376 The Online Community for New Accounting Firm Owners

Boy, do I have a special treat.

For you all today. It's none other than Logan McGrathman, founder of. You're not going to be on screen yet, but what's it called? Counter.

Counter.

Counter.

Founder of Counter.

A new community for accounting firm owners who are newly minted or perhaps about to be minted.

I think that's we're going to learn about today.

A super cool new accounting community that has sprung up.

So come on in, let's talk about what Logan's building.

Do you remember what the music is?

Yep.

That's the best you can do?

I can't hit those. Sounds like work on. I'm going to have to work on that. I need to do this again. So.

Okay. If anybody hasn't met Logan before or.

Seen his world famous YouTube videos or Twitter shit posts. Logan, what is the. What's the 32nd intro to Logan?

Hey, I'm Logan, run a CPA firm down in Austin, Texas. I happen to create content as well for other accountants. Love to post on X Twitter and create content for kind of the POV of how I run my firm. Also just started a community, Cold counter.

Okay, so that's why you're here today is we're, we're doing a whole like rapid fire. We're talked with most of the other like small firm community folks now.

Why did the world need another, another accountant community?

Man, I, I got, I talked to Jason actually almost two years ago probably it's like hey Jason, I'm. I should start a community or I want to start a community. I would it be about. And I was like I'm not really sure, maybe like tax. And he shot, he shot it down really fast. It is completely understandable why like ok, there's no direction in that. And I was just, I don't know, had no idea what I wanted to do. And then all of a sudden I started creating content about how I run my firm and I would get all these direct messages through Twitter and LinkedIn. Hey Logan, I'd love it if you could. If we could do a call. I'm about to launch my firm. I just launched my firm and I really like what you're doing or your content and can you help me out? And I got enough of those to where I was like, man, I, I had to. I pretty much said no to a lot of, a lot of people. Maybe one yes here and there and it made me feel bad because I, when I first started my firm I reached out to everybody including Jason about like hey what, what do I need to what do I need to consider? When I first launched my firm, and so now I'm denying all these people. So it felt pretty bad. But I did that. I said no because I was just getting so many requests and I had my own firm to run and I just couldn't do. I can't do that one on one, not enough time. And I was like, man, there's enough people that seem to relate to my content and want to start a firm. I think a community could. Could help everybody that wants help. And I can make it to where it's almost a one on, not a one on one, me and them, but I can almost help everybody at the same time as a community itself. And that seems like a way more approachable way and probably economical way for people that want advice and way more value that way instead of me helping them one on one. So that was the genesis of Counter. And that. That was probably about a year ago. About a year ago is when I was really thinking, like, okay, I think the. The community makes sense. I think there's enough people that would be interested.

What finally got you off your duff to actually do it?

So I. I teased the community since January 2024 as I. I would post it in my content, Twitter, YouTube videos. And I was just like, I'm doing this. I don't know what I'm gonna launch, but I'm doing this and I want to do this. And then it wasn't until, like, Like, I knew I was gonna do it, but it wasn't until I actually, like, started to work on Counter. When Mike and Rebecca announced theirs, like in August or June, maybe they announced it in June. I was like, oh, shoot, they're gonna launch a community before me. And I've been talking about this for months. So there, it just lit the fire in me. I was like, I actually need to do this before the end of the year. Cause I said I was gonna do it in 2024. I was like, I actually need to do this. And then them launching or talking about launching, I was like, I need to do this sooner than later because I haven't done anything. I just kind of thought about it and put my thoughts on some notes. And then, so it really wasn't until, like August or September, a month and a half before I actually launched, where I was like, all right, here's everything I need to do. Like, here's the actual tangible things that I need to do to launch this community.

Do you. What's your relationship to, like, calling your shot? Like, if you had to do it again. Like, do you tell people what you're gonna do ahead of time? Like, was that a helpful forcing function to get you to do it or do you just ta da, surprise people and like, would you keep it under wraps more?

I think it was. I liked the way that I did it because I, I created an interest form right off the start. So back in January I said, here's a form if you're interested. I also used it as a way to collect ideas for content because I kind of was like, hey, if you want to see more content from me, what would you like to see? And. And then I put on like a community, you know, enter in your email if you want to be notified when this community launches. And so I was able to build up a email list of about 600 people. And then I was able to kind of build the desire like the. I don't know, it was. I teased it to where people were ready to join. I think I probably shouldn't have waited so long. That's on me because it just got busy with fall tax season. But I really think I was able to build enough anticipation for the community. So when I did launch, it was like full steam ahead from the start.

What, what did that look like? Because you're, I mean, launch didn't happen so long ago. What, what was launch like? Was there programming that was part of launch? What did that look like?

Yeah, we launched a month ago basically and I had a launch series thanks to your realize series on members only got to brainstorm launch events, how to do a launch event or what to do for a launch event. And so the whole idea behind the launch series, because I was geared for the new firm owner avatar and like people that wanted to start a firm, I really, I really had a series on the content was all about like, I started a firm now what? And so because when you, when you do start a firm or about to, you're like, shoot, what do I do about marketing? What do I do about services and packages? What do I do about software? Those are the main things that people have the most questions on. And so having that series as the draw, kind of the value from the start, I think was very helpful. And it was a pretty big hit. A lot of people. During each live session, there are three sessions. One about how to get clients, one about services and packages and pricing, and then one about software.

What are some, I guess, like, different, different advice for new firm owners. Like, what's something that maybe it's helpful to turn your brain off to in the beginning or I guess advice that goes counter to normal accounting firm advice, like specifically for new folks.

You gotta turn off your accountant brain when you're running a business because a lot of us are get trapped in like the typical accounting firm model and it's really hard to break out of that, like, especially when it comes to pricing and services. Like, we're just stuck in this like, box where we have to see what other what our competitors pricing and just copy their pricing. And so really you, you have to like, understand that you're a business owner also and that you're trying to make money. And you do that by selling your services and your expertise. And you have to really take advantage of. Of that and not trying to be a boring accountant. And running a firm as an accountant, you have to run it as like an entrepreneur. And that's, that's the hard part. And that's kind of something that I'm trying to help solve with the community itself is like, hey, we got to think not like the traditional accountant accounting firm. We got to think counter to the traditional firm.

Yeah.

Is that like, I don't know, what are some examples of how you have done that in your firm? Like avoided, I guess some of the common traps.

Pricing, evolving pricing, using pricing as like a, a lever for capacity. So people are like, how did you come up with that pricing? Like, why, why are you pricing so much? And I was like, I, I price based on how many clients I have and how many clients I want to have and want to. Want to come in front of me to get. To get in front of me to potentially become a client. And when I have already a lot of work that I have to do and not much capacity to bring on new clients, I increase my pricing. And then the clients that came in from the start, I start to up their pricing to catch up to the market rate. And then so I let the market essentially supply and demand drive the pricing instead of just coming up with a number that I think people would be happy with. Yeah.

That first 24 months, like when you're doing your, your own thing, I imagine especially when you're starting more from scratch. I know you, you had bought a small book of business initially, but is there any escape from the desperation in the beginning where it's like you'll take just about anything because you need just about anything, but then you also feel bad when 18 months later you're charging, you know, three times as much? Like, is that just something you have to get over or is there a solution to that?

Yeah, the way I did it was I didn't evolve my pricing fast enough to where for my returning clients. So you have people that came in about 400, 500, and then all of a sudden I'm charging the same type of client fifteen hundred dollars, and I'm like, oh, no, it's really hard to work for that 500 client now. So you have to, you have to set the expectation about price increases. But when the first 24 months, like you said, is wild, like, you have to bring in the work. And so it depends. What type of financial situation are you in? Do you have to have the money? Uh, does your. Is your firm like the primary source of income for you or your family then? Yeah, you have to, you have to grind and hustle for that, for that money to know that you're secure. But if you are in a little bit more comfortable financial situation, you have a bunch of savings or a loan that you can rely on, then you can try to be a little more picky with who you work with and try to price what you want to price in the next. Like, set your price into what you want it to be in the next 12 or 24 months in the future. Because you. The thing about when you're. When your firm is evolving really fast, your pricing is going to evolve really fast. And you, I think, Jason, you've told me about how to. This tip is like, you really want to think about, like, the client that you want in the next. In the future, in the next two years instead of. And you got a price for that client because you're just going to be changing their pricing very soon if you don't. So you have to think about what type of client do I want and what type of client would I charge that client in the future? Maybe I'm not there now, but it's going to happen soon. And so you, you kind of have to set that price now to kind of future. Future proof you a little bit. And you don't have to do it that way, but that'll definitely help when it comes to the emotional aspect of raising prices on people, because that's never a fun conversation to have. Yeah.

It also helped, like, convince me that those clients existed too, and that it was real. Like, in your head. You're like, I would love to have more of this type of client that will pay me this. But, like, until people actually do, then you don't actually know that they'll agree to it. But, like, proposals are really funny that way where proposals, I mean, Proposals pretty much craft your entire reality of what someone will actually pay you. And until someone does and agrees to it, you kind of don't believe it until that actually happens.

Yeah. I can't believe people are signing up for my packages, like my pricing right now. And it's, it's wild, but that's just the way the market has, has worked. Like I, I would never have imagined I can charge a $1,200 price for a simple return that I would have charged three years ago, $400. So. But you don't know until you try it.

Yeah. Yeah. What's the, like, what's the wisdom in that for the super scared early stage firm runner? Is it to, is it to charge more than you think you can or is it to just be willing to evolve really quickly? Like be willing to change from where you start in a more agile way?

Yeah, I would say set certain like metrics like, hey, I just added 10 clients. I'm going to bump up the pricing to this amount or 20 clients and set intervals to where your pricing will evolve because that way you're able to, you're able to really find that sweet spot of pricing.

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You're one of not all that many people that I know that started their firm by like taking some clients from a past role, like not fully starting from scratch even. And if I remember, like, not necessarily clients that are like, you know, AAA amazing clients, almost like these will pay the bills initially sort of clients. Is that something. You gotta get this question a lot. Is that something that you recommend people do or do you think they're better off literally just rolling it from scratch?

Yeah, I'm, I'm making a video right now just about that purchase and how, how that's gone for me. And it wasn't too long ago where I calculated like the ROI on those clients that I bought and it's, it's, it's like 700% from the original purchase price. And so like hearing that, dude, that, that's like, that's insane. And I have less work as well, less, you know, because a lot of those clients are gone. But I'm still making a lot of money off of them. And like I was against, I flip flop, I was against buying clients. But when you hear about a 700% ROI and you don't have to do the grind of that organic growth and meeting with every single client, adding clients and onboarding them and all of that individually, it just, it's so much work. And then to realize that you can buy clients that are a good fit. Now I had a, the situation that I was in was a very good situation where I had worked with these clients before I bought them. So it was a good fit. And I. Yeah, so it has to be the right circumstance for it to work. But I think that, I think that wouldn't be too hard to find, especially in today's market, or it won't be too hard to find in five and 10 years a good set of clients where they're going to stay with you. There's going to be some that leave, but you can adjust the services that you offer them and the pricing to where it's, you're saving a ton of time from compared to like growing on your own. So based on my experience, I'm probably leaning more towards buy the book instead of trying to grow organically. Growing organically can happen very easily and very cheaply. You just have to invest a lot of time. And that's the thing. Do you want to invest a lot of time or you want to invest a little bit of money and save a whole bunch of time? Yeah.

And like even I think the counter argument I, you must hear is people saying, well, they're not going to be a great fit for me or I'm gonna grow out of them. And it's like, I think the purpose of them is like to get you through that first 18 months. Like even if you, I mean, honestly, even if I went that route and churned them all, I would only be churning them if I had slotted something else in. So like, if they served the purpose of getting me there, then I then like, it kind of. It got me there in the end.

Yeah. Yep. It's a cheat, it's, it's a cheat code, honestly, because they, they can potentially refer you. Refer to you as well and get better clients that way. So it's, it's a really good situation.

Where do people source those deals? I mean, there's no shortage of like super legacy firms that you don't want to touch. But like for someone looking for something small, like how do they, how do they seek those things out?

I would try to find some sort of local, well, depending on how you want to go. But you can find a lot of local organizations where it's just a group of, it's like a regional level networking type situation for other accountants or accounting firm, tax firm owners. And that whole group they'll have, the average age will probably be like 65. And networking with those types of groups will be a good place to start. There's accounting firm brokerages, but that's probably more for your, your bigger firms, not like your small kind of solopreneur firms. That would be a good place to start. So try to find something local and that'd be your best bet for finding, you know, like a $100,200,000 book. But that's all, that's all anecdotal because I don't really have too much research backing me up. But I was in a local tax practice networking group with about 100 people in it. And I can see every once in a while they're like, hey, I'm getting out of the game. Who wants to buy my firm? And so the, those are good opportunities.

Should people get hung up on the demographics or is that missing the point? Like are you genuinely just looking for someone with a pulse who will pay you to do work initially?

You probably have to depending on what type of firm you want to run. If you want to run a virtual firm, you have to make sure that their client base, you know, how is their client base meeting, meeting up with the CPA or delivering information to them. So you probably want to make sure that they are mostly virtual because otherwise there would be a lot of friction, be a lot of work getting all those paperless, those clients paperless and but older firm owners, they work with everybody. And so like they're not only going to work with their age demographic, they're going to be working with everybody because they have such a probably they probably already have a well established network. So there's not only going to be people that probably are just used to the paper documents, there's going to be a whole mix of stuff and then you can focus on the people that are, are very comfortable with digital apps and stuff.

Virtual firm stuff you have, you got maybe the best undressing over email that I've ever seen from a guy that just all caps laid into you and said you're never going to be a shadow of whatever some, you know, past.

Like Cassie, you'll never be a Kathy.

Or yeah, never hold a candle to Kathy. I think that was over. There were, I think they were beside themselves that you wouldn't meet in person. Is that right?

Yes. Yes. I had a potential client just absolutely freak out because I only meet virtually for new client meetings. And they wrote an all caps email back, like, you'll never be like this CPA that they had before who's retiring and just said my business was going to fail. Like, just went on to just. I have that email saved somewhere because it was, it was epic. And I, yeah, I sent it to Jason. It was just because of how comical it was.

Yeah. I mean, that's worth, like, that's worth hanging up on the wall. Like, it was so good. Okay. Your firm. It's been fun to follow the journey of your firm. If you, if you haven't seen. We'll. We'll link it down in the show notes. I think the, I mean, my favorite videos of yours. Every year when you like unpack your whole income statement and you're like, here's what I did right, here's what I did wrong. And it's. I think it's probably the most transparent look into a firm that there is. But, like, it's been a super positive journey. Like, people can follow it year over year from the stage that was. I hope I can replace my W2 to like, I'm making more money than I could have imagined. Which, not to discount your capabilities, but I think is a pretty common story among people that launch firms. Like, I think that's, that's very common. That folks quicker than they expect get to the point where they're like, I got way too much to do. And what you thought was going to be a money problem has now become a, like, boundaries problem. And like, figuring out how to take the foot off the gas pedal. But like, I think your version of this is probably the most transparent one that exists.

I have to imagine that's how a.

Big percentage of folks find you still. It's just like that storytelling, that transparency of like just sort of sharing anything and everything about your firm.

Yeah. Those are my top videos still. And they're still getting lots of views every month. And it's. No one has really done it either since. So I feel they've maybe done it in more of a LinkedIn post type post. Like, oh, here's how much revenue I've grown. But it's all kind of vanity metrics because they're not going into, here's how much money I actually took home, like, how much money I made. I think that's a step that people are afraid to make for some reason. I'm not. I Guess I just have no shame that could be it. Nothing to lose, nothing to hide type of attitude about that. But you know, I go over all of my expenses, you know, here's how much money I spent on software unashamedly, like people are like, how do you spend 40k on software? It just blows their mind. I'm like, I don't really care about that cost. That cost is why I can make, you know, close to 300k with only one employee and a very part time contractor. And so I, I'm very transparent, not trying to hide anything. I also started this year, I'm, I'm. For my 2023 video, I was able to compare like how many hours I worked as well because I really started tracking my time and how much hours it, it'll change because of an employee hiring an employee. So that's like cool metrics that people would want to know about. Like, okay, so you're making this much money now and you're spending this much time less because of employee. That seems like a really good decision to make. And it's, it probably breaks down a lot of anxiety for people that want to do a similar journey as me. I've, I've, I've read people like, say to me like, Logan, I want to basically run your firm. I want to set it up exactly the way you do it. And I think it's because of those videos and I make it so approachable. I'm not, I'm not some, I'm not Jason Stats where I, I can just work so hard and just create a million dollar CAS practice in a year. So I'm not that type of guy. I'm very, I'm pretty lazy honestly. And so I want to make the money in the most efficient way possible. I know we all want to, but like I'm just lazy in that way, I guess. And so, and it's worked out really well and I'm, I'm still making a good amount of money for the work I'm putting in. And it's definitely hard work, but it's, it's definitely doable. Like, like Jason said, if Logan can do it, you can do it too. That's a pin comment on my video.

Is it really?

I commented that on your video, if.

He said if Logan just, you're like, just know if Logan can do it, you can do it too. It's like my 2022 video.

Oh, what a sick burn it is.

It's a burn. But it's also very true because yeah, I'm Not I'm not trying to be like the hardest working person out there, make the most amount of money. So like if you identify with that, then here's what's possible.

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That's 100. It's 100% a real thing because my, my vibe and content is definitely, can be pretty intense. But also like the production value and the over top stuff like that, like, I think it's actually not always, it's not super relatable. So I can, I can say you can do xyz and people are like, well, I'm not, I'm not that guy. I'm not that person. I'm. I'm an accountant or something like that. So like that. I think that is a very real thing. Has that transparency when has that like come back around on you? Has it ever in a meaningful way?

I honestly don't think it has. Like, nothing negative has come from me being transparent. Like I probably get judged by people, but I don't feel that judgment in any way unless they like post a. Post a mean comment. But I've, I've really hadn't like the, the biggest negative comment is like, how could you spend that much money on software? So I. Clients know that I have a YouTube channel, so I'm sure some of them have watched the channel and know how much money I make and know how to approach making money. And that still hasn't come back at me at all. And I've, I've even had a client say like, this is actually really cool what you're doing and be encouraged by it and just like kind of take comfort in, in the way I'm running my business.

Is funny. People will be afraid to literally post on LinkedIn because, like, they don't think that their accountant should be doing that. Or like they will literally refrain from commenting on someone's social media post because they think all of their clients will see and all of their clients will leave as a result. And you will literally say, look at how much money I make. I'm super rich now. All made on the back of my clients on whom I. I give astronomical price increases every single year just to fill my Scrooge McDuck pockets even more. And you still have people lined up out the door that want to work with you saying, great job.

Yeah, it, I understand that fear 100%. It will cross my mind every once in a while. But I'm like, who cares?

You're like, I maybe I shouldn't have said the client's exact name in this video. But, oh well, they probably won't see it. Okay. To bring this full circle to the community. Talked about the launch event. What is ongoing life in the community look like, like what is, what's the long term value for folks hanging out there and meeting other people running firms?

Yeah, everything's recorded. So our launch series is, is complete, but it's recorded. So if you're like, I just started a firm, now what? Well, come on in and watch the series called exactly that. But yeah, we're, we've got some rituals that we do every month that are going to happen every month. And it's, it's a constantly evolving community. So as, as we kind of grow depending on how the community feels about things, we're going to constantly add and evolve to, to provide the most value for everybody. We have a suggestion box space where people can suggest things. And so it's, it's a good way to hear from the community. But you know, two, two rhythms that I'm really proud of is we have a series called our One Thing Series. This is going to be at least monthly one. It's called One Thing Series. And that's where we get other accounting firm owners an opportunity to speak on one thing that they wish they did differently or one thing that they're glad that they did at the start of running their firm. And so hope hopefully that'll help other community members avoid or do that one thing. And we really flush out what that thing is during the session. And we will go off on tangents and talk about other things during the session, but that's a, that's one of them. And then another ritual is we're actually bringing outside experts outside the accounting industry in to help upskill our members and running their business better. Because like I kind of said in the, and earlier in the session in our, in the podcast where we run our firms as like an accountant would run our firm, not as like a business owner, like someone with a good business mindset. And so I'm bringing in outside experts. So this, so, so for example, for December, we have Thomas Koppelman. He's a financial advisor for Millennials. And he's, he's probably our age, but he niched down to niche down to working only with millennials. And so he has a firm, he built his firm to, he's going to surpass a million dollars in revenue. And he's niched down to just working with a subset of, you know, clients. And so we're gonna have him come in him come in to the community and discuss all about niching down and how he did it and things that he's learned from niching and, and what he would recommend for us as well. So I think that's a, those are two, two main things that we have set up right now. But like I said, there's a bunch of other fun stuff that's, that's going to be happening as we grow.

Are there any boundaries like for folks that are maybe just outside of that, like they're still on the fence about whether they want to do their own thing or maybe they're a couple years into it, like are there any boundaries around that that define whether somebody would be a fit or not?

Yeah, I, if you're about to launch your firm, if you want to launch your firm within the next year, I would recommend joining. But if it's like kind of just a dream, you're like, oh, I think that would be cool one day it's probably not a, it's probably too soon for you because there's not much that you can do from a tangible standpoint. You can give me money, that's great. But for it to be of actual value for you, you probably want to join within a year of launching. And then we've, we have some firm owners that have, that have been a accountant for 30 plus years but they had recently launched their firm. So we've got a wide range of demographics. But I'm recommending if you're within five, if even if you have a firm and you're kind of established, if it's been less than five years of running your firm and you're like I'm not really going where I want to go with my firm, I'd recommend joining as well. Big firms probably not a good fit. People have huge teams because there's a lot of smaller firms in the community right now we have about 220 members and so they're all over the place either just accounting, just tax. We have some wealth, wealth management type firms. Handful of audit auditors are in here.

Oh gross.

Your heart. But yeah, so we've got a, we've got a good set of members so far.

At the risk of sounding self congratulatory, isn't that cool? All the stuff that's out there for new firm owners, that wasn't like five years ago. Just the fact that you make friends on social media that do this stuff and it just feels like there's more support than ever before.

It's amazing. Yeah. And thank you Jason for starting realize and doing all this because I wouldn't be here without, without you. I would never have thought about a community for accountants at all. And you gave Me the blueprint of what it could look like. That's helped me out tremendously.

It sounds like I just tore up your tax community blueprint is what I did.

You led me in the right direction. You're like, you probably need to focus on like a very subset of people, not like a tax. So. And I recommend people joining realize Jason's community. If, you know, if you run an established firm and you're looking for other, you're looking for community to test out software and to really leverage each other into improving your firm. And there's been members that have joined that just like, hey, I'm, I'm, I'm not part of this group because I don't identify with this group because, you know, I run a team and I say please join realize because this is, that that will be the place for you.

Okay, one last question that I'm, I'm kind of making sure to ask everybody. I'm, I'm of the mind that it's still very, very early days for communities and communities are almost kind of the future of everything. But like we, we did, we got a good number of new communities here in the last few months. And so there's a bit of overwhelm of like, do I go here, do I go there?

Like, how does that impact communities long term?

And like, where do you see this stuff going or do you think about that?

Yeah, I see communities. Even though we're all in kind of our silos right now, I almost see like a, we're almost a sub community and create a master community of other accountants or accounting firm owners. So basically becoming the next association, AICPA type association for accountants. And I think that's the future of, of the, of communities for, for us, for our, our type of people as accountants. I think AICPA is, is kind of losing its grasp and its relevancy and maybe other, other professional associations are as well. But I, I see as all these other communities that are popping up to work together essentially and almost forming a way to crisscross and network with each other to form almost like a master community of itself. And that way everybody is connected and we don't have this kind of overlord system where it's governed by people at the top. So I think it's going to look very, very cool in the future. How would you think about that, Jason?

I definitely see communities developing more into something that looks more like an association. I think they probably settle into their lanes of relevance and the specific people that they serve in the very beginning when I made my community. The biggest question was why does this, why is this necessary? Like, we already have a community on social media. Like what, like why. Why should people go to pay to be in a more private space? And I think that's kind of proven out the value of it to like, because it unlocks so many things like permission to have access to other people and it's just a much more intimate setting. I don't know, I don't know if it, if it's a, if it's a, if it's a rollup or if it's a product of like everyone in the profession just enabling a much greater level of transparency and that's. And everyone just works like, has a much greater appetite for working together, whether that requires a community platform or whether that just is like social media, which is where practically everyone spends their time now. And like the most pure version of that is, is just like a greater level of collaboration between professionals which hopefully communities and stuff like that serve to inspire. It takes, you know, it takes some sort of organization to do kind of coordinated, coordinated things and advocate for the profession and stuff like that. But I would, I would totally agree that I see the trend going more towards something more akin to an association than like, you know, a little community which is kind of how they, how they feel right now.

Yeah, imagine like a, an alliance of other accounting communities, magicians, account communities. Yeah, it sounds super nerdy, but yes.

Yeah. So on the path to taking over the world, we'll have counter plugged in the show notes for sure. Where else should people go out and find. Find Logan.

Yeah, find me on LinkedIn or Twitter. I make YouTube videos, but I post them on LinkedIn and X as well so you can get a taste of it.

You've been crushing the social lately.

Thank you. LinkedIn is top tier now.

Oh my gosh.

What happened to Twitter? Because the algorithm, something happened and LinkedIn is so much like more engaged and positive, even though half of it are bots. But you feel great when, when the bots engage. Yeah, they're like, great idea.

Thought provoking emoji. Okay, well, thank you for doing what you do and keep doing it. We'll link Logan's stuff down in the show notes. Go find him there and let's do this again. Logan.

Thanks, man. Thanks for having me, Sam.