401 How To Run Your Firm’s First Webinar 🖥️

Gang webinars in 2025, they remain probably the best way to break through and actually like make connections with other humans. For all the ways that there are to attract leads or make people aware of your existence, like posting on social media, that sort of thing, you still got to do something to kind of get them into that next step and humanize you and make you something more than just a face or an avatar that they see online. So regardless of where those people are coming in for you, whether it's a product of like giving a talk somewhere locally, or whether it's like you've built a little bit of an email list over a couple of years and you need something to do with it to like breathe some life into it, a webinar is actually the right answer for most people. So today, talking through kind of some, some common blockers of why we don't do this, talking through the upsides, talking through the very practical technicals of oh, platform to use and that sort of thing, and then I'll share with you the story of how I actually started doing webinars in my own accounting firm as well. And I think you'll probably be able to relate to it. So come on in, let's talk. Let's talk about webinars. Let me just start out by saying I'm so sick of webinars. Holy mama llama. Like, the bar has gotten so low for production value, excitement, level of engagement that most people these days, they, they do one of two things. They sign up planning on getting a link to the recording and watching it at 2.5x and skipping through it and seeing if it's even worthwhile for them. Or they join live and they sit there responding to emails the whole time. And I think it's just a symptom of the larger sort of meeting overwhelm and burnout that we all have, where it's like you've got umpteen meetings on your calendar every single day. We're probably not doing enough to protect ourselves from low value meetings getting on there. And so you find yourself in a situation where you're in a meeting or in a thing, but very distracted and trying to do something else at the same time and probably not doing a good job at either of those things. So what does this mean? One that means stop wasting your time on useless webinars or clickbait webinars. And there's so many from our software vendors that are very general, like, oh, improve this or that workflow thing. And it's very general and you're like, oh, that sounds nice, and you get on and it's the same talk track you've heard a hundred times. But also means, number two, there's an opportunity there for you to break through and do something better, something actually useful. And the biggest advantage we have as technical professionals is we know our stuff and we've had these conversations with clients all day, every day, and we have so much to offer, and we can, you know, for all the fluff that's out there that is not rooted in anything technically helpful, we are struggling with the other end of the spectrum where we are fully technical and we don't know how to put that out into the world in a way that is engaging. But compared to everyone else that's out there, just like pumping things into the ether, you have a lot of meaningful things to say. And as we talk about a lot here, the more specific it is, like who it is you're trying to say something to, the more useful it will be. Don't show people how to read it. P and L show, you know, H Vac people how to read a P, L, like, figure out what that specificity looks like for you. The more specific you get, the lower the bar will be for how good it has to be, and the more useful it will be, too, because you can speak very specifically to that person. Touched on this up top, a webinar is probably the single best way to convert someone from sort of tangential awareness of your existence to, oh, there's an actual human being here that I could connect with and potentially buy something from. If. If that's kind of the angle where we're coming at this from. There's a reason that pretty much every funnel is designed this way. You've got a sequence of emails and then a video that you can watch and then a live events. Like, there is a reason why you see that from virtually every software vendor from online influencers. Again, I don't want to fall into the cheesy version of that or the version of that that we're all sick of, but it's a thing, and it's actually an easier thing to do than you would think. So five points here. I wanted to run through number one. Let's consider what our why is for. Why would we run a podcast? So that we can I say podcast. Why would we run a webinar? So that we can make sure that the efforts we're doing are always coming back to that why? Uh, for most of us, that's probably to bring those leads a Little bit closer to becoming a client. In other situations it will be to disseminate information in a one to many format. They'll save you a pile of time as compared to having to do all that one on one. So recent things that have been going on, maybe that is new tax legislation, maybe it's corporate Transparency act. If you can save yourself a pile of time running one 30 minute webinar and then share like resharing that down the road rather than re explaining the same things over and over again or even like pulling the bullet points out and sharing those and saying here's the long version if you want to see it. That's absolutely worth your while. And we'll get that information out to clients in a human way much more efficiently than calling every single client. But most of the time this is probably going to boil down to how do I keep bringing people further into my web? Maybe convert a couple of people off of a. Maybe a monthly or a weekly email newsletter that I'm writing with the goal of attracting a better client to my firm. Remember, what we're trying to do here is get to a more intentional client list of, of more premium folks, people for whom we are we are solving really painful problems. Because every time I can attract one of those better clients, it usually means I can cut like three legacy projects where the cumulative like profit contributed to the firm of those three old projects is equal to this one. And it's not because we're doing three times the work. It's because we can price that engagement more aggressively because the problems we're solving are more valuable to that individ. And these clients don't just stumble in the door like, you know. The only clients that we know that we can get are the ones that we already have. And that's what makes this hard, is trusting this notion that there are people out there who will pay you more for what you do. Spoiler alert. There are firms way bigger than you, doing way lower quality work, charging 10 times as much as you. There are an abundance of people out there who will pay more for what you do. But just sitting back and waiting for referrals and those people to walk in the door is a very unoptimized version of that where you will get work and you will get busy. But busy isn't the goal. Busy is not something to wear like a badge of honor. Better is the goal here. Running webinars, giving people something to latch onto. That goes a long way with people when committing to a new professional, even if they senior Thought leadership online. Like, not being able to see over the fence of what it's like to actually work with that person. That's a spooky thing. Like, there's actually a lot of stress with switching service providers when you may not be super happy with the account that you have, but at least it is something that's known. Right? But giving them something they can connect with, like a, like a webinar or even answering their questions live or something like that, it takes them a step closer. We'll see if it's enough, but it takes them a step closer. Second thought here. Don't overthink the how this is such an accountant thing to do is the moment you're turning the corner on. Yeah, this is a thing that I should do. When we immediately get blocked with, like, platform overwhelm and, oh, the lighting and. And your webcam, all these, these different things. Like, we are so chronically paralyzed by this. And in my experience, most accountants are biased to, like, under. Under kind of put themselves out there. As a result, rather than being biased to, you know, if you're talking about posting on social media, you're better off being biased to posting more, leaning into the volume game, within reason, because it's those repetitions that make you better. And every single one of those that you do, you learn. And so if you park the bus on running a webinar until the summer, because I just don't have my office set up right. Had you run a couple webinars this month or over the next couple of months, the questions and considerations that would be top of mind when you run webinars in the summer would be so much better. Just because you've gotten some of those repetitions in and those repetitions might be trying to run a webinar and nobody showing up or only a few people showing up. But that's how you gotta start. Like, you gotta do the sucky version of it before you ever do the really, really good version of it. So try not to, like, get in your own way when you think about platforms and all of this. My recommendation is like, just do this on Zoom. It could literally be a regular old Zoom meeting. Like, pay attention to the settings. And you probably want to enable, you know, participants automatically being muted when they join the Zoom. But if this is gonna be a little bitty event, that's probably just fine. Zoom does have a webinar feature and webinar license where you can run an event and all the attendees join, but they're not actually on video and they have limited ways in which they can interact with you. That might not actually be a good thing. If you think 15 people are going to sign up for this webinar. And a 15 person webinar is absolutely worthwhile. Like, don't get too concerned about doing numbers here because a very small number of new relationships and new clients can completely transform a small accounting firm. And so if it's going to be a little event, the more personal it is, the better. So a regular old zoom call might be just fine. Now a really valuable thing, maybe the most valuable part of that webinar feature is it gives you a landing page where people can sign up and provide their email address and then they get a link to the event that's really, really valuable to incentivize people to give you their email address where maybe you didn't have that before, then you can, you know, put them on the weekly email list, put them on some sort of drip campaign. If they signed up for something related to tax strategies, then maybe you got a little email campaign that's like a sequence of five emails, you know, the top five email strategies for taxidermists. And then for the people that read every single one of those emails, maybe you, you send them a calendar link and offer to hop on a 20 minute call with them or something like that. So if you're able to capture the email addresses from this webinar, that's really valuable. But, but again, the trap here is to overcomplicate it and think you gotta go in and pull in some like, you know, conference platform or something like that. Reality is you just need to make connections with people. That's the main goal here. We don't need to overthink it. This episode is sponsored in part by Live Flow. Hey, it's New Year's time, people turn it up to the gym and record numbers. And if you ate like I did over the holidays, oh boy, is it, is it time to cut back? I'm not proud, but you know one area of our firms that we don't talk about being lean enough with the information we put in front of our clients. Good golly, the reports we run from our tax software, from our accounting ledgers. You actually think the clients look at that? They sure don't. I can't even get them to read my email, let alone go through a 60 page report. And so if that balance sheet and profit loss is not something that your client's actually going to make sense, or God forbid, the report from, I don't know, your tax planning software. Your bna. Gross. If they're not gonna make sense of that, maybe it's time for a better way to put information in front of your client. AKA liveflow's new Financial Dashboards. They can be as sweaty or as simplified as you like. You can connect them with a QBO or a zero file so they'll pull that data in automatically and you can augment them with any sort of additional information you want to. I'm a big notion nerd. It's the closest thing I've seen to notion for financial stuff. Pretty cool Kay. We did actually a demo of the new Financial Dashboard stuff on the YouTube channel recently. Just go search Jason on Firms Live Flow simple financial dashboard YouTube video. Just pop that in the YouTube search bar. You'll find it. Or check out the link down in the Show Notes this episode is sponsored in part by Financial Sense. If you were plugged into my 2025 practice management system recommendations, you would have seen Financial Sense on the list. I know a bunch of really smart firms that run Financial Cents. I have. I've been on record as saying it is arguably the best small firm all in one. Er, right now it's really hard to have a PM that does both tax and accounting work well. And while I'm not a believer in all in ones that do everything from tax intake to nailing proposals and all of that, what I am a fan of is the platforms that get closest to that. Right? Because at the end of the day I do want all in one and I also want them to be investing in a more all in one path to where maybe right now that feature isn't good enough for me to replace that other tool, but I could see how two or three years down the road it is. I want that as opposed to the platforms that aren't investing in that way. Right? Financial Cents has actually absolutely been crushing their marketing the last couple of years. They run an annual thought leadership event for accountants. It's really good that I've been a part of. They're putting out actually really good social media thought leadership as well. Not just around like buy my product, but around better ways to run small firms. And those are the brands I want to get behind. Like those are the brands I want to work with. They got a smart vision for the right way to do it and the product's going to be a reflection of that. Learn more about Financial Sense. Check out the link down in the Show Notes Thought number three Use this webinar as a lead magnet after it's already Been done. So you do this webinar, you record it, you're going to get some smart questions there. That's point number four. I'm getting ahead. Let's jump to point number four. The webinar itself will serve as great content and you can harvest questions from that to spin that out into, you know, Q and A stuff on social media. Those sessions will inform you better as to what were the most valuable parts of that session and what are the biggest questions those people have that are actually joining and engaging in the webinar. If you did capture the email address of people signing up, if you want, optionally, you can send out access to the recording of the event or you can use as a lead magnet longer term. After that, join the email list and I'll send you this recording of the last webinar that we did. It's not as good as doing it live, but if it's built around a really specific thing that people are excited about, that webinar then becomes an asset that you can leverage to get connected with more people. Right. Fifth point here, last one I had be thinking about how to make it better. Webinars are not a one and done thing. In fact, in traditional marketing, most people would tell you to always be rerunning that same webinar to get more people into the mix. Because actually running the same webinar ensures that you're putting out like the best version of that webinar that you can. Because the first version of it that you do it won't be the best one. And not everybody's gonna be able to make that first one. I think where we block ourselves here is we think that everybody sees everything that we do. And if somebody sees that you're running the same webinar again, they're gonna be like, is this person like a, like a one trick pony? This is weird. The reality is virtually nobody who saw that you were doing it the first time joined and along the way is a bunch of new eyeballs probably that are seeing it for the first time. Even if you were posting about it before and people were following you. Always remember, I mean, even with me, most of the things that I post, even if someone's following me, if they scroll their algorithm, they will never see that thing that I posted unless it is performing really well and looks like other stuff that they've engaged with in the past. So that that spotlight effect kind of voice that's telling you can't do the same thing again, everybody's gonna see that. The thing you probably need to do is, is actually the opposite is the same thing again and again, iterating on it, making it better each time so that each month it gets a little bit better and you pull a few, a few more people in. It's much like, you know, social media posting strategy where you put pressure on yourself to have something new and novel to say every single day. When in reality the highest converting version of that is you finding 100 different ways to say the same thing. And it's all around that one thing that converts really, really well. That is the thing that people will most engage with. And it's tied to a specific type of person. Like, you know, single clinic dental offices, like, you know, the framing of insurance companies and big dental groups being the bad guys and how like you're kind of there to represent, you know, the, the, the little guy. Those are the people that you work with and, and you're finding a hundred ways to talk about that story and why you believe that and the ways that you help people or you know, the biggest stressor that's facing beekeepers at a certain stage of running their beekeeping business, a hundred different ways of hammering on that one, you know, compliance issue that they get stuck on when they hit a million in revenue or, or something like that. This may sound not very sexy or boring, but the most business optimized way of running social media, running content, is cranking on those same subjects that convert the best. And it takes a lot of experimentation to find that stuff that converts the best. I would say that there's also some encouragement to be taken from that because it means you don't have to be novel and coming up with brand new things every single day, that's not realistic for most of us, especially if we like actually have a job, we're trying to get work done. And then this social media thing is kind of a side thing. It's interesting. A lot of, a lot of folks are stuck between. I don't want to specialize. I love the challenge of getting to work with different types of people and get into different types of things. But then the same people are like, I'm having a really hard time building systems for my firm. It's like, well, it's because you take in all sorts of different types of people. You take them in via different ways. The other end of the spectrum, there is a super specialized firm that's taking in people with a very, very specific problem. And when you have a firm that's more specialized in that way, it becomes so much easier to serve them because you know how to solve that problem that they have. And you have a very specific funnel of people where each of your clients coming in look very, very similar because they all have that same problem. And so then if you're marketing, if your webinar, if your social media posts are speaking to that high converting problem and you have compelling solutions for it, it becomes really easy to serve those clients in a turnkey way because they're also similar. It's not a hairstylist and a phlebotomist and a dog walker. And they all have different ways of managing spend and different organizational structures and all these different things. The beauty of, of, of content is the opportunity for that specificity to say we're the best solution for this very specific problem. And once you convert them to working with your firm, then those, the services themselves can be so much more turnkey because you're working with a more specific type of client. It is exceptionally hard to build systems around a non specialized client base. It will always feel like you're only ever going to be as good as the people that you have because you're so reliant upon expertise in an environment like that. Can't really build systems when every single project that you're taking on is different. So you have to have a bunch of really good people and you can certainly do that. But it is, it's tough to charge for that like everything being bespoke to the client. And as we all know, it's very hard to find those people, very hard to standardize, you know what quality control looks like when every single project looks different. But if you've, if you've ever struggled with kind of shouting into the void on social media and your marketing efforts not going anywhere 95% of the time, the issue is not, well, those people aren't out there or those people aren't on social media, or it's not a big enough market. The issue is you're not speaking to a specific enough person, a specific enough pain that people can really attach themselves to. I mean, go out and scroll LinkedIn, if you're an accountant, know that the algorithm that you see on, on LinkedIn is Accountants Talking about accounting things because the algorithm knows that's what you will engage with. But what most accounting firms are posting online, it's pretty table stakes stuff around kind of basic financial literacy. And that's, that's all good stuff. It just has to be put through a very specific lens because there is so much content that the algorithm's having to decide between when that beekeeper is scrolling through their Twitter or their LinkedIn or whatever it is, it is only pulling out the things that are like perfectly targeted for that person. And that's the level of specificity we have to get to so that the requirement for my stuff to show up in front of them is not it going absolutely viral. Right? And that's when you're new at this stuff and even when you're not new at this stuff, it's. It's unrealistic that something's going to perform that well. It is. I mean, like many things, nobody identifies as the type of person that'll run a webinar until you just do it. And there's a lot of fear with it not being very good or not being up to your standard. But it is a, it's. That's a skill that will aid you forever. Like it's useful to you right now and you're going to learn about it, learn how to do it better the next time just by doing it. But also think about the longer term arc of like, if you got really good at run running online events where you can impact a hundred people at once instead of one person at a time, that's really, really valuable. And that's actually kind of how my journey started was headed into Covid. There was so much legislation, it was like a day by day sort of thing. And accountants were never as popular as they were in Covid. All of a sudden you've built a business model around being able to serve, you know, clients year round and having a few touch points a year. And then all of a sudden everybody makes a run on the bank at the same time and they all want your help and your guidance and you're like, gang, I just can't help everybody. So how do you manage that? In our case, we ran some webinars like every week for almost a month. And for most of you listening to that, that's unthinkable for your accounting firm to think that you would ever run a webinar. You're like, we're not, we're not that kind of firm. Or what would, what would the most common responses to that be among. Among trad firms? Traditional firms would say, we don't need the clients, so we don't do webinars. Or we don't do media stuff like that. We don't do social media, so we wouldn't do a webinar. This episode is sponsored in part by Maker's Hub. If you've tuned in to much of my stuff. You know that I'm a big fan of how Makers Hub is using AI to crush the accounts payable headaches of accountants everywhere. Arguably the domain and accountingdom that is being most disrupted by AI. Well they recently shipped support for purchase orders. Good golly gosh how much I hate purchase orders, but they are a necessary evil for companies of a certain size. But it turns out that purchase order matching, you know, matching the invoice to the po, to the receiving slip, whatever you want to call it. Turns out that's way way easier when your AP tool does like rock solid line item extraction. Got my hands on with with the PO system that they just plugged in recently. Super super impressive. If you have clients that struggle with this like I did, oh my gosh. Makers Hub is about to probably save them a whole heckin lot of time. Learn more about that one. Check out my I've got a couple videos on makers Hub on YouTube that are like quick 5 minute demos. Otherwise I'll link their website down in the Show Notes this episode is sponsored in part by Ignition. Come, come, come, come come. Here's the thing. Here's the thing about client billing. You can't bill for the time you spend billing. You can't. You can't. It is pure waste. And we're bad at billing because it's, it's icky. You let things slide. You don't get paid. You waste time. Waste time chasing people for money. That's not what I did. I would just, I didn't want to waste time chasing them and so I would just eat it. Don't do that. This is where Ignition comes in. The leading revenue generation platform for accountants and professional services. When I was running my firm, Ignition wiped out our ar, it's true, and significantly reduced the time spent billing clients, saving our partners over a thousand hours in the first year because they didn't have to bill all that stuff manually. Man with the condition. We want more business with impressive online proposals. No more hustling, hustle PDFs and Word docs. We automatically pulled payment up front or at the end of a job when it was done. No more dialing for dollars. We transition our firm to more recurring revenue and better managed scope creep. No more leaving money on the table. Ignition is making thousands of firms more money and genuinely made us more profitable. Check out why over 7,000 of the smartest businesses run on ignition@ignitionapp.com put a link in the show notes in my firm, this was an 80 year old tax firm with a bunch of legacy partners around still, it was as cadrely as you could possibly imagine. This was. Had I just become an owner, I can't remember where it was. And it was either right before or right after I had bought out a couple partners, but the old partners were still there right after I'd bought them out. And everybody was. And you know, like, you know this if you're in a multi partner firm where everybody gets a little weirded out by someone kind of going on a flyer and being like, ooh, I hope my clients don't see that everybody was as concerned as you would expect them to be. So the first time I rolled on a Covid webinar, you better believe all the partners were glued to the screen going, I hope this goes well. And they're all like looking at chat and looking at the attendee list to be like, oh, I hope none of my clients are here because I'm not sure about all of this. And you know, before that that webinar went live, it had already vastly exceeded expectations because we had like over 200 signups or something like that. You know, maybe a week before that we spun up a newsletter for the very first time. And so we're like, we're fundamentally at, at the issue of like, how do we disseminate as much information as possible to people in as efficient as way as possible because we know we can't have one on one conversations with everybody. So we did like a mass email dump from whatever our CRM was at the time. We, we sent out a couple emails and people liked that and the open rate on that was pretty good. And then we said we're going to run, we're going to run a webinar, kind of cruising through the main things to be aware of, but also to give you a chance to answer or to ask questions that we can then answer. And as the emails and the calls were flooding in from all the people that wanted help, for the most part we would divert those people to the newsletter or to the webinar. And so we had, you know, several hundred people on this webinar when we've never run a webinar before. And when that thing went live for the first time, oh, that was some squeaky bum time on so many levels because for one, I'd never run a webinar in my life before. I'm sitting down in my office, I've got my door closed and I'm like, well, I think we're live now. And webinars are weird. If you've Ever done one. Like, there's, it is so imbalanced, the notion of like talking to yourself and putting things out there. And I'm, I'm used to this now because I sit in a room and talk to myself all day making videos. But it is a very bizarre thing to sit there and talk to your screen and have virtually no feedback. And if you look at comments, especially in the beginning, it can really derail you because one person says one thing and it sticks in your head and can't focus on what you're trying to say. You know, managing questions while presenting, that's a really, really tricky thing. But this went live to. I was maybe 200 ish people the first time we did a webinar. And it was, it was incredibly, incredibly stressful. But we got through it and people freaking loved it. And I was not polished. I mean, I was not. This is before I had ever done any videos or anything like that. I was, I mean, I was like a, I don't know, early 30s, something, just accountant. Everything you would expect that comes with that. And a client base where a lot of them were, was like, I mean, there were clients of these senior kind of aging out partners. So these were, these were real gray hair people turning in. But there was so much appreciation for it. It was from a technical standpoint, an absolute slam dunk because these people don't know anything about what we're talking about. Right. And we, you know, within the firm, we all try to impress each other with what we know and we get really technical. But you just gotta remember when you're putting that stuff out for general consumption, the bar has to be so much lower because they don't have all the background that you have. And that's probably a good thing because it's, it means it's going to be easier than you expect to dazzle them and to give them something of value. But I remember getting to the end of that thing and boy, was the old ticker pumping. I was like fully in a flop sweat. And I came out and a couple of the, the people who I thought would be the most, like the biggest sticks in the mud were like, I think that was worth doing. I think actually that was helpful to people. And like a couple of clients sent texts and stuff like that. And then we're like, okay, would do we do this again? We do it again? Do we talk about the same things again? Do we send people a copy of the video? Like, what do we do with this next? But because we did that, it unlocked an Entirely new sort of branching path for the firm of what do we do next? Is this recording, like actually an asset that we could use? Like, do we go to the local newspaper and say, like, here's a free resource. Do we put this on our website and get people to bug us less? I mean, because at this point we are not worried about billable hours, we're worried about getting as much information out to people as we can. We are plenty busy doing like, ad hoc work for specific client situations. But the demand is so much more than what we can possibly put out there. And it's such a good example of how you walk into something and the old guard is going to react exactly how you think the old guard is going to react. And sometimes you just have to like, tell them, you kind of just got to trust me on this one and we'll see how it goes. And hopefully they can see far enough ahead to know that on the other side of doing something like that, the one thing you're guaranteed to do is learn. And that is probably what we should be optimizing for, is learning. Now, for you running a webinar, probably the most important thing to take out of that webinar is what are the questions people have, what most resonated with people and what didn't resonate with people. So if I stand up a webinar and it is, you know, the top 10 tax saving tips for taxidermists, and way fewer people turn up than I expected, that's good data. That is good information to have. This isn't like a one and done sort of thing. This is information that I'm going to take and it's going to refine how I do things going forward. Is another example of like, the value of consistently posting on social media and maybe even doing some speaking beforehand. Every social media post is an opportunity to solicit feedback and put out a signal and listen for noise. Is that the right way or is that backwards put out noise and listen for a signal? I don't know. Content is like, it's like a lighthouse. Did anybody like that thing that I talked about or not? If they didn't, then they're sure not going to like the webinar form of it. But for me, and I've talked about this before, like some of the biggest things I've ever done have been like the big old report we put out on 14 practice management systems. And it's out of date now, but it's something that I shared online and the LinkedIn post had like 1400 comments like it's just, just this massively a disproportionately large volume, volume of interest in that thing. And you're, you're not like, not everyone has had that. But this is, this is why we show up online consistently because you will have eventually your version of that where something takes you by surprise. And it's worth listening to that thing that just surprised you because those things that, that pop represent a great opportunity to go deeper. It's a signal that on the other side there's interest in this thing. And that is a prerequisite to somebody being willing to give you their time and attention. And it's, it's a hard calculation to make. The things that we want to shout from a mountaintop and we say no, no, no, this is important versus what the person on the other side today thinks is important, those are going to be two very different things. And if that person isn't in your web yet, there's a degree of placating we have to do to meet them where they're at because they don't know the intelligent questions to ask. And so if we are speaking in a very arcane way about problems they're not even aware that they have yet, that's ultimately it's not going to find anybody. And so it is a bit of give and take there to say like for the type of client that we want, where are they right now and what are the questions that they're asking then they might be completely idiotic questions like should I create an LLC or not or something like that. Right? Like that sort of ignorant question is oftentimes what's going to find people and allow you to direct them to the more intelligent questions. But the only way to ensure that you don't pick up anything from this and then you don't learn anything is by not doing it. And on the sort of order of operations of how to get in front of more people, the best thing you can do, I think is have an email list because it gives any other marketing efforts purpose. Whether it's posting on social media, whether it's going to a local chamber thing and talking, or whether it's turning up at a trade show just to meet people or doing a talk at a trade show. The best thing you can do is have an email list because that email list is a standard way to get your hooks, get your fingers into people that's not dependent on social media algorithms. You know, if you're posting on social for business purposes, like there's an element of making friends and relationships. And that's really valuable. But at the end of the day, that ROI is going to come down to how many people did you get off of the social media platform onto something that you own? You own an email list, you don't own your YouTube subscriber list, your LinkedIn follower list. The goal is ultimately to convert those people to something that you own. And very next after that email list, the best way to connect with people is probably webinars. And if you spend your days hustling zoom meetings and phone calls and all that, talking clients through their various situations, you are more equipped than you realize to do this really well. That is one thing where we are kind of, by the nature of our work, forced to think on our feet and have answers for things. And we just don't realize how much we know as we are the beneficiary of being able to have hundreds of these conversations that our clients will never have. For the client, it is like one of one. It is, everything is unique to them. They don't have a window into any of those things. And we forget just how wise, like or experienced we are by getting to see their exact situation a hundred different times and how valuable the shortcut that you can give them is. That is a product of you having all those other conversations, right? And so you get into that webinar situation and I think there's probably a, a, a risk of trying to structure it too much and build out the whole slide deck and it all be planned out from minute one to minute 60 or however long you want to do it. When the best version of that is probably a balance of here are the talking points you want to hit on. But also keep that open to engaging with the people who are there, who are, are presenting those questions live because that serves to pull people in in a more compelling way than just sitting there and having to look at like a set of bullet points on a slide deck. Right? Like we're all, we're all a little bored of that at this point. It was, I don't know, five years ago, maybe not even five years ago when I ran my first webinar. At this point, I'd never made a single video in my life, was in a stinky old tax firm that was as coddly as you would expect. And you want an example of not knowing what's going to be on the other side of running that webinar. I mean, you could argue me being here was on the other side of that webinar because it kind of definitely opened my eyes to the value of one to many for the first time. And had I not done that, it at the very least would have deferred me ever discovering that same thing. But it's ultimately a tremendous investment in you and you learning what's going to engage with people and developing a really high leverage skill set that hopefully takes you a step past just doing that one on one stuff until the end of time. Any any hot tips on on run webinars? Drop that stuff down in the comments. Will be good to see. Sometimes I think like shy run webinars from time to time, like a couple webinars a month or something. It's part of me that's like, does the world really need any more content? I think the main difference would be it's an opportunity to do some stuff live. I've actually got a silly idea if you've ever seen like social shopping and it's a bigger thing in and like in China it's, it's really big where it's like almost like qvc, like home shopping network, but on social media. I've got a really silly idea to do like a really cracked out kind of live stream of doing like tech advising for people live in like a social shopping kind of format with like all sorts of graphics on the screens and stuff like that. And you're finding new tools and it's all happening live. There's like, there's like a version of that that's in my head that I'm like, that'd be really fun to do. But I don't do much live stuff anymore. Right. I've got the benefit of editors to make me look, make me look so good. That's it for webinars. Any thoughts on or tips for folks running webinars? Drop that stuff in the comments. Thanks for coming and hanging today.