Meet Your Investing Team - Jason's Birthday LIVE Stream

Good morning everybody. Good morning. We are going to start with a quick little video and then we will rock and roll. We got a bunch of people here today. I think you'll enjoy it. Here we go.

From the world headquarters of Arch America in our nation's capital, this is the.

News with Rick Sanchez.

The real estate market. We're hearing about Bubbles.

Adam, does that sound okay?

Bubbles. Who better than Jason Hartman to tackle this issue? There he is, good looking guy. We'll be right back with him and.

More.

Little birthday stuff.

Joining us now is one of the most prolific real estate investors with years of experience in this field. Jason HARTMAN From Jason Hartman.com is where you can find him. Joins us now to talk about this. This is a classic argument, Jason. I mean should the government leave well enough alone and let the market market make the determination or should they get in there and say no, sorry, you're not allowed to collect rents and what's the effect on the poor guy who wants to collect rent because that's what he lives off of.

Yeah, it's a great question, Rick. You know, I don't think the government should get involved. I, I'm out sometimes it's a, you know, slow. It's not perfect but I think it's better than government intervention. However, we have what we have now, the CDC moratorium, the National Apartment association is suing over that one. And we have these in different places. But remember, all real estate is local and some of the jurisdictions vary quite a bit from others. So in these landlord unfriendly markets, the left wing type of environments like New York City where Trinity just reported from, you know, that's going to be a tough slog there in addition to all of the other challenges New York City is facing. But in many parts of the country this is kind of a non problem. A lot of people are talking about it but it just doesn't seem to really be something that's ending up as a problem for very many landlords at all.

Last time you and I spoke we talked about the fact that people were actually going out there and buying more houses while at the same time people were leaving big cities. So we've got this map that I want to put up and I want to share it with our audience and then I want you to react to it. This is about the bubble possibilities, right? This is where the bubbles might burst. And who has the highest chances of having a bubble burst? Chicago, interestingly enough, very low negative 0.6, 166. Vancouver 137. This is North America. Toronto the highest at 196 Louisiana 1, 1.16. And then New York is only at 0.56. Explain to our viewers what this means and why Chicago is so low and Toronto so high.

Right. You know, Rick, Chicago is actually a very low priced, what I'll call trophy city. I know Chicago is not without its problems, believe me, and the state of Illinois has its problems. But as far as a city that is sort of a world class city, if you will, if someone's visiting from Europe and they're visiting the US back when people used to travel, you remember, you know, they'll go to la, San Francisco, New York, and what's on the list next? It's probably Chicago. So and Chicago is a very inexpensive city. All of those other cities are very expensive. So that's the reason it gets some, it gets some slack on that.

So the more expensive you are, the more likely you are that you're going to have a bubble then, right?

Absolutely, absolutely. Housing overall, when you look at median price housing, it's actually cheaper on an inflation adjusted monthly payment perspective because the interest rates are low and had some inflation since 2006. A house today is about $650 a month cheaper than it was in 2006.

That's amazing. That is amazing the way that thing is working right now. Thanks so much, Jason. Thanks so much as usual for joining us and sharing the information with you.

Jason hartman.com Jason's approach to real estate is unique in the sense that it's secure, it's safe.

Jason's one of the few real estate gurus per se, but I know that focuses on building wealth in booming economic times and also in recessions.

And I think Jason's the absolute best.

At building profits over the long term.

All right, so welcome everybody. Go ahead and unmute yourself, if you would. I muted you during the video because I was hearing some background noise. So good morning to all. Let me fix the screen here. There we are. We've got so many people here. This is fun. Hey Evan, what did you think of that segment, that little talk on Chicago we just had with RT America? Rick Sanchez, did you, did you catch that, what I was saying?

Yeah, that it's, it's a world class city that is, that's sort of undervalued or at least the prices are cheap. And that's kind of, it makes sense. As I think I said once before, like half of Chicago is like New York and the other half is like Indianapolis. It's like got that mix of these two markets. And it's, it's because of that there are pockets that are, that are actually good for our approach. So the problem with Illinois right now is just the taxes keep going up and people are fleeing. So there are, there are a lot of issues. We have some of the same problems that the northeastern states and the western states have, but some of the good qualities of our Indianapolis kind of market.

Right. But if you want to be in a sort of a quote unquote world class city and I, you know, I know all real estate is local, of course, and everything comes down to neighborhoods. Not even zip codes. Even zip codes are too big. You, there isn't another inexpensive world class city in America. You know, it's not San Francisco, it's not Seattle, it's not San Diego, it's not la, it's not New York, it's not Miami. Like you can just go down the list even through more of them. And all of those have high expense and, or high taxes. Big government. You know, it's. Chicago is, is in a category of one in that way.

Yeah. I mean it's got some of the great, I mean it's a midwestern city. So we, you know, there's still some of that, you know, they call flyover country.

And Hillary Clinton calls it Flyover Company. Her ridiculous, insulting, demeaning slam against the deplorables.

For 100 years since planes were invented, let's be honest.

Oh, oh. So the Wright brothers called it flyover company country. Two.

Probably it's got that famous name second city, you know, because it really came of age when New York was the first city and then all these other cities grew around it. But I mean, I love it here. Aside from the taxes. I mean there's. So you can actually park downtown, whereas you can't in like New York City. So there are a lot of wonderful qualities and it is a world class city. I mean it's, there's no question. The opera, the culture, the universities, there's a lot of things that make it outstanding.

Yeah. And of course, folks, you probably realize I asked Evan that question because he is in Chicago and everybody else is not in Chicago. So just wanted to get that perspective.

But Chicago reminds me of Houston in a lot of ways.

Yeah.

Just because Houston has the same things that Evan was talking about. I mean it doesn't have the like big name pizzazz, but it's got, it's a reason. At least it was a reasonable price to live. You've got your like major sports teams, you've got your major operas, symphonies, the big name companies come through from, you know, the traveling Broadway teams. And so it sounds a lot like Chicago. Chicago just has a little bit more of the history and a couple more fancy things in it, but reminds and, you know, sometimes we're able to get into Houston, and so it's a potentially good place. But high property taxes, just like Chicago.

Yeah, well, actually, I don't know, are they higher in Texas?

I mean, prize me.

Yeah, Texas has. That's the one bad thing about Texas.

I don't think so. I think Chicago is much higher than, than Houston.

Really? Yeah, I don't, I don't know. I haven't checked that lately.

But it's so neighborhood dependent. It's so, I mean.

Yeah, depending on the neighborhoods. Yeah. Because some different county, you know, some different cities and counties have their own taxes. I know, you know, know I own in Houston. And there's a school tax, an additional school tax. So, you know, just, it's all relative.

Well, and property taxes are going up even in northern Indiana now, too. And so those commuters that are renting in Indiana and commute to Chicago, they're getting an increase. Nashville got an increase in property taxes just recently, so we might see more of that, too.

Well, yeah. And you know what, Carrie, that's an interesting point that you make, like we've talked about over many years on the podcast and so forth, that so many of these municipalities are just struggling to survive. And so the trend is going to be high pressure to raise taxes everywhere, but especially on the places people are fleeing from. So it's like they're getting, you know, a triple whammy as people flee from Los Angeles, New York, San Francisco, Seattle, etc. You know, they're losing their tax base in a time when costs of operating those cities have increased dramatically. And I mean, it's just a really complex compounding problem. It really is. But, but anyway, hey, we jumped into the Chicago conversation, so first of all, good morning, everybody. Lisa, you're not saying much.

And happy birthday.

Jason's mom.

Very cool. Very cool. Thank you. Sarah. Did. Now, did one of your kids make that or did you make it? I made it.

That handwriting was way too neat.

My kids are asleep.

Got it, got it.

It's early there. It's early where you are.

Sarah made it a homeschool work project for him this week.

There you go. Yeah, yeah. Everybody's a homeschooler nowadays, aren't they, Adam?

Yeah, well, I don't know, Sarah. Your kids went back didn't they? Or at least one of them.

One of them did. My. My daughter re. Enrolled herself to.

To private school.

I know that. That was so funny. Yeah, Your. Your. Your daughter decided she wasn't into this homeschooling stuff, so she enrolled herself.

She's a social butterfly. She's got a spreader wings.

That's funny. That's funny. Well, good stuff. Well, hey, let's dive into a couple of your questions and talking points, everybody. So first of all, Adam says, how do you invest when there's no inventory?

You forgot an important part of that. I said, when there's no inventory. I said you forgot the quotation marks around invest. Because technically what I'm. What I'm saying in that and what I've been doing with some people is trying to. You're not necessarily deploying your money right now just because it can be difficult to find properties in the price range that some people want, like around 100 to 120,000 or less. That's just rough to invest in right now. But we are sometimes getting properties in that range. And unfortunately, with the pace of inventory, now is not the time to see a property and say, I want to find out more about that property. So what I've been doing and what I think several other investment counselors have been doing is we use this time as investing in education. And so we go and we have conversations with the market specialists in the towns that will have properties in that price range. So Little Rock, Memphis, northern Indiana, potentially. And you get yourself comfortable with the provider. You get yourself comfortable with what they are offering and you know, what their rehabs do. And so you maybe say, I don't feel comfortable with provider X, but I do with Y. And then when property. When LMS Y comes up with a property, if you like the numbers, you're already comfortable with them. And you say, give me a contract. And you don't miss out on the opportunity because properties are going, you know, within 12 to 24 hours.

Yeah. So in other words, you know, you need to make your decision on your criteria before you have a property instead of sort of evaluating the property and say, oh, this one, you know, looks good or bad or whatever. Right. You need to get your, you know, sort of decide in advance that I will buy this model house.

Yes.

This model investment property if it becomes available. Right.

Yeah. Commandment number one is kind of the most useful commandment right now to me is education right now is. Is so key just because of the.

Speed and that commandment just so you. Everybody Knows is thou shalt become educated. Thou shalt become educated. Good. Good stuff. Yeah, good point. Adam, any other comments on that from any of the other team members?

You want to be really good at reading the performance because, you know, Sarah.

Can you get closer, closer to your microphone? The echo is pretty bad.

How's this?

Much better.

Oh, good. Okay. Yeah, you want to get really good at reading the Performa. You know, when we upload properties to our website, our clients get to see them in the same format. I think you went over that format last week. And the better you are at reading that pro forma, the faster you can make decisions. Right? Because you know what your criteria is. You get the pro forma. Okay. Now you just have to cross check and make sure all those numbers are correct. Cross checking the rents, cross checking the property taxes, getting your loan assumptions in there. And then you can make an educated decision and then just being able to pull the trigger. And then that buys you a little bit of time to do your due diligence, have your inspection done, get your appraisals and everything, and go through that process and just making sure you have the right verbiage in your contracts to let you out of the deal if for some reason you get a bad inspection or a low appraisal.

Yeah, yeah, I call those the weasel clauses, definitely. So. So have a couple of weasel clauses. Those are just contingencies to bail you out with bad inspections and so forth. By the way, Naresh, I see that you're here, but your video is not on, so I have a feeling you're working on technical stuff. Oh, okay. So we will add Naresh to the stream. Okay. There he is. Hey, Naresh. Welcome. So let's go ahead and grab another one of those.

Well, Jason, I make a point on that. When you said about your due diligence, I had a client the other week who we were looking over the original purchase agreement to sign, and they had avenue instead of street. So little details like that make sure you do up front, even you're signing on the right. The right address that you're. You're going to be purchasing because all those little. It was an error on their end. Of course, they didn't mean to put evidence of the street. But some of those details make sure those fine points that you. You recognize ahead of time.

Who. Who made the error? Carrie? You mean the elements specialist did?

Yep. Yep.

Okay. And so. So they made that they put the wrong information on the contract is what you're saying, right?

It was like whatever, 1, 2, 3, something it, they did avenue instead of street.

It's good you caught that.

Okay, but my question is, what happened with that? By the time they got the contract redone, did the client lose the property? Did they sell it to someone else out from under them or. What do you mean?

No, no, no, they still got, they still got the property. We were just reviewing it in that 24 hours and saying, hey, resend us the docusign. You have the wrong street on there. So everything was fine. It was just, you know, if we went to caught that ahead of time, I mean, could they have sold it to someone else? Probably because they had the wrong street.

Yeah, yeah. By the way, looking at all of you here, do you know what, folks, viewers, listeners, you've, you've probably got close to 100 years of experience here on this screen. I know I've got the most and I'm doing the math in my. And yeah, there's a lot of experience here. So this is great advice. So thanks for adding that. You know, Kerry, I'll tell you interesting story. One time when I was in traditional real estate, I had this one, what you call a farm area, Northwood Horizons in Irvine, California. And I had so many listings in this tract of homes all at once that I remember one agent came to me and made an offer on one of my listings. We sat down, presented the offer to the seller and afterwards she walks out with me and says, you know what, I think this is the wrong house. I think my client wanted the other one. And you know, I had two of the same models and they were, you know, on the same street, but different addresses obviously. And so the client ended up buying the right house, fortunately. But that can happen. You got to be careful, folks. So that's, you know, little minor details like that really do matter. So good, good stuff. Okay, let me get to some of these others. Okay, so. So Naresh asked if, isn't it a lot of work to manage five properties at once if this is not my full time job and you know that that's an interesting one. I think a big part of that is just being organized, being organized and using software. Super important to have a system of software. But what other comments do you all have on that? You know, I just one more thing before you jump in. You know, one of the things people need to understand is look, there is a, you know, number one, don't have too many markets, three to five markets, because the ease or difficulty of management comes with having more markets. Right. Three to five. You can remember in your Head what you've kind of got going on. So I think that's a good number. But also, you know, having systems and understanding that if, if you're going to buy like one or two investment properties, you're just going to have a couple of properties. But if you're going to take this on like a professional investor, if you will, and you plan to get a dozen properties or two or three or four dozen properties like some of our clients, you know, you got to understand you're starting a business. You need an extra filing cabinet, you need software, you need to think about how you, you're going to be organized like a business. Right. And you're, you're basically a professional investor. So just understand that going in. But who, who was talking a moment ago? Was that Evan?

It was narration question, so I'm gonna assume it was Naresh.

No. Well, I know it was Naresh's question, but I, maybe he needs answers from the whole group for his clients.

Yeah, I was just gonna say there are two different sides of it. And I know Jason, and many of the listeners have heard Jason talking about self management, but me personally, I own eight properties and I don't self manage. I use the property managers that we recommend to our network and it works out for me just fine for other people, they've had bad experiences with property managers and there are a bunch of podcast episodes on how you can self manage. I think Lisa self manages, I think Adam self manages. They can talk a little bit more about that. But I love my property managers and they make my life a lot easier when it comes to management, dealing with tenants, leasing, even taxes, because they're keeping track of the financials and I can just download the reports, send it to my accountant. So it is, to answer the question, it's not a full time job to manage more than five properties if you allocate your time properly and resources.

And here's the interesting thing. So Naresh likes his. He actually said he loves his managers. That's a rare thing. Glad to hear it, Naresh.

I like my managers.

I have two that I like.

Now, now, now. I hope this isn't just like the typical new romance, that you only like them a lot in the beginning and then after a while they wear on you. But, but no, been going a while. I mean, you know, these property managers are a few years old, right?

Yeah. Yeah.

Well, like you said, you have, you have your ups and downs. It's, it's not a fruitful relationship 100 of the time, but overall, if you look at how much the down, you compare the downs to the ups. It's like, okay, it's, it's okay. To me, it's better than spending more time self managing.

Well, and sometimes it takes a while. I mean, unfortunately, like Adam, right. You've just switched over in Memphis and you found a good property manager. And so sometimes it might, you might bounce from 1 to 2. You don't want that, but you know, you might end up laying the jackpot on that.

Yeah. I would say looking at the time that you were talking about, let's say three, let's say you have, I have three markets, so let's just go with three markets right now. I would say from the time that I spend downloading the financials for the month, looking those over, maybe emailing the property manager if there were any issues and hearing back from them, maybe even making a phone call, whatever those things are, and talking with them on the phone, I'm spending maybe 30 minutes up, potentially an hour a month per market. So I mean, realistically, it's not something, something that you should be spending a ton of time on. I mean, it's something if you're spending more than an hour a month on the phone with them consistently or on the emails with them, something's wrong. Something's really wrong if you're doing that.

Yeah, that's good. And, and you know, Lisa took her self management on pretty early in her investing game and I, I think she really took the bull by the horns. I gotta tell you, the property, you know, I'm going to convert more of my stuff to self management. I got to get a little more organized myself. You know, I feel like I spend time running the business and doing for clients, but not myself. You know, it's shoemaker, no shoes concept. But I think the self management is easier actually. You know, now it depends on your property manager. Depends on the property, depends on the tenant. There are dynamic things here. But Lisa, how has it been for you since you've started self managing?

A lot easier. I think I spent.

And Lisa, can you come closer to your microphone?

I think I spend maybe so property self management has become a lot easier than having a property manager. For me, I think I spend maybe 15 minutes a month just doing my book, including a property shopper, sorry, property tracker. And the. When I have problems with my. So I still have a property manager and then I self manage in a different market and when I have problems with my property manager, it's always been faster for me to just solve it myself. Like Find the vendor, whoever it needs to be, let that vendor schedule it with the tenant. Then I get the pictures, I get all the communication I need. I get the before and after. It's just a lot easier to do it myself than it is to rely on somebody else's account because you never even get to talk to the person who's doing the work. When you have a property manager, right, you just get some sort of receipt that said, I don't know, unclog the kitchen sink and then they charge you $250 for that. And that doesn't make sense.

Yeah, yeah, there's a lot of rip offs out there. And, and you know, one of the other things, and this might sound really minor and silly, but I just love that on my self managed, I get, I get my rent, I see it come in. I don't wait 15 or 20 days to find out whether or not the rent came in or not. I'm just a huge fan of self management. You know, I don't like having that intermediary party in the middle in the way. But I think everybody's heard me say that enough. You know, I'm a big believer and I'm going to convert more and more of my properties to self management. I'll give you another example. One of my properties in Florida got a little bit of hurricane damage, you know, and you know, the property manager who's been really good, I've had them for, I don't know, 15 years. They're quite good. And you know, I've always been happy with them. They're like emailing me and it's like I have to decipher their emails. The communication is just bad, you know. I said, you know, what are you actually asking me to do here? Are you asking me to file an insurance claim? What are you asking me for? I don't understand what you're. What you want me to do. And, and then they're like, well, read our newsletter. I'm like, I don't want to read your stupid newsletter. I just want you to tell me what you want. You know, I don't have an hour to read your newsletter and it was pretty long by the way. So. Yeah, I just, I'm a, I'm a big fan of self management. But anyway, you know, enough. Enough said there. Probably we got to get to some listener comments too, but let's go. Oh, Naresh, it looks like you've got. Well, I can't do that right now, so. Because you posted a. The other question is, how come no properties are available on your website. Well, obviously there's a huge lack of inventory. And look, folks, you got to be working with one of our team members to find property. Now. It's very hard to just go to the website and find it because the properties move too quickly. Also, subscribe to the Property Stream podcast. Maybe you want to comment on that on both of those things first.

Yeah. Well, first off, it's called PropertyCast.

Oh, PropertyCast. Sorry. I'm thinking live stream.

If you go and search for Property Stream, you won't find anything. Yeah, the property Cast is just a podcast feed that down that sends you the PDFs of the properties. Unfortunately, right now it's not very active, just because, as we mentioned, there hasn't been a ton of inventory. But whenever it does come available, you'll get it pretty quick after they're uploaded. So it's still.

They'll be sold on you when you get them.

Yeah, it's still not a substitute for working with us because as I mentioned, they go quickly. And so, I mean, Honestly, it's probably 12 hours behind. Well, actually, by the time it posted and we get the notification and every. And they're uploaded still probably 12 to 18 hours. And so a lot of them are gone in that time anyway.

But you can use that, like Adam said earlier, use what you see and Sarah said those numbers. Okay. You know, you're going to get this amount of return in Alabama compared to Florida. And then when you're ready to pull the trigger, you know what to expect.

Yeah, you can look at each market and see, okay, you know, Memphis is getting this many coming in on a regular basis. Alabama is getting this many on a regular basis. These are the numbers I should expect in those markets. You know, what are they looking like? So even if you're not planning to buy tomorrow, you can at least get a feel for what each market is bringing and generating.

This might be a great example, folks. So, Naresh, in our spreadsheet here, Naresh.

Post what each market is bringing.

I. I don't know if you can hear me or not, but Naresh posted this and wanted to talk about this property, I think, on the. On the live stream today. And it's. Naresh, was this not sold, not in escrow when you shared that link?

So the reason. The reason why I shared that link, it was an escrow, but there are several more of exact or very, very similar properties, same price, same square footage that are going to be coming out within the next couple of weeks according to the seller. So that's why I included this. It's just they haven't, they're not ready to upload it to our system yet.

Okay, got it, got it. So anyway, this one boasts an over a projected overall return on investment of 33%. It's 200 and I'll just round up $235,000 subject to qualifying at 25% down. It'll take you about, you know, $68,000 to buy it. And the projected cash on cash return is 8% annually. So even if you're waiting for the bubble to pop, if you think that's going to happen. And by the way, I just got back from a week long conference in Tampa and I actually did that RT interview you saw in the intro video from my hotel room there. And one of the, I gave two presentations there and one of them was on are we in a bubble? And I think I'm going to take that and turn it into a webinar because I really did a deep analysis into the true cost of real estate today versus back to 1976, back to 1984 and back to 2006, which many consider to be the last peak of the market. And property is actually cheaper today. That'll amaze most people, but you adjust for interest rates and inflation and wow, it's pretty amazing. It really is. It really is. But okay. Any other comments on that before we move on?

Yeah, just back to the inventory. You really, I know, Adam said, you know, okay, if you're not looking to buy now and get, you know, familiar with the markets and that's all great advice. But if you are looking to invest now, you need to opt into our system and get an investment counselor if you already have one. You know, we're sending out hot sheets almost every week, sometimes daily. If we get a surprise property, you need to get on the phone and call your investment counselor because we're talking to these sellers every single day. We're hunting down inventory. Literally we had a record breaking September, more inventory than we we ever had and moved more inventory than we ever have. And you know what? Last week we sold all the properties. Next week we're going to be on the phone getting more deals for you guys. So just opt in to the website. You'll get assigned an investment counselor and we will fight to get you deals. That's what we're here for. We're here to help you.

So by the way, I'll just echo that for you, Sarah. You know, Covid has caused what I talked about back in February Something called supply demand shock. Okay. Which is a really unusual economic phenomenon. And I'm experiencing supply demand shock now. My car lease is up next month and I can't buy a darn car. I mean, not in the color and the combination I want. Right. Which is not exactly weird. I'm not looking for a funky colored car or anything. You know, I'm just looking for a very standard color and fully loaded car. There's like nothing for sale. It's something. We have huge shortages. You know, the factories were closed and I, I had to place an order for a 2021 model and they don't even know when I'll have it. It might be February.

You should have your rental car for.

A while because the rental cars are plentiful.

Yeah, yeah. Well, Hertz went bankrupt and I, I did look at their, their pre owned rental cars, but didn't find anything I liked. What were you saying, Adam?

Oh, I was saying it sounds like our Florida construction. You can buy it now. And it was on it whenever it's done.

Exactly. Whatever it's done. Here's another property, by the way. This is one that Evan posted and this is in Talladega, Alabama. So Talladega Nights, right? Remember the movie? And Evan, this one also says in escrow. Was this one available when you shared this link in our spreadsheet?

No, it wasn't. We sold all of those. But we've got more coming at the end of October out. That's been one of our best markets. And the reason, I mean Alabama, the job growth. There's so many jobs moving to that part of Alabama and we've got a great builder there and they, you know, they have a corporate lease.

So.

Our purchasers are, you know, making money on day one. So, you know, fulfills, I think it's commandment number five, your property should make sense the day you buy it. And so I've had, you know, my clients who purchased there have just been thrilled, but we're getting more. So this is another, this is another reason kind of what Sarah just said is that if you have your criteria, you need to be working with us and you need to be ready to go because these homes go quickly. I had a client who was ready to purchase one and he just wanted to take the weekend to talk about it with his wife and he lost it. I, you know, and I was, you know, we're going to get another form, but there is a sense of urgency and you know, we're not, we're not making this up. This is real this is the real deal.

And, and one thing that's gonna bum you out, folks, if you, you know, take the weekend to talk about it, etc, like that example, you know, your, the next one may well be $3,000 more. Okay, so just, just know that that's coming.

Well, this Talladega one, if you bought it three or four months ago, was $10,000 cheaper.

Okay, so now, now it's 129 9. So this is a really, this is at the very much lower end of the range. And this is new construction. I mean that's almost unheard of. Like you can't, you can't, you can't touch this. What's that song? Get touches.

Showing your age on your birthday.

What is that, an 80s song? I think it is, yeah.

That was the late 80s, I think, maybe early 90s at most.

All right, so this one, let's just talk about this one for a second. Again, not available, but the next one will be similar. It might be a little more expensive.

Jason, there's two of these coming online. They'll be done October 15th. Okay, so October 15th. So they're available for contract. There's two of these coming online.

Clients got one of them. I call it now.

We're fighting over right here on the air, folks. Right here. Okay, let me, let me just tell the viewers about this property for a second. Okay, so one 29 nine subject to qualifying at 25% down. It'll take about $38,000 to buy it. And projected rent is 995 per month. So not quite the 1%, but not bad. And overall cash on cash return projected at 7% annually. Overall return on investment projected at 33% annually. And what I always say is, is it if it even goes half as well as projected. Okay, if it only goes half as well as projected, you're gonna make what, 16.5% annually. Right? Not bad. Not bad, right? So keep that in mind. Okay. Okay, let's move on.

Hey, Jason, you need to take comments and questions.

We got to. Sorry, go ahead.

I was saying you need to take some questions. There's a bunch of them lining up.

Let's. Adam, do you want to. You're really good at this. Do you want to start popping some of those off here?

Yeah, let me to the top and see who's first.

Let's see, Adam has media training, so he's being like a co host.

Jeff Jones says that he wants to do a cash out refi in Memphis, buy a short term rental in on the Big Island. Of Hawaii. Is it a bubble in Hawaii?

Oh, yeah, don't do Hawaii.

And by the way, Hawaii, low property taxes.

Yeah, well, Hawaii has some additional weird problems with COVID Hawaii is like super ice. And you know, anytime there's an island. I'll give you an example. At our event a year, well, almost two years ago now, profits in paradise in Hawaii. It was the only Hawaii event we've ever done. You know, I, I couldn't bring my dog. My dog's been to 18 countries and I didn't, you know, Hawaii is like really difficult. And now with COVID Hawaii is just super strict. And Hawaii is too expensive. It's too liberal, it's too tenant friendly and it's too expensive. But I want to just shoot this over to Evan to talk about his short term rental. He is killing it with this one. He just told me this morning. Now this is in St. Augustine, Florida. So you're completely at the other end of the country. But Evan, wow, you, you said to me this morning, you sent me a voxer message saying that your short term rental is like a life changing deal. It's so good. I think it is.

I, you know, of course I've only owned it for, you know, almost a year. Just about short term rental for Hawaii too. I have a client who has a short term rental in Maui and he has just been killed by Covid. I mean, his, his, you know, the.

Whole summer was gone.

You're so much at the mercy. The HOA fees are crazy, so we definitely wouldn't recommend that. But on the other hand, as Jason said that the St. Augustine is great Airbnb. So what happened was reason it's so great is I was able to refinance down to a 2.875% which I can't believe how good that is. But there's actually been a huge surge in these kind of short term rentals that are near big cities where people can just go and work from there. Like I've got someone who's staying there a month. You know, they go, they work, they've got good wi fi. It's, it's, it's, you know, near a generally big city with Jacksonville. But it is, yeah, it's really been a life changing investment because, you know, it closed before COVID so the value has risen and it's just in a great location. So it's a more conservative kind of Airbnb. Now Jason sort of warned us that these like big fancy Airbnbs, you know, in Hawaii or in Miami, those you pay so much money for them and there's so many regulations. The kind of short term rentals we have are under $500,000. They're relatively linear markets, or they're near linear markets. And so they really make sense. And I couldn't be happier.

Yeah. So let me just comment on that for a moment. You know, Airbnb has mostly, I think for most Airbnb hosts, it's been a disaster with COVID Okay. It's. I mean, I can tell you I've talked to a lot of Airbnb short term rental people that have just been really hurt. They've been hit hard, so I feel very badly for them. But they were doing great for a long time. But again, you know, taking a vacation is not a necessity. Okay. If things get really bad, vacation is optional. Right. So that's one thing. But, but the, the distinction, I think, is that a short term rental property that's not too terribly expensive, that's in a low density environment that offers a drivable vacation, it's got to be drivable, not requiring getting on an airplane. And that's another problem with Hawaii for most people aren't in Hawaii. And you know, you're in Hawaii in one place, you're probably not likely to vacation in another place in Hawaii as much. Right. But if you can drive to it and you can obtain a truly different experience than where you live, like St. Augustine, our only short term rental market we've ever done provides a legitimately very different experience from Atlanta and Chicago. Or sorry, not Chicago, Atlanta and Orlando. Okay. Which is where a lot of those people come from. They just drive from Atlanta or Orlando to St. Augustine. And so, you know that, that's why I think that market has just done so well. So good stuff. Okay, Adam, you want to get another question in?

Yeah. Tyler Lawson says, how will your investing strategies change depending on who wins the presidency? I don't think this one is going to be as big a deal as people are making it out to be. I know there's the concern about Joe Biden eliminating the 1031 tax deferred exchange, but that's a big long road for him to try to take. It's a great talking point if he wants to make it. But getting all of Congress to sign off on it and getting it through all the lobbyists and all of the, you know, you would, it would take, it would take a whole lot to get it done, and it would be a process that you would see coming down the road a long way.

Yeah, yeah. Well, and that's a good point that you make, Adam, by the way, that wasn't all from the viewer. That was from. That was your commentary. Yeah.

The question was from the viewer.

Yeah. Make sure you distinguish that. Okay. But you know, look at income, property and real estate have a giant lobby. They have the largest trade organization in the world, the national association of realtors, almost 1.5 million members, I think are maybe 1.3, something like that huge lobbying organization and many others that it's always been this kind of sacred cow. Okay. So don't worry too terribly much about them attacking real estate. You know, they'll try and you know, it is what it is. But, but any other thoughts, folks, on changing strategy based on the presidential election? You know, Adam went specifically to 1031 exchange, but there's way more to it than that.

I have a question for you, Jason, based on that. So I recently refined, or I am refinancing one of my properties, and I've talked to various lenders within that company that's doing the refinance, and almost every single one of them has told me we need to do the refinance before the election. And I said, why? And they said, because there's a very high possibility that interest rates are going to go up if Joe Biden wins. I don't know why. I thought maybe you could comment on that. I didn't necessarily agree with them, but maybe you have some thoughts.

Yeah, look, you know, I mean, I hope Biden does not win, I'll put it that way. But, you know, it's pretty weird what's going on. I mean, we've got, we got a president and first lady with COVID in an election in what, 30 days. So this is who, you know, things could go all kinds of directions right now. It's really a strange time. But, but, you know, no one wants things to be bad on their watch. Right. And one of the sort of easy things to do, well, two of them are to keep the pressure on the Fed to keep interest rates low, number one, and number two, to just spend money and have stimulus. And you know, Democrats spend more than Republicans, but they're almost the same now. I mean. Yeah, like, look at Adam, the Democrat or one Democrat here, probably. I don't know.

They don't. I mean, you look at, look at the tax cut the Republicans did that was spending 1.5 trillion.

I listen, that's. They're pretty much. Okay. Okay.

But Jason, what, what about the stock market? If Biden is elected, the stock market.

Will not Be good if Biden's elected. Because that's what I think is a good point. You know, the general thinking is that, that Democrats are bad for business, Republicans are good for business. And you know, when you saw the Trump election, the stock market went crazy and so did the real estate market. And the whole.

We never know.

The stock market likes predictability, you know, and so if they think Biden's going, I mean, remember when Trump, when it was indicated he was going to win the election, the market plunged temporarily, 1,000 points and then it came back up in the next couple days. So I think right now the market may be adjusting if they think Biden's going to win. I mean, I don't know. I'm not, I think in the long term stock market, but I don't know about the short term.

All right, well, going back to the whole taxes and real estate, as this applies to real estate, just look at the properties that we have available on our website. Alabama, Florida, Tennessee, these aren't. We don't have any properties in California or New York or these ultra regulated states for a reason. Because it's very difficult to invest in real estate in ultra left wing Democratic Jason calls socialist states. So if someone like Kamala Harris, who's currently senator of California, becomes president, because that's a very. Really, it's not about Biden. It's probably about Kamala Harris three years down the line.

Well, no, it's not three years. It's two months, Naresh. Oh, okay. You know, Kamala Harris will be president two months after Biden's in office as Biden is declared. You know, I saw a funny thing today. This is obviously anti Biden. It said Joe Biden for president, but they crossed out the P and it was resident of a nursing home. I thought it was pretty good, so.

I had to look it up because y' all were talking about it. Historically, a Democrat has been a president. The S and p has averaged 14.9% per year. When a Republican is a president, it's 9.1%. Okay.

I'm not doubting the stock market. I'm just talking about real estate. And we're getting a lot of comments here saying good point, race, good point. Exactly the point that I'm making.

Something that's a good point, Adam.

The main point is it's very difficult to do real estate investing in, in Democratic states. Very, very difficult. And just look at our website.

So the insiders win in the Democratic state where they like in Chicago. I mean, you can make a lot of money. But it's the insiders, the people who are connected to the politicians. I'm sure the same is true in la. It's the insiders.

Yeah. The crony capitalist crooks. Yeah, no question. Yeah, absolutely. Okay, Adam, you want to keep going with questions and comments. Make sure you read comments, too, okay? Just make sure you get everybody.

Digital Life's about to make your head explode. Digital Life says, should I continue to be a cash buyer? I've had no debt since 1980. To think I've had a. To think I'd have a mortgage is somewhat foreign. What are your thoughts? Cash or finance? Jason, would you like to explode?

Don't do that. Digital Life. Refinance your properties. Pull that equity out. It puts you in a safer position. It's. It's counterintuitive. I get it. You know, but look at. Just listen to the podcast, the Creating wealth podcast. Watch the other videos on the YouTube channel. There is very rarely a reason to have a lot of equity in a property. You know, income, as I always say, income. Property is the best asset class, but it's not a very good bank. You're using it as a bank. Okay. And you'll be much safer, better off, have more tax benefits, have lower risk. Counterintuitively, if you leverage your properties and with. With money this cheap. Go get some free money. Go get some free money. Seriously. And so I've got a comment on that.

So I. I recommend people look up Alex Rodriguez real estate. Alex Rodriguez made, I think over half a billion dollars through endorsements and salary playing in Major League Baseball. And he's a real estate investor. This is a guy who has a lot of cash, obviously. And he does an interview about leverage and how he finances all of his real estate properties. Not just single family, but he does multifamily, probably a little bit of commercial.

I'm going to get on your case for not putting a link to that video in our content group.

I think you posted it many years ago.

Oh, well, okay, never mind.

I'll post it in the comments right here.

Please do.

But.

But to Digital Life. First off, congratulations for having a lot of cash on hand and not, you know, just doing well, but there are so many tasks, tax benefits, there's so many just benefits in general to using leverage that we talk about on our website. Jason hartman.com on the podcast. I'm going to go ahead and post. I'm going to find that link and you guys can check it out in the comment section.

Good stuff. Okay, Anybody else on that one?

Well, I would say even if you look at refinancing and it comes out to be where you can buy two or three properties and your cash flow ends up the same, you've obviously, you've already diversified your risk. You know, you've diversified the risk of if something's vacant, you're still making money from your other two properties or one property or whatever. And then you've also got your mortgage write offs, your interest write offs on your taxes. So it just the benefits of refinancing and getting more properties far outweigh the, the risk of a mortgage payment and that you're going to have in money.

The mortgage payment's not a risk, it's, it lowers your risk to have a mortgage payment. That's the counterintuitive irony of the whole thing and all time to go into that. So, you know, just, it's on the podcast on the YouTube channel.

Go ahead, Refi till you die.

Forbearance. Did anyone who owned, I mean, we didn't recommend forbearance for people, but it's if you needed it, what if you had all your properties paid for in cash? Forbearance didn't benefit you at all. But if you had big mortgages you could have, you know, you could delay payments for a year. Now under the stimulus that all the adjacent. You talked about that, that all the benefits always go to the people who have more leverage. So take advantage of that.

Yeah, it's not necessarily fair folks, but it's the way the world works. So get in the leverage position. Adam, we got a ton of stuff.

To get through and said and agreed with you. Toby's obviously been listening for a while. He responded with definitely leverage finance. It's free money at these rates. Dan S wants to know what are some system or software that you use to manage homes out of state.

Adam, are you reading these in order by the way? Because.

I'm at 10:25am Jason, we're okay.

Okay, great. Okay, go ahead. So what's the question?

Dan wants to know what are the systems and softwares that you use to manage homes out of State?

Property Tracker PropertyTracker.com is excellent and I like it so much I bought the company. So it's like kind of like the Hair Club for men commercial. I like it so much I bought the company. They show the guy bald and he's got a hair. That's, that's the kind of company I need to buy because it's definitely getting thin. But yeah, so property tracker and then we did for our empowered investor Inner circle group. And you can talk to any of our team members about joining that. We did a special webinar just for them the week before last. I guess it was now on another software that we really, really like. So, you know, talk to them about it. You can watch that video replay and we might do a webinar with that one as well. Okay, Adam.

And then Dan also asked, how do you remote show the houses, the tenants? And this is, this goes back to the hybrid model that Jason's talked about a lot. And it, you can hire a la carte people or either a real estate agent or a property management company, they'll show your property, they'll find you a tenant, you still have to pay them your lease up fee, but you don't have to do the, the work of actually getting a tenant.

Adam, where are you reading the comments? Are you reading them off our internal software in the studio or off, I'm.

Reading them off the, in the, in the chat here on our internal one. And Dan asked us at 10:26am Are.

You deleting them after you're reading them?

Nope, I can't do that.

I don't, I don't have them back to 1026.

Oh well, I scrolled.

Yeah, they, they only go back to 1101 for me.

That's because you're in Florida.

Sorry. So 30 minutes ago Dan asked, how do you, how do you remote show the houses to tenants? Okay, but Jason, your mom fully self manages. How does she do it?

Well, she's an extreme. Do it yourself. Or by the way, I wouldn't follow that example. She literally leases the properties up herself. But we recommend a hybrid self management approach where you have a real estate agent or a property manager working on an a la carte basis not fully managing your property, but you have them do the tenant turn, meaning they do the walkthrough with the old tenant, they send you pictures, they get the old tenant out, they find a new tenant, they check their credit, they do the screening, they do the walkthrough, they help you coordinate any repairs or improvements that need to be done in between. And you know what you're going to find when you're self managing? You're going to find your tenants treat your properties better almost always. And if they don't, they will give up part of their security deposit and understand why they did it. Okay. Whereas with property managers, they just won't even take any part of the security deposit. It seems like a lot of the times because they're trying to serve two masters, you know. So anyway, that's just another point on self management. But use a real estate agent or a property manager on an a la carte basis to handle the tenant turn so you never go to the property. Okay. And I've done that for many years. It's worked, it works great.

And there's show your property, they'll find you a tenant. You still have to pay them your lease up fee but you don't have to.

There's several other options out there. So just reach out to your investment counselor. We'll send you the links. Whether you want to compare rent, do.

The work of actually getting a tenant.

Adam, where are you reading the comments? Are you reading them off our internal software in the of state studio or office?

I'm reading them off the, in the, in the chat here on our internal one and Dan asked us at 10:26am.

Are you deleting or look at the.

Market a different way? Compare numbers. If you join the real estate empowered investor Network. You know we compare investors compare prices of plumbers to in Memphis to this to that. So reach out to us and we'll connect you with more information.

Good, good stuff.

I have a comment to make Digital Life talking about their question on, on debt they said. All right, so long Dave Ramsey. Jason, you've, you've talked quite a bit about Dave Ramsey on your show. I just want to say that Dave Ramsey's program, when he talks about debt, he's not specific. He's not talking about real estate debt or mortgage debt, which is different.

Actually Naresh, he is, he doesn't like any debt. Okay. He doesn't even like real estate debt. Believe it or not. He's crazy on that. Okay. He's right about like for Dave Ramsey's market. He's good for getting people out of stupid consumer debt and all that stuff. He's just wrong about investing. He's not, you know, you, you need look at if you're, if you're, if you don't have credit card debt and you don't have like stupid debt and you've got your act together, you need to graduate from Dave Ramsey school. Okay. He's fine for the market he serves but yeah, no rush. I thought like you in the beginning but he doesn't like any debt even on real estate. So he's just, he's just clueless about that. Dave Ramsey is.

Jason, my, my daughter, you know, my daughter's and she's a senior in high school and I just had to order a Dave Ramsey book for her financial class. And we were in the car yesterday, and she was telling me about it, and she, like, she loves the class. And I'm like, that's great. Like, this is so great that they're teaching you this so great that they're teaching you this at, you know, age 17. I said, but when. When you get into your young twenties, I'll teach you about real estate investing. So it's a great. I think it's. Dave Ramsey is a great foundation for people to have agreed, manage their money, but not for the long term. You know, buy and hold investment. And I think Dave Ramsey said he got burned in real estate years ago.

Yeah. Yeah, he did. I had his number two guy on the show years ago, and he just didn't know what he was talking about, honestly, you know, he wasn't following your plan. He doesn't get it. By the way, I wanted to say thank you to everybody for all the nice birthday wishes and comments. Adam, I don't know if you've gotten to those yet. There's nice testimonials in there. So.

Yeah, so Robert said, happy birthday, Jason, you're a great person. A tremendous blessing to all of us who listen to your expert advice.

Thank you.

Ultimate bargain says I focus on cash. On cash return and debt coverage ratio. Debt coverage ratio isn't a number. We go into ton with the network. But it's very, very important. If you're looking at getting a loan, you know you've got them after you're reading them. Nope, I can't do that.

I don't. I don't have them. Back to 1026.

Oh, well, I scrolled.

Yeah, they. They only go back to 1101.

That's because you're in Florida.

Sorry. So 30 minutes ago, Dan asked, how do you. How do you remote show the houses to tenants?

Okay. All right.

But, Jason, your lenders that won't lend to. On investment properties, where the number, I believe the one I've seen the Most is about 1.2. I forget the exact formula that it takes. I have it written down somewhere, but.

I'll speak on that for a second. So the debt coverage ratio, I like to call it the how likely it is I'll ever get into trouble with that property ratio. Okay. You know, I always have these, like, simple, funny names for stuff. And on the debt coverage ratio, what Adam's saying is, is the lower it is, the worse it is, the more likely it is you'll get into trouble.

One is break even.

Yeah. One is break even. And he's saying that lenders don't want to see that debt coverage ratio fall below 1.2. Now, just to give you a comparison on the property in Florida that we just talked about, we showed it on the screen a few minutes ago. The debt coverage ratio on that one is 1.52. So that's very good. The likelihood of you getting into trouble there is very unlikely. The other property in Talladega, the debt coverage ratio was 1.49, also very good. So there you go. If your credit, we'll have others.

If your credit and income are good enough to qualify for the loan, that house will get approved every day of the week. Twice on Sunday. If it's there.

Twice on Sunday. Is that like a saying? That's funny. I like that.

That's a Southern saying.

Okay, Adam, y' all keep reading.

Art and paper says happy birthday. Jason, you look good. What is your birthday wish?

My birthday wish is. I don't know. Which one should I pick? Well, I, I, I'd like to find a wife and have some kids. That's the one thing I really just haven't done in my life, so. Well, not, not happening very quickly for me, that's for sure.

But kids ain't cheap. Yeah, we got, we want to have.

Neither are wives.

Not yet.

What was that one Carrie said?

Don't and don't get an au pair just yet.

Yeah, folks, Evan, here's how rich our team members are. Evan has an au pair and Carrie just got an au pair too.

Fully self manages. How does she do it?

Well, she's an extreme do it yourselfer, by the way. I wouldn't follow that example. She literally leases the properties up herself. But we recommend a hybrid one.

He's helping me get one.

Oh, okay. Yeah, I'm too rich. You know, Let me tell you a funny story about that, by the way. This is funny. So these clients and friends of mine from many years ago, I will not mention the name because this person is rather famous, you know, in, in business famous. And not a celebrity grid self management approach where you have a real estate agent or a property manager, but a business celebrity, if you will. And they were, you know, getting older and they were like this professional power couple. And they used to live next to me in Orange county. And I remember I sold that house for them and sold a bunch of their others, their investment properties. Working on an a la carte basis, not fully managing your property. And they thought, you know, maybe we better have a kid. We're getting older and they started and they thought, you know, we're both like professional power couple. You know, we're not, we're gonna need a nanny. Okay. Or an au pair. And so they started looking at, you know, looking at catalogs of au pairs and nannies and they, they started looking at all, you know, they'd have like a picture and they'd have their profile and their information and all this stuff. And, you know, you pick one out of here and so the wife says, you know, these nannies and au pairs are just too good looking. I think we ought to skip this and just get a boat. She didn't want to have some hot young nanny around her husband.

You know, I was telling Carrie this. We, we talk a lot about inflation, and people say there's no inflation. I, we first got an au pair five or six years ago. The initial fee was like 3, 500. Now the initial fee is like $9,000.

That's like a one time fee or per month.

What do you mean one time fee? And then you pay the. But I think part of inflation and some of it's just like the immigration laws and how things have changed, but they're really, you know, I shared an article with the group, the Wall Street Journal had an article that there is a lot of inflation in things that matter. Oh, you know, things are refined. And this is just another proof of that.

Well, I, I can tell you my son was born in January pre virus. And from January to where we are in October, the cost of a nanny has gone from here in Florida anywhere from 10 to 15 dollars an hour to 20 to 25 dollars an hour. And that's. I think it's, I think it's clearly a supply issue. A lot of nannies are saying, you know, I don't want to come to some stranger's house and take care of people.

Yeah, interesting. Yeah. No, there's definitely inflation. Okay. Adam.

Yeah.

Tyler Lawson says I can't wait to buy a property. I'm so close to paying off my business loan. Hopefully I'll be buying a couple properties a year to start and then bump it up as cash flow increases. So. Congratulations, Tyler. Digital Life says I've heard property values can't stay high with immigration opening up. True or false? I don't see how. Immigration opening up and having more people enter the market for properties.

Would you have them do the tenant turn? Meaning they do the walkthrough with the old tenant. They send you pictures, they get the old tenant out, they find a new tenant, they check their credit they do the screening, they do the walkthrough, they help you coordinate any repairs.

Hurt property values.

Yeah. Folks, in the next 30 years, if you, if you get a 30 year mortgage today, okay, your, your tenant is going to pay it off because that's who pays your mortgage in 2050. Okay. Three decades from now and there will be at least 80 million more people in the United States by the time.

That mortgage ends and there will be zero more land.

Yeah, good point, Adam. Zero more land. Yes. In fact, if Al Gore is right, there's going to be a lot less land because the oceans are going to rise and you know, we're going to have coastal property in Phoenix. Gary, you're going to be on the beach soon. Improvements that need to be done in between. And you know what you're going to find when you're self managing? You're going to find your tenants.

But Obama was supposed to stop the oceans from rising.

That's true. I know.

Yeah.

That song Oceanfront Property and might become true.

Yeah, there you go. All right.

There's an important question here that, that.

I just wanted Naresh, don't go out of order though. Let's just go in order. Okay.

Digital Life also wants to know thoughts on furnace short term rentals. I think we, I mean short term rentals are going to have to be furnished and we kind of covered the, the market. So I don't know if anybody else has anything to say on that. See, Brent Cook says Hawaii is busy killing the golden goose tourism. Let's see. Sorry, something just updated and moved down. Brent Cook also said refi till you die.

Hi Brand.

Yeah, all Colin Moran says happy birthday Jason. Thanks to you and Sarah and all the others for all that you do.

Hi Khan.

Thanks Khan.

Someone wants to set up their sister with Jason.

Yeah, that was the important, that was the important.

20 minutes ago Bill Brown said.

Good point for Instagram.

Let's see, we've got all me said Adam, what about investing in surrounds of Austin? Are there possibilities? We actually Lisa and I had a conversation with the potential provider in Texas, including the surrounding Austin areas, San Antonio, that kind of stuff. When it comes to investing in Austin at the moment, you're gonna, I mean no, but you're gonna have to go down to like Kyle and Buda which is about 20 or 30 minutes outside from downtown Austin without traffic. It's 20 to 30 minutes.

Selling in Kyle.

Yeah. Or you're gonna have to go east out to Dell Valley or farther and I mean even those properties are getting expensive. You can't go north. North has gotten crazy. You can't go west. There's nothing really there. And what is there is getting really expensive. You can't even go southwest. There used to be Dripping Springs and that was reasonable. It's now as expensive as Austin almost. It's up around like $400,000 for an entry point house. And then after that you're out in the hill country. So there's nothing there. So there's just fewer and fewer places that actually make sense around here. So the providers we're looking at are in are outside of San Antonio, a little bit farther south. But you're kind of somewhat out of the Austin market by the time you get where you're going to be able to build.

Keep going.

Con Moran said Narration Exactly.

Your properties better almost always. And if they don't, they will give up part of their security.

So we're to the point where narration is bragging. Brent Cook refi till you die. SCSU 300 says put me down for one of those Talladega or Florida new builds. I don't know who that is. But you have an investment counselor then.

Yeah. Hope maybe one of your counselors is here. We're not sure. But if not, be sure to go to jasonartman.com or pandemic investing.com by the way, we should talk about our event coming up, folks. We have an event coming up online event. Pandemic Investing Conference online. Our first one coming up in just like 13 days I think, right? Yeah, yeah.

And basically your picture will be here on this screen.

It's the same deposit and understand why they did it. Okay. Whereas with property managers, they just won't even take any part of the security deposit. It seems like a lot of the times because they're trying to serve two masters, you know. So anyway, that's just another point on.

Self management concept except for all of our investors are here together and you get to actually ask your questions.

Well, and that at Meet the Masters, the conference less than two months ago, those Talladega properties, those investors were the ones that got the 10,000 last prize they were 119,000 and now they're 129. So sign up, register. There might be more exclusive properties at this event.

Good point, good stuff. So there's the link pandemic investing.com There's a free book there, but you can also register for the event. Go ahead.

Robert Hernandez says Democrats are horrible for small business owners and entrepreneurs with all the regulations. Ken McElroy just said around 50% of small businesses close down for good.

I'm surprised you were willing to read that question.

I'm glad you were.

Kim M. Says, what do you guys think about modular houses?

Okay, so I'll just speak on that for a second. I think they're great, but they have a stigma, unfortunately. And I don't think they should have a stigma. I think it's an unfair stigma. But it is the way it is. That's the perception. People don't like them. And hopefully society will overcome that because I think it's an unfair stigma. Go ahead, Sarah.

Do I recall you telling me one time that loan on modular housing can be really hard, or am I making that up?

Banks have the same thing.

It was the other one.

The prefab. Or no, I don't remember.

I can't think of.

But use a real estate agent or a property manager on an a la carte basis to handle the tenant term.

The name I saw somewhere in the comments. Manufactured houses. Yeah, I just had a client try and buy one years ago and the lender wouldn't finance it.

Yeah.

Okay, so cash deal.

Come closer to your mic, Sarah.

Oh, I'm sorry. I had a client try and buy one years ago, but they couldn't get financing.

Okay, Adam, go ahead. So you never go to the property. Okay. And I've done that for many years. It's. It's worked. It works great.

And there's that.

Brent Cook says Ramsey must have amazing asset protection. I'm assuming that's because he has so much cash, actually, in the. In the deals.

Yeah.

Let's see. Tyler Lawson says, I used to be a fan of Dave Ramsey. Then I found Jason Hartman.

Good idea. Good idea.

And it just updated again because I guess I got too far behind.

Let's see, there's several other options out there, so just reach out to your investment counselor. We'll send you the links. Whether you want to compare rents or look at the market a different way, compare numbers. If you join the real estate empowered.

She says, happy birthday, my favorite person. Thank you so much for all the information you've always shared with your followers. Okay, go ahead, Adam. You can. Can pick up now.

Digital Life says, should I stay or should I go? Paid 275k cash in 2018. Can list for 419. Seems like I should sell.

You should sell? Yeah. Where? I don't know where that is, but that's. That's too expensive for rental property. You can. You can buy four rental properties. Three or four. Sell that. Yeah, good idea. 1031 Exchange. If it's a personal residence, you don't need to 1031, but 1031, exchange it if it's a rental property before Joe Biden takes the 10:31 away. We talked about that. And, and contact one of our team members and, and get a, get a whole rental portfolio for that. That's great.

Yeah. So art and paper needs to go to Jason hartman.com ask because he's saying, can I set Jason up with my sister?

Yeah, I know art. I know art on paper. I'll hook you guys up, quite literally.

Send me a Facebook or Instagram link, will you?

Okay, we have. What are your thoughts on Mexico?

No. Political instability, no civil rights, no good financing. Not a transparent market. You know, none of these foreign markets really seem to work that well. They sound attractive at first, but in reality they don't. They just don't work that well. So, yeah, we could be putting the questions on the screen. I just forgot about that. We haven't been doing that, you know, so here we can, you know, do that.

So I will say one of the things that I learned about Mexico reading the John Burns book is I hadn't realized that the economy has gotten good enough that we're actually seeing an outflow of Mexicans from the United States to Mexico because they came over here in order to be able to get a job and send money home. But we've been at a net loss for the last about 15, 10 to 15 years. So we're actually losing people to Mexico.

Every year that actually everybody's leaving California.

Yeah, that kind of surprises me, Adam. I bet there's a little more to that stat, but fine, I get that you're right about Mexico's economy getting Buster Network.

You know, we compare investors, compare prices of plumbers to better, but a lot.

Of that is largely because of NAFTA and with the Trump administration, you know, that's not going to be quite as good for them as it has been.

Well, it actually saw one of the articles I read said it didn't. The new agreement didn't work out quite as expected because it requires. It doesn't require that things be built in America, but it requires that workers get paid an average of $15 an hour. And so then what they discovered was companies didn't spend the millions and millions of dollars it takes to move it to the United States. They just up the salary of the Mexican workers. And now everybody in Mexico wants to work at their factories because they make more working there than anywhere else. So.

Okay, got it. Yeah, Interesting. But regardless of that, of any of that.

In Memphis, to this, to that. So reach out to us and we'll connect you with more information.

Good, Good stuff.

Okay, I have a comment to make. Digital Life talking about their question on.

And we look at folks, a lot of times, these questions really deserve a much longer answer. And that's why you got to listen to the podcast, the Creating wealth show, because we go in depth on. On issues there. And we've talked a lot about foreign investment. Not just Mexico, any foreign country. The United States is a very special real estate market for numerous reasons. Okay. So leave it at that. Listen to the podcast, the Creating Wealth Show. Adam, go ahead.

Tyler Lawson wants to know when you will have live events again.

We do. We have an event in 13 days. Pandemic investing.

They said live. When restrictions get lifted.

Yeah, maybe. But I got to tell you something. I like these virtual events. And at this live conference I just came from in Tampa, you know, a lot of those people host their own seminars, and they were all talking about how they now love virtual events because they're so much less expensive and so much easier to run. And, you know, hotel inflation has gone through the roof. You know, $120 a gallon for 12 cups of coffee. I mean, it's absurd what hotels charge, but that is a lesson, by the way, folks, the person who controls the real estate controls the whole game, okay? And that's what a hotel does. So, you know, we'll certainly have live events again, but, you know, who knows? It's not going to be soon. So join us virtually on Zoom in 13 days. Go to pandemicinvesting.com all right, and Brent.

Obviously been listening to you on the podcast and your live streams because he said, you mean the plandemic A pandemic.

Exactly.

And now we're all caught up. Digital Life says thank you from every fiber within.

On debt, they said. All right, so long, Dave Ramsey.

And Brent says he misses the Brent misses the Irvine events.

Yeah, yeah, we'll. We'll get back there again, Brent. Don't worry. It'll. It'll happen eventually. Okay, so let's go back to some of your questions and then we'll kind of wrap it up here in a minute.

If I missed your comment, post it again because I don't want to scroll all the way up and see what I did and didn't post.

I think you skipped this one from Derek Snarl. He was talking about, he was asking, are any of you having issues keeping up with the local Market rental housing regulations. I don't know if we addressed that.

I didn't see that one. Sorry.

Yeah, yeah. Adam, I don't think you got all of them. It's a little hard the way that software works that we're using to get, you know, it's sort of jumpy the way it handles the questions and comments. But go ahead, Lisa. So local where? Did they say where or.

No, I thought for me, like it was more like what regulations? Because the states that we invest in have regulations like that. For the most part, Chicago might be different.

I don't know.

Sarah, Evan, you want to speak to that?

I think Derek is, is from the LA area, so that's what he's, you know, comparing, probably comparing to.

So yeah, I mean there's certain places that require you have like an annual inspection by the county, things like that, but not, not in any of our markets that I know of.

Right now. Chicago is, is tough like inspections. St. Louis, Missouri is tough on inspections. And what I mean by that is, you know, the, in addition to like when you have a tenant turnover, for example, there will be a requirement to have a city inspection and then you're at the mercy of when they can put you on, on their schedule. And so, you know, if you're trying to turn your property quickly so you can rent it.

Jason, you've, you've talked quite a bit about Dave Ramsey on your show. I just want to say that Dave.

Ramsey's program again and that inspector isn't available for two weeks. You know, that's two weeks of rent.

When he talks about debt, he's not specific. He's not talking about real estate debt or mortgage debt which is actually coming.

Out of your pocket in just wait time. So I don't know if that was, if that really answers the question. Maybe you can clarify further in the comments. But you know, we, I mean we do, we do keep tabs on that. We try and stick with landlord friendly markets. But there are a few markets that do have some, you know, regulations like that around city inspections.

Yeah, most of our markets are very, actually Naresh, he is, he doesn't like any debt. Okay. He doesn't even like real estate debt. But landlord friendly. Well, comparatively all of them are more landlord friendly than the places a lot of people invest like California, New York or, or whatever. But you know, it's a spectrum, obviously. Okay. I just put up on the screen, by the way, pandemicinvesting.com this is where you can go and you get the free book okay. The Pandemic Investing book. And you can also register for our upcoming conference, our Pandemic Investing Conference. You can see this cool little educational video that's six minutes long, five minutes and 49 seconds long. And join us October, Believe it or not, he's crazy on that. Okay. He's right about, like for Dave Ramsey's Market 17th virtual event. And you know, we're going to discuss a lot of great stuff there, go into detail about the migration patterns. And we're also teaching, for Sarah's request, some of my creating wealth concepts there, but applied to the current environment in which we find ourselves. So go to pandemicinvesting.com get your ticket for this virtual event. Really easy to attend. And that's October 17th, so it's coming up in 13 days or actually 12 days. And where'd that timer go? It went from. It was on the other page.

Anyway, Jason, some of my, some of our most successful clients, you know, they, they keep attending these, they used to be in person conferences. Now they're virtual. But even, you know, so many of our clients that attended our most recent Meet the Masters conference, it just really helped them to get going and to grow their, you know, whether they were new or investing with us for many years. You know, a lot of the people that were investing with us for many years executed that refi till you die strategy, you know, and the new investors that really just helped them to get started. So stay plugged into the content, the events. You never know.

He's good for getting people out of stupid consumer debt and all that stuff. He's just wrong about investing. He's not. You know, you, you need, look it, if you're, if you're, if you don't have credit card debt, who you're going.

To meet, who you're going to hear just a little bit of information that really helps you grow in your income property investing business. So the conferences are just, they're awesome, even the online conferences. So stay plugged in because that's where you're going to learn and pick up more information.

Good advice. You got it, you know, and you don't have like stupid debt and you've got your act together. You need to graduate from Dave Ramsey School. Ray Kroc, the founder of the McDonald's franchise system. Now everybody knows who he is because the movie, the Founder, which was a really good movie, by the way, and he discovered that the whole thing with McDonald's was a real estate play, by the way. I just want to point that out okay. It wasn't the McDonald's thing. It was the real estate that made it all work to become one of the most successful companies in the world. But one of his favorite sayings, his favorite quotes really applies to what Sarah was just saying and about into the conference, you know, and. Okay, he's fine for the market he serves, but, yeah, no rush. I. I thought like you. And that quote is, as long as you're green, you're growing. As soon as you're ripe, you begin to rot. So as long as you're green, you're growing. Okay. And that's the value of ongoing education.

All right, so Jeff Jones asked if we have any comments on Roofstock. And for that, personally, I kind of give that the same. Same caveat as Zillow. You don't know what you're walking into with our properties. You know, you're getting either completely renovated properties or completely new. We have had one or two come up that haven't been completely renovated. They're kind of as is properties, but we divulge that off the bat. When it comes to roofstock and Zillow, those places, they're just properties up there that, you know, you're gonna have to assume you're gonna get more maintenance.

Yeah, these are platforms. Sorry, Sarah. I'll just finish mine. You know, I actually tried to be their customer a couple of times now. Not to buy a property, but to sell a property. Well, I did get a little nervous on the 1031 exchange I was doing, and we didn't have any inventory, so I actually looked there, and. But I knew our clients were. Wouldn't buy some of my more highly appreciated properties that I want to do 1031 exchanges on. And, you know, it was just really hard to be a customer, so I. I just didn't do it. You know, I. These are. These are platforms, you know, like Zillow. It's a good comparison to, say, Zillow. Yeah, go ahead, Sarah.

Yeah, so I'm on their, you know, email list, and I look at their listings all the time. I mean, after all, I'm an investor. You know, if I can get a good deal somewhere else. I have never purchased a property out of our network, I'll tell you that. But except for my primary residence, but there was this listing in the beginning.

But he doesn't like any debt, even on real estate, so he's just. He's just clueless about that. Dave Ramsey is.

Jason, My. My daughter. You know, my daughter's. And she's a senior in high school. And, and it was in, in Atlanta, in the same city that I already owned a property that I bought through the network. And it looked great. So I started researching and I'm like, this looks too good to be true. And the first thing I noticed was that the rent was off by like a couple hundred dollars. So I filled out the form and they called me and I talked to them and told them I was interested because I was. I just had to order a Dave Ramsey book for her financial class. And we were in the car yesterday and it wasn't even there listing that, that particular property. And what I, what I learned is that sometimes they do control the inventory, but sometimes they're just pulling deals off the mls. And that particular deal they pulled out the mls and I learned that it wasn't vetted. The rent was, you know, way off. So I, I took those exact numbers, I put them in our first format, our property tracker format, to see like, you know, what the return would be. And it didn't compare once you start picking apart the numbers. So, you know, I'm sure they have some one off deals that work. But I think what Jason was saying is a lot of people list their appreciated properties that don't work anymore, and that's how they unload their deals. And she was telling me about it and she loves the class, and I'm like, that's great. Like, this is so great that they're teaching them. I don't know that many of the ones that I have seen work, you know, make sense from day one, I guess.

Yeah. You can also go to ebay and buy properties too. Good luck, folks. Yeah. Okay, let's move on. Adam, you got it.

DM asks what happens when everyone figures out the government is serious about rent skipping and everybody takes them up on it. New regs are coming soon, before the end of 2020. Everyone wants to live for free. Yeah, Jason and I, you and I discussed it in one of the live streams. And the skipping rent is possible, but you have to actually document Covid related hardships. It's not something you can just say, I don't want to pay my rent, at least in the markets we're in. I don't know about California, but you have to document Covid related issues and the rent is still technically due. It just gets bumped back.

Which to comment on what Adam's saying is, number one, like I said on that RT interview, this rent moratorium issue has been like a non issue for people in our network. I was very fearful that this would be A big nightmare, a big problem, a disaster. And it just hasn't been at all like, it's, it's, you know, once you stop listening to the news media and you talk to our investors, it's like a non issue. Nobody's talking about this in our network. Okay. I will tell you that.

So great that they're teaching you this at, you know, age 17, I said, but when, when you get into your young twenties, I'll teach you about real estate investing. Exactly.

Remember your option, and this is why you should have your properties leveraged is you can always pass that hot potato to your lender. Okay. If this happens, if it becomes an.

Issue, it's a great, I think it's, Dave Ramsey is a great foundation for.

People to have agreed where rent collection does become an issue. You just go into forbearance or, you know, and that forbearance program in the future may look different than it does today. It might be a better program, but you just pass the hot potato to the lender. That's your back door.

Trickle up economics.

Trickle up, that's what I call it. Yeah. Trickle instead of trickle down economics, like.

Manage their money, but not for the long term. Buy and hold.

The Reagan era idea, this, this is trickle up. In other words, if I'm not getting my rent, I just trickle it right up to the lender and say, lender, I can't pay you. Sorry. And then they go to their bondholders and the government for a bailout. So that's what happens.

But don't do that if you're trying to get more loans because the lenders don't want to give you loans if you're in forbearance to that, don't do.

It because it's not a problem. If it becomes a problem and it really becomes a catastrophe, that's your option. Okay. It's always your option to stop paying the mortgage. So just know that that option is there. And this is why you shouldn't have free and clear properties. It's yet another reason because you know, who you gonna go to then? Like they say in Ghostbusters, who you gonna call? Nobody. It's gonna be your problem. Yeah.

And especially forbearance, when the market first tanked, was kind of a stigma that could be attached to you. But these days with the lenders, it's pretty much as soon as you're out of forbearance at, at the moment. From what one of the lenders I talked with said is as soon as you're out of Forbearance, you're pretty much eligible loan the next day. So it got all that stigma disappeared.

And, and that's the way forbearance is today, right? It's not necessarily going to be investment.

Theme and I think Dave Ramsey said he got burned in real estate years ago.

Yeah, yeah he, he, he did. I had his that way in a year or six months, you know we don't know what will happen. Okay.

Victim laws are changing constantly. Everything's changing. Just stay up to, stay up to code or stay up to the news.

On number two guy on the show years ago and he just didn't know what he was talking about honestly.

You know it's, it's get reach out.

To us and we'll help you find out with regulation are that day.

Kerry, did you just say the victim laws eviction. Oh, eviction laws. Okay. I like that the victim laws because everybody acts like a victim in today's world, you know.

Well you know if, if the renter is the victim of COVID and you're the victim of non payment then your lender becomes the victim of your forbearance.

And you know but listen the securities, the mortgage backed securities become the victim of your non payment and then the government becomes the, the victim of it because they do a bailout and then inflation becomes the answer in the long term. But go ahead Sarah.

But you know the majority of the people, you know they want to pay their rent. They want to do their own your plan.

He doesn't, he doesn't get it. By the way, I wanted to say thank you to everybody for all the nice birthday thing.

The people that aren't paying are having legitimate hardships and as investors, as real estate investors be in the position that we're in having the knowledge that we have. I feel it's our duty to kind of coach these tenants, right. So like I had one, I did have two tenants fall behind at the beginning of the COVID One of them I put on a payment plan. They got caught up, they're up to date. The other one they just, they couldn't make the payment for two months. And I said to the property wishes and comments.

Adam, I don't know if you've gotten to the those yet. There's nice testimonials in there.

Manager, let's, let's let them break the leaves. Let's help them downsize. You guys can find them another property to rent because this was kind of a high end property and you know the rent was really expensive and I said you know, they don't want court system. They're already having their challenges. You know, let's coach them into a more affordable rental, and then I'll. I'll work out a plan for them to pay me back. And we did that. And that tenant, they came back, they paid me in full. I actually rented the property. Within 30 days, I got a $50 rent increase, and that person downsized because they were down to one income. And that's life. You know, if you're. If you can't afford your rent, sometimes you have to. You have to make adjustments. And I think it's our duty as investors to first try and coach them a little bit. Maybe it's the property manager that's going to coach them, but it's. It's. The property managers don't think this way. You know, they just want to fill out the form and file the eviction. And sometimes there's a better way. So don't be afraid to, like, think through this stuff and, you know, have a little compassion if you can.

That's a great point, Sarah. You know, I mean, hopefully we're all here to make a difference in the world, right? And most tenants are good people. They're not a problem. They're like. Tenants just get portrayed wrongly by a lot of landlords. And, you know, who had like one bad experience out of a hundred, right? They had. Maybe they had a few properties, and over the years, they had a hundred tenants, and they almost got like one or two bad. One. I've. I've had some bad ones, too.

Yeah.

So Robert said, happy birthday, Jason. You're a great person and a tremendous blessing to all of us who listen to your expert advice.

Thank you.

Ultimate bargain says I focus on cash. On cash.

Right. But the by and large, they're good. And remember something that they. The money is still due. Like Adam said earlier, you can literally, even if your tenant is under a moratorium and you can't evict, you can still take them to court and get a judgment against them. You just can't get a judgment for eviction. That's a. You can still get a money judgment to say, hey, look, they owe you the rent, and it's on record. And when that judgment is recorded, it's going to be very difficult for that person to buy a car, buy a house, rent another house. So, you know, just work with them. You're. And you won't have to do that. You know, that. That'll be the very rare time that you have to do. Do something like that. But just so you know, landlords still have rights even though they don't or may not at the time have turn.

And debt coverage ratio. Debt coverage ratio isn't a number. We go into ton of the right to actual eviction.

Okay. So just understand that. Okay, go ahead. Adam. Is there another one?

Yep. Digital Life says this is the highlight of my year Mr. Hartman. Making me money money with the network. But it's very, very important if you're looking to getting a loan. You know you've got Robert Helm made me money in 2016, told me to wait a year, then sell Washington state property. I made 100,000 more by waiting. Love you real estate gurus And Lorna Fash. She had said I skipped her question so she reposted it. Thank you very much Lorna. Wishing Jason happy happy birthday. Good health, long life and prosperity. Thanks for sharing your knowledge. And DM said follow up. How are the credit agencies handling this? Meaning are people taking hits on credit personally for forbearance and or rent.

If they take this deal supposedly forbearance, they're not supposed to get a credit ding for a forbearance program. That's the actual rule as I understand it. But not all lenders have been reporting correctly. And you know folks, it really is important for you to become aware of the way credit works in our country and to manage your credit. And I, you know we did a webinar on a funding program and one of the side benefits I talked to a lot of our clients because we did that webinar several months ago originally and a lot of people signed up for it.

Lenders that won't lend to on investment properties where the number I believe the one I've seen the Most is about 1.2.

And now I've had some nice feedback on it. And I also at this conference I.

Was just at in Tampa, I forget the exact formula that it takes. I have it written down somewhere.

But I was with the founder of that company and talked to him for a while and you know, one of the side benefits other than getting this funding, this business credit is that people have really become much more knowledgeable about how to manage their credit score. And it really is something that deserves some thinking and some attention. It's not complicated. In the beginning it seems complicated and foreign. But you know, once you understand it a little bit, it's really super easy. So anyway, good, good, good stuff. Go ahead.

Tyler wants to know, have you guys noticed that your tenants would rather work directly with you rather than the Property manager.

Absolutely, yes, good point. I have any other thoughts?

Lisa, you're the one who self manages.

Oh yeah. Oh yeah, I unmute myself that. I actually had my tenant tell me that she'd rather work with me than a property manager.

Speak on that for a second. So the debt coverage ratio, I like to call it the how low likely it is I'll ever get into trouble.

So I think that answers that.

All right, digital life, you'll love this. Jason, do you invest in commercial with that property ratio?

Okay. You know, I always have these like simple funny names for stuff and properties. Well, commercial, like I've said so many times, is a really bad word because I don't know what it means. Commercial is not a complete concept. Commercial could mean industrial properties, retail properties, office properties, apartment complexes, mobile home parks, whatever. I like housing. That's what I invest in. I have a mobile home park. I have a small apartment building now with some clients of ours and I used to have a really a couple of big apartment complexes with a different client of ours. So I like those commercial properties, but they're all housing. Notice the common thread. Housing. Right. So but my favorite by far is the good old fashioned single family home. It's the best one. When you have an apartment complex or a mobile home park, that is not an investment, that is a business. I mean it is complex and problematic. And I got to tell you something, even though that last apartment complex I sold last year that I talked about extensively on the podcast, it was 139 units. And I bought that with a client of ours, our client Steve, Sarah knows him quite well. And we sold that last year and I was so relieved to be done with that property. It was just a frickin pain. And by the way, we made good money. I think we bought that for like two point on the debt coverage ratio. What Adam's saying is, is the lower it is, the worse it is, the more million or two point. No, I think we bought it for like 2.2 and put like 600,000 into it or something and sold it for $5 million. Exactly 5 million even. So we made money, it was good. But we spent over $200,000 on legal fees just with lawyers and don't quote me on the legal bill, I think it was around 200 grand in and out of that deal. More likely it is, you'll get into trouble.

So one is break even.

Yeah, one is break even. And he's saying that during the deal because we had low income government subsidized housing, not just Section 8, but a local city program too. And like the red tape, you just can't imagine. And what makes me really nervous about those, those deals is you get into a deal where you're signing a lot of things that you, you just can't possibly understand. Don't want to see that debt coverage ratio fall below 1.2. Now just to give you a. And that just makes me super nervous. And yes, I do it like other people, you know, when you, when you get, you know, oh, here's a 400 page legal document, like I'm supposed to understand this and agree to it and like you're agreeing to all these policies of this local rent subsidy program. I just don't want to be in that world, folks. That's just too, I don't know, it's just too stressful for me. Give me a, you know, a portfolio of good old fashioned single family homes. I like them a lot better. Okay. But single family home comparison on the property in Florida that we just, you know, you know, the idea is you can scale more with these bigger assets. But I don't know, I've seen our investors do it very nicely with single family homes and that's where I feel safe. Okay. So it's, it's my benefit of single.

Family is, you know, if you just need to like liquidate, liquidate a portion of your portfolio, you need to free up some capital. You can do that with a deal or two or three. But if you're in this big apartment deal, you know, you're just, it's more difficult, you know, to get out of it if you want to sell.

Absolutely. So housing is the answer no matter what. It's housing. Single family being my favorite in the housing asset class.

Julian Assange says he would love to be a victim.

Julian Assange, That's a fake name obviously. Right. Talked about. We showed it on the screen a few minutes ago. The debt coverage ratio on that one is 1.4. So that's very good. The likelihood of you getting into trouble there is very un. Who knows?

You never know.

Yeah, yeah, you never know. He got evicted from the Ecuadorian Embassy. Unfortunately, Julian Assange. History may look back on him and some view it now is he was a real hero. So, you know, Nobody ever says WikiLeaks is fake news. Isn't that interesting? Yeah.

Jason, we have another question from my client, Keith.

Okay.

Want me to read it? Okay. I have properties with mortgages with a rate in the high to mid fives. Does it make sense to refi. To 4% and cash out some equity to deploy into other properties. It's a math problem, but curious. Probably I'll break it down for you, Keith.

Probably.

Likely. The other property in Talladega, the debt coverage ratio was 1 point. Go ahead, say so you want to break it down for everybody.

Well, when I say break it down, I'll send you a sheet to complete and I'll, we'll run the numbers like in real time. But because it, you know, it depends on how much equity you have in those properties. If you have a good amount of equity, it will absolutely make sense because you can, you'll be able to pull out all that cash. Cash, you know, for get a super cheap rate and then you can deploy, you know, and apply the refi till you die strategy. But it also depends on, you know, I know you purchased them recently through us. It depends how long you've had the properties because you're going to have the cost of, you know, the refinance. So if you can roll in your closing costs and get a lower month, four, nine.

Also very good. So, so there you go.

If your credit, monthly payment or a lower interest rate probably won't make sense.

Yeah.

Our clients are getting rates in the low threes. I did two refinances at 3.3875.

Wait a sec. Evan's going to tell you something. No.

Yeah, same thing happened to me. It's happened to Sarah. In fact, Sarah mentioned it on one of our internal conversations that got me thinking about it and it ends up saving me a ton of money. Yeah, it's if you can, if you wrap in the closing costs and prices have gone up. I mean, I don't know when Keith bought but you know, there's been some appreciation so you could probably wrap into closing costs. I was able to. So I'm very, it's, it's amazing.

And on your short term rental, didn't you just get 2.89%?

Yeah, yeah, but that's, that's because it's technically a second home because we use it sometimes. So you get a little bit lower rate. Yeah. But I've seen for investment properties as low as 3.375. That's the lowest I saw for an investment property maybe. And that was like at a certain period of time. I don't know what it is right.

Now, but that was, we'll have others.

If your credit and income are good enough to qualify for the loan, that house will get approved every day of the week, twice on Sunday if it's.

There Twice on Sunday. Is that like a saying? That's funny.

And you want to ask the lender about doing a rate buy down. You know, it may or may not make sense, but like my deals, I paid a point, a percentage of the loan to get a lower, you know, interest rate. But, you know, for me, you can. You can calculate the break even time on that. So. So on my deals, I was going to make that money back in three years. My break even was three years. And I plan to keep that property for longer than that. If you can do the cash out refi and lock in a much lower rate and then keep the money rolling, your property should be buying properties eventually. My properties are buying properties. It's amazing. I love it.

Your portfolio buys you free property. That is a beautiful thing. What were you saying?

Several clients have had that. You just had one of my clients on your show and talking about that, and it just keeps rolling it over and buying new properties with that.

It's beautiful. You get free properties. You know, one of the beauties of income property is that you can.

That's a Southern saying.

Y'.

All. You can get all your money back or a lot of your money back or even more than all your money back by refinancing, and you still own the asset. But it gets even better than that. You can get your money back, plus you can get a new free asset that the property portfolio buys you by refinancing and using that cash as the down payment on another one. It's. You know what it's like. I just thought of this. It's like a really great legal pyramid scheme. Okay, Adam, y' all keep art, and.

Paper says Happy birthday, Jason. You look good.

Madoff would be proud. Okay. Hey, folks, we've been going an hour and 42 minutes. I gotta go to birthday brunch here, but we got one more I think we should, because our client, Pat Anderson asked a question. Do you want to do that one, Sarah?

Oh, put that one on the screen. Screen. That's awesome. Thank you, Pat.

Oh, that's not a question. Okay, pull that. Wow. Congratulations. There it is. There's your example, folks. So Pat did it right there at our conferences over the years. And. And that's great. Yeah.

So there's one more I think we should do. It came in about 10 minutes ago. Digital Life wants to know the names and what these. But he wants to know what we do, and he said, forgive me for the newbie question here. So in terms of what we do, we just. We help connect the investor with the right properties. So that's really when you reach out to us and say, hey, you know, if you go to jasonhartman.com fill out any of the forms, one of us will call you or good. What is your birthday wish?

My birthday wish is. I don't know. Which one should I pick? Well, I'd like to find a wife and have some kids. That's the one.

Preferably. You give us your phone number, we can call you or you give us your email address, we'll contact you and we'll help you figure out a plan for how to build your portfolio. And we have, as we, as we've mentioned numerous times, we have providers that we've partnered with across the country with properties that make sense the day you buy them. And we just help you build up your portfolio that, you know, makes you money. And as we talked about the whole time here.

Oh, go ahead. You'll be assigned to an investment counselor. So each one of us here in the Brady Bunch, we're an investment counselor.

Hey, we need two more kids to be the Brady Bunch. You know, Coco.

Why isn't Coco in here?

Yeah, we.

Oh, that is important. We need a Coco update.

Yeah. Oh, Coco is. She threw up thing I really just haven't done in my life. So. So. Well, not. Not happening there. I woke up this morning and had. There was vomit on the floor. So now I'm worried about her again. And. But she, she just ate during this live stream, which makes me feel better that she just ate. When, when an animal's not eating, you get really concerned. But I'm going to take her to the vet today too, you know, here. So it's another thing. Yeah. But overall she seems like she's been doing well, so that's good.

Yeah. So you'll be assigned to an investment counselor and we'll work with you to build your portfolio on various aspects. I think Sarah was going to highlight on some of those. Financing, finding properties, property management issues, concerns.

We're just very quickly for me, that's for sure.

But it's ain't cheap. Yeah, we got.

You want to have hands on involved the whole time to help you build your. Your portfolio.

Good deal. Yep.

Okay, so do we. Can we wrap it up here?

One more comment from Juliana.

You want to pull that one? I'm refinancing four properties, but in one property, P and I went from 1100 to 820.

Congratulations.

It went from 5.6 to 3.375. Incredible. Rent increased and my mortgage decrease.

Awesome. Congratulations. Yeah. Here, we'll. We'll do. Yeah.

Where's the birthday song?

I don't have one of those.

Come on.

So I have some other sound effects on this machine, but I have to figure out how to use it. So anyway, but. But good stuff. Congratulations. That is totally awesome, and we really appreciate you all listening. So, folks, we got to wrap it up, go to pandemicinvesting.com and get your free mini book and register for our upcoming event. Okay? So, folks, would you all agree?

Not yet.

What was that one Carrie said?

Don't get an au pair just yet.

Folks. That people should do that. Tell them. Do it.

No better time than now.

Yeah, no better time than now. What is that, Sarah?

Can you hear it?

My birthday.

Do you know? Here's. Thank you. You know, an interesting thing, you notice you never. You probably heard this little trivia before, but you notice you never hear Happy Birthday in a movie. It's because that song is copyrighted, and they just won't. I guess they're really difficult to work with, and they won't license the song very well. So, like, never in a movie, you never. It's just kind of think about that. Have you seen a movie where they're singing, like, happy Birthday to someone?

No.

I tell you what, though.

Even in Sixteen Candles or something, right?

Never even noticed. Yeah, that's crazy.

I had a story about the Happy Birthday song that's pretty funny that he learned in South Africa growing up. So that's a great happy birthday song that he sings.

So, Evan, here's how rich our. Our team members are. Evan has an au pair, and Carrie just got an au pair pair, too. I do YouTube it. What? What is it? Who?

Trevor Noah, the Daily show host, had a thing about when he grew up in South Africa. His mom taught him a Happy Birthday song that was way more exciting. It was like happy, happy birthday and that. And he said he went to his first, like, birthday party where they sang Happy Birthday.

Let me get one.

He's helping me get one.

Oh, okay. Yeah.

You know, let's sing the birthday song. And he started doing his big energetic thing. Everybody looks at him like he was insane.

He thought it was totally boring. Huh? Yeah.

It's worth YouTubing to listen to him sing the Happy Birthday song.

Good stuff. Good stuff. Well, hey, folks, thanks, everybody for joining us. And thank you to the team. And let's wrap it up and just make sure you have gone to where Pandemic Investing.

Not plan demic. Pan.

Pandemicinvesting.com or Jason Hartman.com.

Yeah, yeah, but but specifically for the event, pandemicinvesting.com and we'll get in touch with you either way. And we look forward to helping you build your investment portfolio. And thank you to the team. Thanks to all of you. Appreciate you joining me.

Thanks, David.

We'll do this again. That was a lot of fun. Bye, everybody. Let me tell you a funny story about that, by the way. This is funny. So these clients and friends of mine from many years ago, I will not mention the name because this person is rather famous, you know, in business famous and not a celebrity, but a business celebrity, if you will. And they were, you know, getting older and they were like this professional power couple and they used to live next to me in Orange county. And I remember I sold that house for them and sold a bunch of their others, their investment properties. And they thought, you know, maybe we better have a kid, we're getting older. And they started and they thought, you know, we're both like professional power couple. You know, we're not, we're going to need a nanny.

Okay.

Or an au pair. And so they started looking at, you know, looking at catalogs of au pairs and nannies and they, they started looking at all, you know, they'd have like a picture and they'd have their profile and their information and all this stuff. And you know, you pick one out of here and, and so the wife says, you know, these nannies and au pairs are just too good looking. I think we ought to skip this and just get a boat. She didn't want to have some hot young nanny around her husband.

You know, I was telling Kerry this. We talk a lot about inflation and people say there's no inflation. We first got an au pair five or six years ago. The initial fee was like $3,500. Now the initial fee is like $9,000.

That's like a one time fee or per month.

What do you mean one time fee? And then you pay the. But I think part of inflation and some of it's just like the immigration laws and how things have changed, but they're really, you know, I shared an article with the group, the Wall Street Journal had an article that there is a lot of inflation in things that matter.

Oh yeah.

You know, things are, we're buying. And this is just another proof of.

That that I've seen. I can tell you my son was born in January, pre virus. And from January to where we are in October, the cost of a nanny has gone from here in Florida anywhere from 10 to $15 an hour, to 20 to $25 an hour. And that's, I think, I think it's clearly a supply issue. A lot of nannies are saying, you know, I don't want to come to some stranger's house and take care of people.

Yeah, interesting. Yeah. No, there's definitely inflation. Okay, Adam.

And Tyler Lawson says I can't wait to buy a property. I'm so close to paying off my business loan. Hopefully I'll be buying a couple properties a year to start and then bump it up as cash flow increases. So. Congratulations, Tyler. Digital life says I've heard property values can't stay high with immigration opening up. True or false. I don't see how immigration opening up and having more people enter the market for properties would hurt property values.

Yeah, folks, in the next 30 years, if you, if you get a 30 year mortgage today, okay, your, your tenant is going to pay it off because that's who pays your mortgage in 2050, okay. Three decades from now and there will be at least 80 million more people in the United States by the time.

That mortgage ends and there will be zero more land.

Yeah, good point, Adam. Zero more land. Yes. In fact, if Al Gore is right, there's gonna be a lot less land because the oceans are gonna rise and you know, we're gonna have coastal property in Phoenix. Gary, you're gonna be on the beach soon.

But Obama was supposed to stop the oceans from rising.

That's true.

Yeah. That song Oceanfront prom property and might become true.

Yeah, There you go.

All right, wait, there's, there's an important question here that, that I just want.

To Naresh, don't go out of order though. Let's just go in order. Okay.

Digital life also wants to know thoughts on furnace short term rentals. I think we, I mean short term rentals are going to have to be furnished and we kind of covered the, the market. So I don't know if anybody else has anything to say on that.

Right.

Let'S see. Brent Cook says Hawaii is busy killing the golden goose. Tourism. Let's see. Sorry, something just updated and moved down. Brent Cook also said refi till you die.

Hi Brent.

All Con Moran says happy birthday Jason. Thanks to you and Sarah and all the others for all that you do.

Hi Con.

Thanks Khan.

If someone wants to see set up their sister with Jason.

Yeah, that was the important.

20 minutes ago Bill Brown said good point.

Narration for Instagram.

Let's see, we've got all me said Adam, what about investing in surrounds of Austin? Are There possibilities. We actually, Lisa and I had a conversation with the potential provider in Texas, including the surrounding Austin areas, San Antonio, that kind of stuff. When it comes to investing in Austin at the moment, you're gonna, I mean, no, but you're gonna have to go down to like Kyle and Buda, which is about 20 or 30 minutes outside from downtown Austin without traffic. It's 20 to 30 minutes.

Selling in Kyle.

Yeah. Or you're gonna have to go east out to Dell Valley or farther. And I mean, even those properties are getting expensive. You can't go north. North has gotten crazy. You can't go west. There's nothing really there. And what is there is getting really expensive. You can't even go southwest. There used to be Dripping Springs and that was reasonable. It's now as expensive as Austin almost. It's up around like $400,000 for an entry point house. And then after that you're out in the Hill Country. So there's nothing there. So there's just fewer and fewer places that actually make sense around here. So the providers we're looking at are in. Are outside of San Antonio, a little bit farther south, but you're kind of somewhat out of the Austin market by the time you get where you're going to be able to build.

Okay, keep going.

Con Moran said narration Exactly. Sort of the point where Nuratio's broken bragging Brent Cook refi till you die. SCSU 300 says put me down for one of those Talladega or Florida new builds. I don't know who that is, but you have an investment counselor then.

Yeah. Hope maybe one of your counselors is here. We're not sure. But if not, be sure to go to jasonartman.com or pandemic investing.com by the way, we should talk about our event coming up, folks. We have an event coming up online event, Pandemic Investing Conference Online. Our first one coming up in just like 13 days, I think, right? Yeah, yeah.

And basically your picture will be here on this screen. It's the same concept except for all of our investors are here together and you get to actually ask your questions. So fun.

Well, and at Meet the Masters, the conference less than two months ago, those Talladega properties, those investors were the ones that got the 10,000 last prize they were 119,000 and now they're 129. So sign up, register. There might be more exclusive properties at this event.

Good point, Good stuff. So there's the link. Pandemic Investing.com There's a free Book there, but you can also register for the event. Go ahead.

Robert Hernandez says Democrats are horrible for small business owners and entrepreneurs with all the regulations. Ken McElroy just said around 50% of small businesses close down for good.

I'm surprised you were willing to read that question, Adam.

I'm glad you were.

Kim M. Says, what do you guys think about modular houses?

Okay, so I'll just speak on that for a second. I think they're great, but they have a stigma, unfortunately. And I don't think they should have a stigma. I think it's an unfortunate stigma, but it is the way it is. That's the perception. People don't like them and hopefully society will overcome that because I think it's an unfair stigma. Yeah, go ahead, Sarah.

Do I recall you telling me one time that getting loan on modular housing can be really hard, or am I making that up?

Banks have the same thing.

It was the other one.

The prefab or. No, I don't remember.

I can't think of the name I saw somewhere in the comments. Manufactured houses? Yeah. Do you mean I just had a client try and buy one years ago and the lender wouldn't finance it?

Yeah. Okay.

Cash deal.

Come closer to your mic, Sarah.

Oh, I'm sorry. I had a client try and buy one years ago, but they couldn't get financing.

Okay, Adam, go ahead.

Brent Cook says Ramsey must have amazing asset protection. I'm assuming that's because he has so much cash actually in the. In the deals.

Yeah.

Let's see. Tyler Lawson says, I used to be a fan of Dave Ramsey. Then I found Jason Hartman.

Yay.

Good idea. Good idea.

Oh, and it just updated again because I guess I got too far behind. Let's see.

Digital license, she says. Happy birthday, my favorite person. Thank you so much for all the information you've always shared with your followers. Okay, go ahead, Adam. You can pick up now.

Digital Life says, should I stay or should I go? Paid 275k cash in 2018. Can list for 419. Seems like I should sell.

You should sell? Yeah. Where? I don't know where that is, but that's. That's too expensive for rental property. You can. You can buy four rental properties. Three or four. Sell that. Yeah, good idea. 1031 Exchange. If it's a personal residence, you don't need to. 1031. But 1031 exchange it if it's a rental property before Joe Biden takes the 10:31 away. We talked about that. And contact one of our team members and get A whole rental portfolio for that. That's great.

So art and paper needs to go to Jason hartman.com ask because he's saying, can I set Jason up with my sister?

Yeah, I know art. I know art on paper. I'll hook you guys up, quite literally.

Send me a Facebook or Instagram link, will you?

Okay, we have. What are your thoughts on Mexico?

Oh, no. Too much political instability. No civil rights, no good financing. Not a transparent market. You know, none of these foreign markets really seem to work that well. They sound attractive at first, but in reality, they don't. They just don't work that well. Adam, we could be putting the questions on the screen. I just forgot about that. We haven't been doing that, you know, so here we can, you know, do that.

So I will say one of the things that I learned about Mexico reading the John Burns book is I hadn't realized that the economy has gotten good enough that we're actually seeing an outflow of Mexicans from the United States to Mexico because they came over here in order to be able to get a job and send money home. But we've been at a net loss for the last about 15, 10 to 15 years. So we're actually losing people to Mexico.

Every year that actually everybody's leaving California.

Yeah, that kind of surprises me, Adam. I bet there's a little more to that stat. But fine, I get that you're right about Mexico's economy getting better, but a lot of that is largely because of nafta, and with the Trump administration, you know, that's not going to be quite as good for them as it has been.

Well, it actually saw one of the articles I read said it didn't. The new agreement didn't work out quite as expected because it requires. It doesn't require that things be built in America, but it requires that workers get paid an average of $15 an hour. And so then what they discovered was companies didn't spend the millions and millions of dollars it takes to move it to the United States. They just up the salary of the Mexican workers. And now everybody in Mexico wants to work at their factories because they make more working there than anywhere else. So.

Okay, got it. Yeah, interesting. But regardless of that, of any of that, and we look at folks a lot of times, these questions really deserve a much longer answer. And that's why you got to listen to the podcast, the Creating wealth show, because we. We go in depth on. On issues there, and we've talked a lot about foreign investment. Not just Mexico, any foreign country. The United States is a very special real estate market for numerous reasons. Okay? So leave it at that. Listen to the podcast, the Creating wealth show. Adam, go ahead.

Tyler Lawson wants to know when you will have live events again.

We do. We have an event in 13 days. Pandemic investing.

They said live. When restrictions get lifted.

Yeah, maybe. But I got to tell you something. I like these virtual events. And at this live conference I just came from in Tampa, you know, a lot of those people host their own seminars, and they were all talking about how they now love virtual events because they're so much less expensive and so much easier to run. And, you know, hotel inflation has gone through the roof. You know, $120 a gallon for 12 cups of coffee. I mean, it's absurd what hotels charge, but that is a lesson, by the way, folks. The person who controls the real estate controls the whole game, okay? And that's what a hotel does. So, you know, we'll certainly have live events again, but, you know, who knows? It's not going to be soon. So join us virtually on Zoom. In 13 days, go to pandemicinvesting.com.

All right, Adam and Brent obviously been listening to you on the podcast and your live streams because he said. You mean the plandemic.

Plandemic. Exactly.

And now we're all caught. Digital Life says thank you from every fiber within. And Brent says he misses the. Brent misses the Irvine events.

Yeah, yeah, we'll. We'll get back there again, Brent. Don't worry. It'll. It'll happen eventually. Okay, so let's go back to some of your questions, and then we'll kind of wrap it up here in a. In a minute.

And if I missed your comment, post it again because I don't want to scroll all the way up and see what I did and didn't.

I think you skipped this one from Derek Snurl. He was talking about. He was asking, are any of you having issues keeping up with the local market rental housing regulations? I don't know if we addressed that.

I didn't see that one. Sorry.

Yeah, yeah. Adam, I don't think you got all of them. It's a little hard the way that software works that we're using to get, you know, it's sort of jumpy the way it handles the questions and comments, but. Go ahead, Lisa. So local where? Did they say where or.

No, I. I thought for me, like, it was more like, what regulations? Because the things that we invest in are. Don't have regulations like that for the most part. Chicago Might be different, I don't know. Sarah, Evan, you want to speak to that?

I think Derek is, is from the LA area. So that's what he's, you know, comparing, probably comparing to.

So yeah, there's certain places that require you have like an annual inspection by the county, things like that, but not, not in any of our markets that.

I know of right now.

Chicago is tough like inspections. St. Louis, Missouri is tough on inspections. And what I mean by that is, you know, in addition to like when you have a tenant turnover, for example, there will be a requirement to have a city inspection and then you're at the mercy of when they can put you on their schedule. And so, you know, if you're trying to turn your property quickly so you can rent it again and that inspector isn't available for two weeks, you know, that's two weeks of rent coming out of your pocket in just wait time. So I don't know if that was, if that really answers the question, maybe can clarify further in the comments. But you know, we, I mean we do, we do keep tabs on that. We try and stick with landlord friendly markets. But there are a few markets that do have some, you know, regulations like that around city inspections.

Yeah, most of our markets are very landlord friendly. Well, comparatively all of them are more landlord friendly than the places a lot of people in invest, like California, New York or whatever. But you know, it's a spectrum, obviously. Okay, I just put up on the screen, by the way, pandemic investing.com this is where you can go and you get the free book, okay, the Pandemic Investing book. And you can also register for our upcoming conference, our Pandemic Investing Conference. You can see this cool little educational video that's 6 minutes long, 5 minutes seconds and 20, 49 seconds long. And join us October 17th virtual event. And you know, we're going to discuss a lot of great stuff there, go into detail about the migration patterns. And we're also teaching, for Sarah's request, some of my creating wealth concepts there, but applied to the current environment in which we find ourselves. So go to pandemicinvesting.com get your ticket for this virtual event. Really easy to attend. And, and that's October 17th, so it's coming up in third in 13 days or actually 12 days. And where did that timer go? It was on the other page.

Anyway, Jason, some of my, some of our most successful clients, you know, they, they keep attending these, they used to be in person conferences, now they're virtual. But even so, many of our clients that attended our most recent Meet the Masters conference. It just really helped them to get going and to grow their. Whether they were new or investing with us for many years. A lot of the people that were investing with us for many years executed that refi till you die strategy. And the new investors, that really just helped them to get started. So stay plugged into the content, the events. You never know who you're going to meet, who you know, you're going to hear just a little, you know, bit of information that really helps you grow in your, you know, income property investing business. So the conferences are. They're just. They're awesome. Even the online conferences. So stay plugged in because that's where you're going to learn and pick up more information.

Good advice. You gotta, you know, like Ray Kroc, the founder of the McDonald's franchise system. Now everybody knows who he is because the movie the Founder, which was a really good movie, by the way, and he discovered that the whole thing with McDonald's was a real estate play, by the way. I just want to point that out, okay? It wasn't the McDonald's thing. It was the real estate that made it all work to become one of the most successful companies in the world. But he is. One of his favorite sayings, his favorite quotes really applies to what Sarah was just saying and about coming to the conference, you know, and that quote is, as long as you're green, you're growing. As soon as you're ripe, you begin to rot. So as long as you're green, you're growing. Okay? And that's the value of ongoing education.

All right, so Jeff Jones asked if we have any comments on Roofstock, and for that, personally, I kind of give that the same. Same caveat as Zillow. You don't know what you're walking into with our properties. You know, you're getting either completely renovated properties or completely new. We have had one or two come up that haven't been completely renovated. They're kind of as is properties, but we divulge that off the bat. When it comes to Roofstock and Zillow, those places, they're just properties up there that, you know, you're gonna have to assume you're gonna get more maintenance.

Yeah, these are platforms. Sorry, Sarah, I'll just finish mine. You know, I actually tried to be their customer a couple of times now. Not to buy a property, but to sell a property. Well, I did get a little nervous on the 1031 exchange I was doing, and we didn't have any inventory. So I actually looked there and. But I knew our clients were. Wouldn't buy some of my more highly appreciated properties that I want to do 1031 exchanges on. And, you know, it was just really hard to be a customer, so I, I just didn't do it. You know, I. These are, these are platforms, you know, like Zillow. It's a good comparison to, say, Zillow. Yeah, go ahead, Sarah.

Yeah, so I'm on their, you know, email list and I look at their listings all the time. I mean, after all, I'm an investor. You know, if I can get a good deal somewhere else. I have never purchased a property out of our network, I'll tell you that, but except for my primary residence, but there was this listing and it was in. In Atlanta, in the same city that I already owned a property that I bought through the network. And it looked great. So I started researching and I'm like, this looks too good to be true. And the first thing I noticed was that the rent was off by like a couple hundred dollars. So I filled out the form and they called me and I talked to them and told them I was interested, because I was. And it wasn't even their listing that. That particular property. And what I. What I learned that sometimes they do control the inventory, but sometimes they're just pulling deals off the mls. And that particular deal, they pulled out the mls and I learned that it wasn't vetted. The rent was, you know, way off. So I took those exact numbers, I put them in our format, our property tracker format, to see, like, you know, what the return would be. And it didn't compare once you start picking apart the numbers. So, you know, I'm sure they have some one off deals that work, but I think what Jason was saying is a lot of people list their appreciated properties that, you know, don't work anymore. And that's, that's how they, you know, unload their. Their deals. And I don't know that many of the ones that I have seen work, you know, make sense from day one, I guess.

Yeah. So that you can also go to ebay and buy properties too. Good luck, folks. Yeah. Okay, let's move on. Adam, you got dm.

DM asks what happens when everyone figures out the government is serious about rent skipping and everybody takes them up on it. New regs are coming soon, before the end of 2020. Everyone wants to live for free. We've seen.

Look.

Yeah, Jason and I, you and I discussed it in one of the live streams and the skipping rent is possible, but you have to actually document Covid related hardships. It's not something you can just say I don't want to pay my rent, at least in the markets we're in. I don't know about California, but you have to document Covid related issues and the rent is still technically due. It just gets bumped back.

Which to comment on what Adam's saying is number one, like I said on that RT interview, this rent moratorium issue has been like a non issue for people in our network. I was very fearful that this would be a big nightmare, a big problem, a disaster. And it just hasn't been at all like it's, it's, you know, once you stop listening to the news media and you talk to our investors, it's like a non issue. Nobody's talking about this in our network. Okay. I will tell you that. Remember your option, and this is why you should have your properties leveraged is you can always pass that hot potato to your lender. Okay? If this happens, if it becomes an issue, where rent collection does become an issue, you just go into forbearance or you know, and that forbearance program in the future may look different than it does today. It might be a better program, but you just pass the hot potato to the lender.

That's your, your back door trickle up economics.

Trickle up, that's what I call it. Yeah, trickle instead of trickle down economics like the Reagan era idea. This is trickle up. In other words, if I'm not getting my rent, I just trickle it right up to the lender and say lender, I can't pay you, sorry. You know, and then they go to their bond holders and the government for a bailout. So that's what happens.

But don't do that if you're trying to get more loans because the lenders don't want to give you loans. If you're in forbearance to that, don't.

Do it because it's not a problem. If it becomes a problem and it really becomes a catastrophe, that's your option. Okay? It's always your option to stop paying the mortgage. So just know that that option is there. And this is why you shouldn't have free and clear properties. It's yet another reason. Because you know who you going to go to then? Like they say in Ghostbusters, who you going to call? Nobody. It's going to be your problem.

Yeah. Especially forbearance when the market first tanked was kind of a stigma that could be attached to you. But these days with the lenders, it's pretty much as soon as you're out of forbearance at the moment. From what one of the lenders I talked with said is as soon as you're out of forbearance, you're pretty much eligible loan the next day. So it got all that stigma disappeared.

And that's the way forbearance is today. Right? Not necessarily going to be that way in a year or six months. You know, we don't know what will happen.

Okay, Victim laws are changing constantly. Everything's changing. Just stay up to, stay up to code or stay up to the news. Get out, get, reach out to us and we'll help you find out what the regulations are that day.

Carrie, did you just say the victim laws?

Eviction.

Oh, eviction laws. Okay, I like that, the victim laws. Because everybody acts like a victim victim in today's world, you know.

Well, you know, if, if the renter is the victim of COVID and you're the victim of non payment, then your lender becomes the victim of your forbearance.

And you know, but listen, the securities, the mortgage backed securities become the victim of your non payment and then the government becomes the victim of it because they do a bailout and then inflation becomes the answer in the long term. But. Go ahead, Sarah.

But you know, the majority of the people, you know, they want to pay their rent, they want to do the right thing. The people that aren't paying are having legitimate hardships. And as investors, as real estate investors, being in the position that we're in, having the knowledge that we have, I feel it's our duty to kind of coach these tenants, right? So like I had one, I did have two tenants fall behind at the beginning of the COVID One of them I put on a payment plan. They got caught up, they're up to date. The other one, they just, they couldn't make the payment for two months. And I said to the property manager, let's, let's let them break the lease. Let's help them downsize. You guys can find them another property to rent because this was kind of a high end property and you know, the rent was really expensive. And I said, you know, they don't want court system. They're already having their challenges. You know, let's coach them into a more affordable rental and then I'll, I'll, you know, work out a plan, plan for them to pay me back. And we did that. And that tenant, they came back, they paid me in Full. I actually rented the property within 30 days, I got a $50 rent increase, and that person downsized because they were down to one income, and that's life. You know, if you can't afford your rent, sometimes you have to make adjustments. And I think it's our duty as investors to first try and coach them a little bit. Maybe it's the property manager that's going to coach them, but it's. The property managers don't think this way. You know, they just want to fill out the form and file the eviction. And sometimes there's a better way. So don't be afraid to, like, think through this stuff and, you know, have a little compassion if you can.

That's a great point, Sarah. You know, I mean, hopefully we're all here to make a difference in the world, right? And most tenants are good people. They're not a problem. They're like. Tenants just get portrayed wrongly by a lot of landlords. And, you know, who had, like, one bad experience out of a hundred, right? They had. Maybe they had a few properties, and over the years, they had a hundred tenants, and they almost got, like, one or two bad. One. I've. I've had some bad ones, too. Right. But the by and large, they're good. And remember something that they. The money is still due. Like Adam said earlier, you can literally, even if your tenant is under a moratorium and you can't evict, you can still take them to court and get a judgment against them. You just can't get a judgment for eviction. You can still get a money judgment to say, hey, look, they owe you the rent, and it's on record. And when that judgment is recorded, it's going to be very difficult for that person to buy a car, buy a house, rent another house. So, you know, just work with them. You're. And you won't have to do that. You know that that'll be the very rare time that you have to do something like that. But just so you know, landlords still have rights, even though they don't or may not at the time have the right to actual eviction. Okay. So just understand that. Okay, Go ahead, Adam. Is there another one?

Yep. Digital Life says this is the highlight of my year. Mr. Hartman. Making me money. Robert Helm made me money in 2016, told me to wait a year, then sell Washington state property. I made 100,000 more by waiting. Love you. Real estate gurus. And Lorna Fash. She had said I skipped her question, so she reposted it. Thank you. Very much. Lorna wishing Jason happy, happy birthday, good health, long life and prosperity. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.

Thank you.

And DM said follow up. How are the credit agencies handling this? Meaning are people taking hits on credit personally for forbearance and or rent?

If they take this deal, supposedly forbearance, they're not supposed to get a credit ding for a forbearance program. That's the actual rule as I understand it. But not all lenders have been reporting correctly. And you know folks, it really is important for you to become aware of the way credit works in our country and to manage your credit. And I, you know we did a webinar on a funding program and one of the side benefits. I talked to a lot of our clients because we did that webinar several months ago originally and a lot of people signed up for it and now I've had some nice feedback on it and I also at this conference I was just at in Tampa, I was with the founder of that company and talked to him for a while and you know, one of the side benefits other than getting this funding, this business credit is that people have really become much more knowledgeable about how to manage their credit score. And it really is something that deserves some thinking and some attention. It's not complicated. In the beginning it seems complicated and foreign, but you know, once you understand it a little bit, it's really super easy. So anyway, good stuff.

Tyler wants to know, have you guys noticed that your tenants would rather work directly with you rather than the property manager?

Absolutely, yes, good point. I have. Any other thoughts?

Lisa, you're the one who self manages.

Oh yeah. Oh yeah, I'm that they. I actually had my tenant tell me that she'd rather work with me than a property manager. So I think that answers that.

All right.

Digital life, you'll love this. Jason, do you invest in commercial properties?

Well, commercial, like I've said so many times, is a really bad word because I don't know what it means. Commercial is not a complete concept. Commercial could mean industrial properties, retail properties, office properties, apartment complexes, mobile home parks, whatever. I like housing. That's what I invest in. I have a mobile home park. I have a small apartment building now with some clients of ours and I used to have a really a couple of big apartment complexes with a different climate client of ours. So I like those commercial properties. But they're all housing. Notice the common thread. Housing. Right. So but my favorite by far is the good old fashioned single family home. It's the best one when you have an apartment complex or a mobile home park. That is not an investment, that is a business. I mean it is complex and problematic. And I gotta tell you something, even though that last apartment complex I sold last year that I talked about extensively on the podcast, it was 139 units. And I bought that with a client of ours, our client Steve, Sarah knows him quite well. And we sold that last year and I was so relieved to be done with that property. It was just a frickin pain. And by the way, we made good money. I think we bought that for like 2.9 million or 2 point. No, I think we bought it for like 2.2 and put like 600,000 into it or something and sold it for $5 million. Exactly 5 million even. So we made money, it was good. But we spent over $200,000 on legal fees just with lawyers and don't quote me on the legal bill, I think it was around 200 grand in and out of that deal. And during the deal because we had low income government subsidized housing, not just Section 8, but a local city program too. And like the red tape you just can't imagine. And what makes me really nervous about those, those deals is.