Singapore based entrepreneur gets customers to paint their own cinema. The Projector story with Karen Tan.

Hello and welcome to this episode of the Unnoticed Entrepreneur with me, Jim James from the uk. Today we're going to Singapore, sunny Singapore, to meet Karen Tan, who is the founder and CEO of a company called the Projector, which is a community based cinema in Singapore. Karim, welcome to the show.

Hello. Thanks for having me.

Well, it's my pleasure. Because I was in Singapore, we went to see the Projector on Handy Road and it's fabulous. And I wanted to, you know, get you on the show to talk about how you've built this community cinema in a, in a city state that's not famous for having creative, you know, art house style projects, but you've managed to build this to a cinema that's got, you know, over 250 cinema viewings a year for films. You've got 35 to 40,000 people as your community. Karen, you started this business back in 2015. So tell us about the Projector and the vision that you've had for building this cinema.

Oh, big questions. So the Projector, not easily summarized in one in, in one sentence and I think we deliberately set out to make it that way. So it's an, you know, it's Singapore's only independent cinema and but you know, our tagline is not your average cinema. So we, from the start, from the get go, it was to, you know, the vision was to create a place that was beyond just a space for showing film but also to broaden our sort of slate of content to, you know, anything that was cultural and artistic and creative in terms of performance. So you know, we play host to, you know, comedy, comedy, comedy nights, jazz performances, drag queen cabarets, art exhibitions, talks, panel discussions on social issues. You name it, we have it. Cat adoption drives even. So it's a cinema, it's arts and cultural space. It's also just a platform for creative expression and it's also now known as a cultural institution as well in its own right in the Singapore cultural landscape. And also, you know, a home for, for, for our community of supporters and our fan base who, who, who are regulars and actually are our best ambassadors at this point.

So Karen, and the reason I wanted to have you on the show is because it's such a unique business that you've built and you know, you and I are going to talk about how you've built that as ways that fellow unnoticed entrepreneurs can learn about how you've really started something from the, from the ground up and built it strong community that also survived. Covid. Let's not forget to say that that many venues have gone out of business. But you've come through this really well. So we're going to talk about how you've managed to do that. So Karen, just tell us first of all about the funding for the projector because that in itself I think has a really interesting story that maybe gives a hint to the success and the durability of the brand.

Yeah, so it has the seeds of, I guess, how we approach the business and also how we view ourselves. So at the start, so the projector, I started this with my co founders, Blaze, Trig Smith, my business partner and my sister Sharon Tan. And all three of us did not come from a cinema background and not a film background, frankly. And so, you know, we were literally starting from scratch with this idea. And I think, you know, amongst other things which we, you know, had to try and figure out quite early on was, was funding and of course we had, you know, some seed capital that we could plow into the business. But also, you know, we, we decided quite early on that crowdfunding was going to be quite, quite, you know, an important piece of funding that we would engage with. So we did a crowdfunding raise on Indiegogo. I think it was maybe 50 to 70,000 US dollars. I can't quite remember now. It wasn't, you know, it was material but it wasn't, you know, the majority of the funds required. But, and you know, I suppose we could have funded that amount in other ways, but crowdfunding for us was really important in the context of Singapore because we looked at it also not just as a means to raise money, but also to get people behind us to get the word out. It was essentially a good vehicle for word of mouth marketing and reducing the risk of the startup because you're pre selling tickets, you're pre selling seats, or you're pre selling venue hire slots. And that was, we weren't quite sure how it would be received, but it was tremendously well received and we were really heartened by that. And I think there's something to be said also about having people put their money where their mouth is. If they think something's a great idea or they want to see something happen. And if they've been part of a crowdfunding drive for it, it's the, it makes sense that they tell their friends and they get their friends to come once it's open and it's something that they can be proud of because they literally help make it happen. And this. Yeah. And it was so that emotional connection that we were able to then Build early on with our customer base or we view them as also our community. That was really, for us, instrumental in like literally getting started financially, but also psychologically for us. You know, we had one of the first screenings and we didn't even have like a means of like issuing tickets. We didn't have even a means of procuring films in a formal way. But, you know, we had friends who were film directors and they contributed the films. And then we just put some, we put some Facebook kind of posts out and we were wondering how many people show up in the first week. And we thought, okay, if we get, if we get 80, that would be an achievement, wouldn't it? Yeah, so be great. 350 people showed up and I. We still have photos from that day where people are sitting, you know, on the steps. There wasn't, there wasn't a, there wasn't an inch, you know, to spare. People sitting on the stage listening to the director's Q and A after the film. And I think for us, that overwhelming response from the Singapore creative community was really something that we still remember to this day. And, you know, I think that was, that just really got us psychologically over the line, like, yes, we can do this and people want this and people are behind this. So, yeah, that was a long answer to a short question.

No, no, no, it's, hey, it's, it's wonderful. And because it's plainly a project that you put so much heart and soul into and it shows. So you've now got, for example, people can become a member. So how did you transition that and how do you sort of get people to sign up to be a member of the projector? And what do you give them as if you like sort of membership rewards and loyalties.

So we've got a membership, we've got, we've got membership, membership scheme. At the moment it's quite, it's quite simple. You can be a student club member, senior club member, you basically get some free tickets and you get discounts on all the merchandise and food and beverage. Sometimes you get access to screenings or special events. Well, Covid put paid some of those plans, but it's our intention to build out the content for membership over time and that's something that we are looking to do going forward. But yeah, so that's the membership program. We do engage a lot with our community on our socials, Facebook, Instagram. There's also now TikTok and also we've got a weekly sort of newsletter that goes out via email and Edm that has a really high open rate of I think 50% and pretty high engagement rate on our, across our socials as well. So it is really about, you know, we are giving, giving our company a voice. The projector has a voice and we're not afraid to use it, you know, to make, you know, in terms of making social statements or just being irreverent and witty and funny and corny and you know.

Yeah. And Karen, you know, I have to ask you, Singapore is, you know, well known for being the center of many things but creativity and relaxed thinking, not necessarily one of them. How have you had to deal with any sort of government, sort of regulations and permits and sort of government relations? Obviously not on a political basis but this is key in running something like you're doing with the projector, isn't it?

Yes. You know being a cinema operator is a licensed business in Singapore as with most other places. So and being that we are in Singapore, it's quite highly regulated, very little room for navigation or gray area. The simple answer is comply. You know that's kind of. And we, you know, lots, interestingly, interestingly lots of people have the impression that you know, we're quite renegade. We are but you know, that doesn't mean that we have to do it at the expense of endangering licenses which to a business are fundamental to your ability to, to operate. So we, you know, we take that quite seriously. We you know, do everything overboard but we've also been able to engage, you know, this IMDA which is Singapore's sort of censorship board if you will. You know, we engage with them pretty often in terms of whether they should censor a particular film or a scene. You know, we, we do push back quite hard with them and they have been quite willing to engage. So.

Yeah, yeah, so, so part of the communication is, is with, it's a sort of a stakeholder, isn't it? Just by virtual terms the authorities there. Karen, you've also got for example venue hire and I'm showing that on the screen and you've got quite a lot of big companies that have been renting out your amazing looking venues. What's been the strategy? Because on the one hand you talk about community and being a little bit art house for example, but you've got Google, Microsoft, Zendesk, Carly Reebok, Uber as your clients for rental. How has that worked? How can you reconcile sort of being offbeat, trendy and being corporate venue?

I suppose it's cool by proximity would be a summary of a fair summary of what's happening here? So, yes, we're known to be, you know, edgy and offbeat and arty and cool and, you know, you'd be surprised at the number of, you know, banks and legal firms that, you know, are looking for a venue to have a town hall in that is not a standard hotel ballroom or an auditorium. And of course, you know, creative companies, tech companies, you know, startups, those are a natural fit to our venue and our vibe. But yeah, it's. I think people are, well, people like. Like, you know, like something different and, you know, that's what we are. Our Golden Mile Tower flagship is essentially a 1970s vintage cinema. You know, we are the only cinema with. We are the only vintage cinema in Singapore, actually, because we reupholstered and also restored the actual seats from the 1970s. That's not found anywhere else. And it's just. We've created a. The vibe of the projectors is deliberately anti corporate and kind of. Yeah, and relaxed. It's quite a. We create a really relaxed, almost slightly vintagey, edgy environment which people sort of resonate with.

Yeah, And I love that. So, Karen, it seems like a sort of a masterclass in building a community and a venue that's in line with the mission. Have there been any things that you and the team at the Projector in Singapore have done that hasn't worked out quite as planned? Because I don't want to embarrass anybody, but it's always useful to learn from people what they've done that hasn't worked.

I think if you're a startup, it's never an embarrassment anymore when things don't work out. It's just part of the everyday, really. So I think, yeah, no, we've tried loads of things and I think part of our. I hate to use the word corporate culture just feels weird, but a strong part of our culture is actually empowering all our members of the team to have autonomy and judgment and the ability to be creative and sort of take ownership of whatever they're doing. And so if they've got ideas that they'd like to try out, we're more than happy to kind of listen to them and let them give it a go. Even if we don't actually know how it's going to pan out exactly, or how exactly it's going to be executed, I think. So there's a lot of. What I'm trying to say is there's a lot of experimentation that goes on within our company and it's part of our DNA to Be innovative and to sort of rock the boat. And I think so. And part and parcel of that is obviously failing, you know, and so how long is a piece of string? How long do you have? But I think one of the. One of the main things that we tried recently would have been. So we thought. We thought. We had thought that it would be relatively easy, a transition to maybe also start kind of getting in some mainstream films and getting a bit of that piece of. To sort of further diversify what. We further diversify our slate. And so we've tried to do that in the last couple of years, and it's proven quite challenging, actually, because on the surface we thought, okay, well, we provide a really cool, nice physical environment. And our food and beverage is kind of better than your average Coke and nachos. You get to have a lovely chicken karaage with a lovely pizza and beer. And, you know, it's a full sort of hospitality approach to the cinema experience. And we thought, okay, well, you know, if they're showing the exact same film, like Avatar versus a commercial big boy who has none of those things, surely the choice is obvious. Like people, you know, the customer come to us. But. But no, actually, I think it's. It's been quite challenging getting people to come to ours to, you know, the more mainstream blockbusters, if you will, that we're not known for. And we think it's, you know, it's quite possibly due to the fact that we're actually victims of the strength of our brand. You know, when people think about, you know, an art house film, naturally they just hit us up on our website and they buy a ticket because they know that it's a natural fit. You know, of course, I'll see the projector. But, you know, if they start thinking about things like Avengers or, you know, Top Gun, they straight away, I think the association is with, you know, the commercial big boy chains and so. And so, yeah, so that's one of the learnings that we've had. It's almost like, you know, do we. So right now we're at the cross. We're at a crossroads. Whether we. We're wondering whether we should just maybe not pursue those films anymore at the risk of maybe, you know, brand dilution and just keep building on, you know, what. What we're known for and what we're good at.

Yeah. So. So staying in the lane, if you like. And you've got, for example, a film festival coming up this year, for example, you've got the European Film Festival, and you've also Got some movies that are. That really are our art house, including, for example, some sort of testimonials to. To people that have passed away, that are famous directors and so on, haven't you? So you've got, you know, remembering Ryuichi Sakamoto, for example. So. So staying faithful to the core mission makes a lot of sense, and I can already see that now. I just want to also ask you, Karen, in the venue that I've been to, that you're in today, do you want to just also tell people how you help people to share when they're at the venue? Because you've built some lovely ways for your clientele to share the fact that they're at the projector? Do you want to just tell us about that? About those little areas that you've created?

Yes. So when. Whenever we go into a space, we. It is important for us to create spaces that are just sort of memorable and different and I suppose, for lack of a better word, Instagrammable, you know, and so in the location that we're in, a lot of the. We've covered the walls with posters, and every single poster is a film that we have shown. It's not a random. It has passed through our projectors and passed through our screens. So, you know, there's a story to tell. There's. And, you know, we found people sort of like pointing posters out to their friends and going, oh, well, you know, remember last year I came and we watched that and so on this, that and the other, you know, we also kind of worked with some of our designer friends and created like, almost like mini sets inspired by certain films. And, you know, in the lobby. And, you know, it's just. It's part of the seating. It's, you know, it's not like a museum piece. You can do what you like with it. But, you know, creating just a unique sort of look and feel, I think, encourages people to sort of interact with the physical space and also, you know, take photos and share, as is the thing with Millennials and Gen Z these days. So we're, you know, giving them what they want. And the other thing that we do with our physical spaces is that when we kind of do a renovation, we do engage our community in actually physically shaping the space. So, you know, they help us build, you know, our signage, or they've helped us paint our ceilings or string up lights or put up posters, and they also get to sign their names on the walls. And so it's all part of sort of, you know, allowing people to contribute to, you as well as have a sense of ownership over what we're creating.

And Karen Tan, the founder and CEO of the projector. What I think is also amazing is that you're describing really also personalization at scale because you've showing over 250 movies a year and you've got 30, 40,000 people on your mailing list and yet there's a real human touch to each interaction. And having been to the handy Road venue in Singapore recently feels so comfortable. And yet you've got commercially a proposition that plainly can scale because you've also got some other franchises, haven't you? I saw you've got, for example, a hairdresser in there and some other related franchises. Karen, if there's one piece of advice for my fellow unnoticed entrepreneurs from you in Singapore about getting noticed, what would you like to share?

Don't do it. Run to the hills now while you can. Leave.

All righty, we're not going to edit that out because Karen has been a, you know, has persevered, but you, you've built a business, Karen.

Yeah.

You survived this long.

In all seriousness, in all seriousness, Karen.

I know each other very well and don't run for the hills. Stick with the business. Otherwise where will people go? To the cinema? Karen, come on. One, one tip for us.

Yeah, I, I think that would be, you know, you've got to. And for sustainable, for sustainability, I think you've got to. Well, well, you don't have to. I mean, it's your choice. But I might, I would recommend, highly recommend, sort of building a community around your business. And it's almost, it's almost about viewing your customers not just as customers, but also community members and supporters and people you can engage with and also people that you can kind of draw on for help as well. You know, a lot of our supporters come forth and they're graphic designers. Sometimes they work with us, you know, they, and they were actually instrumental in supporting us through Covid, you know, and, and so it is about trying to get that community behind your business and getting them to feel, and allowing them to contribute and therefore feel connected to the business and what you, what you're building together almost. So it does sound a bit like a community project, but it's not, It's a business except that, you know, you build a community around your business and these will be like your most loyal fan base and ambassadors. And, you know, it comes through them feeling proud of what, you know, the business stands for and being proud of being associated with that. And, you know, they'll tell their friends, they'll tell their families, they'll tell their, you know, tourists that come to visit. It's that, that's. That gets you a lot more mileage than, you know, an advertisement.

Karen, Tony, Nothing. Hopefully you're proud of what you've accomplished there in Singapore with the projector. Thank you so much for joining me and my fellow unnoticed entrepreneurs today on the show.

Thank you very much for having me.

Well, it's been my pleasure. An inspiring story on lots of levels there with Karen Tan. Of course, I'll put her details in the show notes, but you can just also go if you want to find the website. It's TheProjector SG and of course we will include that and Karen's contact details. So thank you so much for listening to this show show and with me here in the uk, Jim and Karen there in Singapore, on the other side of the world. And if you've enjoyed this, do please share it with a fellow unnoticed entrepreneur. And if you've got a moment, review the show on your player because it really helps that other people are sharing and liking the show. Thank you so much for listening. Until we meet again, I just encourage you to keep on communicating.