The UBER of Car Rentals

When you go on holiday and you want to rent a car, you're faced with just a few of the very large branded networks. And in fact, I was having a conversation the other day about how tiring it is because when you arrive they try and sell you all the add-ons when you just got off the plane. It's really, really tiring. And I loved Stavros in Crete who ran his own car rental shop. And I love to walk down the street and meet the guy who actually runs the shop, who owns the car rental business. But if you are booking a car for a holiday or a business trip, it's very hard to find Stavros until you get there. Well, my guest today has solved that problem for people like you and me who are traveling, and also for the person like Stavros in Crete who offers a wonderful personalized service. But until now, couldn't be found by people unless they're walking down the street. We're going to have a conversation with Amar Akhtar, who is joining us from actually Cardiff. Uh, he's got a great life story. We'll hear about that, but he's actually changing the way that we can relate to the car rental companies, but he's also liberating international clients for people that run local car companies. Amar, welcome to the show, founder and CEO of a company called Finalrentals.

Jim James, thank you very much for having me and thank you for such fantastic intro. I mean, you have really found the Stavros.

I have, and Stavros, fantastic, runs the business, was willing to stay open later than the Europcar. His cars were clean. His daughter was helping keep the shop open until we could get back from the beach in time. Just a wonderful personal service. Great insurance. Great price, everything I wanted, but I wouldn't have found him unless I'd been walking down the street. Finalrentals, you're changing that, aren't you? You are helping people to find that person who runs a company and really cares about you when you arrive in country. So tell us about Finalrentals. You've got a bit of a backstory from Pakistan to Dubai to Cardiff, of all places. Um, and so we're going to talk about that a little bit, but then we'll talk about how you've built this amazing platform with what we call a dual avatar strategy. You're getting both people that want to rent cars and people that want to, uh, hire the cars to us. But also, you've raised money recently, so we can talk about that as well. Tell us, first of all, why did you start the Finalrentals.com business, Ammar?

Yeah, absolutely. So, so, Jim, thank you very much for putting it all together. So, uh, moved from, uh, Pakistan to Dubai in 2006 when I was 18, 19 years old as a young web developer. And as destiny would have it, my first project was to build a website for Budget Rent-A-Car. So Budget was a very, very big brand, and it was its first, let's say, entry to the UAE, to the Gulf market as a big franchise. So I ended up working with Budget, Thrifty, Europcar Enterprise, Hertz, Alamo, all these companies in the GCC, built their platforms built their booking engines, loyalty systems for over 16 years as a group CTO. As I grew older, while I was working with these companies, I realized that they have so many locations, people, cars, resources, and I was always thinking how, like you mentioned, Stavros will, you know, will compete with this, or how Stavros will handle this new wave of expansion, because all these companies were having all the bookings from a Travelocity or a Holiday Autos or or Booking.com or Kayak, Skyscanner. And I was just wondering what will happen to a Stavros, because half of this industry is actually comprising of many, you know, Stavroses, Johans, Jims, and they run a car rental business with 40 cars, 60 cars, 50-odd cars. And as you mentioned, the family business, daughter is helping the father to, to keep the shop open. So I was just thinking about this, how can one, you know, build this business, or call it a digital franchise, and help all these guys come under one umbrella, serve through certain standards, and then join these bigger online platforms. Because I had the technology, I had the knowledge of this. So that was the inception or advent of, you know, Find Your Rentals. That's how I started. And I started with my first two locations in Dubai.

So you started in Dubai, but then you've moved across to Cardiff. Not an obvious lifestyle choice, especially in light of all the rain that— actually, I guess Dubai had a lot of rain recently as well, didn't it? And the UAE had a lot of rain too. That's right. Ammar, why Cardiff?

So that's a very interesting question because I'll be honest with you, 2 and a half years ago, I landed at Cardiff Central Station and I had absolutely no clue if I'm in a new country or if it's a part of the UK or how it works. I had no idea, you know, and I wanted to own a small place or rent a small place in Cardiff But I think fast forward today, I think Cardiff really owns me, to be honest. So how it works is while I was working in Dubai, I was very happy. I was winning awards. I was one of the top entrepreneurs in the car rental space. And then came COVID-19. So when COVID-19 happened, I realized that Dubai wasn't the place for crisis. And what do I mean by that is there were no laws for furlough, for example. There were no government support in terms of how they're going to help us innovators, because we are not greedy people. We don't have money in the bank, but we create innovation, right? And that was the time, right? And I realized it wasn't the place for me. And as an innovator, I was just— I think I, I crossed my time, you know, for, you know, for, you know, for Dubai. And now it's time to explore something else. So I applied for Tech Seed Poland Prize Tech Seed program by European Union. I got into the program, moved to Gdańsk in Poland spent a couple of years there, built business further, added more locations, grew into Europe, Malta, Caribbean, Florida, worked with some incredible young talent. And then one day, one fine day, I got a call from UK Embassy in Warsaw, and they said, hey, do you want to have a tea with us? Come, come, come, let's have a tea. Oh, I was like, okay. So I took a train to Warsaw. I absolutely no clue. I'm like, okay, let's go, let's see how the embassy is, you know, how the UK Embassy is, you know, you know, let's just see it as a trip to the UK Embassy. So when they're like, you are this English-speaking founder Why don't you go to UK? You know, we have Innovator Visa. Why don't you— you know, you can get an Innovator Visa, you can go there, you can raise funding. UK is much, you know, much better in terms of, you know, fundraising and all that in comparison to Poland or Europe as a whole. So I studied that whole program and I applied for it, got into it, and guess what? Landed in Cardiff. Uh, I'm a white person, so I have been to London, Coventry, Birmingham, all these places, Scotland. But the moment I landed, I was having across UK trip to find a place for myself. And the moment I landed in Cardiff, my first foot in Cardiff, it's like Neil Armstrong, you know, Neil Armstrong, right? So a giant leap for my company, I would say. So, so my first steps in Cardiff, I'm like, you know what, this is my place. This is my Silicon Valley. And since then, the rest is history. I never looked back. Raise money from Welsh angels, raise money from the Welsh financial institutions, raise money from London, from Silicon Valley. It has been quite, quite a journey.

That's a wonderful journey. And I've been to Cardiff. I live just across the river, across the estuary, and I live just outside Bath. And Cardiff is a beautiful city, and Wales is an amazing country too. Well, we're very blessed then that the UK has this outreach program from the embassy, and they've brought you back here to the UK and creating jobs and reaching out. Let's just look then at how you've been building the business, Amar, because when you have a platform as you do, you have always this problem of you've got to find the customers and the suppliers, haven't you? Because if you have all the people that want to rent cars and nobody that's renting the cars, that's not going to work. And conversely, if you have lots of people with car rental businesses and no incoming traffic, you're not going to acquire anymore. So can you just take us through the strategy of building the, the two parts of the equation?

Yeah, absolutely. So I, you know, I always tell my team, guys, we, we are in a supply chain business. And they're like, what do you mean by that? I'm like, you know, we create supply and then we also create demand, right? And, and, and if both the ends are working together, you know, only then we are successful. So when it comes to the supply side, We scout, we, we try and find local businesses around the world. We have a world map always in front of us, the most attractive urban centers that we want to attract, the most important airports. So, so, so we have a method to, you know, to, you know, do this madness. And we basically approach those companies through business directories, through Facebook, through Facebook pages. You, you'd be surprised, some businesses only have a Facebook page actually. So, so my team is checking, you know, you know, where they are. We have a chat with them, we have a call with them, and we build our supply base city over city, region region over region, province over province, you know, in, in mostly the highly touristic inbound countries, right? So that's how we approach the supply side. On the demand side, we are always connecting with platforms, you know, who will actually create more bookings for us. So, so we are connected with Kayak, Skyscanner, you know, we are also connected with Discover Network, VIP Cars, Odom Cars, BSP Auto, Autorentals.com. So all these platforms tap into our Magic API, and through our Magic API, they can, they can reach Jim James or Ben's or Stavros, and they can book, you know, through their, their supply, their cars using our magic connectivity platform. So, so that's how we are solving both, both sides, you know, both ends of this business. Again, my vision is to— right now we have a booking every 8 minutes on our platform. But my vision is to, you know, bring it down to every 8 seconds and then maybe every 8 microseconds.

Well, there'll be a lot of happy Stavroses out there. There'll be a lot of kebabs being eaten. Well, that's wonderful. So you've got then this dual, you know, one-to-one outreach, as you say, a lot of companies, especially in maybe more local markets don't even have a website, right? Right. And so they'll have a Facebook page, maybe, as you say, then Direct outreach. What do you have to say to those people, to a Stavros, for example, who's got a business, he's built the brand, he's been in there for 30 years, he's paid for the great location. Stavros was on the corner, in fact, at the busiest street where we were. And he says, well, thanks, Amar, but, you know, I've got enough business. I don't want to lose my brand. Are you going to take my margins away? Those would be, I could imagine, few of the objections you have to overcome?

Yeah, absolutely. So, so first thing first is, I think we all have ambitions, you know, as people. So, so Stavros has seen Hertz, Europcar, maybe on the other side of the street, he has seen those bigger brands. And he sort of looks at them, wow, you guys are also on these platforms. So there's a bit of an envy element in here, right? And obviously, Hertz will never have a chat with Stavros because it's Hertz or it's Europcar. They have their own strategy of expansion. They also own the cars and all those things, right? So when we have a chat with someone like Stavros, for example, so you will meet actually two kinds of Stavroses. Number one is the one that you mentioned, that, you know, he's saying, I have 40 cars, I'm always occupied, all done, my cars are on the road, I don't, I don't want, you know, more haste in my business, I don't want, you know, to serve 20 customers a day, I'm happy with serving 8 customers a day, and I'm, and I'm fine, and I don't have a capacity for that. I respect that, completely understand. But then you'll find a second type of startup who will say, I have 60 cars, but you know what, it can be 240 cars if it's done right, if I get more demand, which is not there at the moment. And I really don't know how to get to a Kayak or a Skyscanner or all these platforms. And that startup is a person that is very entrepreneurial, or, or, you know, he, he wants to scale, right? Scale. So, so when we are let's say filtering out all those contacts that we have or all those leads, the first discovery call that we have with these companies is to understand what is their entrepreneurial angle, right? If they don't have that, it's okay. We respect that and we shake hands. There's no problem. So that first discovery call is important to vet if they are actually a Finalrentals material or not.

Right. And you might even find, of course, that the second generation is saying, come on, Dad, you've got the first generation of the business up and running. Where do we go from here, right? Let's start with his daughter, maybe. This is great, but Dad, you know.

So one thing, so, so one thing is, I think is a blessing or maybe, uh, not sure. So, so when I was doing my MBA, right, I was doing my MBA. So, so I did it from Italy, from, from MIP Milano. And, uh, because Italy is a land of family businesses, right? Many family businesses are there. All right. So, so they also teach you how to run a family business. So, so we actually have a course in our MBA, how to run a family business. Which is unlike any other MBA, to be honest, right? So, so I've studied that, and I love family business. I'm a family person. I love family businesses. So when I'm dealing with those companies, I can tell you it is incredible. And you are so right, there are many companies who were like 28 years old, 30 years old in the business, legacy businesses, and now the daughter is running the business. Father has been taking a back seat, you know, he has retired. And those businesses are one of the most successful businesses on my platform. They make a lot of money. They do. They have incredible service. The vision is there, the young vision, you know, the young blood. And, and I think I've been able to tap into that, that entrepreneurial flair of the people. And because they look at me also as an entrepreneur— oh, this guy came from nowhere, he came from Pakistan, and today he runs a business that is spanning 303 locations, 41 countries. How on earth he did that? So they look at me and, you know, at this guy— wow, man. I can learn from him and vice versa. Of course, I think I've been able to tap into that emotional part of this business. And in the end, we all are human beings and we are emotional. I think that's where Find Rentals becomes very powerful for them. Yeah. And their relationship with me is very powerful as well.

Yes. Aman, I think as well, what you've also picked up on is that they'll recognize that if they don't find scale and inbound, those those multinational brands will eventually squeeze them out, right? So from a, you know, it's not sustainable in the end to just be independent on your own. What about the issues of brand and margin for Stavros and his daughter? Where do you take the margin from their business?

So we have very small margins. On every picked up bookings. So good news is we do not charge anything on ancillary products. So if they are selling a baby seat, GPS, eSIM card, or full insurance, half insurance, we don't really take any commission on that. We only take commission on rental days for cars on the road, and that's all, which is unlike any other program in the world. All these bigger brands, they take commission from every single thing. Right, so that is one very, very clear approach. Second thing is taxation. So our commission is applied after taxation, after taxes. Keep it very, very clean, keeping the books very clean. So I've never heard from a staffer that, hey Amar, your commission is too high, because he has had those conversations before with some platforms and he knows how much a platform is charging. So when they hear my approach, I'm like, wow, this is fantastic, absolutely non-greedy approach to business. So volume So I believe in volume than just having 10 bookings and making 30%. I would rather make 8% on 1,000 bookings. So that's my approach to business. And I think that has worked really well in almost every country.

And Amar, from a practical point of view, does an individual rent the car from Finalrentals.com or do you really make the introduction and then the contract is with the rental company?

Sure. So legally, Finalrentals is the introducer or the facilitator of this whole booking process, and we own the whole experience. Like, you will be using Finalrentals, it'll be a brand, there's a way of dealing, like how you book from Ibis Hotels, for example. You know what to expect in every country, the same hotel chain. So we manage the experience, but your contract is with the local company because because in fairness, you own the car. You are the local guy, you own the car. Because I do not own the car, there's no point that I will have a contract with the customer.

Great. I think it's important for the customer to know as well then that they're using your engine almost as a sort of a meta search engine really, isn't it then? And then we've still got a relationship with Stavros, which is part of your ethos, which is to bring business to the small person, rather the smaller operator, I should say. Rather than to exploit their weakness?

Well, customer knows it. Customer knows it. So, so when you make your booking, when you have a booking voucher, it is clearly mentioned that, that Fine Hunters is a franchisor of this booking, and this booking will be served by, let's say, Jim James Limited in Greece, as an example, right? So, so, so it is, it is very, very clear. We keep it, we keep everything transparent, whereas in my industry, transparency is, is the last thing that people apply, right? And for me, transparency is the first thing to apply.

And in terms of the assurance then for the consumer who's thinking, well, I'd like to get a car, for example, you've got Jordan Car Rentals here with FAQs. What reassurance do I have that when I get there, as opposed to Europe Car, Hertz, Avis, by and large, we're paying for peace of mind because the cars are all the same. What peace of mind do you give the consumer, Amar, that if they're booking from finalrentals.com, that the person delivering the car at the destination is going to be there, the car's clean, you know, it's got insurance? What sort of quality assurance do you provide?

So first thing is we do not work with any company that is not following our quality guidelines, right? Or they do not really tick all the boxes before even having a chat chat of any kind of partnership, right? So we have certain minimum quality standards, right? And then we have a chat and then say what exactly, you know, you can do to, let's say, elevate this whole experience. So that's number one. Number two is when you make a booking, there are multiple touch points. So exactly after you make a booking, you will receive your booking voucher, you receive all the pickup instructions, and same thing also goes to the local partner, right? And they confirm The booking is in the system, everything is ready to, you know, ready to go. So customer also has touch points and the provider also has touch points. Second, and the most important thing is if anything happens, for example, you're not able to make it to the location and you are a no-show, as an example, or you have to cancel last minute or something happened, your money will go back to your card. We will not charge a single penny from you. We don't charge any no-show fee, we don't charge any cancellation fee. Right? Because we understand that not showing up is not your hobby, right? It's not that you're doing it on purpose. Something must have happened. But we always check on video, you know, you know what happened, your flight got canceled or something happened and you can always rebook. We do not charge a single penny on any of this process.

And presumably the, the car rental operator, Stavros or whoever it is, they're aligned with the policies that you've got, which are really all about creating a better customer service experience than the multinationals who seem to be competing to offer the lowest price, but with the largest number of optional extras, which can sometimes double your rental fee.

Absolutely. Absolutely. So, so, so we have this thing, you know, it's just a comparison, right? So online world is all about, like you mentioned, if you can guarantee peace of mind, or if you have sold that peace of mind, then, you know, you are— you'll be sold out. And, and, and what do I mean by that? If you buy anything from Amazon, for example, right, and you say, I don't want it, Amazon will take it back from you, no questions asked, and your money will come back to your account, right? I ordered a few books, you know, for my kid a few months ago, and, and those books were delivered somewhere else. They were not delivered to my post box. For example, I told Amazon I didn't get them. Okay, no problem, sir. Your £40 back to your account instantly. It took 30 seconds, no questions asked. I educate all our operators to think in the same way. Your online customer will never trust you if you have, let's say, you know, hidden cost, or you take the money and you don't, you know, give the money back, right? And we don't want to owe a single penny. I don't want to see a single penny on my balance sheet that is taken off from a customer who didn't use our service. So I have this very, very clear message. It's all across the board, right? We don't want to see a single pound on my balance sheet that is not mine. Customer hasn't, you know, taken any car, but, but we'll still, still, you know, are showing that as a, I don't know, transaction. That's not how we, you know, we'll do business. And that is very clear. We tell them day one, that's how, you know, we're going to operate. And, and they understand. Some of them don't understand this. They say, no, you know, I will charge for a no-show, I will charge for cancellation. I understand we don't align We move on.

Okay, so it's very clear that if like the, the rental terms across all the operators that are on finalrentals.com would provide the same level of customer service and, and terms, or they're not on there. Because what obviously one is concerned about with some of the search engines is that an entrepreneur has gone and sort of scraped and got whoever they can find You know, and they're making money off of commissions, off of running ads. But Ammar, you're working to offset any anxiety of the consumer by this sort of quality assurance, which maybe sort of countermands the current branding that hurts Avis Europe Car. They've got the brand, which gives the brand promise. And you've got to do that in a different way, haven't you, by being aligned with with your operators.

Yeah, absolutely. And also, I will not take names here, but, you know, one of my friends, you know, he booked from a very big brand, you know, very, very big brand, and he booked from, you know, Birmingham Airport, right? So he took the car, and then what happened is he drove to London and he wanted to extend his rental for 7 more days. He was paying them for 7 more days. He called the company, press 1 for this, press 2 for this, press 3 for this, and he was, and he was in that vicious cycle of pressing buttons. Nothing happened, could not extend the rental, could not speak to a single human being on the phone, which is unfortunate in today's day and age. Went to the chatbot, chatbot was useless, right? Went to the broker from where he booked and they said go to that local company. So it was like a game of ping pong. And he called me and he said, Amar, guess what? You're doing the right thing. I said, what do you mean? He said, you make it so easy for consumers that if someone wants to extend, what they have to do? I said, if they want to extend, they have to swipe right on the app and say how many cars, how many days they want to extend to, and it's done. And he said, I've used this company and I could not believe what he was telling me. It was just unbelievable for me how it is even possible.

So you mentioned that you've got an app, Amar. So where is the app? Because on your website, I can't see a link to an app. So how does that work? Where do people get an app for finalrentals.com?

So our app is on iOS and Android stores, right? And basically what we do is we disconnect the experiences. So when you're on the web, we don't want to send you to an app because we want you to do it on the web. And when you're on the app, we don't want to send you to a web. So that's why, you know, we have, you know, two separate experiences, right? So our app is available and you will be happy to know that 19% of all our transactions that happen are happening on our app.

19.

19.

19. Okay. Out of interest, why are you separating the web and the mobile experiences?

Because these are two different customers. So, so, so what we learned from, from our different, let's say, heat maps and also the consumer behavior, there are some customers who just love doing it on the web. Okay. And then there are customers who are like, you know what, I'm only going to do it on the, on, on the app. It is also a generational thing, right? And that's why before we used to have like a top banner, download the mobile app and all those things. But we have taken those off because that was sort of a friction or add-on step for the customer, whereas we want them to book and search and book, right? So searching is the most important element for us. And we have improved our searching on location on the website as well as the app.

Very interesting. You're the first person I've heard who's now separated those two out. But also what I'm hearing from you, Amar, is that the customer customer experience and putting the personal, you know, the person back into the business transaction is a key difference for Find Rentals. And that's also going to be the case when you, when you arrive in that country and find the person who actually owns and operates the business. So you're going to get that personal experience all the way through. Now let's just move to the personal side of your experiences. We've got about 10 minutes left, and so I'd just love to hear from you, um, From a sort of a marketing perspective, you've managed to build this brand and you've raised money a couple of times now. Can you just share with us the experience? What did you have to do to raise funds for Find Rentals?

So interesting thing about raising is when you're raising your very first funding and when you're raising a second funding, these two are different worlds. Like, you just cannot compare the two experiences. They are just two different experiences. So when I was raising my first funding round, there were so many things that I didn't know about. So for example, when you are running without raising any funds, you are the master of the universe and you are doing everything, you know, on your own. You have— you can hire people, you can fire people, you can spend on something that you want to spend on, you can do many things without any approval, for example, or, or without any planning. Like, you can say you can be more instinctive, right? But when you have raised funds, you need to think on a very strategic level, month over month, quarter over quarter, right? So why do you raise funds? First thing first is, right, you should never raise funds if you don't know exactly what are you doing it for. I understand when you raise funds you become famous, you know, people write PR for you where you're like, you know, this company has raised this much money, hahaha, all that point. That's the red carpet stuff, I understand. But don't, don't raise funds for that. Please don't. If you don't know exactly where the money will be used, you know, the funding will, you know, will just be nothing, honestly speaking. And the money will, you know, will just go, and your investors will never trust you when you go back to them. So I made a plan why I raised funds, why I want to raise funds. I think when you are much older in your business, like I've spent many, many years in business, so, so I was having a very established business in Dubai, then moving to Poland, then to, you know, coming to the UK. So when I went to investors and I said, you know what, this is what I have built so far, right? And I want to raise funds because I want to reach here. I'm here now, I'm stuck. I want to reach here. And my vision is to be the next Uber or the next big car rental tech, for example. So that really helped because everything was on paper, everything was there. So it's all, all about planning, you know, having those papers, having, having your P&L, you know, you know, and see how it goes. Many founders who start raising funds, they come from a tech background and they don't have a finance background or they don't understand numbers. For them raising funds will be very, very hard. So understand your numbers, keep it simple. You don't have to, you know, you know, be a CA for that. No, understand your basic P&L, right? And how it is working for you. What are the levers where you make more money? What are the levers who are, you know, giving you losses? And then just go to the investors. In the first round, people will be very kind to you, angels, because they have been there, done that. But if you go to them completely unprepared, you will not be able to raise funds, or at least the journey will be much longer than than what I've seen. So, so be prepared, get your numbers right and get your levers right, and then, you know, start raising funds. So that was my first experience for the first round. Second round was very different because when you start raising for the second round, you know what happens is the first question is, what have you done with that money, right? So, so, so, so what happened to that money, by the way, and, and, and what did you build with that money? So, so that story is very, very important.. So like I said, these two things are very, very different.

Yeah, very, very different. MRS, isn't it? As you say, once you've raised the money, you really are working for the shareholders. You know, I raised money for an internet business back in '98. Yeah, from a cement company. Oh, wow.

Yeah.

And the CEO said, I really don't understand what you're doing, but I understand that the internet is going to be big. So we're going to trust you. To help us to, you know, get into this space. So it came with quite a lot of responsibility, actually raising the money as well, plus the expectation that they will 5, 10x their money in about 3 years, right? I mean, they're taking the risk capital. So it does come in. I sometimes think the PR is actually the investor's way of getting you on the hook. Because they make you publicly say, I've got the money, this is what I'm going to do with it. And it's like, that is the best control mechanism ever invented for an investor, right? Because otherwise you have a huge loss of face if you don't make it. But Amar Akhtar, you have already been building Find Rentals. What now, for how long has it been?

5 years.

5 years. And you've got how many locations?

303 locations in 41 countries.

So there you go. 303 locations, 41 countries. I think we need to introduce you to Stavros over there in Crete. So you get one more location. If there's a learning or a mistake that you could share in building to this 300+ companies, what would that be, Amar?

So 3 fundamental learnings, right? So the first is when you are, I would say, a migrant entrepreneur, you know, who, or or an expat, you know, who moves from you, who moves from the country that you come from, and then you go to Dubai, and then from Dubai to Poland, and then Poland to UK. I think it's very, it's a very difficult journey, you know, I must tell you, because, because there are days that you ask yourself, who am I actually? Am I a Pakistani going to be British? Am I, you know, like, what exactly, you know, is going on here? And, and then to match that also within that work culture So when you will raise your first funding round, you will be asked to hire people, and those people might be coming from different backgrounds. You know, they might be approached on LinkedIn, headhunted. They might have worked in bigger companies than, than what you are building. So managing that work culture is very, very important. I think when I raised my first funding round and when I hired those new, new fantastic people, I knew very little about building a dynamic work culture. Because before raising the funding, we were working as a family. People who were working for me, they were working on a very subsidized salary. And then when we raised funds, everything changed. And sort of, okay, I was able to manage it, change myself in a month or two. It made me a better person, by the way. But, but maybe many people could not understand, you know, what's going on, the next phase of Finalrentals. And that's where you come in as a leader, as a founder, as an entrepreneur, and you have to manage that. So if I go back, I would like to manage it in a much better way. Though I have overcome those challenges, of course, but I would manage it in a much better way. I would do it, do it as a transition, not as an abrupt overnight change. That is one thing. Second, and the most important thing, is when you are in the early stages, even, even if you have raised 2 funding rounds and you are 17 people in the company, when you are in early stages, right, it's you, the founder, that people are, people are believing on. There are many people who don't understand what is final rentals. They understand me, maybe they've met me, they're like, this guy is building something, I'm going to give him the money, right? So make sure that your shareholder reporting is on top, you know, is right, is right on the money. So have month-over-month updates, don't leave the investors alone, right? Don't go back to them after 3 months, go back to them after every month, it's fine. It can be a simple update, that's what I'm doing, that's what I'm building. That's very important, that relationship is very, very important. And that has really helped me in raising the second funding round much faster than what it was in, in, in the first funding round. Third and the most important thing is a lot of founders that I meet, they, they think that when they will raise funds, um, they will be controlled or something will happen. So if you are thinking— I think it's a mindset thing, right? So in the end, you are the founder, you own 70% of the business, you are the founder, you build this whole circus and the whole orchestra, right? You have built this whole thing. So yes, you have new people in, but you have built this thing. So don't, so don't, don't think of yourself as, oh, now I'm being controlled, or I have to do this, right? So please don't, because, because this will demotivate you in, in many different ways that you will not know, you know, about these things, right? So just, just keep your head high, right? Because in the end, people have believed in you. If you have a problem, let's say if you have a problem with something That is a person in your company, that is a person on your board, that is a person on your cap table. Have a chat with them, have a town hall with them, have a coffee with them. Solve those problems because in early days, the less friction, the better. Because when you will scale and when you will have 50 employees, 100 employees, right, the playbook will be different. This playbook will not work over there, right? So you have to understand, so make sure that you, you deal with the issues as they occur and don't leave them, you know, let's say for 2 months, 3 months, because that 1 minute of leadership will save you 3 years later.

So yeah. Amar, that's great advice. Thank you. And as you say, when you take money and when the business scales, as an entrepreneur, one has to change your style and some of the conversations that you have with the people and deciding whether those people are still the right people for the business. So it's the joy of being an entrepreneur, isn't it? That nothing stays the same. You plainly learn, have learned a lot, but you also read a lot and listen a lot. Amar, if there's a book or a podcast that you found useful and inspirational in your journey as an entrepreneur, what would that be?

So, you know, there are many books, right? So I follow the leaders, right? So I was reading this book that was about, you know, J.D. Rockefeller, right? It's called The Titan. Okay. Where, where, how he built his empire without having a WhatsApp or HubSpot or all these tools and technologies. It was fascinating, right? Big follower of Tata, the Tata family in India. I think, I think, I think they have built incredible empire. So how these guys built this incredible empire that is still today, still relevant, right? And then when you talk about contemporaries, young leaders, or maybe not so young, I've read the book of Netflix, No Rules Rules, recently. That was fascinating because the feedback culture and how the feedback culture changes the company radically as a work culture, that really helps. Last but not the least, I think we all love what Steve Jobs has done to us. So his biography by Walter Isaacson was also fascinating.

Well, I asked for one, but we've got a library there, which would be great because if we're taking a plane to go and get one of your cars, we've got books to read as well. Absolutely. Amar Akhtar, if we want to get hold of you, where can they do that?

I would like to believe I'm quite active on LinkedIn. So LinkedIn slash in slash my name, and I'll be happy to connect. I'm a very communicative person. I like to connect with people. So always happy to connect.

And that's Amar Akhtar. It's A-K-H-T-A-R. And of course, we'll put Amar's details in the show notes. And if you're going to Cardiff, book a car and drive over to see him. Ammar, thank you for joining me on the show today.

It was an honor. Thank you very much, Jim. Thank you.

Well, it's wonderful to hear another expat entrepreneur. I mean, Ammar has come from Pakistan and then gone to Poland and ended up now in Dubai and now back in Wales. I can associate that, you know, with that story because I went to Singapore and then to China and now to the UK. So there is another whole dimension to being an entrepreneur when you're not in your own culture. So credit credit to Amar for building such an amazing business and transitioning and taking such great care of plainly his family and his team and most of all his customers and those operators who he's providing a lifeline to new business. So it's a business with a cause and a business that's got plainly some core values at the heart of it, which is why it's growing so well. Finalrentals.com is the website and then you can also find the app on the iOS. If you've enjoyed this story with me, Jim James, do please review it on your player and share it with a fellow unnoticed entrepreneur. And next time you go overseas, look for Stavros. I can tell you, in Greece, he rents the best cars. Thanks for listening.