560 TIME Management Advice for Accounting Firms

Okay, podcast friends. Today we're looking at a live workshop that I hosted in Austin, Texas for about 80 firms. And the Q and A segment and the, and the Q and A segment at the end got into some firms who had run time audits. Basically the firm owner made this crazy detailed list of all the things that they do and then brought that to their team and said, let's dig into this. Where can I get help? Are these the right things for me to be working on? And that conversation led into a conversation about email delegation, about how to pull people into the work that you're doing, and blossomed out from there into how, how do we get our clients to behave in the way that we want and kind of follow our expectations and the rules that we set for them? Turned out to be a fun conversation. So without further ado, here's a segment from a recent live event in Austin. Just to set the stage a bit, because I really, I do really want kind of a core part of these events to be somewhere I can take my team where everybody can get inspired. And we go back like we just had a fun night and we've got kind of a different energy level for where we're trying to go next. And there's very like heady big brain ways you could talk about like change management and all these different things. But I think in the day to day it's easy to become so self obsessed with what we do that we aren't thinking about what the other person needs. Like, when was the last time that you went to somebody and you were like, what can I do to help you today? I mean, think about that in the business context. It's been a long time for me. Cause normally like we're so obsessed over what is our stack of things to do and we gotta get through this whole list, right? The reality is everybody needs help. But getting of help and the elevating people in your firm and you being able to elevate to the next thing, whether that's spending more time on finding better paying clients or pricing engagements, whatever that is, that doesn't happen until somebody comes along and says, what can I help you with today? Some version of that. Even working with our clients, like how do we find the next gold client and better understand their needs and better understand why they were happy to pay us a price that was maybe surprising to us. Like that starts with kind of the weird cringe thing of like, how can I be helpful to you today? What can I do for you? This is maybe easier for us to Think about in terms of, in terms of our team. But I would say one of the things I'm most proud of in our firm is how quickly we accelerated the skill sets of the people that we brought in. And that was because delegation was just not optional. It was talked about so much. I had an assistant that was in my email inbox and everybody saw that. In fact, the old partners I bought out made fun of me about that. They would razz me and they would talk to other people and they're like, you see what that guy's doing? Like, man, I just did this for 60 years. I never needed an assistant in my inbox. Like, that guy can't manage his own stuff. The culture became you're a 20 year tax pro and a client just sent you a 65 page PDF. What happens next and what aspects of your 25 years of tax experience are required for you to now go split up and put it in CCH engagement and annotate it? Just like, that's not the best use of your time, man. But people won't buy into that until they see you doing it. So, you know, in the perspective of a lot of the people that I worked with, I turned into a snowflake because I wanted my team members to be more precious about their time. And that had two effects. One, you learned the skill of delegation just through doing like, nobody got out of bed and knows how to delegate stuff effectively. Like, that's just such a learned skill. So for one, like, you learn how to delegate better not only yourself, but your entire team. But maybe the bigger benefit is how quickly it upskills everybody. That is being delegated to because you're junk, you're trash. The stuff you don't want to do is an opportunity for somebody else. And oftentimes we won't hand it off because we're almost ashamed that we're still doing it. And you're like, I wouldn't wish this on anybody, but you'd wish it on yourself, evidently, right? And so, like, especially for the staff in the room, I think for owners, this is like, we think of this more through the lens of clients. For staff, this is 100% about how do I better support my seniors. The path to them doing something better, which, by the way, is the best thing for you. Everything we just talked about, if your firm owner can figure out how to make projects twice as profitable, that's going to be good for you like it will. The path to them being able to do that is them turning into Teflon. Like Being able to slip out of all those tasks and the tasks go down the skill spectrum and they're not all going to be sexy, by the way. Like being an entrepreneur. It's not sexy, but that's your opportunity. Like, those are tasks that ultimately pull you up to doing the owner's job, because that's what they need done. Is today, this is your set of tasks. And I can't become the version of me that's here until I got a plan for these or even just these. Right. This is uncomfortable. And you may not even feel like you have permission to do this. But it is a type of vulnerability that I think will go down very, very well. If somebody came, if somebody came to you, the business owner, and said, like, what can I do? Like, what do you got? There's more formal versions of this, like doing a time audit, but it's honestly as, as simple as this. How do I move into the job that somebody else is doing so that they can move into whatever their next job is? And there will be some people you encounter that will be, you know, territorial about that. Like, well, if I don't do that, then what do I do? I would tell you, most firm owners say, especially firm owners that listen to my stuff are like, there's a hundred times as many things I could do than I have time to do right now. And so they will very happily get out of the way and let you step into that. That's probably the thing I'm most proud of doing in my firm is that kind of being cultural. And we'd bring somebody in. Like we brought in this kid who worked at like a, it was like a Doritos warehouse or something like that. We like, we really liked him and he was like, still studying accounting. And we're like, we'll get you plugged into kind of doing our cast stuff in four years time. That guy was a wizard. He was basically functioning as like a controller for these 10, $20 million companies. It was so cool. Like, he's in his mid-20s and then what did he do? He went out and took another job and he was making like six figures, five years from a warehouse to a really well paying job elsewhere. And we had a real come to Jesus with the team when that happened. And that conversation looked like, listen, y' all are learning a lot right now and you're growing so, so fast. And there's some trade off intense. Like we're asking a lot of you, but we're learning very fast. And if you've been here very Long. You can look back and see, like, it was not that long ago where I was not in this place and, like, vastly more confident and more capable and all that. At this point, we had staff that were getting poached from, like, other firms that were watching my content and all that stuff. And it's like, there's gonna be a time when it may make sense to get off the bus where this intensity doesn't make sense. Cause I'm having a kid or I wanna slow down or something like that. And when you do, you're gonna be in an awesome spot. But the time is not when you're 25 years old. And so in my firm, that was probably the thing I was most proud of building, was this place where folks grew so fast and they felt supported. And that was 100% the product of me being a snowflake and being unwilling to do things that didn't need to come to the owner. Like, somebody sends me an email and they're like, we really need you to do this today. And I'm like, we employ 40 people here. And you really mean to tell me that I'm the only person that can do this? This is a hard thing for a lot of people to hear because they weren't used to this. And past ownership was like, they would put on the cape and swoop in and be the hero every time. And so the next time the same thing happens. Yep, it's coming right back to you again. Right. But, like, me trying to avoid all of that stuff made everybody else better. So, like, whatever that stuff is that you are sitting on top of right now, that is your thing. And there's probably some identity tied up in that. Like, the next cooler opportunity. Like, that only happens if you have someone that. That can go to or stop doing it altogether. Like, especially for solo firm folks. Like, what is the path out of that? Is it automation? Is it. I probably shouldn't be doing this to begin with. Like, you can't get to that next thing until you drop that stuff. And it's made harder by the fact that we're just so bad at estimating our own capacity. Right. And I actually heard this, framed really nicely the other day, is that's not a to do list, that's a wish list. Wouldn't it be nice if you got all those things done? But you never do, do you? So we expand the time horizon to a year or a month or. I'm going to get that back to you right after April 15th. Never happens. Right. So we almost have to get to a level of capacity where it's like, I don't know what I'm going to do or it seems like I'm going to have a bunch of free time. That to me is like the only space where you actually have the flexibility to do new things. And that's a. For people who were, who had realization pounded into us from the day that we left school, that's a hard thing to get your head around. The notion that you won't always be at max capacity or that it's inefficient to not plan every moment of your day. Right. But because we're so bad at estimating capacity, the version of you six months from now that has time to lean into new things, to go to lunch with some local people, to get some kind of bigger thinking around how to run your firm right now, if you think about what it will take to get there, it probably looks like having a bunch of downtime. It seems like it will be that way, it won't be that way. But if you're planning like what are all the responsibilities I have to do? We kind of have to bias to like, we have to over delegate. We have to get rid of more than we think because most of us are operating at 100% capacity and there's another 30% of low hanging fruit that if we just had the time, we would do. Right. And so you get a little bit of time back and then you start like dipping into that low hanging fruit. And it turns out there's actually a lot more stuff on the table you could be leaning into if you just gave yourself that flexibility. So as much as possible, whether this is through the team, whether this is through valuing your time more is something I talk about with my team is how we value our own time will definitely impact the things that we're willing to do. And when we raise our hand and we're like, hey man, let's hire a va or let's like we need somebody to come in and help with that stuff that like, that's the path to like the next version of you. Because the really sad thing is when an accountant will live the same 12 months on repeat for like a decade sort of. On that subject, I wanted to put out the question, this is where we get more interactive. Has anybody done sort of time audit through the lens of how do I get some more of my time back? Or where can I pull a team member in? Do you want to tell us about it? Laura, how yours went? Could be good or bad.

No, it was really enlightening, actually. I had a Excel spreadsheet, of course, and I just tracked everything that I worked on for two solid weeks. And then I categorized every single item by either Trash, Trim, Delegate, or Treasure. But then I started being able to put together a list of things that, well, maybe it didn't even have to be done or somebody else could do this. And you're right. A lot of it is you feel like, oh, it's me. It's so tied to, I'm going to come in, save the day. And it's so important that I do it in reality. Like, anyone can do this. It's not just me. So it did free up a lot of my time.

What did it look like to, like, pull other humans into that? Like, what was that process?

You know, my VA really stepped up, and the one thing that I haven't been able to figure out is how to get out of my inbox. Like, she did try to come in and look at things for me, and that just didn't really work out. So I'd love to hear your strategy around that. But, you know, even, like, paying our clients taxes, we do go in and make estimated payments. Like, I always feel like, oh, I should do that because it's so important if it gets screwed up, you know, but realistically, it's logging into a website, it's making a payment. It's not that big of a deal. So. But it's really. It takes trust, trusting your team to do the right thing and encouraging them to do the right thing and encouraging them to try and then come to me with any questions as opposed to, you know, just. I used to just take it all and be like, no, I'll just do all that.

Let's circle back to the email thing, because that's a rich thing to mind. Other folks that you said you had kind of done a time audit.

Well, I kind of backed myself into it. I didn't mean to do a time audit in the beginning. I was really looking for administrative help and at the same time wanting to have a better customer experience. So I hired a VA and I spent probably 6 to 12 months just training her on and actually having her train on software. By the time she was done, she was so empowered on how we should be elevating our customer service journey that all that time that I was. That I was thinking about, but almost second nature, she took off my plate. And one of the things was email. So I did have a mix of clients emailing me directly or calling me directly. And we just put a firm stop. So when we give a proposal, we explain how we work and we say we don't use email because the owner gets 100 emails a day sometimes. And, you know, you want to get your answers quickly. You got to use the portal. So it takes a little bit of training. But I have two customer service people and that's all they do is manage communication.

Very cool. Anybody else with good experience on kind of the time audit?

So kind of calendar wise, I make a lot of time for blocking and tackling so that I can do some of the work that I know I need to be doing versus just fielding requests constantly. So someone once told me, if you don't choose your calendar, your calendar will choose you. So my VA went in right away from an inbox standpoint, really to keep my schedule and actually protect a lot of my schedule. And then we also just rank my inbox by priority. So sales opportunities, obviously one client requests can get fielded to other team members, unless they don't, you know, need the answer and they need me. And then everything else is pretty much either junk or can get answered later.

There's a lot of things there where people are like, oh, that would. That would be nice. I need to do that. Planning my day instead of my day planning for me, also sales inquiries. Interesting. That's one on your list and not like 100 on your list. Because I think that's what most of us struggle with. So most people, like have no frame of like, how would I even pull somebody and to the inbox and like, maybe you've done this for a while and so it just feels like second nature. But like, what's the very 101, like first 30 days. How do I get somebody to help?

Yeah, absolutely. So I actually got really lucky with my va. Our ramp up was really fast, I think, at the time. Honestly. I have monbre now because I had my second one recently. But I think I was on a time press because I was about to have a baby and I was like, we need to figure this out asap. I mean, you got a lot of time to brew one, but at the same time, you have all of a sudden everything happens fast. So she was just mirroring me like daily for like a month. So that. And, you know, it's kind of painful to talk about what you're doing when you're doing it, because it seems kind of silly. But being sort of maniacal about every step of your day, it's pretty transformative, actually. It's just like documenting a Process or a workflow flow ends up paying off later.

There's a very big vulnerability component to it. Like when Laura's talking about, like, here's my whole calendar or my whole spreadsheet and I'm going to let people see it. And even for the whole team to do that, I suspect that's probably where it dies for a lot of folks is they're just not willing to have their time and all of that be put on display for everyone or it's hard to ask for help. I do like the idea of, like, it's not just a me thing, it's an everybody thing. Like, because my seniors, they need help too. And like, our tasks that we can push down are their opportunities. I can share a bit about how I did inbox management, how I pulled an admin in, if it's helpful. So there's a question of who it is and where you find them. We had an admin who was like a crazy, overqualified, like, just super capable admin when I first pulled them in. We could have gone to, like, who's the cheapest person on the team we could pull in? Or the most capable. And this, like, this person, they were making, I don't know, 80, 90 grand a year, like, as an admin. And I was like this, like, this person, like, because my time's actually incredibly valuable, like, it's the most important thing for the firm. She came in, it was definitely a learning experience. Couple things I've shared before. Basically I had to make the rule that, like, I was only going to be in the inbox once a day within a specific time window. And my team knowing that was helpful because it meant they had to do all of their cleaning out of the inbox before that time window started. So they kind of built that into their daily cadence. And then by the time I hopped in there, like 11am, it was ready to go. All the stuff that I handled was actually put into a Today folder rather than from the Inbox. Cause if you're working out of the inbox, you're constantly distracted from the new stuff that's coming into the inbox. And it's like running in quicksand. So I worked out of just a folder that had, here's all the stuff that I gotta handle today. I will say the exercise of other people having visibility in your inbox is really useful because for firm owners, I would say the inbox is a very good proxy for what are all the things I haven't delegated yet. So if you look at all the things that we do. What's the most complete snapshot of that? For most people, it is their inbox. So the client that still reaches out to you. The software platform where anytime there's something that goes sideways, it's me calling Lisearch. Maybe there's a billing issue with the research tool and they send that to me. It's like the stuff that comes to me, that's stuff that I haven't effectively delegated yet. So does every client have an owner who's not me? Does every software platform in the firm have a subject matter expert that isn't me? Do the technical matters have an expert that's not me? In my firm, I went from doing the client work to being out of the client work. And before me, it was a traditional sort of partnership model firm. So everybody kind of had their favorite team members and you'd report up to that boss, and everybody kind of settled into their roles. But it meant we had to elevate folks on the team to say, like, okay, we don't have an expert in this new Oregon corporate activity tax stuff, which is a nightmare. Somebody's got to, like, take the lead on this. So every time one of those things came to me, it was a signal that either we had to elevate somebody to see if they were capable of taking the lead on that, or we had to go out and find the person who could do that. And oftentimes we just didn't have that person on the team. But we could use that to sort of shape what the role looks like. There's a whole lot of reasons, I think, why people send stuff to us from. We've always done it that way in the past, and so it's easier for them to send it to you. Sometimes it's as innocent as they don't want to step on your toes because you've done that in the past. But, like, the other end of the spectrum of that, like, the vulnerable version of that is like, when you can lay out the stuff that you do, which is really uncomfortable, and say, here's my last two weeks, and not dictate to them even necessarily the ways that they can help but, like, let them come in and go through that and be like, yeah, like, the goal here is to get as much off lower as plate as possible. Like, how can we carve this stuff up? Who are the people we already have on the team that can take this stuff over? And then next step, how can they do the same? Because where we got stuck on this, oftentimes was I would delegate to people who had nobody to delegate to and then their capacity would be full. And that's when you end up in the situation where everybody's full and nobody can come and say is there anything I can help you with today? Because if everybody's locked and just has no free moments in the day there you lose that fluidity. Hey, real quick attention. If you have clients that do project work, do ugly stuff like manufacturing, like inventory, construction stuff, anything where you got hairy itemized bills that have to go to specific destinations. When it comes to bill pay, there is a new sheriff in town. It is this episode's sponsor, Makers Hub. Even if you don't do bill pay, this is something that is worth showing your clients. Actually we've done a number of videos on my channel. You can start sharing my videos with your clients. What fun. Gang, we are light years beyond what the old guard like Bill ever did with automated bill extraction and like getting these things through the approvals process which is oftentimes much more complex than just is this bill over $10,000 or under $10,000? Man. 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A tremendous amount of the time spent during tax season is just chasing people for docs and like building out the request lists of all the things that we need when the client emails and they're like what do you need from me? And you go back to the prior year file and you look at what you already have and you just got to do all that stuff. Sorban man, it wipes out all of that complete no brainer tax workflow tools like this is not an exaggeration. Are honestly like a must buy right now for tax firms. I say they have been for the last like two years and they just keep getting better. Sorban also, they are working on pushing the data to your tax software. Really hard problem to solve. They're working on it. They're also working on automated delivery. So ingest the tax return and then gives the client like a super smooth signing and sort of to do list experience once the return is actually done. Really good product. Know a lot of happy users. That's Sorban. If you do more than a couple hundred ten forties a year, definitely check out Sorban link down in the show notes. Any other people with thoughts on inbox management or questions on that stuff or ways they feel like they've either done that right or wrong. But if I were to mention to the clients that I have a sub, I have an admin coming in that can answer and help you and if I'm out, I want to turn it over to them. Some of my clients would just go crazy. I don't know this person, I don't trust this person. How can you do that? So how do you do that? It's kind of like an imposter syndrome, but not really. Yeah, that's a great question. At the top, we talked about, like, who do you get access to? And this is where starting to think about the way we serve clients through the lens of who will ultimately be the main point of contact gets valuable. And so if it has to be you, that's as premium as it gets. Right. And so year over year, like that's getting more expensive, that's getting more scarce over time. Maybe there's even a day where it's like, I'm not gonna do the client stuff. I just want to train and employ the people to do the client stuff. There are ways to mitigate that and hopefully make that medicine go down easier. One of the things we did in our cast practice is every set of monthly financials we sent, we decided needed to be sent with a little three minute video. The person had to show up on a loom. There's a little talking head bubble of them walking through the financial statements just because our clients didn't understand what those meant. And a surprise benefit of that is the client stopped going to anybody else but the person who would send them that useful thing because they'd seen them and there was that kind of the bridge of humanity that had sort of happened. So most people, I think universally were all like, no, I don't want to talk to somebody I don't know yet until they know. Until they know them. So the devil's in the details of like how we introduce that individual and they. Have they had any positive experiences with them yet or not? In my case, if my admin was redirecting things, they would actually redirect that client to the owner of that client, which was like an account manager sort of person. It wasn't the admin that the client would interact with. And that account owner would already be copied on any interactions that I had with the client. They're always pulled into meetings. Basically, I couldn't do anything with the client at all without the client account manager being with me. So they were always in the loop. But it's just something that comfort level just kind of takes time to build. Right. But I would say it is an argument for scoping who they get access to because there will be clients for whom that'll never be okay. There will also be clients who are happy to pay more for that. And they're just, they're like, no, don't push me off to this person. But if you actually put a proposal in front of them where you're like, well, here's the price for me and here's the price for somebody else, a lot of them will be. Be like, cool. I just always want access to you, you know. So I would say it's an argument for scoping exactly what level of person they get access to, who that is one thing that was super common in the intake form, practice management stuff. A lot of canopy firms. Kind of weird. Who's a canopy firm here? A lot of canopy firms. A lot of people in like varying states of onboarding versus setup versus still trying to get it figured out. But probably the most common theme in that registration intake was our workflow sucks. Like, we are really struggling with workflow. And the really hard thing about workflow to me is I don't know that we have an agreed upon snapshot of what good workflow even is. Right. I can tell you there's a lot of workflow that looks bad because there's just too much stuff going through the tube. Like we're just over capacity. And then we try to workflow our way into all the, like delivering on all the promises that we've made, you know, that maybe we promised a little bit too much. And so now the problem is workflow, not capacity. There were a few brave souls who I won't call out that were like, I feel like we got our systems pretty, like, nailed down. Like, we. Like, I'm feeling pretty good about our systems. Does anybody want to take a stab at defining, like, what makes you feel like you're there, like you've got something reasonably solid, doesn't have to be perfect, but does anybody have a reasonable definition of what good systems look like?

So I don't know if it works for everybody or not. We still have a pretty manual system.

Okay, give me the mic back.

But it's more about delegation than workflow. What we did in the beginning of the year was we would. I would send the emails out here. This is the stuff that needs to come in, and they would send the stuff, and I would check what's going on and what's left over. So in the middle of second tax season, I was like, I don't want to do this anymore. And then it's just not productive. So I delegated a team member. Hey, you email these people. These are the pending items. You check every time they send stuff that have. They provided everything. If they have, like, two items left, you email them back. So I think that's worked out really, really well, because when she had everything, the tax preparer would do it, and then I would review the things. So I think that was a good system, and it made the tax process go a lot quicker. I feel like it did. Good was before I had this person email anybody. I send out a blast email to every client. Hey, you will get email from this person. This is the email address. This is another person. Make sure you mark it as, like, a safe email address so that you don't miss those emails. And I think that helped everybody come over the hump of, okay, hey, I don't know this person. Am I even supposed to be getting email from this person? And so on and so forth.

That's interesting because that's equal parts internal and external. That's like setting a new boundary with clients. Was that like, did clients push back on that?

You feel like, no, nobody had an issue. As long as I tell them you're gonna get something from somebody, they've never had an issue.

How did you communicate to them that this was gonna come? Did you do, like, a big blast to all clients saying, this person's gonna reach out? How did you get that out and get them to read it?

We just send them an email. That's it. And if they read it, great. If they didn't read it, that's on them. And if they called me back and tell me that, okay, hey, I didn't receive your email, I'm gonna like, well, no, you should have received an email from Megan. And in the beginning, what I did was when she sent the initial emails, I did tell her to copy me on that email so that, you know, hey, I know it's gone to them to a certain extent, and they know I'm on there too, so it makes them feel a little bit more comfortable. So I know it went. I can see in my inbox. You can't tell me I didn't get it. Especially if they see it went to DJ as well. I can't tell DJ I didn't get it.

That actually dovetails really nicely into the delegation thing. Like, how do we. How do we bridge the client expectation from always. It always being a DJ thing versus always, you know, being this new person on my team. How do I change that expectation? Thanks for sharing that.

So this might be super helpful for anybody that is using Canopy. What we found was when we were onboarding clients, they get an email to create their login, and what was happening was they were creating their login on their desktop, and they, I have an issue with Canopy because it's not telling them to download the app on their phone. And our clients are primarily phone users. So we were having customers log in that first time and then coming back to us and saying, like, I never logged into the app. What are you talking about? And on my end, I was seeing that the user had logged in at a specific date, and then I was like, wait a second. So I. When I first got Canopy, everyone should have it on their phone, testing constantly what it's like to be a user. That's like, step one. And when I redid this step, I knew when I downloaded Canopy, oh, it's an app. So I just downloaded the app, right? But I redid it as, like, a test new client and was like, oh, shit. Like, I would never have thought to, like, download the app. So what we focused on now, and we did a terrible job, like, last tax season with it. But this one, we're ahead of the game where any clients that we're getting, we actually have an onboard specialist where as soon as they're becoming our client, we are having them jump on a call with them and go through their first questionnaire with them. So they're like, oh, this is what it looks like in the app on their phone. And then on our end internally, like, we have, oh, they checked off okay. Our onboarding specialist got them on the app. One, that's risk reduction. But then two like, we're trying to create an atmosphere where during tax season there's way less headache. Everyone knows everything's just on their app, right? On their phone, on the go, all the time. And to parlay with that in the actual, like task management, Jordan here created a bunch of different tabs where on the onboarding it goes into 30, 60, 90 day process and then that's where we're able to create automated workflows off of. So if Kate is the one that's onboarding specialist, as soon as she clicks off, okay, onboarding done, it automatically goes to the next person on that task list of oh, in the 30, 60, 90 days. Because if you with your clients crush it in the first 90 days and they know how to use your app for the next 90 months are going to be much more efficient and effective. So we've really just focused on the beginning of like over providing when they first get into this system, which has also forced us to be more of like a customer of ourself and just always knowing what's going on within the app. And that has been even in just like the past month, like, transformative. The last statement I would say is we tend to like create the processes and workflows, but then you don't have a project manager actually being like what I would call the asshole, like following up every single time. So that falls on me where creating a Slack channel. Every Monday we have a new client channel and an onboarding channel and it's like, hey, what are the updates for the process? So it's a little bit more work for onboarding specialists, but that forces her to really dial in, like, where are our new customers at in the process and making sure that it's coming to fruition. And then on Tuesday we have a huddle. So on Monday everything gets posted. On Tuesday we have a huddle and it's like, is there any issues with any of these clients getting onboarded? The painful part of this, now we have to figure out, like, our customers that have been our clients. Right now I have to create a process to do that. But for your new ones or anybody that's getting onto the platform, I wouldn't just leave it up to email. We were doing that and it was a headache. I would literally say, hey, we'd love to schedule like an onboarding with you, even if they're a current customer for Canopy and like run them through, make sure they're on the app and make sure they can just ask you any questions there. Because if come tax season, they already know, just like all the checklists are just in that app. You're going to save so much time on the back end if you do it that way.

It's funny how, like, if you don't do that, you're hearing that, you're like, man, that's so much work. That's so much more than what we do. Isn't that kind of everything, though? Like, doing the good version of something just always takes more time than you expected and costs more money than you expected. And that's, like, coming back to the capacity thing. That's just kind of the way of things, it seems like. And that is it. Thank you all so much for being here. Means the world to me.