131. Canadian Real Estate Investors Tax Strategies

You are listening to the Wealth Without Bay Street Podcast, a Canadian guide to building dependable wealth. Join your hosts, Richard Canfield and Jason Lowe as they unlock the secrets to creating financial peace of mind in an uncertain world. Discover the strategies and mindsets to a financial future that you can bank on.

Complete Taxation A guide for Canadian Real Estate Investing. We are just beyond honored to be joined again by Cherry Chan. Now, Cherry's been on our show before. This is Cherry's second appearance of many. We asked her at that time if she'd be kind enough to rejoin our audience, and she said, absolutely, be happy to be on anytime. And having just gone through yet another busy tax season, on top of serving all of her clients in such a great manner, Cherry's an entrepreneur and she's an author. And she wrote the book titled Complete Taxation Guide to Canadian Real Estate Investing. And we're going to provide links for you to be able to connect directly with Cherry on social media for you to get a copy of her book. She's also a blogger. She's a proud mother of two young children, and her accounting practice specializes in working with and helping real estate investors to reach their investment goals. And that specialization comes from Cherry's own experience in her journey with real estate that began just over a decade ago and moving from buying just one student rental and then becoming two more in that same year. She co owns multiple properties with her husband Irwin, who's also been a guest on our show, Irwin Zito. And Cherry is an honor roll graduate, chartered accountant, and she's just an exceptional person and we're really excited to have her with us. And you know, she hasn't just worked with one or two real estate investors. We're talking about hundreds of real estate investors across the country. In fact, well over a thousand, if I understand the current number. And being someone who has expanded her presence on social media, she's continually sharing, posting, adding YouTube content, inviting people to complimentary webinars to share her knowledge with all of you. And so after that introduction, allow me to extend a warm welcome again to Cherry Chan. Cherry, welcome. Welcome back to Wealth Without Bay Street. It's so good to have you back on the show. How are you?

I'm great, I'm great. Thanks. Thanks for having me back. Jason and Richard really appreciate the opportunity to be back again.

Very excited, Terry, it's, it's so good to be with you. And we were chatting a little bit before hitting the record button today about how you've come through yet another very busy tax season. And there's been a lot of interesting, know, things that have been happening out there as it relates to, you know, corporate people wanting to, you know, move real estate into a corporate structure. And so there's a lot of things like that going on in the conversations that we're having with real estate investors as well. And so what are you, what are you sharing as your, you know, your top tips and, and golden nuggets of wisdom in the real estate investing community as it relates to minimizing tax. What are some of the things that you've been sharing a lot of knowledge about?

I think the number one golden question that I guess I get to, I get asked all the time is whether an investor should set up a corporation or not. And there is no one size fits all solution. That's just a unfortunate reality. There is always this myth out there saying that, hey, like I need to set up. You need three or four properties before you should set up a corporation. The reality is it goes back to your goal and your criteria and your priority. It really re is really individualized. So it's not like some. For some people, setting up a corporation is a must because we just got a client letter. We are the official office or I guess register office for one of our clients corporation and we receive a letter from the lawyer saying that you are being sued right now because I slip and fall in your house or my client got slip and fall in your house and therefore I'm suing you right now. And we got that letter and it's not fun. And how important it is for you to have that layer of protection if this is very important to you specifically and you just want to separate the risk. Yes, corporation is the right way. Now if it's not the case, then we step back and look at like, where is the source of fund coming in from, how did you find the money to purchase your investment properties and do you have a small business? And all these other criteria that we look at as real estate accountant to help real estate investors is to the side. It's not a one size fits all solution.

And so that's why it's really important to be speaking with a chartered accountant. Someone, but someone more importantly who has expertise in that area like you, like your team and the work that you do with your clients. This is an area of specialization for you. And so it's not a, you know, just a general conversation. I mean, you're working with real estate investors every single day.

Yeah. Like we have, as you mentioned earlier, I do a lot of social media Posting as well. We have accountant and tax advisor who at least on social media, they said, I work, I'm in tax, I am a tax advisor. And they would challenge me and put comments on my social media posts saying that, hey, like, generally speaking, there's no benefit setting up corporation to own properties in the corporation. So then I would respond, I'm not afraid to respond because everyone's criteria and priorities are different. Right. It goes back to where your money is coming in from. No different than, I'm sure, whole life insurance policy as well. Where you hold it, should you hold it in personal name or in the corporation's name, where the money is coming in from? And that's number one. What kind of investment strategy are you using? If you are buying the properties and flipping it then or now, if you're planning to sell it within one year, it's now considered income because the most recent federal budget just changed the rule altogether. So all these things come into play, all these criteria come into play if you just post accountant out there. Just to answer one question, there's no tax benefit. There's no not necessarily tax benefit. There may be tax flexibility to lower your tax liability owning the properties in the corporation. There's also the concern about, on top of the type of strategy, there's also concern about how many properties can I buy? We have clients who put all their properties into a corporation just so then they can qualify to buy more properties. Sure. Richard knows more and can relate.

Well, I think what's interesting, you know, one of the things I think it's important for our listeners to take away is you, you'd indicated the importance about liability. This, this letter that showed up at your office's registered office. You know, any real estate investor right now, or anyone who's even considering real estate investing, who's hearing that, they're like, oh, tenant slipped, fell. There's a legal issue, we're getting sued. That's a big fear. That's a big concern for people when they're, when they're exploring becoming a real estate investor, or when you just get started and now you have a number of doors and now you start recognizing some of the tenant problems that can happen. And you're just kind of wondering, okay, where, where's my risk now? The risk we often think about is the market risk. That's where people's head initially goes, is to market risk. But what about the liability risk? And I think that more and more, as our society becomes more litigious and we need to be mindful of that and so I maybe just quantify a little bit. But I believe what I'm hearing, Jerry, is that one of the key advantages that real estate investors can obtain by setting up corporate structures and having the real estate held there is that mitigation of where the asset is. If a property is going to get, a person's going to get sued because of the property they're suing the owner. If the owner is the corporation on title, there's a way to mitigate and limit some of that liability to maybe that one property or group of properties in the company versus now, hey, we've got another holdco over here or we've got an operating company over here. We've got personal assets. You can create a bit of a barrier of separation there from having everything just disappear because someone slips and falls.

Yeah, absolutely. What people don't generally understand is how much exposure they have because your personal home, it could be fully pay off everything under your name register under your name. And it kind of sucks that way. And if for people who, couples who own the property together on the same property titles, that means the entire family asset as well. Right. So that also play into the decision factor for sure.

And if you're, you know, dealing with multiple joint venture, you know, projects, you've got, like Richard said, you know, maybe you've got a group of properties that are part of that particular project versus another group of properties that are maybe just more so your own corporation, they're held there. So you've really got to create that separation. If I guess the more active you become as a real estate investor, you have to continually being on the lookout to say, okay, how do we protect these assets, but how do we minimize personal liability? Heaven forbid if something like what you described, you know, happens and thinking about the, the transfer of wealth and what happens when, you know, the shareholder of the corporation passes away and you know, we talk a little bit. You mentioned, you know, whole life insurance in particular, dividend paying, you know, participating whole life insurance. Real estate investors are favoring, you know, that tool because of the attributes, the ready access to capital, the, the estate planning elements of it as well that are so important. I remember when we chatted one time and you had mentioned, we were just in a discussion, there were a few of your colleagues there and you had expressed within the group, you said, you know, this is in addition to the living benefits of the financing characteristics and et cetera, we also have to really remember, like there's a wealth transfer component to this and there's an estate planning component to this. That's really important because so much of the day to day in real estate investing is all about finding the deal, structuring the right financing, making sure that it's going to cash flow, tenant screening, the list goes on and on and on. But there has to be an emphasis placed at some point on what is going to happen. Not if, but when death comes. And how do we deal with deemed disposition and how do we deal with a lender who says, whoa, wait a second, we had husband and wife on this deal. Husbands passed away. We're not, we're not okay with just continuing status quo. Like we need to look at this financing arrangement and make an adjustment or, and if you've got a tax free windfall of money that shows up precisely when it's needed, precisely when it's needed, and you're not worrying about liquidation, you're not worrying about a forced sale or a motivated transaction, you're dealing with a windfall of tax free capital. My goodness. It certainly takes care of a lot of problems that come up in a situation like that.

So really I have a different story to share.

Yeah, please.

Client who, who passed away a couple years ago and he's like the happiest person and healthiest person that I met. And then all of a sudden he dropped that on the hockey rink.

Oh boy.

And, and it was such a shock to the family, to us as well, because we've been the accountant for a number of years and we build a relationship with him. He's one of my earliest clients and it was just very sad. And for the team as well, for the team, the entire team that worked with him. And so we've been working with the, the, the wife and we were told that he canceled his life insurance policy a couple months ago. Now his life insurance policy is not a whole life policy, but at least it is something. But he canceled it because he didn't see the need for it and it caused a lot of trouble and like unnecessary financial pressure when he passed away. And I've witnessed them all, like all through the entire process. The wife as well as the kids were going through so much pain on top of having to deal with all these pressure, the financial pressure and that.

That just losing a loved one is devastating enough. And, and then like, like you said, you know, having to deal with the financial pressure. One of our late mentors, Bob Shiels, he often said, I wish that everyone could die once, just for a week. If you could die once just for a week and see the problems that are left behind. If there's a, if there's no planning, if there was nothing in place to see the problems that are left behind.

You would, you would make some pretty significant changes. And, and just to ensure that you're, you're dealing with what is going to eventually be a reality for, for people who are left behind. And gosh, what, what an amazing instrument, you know, in this, you know, dividend paying, participating, whole life and then working with you and your team who are specializing in dealing with real estate investors and having that complete package is a great way to bulletproof, you know, your, everything that you work so hard for. Because qualifying for a mortgage is one thing. It's all the hard work that you did to prepare to be qualified for it to begin with. You know, the banks don't just lend money to anybody. And when, when you're building this portfolio of real estate, you're doing it not only for a deferred benefit, but you're also doing it to improve and expand your wealth and create the lifestyle that you want. And, but again, you know, we, we're, we're just so grateful to, to work together and, and to be associated because we really truly are, we really, truly are doing something that's going to be transformational for families who want to build a real estate portfolio and want to be protected and want ready access to money and just want to stop dealing with all the headaches involved in financing and, you know, not have to worry when death comes about stroking a big check to Revenue Canada and not having access to the assets and so much more. So we're very blessed to have this association and our listeners are very blessed to, to hear from someone like you who specializes in, in this area. It's, it's awesome.

Well, first of all, I want to thank you. Like, I don't know if I live necessarily live up to that expectation, but I, I think I always, when clients always approach me about estate planning, the way that I explain to clients or anyone who ask me, because I, I do go to a lot of events. I meet a lot of real estate investors in general. Some of them become my clients, some of them don't. But we think we still talk and we still have a great conversation. They asked me how they could, would be able to leave their assets to the, to the, to their children and the type of tax planning that they need to do, the type of structure that they need to do to, to facilitate that, to minimize the amount of taxes that they would have to pay. I, the way that I explained to my clients or any real estate investor out there. Is that the way the current way it's going is that at some point someone somehow has to pay the tax, Whether it is in your lifetime or it's being deferred all the way to when your kid own the property and decide to eventually sell the property. Someone always has to pay that tax. It's just the timing. So like whatever tax planning that's involved, you still need to be prepared for the tax bill, ultimate tax bill that you would have to pay whether it is in your lifetime or when you pass away or whether it is in your kids lifetime. You just need to be prepared for that amount. And yes, I think the whole life insurance is a very, I guess, a very good complement to that problem that we have. We live in a great country and yes, we have to pay a lot of taxes, but at the same time, I can't even tell you like the people the story that I hear, oh yeah, I'm leaving the country, I need to move somewhere because this sucks. I have no freedom. And then we know of someone who moved to Panama because they don't want to pay tax. We know Panama is generally a tax haven and so they have no tax payable over there. But during COVID the person would not be able to have access to food. So I'm grateful to have to be living in Canada. I'm grateful to what we have and I'm grateful for also having the ability to buy real estate and be prepared for it. It substitute a portion of the tax to the government. But I also want to be prepared for it. I know I'm getting a lot in Canada in general, so I don't mind paying a portion of it to the government to keep our great country going.

And if that makes sense, that makes perfect sense. And if you can be in a position where you're going to let the life insurance company pay the bill versus having your estate pay the bill one way is a lot cheaper than the other. And so use the life insurance company's money to take care of the of the bill versus having the estate pay for it.

Oh, absolutely. It's not just that. I think there is the growth component that I really appreciate because Canadian real estate, I mean it has been going down a little bit just because of the recent federal budget announcement and all the recent measure, but generally it has been going up and it will continue to go up. And similar to the death benefit offered by the whole life insurance, it will continue to grow, to grow as well. Maybe not necessarily in the same pace. But at the same time, there is that growth component. So it may or may not match the exact tax liability that you have. And there are other way to fix that tax liability to a certain. Hold that into a certain amount. We can do that totally. The tax accountant will be able to do your tax planning for you to limit the tax liability. But at the same time, I really appreciate the whole life insurance, the growth component in it, and I think that's why it's a great fit for real estate investor.

I agree wholeheartedly because we haven't met one real estate investor yet who's allergic to cash. Yeah, we ask them all the time, like, hey, when's the last time you had an allergy test? Because we want to make sure that you're not allergic to money and the cash value that accumulates in the policy while you're alive, guaranteed on a daily basis. And it can't go backward. That's value that cannot be repossessed. And if you've got this aquarium, you can borrow against it to improve or expand your real estate investing activity. My goodness. The real estate investors that we work with, that you've been kind enough to introduce to us and that we're privileged to serve, not one of them is allergic to money. Shocker.

It's actually a very interesting. I mean, I'm always speaking from my own personal experience as well. I'm sure Richard has a lot of also real estate investing experience as well. When you qualify for financing, it's just a little bit interesting to go through the process I'm going through with Scotia Private wealth right now. It's a longer process. That's a different story. But they do like to see the life insurance and they do like to use it as collateral. It helps strengthen your whole application, which is something that I, I mean, I'm just experiencing now. I know, Jason, you work with a lot of people. I'm sure Richard, you probably uses it as well, but I use it as well, but I mean, I'm just experiencing it a little bit. So it's interesting to see how it impacts the borrowing too.

Yeah, it's the, it's the quality of the asset that appeals to the, to the bank and the lender when they, when they understand. I mean, if you're dealing with, you know, if you just walk in and talk to a teller at your regular bank, they may not have any idea. They're not generally not trained. But you're talking about being at the private wealth management level. And yes, they, they fully Understand in fact they are often the largest lender of collateral on those types of contracts. And so what's interesting when I, when I speak to real estate investors and I find what really connects and resonates with them and you, you may have found this as well is you know, there's, there's, so there's a myriad of different ways that you can, you could purchase property and generate profits. You got you know, flipping and long term buy and holds and you've got people doing a different lease option strategies and there's a whole host of Airbnbs and a whole host of different ways. But you know, generally what people first think about is this, the plain vanilla. I'm going to go put 20% down. I'm going to buy a place for the long term. I'm going to hold it for 10 to 20 years and it'll eventually get paid for and I'll have this extra cash flow in retirement and then one day later on I can sell that. That's kind of the, the very vanilla aspect of it. And I think that the power whole life contract, especially when it's designed well and the way that you've become familiar with it really is very closely related. It's very synonymous with a long term buy and hold property. It, it, you know, it, you put, you have to put some capital into it. Eventually it becomes very profitable in a short number of years. It produces cash flow. Eventually you can kind of have it paid for. All these kind of things can happen. The, the difference I think is that in, in the real estate market we, we, we do see ebbs and flows. Yes, there's a, you can draw a trend line from like 1980 to today and you'll see it, it's going up pretty substantially. But in those individual pockets along those years, there's periods where it's down and then it recovers. And you know, Edmonton's a market where that's been happening. I know I still have a property in Edmonton that's I could finally now get rid of it for what I paid for today. But that's been about 12 years, you know. Cause I bought it at a peak of the market. And so I'm sure we have listeners who've experienced this. In fact, I was talking to two of them this week. Another, another gal who moved to Ontario. She's got a property in Edmonton. It's a condo. She owes almost double what the property is worth today. And so that's not, doesn't always happen but it does happen at some points in Time. And so people, I think it's important for them to have that connection where we don't control the market condition and we don't control the interest rate environment and we don't control what the, the federal powers that be, you know, on, on high make decisions about our lives that could have an impact on marketplaces which, which we' take place. And so I think it's important that people recognize power whole life contract when designed the right way, it has similar attributes of building equity. We're able to build equity in a very nice easy method. We can create long term cash flows with it, but the market value or the appreciation is, is guaranteed. There's forced appreciation in a power whole life contract that, that doesn't occur in a long term buy and hold. You might have the potential for a higher level of appreciation, but you also can't control that it happens. And so I think when you break the two components apart, they have these similarities and they're also contracts in that you, you own the title on a piece of property. Well, you, you own private contract, a contract with the insurance company. And so they operate under that private contract level, which I think is very interesting. So I'd be curious as you're talking to the real estate investors and all the networking groups that you're a part of and, and, and your own network that you guys regularly provide educational content to, how do you find people are learning about the different options like, like cash value insurance that can help support the growth of their real estate ventures?

I think the biggest is the need when, when people have that need and when people get educated on really how this is how much I would have to pay tax on. I think that's, that's the aha moment. Hey, like I need to do something about it and what can we do about it? And that's the part that I think it, I think that's the trigger when, when people start looking at whole life insurance policy because they probably don't know that hey, I don't have to sell my property, I never plan to sell my property, so why do I have to pay any tax? But they, what they didn't know is that even if they don't sell their property, eventually they're going to pass away. That's just life. And so at that point that's when tax take in and people doesn't understand it and therefore that's where the problem is. But to your point earlier, whole life insurance is very similar to real estate. But to me what I get attracted to is not Necessarily just a need. Obviously I have a need. I have huge amounts of mortgage just like a lot of real estate investors out there. And then I have two kids that I need to protect. And to me that's extremely, extremely important because they are still young, they don't know what going on. And so I wanted to be able to provide them with that net safety net. But I also don't want to lose the opportunity because you know like smart money investing through the whole life policy. And I want to use that to provide the protection but at the same time not necessarily losing the money that I invested in a policy or used to buy the policy. So when I funnel it through and then it's when it still allows me to take the money out and then buy real estate, I think that that really, really makes a difference. And a lot of people don't understand that. Oh, you know how like I think Jason knows this really well as well. I know Jason is a tax geek himself. Especially when it comes down to like applying whole life insurance policy. Like when I think a couple years ago 2017 when the finance minister Bill Mono changed rules when the, for example doctors and dentists, all these high paying professional, they are incorporated and if they earn these interest, they, sorry, they earn these passive income, they have to. And, and if it exceed the $50,000 they are going to affect the small business deduction rate. So their business income is going to be taxed at a higher rate. But by funneling through all these corporate profits through an insurance policy they can still invest. They can take all the money to invest just like they normally do. But then now you're investing in two vehicle as well as lowering your passive income because you now have to pay interest by borrowing against yourself. But that, that is one, not necessarily a perk but at least it helps with all these tax planning strategy as well.

Oh absolutely. And when you have this wonderful tool, this contract that is exempt.

From the passive investment income tax rules and you become a co owner of the company that issues the contract and that company has never failed to engineer a surplus since inception.

And you're going to trigger at some point a windfall of capital that's going to give rise to the capital dividend account inside the corporation, you get assets out of the corporation in the form of tax free capital dividends. How much capital do you not want flowing through a tool like that?

Absolutely, absolutely. So this is the reason why people, I mean it solves a big problem. At the end of the day it started with having that problem and facing that problem and then having the solution or the tool that equip them to solve that problem and having them understand how to use a tool to their advantage as well. It's not just, hey, I'm committing this much money to a policy and I'm losing out on the other investment vehicle. It's not like that you can choose and then rinse it. To me, it's just how you direct your cash. By rinsing it through a policy.

Absolutely.

One thing that's interesting is we talked about some of the liability aspects, why, why people would choose to incorporate for their real estate business and we've talked about tax minimization and that sort of thing. What I find is intriguing is just to kind of learn from you and your knowledge base, you know, because I know when I first started getting into real estate investing, I didn't know anything about what corporate advantage was. I just heard, oh, I know there's some good stuff there and you should consider that. But I didn't know enough about it. And of course, learning more, you begin to delve down that path. What I'm curious is as you, as you meet with people and you're starting to look at their, their portfolio of real estate, how they're structured with different properties and some of their objectives, how many that come to you are familiar with the capital dividend account and how the CDA in a corporation can play a large role in that, in that lifelong mitigation of tax. Because I know for me it was, it was eye opening when I first learned about it. So I'm just curious if people are having awareness when they come to you now or is that a real opportunity that you get to showcase to them how such a, such a, an account that every corporation in Canada has can, can play a huge advantage in their financial life.

It, it for sure helps when it comes to explaining that capital dividend account and the power of capital dividend account, especially when they are, they're engaged with you or actually purchase a life insurance policy, they would come to us and, and ask about that questions and it doesn't come up all the time, but it does, it does help when the life insurance policy is put in within the corporation.

Yeah, absolutely. And you know, the thing that, and we've got great video on this as well that really expands, you know, on the discussion. But what people.

Most, most accountants that we've spoken to as well, who, where they have clients, they're not specialized in this area of real estate investing as you are with, with your organization. And when we Talk about the. The. This notional account, this capital dividend account. And we say, look, if you have a situation where you've got $4 million of, of assets, tangible assets inside the company, you've got this insurance contract with a $10 million death benefit. The corporate owner, who's the life insured, passes away, has a $5 million loan balance outstanding.

The CDA credit is for the entire $10 million.

Absolutely right.

And the accountant goes, can you run that by me just one more time, but just say it a little slower because did I hear what you just said? Is that correct? And the answer is yes, it's absolutely correct. So the amount of, of death benefit that's actually received by the corporation is 5 million because there was a loan balance outstanding. So you got a $10 million death benefit. You've got a CDA credit of 10 million. You have a loan balance outstanding at death. The loan balance is extinguished by the death benefit. The insurance company sends a check to the corporation for $5 million. The notional account, called the capital dividend account, is created. It's credited with $10 million. We've got another $4 million of tangible assets that need to come out to the surviving shareholders or the heirs. All of that comes out tax free. Tax free.

The accountant goes, why didn't anybody explain this to me when I was going through my accounting training? Because the conversation around life insurance is just so shallow. It's just, hey, you need to know you're gonna have a lot of people asking you for your opinion on something. And we always suggest, much like I know you do too, always speak to somebody who's designated to give you the advice in that area of expertise. Because an opinion can be very detrimental. If an accountant says, look, my opinion is you shouldn't purchase the insurance. Well, if you're not designated to give that opinion, and God forbid you have a client who passes away prematurely while playing ice hockey and someone says you should, yeah, you should just get rid of that policy. Which didn't happen in this case, but just following the same example, and that person wasn't designated to provide that advice, they're going to have a very big legal problem on their hands. When the family says what the accountant told you to. Can't terminate this thing. How long has the accountant been licensed in this area? Never. Houston, we've got a problem, a big problem. And so that's why professionals like you who go about this properly say, listen, there's a need here, but you've gotta meet with a designated professional, an extension of our team who can help you and guide you through this and that. That's again just another facet of the relationship that we, we're just so grateful for because it's, it's rare.

Yeah, absolutely. This is the reason why a lot of our investor purchase, our clients purchase an insurance policy inside a corporation. Typically we advise them to put it in the corporation for that same reason. Exact same reason.

Yeah, it's so good. So good. And talk to us about in terms of your, your groups and, and the education, the resources that you provide. Talk to us about that. You, you host YouTube videos, webinars. I'll never forget when you first got started and you were like, oh gosh, you know, I'm, I'm just getting started on the social media and I feel just obviously a little bit, you know, it's something new. It's a little uncomfortable at first, but how you show up on camera now, how you show up on the YouTubes and the Facebooks is way different today than it was when you first got started. I, I'm so proud of you. Like, you really done really well.

Thank you. Thank you. I mean, I learned a lot from you guys as well. I know you have a very strong social media presence as well. It's not just me. I'm learning from everyone that I can see that has a great marketing channel. So we do a lot of, I would say a lot of content. Maybe in some marketers eyes it's called content marketing. The reality is that I believe, to me, I believe that my goal is to become the Google map for real estate investor, for hardworking Canadians seeking financial freedom. So my, I'm using the channel that I have. So including my blog, I do a weekly blog post on my website and if you want to receive that, you can do that. I do a blog post every single week. I do, I do my YouTube video on a weekly basis on a relevant topic to real estate investor. And then I also, I'm on social media, Instagram, Facebook and on occasion probably once or twice a quarter, quarter. I do a webinar to my client, my, my email list so that we could provide more value to them. And really I just wanted to simplify the life, I, I guess simplify the income tax act so people can actually understand it and it's something that they can apply on a daily basis and not missing out and not pay a dime more. I love the country, but then at the same time we are also paying a lot of taxes. What you're seeing is just what you're seeing what we are seeing on the income tax return is just the personal taxes, the corporation tax, maybe the HST as well. But what people are not seeing is the property tax, the HST that you are paying to consume everything, and that there is the excise tax at the import tax duty that you're not even seeing because it's embedded and that there is a tax on gas. There are all kind of taxes that we are paying already. So we're just trying to minimize that as well, simplify the tax acts to the level that majority of people can understand and apply to their daily lives.

Well, I bet you if somebody came out with a YouTube channel that was focused on, you don't feel like you're paying enough tax. Subscribe to this channel. We'll teach you how to pay more. This channel would probably have no subscribers.

Yeah, for sure.

You know, crickets and. But that's one thing that you do really well is you, you take something that would otherwise be complex for most people and you simplify it and that is valuable. That is really valuable. So don't, don't ever lose that. Keep doing that.

That's something that you've done with your new book as well. And that book, I'm. I'm guessing, you know, there's, there's obviously a lot of strategies and ideas for people to understand the inner workings as a real estate investor, you know, if you were to pick one, one item or one chapter out of the book that you think is really relevant right now today for people that are watching, that are real estate investors, to be aware of, what would, what would be one that pops into mind.

So the book has a lot of great information, a lot of basic teaching. What can be deductible, what cannot be deductible. Tax is a continued evolving thing. I think one thing that I wanted to bring out from my book, not necessarily from a tax perspective, is regardless where you are, you can just start. And if you don't start today, I mean, if you haven't started yesterday, you're not behind. You can always choose to start today. I think the biggest message, and when I finished writing that book in 2017, the biggest message was that I, that with someone with my background, I think I represent a different voice in the industry in general as well. Someone with my background. English is not my first language. I immigrated to Canada in my late teens and I went through all these things and when I first came here, I probably would not be able to have this conversation at all. I wouldn't, not that you wouldn't be patient enough, but I wouldn't be able to understand anything. It's just the book is represent more than just tax and of course tax. The boring stuff is there and the technical practical stuff is there. But I wanted to also use the book to inspire people who think that they is not possible. Everything is possible.

I love that.

And we would encourage our viewers on the YouTubes and our listeners on the podcast platform. Head on over to realestate Tax Tips Ca. Again, that's realestate Tax Tips ca. And when you get to realestate taxtips Cat, you'll be able to connect with Sheri, connect with her team and you'll be glad you did. So again, that's realestatetaxtips CA and just ease on over there. We're gonna have all the links in the show notes as well where you can connect with Cherry on different social media platforms and keep an eye on her content. It's glad you did. Especially for those who are actively investing in real estate, maybe you're contemplating beginning your journey in real estate investing. Whether you want to improve it or expand it, you'll be very well served connecting with Cherry and her amazing team. So rich with that. Take us home on this amazing Friday.

Take it away.

Well, Terry, we, we appreciate you so much being here and sharing your knowledge with us today and, and your continual knowledge that you'll be sharing ongoing in the future for everyone that gets connected with you and the information that you do provide now moving forward through time, you're as you release these blog posts and you, you do the content that you' then you meet knee to knee or zoom to zoom, as it were, probably a lot today with the clients that you, you're going to serve. Every time that you help a real estate investor save a few dollars or a lot of dollars in tax and every time that you help them understand how they can be more protected against liability risks that exist for them, helping them understand how to navigate the ins and outs of structuring their real estate business. You may not show up thinking that you're, you know, wearing a cape to all those meetings, but you're really showing up as a superhero because all that value that you provide is intrinsic to the wealth creation and the wealth preservation of Canadian families. So we thank you for that. And our question for you is who do you most want to be a hero to?

Oh, absolutely. My kids. Absolutely. We're doing this all for my kids. Not to have them inherit my business or anything. It's more for to set a good example for them that anything is possible.

Jerry, it's been an absolute pleasure yet again and we will have you back if you'll join us. And we encourage again our viewers on the YouTubes. You'll see a playlist that just showed up because we have a great editing team. Like, they just, it just showed up. It's pretty awesome. And so continue your journey of learning and there's always something new to learn. There's no such thing as having arrived in knowledge. Make sure you get connected with Cherry and have an amazing rest of your week. This was a lot of fun. As always. Thank you, Cherry. Please give our very best personal regards to Irwin and I'll look forward to seeing you in one of my trips up to the gta. And I appreciate you very much. So enjoy the rest of your week.

Yeah. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me, guys.

Thanks for listening to the Wealth Without Bay street podcast where your wealth matters. Be sure to check out our social media channels for more great content. Hit subscribe on your favorite podcast player and be sure to rate the show. We definitely appreciate it. And don't forget to share this episode with someone you care about. Join us on the next episode where we continue to uncover the financial tools, strategies and the mindsets that maximize your wealth.