How to Remember Names: Memory Expert's 3-Step Method

Hi and welcome to this edition of Chats with Jason, of course. I'm your host, Jason S. Bretro and this is the show where we help you transform the experience to transform your business. Now, today's guest is a little bit left of field to some of the guests we've had on recently, but I'm absolutely, positively sure we 1000% that you're going to get some great insights out of this conversation because we're talking today with Bob Miller, the author of Remember the How to remember everyone you meet at an event. And I know if you're anything like me, when you're going to an event, you always forget one key name of the person you really didn't want to forget. So Bob's going to help us navigate remembering everyone's name. Now, Bob, welcome to the show.

I'm glad to be here.

Thanks so much. Now, congratulations on the book Remember the room, how to remember everyone you meet at an event. How'd the book come about?

Well, it came about through a series of events over the years. I was a professional magician for 20 years and that's where I accidentally started doing this with my audiences. One time I was at an event, There was about 20 people there and I said, well, I don't normally ask my audience their names because, you know, what's the point? But I was doing walk around magic and doing tricks before the big stage show. And so I just asked people their names and I wasn't trying to remember everybody, but when I got up on stage I realized that I knew everybody's names. So I just said, well, I'd like to personally greet each one of you. And I said everybody's names and it was instant applause. It was like I had done an amazing magic trick, you know, and as a performer I pay attention. Let it get applause. So I said, I'm going to try that again. So I just kept on practicing and I got better and better at it. So as a performer I was doing that then. I'm no longer a full time performer, but I'm working. I'm a marketing director for High Power Data Solutions. It's a tech company in the Twin Cities. And since I'm the marketing director, I'm always going to networking events. So I was really putting this into practice a lot and I just had lots of opportunities to learn how to do this. And over the years I've also taught memory training. So all of that just came together and I said, well, I'm going to put this down into a book finally. Well, I do Have a two hour, remember the room workshop. And so basically this is like the workshop printed.

Right.

You can read through it pretty fast. But it's all the content, plus the stories that I got from the networking events and to show the application of how I use the memory skills. So it's been, you know, a lot of years in coming, but I'm surprised I didn't write it sooner. But I understand why I didn't because I had to have all these factions together.

Yeah. And I really appreciate the effort you've gone to condense it into a really actionable book. And the reviews have been quite positive. You know, it's nice to know someone's name. And, you know, like you said, you got an applause when you could rename everyone in the room. But what's the business application like? How does it help you day to day being able to remember everyone in the room?

The business application is when you go to an event, say there's 50 people in the room, they're not all going to be your prospects. Right. I mean, depending on your business, I suppose. But for the business that I'm in, not everybody's a prospect. Or if they're a prospect, you know, for this point in time, they may not be. So the goal is not to say I'm going to remember 50 people because they're all going to be my prospects and I'm going to call them all up. But it's so that I can hold those names in my memory while I'm at the event and then I can focus on who is going to be a good prospect as I get to know them and I don't have to go up to this person again and say, what, what was your name again? A lot of times the strategy that I'll do is that I will. When an event is over, I'll just sit at the exit and when somebody comes by that I want to talk to, I'll call them by name. Well, they're going to stop. Right. Because if I know their name, obviously I must be a friend or a business acquaintance or something. So the door is already opened to the business discussion. So it gives me that power to pick and choose who I want to talk with as a prospect.

Yeah. And I guess it fast tracks that rapport that you have with the customer or with the other person because you're using their name. It's the one word we all like and it allows people to get over a couple of those hurdles, I'd imagine. Now there's 11 different sections in the Book memory power. The key that opens the door to more is where you start and you end with providing resources to the reader. Out of the book. Do you have a favorite chapter or a favorite tip or hint that you can share with the audience?

Well, the way the book is structured is that the first two chapters are really about the how and the why. And I've got some stories about how I use the memory techniques in business settings. And there's some great stories in there I'd like to tell you. But before I do, the middle section is all about the instruction. It's the three step process is look, listen, link. We've got one chapter devoted to that and then we've got a separate chapter devoted to each of those points. Look, listen, link. And then at the end is a couple of chapters where it's a wrap up. It's misunderstandings and explaining what not to do and how to use this, the method. So a favorite story in there is true story. Well, they're all true in there. But there was a young graduate student, teaching student named sue, who was applying for a teaching job. And she came into the room and she was introduced to five men. And she was just nervous thinking about her interview. And about halfway through the interview, the interviewer unfortunately said, what do you know about John Brown? We'll use that name as an example. And she's thinking, this is an educational question. She's thinking, I don't know of any educators named John Brown. She said, I'm sorry, I haven't ever come across that name. And he said, yes you did. He was the third man I introduced you to. And she was just devastated. It wrecked the rest of the interview for her because she was so worried about, oh, they must be thinking, I'm not paying attention to everything. And so, you know, it wasn't really a fair question, but you know, it was a lesson that sue remembers for the rest of her life. But it also is a lesson for us to show that names are important and we often just skip right over them. I'm sure many people can relate to the event of hearing somebody's name and completely forgetting it five seconds later. And so the lesson is, you know, we need to be mindful about that all the time. The name is the first step in the business relationship.

Yeah, well, relationships in general. And that sue in your story, you know, I can appreciate she would have gone into that interview high stakes, potentially really wanting the job. Mind going at a thousand miles an hour, right? Gets five names throwing at her. And you know, her mind's still like 30 minutes down the track going, I need to remember to talk about X. Yeah, I really feel for her. So you mentioned that we have to, I'm going to paraphrase, but, you know, be intentional about.

Right? Yes.

Knowing the name and using the name. Have we always had this problem where, you know, if we were to roll back the clock 30 years, were people struggling with remembering people's names as much then as they are now, or is it a symptom of constantly being bombarded with information and distraction?

I think that it has always been an issue. Years ago, people actually referred to each other by their last names, and that even made it more difficult. So if you were in a social or business situation, you refer to the person as, you know, Mr. Widener or Mrs. Simpson. And I think that we've got an advantage now that we're on a first name basis, even in business situations. So that makes it a little bit easier for us. But I think there's always been an issue about forgetting the names. And intentional mindfulness is, you know, that's gotta be key because when I teach people these methods, I have to tell them now. You have to be thinking about this. Just because you've read this book doesn't mean it's like a magic pill. You're not going to forget somebody's name. It means every time you meet somebody, you look, listen and link. And you have to be thinking through that process.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. So look, listen and link. Can you give us a rundown, just a brief rundown on what each of those three steps are?

Sure. Well, looking obviously means that you're looking at the person, but you need to look at them like you really want to remember them. Like you. What you want to do is find something significant about their face or their body or even their clothing if you only need to remember them for today. But you need to choose something that is going to stand out to you. There's a lot of times when we really don't see people at all. I have a story in my book where I greeted a man in church, a man named Sam. And then after church, I went to the hardware store and Sam did too. And so I crossed paths with him and I said, hi, Sam. And you know how it is when people don't really know who you are, they just like, you know, kind of nod and move on. It's exactly what he did. So he met me just, you know, an hour ago, but he didn't really see me. That's a common feature. So when I say you're going to look at a significant feature, it should be prominent because it will be something that you will notice the next time you see them. If you look at me, you'd notice I'm follically challenged. Okay. So you're probably.

I'm on my way there.

So you, you, you may want to use that as, as your memory hook. Or if a person has a very, a unique, maybe face structure or something, or if they've, or if they've got, you know, sometimes people have colored hair now, but something unique or if they've got an eyebrow ring or something, or freckles on their face, but you're really going to look at their face like you've never really looked at a person before. And just choose one characteristic that you're going to use as your memory hook. That's the first step.

Yeah, so that's look.

That's look.

Get that visual hook as to who Bob is. So let's move on to listen.

Listen. This is one of the hardest points because it involves not just hearing the name, but doing an active process of converting the name into a memorable object. And what I mean by that is that it is hard to remember a nonsense syllable or a nonsense word. And basically names are nonsense words. You know, what is a Jeremy or a Karen or, you know, what is a Leslie? It's just a name. It has no meaning whatsoever. And we're trying to attach that name. Something that has no meaning to somebody's face. Well, there's a missing variable in between there, and that is that you need to convert the name into something that is memorable for my name, Bob, you could convert it into something that is visual, like say a fishing bobber, if you know what that is. And so if you just do only that one step that will help you. If you only do the one step of just really studying their faith, that will help you. But you convert their name into something memorable. So you've got an image.

Yeah, yeah.

For example, Lisa could be leash, as in dog leash. Or there's a lot of names that, you know, you have to choose something that sounds sort of similar, like if you hear a Pete, you can think of a beat or a beater.

Yeah.

Then there's a lot of names that automatically are visual images, like the name Forest or the name John. So whatever. If you can come up with an easy image for a name, that's great. But. So the hardest part, I would say, is you come across a name you haven't heard before, and so You've never, ever converted it into a memorable object before. So then you have to take a second to think about that. But that gets easier with practice.

Yeah. And I was also thinking, like, as you were saying, converting the name to an object, there's some names that I'm, like, I'm spending the first five minutes trying to remember how to pronounce it, do that second part of converting it. So it definitely seems like something you've got to put practice over time. So we've got. Look, get that visual understanding.

I could. I could mention something about that. Jason, if you don't know how to pronounce it, that's a great point to ask them.

Yeah.

They will appreciate it. And. And I've met people where I can't hear their name correctly or they've got an unusual name and so I'll ask them how to pronounce it. Sometimes I'll even ask them how to spell it. Because you can't remember what you haven't heard.

Yes.

So. And it will make it more memorable for you if you do ask them how it's pronounced. Exactly.

Yeah. Certainly from the work in, you know, hosting this show, there's been a number of guests where I've had to say beforehand, how do I pronounce your name? And then, you know, instances even where I've had to, after the recording, go back and rerecord the name just because. Not because the guest has asked for it, but just because I had got to know the name better and could pronounce it better. So, so we got. Look, listen, we just did. And then the third magic piece of the puzzle is link.

Yes. So at this point, you've really got two visual items. You've got a visual item on their face. Maybe you're going to look at their eyebrows, like if they got a unibrow, that's going to be unique. And then you've got their name, which you've converted into an object. So, for example, for the name Jason, believe it or not, for. For that, I think of the mask from the movie Friday the 13th. So that's what I always think of with Jason. So you've got these two. You've got two visuals now. You've got a visual for the name, you've got a visual for their face, and now you link it together in a funny and humorous way. For example, in my book, I tell people to imagine my head as being a giant fishing bobber. You look at my follically challenged head and you imagine a fishing bobber, which is red and white with a little red plug on the top. And I tell them you have to really see it in your mind's eye. You make that image. Okay. So then when I see Jason, I'm going to imagine him wearing this mask that reminds me of his name or whatever it is. You make a funny characteristic and you link them together. And in my book, I tell about five different ways to make an image really memorable. And the key point on this is that it's not memory, it is imagination. Some people will say I have a terrible memory, but they'll say I have a great imagination. Here's an example that I also use in my book. Think of any co worker that you know. Can you remember what he was wearing he or she was wearing last Monday? Well, how would you remember that? Right. It's not memorable at all. But what if your co worker was wearing a clown suit with a big pointy hat, orange hair, floppy shoes? You think you'd remember that and you know you would. And that's because it's different. It stands out. And so you wouldn't even have to try to remember. It would be automatically memorable because it stands out. And that's why we try to make crazy images in our mind. So when we see that person again, we look at that unibrow and that reminds us of their name automatically without even trying.

Yeah. Fascinating stuff. I'm seeing all the dots are connecting for me. And I guess my question for you is knowing the theory is one thing.

Yes.

And it's really easy to know the theory. Some people go, oh, it's going to take me too long to master it. So, you know, with this practice is obviously going to make perfect. Well, with most things. Right. But how do you suggest people get started in improving their memory, their abilities to know every name in the room?

Yes. You know, set yourself some reasonable goals. You know, you're not going to learn how to do 50 people at once. It took me a while to learn how to do this, too. But whenever you hear somebody's name, try to convert it into a memorable image. If you're watching a show, a program on tv, or you're watching a movie and you hear the character's name, try to convert it into a memorable image. So you're practicing whenever you hear a name and that. And you're going to get better at that. And there's going to be the popular names you're going to learn right away, you're going to get an image and always use that same image whenever you hear that It'll be like a Spanish English dictionary. You hear a name and you convert it to an image. So at first it may seem daunting, it may seem like a lot of mental overhead that has to happen. But as you continue with it, it will become second nature. You still have to think about doing it, but it will become very easy for you. And I don't have any special memory skills. I do not have a photographic memory or anything like that. I've studied just like everybody else, but I can do this. And so I know that anybody else can also with just the mindfulness and the practice.

Now, memorymagic.info. is your website. We're having an interesting chat about some challenges you had with domain names beforehand. But I noticed that memorymagic.info, obviously there's ways for people to get the book and some other resources. But you have a free email course as well.

Yes.

So what's included in that?

That's about how to remember anything. It's not just about names and it's one email sent each week for 20 weeks right now. And it does have a name memory in there, but it's got a lot of different techniques and so people can just read it. It's very fast. It's only like a two minute read. But it will help to remind the readers to practice their memory techniques for one. And they can get better at it, as you know, every week it'll be in their mailbox and will help them.

Yeah, well, that's a great free resource and we'll be sure to link in the show notes, I should say. But also other ways that people can follow your work and start to improve their memory. Certainly something that I need to sign up to that course. I'm terrible with names. I can describe the person to you, but sometimes I just can never pull that name. So as I've been reading your book, I've not finished it yet, but I've been loving the anecdotes, the stories and the really actionable insights. Before we wrap up, I've got two last questions for you. The first one though is what stops people from putting your work, your hints and tips in the book into action? What roadblock? What stops people from moving forward?

That's a great question. And it is what's called a self limiting belief. If you say to yourself, I have a terrible memory, you're training yourself to believe that. I had a problem with this when I was learning this as a professional magician. I got to a mental plateau of only 40 names. If the audience was less than 40 names, I would try to remember people as I'm doing my walk around magic and I would recite their names from stage. But if there was more than 40, I was too intimidated and so I didn't try. I finally got over that mental roadblock. Well, I thought, well, if there's 80 people there and I, I only remember half of them, that won't seem very good. But then I got over that. I said, well, it's still 40 names.

Yeah.

So I got over that and then that led me to get better and better. So actually got up to the point where I got up to 80 names and if people go to my website, they'll find a YouTube link where they can see me recalling 80 people at once. So the first thing is believing yourself. Just say, well, I'm just going to try it. Set a goal you can believe in. Like say, I'm going to learn how to do five names.

Yep.

So that's the first thing. And stop saying I'm bad at names, because that's teaching yourself.

Yep. Okay, great. So good to understand what stops most people. And the clear message there is stop the negative self talk and prove yourself wrong. Really? So leading into it, you can't use something you've already said today. I apologize, but what's the one thing an audience member should do today or in the next 24 hours after listening or watching this show to help them remember every name in the room?

One thing that I haven't mentioned yet, I would say self talk. When you see somebody, it's okay to be thinking about things about the person, maybe about how they look, and definitely say their name mentally to yourself. You know, repeat that and if possible, say the name back to the person. And I don't mean to repeat it, to say it over and over to the person, but be sure you use their name as soon as you hear it because you'll remember yourself saying their name and that will be something that will help you.

Yeah. Okay, fantastic. We've got a number of hints today for our audience and of course we briefly, really briefly talked about those three key elements of your program, which in and of itself sounds simple to look, listen and link, but the secret sauce is in, of course, going deeper and then applying and practicing those three look, listen and link. It has been an absolute pleasure, Bob, having you on the show today. Other than your website, how else can people follow your work?

My book is available on Amazon. They can also find me on Twitter. Bob Miller, author.

Fantastic.

Or I guess it's called X now. So Bob Miller, author on there.

Okay, fantastic. Well, we'll be sure to link to that as well. And again, thanks for your time today.

It's been a pleasure. Thank you very much for the opportunity.

Thank you.