out, because we cannot. Like you said, you can't explain to people, well, you want it made in the U.S. but there's a minimum wage here.

Absolutely. And just for reference, because I just think this is so important to let people know, and maybe a lot of people listening to this already know this, but as I was getting quotes for manufacturing our tunics, there was two places in the US I reached out to. Their quote back to me was $80 per tunic. That includes the cost of the fabric. So, you know, like, you've taught us, like, doing our wholesale numbers. So that's like $80 just for the cut and sew. The fabric is, I think, about 15 per. Let's just say 20 for ease. So that's like a hundred dollars per tunic. I mean, I'm gonna be.

A 400 tunic?

Yeah. I'm selling a sweatshirt for 400 and it's like, yeah, they're awesome. But not gonna buy a sweatshirt for $400.

You know, not Gucci.

Yeah, exactly. So it. It is hard, right? Because I feel like as much as I want to keep it in the U.S. and grow it in the U.S. it's like, wow. Like, I just feel like sometimes we're just not quite there, you know, or it's like, I'm a business and I want to keep my business going. I can't afford to make something that now all of a sudden I have a 400 tunic that the minimum order is going to be, you know, a hundred of five color runs. So I have to order. You know, it's. It just doesn't make a whole lot of sense. I'd go out of business.

I mean, this is why people sign up for one on one calls with me. This is why people join the Mastermind. Right? Like it's to. Because these other programs that I have, like Product Biscuit and Multi Stream Machine, they're do it yourself programs. They offer a lot of information but some people want to go deeper and that's how you know we'll end up on calls like this. We'll do a VIP day and a lot of people like at your level will join the Mastermind with me because they want to take it to that next level and they're thinking, well, how do I do this? I need to kind of like work through it all. So it's all possible. You probably also can still manufacture in America, like in the lower 48. It's going to take quantity. You have to make more. So you might have less options available. It's just however you're doing it right now, you know, you skipped over a part. Not skipped over. You've been figuring it out on your own. We all are figuring it out on our own, right? Unless you were me and you worked at bigger companies that I was given options to do. My friends who worked at Nike and Abercrombie, one of them was going to leave and start her own company and she called me, I was like, what's your grading roles? And she's like, I don't even do that part right. Because when you work at really, really big companies, you have like a very small part of the whole process. I was really fortunate when I was in the fashion design industry that I worked for, they were still sizable companies, but they were still run mom and pop. And so I was able to almost like see every section of it. Like I work the markets, I was counting the inventory. I saw the marketing stuff. I was. We were making samples in house so I was able to see it all. And that's why I know so much. Because I've just had these different opportunities that I took, which I didn't know at the time how useful it would be to everyone else.

It's super useful. If you could just take your brain and put it in mine, maybe things would just be so much.

I'm working on it.

Yeah, I.

It. Appreciate.

Appreciate it.

Yes.

Give it all to me.

So you know, and, and we don't know the experiences. So for you and anyone else that's listening, we don't necessarily know it all. There's a student right now that I have in our mastermind. She actually does maternity bras. She worked at huge company like Free People and anthropology. Like she designed lingerie for them and huge. And she's figured out a lot of it on her own because she understood the tech part of it all and the sourcing and all that. And she's actually done a really good job at marketing. I mean, she's got this amazing business. But still, like, there's still so much you don't learn when you work for bigger companies. And it just depends on your experiences. So in saying all this, it's all totally possible you just might need a source, might need way more sources that you're going to go through and weigh it out by like, what are your minimums? Okay, what if I did have to sew 150 of every bra in one print across sizes? So you're going to need to know like what the container is that you're living in to then know. Because this is why wholesale would work so well for you. You sell more units to less people. Right? Yeah, because a retailer can buy 6, 8, 12 from you versus selling direct to consumer, where I might buy one of that print and then one of something else.

Right.

So this is how you'll be able to keep up with units if you go wholesale because you'll have to order more, but you'll get a lower price per unit and you can sell more to less people. And I say that because retailers will buy in bulk, if that makes sense.

Yep, absolutely.

Okay. So I think that wholesale is a strategy for you to grow into going back to multi stream machine. It's that concept of how I teach you how to do that outside of fair and then in product biz school. And I'll send you what I can from this call what I have established. But product biz school will help kind of in that make it manufacturing foundational part.

Yep.

Going back to your other question. So it gets back to you trying to get to the $600,000 goal. Right, right.

Yep.

So, you know, one of the things and again like I've learned this from you is I literally have a calendar, like a whole year calendar in front of me. And I've been doing a lot better at like looking at my conversion rates every week and looking at doing the breakdown. Like we, you know, we've talked about this like working backwards. Right. So I want to make 600,000 this year, which basically means how much do I need to make A month? How much do I need to make a week? I know, like, quarter four. We tend to make more money, but I can look at past numbers and get a feel for that. One of the sheets, it was probably from one of your free ones because I learned so much. I have this sheet that I've used now for like three years where I write down what I made every month. And then I do the good, better, best. So I just take that. And I know in January last year, I made $3,000 if I want to do, you know, and I double it to do the good, better, best. So anyway, back to my big calendar. I've been trying to figure out more ways to. Just simple examples. If I'm supposed to make $5,000 this week, and I came in short, what do I need to do that next week? Because I always feel like this is like, very vague. It's like, okay, so now in January, I made. I don't why I keep saying January or March, but, you know, I made $5,000. I needed to make $5,000 this week, but I only came in at 4,000. And always the simplest is like, okay, well, I run a sale the next week. But I just feel like it can't always be so sales driven. And I always feel like these conversations are a little bit vague into what is it exactly? Like, I guess I'm trying to say is like, I need more tools in my toolbox. So, I mean, it's super easy. If I'm supposed to make $5,000 this week and I make 6,000, okay, we're already a thousand ahead. But if I'm coming under, what are tactics that I can use to try to make up that revenue difference that I was down on from, you know, the prior week?

I think overall, you can look at your months and your monthly goals, right? So weekly. Because some weeks you might outperform and some weeks you might underperform. Right. Things happen in the world and they shift how people are operating online. You know, like just things happen. So it might get too granular if you're always like, I have to hit 5,000 a week, and I didn't hit it. One of the biggest things that people have an issue with is how to get customers right. For you, it sounds like you know how to get the customers in person, but you need to figure out how to get customers online more. Because the other way that you said that you're making money is direct to consumer, whether it's through social or through your E commerce site. Correct. So this is the Concept of you building this like online sales machine. And so when we build our own sales machine online, we're responsible for bringing in the traffic. So you either need to be always acquiring new customers or retaining and getting your current customers to buy more.

Right.

Okay. And you've said you've done it all completely organic, which is amazing. It looks like you've got 7,000 ish followers on Instagram, 7,300 at the time of this recording. So you don't even have like a gazillion followers, but you have a quarter of a million dollar business, which is awesome. And 12% of your sales are coming from social.

Right.

So you think about that. You want to start to like pull these levers and say, okay, if I'm selling online and I have this like online sales machine that I need to do, I need to be bringing in people and always need to be doing new lead generation and going back to my current customers to buy more. So it might be on the back end of the people who have already bought from you. How do we get them back in? How do we retarget them? Are you using Klaviyo or what are you using for email?

I just switched to Klaviyo, which I highly recommend. I mean, it took me a second to get over there, but that's an awesome platform.

Yeah. And are you on Shopify?

Shopify, correct.

Yeah. Because Klaviyo and Shopify are the two things that I'm teaching in product biz school. Those are. And the reason why is that I know there's a lot of other things that you all can use, but they work so well and they're so scalable that you could have it as a $50,000 business, a million dollar business, a $25 million business. Like, it can grow with you. And that's the goal. Like, because every time we have to switch platforms and change our email marketing system and change over our website, it's all going to cost us a lot of money. So, like, if we can do it when we're smaller, it'll grow with us and we don't have to worry about that part again, you know?

Yep, couldn't agree more.

Yeah. So for you, the idea is, you know, I don't know that you necessarily need to move to paid yet, because I talk, I talk about paid, organic and partnership. So what you mentioned was more of the organic growth and the partnership growth.

Yep.

So organic, you're doing it. So figuring out what's working for you on social right now and how do you do more of what's working. Okay, right, like how do we get you to go viral a bit more? How do we get more? Because what we need is we need more reach on social media. So we need virality a bit more to reach more people. It's like casting a really wide net and then gathering followers that you're reaching more of your potential customers. Annika, who's famous and she's a mentor at MSM Next Level, she just grew 50,000 followers on Instagram over the last two weeks. It's something insane because she put a reel of her sewing at her sewing machine. But she says, me waiting for all the plus sized babes to find my account so I can show them all my comfy size inclusive designs. It went friggin viral, like 41,000 likes, 50,000 followers from it. And she said find out more. Right? So not everything's gonna hit. Like I had one, I had a Taylor Swift reel that went viral, like 85,000 views, which was a lot for us when it posted like seven follows from it. So some stuff is gonna work and some stuff isn't. But what it is, it's just going to be like hitting social in a different way than you're used to so that you can have a bigger reach to people. So it's not always selling to them. We're gonna have more of a reach. And I do teach this inside of product biz school. It's gonna be how do we reach more people and then get follows? And then you're gonna have content that sells, but it's not all salesy.

Right.

So I think for you it's working on your social, because your social is working. You're telling me 12%. So if we can move 3% more on that. Let's not. We don't have to double, we just have to start to inch up. I want you to pay attention to what's working and then you just start to do more of what's working. Little tiny tweaks there are going to change the percentage there, okay. And that's going to exponentially grow, right.

And then what we mean by what's working is just looking at the numbers, right? So looking at the number of views, like the analytics that's like within the social media platforms to see which, which videos, which reels, which posts are getting the most likes and follows.

And yeah, so I'm going to look at you on my desktop because on the desktop you can see more information. You can actually see likes. You can't see it on our Phones. So there's one of someone with black hair holding a bra out in black and white that has 218 likes. 77 Comments yeah, that one was says when our founder couldn't find a bra. So it's like you telling the story. Just because you told the story once doesn't mean you don't tell the story again and again. Doesn't mean that this piece of content doesn't happen again. And you put a another trending sound to it at another point. But that has some of your highest engagement.

Right.

So you look at the stuff that has high engagement and you do more of it. It looks like user generated content or when you're all being wacky and like costumes.

Yeah.

And actually some of the less engaged content is your really beautiful photo shoots.

Yeah.

Which is fine. It needs to be that mix. So you'll see. Okay. We're still going to do our photo shoots and we're still going to create content that's like, like, you know, styled and there's models and they're out and they're doing all the things. But maybe our user generated does better. Maybe you as the face does better and you kind of, you keep testing it and you're gonna just play with what can go viral to get follows. Because that's how you like imagine like we're fishing and you're hooking them in.

Yep.

And you're bringing a bunch of people in and then they're gonna stay for stuff that's relatable, for stuff that makes them feel like, you know me, you've seen me. And then as they're engaging with all of that, because remember, this is social media.

Right.

Then the ones where you're like new bra drop or new collection or new tunic print or sale today, they're going to see it because they've been engaging with all that other content.

Right.

We can look at really big brands. I'll go back to Nike. We can look at Nike and they have a lot of followers but their engagement isn't super, super high. Or a lot of the brands that we might follow, their engagement isn't high because they're straight up brands versus all of us as small business owners can kind of treat it like we're still going to be creators and marketers in this space.

Right.

You have to be.

Yeah, you do. And it's a tool. You don't need social media. We don't need it. But you do need it in a, in a way that it establishes your brand in other ways on other platforms. Because if they find you on this platform and they're like, oh, yeah, I like this brand, and they engage with social media more than they engage with their email or more than they go into www.wareswoop.com, then they're going to be reminded of you more often.

Right.

So we can think of it as like a little bit of a billboard, like another piece of our marketing content. Virginia brought up a great point here. It's great to have sales goals, but what do you do when you start to notice that you're off track? You might not be able to come up with $10,000 in sales in one week. Maybe not even a thousand dollars in a weekend. Right. But if you notice that you're coming in below your goals, you can start looking at the different areas you're bringing in money and start making small tweaks that are going to build up over time. If you can get one extra customer from social media this week, if you can get one extra wholesale order, if you can do something different, you can keep building from there. You can start to close that gap and hit the end of the year strong.

I do think back to, like, social media. It's just kind of interesting for us because in the beginning we're heavy into Instagram and that really has become our brand. You know, like just all of these photo shoots that we've done and then just trying to use them in multiple places, whether it's through our social media and then through email, you know, email we send and our website. So then it's again, like, you know, I think, what is it? Like, 10 times a person has to see it before they purchase it or for that it to kind of get stuck in their brain. So it is kind of interesting how like, social media does, like, kind of help that backing of your brand to like, really create the feel and the vibe of, like, who you are.

Well, in the last couple years, people have come back to sending catalogs, or I get them from anthropology and free people, and especially the holidays, you'll get them free people. Does it a lot where they're going to send you, like the seasons, basically. Like, it's not a catalog, it's a lookbook, basically, like a little mini magazine. Because it's that same idea back in the day before social, it was all through mail, direct mail, or billboards or commercials. The way that small businesses would start would be you either had to build a store, like have a store and have foot traffic, or you sold wholesale because we didn't have a way to reach customers. Directly because E commerce didn't exist.

Right.

So living in the world that we live in now is amazing because we can reach any customer anywhere in the world through social media, which is free. Using social to grow our email list, marketing to them, we cut out all the middlemen. We do not need to have a store, we do not need to sell wholesale. We can. But I do think there's the concept of borrowed land and land that you own.

Right.

I always say this. Your email list, you own that. Your own Shopify site or your own e commerce site, you own that. The borrowed land is using other platforms. Amazon, Etsy, actually selling to stores, it's borrowed. Social media is borrowed, Pinterest is borrowed. But we need to have a good mix. And so my goal is that you understand how to like, I think you've nailed it with what you're selling. You know what people want, you're understanding their prints for you right now you've been doing it organically to get organic customers. But the goal is, is that we move it away from in person foot traffic, which takes a lot of resources and time to how do you get more customers online? How do we get more traffic and direct that traffic to your website or to convert on a social shop? And at the same time selling wholesale is going to get you more customers because you're going to be on the shelves of stores.

Yep.

So those to me are your two biggest plays for this year to hit your goal because I don't think you can do any more of in person without burning out. So then now what we have to do is we have to get a higher average order value potentially at your in persons.

Yep.

How do we get them to buy more when they're there? So then you're selling more to less people and then changing the percentages or making more money on these other platforms that you've established. Again, success leaves clues. So you have the clues to what's been working. So now it's just clarifying, like doing more of that.

Yeah, I love that success leads to clues. It's like they're all right there in front of me. I just have to dive a little deeper and pull them out.

Yeah, we ignore them. We're like, oh, we should add Amazon. No, let's.

I want to do it all and I want to do it all right now.

Trust me. I have a whole my on my desktop, on my like wallpaper and behind me it says things take the time they take because I'm like, the time needs to be now. So I think Going back to looking at the clues, finding more of that. And I want you to work on more people coming in, and you need to retain and sell more to the people you have. Let's see, you said you did about 25%, so about 62, $63,000 in wholesale orders.

Yep.

Okay, so if you can think about doubling that.

Correct.

Tripling it, like, look at your 62,500 and say, how many stores have I sold to? What is the order minimum that they're buying?

Yep.

Can I increase it to, like, a better threshold? Or. And. Or how do I get them to come back and reorder? And also now how do I get more of those stores?

Right.

And there we could potentially grow that into a $200,000 arm of your business, just through wholesale, Just doing more of what you've been doing.

Yep.

I like that idea. I think, like, you kind of said it too. It's like diving back into MSN and, like, looking at who potentially would be great partners for me as well. Ones that I have used in the past and ones who potentially could be new relationships for us.

Yep. You'll go back into MSM and you'll figure out how you're going to contact them, how you're going to find the stores. What you're going to do is like an outreach point. You can still use Fair as a tool. And then you just math it. Like you said, you work backwards. So if. Do you have a minimum that you require them to buy?

I think my minimum on, like, that I've used on fair is around $200.

Okay. So to hit 200,000, that's like a thousand stores, which is a lot. So let's say you're making $200,000, 400 stores.

Yeah.

But again, you're selling apparel. They buy more than that, probably. And if they can do reorders. So it sounds big, but that's because I think your minimums are so low.

Right.

So if we can raise your minimum so that, again, is like, average order value. If we can raise that up.

Yep.

Let's say you add an extra 50 stores to your this year. Right. So we do 50 stores. Okay. So that's 25,000. And then you get those 50 stores to come back in and buy again and again. And then you can keep adding on new stores. Then you just see how it starts to build on itself, like a snowball.

Right.

And then it becomes easy. Just like that.

Yeah, just like that. You're gonna go to sleep, you're gonna wake up, and it's done.

No, exactly.

It's a, it's a minimum thing and it's. And it's supporting the stores and getting them by again and then your quantity. Right. So then you're gonna think about how do I grow that side of it? And then social media driving people. I'd like you to also think about at your in persons, how do you get more people to your website?

Right.

So because you're getting that traffic, how do we then get them to come back and buy online? So the next part too is like, you're meeting them in person. How do we continue to support them that they then come to your website and they purchase from you there. Maybe they subscribe to your newsletter while they're in front of you, or they follow you on Instagram and send you a DM and like you send them a coupon code to use online with a time limit. Right. Like, you want to always think this omnichannel way of, like, how do I get people all the points that I meet them, how do I get them into my other channels?

Right.

I like that idea. One of the things I thought about too is, you know, why do we do so well at the in person, you know, or what is it when people come and look at our stuff that like, I think about as a tipping point for them to like, purchase? So is it that they touch it and that it's soft and it just like feels really good against their skin? But just trying to think about some of those things to dive a little bit deeper in, especially like from like social media platforms to using those ideas and getting that, that kind of feeling and vibe more out there to drive more people to the website.

Yeah. So then you need someone says like, Jacqueline walked by the booth and she touched it and she was like, oh, my God, these are so soft. Then you'd be like, oh my God, these are so soft. And put it as a quote, right? And then just touch your fabric, watch qvc, watch hsn, watch how they sell you stuff. They touch it. And so a lot of times we, a lot of us start in person and we do not take what we're so good at in person and bring it to social media and bring it to our website. So you just have to pay attention to the things that you're saying. Again, success leaves clues. So people are touching it or you're like holding it, or you see them do this, then do a video of you touching it. My gosh, these are so soft. And you're just touching it and people imagine, wow, this is really soft. Oh, my goodness. These are so stretchy while you're stretching it out. Right. Like you want to just show it's the senses that we visually need to see and saying it with words and then it starts to do that. So maybe next time you're at one of your own persons, write notes of things that people say, ways that you're describing it, and then think, how do I transfer that into an online version? Whether it's social media, Pinterest, my website, my product descriptions, videos, whatever it is you think about, how do I transfer it over?

I like that.

Okay.

Yeah.

All right, so lots we talked about in just about an hour. Tell us how we can shop from you, buy from you, support you.

Yeah. So our website is wareswoop. W E A R S W-O-O-P dot com. That's the best spot. And you can also follow us on Instagram at wearswoop.

Amazing. Thank you so much. This was so good.

Oh, thank you. It's just such a pleasure. And you know, I've just been a big fan from the start and just really appreciate you and everything you bring to the table.

Okay. That coaching session was great. We outlined a clear path to Virginia reaching her ambitious goals, which I absolutely love, all without putting her product on Amazon. And honestly, that's one of the things that, you know, when I work with people and I coach people and they're asking, you know, they have these ideas because that's what we teach inside of multi stream machine. But when you actually get that mention mentorship, we can start to pull it apart more and say, this is for you or this isn't for you. This makes sense or it doesn't make sense. Sometimes we're too close to our products to know that. So we were able to figure that out without her putting her product on Amazon for now. And one of my favorite sayings is success leaves clues. And that's because it works so well for product businesses that are already making some progress. When you see what's working in your business, you can start to put more energy into that area and the results really start to amplify. So where is your business showing you clues to success? And what dials can you start to turn to bring in more revenue? I want you to take some time, maybe after this episode to take a look or reflect or sit in silence, maybe meditate on it and see what jumps out for you. Because your path to more profit, your path to your first six figures, to multi six figures to seven figures, could be right. In front of you now. Don't forget that we have a link to a freebie for you in the show Notes and if you feel called to put in an application for the Inner Circle Mastermind. We are currently taking applications for our next cohort. So excited for all the applications that are coming in so far and say hi to me over on Instagram @thepro product boss and I will see you in the next episode. Thank you for being here and listening all the way through the Product Boss podcast. If you love our show and it has helped you in any way in your business, would you mind doing two things for us? Subscribe to the show so you never miss an episode and leave us a review. Reviews help other product entrepreneurs know that this is the place to be to grow their businesses and realize that they're not alone. And we know that you all know that a five star and honest review helps you sell more products to more people. So you know that your reviews help us reach more listeners around the world. Remember, what we give is what we receive and we are all about helping each other in the Product Boss community. We are all in this together. We would be so appreciative of you if you could take the time right now to subscribe, leave a review and even share this episode on social or someone you know so we can impact more lives. And remember, subscribing means that you will get notified each time we release a new episode so you never miss a thing. You have helped us grow and climb into the top 10 of all marketing podcasts and together we can keep climbing. Thank you friends and remember, there is room at the top for all of us.

SA.