Generational Wealth with Agustin Barrios Gomez

Welcome. This is the Insider's Edge to Real Estate Investing with James Nelson, the principal and head of Avison Young's US Investment Sales Group and his co host Kim Troller from his investment sales team. In this program you'll learn game changing strategies to outperform the market. James will teach you how to source, execute and capitalize on the best real estate opportunities in New York and around the world. Now here are your hosts.

Welcome back to our new season of the Insider's Edge to Real Estate Investing. I am your co host James Nelson. I'm head of US Investment Sales here at Avison Young along with Kim Troller who is also working on our USIS Investor initiative. And today we are here with Augustine Berrios Gomez. This is episode number 228. We going to be talking about generational wealth and today you're going to learn about gaining that insider's edge in different markets and finding the right tenants in this conversation. Augustine is the founder and president of International Capital Partners. ICP has built a portfolio of nearly 90 properties across 15 US markets by focusing on stable cash flowing industrial and suburban corporate office assets.

You'll hear how real estate serves as a tool for generational wealth through tangible income producing assets. Augustine discusses how ICP works with trusted local partners, leverages regional banks for debt and structures each investment to align with both the fund and its operating partners.

Kim, what I really appreciate about what Augustine is about to tell us is that he's really figured out the fundamentals of real estate investing. In fact, he even said that he's not looking for any future upside. I mean it's really about the cash flow today boiling down to the fundamentals for wealth creation. Look to outperform, get some, some beta as well. So I think this is going to be a very interesting conversation for our listeners.

Absolutely. And he's very transparent about that too with his investor reporting and just kind of telling them how it is. One of my favorite things about Augustine too is his diverse background in politics and public speaking about foreign investors. So he, he's a very well rounded guy and I think he brings a very unique perspective to the industry.

Well as always you can go to james nelson.com that's where you can find the show notes. That's how you can figure out how to connect with Augustine. And then we're going to have a short word from our sponsor. We'll get right into our interview with Augustine Barrios Gomez.

Avis and Young's United States investment sales platform executes on multifamily Office, retail development and specialty asset transactions across top US Markets. As experienced leaders in the industry, our integrated national team is here to help you make informed investment decisions. Whether advising on your current holdings or identifying new opportunities nationwide. Our one unified platform is built on unparalleled collaboration and connectivity across 120 full service offices around the world, giving clients direct access to the deepest pools of capital. We put our clients first, delivering tailor made strategies to achieve superior relationships. Results.

Welcome everyone to another episode of the Insider's Edge to Real Estate Investing. I am your co host now, James Nelson. I am head of US Investment Sales and Kim.

Good morning everyone. I'm Kim Troller. Welcome. Today we have Augustine Barrios Gomez joining us in from Mexico City. He's the the founding partner of International Capital Partners or ICP Funds. Augustine, thanks so much for joining us.

Thank you, Kim. Jim, it's good to see you guys.

Yeah. And just as a brief intro, Augustine, like I said, he's the founder and president of ICP Funds. They're a commercial real estate investment firm focused on office and industrial in several cities across the US he's between Mexico City and Houston and also happens to be very involved in politics and he's a public speaker on issues related to international investments in North America. So he's got a lot of wheels spinning and we're really excited to kind of dig in and hear more about it.

Thank you very much, Kim.

Yeah.

So Augustine, maybe just for our audience, if you could just give a background of icp, maybe just tell us a little bit about what the platform is. And I know that there's some different verticals that you're invested in, so maybe just kind of give a sense of the overall portfolio.

Right. So we're a private equity fund based in Houston. We buy industrial and suburban corporate office assets throughout maybe 14, 15 cities across the U.S. our strategy is we're very cash on, cash focused. We're cash flow focused. We buy core, core plus assets. These are stabilized buildings. Our weighted average lease term is upwards of 6, 7 years. We have 90 properties in 14, 15 markets across the country. And we have, we have a perfect track record. We've been around for about nine years. It's a fund that's, you know, we curate our portfolio very specifically in terms of our industrial assets. You know, these are buildings that are between 10 and 30 million dollars. Mostly in terms of our suburban corporate office assets. These are buildings that have some element of, you know, mission critical. For example, we have portfolio of properties in the Denver Front Range area that have significant Skiff space. Right. That sensitive compartment and information facility, which means that all of these suppliers to the DOD have to do these business processes within these spaces that are specifically that have specific build out so that they block electromagnetic frequencies and all that. Anyway, so this is all what we try to do. We try to make it such that our portfolio has particularly sticky tenants. This is a cash flow portfolio. We're very, very conservative in our underwriting. We stay away from markets that have had speculative activity. We stay away from what are the traditional gateway markets, simply because when you do your underwriting for those purchases in the New Yorks and the Californias and the Miamis and these markets that have other elements of market demand going for them, then you have to assume that there's going to be upside. And in our underwriting, in our projections for the yield that we're looking to give our investors, we're very conservative. We don't assume anything in terms of upside. We assume that we do our underwriting based on what's in the lease contract, the rent bumps that we have already established. And so that keeps, that keeps the flow very steady. It keeps our investors very happy. Again, we went through Covid and we were able to hit our objective on time and on target. Currently we've got a nine and a half percent yield per annum. And so we believe that this is the part of the portfolio that you can count on when other things are going a little haywire.

Right?

Yeah.

So generational wealth, if looking to build and protect your wealth, real estate is a great vehicle to do that for many, many people. What does that term, generational wealth mean to you and how have you used real estate as a vehicle for building that for yourself and for your investors?

Sure. So, I mean, for us, what that means is basically, you know, it's capital protection and yield and it's that sweet spot between the capital protection aspect of it where you actually own the underlying asset and all of that. But at the same time, you know, we're looking to make sure that our investors do have that, you know, do have that yield that is attractive and that they can actually, you know, it's the whole sort of live off your rent strategy. Right. But we believe that this is a more intelligent way of doing it than buying direct. So because, you know, it's interesting, we've developed this little. We have this niche in all of our markets. You know, in the Houstons, the Dallas's, the San Antonios, the Denver's, the Chicago, St. Louis, we even have, we have property in Detroit. We have a property in Lexington with Long Waltz. And what we found is that there is, there is an act, there is actual value to be, to be given, you know, to be provided for your investors based on having a great reputation. So in all of these markets where we're, where we're active and we're constantly and consistently active, what we've been able to do is, is, is be very clear to the selling population, right? To the, to, to the, to the, to the ecosystem that sells in all these different local markets. And the way that, the way we do that, we're very clear that we're not going to, we're not going to go against institutional money. If you have someone with deep pockets going after your property, we're really not interested. We're looking for that, for those double digit cash, you know, levered cash on cash returns. You know, if we're not able to hit that with your property, we shouldn't really even be spending time on it. And what's great about that, you, in exchange for all of that, we do give surety of close. You know, we've, we've closed every property that we've ever put under contract on time and on target, except for a couple that have had issues with dd, of course. Right. That's something that's completely out of our control. But they know that, right? Sellers in all these markets know that. And because of that we generally buy off market and we generally buy below, below market prices. Why? Because they prefer to sell to us instead of being, you know, 60, 75 days out after this whole, you know, after the whole purchasing process and finding out that the buyer in one way or another can't perform. And so I think that it's a great deal for the sellers, it's a great deal for us, it's a great deal for our investors. And that's how we focused it. And so the way that we look at it, and I was at a family office conference in San Diego last week. Upwards of 50% of the portfolio for family offices these days is actually concentrated in private equity of one sort over another. Right. So alternatives, if you want to look at it this way, that way. And so we found that, that, that, that family offices, high net worth individuals working through, you know, private banks and all that, you know, they'll have the classic bond and stock portfolio that, that are the publicly traded securities, of course. And you know, as, as that's as investment as investing 101 will tell you. But at the same time they're very, very interested these days. Products that give, that are not correlated to, you know, the, the ups and downs of the financial markets, that for them is very important. And so when you have a portfolio of properties that has, you know, the underlying, obviously the underlying property, but you have, but that really depends on these, you know, credit tenants one way or another paying the rent. And we believe that that has allowed, and it certainly has allowed during the last nine years that we've been around to have these uncorrelated returns. And so that's the way that family offices are looking at all of this. Obviously in that space, you know, you have to include VC money. Right. I mean there's a lot of people going in and investing in, you know, in these venture capital products and you know, early stage investment and now you have tech and all of that. But within that basket you also have funds that are much more conservative, that are much more geared towards providing a current return as opposed to these spectacular IRRs that are promised by a lot of other funds.

Right. That's really helpful background and that makes a ton of sense with your investment philosophy. If we could just take a little bit of a step back to understand your position within the transaction. So you come in as the equity partner. So you're always going to have an operating partner who's going to actually be running day to day. So are you, you know, typically you see these 9010 deals, you've got major decision making rights. I mean, are you always the majority equity partner who has that?

Always.

Okay, so is that, that's really. So tell us kind of a typical deal profile because again, if you're investing in properties that have great tenancy credit. Walt. I mean are these deals maybe just share with us what the capital stack looks like as far as how much finance, how much equity you're putting in and how much you look for your partner to contribute.

Yeah, absolutely. So yes, we do work through local gps. Our. We, we have nine, although there are three that are most, most dominant within our portfolio because these are the ones that work in the, in the geographic areas where we're most active. So about 50% of our portfolio is actually in the Texas triangle and that is basically Dallas, Houston and San Antonio. We don't buy in Austin because we believe that Austin often can show a lot of the, the, the market dynamics of a sort of sexy market that we're not, not all that interested in. Intern because because of the whole, you know, speculative aspect to it. So 50% of our portfolio is there. So of course our Texas GP is, is, is Is, is, is, you know, particularly important. We're very clear. So we're, I guess, you know, I've been heard, I've heard it called controlling lp. And what that means is that we're very clear with respect to, you know, what the, what the benefits are for the sponsor. We are, we are, you know, major decision making obviously is always kept in by far the majority investor. We, you know, we'll do from 99,1, we'll do 99% to say, 75%. If the GP brings someone that, you know, a local investor that brings some value to the, to the, you know, to the, to the operation, then, you know, we'll contemplate that. But of course the conditions are always the same, right? The promote's always the same and all these different things. So we look for, we look for debt and that debt is generally between 60 and 65%. There are three sources, three main sources of debt for these types of transactions. You know, you have regional banks, you have Life Cos and you have, you know, the big financial players normally out of New York that do the CMBS loans. And so most. Maybe nine out of ten. No. Well, probably about seven out of ten are regional banks. We like working with regional banks. We believe that regional banks bring a lot of local expertise. We also like them because we can give them a call if anything comes up. With respect to the tenant, with respect to the building itself. It's a, you know, this, at the end of the day this is still a very much a relationship business. You know, you still, you still have to know who you're talking to. You still have to know the players at the local market, at the local level. And regional banks really do give that, those, those benefits. And then of course you have Life Cos. Life Cos are great when, when you can line up, you know, the, the, the walt with their, with their needs. And so sometimes they offer, they offer some really good terms and, and CMBS is, you know, when you're basically clipping coupons for 18 years from, you know, a credit tenant, then a CMBS loan might be interesting. But those are very, very few and far between because as you know, the CMBS loans can be very complicated if you actually need to talk to somebody because of course, you know, these are syndicated loans and so you, there's no one holder of, of of that debt. And so we are leveraged across the portfolio to about 63% on a weighted average. It's on a deal by deal basis. There's no, you know, there's no Cross collateralization, you know, basically there's also no, there's no recourse on that debt simply because of course we couldn't, we couldn't have that. And so we've been able to finance our deals at attractive rates and what's great also by being an evergreen fund, which is what we are, that gives us the ability to, and it, on the one hand, it, it separates us from, from funds that are, that are project by project based. It gives the investor immediate divers and it also allows us to buy in all environments. Right. So we've been very successful at buying in low interest rate environments and very successful in buying it in high interest rate environments with higher caps. And so generally you're looking at financing when the markets are a little bit more jittery. You're looking at say a SOFR plus 225, 230, 240. And when markets are a little bit more calm like they have been lately, and there's more capital being deployed on behalf of, you know, on behalf of the banks and the debt, you're looking at maybe a SOFR of plus 180. So as long as you've got that delta between the cost of your capital and the yield, then you're able to give those returns that are attractive to investors.

So from what you've described, it sounds like you have a very long term investment horizon. You're focusing on cash returns.

Nevertheless, we also believe, and this is important, I think one of the things that investors tell us is that they don't like long lock in periods. Right.

Where I was going, yeah.

And because there's no development risk, we don't develop, there's, yeah, we'll do a lease up, but lease up. But when it's very, very clear what the, what the exit is and what we're looking at, you know, maybe 85% occupancy, you know, nothing really, you know, out there in those terms. So we might do a lease up, but very, you know, and there might be a little bit of a value add play on some buildings where it's very, very clear. But the in place, the in place cap rate has to be attractive from, you know, again, from the get go. Right? It has to be, make sense, it has to be accretive. It has to make sense from the get go. We have to be able to get our returns from, from, from, you know, from, from the, the starting bell, so to speak. And, and at the same time, you know, we have enough, we have, we have about 450 investors at this Point. And so there's enough movement within the portfolio so that we can offer our, our investors their, their exit, after which we believe to be very, very reasonable. We can offer them exits to liquidate their positions within three months if it's below a certain threshold and six months if it's above a certain amount.

Well, as opposed to stocks and bonds, real estate is an illiquid asset class. And with that comes illiquidity premium, which a lot of investors who are willing to be patient can reinvent.

And there are several sources for that, right? I mean, you have, you have incoming investment, which is, which fortunately tends to be enough. There are lines of credit and of course, at the end of the day you can always go out and sell a building. But as investors know, when an investor of a certain size does seek to liquidate based on a sale, they're the ones that have to take whatever loss is on the table if that's what happens. Right. I mean, because I think investors have to be aware that like you just said, Kim, this is, these are illiquid assets, but at the same time, that's what makes them attractive, that's what makes them solid, that's what makes them real, so to speak.

Right.

I'd love to understand a little bit about how you get comfort with the various tenants in your portfolio and if that really drives, I mean, I know, for example, Amazon is a very big tenant in your portfolio. I know you also actually they're very, very small.

And that was, that was an interesting deal. That was, and maybe I can answer your question with respect to counterparty risk, right. At the end of the day, counterparty risk is very much the name of the game. And there are two ways to mitigate that risk. There's the multi tenant way, right. We have in our portfolio Flex Product, where you might have 30%, 40% of the GLA office build out and then the rest is light industrial or warehouse distribution. So we call that sort of lunchbox real estate. You know, you have, you have these, these, these local, you know, plumbers, electricians and all that. We have, we have some of that in Texas and we find them to be amazing tenants because the one, nobody's building that space and two, you know, you do have a lot of these local contractors and these types of tenants that are doing very, very well and they need that sort of space and you can actually charge a premium because of course these are not credit tenants, but you have a diversification in the property that, that, that, that banks like. And, and that's another element with respect to debt that we like. When you're making, when you're making these purchase decisions, you're making them hand in hand with, in normally a regional bank. And so you, you can, you can gauge the temperature of the, of the, of the tenant mix just by the, just with the back and forth that you have with your, with your, with your finance partner. Right? And, and, and oftentimes when you have a diversified, when you have a property that has a diversified base of tenants, even though not, not no one of them is, you know, is national credit, nevertheless the, the credit risk is fairly low because of the diversification within the asset and at the same time because you know, their, their, their individual balance sheets are actually quite good. Right. And then of course you have the national, you know, you have the credit tenants, the proper credit tenants that you can have. You know, we just bought a, a two property portfolio for German, you know, automobile manufacturer supplier, one of these Tier 1 OEM manufacturers for, you know, that they supply pretty much everybody in the automobile industry with sunroofs and drop tops and all these different things. And so that's a German company that's been around for 125 years and they have a plant in Lexington, they have a plant in Detroit. And that's a sale and leaseback, which we love by the way, for that's, that's 18 years. Right. And so that's a very specific type of credit risk and that's a very specific type of SLB sale and leaseback opportunity.

So how do you get. Because it's really interesting that in some cases it might be better to have kind of the multi tenant mom and pop than just say one Amazon tenant. Right. So but regardless of the tenant, how are you getting a comfort level with the credit? And then what type of return are you looking for in return? I mean, obviously if you have a credit tenant that's going to warrant for most investors, you're willing to accept a lower return. If you sell in the future, you're going to get a tighter cap rate. But how do you really, I mean, is it just going to Moody's S and P, you know, trying to figure out what the credit rating is. I mean, with these private tenants, how do you get comfortable with their shadow credit, if you will?

Well, it has a lot to do with their particular activity. So I mean, I guess the classic comparison is with retail. We do not do retail. But the classic comparison is, you know, with the nail salons and the, and you know, the cleaners and all these different People in the retail side, that's a very specific type of activity. When you're dealing with industrial product, when you're dealing with flex office industrial product in the local markets, you know, with surface parking, you might even have overhead doors, for example. Generally these are, these are, these are businesses that have been around for a while. Their family, they're, they're certainly mom and pop in the sense that they're family, but you'd be surprised at the, at the, at the, at the amount of, of money that, that, that they represent. Right? I mean these are generally, you know, they'll have some, they'll have monopoly, a monopoly over certain things as contractors, for example, within a region. Because as you know, these are very local businesses. They will have been around for a long time. They will have a very attractive balance sheet. They'll have very, very little debt on their books. And at the same time, because they're like you say, shadow credit, if you want to look at it that way, they also tend to pay a premium in terms of rents, which makes it all the more attractive. And at the same time the element of diversification, that is also very important. You might have 30 of these types of tenants in a FL Flex office industrial building that's a single story surface parking, overhead door kind of, you know, situation. And of course you're doing this again, you're doing this hand in hand with, with, with the regional banks. Oftentimes these, these, these businesses will actually have relationships with these banks so that, so, so the bank will, will be comfortable also with that credit because they will know these people personally. And that, that, that's, you know, that's the granule, that's, that's acting at the granular level, of course.

Augustine, what is your reasoning for staying away from retail? We've, we've noticed just from our internal reporting that over the past few years there's been an oversupply in assets like industrial and multifamily. But from a rent growth standpoint, retail is in a really great spot, particularly bricks and mortar retail. Why, why not retail?

You know, originally there's, there, there's a sister fund that, that, that operates in Mexico that marts and has significant amount of retail that I have business partners that have that fund. And when we looked to launch icp, that was sort of a natural way to do things. But what we saw was retail has different dynamics. Often the property will be very specifically built out for, you know, for the tenant in retail. We didn't see that with that, you know, with that customization Necessarily we would find the commitment on behalf of the tenant in terms of the length of the Walt for it to really make sense. Which doesn't mean the retail isn't a great business. It certainly is and more power to those who are in that business. But when we were looking for stability, when we were looking for properties that, that really, you know, that, that, that could turn on a dime in terms of, of, of of finding new tenants, but that had very sticky tenants in the first place. We actually found that, that industrial and specifically, you know, mission critical suburban corporate office, because office is a huge, you know, it's a huge space and suddenly, you know, you hear, oh, office is doing terribly, not all office is doing terribly.

Right?

And in fact, you know, when, when, during the pandemic when, when, when it was sort of the height of the, the, the office crisis, because our, our office properties were truly mission critical, we actually didn't see any issues with, with the, the, the 47% of the portfolio that, that, that, that is made up of office. And so I, I think, you know, you have to know, right? I mean, you have to know if the, if the, if the, if the tenant is actually using it as a sort of a cookie cutter space that they could, you know, they could take it or leave it, right? Or CBD office, for example, that was all. That's, you know, that's still having its issues. In particular, you know, 90s and 2000s product that you have these amazing buildings. I mean, some of them are like, you know, brutal, brutalist masterpieces and like that style or you know, or these sort of, you know, glass CBD towers that are also very iconic. But if they're not full on aaa, you know, if they're not, you know, you know, full on top of the, you know, top of the class office product, there's very little demand for them. We never got into that, right. We just, it just didn't fit our profile. We, we were always on, on in, in these suburbs that have, you know, the market dynamics where you have, for example, the C suite that lives very nearby or the, the employee base that also, you know, that you would, you wouldn't want to send them 40 minutes further west or east or whatever, right? And so there's, there's another reason why they're there. Skiff space in, in, in, in those markets that are related to national security and Department of Defense. Like you know, the fact that, that in Colorado Springs, which is one of our markets, you have, you know, the Air Force Base and, and up until now, you Had Space Force and all of these different things. In Denver, for example, I don't know if you know this, but Denver has, Denver is the sort of capital of the west apart from California of course. California is its own world, but Denver is the high, has the highest concentration of government buildings outside of Washington D.C. and so you have these, you know, so you have these defense contractors out there that have a bunch of rules around them with respect to where they do business. And so they, these are the stickiest of tenants despite the fact that these are offices, buildings.

Right, interesting. Augustine, maybe you could talk a little bit about your partner. So you said, I think you said you have nine different partners, repeat partners, especially in Texas. So you know, what do you look for in a partner? You know, maybe how did you end up connecting with them? And then you know, maybe there's someone who's listening to this show right now who has a great opportunity and they say hey, this perfectly matches, you know, ICP's deal parameters. You know, someone just reaches out and says hey, you know, would you have interest? Does that ever happen? Or is it more kind of debt equity advisors who are kind of help matchmaking for you. How do you find your partners?

No, so it's been very organic. So you know, we, we started out in Houston because just for family reasons. My former father in law had been developing in Houston since the 1970s and that was where we started out. And we still have a, a, a good, what are we at? Maybe about 29, 30% of the portfolio in Houston. We love Houston. We think it's, it's, we love the, the business dynamics there. And so we were looking at a property, it was one of the first properties that we were looking at that we ended up not buying. But we were introduced by the, the broker, the seller's broker because you know, we were looking at the property, we said we had, we had this, we had a GP in tower, sort of a small two man operation that was going to be the GP that had a lot of, a lot of experience but they hadn't actually created their, their, you know, built out their business since the guy left this massive like sovereign wealth fund that, where he had managed a large portfolio. And when we told the seller's broker, we said, you know, this guy can't, can't perform anymore. We're going to need somebody to pick, pick up the slack. We're going to need somebody, you know, to, to, to, to, to, to do just perform the duties of our know, procuring debt and a lot of the Property management, that sort of thing. And, and, and he was the one, the, the, the, the, this, this sellers broker from jll. He, he was the one who put us in contact with, with this group. And, and, and in particular in, in, in with respect to our gps, what we look for, we look for basically that have, you know, that have a really good reputation, that have incredible local contacts that have done a good number of deals. But we don't, you know, we don't want them to be like these multi billion dollar operations that have done all these deals with institutional money because it's not, that's not where we play, right? We, we're not looking at deals up north of you know, $30 million, even 25, $30 million, you know, where we, we curate our portfolio. We're not, you know, we're not deploying enormous amounts of capital which is the reason why we're able to buy at the prices that we're able to buy because we really are looking for, we're very, we're cherry picking in a very aggressive way, in many ways but. Aggressive? No, actually I wouldn't use that word. It's not aggressive. What it is is very open, very clear, very transparent. We're working to hit double digit levered cash on cash and we will give you surety of close but you're not going to get top dollar, right? But if you're serious about selling your, your property, if you're serious about selling your building, we will give you a fair price for what, what is for us a fair price. We're also not going to be overly aggressive with respect to, you know, it's, it's not that we're trying to squeeze the last dollar out of you. It's, it's the fact that we have a commitment to our investors for a certain level of return and we're very clear. And so it's very funny because people, sellers actually really appreciate that it's been surprising for us that we have been in what is in many ways such a perfect market, the market dynamics. I mean commercial real estate in the United States is by many measures the biggest asset class of any kind in the world. Maybe China might be bigger, but of course China has its own thing, right? So in terms of like, you know, asset classes, commercial real estate as a, as a whole is perhaps the largest asset class in the world. And so you know, you would think that it's a perfect market, but it's not. There's still a lot of there, there, there is still a lot of value to Be had that with those personal relationships with your, you know, with a reputation with giving the, you know, the seller certain guarantees in terms of the fact that they will close on time and on target. And that mean that represents millions and millions of dollars for our investors. And that's the reason why we can, we can give these returns or we have been able to give these returns up until now since inception because we have found those deals so we curate them in that way. So again our gps, our sponsors, they have to have those, those qualities about them. These, you know, generally these are second or third generation players, you know, very well known in the market. They know everybody in the market. They can sit down with, with, with, with the debt providers, they can sit down with the, with the sellers and everybody knows them by name. Those are the people that we like. And of course they understand that they're not going to, this isn't, this isn't a one and done sort of situation. You know, they're, they're. I think you know, in an ideal environment everybody does very, very well. But at the same time it's not a get rich quick scheme. You know, we're not looking for, you know, we're not looking for, to sort of kill it with them such that everybody gets this massive promote and all of that. That's not where we're about. We're about consistency. We're about, you know, this is a marathon, this isn't a sprint. Right?

So on that note, let's talk about foreign capital. I know you, you work with a lot of international investors and I'd be curious what sort of draws foreign capital to the US we know that foreign investors often have a different deal logic than, than domestic and maybe if they're trying to get their capital out of their country, deals that might not make sense for us investor might actually pencil for them. From a yield standpoint. Is that something that you're seeing with your investors?

So yes and no. Generally when you know the, the, the foreign investors that we deal with tend to be very sophisticated investors who are already in, in the U.S. they, they general oftentimes and this is something that we, we prefer to be honest, they have their own investment vehicle, they have their own C Corp in the US and we can give them their K1 and everybody's happy. Right? And because at the end of the day the, the vehicle, the, the, you know, the, the, the, the actual investment vehicle is is, is a pass through llc right with and whatever underneath. And so if you know the foreign investor, even though they will be a foreign investor from the perspective of the fact that the ultimate beneficial owner is international, they will have some sort of US investment vehicle that tributes in the United States that has a real presence in in. In the US and and has its own operation. A C Corp. Right Not a pass through. We we. We don't do. You know, we can't have another pass through. We we need to have an actual C Corp. Check the box. Llc, however you want to call it. And so that, that they they tend to have very similar dynamic to the, to the, to the US Investor. You know, these are, these are people family offices like out of Monterey for example. Monterey, Mexico, which is a very you know know it's a, it's a wealthy industrial city that's been around since forever. It's part of the region in terms of Texas. Like that whole region is really very integrated. Obviously used to be part of the same area. So you know, people are very comfortable with the San Antonios and, and whatever because you know the these, these, these family offices, the the owners will have their beach house. It's part of the.