Jim Penman - Remember When Legend - 27 Apr, 2025

Andrew, growing up, I can't tell you how many times I've been stuck in traffic behind a car towing a trailer. And on the side of that trailer is this logo and the logo is Jim. And we have the pleasure of chatting now to Jim himself, Jim Penman from Jim's Mowing, Jim's Accounting, Jim's dog Washing.

Jim's brain surgery I believe is on the way. Yes.

Jim's helicopters, I don't know. But Jim Penman, the man, the brains behind the business joins us. Hello Jim.

Yeah, good to talk to you.

Thank you for making time like this Jim. Now a couple of interesting things here I have in front of me and this is from you and we provide the opportunity. But success comes down to dedication and focus. I understand that. And you say here that you have something of a millionaire factory. You've churned out more millionaires than any other franchise group in Australia, is that right Jim?

Well, I think we've turned out more millionaires than any company in the history of Australia. But let's face it, some companies get successful and they make a few of the investors rich. But we've made hundreds of people wealthy in their own business.

It's a remarkable business that you set up. Did it come to you just as an idea or did it start with something and then evolve in a way that you never imagined it going?

Well it started as a way to fund my PhD. I had a lawnmower and I needed to earn my living because I wasn't getting paid much for that. So I started mowing lawns for a living, gardening and then mowing lawns. And then when I finished my PhD and had no academic career, I decided to make it full time.

A PhD in what? Particularly Jim in history. Oh okay.

Very practical. If you really want to work with a lawn mowing contractor, start doing a PhD in history and you'll get there for sure.

That's brilliant.

I love what you say here. Anyone can get into a trade or hands on service role. You just need passion and support and I think that's what you provide, isn't it? Or you help along with the support particularly.

Yeah, we do. You've got to focus intensively on customers and you've got to be always looking to improve and change what you do think every day. How can I do it better? It's not easy to say that, but complicated to do it is it?

Does the Jim's group vet or filter the applicants who want to take out a franchise? Do you sort of investigate them reasonably thoroughly to make sure that you actually want them to be a part of your group?

Yeah, absolutely, we do. Just. Just this last week there was a guy who applied for a fencing franchise, went out on the road and was knocked back. We just didn't think. We didn't think he was going to be successful, so we said no. And that's common.

Okay.

We also do police checks too. So if somebody comes up badly on that, we can't take them, unfortunately. Which is sad sometimes, but that's the way it is.

Yeah. Now there's another franchise opportunity. Jim's police checks.

You never. Jim, how many different franchises do you have now?

Something over 40.

40.

40 different franchises.

Can you just go through some of them just in front of us? Obviously the mowing and there's the fencing and I know there's also accounting, isn't there?

Bookkeeping, it test and tag. Dog wash, window cleaning, carpet cleaning, blind cleaning, blinds, energy, which is to do with solar panels. It's difficult to name them all, actually.

Yeah.

Plumbing, garage doors, removals. New one. Great, great. New division been removals, just started up.

Removals, yes, of course. That's.

My daughter actually is doing that. She's wonderful. She's like 22 years old and it's gonna be a real entrepreneur one day like her dad.

So she's just getting into it now, is she? That's.

Yeah. It's been going about six months, but they're doing well.

Wonderful. I also got a press release the other day for Jim's remedial massage.

Yes, yes. Also Jim's health care. Jim's life coaching. That's a new one.

Wow.

We've got about three or four we're looking at the moment. We're just talking to the people who are potential divisionals. Jim's driving school just started. Jim's laundry.

Well, given the state of politics in this day and age, would there be Jim's political party that we could all vote in?

Well, actually, to be. So I am seriously looking at having a run for the Victorian State Parliament the next election because I'm really concerned about the cost of housing. Yes, Excessive. Excessive regulation is forcing up the price of housing and forcing up rental costs and that's hurting a lot of ordinary people and there's a lot of movement around here to do something about that. So people can afford their. Takes about 7 years average income to get a house in a major city. Used to be like two or three.

That's right, yes. It's. It's certainly as soured since I was a young guy getting into it. Was always expensive, but it's just become ludicrous now you. I have a former reptile breeder, a guy named Gerald Schliebus, I hope that's correct, who now runs a multi million dollar franchise that started through you, is that correct?

I'm not sure who that would be, I'm afraid. A lot of people get their start through us. A gym's franchise can be the first station business where you get support and leads and so forth and they go on to other things.

That's interesting, really quite interesting. Also, I don't know how, but it's quoted here in this piece I have in front of me that service roles, even with mowing, you can earn big, big incomes with the right amount of passion and support. How do you just mowing lawns earn huge incomes, employ other people? Oh, you sort of.

In the millions. Yeah, they just have. Because the point of it is things like mowing and cleaning and so forth, you have regular clients. So if you put on workers, you train them, you supervise them, we're very keper. But there's no, there's no limit to the number of workers you can have in a gymnast franchise. And we've got a lot of work because we knock back about a quarter million leads in the last year. So somebody's ambitious and they want to grow their business, we show them how, we'll give them work, we'll support them for it.

Because you do. With a franchise, you get an area that you're allowed to operate within, don't you? So you don't have like six gyms mowing people in the one area all, you know, fighting each other for the same business.

Ours is a bit different. We have a territory where you get exclusive right of first refusal. Lee comes in, you want it, you get it. But you can ask for work anywhere and you can find work by referrals anywhere. So you're not restricted. It's actually restriction is on us as franchisors, not on the franchisee. They can work wherever they like, they can grow their business as big as they like.

Ah, so if I'm just Joe Bloggs and I live in Baldwin, for example, but if the Jim's guy who does my mum's lawn in Lilydale is particularly good and mum says, oh, you should get this guy to do your lawns, I can book him even though he's not strictly speaking in my area.

Yeah, that's right, Yeah. A lot of the growth, they get it through referrals. Somebody has a great job and so can I Get you. Get you to come and do mine as well or my friend would like. Same job that tends to work.

Yeah. Jim, as far as you know, are you unique in the world of franchising? Because I don't know of anyone else who franchises. I know lots of franchises, of course, McDonald's and KFC to start with. But I don't know who franchises in so many different branches of work. Is there, are there other people out there like that in Australia?

I don't know of anything in the world. Yeah, I've never, I've never heard of anybody who does so many different brands. We are very. We don't do site based franchises. We don't do fast food. We don't do things where you've got to have a place. We're all service. But service franchises are very similar. Dog wash, mowing, cleaning, pest control, hazardous waste, building inspections. They're all services where you go out to somebody and give a service. And they're very similar in the way that they operate.

With something like building inspector. Being a building inspector under your umbrella, you'd have to have some background before you'd accept in building inspection before you'd accept me, wouldn't you, Jim?

Yes. Yeah, they're mostly ex builders and so forth and the same. Look, there's divisions like plumbing, electrical, it, bookkeeping. When you do need a background in that industry, most of them we actually teach from scratch. Most than we can show a person how to do it.

So franchisees aside, how many people actually work for you, Jim, in sort of the head office overseeing this massive business structure?

About 100.

Good. Yes. Quite an administrative staff. You wouldn't need it. Jim, just on a personal note, feel free to say you don't want to answer if you want. You still live. I was told once you lived in a sort of a fairly large area in Bayswater, is that right?

Our office is in Moorbach, actually used to be in Bayswater, but that was removed 22 years ago.

My information is a little over. Out of date.

It's just a touch out of date.

Yeah, we outgrew that one actually. It got bigger too fast. We just couldn't fit in anymore.

That's amazing. Do you ever. I must get out there one day and see. Have you got a caricature of yourself on the building at all?

I don't know. You're very welcome to drop in. I'd love to see you.

Which, which road are you in in Morralbach?

Edinburgh Road.

Okay. Yes. I'm a Churnside park boy, so Moral bar was a large part of my life myself, so I'll have to get out and have a look as well. I used to joke, I used to always laugh at the fact that, that the Jim's mowing, you know, logo, that, that face on the side of all the vans and things in better joke that he. That you've stole the. That you stole the picture from Don Burke. Of course his, his fallen from Grace. But I, I say that in a roundabout way to ask. Do you actually look like the Jim on the side of Jim's franchises?

Well, actually I wish I'm a little bit older than that. It's about 30 years old, that picture so.

And leave it then. It's a. Leave it where it is.

No beard.

No beard.

I was, I was getting. I was, I was. Bed was going grey and I was single and I thought I don't need to look any older at my age, which is late 40s. So I found my love of my life. Actually, we're just having our 24 year anniversary today.

Oh, lovely. Congratulations. How many children do you have, Jim?

Overall, 10.

But how well is it going, may I ask, if. 10. We'll circle back to that in a sec. But how good is it going if tonight's your anniversary and you're chatting to us?

That's not.

She wouldn't be happy about that.

Absolutely wonderful. We're actually in bed playing Chinese checkers. Is that right?

What a lovely insight.

Very romantic occasion.

Well, you've had 10 romantic occasions at least. What's the age range of your children, Jim?

40 down to 15.

That's marvellous. How many are involved in Jim's franchises?

We've only got one of my. One of my daughters. The building inspections. She's doing it. Sorry, not bird inspections, they're removal.

Removals.

That's right. You're saying earlier. I'm a bit surprised, to be honest.

Well, like all the different things, I've got lawyer and I've got computer programmers and I've got a psychiatrist and I've got all kinds of kids doing different things. Neuroscientists, they're all brain boxes, Simon. Yeah, I've got great kids.

Well, the good thing about having 10 kids, obviously you do actually get away and get a bit of relaxation time when you're not flat out busy running the business.

I love my kids. I love seeing them actually. It's been wonderful.

Did you all get sort of get together for Easter? Are they all still local?

Yes, I've seen most of my kids at Easter. It's Great. The kids are the gift that keep on giving.

They are.

I love. I love my kids, whatever age they may be.

Any.

Any grandkids then?

Yes, I have got. Hang on a bit. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and one more on the way. Due next month. It's going to be six.

It's going to get you very shortly, Jim. Going to get to the point where if someone asks you their names you're going to panic and start trying to remember them all.

Yes, well, I'm remembering their birthdays but luckily my phone has got a good reminder system for that.

Yes. God bless mobile phones. Jim, passion to start up yet another franchise. Anything on the horizon?

Ah, Jim's Towing, the one about Breakdown. We're looking at that one. What else are we doing? I don't know. There's quite a few actually but they're in sort of different stages. We talked to somebody, somebody's interested in doing like out a business that outsources work to the Philippines. This kind of thing. That's a different one.

Good heavens.

There's rumors that the nine Network who own our radio station are looking at offloading our radio network. Have you ever considered Jim's Broadcasting?

No.

One thing I've learned, if you stick to what you know, I'm really good at what I know when I go into things I don't really understand so well, it's a lot, lot more difficult than you think.

No, that's, that's fair enough.

Can I be a little bit controversial and ask you, have you had some lesser successes, shall we say in franchising that haven't really gone how you expected?

Oh yes, yeah, we've had, we've had a few. Jim's Beauty was a big embarrassment. I can tell you what. They got big splash and interest in it and it just. We just couldn't find the good local work that we had to actually in the end we hadn't sold any franchises. We gave their money back and left it that a few.

What would have been what was involved in Jim's Beauty? Was it like makeup products and things?

Yeah, makeup and stuff, yeah.

Because. Because with no disrespect but your logo doesn't sort of clash with Maybelline and Revlon.

I think so, yeah. I think, I think we can get friend. Yeah, I don't know. The work just didn't come. We need to be able to. We have a pay for work guarantee where people can do free services so we can't put a person on if we got a reasonable amount of work because Otherwise we have to pay for themselves.

One area I thought you would get involved with and I remember having this conversation with my wife four or five years ago was I thought you'd be in food delivery. No, I thought you'd have a go at Uber and those sort of, those giants.

I would love to do something like Uber but the software is very, very complicated. Really, really difficult. We spend several million dollars a year on software development as it is. That kind of area is huge. I'd love to do it. I think they're complete rip offs the way these big companies, the percentage they take. Yeah, our typical franchisee takes. We pay about 6% of turnover. These guys take like 40%. It's huge.

That is, yeah, it's an awful thing for the small businesses that need it to survive but also barely survive because of it. It is an awful model that they.

Take a rubbish amount of money. It's really, really wrong. There's got to be a better way to do it. I reckon you should be able to do it 6% but I need the right software, which we don't have.

Well, with Jim's parliament we'll be able to rectify that.

Hey Jim, you'll get my vote. I'll tell you if you want to stand for Victor, I'm sticking my hand up straight away.

Yes, well that'd be great. I think housing is the one thing they get so passionate about. It impoverishes so many people. Young people cannot afford to buy houses. When they do, they're stuck with a stupid rent. They turn to mortgage, they turn to rent and there's 40 people vying for one property. It's just, it's outrageous and it's simply bad government. It's governments restricting and restricting and restricting zoning to force up the price of housing. Who benefits from that? A few rich people, not too many others.

Exactly right.

Well said.

Yeah, completely agree Jim. Time is getting away from us. We have to wind up shortly. But I will, I just want to, to throw in at the end. I love your sense of humour that you've clearly gotten. You've demonstrated tonight on a few occasions there. But on April 1st I got a press release for Jim's smokers insurance or something along those lines.

Yeah, life insurance for smokers. Basically we offer extremely generous rates because smokers aren't likely to live that long. In actual fact I'm the worst nag at all my stiffer smoking and I come out, I'm wandering about these, hiding behind their backs because I have to go with him about it. I really think it's a terrible habit. I really wanted to make a point.

Yes.

Well, the press release was beautifully done. And I'm reading it with disbelief, thinking, what? This is quite a bizarre thing. And then I realized the date and realized it was an April Fool's gag. But Jim's life insurance for smokers I thought was brilliant.

Oh, it's been a great pleasure talking to you, Jim, and we look forward to further conversations. You really are. You're in our legend section here on Remember When. That's where you're being played. And you deserve that title. So all the best to you and more power to you.

Thank you. We love three. Aw. Anytime.

That's Jim Penman from the Jims group.