Chris Ross - The Mental Game Of Selling

So if you're really struggling out there in sales and if you want to experience.

What it feels like to have zero buyer remorse, ask the what, when, why, how questions, diagnostic questions, open ended questions. Understand what they're really going through. When. I usually ask questions with people and it doesn't really matter what capacity, what they do for a living. I'm not really listening for what they're saying to me. I'm listening for what they're not saying to me.

This is an intro. Intro, intro, intro.

Hustle and Floatshark with your boy, my.

Boy, Matt Wolf and Joe Fear.

Hey, what's up? Hustlers or Flowcharters?

Yeah. Which camp do you fall in? We should do a poll. We've never done that.

Well, I feel like we don't have a name for our listeners. Like, you know how like the people who listen to John Lee Dumas are fire Nation.

That's right.

What does Rogan call his people? Joe Rogan, he bitches.

Yeah, I think he just says like what's up, sexy bitches or something like that.

Yeah, I thought he had some other thing, but yeah, we're not going to call you guys that. Don't worry. I don't know what name. Hey, so write into us like clickfunnels.

They're all funnel hackers.

Funnel hackers. Give us a shout. Give us a shout. Throw us an email out there@infoevergreenprofits.com.

I don't like Hustlers though, because it's not really what we stand for.

No, nor are we just flowcharters. We're this weird hybrid and I feel like, like people kind of should be. But send us an email, give us some ideas. Go to our Facebook group.

Name yourselves. Name yourselves.

Flowchart group.com. this is where I'm going to throw out all the. No, like, join the. Tell us what. Tell us some ideas, man. Maybe we should do a poll in our group, actually. Yeah, we can do a poll. There we go. Let's do that.

Yeah, we'll do a poll in our group. So if you're listening to this, look for the poll in our group. Maybe we'll link it in the show notes. Yeah, if we remember by the time.

This comes out, maybe sue will help us. Reminders.

Yeah, that's a good idea.

Cool. Flowchartgroup.com, go get in that group. It's free. There you go.

All right.

Pitching over. Pitching free stuff. Yeah, not over, not over.

We got a lot more free stuff to tell you about, actually.

Hey, man, this is us. We just like to give you cool shit and we're not gonna stop. So if you can complain about. We're actually just right prior to recording. This is a little. We've noticed some people under the kimono.

Yeah, under up the kimono. Lying on the floor, looking up the.

Kimono.

And it's like, you know, like a kilt. He's like, don't do.

Yeah, not a good idea.

Don't look up. Keep that thing on. But, yeah, no, we were just. I think we've shouted this out the last time we got a complaint, actually. It's so funny. We get these support emails occasionally that it baffles us how many people will complain about a free thing that they were expecting but they didn't get. So, prime example are these companion notes we have for every podcast. We always take notes and we say, hey, within two weeks of this going live, you'll be able to get the notes for free. After that, they go away. So there's actually four episodes of Notes that are freaking free. Each one's, like four to five pages free. And that's like Cliff Notes of a deep dive, which is typically a master class. Like, in this one, we're talking to Chris Ross, and I was going to say Voss.

That'll come up on the show.

Yeah, that's an open loop later. But Chris Ross, this is going to be a masterclass right now of sales and how you and everyone around you can do sales, even if you don't think so. And the notes that are free are literally like gold. I mean, that is like a product you would pay for 100 bucks, thousand bucks, whatever it's worth to you. Doesn't matter. It's all worth different things to other people. But, like, then people bitch.

Well, there's definitely a money value on it because we're paying people to make.

These things for you, tons of value.

And we're giving them away for free.

So point of the matter. It's just funny how, like, there's a lot of folks that will. They approach it in the incorrect way. We'll say. And they come off, like, hostile when they're looking for something free. Maybe they were a little late, which was the case in these scenarios, is like, they didn't get the notes in time. And they're like, this isn't what I was. I was like, whoa, hold on. I'll give you those. Let's be nice. Let's think about, like, this is a free service we're offering, and it's just and you know, there's a lot of other free services that are offered. Be a good human. Yeah.

Here's a little secret, and I don't know if I should say this publicly, but be a good human. I've already opened the loop. If somebody was to email our support and say, oh, I just listened to that episode, but the notes aren't available anymore, chances are we'll be cool and just send you the notes. I mean, just don't do it for like, every fricking episode. But if there's, like, one that you really want the notes for and you're to email support, we'd probably hook you up.

I'm pretty 99% sure. Yeah. So that's all. That's endrant.

Yeah.

Hashtag endrent. So, like you said, we're talking to Chris Ross today with an R. R.

O, S, S. Yes.

So we're talking to Chris Ross, and the way I would describe this one is almost the mental game of sales, because he really went into, like, what the mindset you have to be in to be good at this is and how you need to approach it. We even talk about his daily routine. So, like, this is like he gets up at 5am every morning, and these are the process he goes through to get set up for the day. We talked about how you handle objections. And more of it is. It's less about, like, what scripts and exactly what to say and more of, like, what your brain needs to be. How your brain needs to be working. Going into the conversation, I'd say, yeah, yeah.

And it's, you know, so a little, little step back. You know, Chris and I, we've had tons of chats and I got a shout out to. To Travis Cody, his copywriter. The guy couldn't remember. I'm sorry, Travis. I know you. Listen, man, and you're so cool. You know, I know you. I'm just like, oh, man, I just blank out this, you know, with the connections thing that's always like, dude, I.

Don'T know how I met this guy.

But yeah. So Chris, him and I. His Win Win Effect podcast is Chris Ross's podcast. Big shout out. If you love this episode, go listen to his podcast. I got to do him a favor and do that. He did us a favor spending over an hour with us. You will learn basically, like, sales at a level that I've never heard before. And, like, it's perfect for anyone. And it's not like we're going to grind the sales machine down your throat and blah, blah, like, no Like, Chris is cool. Cool as shit. And. And that's how you should be when you're just with people. And, like, I think there's like a genuine. Like, there's a. There's a value add that he wants to do better in the world. He wants to help people. That's what we aim to do as well. And, like, if you actually care about other people, then, like, that's. You're selling, you know, but you're, like, listening, you're giving, and you're connecting, and you're problem solving all this cool stuff. So, yeah, nobod.

It's good stuff. And, like, he really breaks it down. You'll have some aha's and some mind shifts around selling. We do have notes. We just got done talking about notes.

Let's just give it the shout out what it is.

Yeah.

So you can go get the notes for free. But listen closely. You gotta go get them within two weeks of this episode going live, or they get archived. So go.

Felt like I was reprimanded.

Yes.

Listen closely.

You are. Steve. I know you're listening, Steve. Dale, go get the.

You're listening, but you're good.

You follow direction. You're good. You're good. Plus, I think he's a member of.

Our community, so genuinely is. Yeah.

So he's getting all the notes and.

Backlogs and all that kind of stuff.

But hustleandflowchart.com comp, go get them notes there. They're free for two weeks. Other than that, they're locked in our vault, and you can get those for like, 15 bucks a month. So hustleandflowchart.com comp is where you can go get those. Also, this isn't a sponsor.

Nope.

But it's a cool tool that we've been playing around with.

It's super cool. All right, so this thing is called Groove Pages, and it's by our buddy Mike Phil. Same. We've actually had him on the podcast, so you might have heard the episode that came live. And we did video and all that, did a whole big old demo of this thing.

Cool.

Thing with Groove Pages is like, it's free. Yes. That's the coolest thing, actually. But the second thing is this is probably, like, the second most asked question to us of our community and listeners. Page builder. Yeah. Well, first thing is like, hey, what's that? Shopping cart? Because they, you know, we talk a lot about conversions and so. ThriveCart.

Thrive Cart's the shopping cart, Obvi.

I guess the other one is like, what's lead capture. Convert box.

Convert box.

But it's like, what's your, what page builder do you recommend?

And we've never really hung our hat on just one page builder.

No. And we, we still don't. So I mean, here's the interesting thing and the really cool thing with Groove and what Mike Phil Same is doing is that he's making it a no brainer for every single person, including us, even though, you know, because we're constantly on the hunt. Like, what is not only what is the best page builder, what is the easiest low friction way to get a page up and selling? Yeah. And you'll hear like Chris even kind of come at me a little bit. Not in like a bad way, but he was like, you know, like basically saying like, I got like some perfectionist tendencies in me. And it's absolutely true. And he said 75% good enough, get it out there. And like if you're just looking for any kind of tool, I think that's a good thing to get it out. But GroovePages, like, if you're just like stuck in, you just don't have a good tool or you're looking for something new. Like this thing's free.

Yeah. I mean, even if you've got one, even if you've got clickfunnels or leadpages or one of the other ones, I mean they're all good, right? That's why we've never really hung our hat on one, is because we actually kind of like them all. But if, if you don't have one already, just go get Groove Pages. It's free. We've got a link over at hustle and flowchart.com groove. We will get credit if you buy something later down the road. But it's free right now. Right. But even if you have like a clickfunnels or Lead pages, go get this too and just see if you like it better. Maybe, maybe you could cut one of those costs if you prefer this one.

Well, that's the big thing right there. Yeah. That's what we're getting to is like you can, this is a perfect opportunity to cut some costs. If you've been just like sitting on the sideline and stuck trying to maybe hire people to help you out or hack it together in WordPress. Get Groove Pages. You will thank yourself and maybe us later, but either way you will get in there. There's not even a credit card required. That's what's kind of crazy. And here's the genuine thing, it's actually A really interesting case study of lead generation, but then how to do affiliate management and promotions and all that. Because Mike Filsaim is one of the best out there. And you'll literally see, like, how he does this. So I would. I would use it as a case, a learning lesson as well. Yeah, and you'll get groove pages for free.

So hustle intro. Hustleandflowchart.com Groove. All right, hustlers. All right, flowcharters, let's go talk to Chris Ross.

Chris, we are recording. How you doing, my friend?

Man, I'm always good. You know, me, N's and Y, my friends. What's going on?

Love it. Man, I wish you were wearing a, you know, for video. We're staring at each other. You're out in London right now. It's a little past six, and I always think, like, it's like going to be like nighttime always in London. Like, it's still light there. You're like, bro, it's just like, oh, yeah. But then the other.

I like to say that I'm five hours ahead of everyone in the state. So at least. And you know, I know that you guys are in west coast, so eight hours, but yes, little past six o' clock in the evening. It doesn't usually get dark until around, like, right at 9 o', clock, so. But then again, I still work us hours because obviously my businesses are in the states, so it doesn't matter to me what time it is. If it's dark, light out, raining, I'm taking calls, man.

Chris is on it. You're also growing that epic beard, too. That was the other day.

I was gonna say, I'm getting it down. I'm growing it out. Growing it out. What it is. I'm compensating for the lack of hair.

On top of my head. The up top.

That's right. That's right. But it's not all the way gray yet, so we're good.

Oh, you're fine.

But I do appreciate you having me on the show. Really honored. I really do appreciate it.

Thanks, brother. You and I have chatted numerous times. I don't know, four or five times or something like that. And we've chatted about your podcast, this show getting you on here. But then just. Just the really cool sales stuff you're doing, people you're working with, people you're partnering with, companies you're, you know, working for.

How did you two get connected? I'm always fascinated because Joe seems to know everyone, and so I'm always kind of curious of the origin story of how Joe knows everything.

I believe it was my copywriter.

I think you're right. Oh, it was. Oh, my God.

Yes, Omar.

No, not Omar. Dear God.

Let's see how good his memory is.

I'm blinking on that. Come on, man. I haven't had enough.

Travis Cody.

Travis Cody? Yeah. He's out of Vegas. He always harasses me. He wants everyone to move to Vegas with him. Travis is not going to do that.

If I had to move to Vegas, I think I would die. I've been in sales too long. I've been in every sales convention, especially in a trade school type of education field, you know, in that type of world. And. Excuse the voice and I normally, for the listeners, I don't normally sound like this. I had a steroid shot in my throat because I had some allergies and hay fever and whatnot. So if you're listening to this and you go to listen to something else of mine, like, that's not him, I promise.

We hired an impersonator.

I got video footage.

So the main thing with the trade schools, you're not allowed to make commissions, you know, like making something off the sale or enrollments, they call it. So what they do is, as a. I guess you would say, an incentive. If you're top of your game and whatever type of capacity, whatever your field is in admissions, they'll send you to Vegas. So I've been to Vegas more times than I can count. So people go, let's go to Vegas. I'm like, no, I'm good.

Yeah, I know.

I've been there. Seen that, got the T shirt and sold it.

You know, like, I like my sleep and I like, just calm.

Every time.

I've been to Vegas, it's about three days, and I'm like, all right, I'm kind of over it now.

Yeah, it's a two day town.

Yeah, two days.

Even better. Yeah, three days already burnt.

You gotta go, you gotta go.

All right, Travis, we love you, man, but. And sorry, I can't remember.

Yeah, so that's how. That's how we got hooked up here. And I think. I think it was just chatting about podcasts, and then we started riffing. I mean, you're just fun to talk. Talk with. And, you know, it just seems like a. I know that's going to lead to a really cool cop podcast here.

I appreciate it. Yeah. Because it, you know, our conversations were. It went from just, you know, picking each other's brain and figuring out how we can both serve Each other and your audiences or whatever. And then it went from that to personal to digging in. And that's normal when you have conversations and you really care about the other person, because you know how it is. I mean, you probably have tons of guests, and I love your show, by the way.

Thank you.

And you have tons of guests that come on, and all you want to do is. Of course, you would have served the audience, but they. All you want to do is talk about themselves and say, hey, how's it going? But not really listen for the response. So we can get more into that on why it's important in business.

Yeah. Oh, we will. I know. Because that's a big piece of what you do, man.

Right.

Let's go back. I mean, there's. I know there's a lot of stuff. South Carolina is where you're from originally, right?

Yes, born and raised. Charleston, South Carolina. Beautiful place.

Yeah, it is. I love that. I love Charleston. I have a lot of family, you know, down in Beaufort. But you made a move out to London town. How long ago was that? How long has that been?

That's. I think I'm going on four years now, being in London, which is a different dynamic for me because I feel like London, and I don't. For the people that are from England. Don't get offended when I say this. It's just that you guys watch different sports than I do.

I really don't deal with the cricket and the snooker and soccer. I know that soccer is like a thing you don't say here, but it's soccer to me. But I have ESPN problems because of the rights and what. So I have to stream it. But other than that, other than the rain, sporadic weather, getting four seasons in an hour, I'm good to go. Different place. Yeah, definitely.

Well, take us back, man. I mean, a little bit, because I don't think I've ever really dug into your history back.

I'm here, man. I'm at your service.

Let's do it, man.

You need to.

Well, what got you? What? It's been like 15 years or so since you've been in the kind of the sales realm, doing the business stuff there. Right, right.

Well, I joined the military at 17 years old, right out of high school. My sister passed away. My older sister passed away at 15. She was born handicapped. Mentally retarded, they call it, obviously, back then. That's what they called it.

Sure.

And that's the reason why I'm telling you that, because we'll dive into. That's one of My competitive advantages. But when I left and went to the military, it was kind of like when. In the 80s, when you come up and you graduate high school, you go find a job, go into the military or go to college. I wasn't really digging the college thing, so I went into the military because my family couldn't really afford to send me to college. My dad looked at me and was like, either it's you or your sister, younger sister, Megan. And I was like, well, I guess that's, you know, her. So I gotta go. So I look at it as a sacrifice I enjoyed. It's probably the best decision I've ever made in my life.

Which. Which branch were you in?

I was in United States Navy. So I get out as a E5 Osamate. So I drove, like, small boats, original inflatable boats. Did that for about five years. Got out the military, of course I. Now I have college money. Wanted to kind of go into that type of, you know, opportunity for myself and. Which was a different type of feel, though, you know, when you go and you're a little bit older, you know, a little bit more.

Completely different, man.

Yeah. You're like, I'm not really digging the whole parties. I did that when I was in.

The Navy, so probably way better than any college party.

Yeah. Got in, got out, got recruited right out of college and went to. Right into chemical sales. So I've always been in sales. Even when I was a kid, like, going into, I think about 14 years old, we moved from one area and went to. Moved into a cul de sac, like, type of suburban type of stuff. And I started my own lawn care business when I was 14. I took over the area cutting grass. So I've always been kind of the person that you don't have to tell me to do things. I just move.

You were knocking on doors. You were hustling from 14.

I was hustling, yeah. I was like, do you want to wash your car? Do you want me to cut your grass? What would you like me to do? Because they're older people, they don't really physically not able to, you know, do those things.

So I want to hear Matt, like. Because he lives in a cul de sac. I'm like, okay, you're in a suburban area. Like, do you get kids knocking on your door? Because I don't hear about this happening anymore.

No, no.

But most of my neighborhood's actually elderly. It should be me knocking on my neighbor's doors.

Actually, like your kids or their kids.

I mean, you have to look at it. I mean, I wanted to wear nicer things. Like even you're in high school, you know, it was a big thing. Right. So didn't really come from a lot of money just because of, you know, the situation with my sister. And my dad had to, you know, work two to three jobs his whole life to kind of, you know, provide. And I've watched, you know, but then again, with all the things that we lacked, I didn't know that we were, you know, not in a good financial situation. Because I was, you know, I was raised by good people. And they, you know, give me everything I needed.

Love.

And all the different little missing hidden tools and golden nuggets of growing up in a crazy work ethic. So to kind of give you a little bit more. So I went into my career in sales. You know how they give you a script and say, here's your script. You sell this. And I'm like, I don't want to do that.

It didn't work for me because sales is all about adopting the right approach. It works for you and give you a little bit more about myself. I was. I can't. I couldn't read that well off a script because I was dyslexic. Never knew what was really wrong. Just all the words kind of go together. That was one of the major reasons. So I'm the kind of person where I had to, like, memorize the script and make it my own. And then I was able to execute. So was in chemical sales for a long time. 2008 happened. Went in. That obviously didn't really work out well for me. I did very well. I was able. I learned some valuable traits while I was in the military by some great leaders. And you don't really need a position to be a leader. You can become a leader even if you're a bottom. Like, I guess you would say a salesperson.

Sure.

You know, being a rep. So I went from just me being a rep to a team lead to a director to a regional director, admissions for, you know, those types of fields, and taking over a whole region and within about two to three years. So when that happened and everything shifted over, I went to education. And that was probably the best. I don't know. It's the probably. You know, how like you had. Is right now with this course, with this pandemic going on, there's like little hidden pivotal points in your career where it can really shift you.

Yeah.

And shift your whole career into a different way. Have you ever thought about it?

So being A leader for you was kind of that. That thing that. I mean, it sounds like you had that from 14. I mean, if you're already out there charging the neighborhood with, you know, banging on doors, you're leading yourself. Of course.

Of course. And I think that's where it kind of goes with everything that. I do believe in sales. I believe every person's a salesperson. Every person. And I meet a lot of entrepreneurs now, you know, and I still do what I do just at a different capacity. I'm working with companies and corporations and people that, you know, make pretty big deals. But the ones that.

Understand that if you develop enough emotional intelligence, enough understanding of what people say to you and what they don't say to you, you can make a huge impact, especially even on a team. Say, for instance, hypothetically speaking, Matt, you and I are in the same team and Joe will be on a different team. But if we have a really good connection and you don't really need to tell me what you're feeling and what you're doing, what do you. What do you think is going to happen within our team?

I think we're going to outsell Joe's team.

Right. Because I really don't need to explain things to you. It's a synergy. It's an understanding.

It's an innate kind of bond. Relationship.

Exactly. Yeah. Because people don't ever. I don't think that they don't spend enough time on actually knowing what a person is feeling. You know, people don't really have to understand, like, what I feel. I'm not. Not trying to get into the emotional side, but what I try to do is understand at least having the. Enough empathy and understand what they're going through, and then I can make the proper adjustments from there.

Yeah. And that goes back to. I know you said something. It's. It's the listening, you know, it's the whole. You know, if you're. I feel like if you're just on a script, you are waiting for your opportunity to jump to that bullet point that you need.

Double Dutch. Yeah. It's like playing, like, jump rope. Double Dutch. Yeah. From the south. I would see the kids with the jump ropes and they're horrible at it.

I would always fall.

There's actually a video when I was a kid trying to jump rope that was not. That didn't go well, so. But I. They're only listening for enough to be able to interject their product or service are good and not asking the what, when, why, how question. So if you're really struggling out there in sales. And if you want to experience.

What it feels like to have zero buyer remorse, ask the what, when, why, how questions, diagnostic questions, open ended questions. Understand what they're really going through. When I usually ask questions with people and it doesn't really matter what capacity, what they do for a living. I'm not really listening for what they're saying to me. I'm listening for what they're not saying to me.

And you get that by those diagnostic questions. It's not a yes and no question. That's what's nice. Because. Yeah, it's. And I learned that from who? Is it a Chris Voss? Christopher Voss, you know?

Yes.

Never.

I love his stuff. And I didn't know who he was until.

Probably like seven or eight months ago. No joke.

Wow.

Just because his name's very similar to mine.

Oh yeah. Very similar.

Chris Ross. So there's only one letter. Right. So I didn't know who he was. And I was. I think I was watching something. You ever seen that Master class?

Mm. Oh, yeah, I've seen. I've seen his.

Yeah, I haven't seen his whole thing. I just saw the advertisement. It said Chris Voss. I guess someone. You know how like someone just attacked I guess you at you or whatever it was. And they did. I guess they typed their name wrong and typed my name on social media. And it says Chris Ross. And I'm like, that's not me. Who's this guy? I was like, FBI. Yeah, that definitely is not me.

Coming after you're listening to this Chris. Love your stuff, man. Love your stuff.

Yeah, he was, we had the pleasure to have him on the show here too. And before that. Yeah, we. I read his book and that was the. That was my big takeaway was we're asking questions that they can't answer a yes or a no too. But it opens them up and, you know, for negotiation. Of course, you now have the power because they're just feeding you answers, you know, or your next moves. If you're listening, of course.

Right. You gotta listen. I've been like this since I was a very young salesperson. There's always been a notepad on my desk. When someone's talking, I'm writing down.

Like, video. Doesn't really work well for me when I'm on like a discovery type of call.

I was gonna ask about that, actually. Yeah, the visual.

I like to turn the camera off and be voice to voice because now I'm gonna use my sentences and I want them to hear me.

Yeah.

I teach a lot of this with younger salespeople or maybe some salespeople. They've been in the game for 20 years and they think that they need to sell on video. Yeah. Doing group calls, trainings, those types of meetings, definitely video. They need to see you as a real person. But when you're in. I guess you would say when you're in the zone and you're in sync with someone, that's only going to happen when you're using your senses and using your brain. So when I try to. Like when cold calling, make an example, make it easy for listeners. Think about a cold call. You have to call someone out the blue. Don't know nothing about them other than her name, email, phone number. Love that stuff. When I call, I want to get their attention. That's the first obviously objective you have, right? You got to get their attention. Like, hey, Joe, what's going on today, man? I'm gonna pretend like I know you because you're another human being. You're not special. Yeah, I'm not special.

Like, hi, I'm Chris from.

Yeah, I'm like, Joe, the purpose for my meeting today or purpose for my call is blah, blah, blah, blah. And then I'm dive into where. Where are you at in the world? I'm closing my eyes and I want to use my sense. I'm gonna hear what's happening in your background. Is there a car passing? Loud noise? Is it a kid? Is. Does it sound like you're eating at a bowl? You're eating ice cream? Like, I had. No joke, no bullshit. One time I had someone, it sounded like he was taking a bath and I actually called him out. I was, are you taking a bath?

No, I'm taking a shit.

Are you taking a bath? You take a bubble bath? How old are you? You know.

That'S how much you want to be. You know, use your brain and use your senses and. Yeah, I think you can get my point.

Well, it's a very empathetic way of, you know, you're literally putting yourself, hopefully not in the bath with them, but you know, like in the.

Life looks like.

Yeah.

What does your life look like? Walk me through.

Everyday life for you. So if they requested information, can Mr. Or Mrs. Prospect, can you do me a favor? And I would like for you to put yourself back in the same emotion when you took action on this program or took request this information. What was going on in your world at that time?

I put myself back in that emotion because now I need to figure out what actually.

Made Them want to take action. Like now I'm putting myself in that emotion with them. Do you see how that can be powerful?

Yeah. What you're doing, it seems like, is you're bringing them back to this anchor point that might have started this journey that they're looking for solutions to. And here you are bringing them back, understanding, but you're also like rewinding the clock in their brains. And then here's Chris along for the whole journey there. And then he's going to set you up for the right next path.

Right. So a lot of times when I discover things, I don't really bring it up with them at that time because I don't feel that it's best to bring it up at that time. It could be later in the process. Like Joe, I really do appreciate you sharing that information with me. And it does give me a little bit more insight on, you know, what brought you here. Here's what I'd like to do at this time. I frame everything.

Salespeople, they. You can't do that on a script.

Right.

If you're reading a script and you get to the next question, frame that, I want you to understand that this caused zero judgment, zero issues. I can give a shit. Can I curse? I'm sorry, that's a bad thing. I can give a shit what's happened to your life prior before me.

Good, bad, ugly. I'm still going to be able to deal with it with you if you allow me and give me the opportunity to help you. There's people that I've helped and served over the years has given me enough skills and enough understanding on how I can deal with whatever happened. There's nothing that you're going to share with me that perhaps I haven't heard before. And if you do share something with me that I haven't heard, will bring it up and you'll. Your name is going to be that. Objection.

That's right.

Because it's. I want now what I'm trying to do is I'm trying to let them know what's going to happen. Think about perfect example. I hate dentists. Not all dentists. I just hate going to the dentist office. And it's not about the pain because he numb you up. You don't feel it. Let's be real. But it's the aftermath. It's like your mouth's numb and you can't feel anything. You know, it's the drill. It's the glasses. They look at you in the eyes. You know, when you're Doing you look at my eyes.

Awkward. Who are you?

Like, do I look them in the eyes so I look down?

Oh, yeah. We're all dealing with an awkward moment.

So I hate dentist office. Okay.

Yep.

So think about what happens, what could happen if the dentist office sent you an email prior to your first meeting or whatever meeting. Here, here's what's going to happen. And if you tell me what's going to happen, there's a good chance I'm not gonna get hit with a surprise.

Yeah.

So now I'm a little bit more open to come in and have a conversation or come into the dentist's office because I know exactly what's gonna happen. Like, hey man, this wasn't on a brochure, this wasn't an email. Clients, prospects, whatever compass. I don't give a shit if you're in mom and pop shop. You're selling a T shirt popsicle, you're selling a hundred million dollar business. They want to know what's going to happen and they don't want any surprises.

So basically it sounds like obviously the framing is most important right from the very beginning, before even the thing.

So are you essentially getting on a call with them and then right in the beginning of the call saying look, I got something to sell, but let's get to that in a minute.

Or is it no. Yeah, kind of. I try to take the power away from them. You can't buy what I'm selling until I properly qualify you for that product or service of good.

Gotcha.

I'll let you can request an information doesn't entitle you to. You have to.

You're able to make that type of decision on your own because perhaps that's probably what's brought you here with me, is you made poor choices and bad decisions. So can you walk me through some of the decision making? What's your decision making process? Walk me through that. Once I kind of understand your decision making process, I can start understanding where can I make the proper adjustments for me to make more of an impact with you. Because if I make an impact with somebody with taking the element of them buying a product or service or good out of it, that's going to give. It's going to do what with me? It's going to connect me with them immediately.

Yeah.

Now they're like, damn, this guy knows his shit. This guy is not just listening to me, he's hearing me.

He'S hearing my frustration, he's feeling my pain. But most importantly, I'm not going to do it and be vulnerable with them. And hey, it's okay. Your life sucks. No, listen, Joe, you made this decision. Here's what the repercussion. Here's your consequence. You need to hold yourself accountable to that. I can't do it for you. Here's what I can do for you. Grab a pen and piece of paper, and they're like, okay, it's. But I don't need to tell them I'm the authority figure or I'm. You know, the positioning is a big thing, and Matt touched on that. You want to position yourself. I don't position myself because I'm telling you who I am. You're going to know who I am, was what I'm saying to you.

Mm.

You ever seen. Was it Michael Clayton? That movie. Wait, what's the movie Michael Clayton has? What is the name? George Clooney. He's like a lawyer.

He's the only name of the movies. Michael Clayton. I don't think I've ever.

I think so he comes in and he's the person who just fixes problems.

Okay.

That's before me. To perform. Able to fix your problem, I need to diagnose the problem.

Mm.

I mean, think about going to a doctor. I do the same thing a doctor does. I give you a. I diagnose the problem. I figure out maybe here's some symptoms, here's some things that maybe we could potentially work on. But in order for you to buy xyz, I'm going to need to do this with you to get you ready.

Yeah. Yeah.

Are you willing to meet me halfway? Because I'm more than willing to help you. But I can't help someone that doesn't want to help themselves.

Sure. So it sounds like it's that intro part of the conversation, whatever that part of the relationship really is.

Right from the beginning.

Yeah.

Right.

That's the. That what? The how What? When What?

How What? When How What? When. Why? How.

Oh, why was in there.

Yeah. But then when am I hitting. I'm hitting him with that how. At the end of it again, because it's a second how. How would you go about doing it differently?

Yeah.

Walk me through that process. What does that process look like for you?

So it's almost like you're getting the picture. The snapshot before with the how, and now you're saying, like, the future pacing, where they really want to go.

Right. So let. What I'm trying to do is I'm trying to hold them accountable on what they're learning with me. Are they gonna be able to do this on their own. Because I can't. I'm not gonna be in your house, bro. Like when times get difficult and you go wake up in the morning having self doubt and having a nagging girlfriend or a nagging boyfriend is telling you you ain't shit or whatever it is. I can't control all these moving parts but I try to at least train them on and teach them that they can't control their thoughts but they can direct them into a positive outlet. And that's the re anchoring piece.

Yeah.

If I frame it and drop that anchor, I'm remove helping them. Removing that anchor and dropping something positive there. Go. Chris told me about this. He knew exactly what was going to happen. Here's what I need to do. We talked about this. They're prepped so like so visit training program, education. I try to frame exactly their journey so that way when I get there, Chris told me I would. Chris told me to buy a popsicle here or Chris told me to experience this feeling. Yeah, I hope you get my point.

Yeah, no, it's great. You're literally giving them a journey throughout this whole thing and it's making them feel easy because they're kind of self directing the journey. You're just, you're just giving a little bit of bumpers, you know, on like a, on a bowling alley. You're just kind of keeping them in the lane but you're keeping them moving down the path, you know?

Right, right. The only way to do this effectively is ethically.

You have to generally want the best for the other person. And that kind of goes with the podcast that I have. It's the win win effect. It's everyone winning, not just the buyer, seller relationship of me selling you the product and you are being happy. No, it's me working with you and everybody in your surrounding social circle, the people around you, whatever. Not just in the short term, but long term. Looking at longevity, look at myself flourishing from that type of relationship. Guys I have guys that have purchased probably four or five different products and services with me over the last eight years because they keep following me to different places. Why do you think that is? Because it's the relationship and how I made them feel that it's a lifelong client. I don't have people that buy in and out and just buy one service come back to me. And the only way for them to do that is they see me as a trusted advisor.

That's it.

A trusted authority figure like, damn, this guy's doing some big things. And I'm more amazed by the impact that I've had in their life, not in a business aspect.

Do you think this is why your approach is. I guess because I know a lot of folks don't think that they're salespeople or that they're cut out to be salespeople. And you said earlier everyone is a salesperson and can be. There already are, but you just don't know it. Maybe, but it seems like there's a lot of, you know, more of the aggressive types of salespeople that might turn people away from even pursuing, figuring out sales for them. So, like, let's talk about, like, how someone that doesn't feel like they have the confidence for sales or like, oh, I can't, you know, like, I've heard all this sales stuff. It just doesn't fit with me. Like, it doesn't feel right.

Right. And that's the problem with the sales. You know, I guess you would say the different eras of sales, and I speak a lot about this, is there are different eras. We're now in an era, and especially right now with this pandemic and things going on, it's forcing people to have that connection.

Yeah.

A lot of people have to stay at home, talk to their spouse they haven't talked to in years, potentially talk to their kids, build a relationship. So it's about that connection. So the era that we're in right now is we're in a digital world with a stone age brain, and we're built to. We're wired.

To protect ourselves at all times and also to help. People don't realize that is that you're here to help. So if I took a hundred. A bag of $100 bills. Okay. And went on a street in London, set it next to something, and then I put a. Then I had someone sitting there and said, would you help this person, say they were in need, or would you take the bag of money?

99.9% of people, they would grab the bag, wouldn't they? Of course. But they don't know that if they went to help that one person, then I would give them the bag of money.

This is the whole thing about believing in abundance. You have to fully believe in abundance for this to be able to work properly. And what does that. That do? I mean, it takes time, doesn't it?

Definitely. It's practice, man. A lot of folks are stuck in scarcity. Yeah.

They're scared. They're stuck in that mode, and they're. They're scared to commit to something. Look at people in relationships. You have the highest divorce ratio ever known to man nowadays. Because people are scared to commit to shit.

Yep.

But people are scared of one thing. Fear themselves. Why?

It doesn't, it doesn't make any sense to me. Like you have to be whole to be able to do what I do at a high level.

And that's people. I don't need to tell people that. People feel that with me. They feel that with the people that I trained. The companies, the corporations. I came in, left the education field, went to like more of an international consulting with, you know, sales teams and selling high end programs. And that's obviously helped me be able to develop enough capital to do what I do and invest back into myself. Then I went back to the education field and a different, I guess you had a different mask on and a different cape. Like I'm here to fix this whole setup you have that's called the biggest scam of all time. FAFSA and student debt. So I'm going to train you on how to really properly, you know, really properly qualify your buyer for not just to get through the program and then pass review career services, but, but to do well in their life is a stepping stone. Like one of the pieces of advice that I give the people that work with me, not for me. I don't like to try to say that these guys work for me. I want them to view me as a stepping stone for them to get to where they want to go in life.

You're growing everyone around you.

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. It comes from every piece of me. So you have to believe in it 110%. Well, I guess anything less than that then you're, you're going to get exposed at one point you're going to be a fraud.

Yeah, it kind of sounds like too you've got this sort of mindset of what you're selling is the prize not necessarily getting the customers the prize. I don't remember where this came from. It was a book I read somewhere. But I remember it was about George Clooney. I think about his methodology when he was walking into auditions to be in shows and he was so successful at winning these auditions and getting on these various shows and movies. And somebody asked him about it one time and he said the difference between my mindset and most of the other actors that are walking in there is that I walk in thinking I'm the prize. They need me more than I need them.

Exactly. It's reverse psychology. You're moving the table. Like when I talked about Matt, when. At the beginning of this, when we talked about, okay, they can buy. No, I take the power away from them because I'm taking the table and turning the table on them. It's like talked about Vegas. A lot of loop in a lot of loopbacks.

I'm taking the odds away from the dealer, you know, the house.

Yeah.

You have no longer have the odds. I'm have the odds. I have leverage.

Yeah.

Sales is a game of inches. And it's all done by leverage. All done by leverage. How I gain that leverage is by listening to what they're saying to me and what they're not saying and I'm right. Usually when I'm writing those stuff down on a piece of paper, I'm not writing anything down where I'm looking at an angle. I'm writing down.

Baby, maybe just understanding some of the things they're not telling me. And all the negative shit. When I ask them to write things down, I'm only asking them to write things that down or are positive because when they go back after the call, they're going to look at their piece of paper and it's only going to be positive stuff on that piece of paper. My job is to deal with the negative shit. Your job's to deal with the positive stuff.

I remember this from one of the podcasts I listened on the Win Win Effect podcast, which, by the way, everyone, like, if you are interested in sales, go listen to this podcast. I'm serious. It's like the same talk. And you do a lot of role playing back and forth with people, too. But there was something. Yeah. That stuck out with me. I remember now. You just reminded me. It was like, yeah, you tell them to have a pen and paper in front of them, but you are going to direct them on what to write down on that paper. They're not there to take notes.

It's.

You're anchoring in these good emotions and I haven't heard about. Yeah, I didn't hear your side of the coin of what you write down. But you're writing the negative stuff. Maybe the. Yeah, the stuff that they're not saying that you're like, okay, well, that's something I should probably bring up here.

When I made the dedication to become 1% better each and every day of my life, that's a hard decision and a hard commitment for yourself. I think I shared with you the spreadsheet that I use for even my personal life.

Right.

And I hold myself accountable to that because I'M more of a. I like to strategize. So what I do, I'm very methodical. Like, I don't just do things to do it. I do it for a purpose, because that serves a purpose for me getting to a target or a goal. Okay. So when I made that commitment to become 1% better each and every day, it was for myself. Had nothing to do with me perfecting my craft or me trying to, you know, have a better quality of life. Had everything to do with how I felt about myself.

Mm.

And it comes in it. And that's where it comes from, my competitive advantage. And I'll touch more about that. But when I look at these notes and I'm writing down all these negative things and me realigning that, I'm going to go back and I tell my clients, this goes with the CEOs that I work with. Listen, what I'm going to do at this time, now that we've. I've learned a lot on this phone call. I've learned a lot in this encounter with you. But what did you learn? Like what. What are some things that you're going to work on? What. Where would you go with that? What are you going to do after you reflect on this? I'll tell you exactly what I would like for you to do and propose. But what. What do you think you need to do? And then they'll tell me, and then I'm going to correct that if it needs to be corrected. And then I'll say, look, you're doing this. I'm doing this. We're going to meet back for this next meeting. How exciting is that? Because I'm going to spend 15 to 20 minutes digging into this recording, listening to where I'm potentially missing an opportunity or could maybe enhance your overall experience within this system or this journey. And then I'm going to try to tie in and tie in an angle to where I can make more of an impact with you. Right at the beginning of the call, that's indirectly telling them that I care more about them than I care about the sale, because I'm working on them, but I'm not working on getting them closer to the buying time frame and getting them close and closing the sale. It's something to deal with them personally, that I feel that it could help them and best serve them long term, not just short term. So when I'm doing that, it takes a lot of time and effort. Guys, there's not a phone call that I still don't go back and listen to each day, every day, the sales calls that I have, doesn't matter what capacity. I listen to my calls, the next day I might be in a gym supermarket. And yes, I've been that crazy person in this. And you know, with AirPods in and someone walks by, I'm like, motherfucker.

Trying to talk to me again.

I'm like, it was. I'm yelling at myself.

So you're like a football player reviewing the tape.

Yeah.

Right. You gotta, you gotta. I mean, just like, what, Bill Belichick, football. How much does he watch tape?

All the time. Probably gotta know, man. Yeah.

Learn from your failures and learn more from your wins.

Yeah, that's a really good point, man. Yeah.

Yeah. You see the videos of like Tom Brady and he's sitting there eating breakfast, watching footage in the morning of football games.

And like, I don't stop, man. I don't. I love music, but I don't listen to music other than just background stuff. Maybe just when I'm need to get my mind off of things, I don't. But with that competitive advantage, another thing comes with me trying to focus on how can I increase my knowledge, how can I make more of an impact? How can I do this on a different capacity, different scales? I pinch myself sometimes. How the hell did I get here? Well, I know how I got here. Hard work.

Yeah. And you're reviewing it. So you're anchoring all that stuff in your head and obviously the stuff that you probably could have done better, maybe some gaps in that conversation could have framed that question better.

Right. It's. I've been in every sales calls, it sounds different, every single one, but I have every scenario I went through over a hundred thousand times.

Because I'm. I'm playing it out in my own mind. I'm playing, you know, imagery technique, imagery training. I do that a lot. Like when I go on group calls. Like if it's a training, when it's kind of like this kind of, it's freestyle, it's just me having a normal conversation because I believe that that's the most authentic thing is podcasts.

Yeah.

I think that should be zero scripted nothing. It should just be you microphone, another person just trying to make an impact with the listeners. That's what it's all about.

Amen.

And this is free content. But my competitive advantage goes all the way back to my sister and me watching her breathing through tubes and struggling to breathe. I have no reason and I have no excuse, guys, not to be great.

How old were you? How old were you? When you're watching her.

She was.

She. She was only supposed to make it to four years old.

Whoa.

And I think that that was probably a good thing that she couldn't comprehend what the doctor. His diagnosis, because she made it to all when she was, you know, 17 years old.

You probably.

Yeah. Better mindset. Yeah.

But I was in a crib with her.

I had nothing.

I had no idea that, you know, anything was wrong with her. I was. I was a baby. I was two years younger than her. Right. So, okay, three years. Almost three years. And I was three years younger than her, but I had no idea nothing was wrong. So she was my first best friend, to be honest with you. Grew up in the same crib until my mom couldn't really, you know, take care when she got bigger and whatnot. So I've watched it from every year around February timeframe, she would get sick, get pneumonia, and I would see that, and I would have to witness that. My mom's had eight back surgeries, you know, beating cancer. At one point. I watched my dad work his ass off his whole life, you know, and he had to sacrifice all the things that he wanted to do in life just to be able to put food on the table and provide because he had a family. So you can learn a lot from just paying attention to your surroundings. Like when you realize. I went to a Tony Robbins event, I think it changed my life. About eight years ago. Really changed my life, bro. I walked in there, I knew who Tony Robbins was. Of course, who doesn't on the planet? But I didn't know the intensity of what he was bringing to the damn table. This. What is it? Unleash the power within. Yeah, man. I walked in there, bro. These guys are, like, doing, like, freaking. I don't know, shooting water bottles up in the air, throwing T shirts. I was like, I don't do drugs or drinks, so I don't know what the hell's happening here.

I didn't sign up for this.

And that's all about just changing your emotional states. And I realized, one, there was one key thing that I learned. Well, two actually, was when I realized that life wasn't happening to me, it was happening for me for a reason. And that I felt that before, but hearing it coming from someone of that type of authority figure. And one, he's that massive. I don't know if you ever.

He's huge. I haven't met him first.

I've never met him in person, but I've seen him in person.

Yeah.

And Tony, if you're listening to this. Love to have you on the show, man.

You changed my life with this. The next thing he did is I've always been. I've always been. Had a lot of pride of saying I can break through people's emotional bullshit pretty quickly and breaking through the layers and getting to the core and a root of a problem. But, man, when you watch someone like him do it like that with, like, ease, like cutting, it's like a hot knife cutting through butter.

And it's quick, too. I know he's fast, man. And it was.

And it was. It wasn't like. It wasn't just like, him just getting to the core. He knew what to do with it when he got them into the core when they were in the most vulnerable.

Good point. Yeah.

Because that's where a lot of salespeople fail, is that they can get to the core root of problems. They try to avoid tension because tension does something different inside that dynamic because they don't want to ruin their sale.

Is it because they're kind of anchored? They're like, they still want this win at the end of the day, they're still trying to get the sale, but they're still passing them through the journey. And we got to get there.

Exactly. I mean, are you there to take orders, or are you there to change lives?

You make a decision.

I mean, that's true, man, because if you're opening them up that much, now you have a trusted advisor, hopefully, in you or the salesperson speaking to that person. And, yeah, if you don't know what to do with them and lead them down the right path after that, then, I mean, who knows where you're taking that person then could be right.

What do you think the lifetime value of a customer is for me?

Oh, shoot. I know it's high. Really high.

I mean, you have to look at the multiple different types of opportunities. Some of these guys make just as much money, if not more money than I do a year, you know, and it's not about getting on here and be like, yeah, I made eight figures and I've done this and I've done. No, it's about how many people I've served and I've helped. Because it's not about the money. Money will come if you dedicate the time and effort into mastering your own self first. Yeah, if you're able to do that, you can, man. Just find the right vehicle, bro. You'll find it. Put the right shit out the universe. I believe some of the stuff with Law of Attraction, not all the way. Yeah, there's a lot of holes into it. Like what is it the other one? The sales approach? Nlp, man, come on. There's a lot of holes in that shit.

Like what are some holes in there? I'm curious.

Yeah, it's, it's the follow through.

Uh huh.

It's the follow through. And not they can persuade them or convince them an influence on what they need to do, but there's zero follow through and follow up on the back end and making sure they're doing the right thing. So for the, for the person.

Gotcha. Okay, so there's like kind of lead up, but there's no follow through at the end.

Yeah, I mean, I've studied it. I mean that's where I think I made a huge shift is when that was what, eight years ago I went to that event. Wasn't just that one event changed everything. I think it was just a spiral of events, that kind of chain reaction to a lot of things that I was already doing myself.

Sure.

Because when I hit that, I was, you know, at the time I was a regional. I had four different campuses. I was taking over and I was going in, hiring and firing sales teams. I was like, man, I can make a shit ton of money doing this shit by myself. I just didn't know how. And another thing I didn't have is capital.

That helps, right?

I had the confidence, I had the skill. I just needed to be polished up a little bit. And so I started reaching out to some, maybe people that have made that type of money before. And then I've realized that I never learned like something from like a specific thing from someone. It was just like, I look for explicit knowledge so I can take that explicit knowledge and apply it. Bam.

Yeah, you're kind of picking and choosing and then, you know, applying what fits.

I don't like reading a whole book. I've read a lot of books, but I don't like, I don't like to take in all that bullshit information that you're giving me to sell the book.

Yeah, I don't want to listen to it. So I'll pick out what I like and then I, then I dedicate my time and seeing how I can implement that.

Yeah, that's the worst. When you get a book and the first like three chapters are telling you why you should read the book, I'm.

Like, yeah man, I've already bought it. Shut the fuck up. What is this?

Trying to resell me so I don't return the book to Barnes? And no Or Amazon. Come on. Who does that?

I'll tell you what book is actually good. And I'm listening to it mentioned before I was dyslexic reading it on a thing. It kind of goes together on me. So it takes me longer to get through it. So Curtis Jackson, 50 Cent.

He's got a book out.

Man, that's a great book. I'm like halfway through it. Just some. Maybe it's just called that. I don't know. One of my. Actually the co host of my show, Wes Base. Yeah, he actually was like, man, you should. You should listen to this book. It's really good book. And I'm like, what is it about? He's like, it's just different Personas. He had to make the 50 cent type of version of himself to be able to deal with what he need to deal with to be successful. Curtis Jackson is different. I always loved that.

There's a. Yeah, we have. Oh, my God. It's the alter ego, Todd Herman. Todd Herman. If you. You'd probably like that too. He's been on the show and same idea. He's talking. He's kind of chatting about different celebrities and breaking them open. Like, you know, Beyonce or, you know, and Sasha Fierce, like, that was her stage name for a while because she, you know, she needed in by. But then she graduated to Beyonce. She's like, I don't need Sasha Fierce anymore. You know, I'm confident on stage. I'm me now.

But yeah, I remember reading the 50th law, which was Curtis Jackson with. With Robert Greene, who wrote the 48 laws of power. That was really, really good as well. Sort of some similar concepts.

Nice. Yeah, I'll check that book out.

There's a couple different books out there. It talks a lot about that. I believe in some of it.

How do I put this? There's a daily routine I work on to get myself ready to serve. Right. I mean, I can't just wake up in the morning and be like, hey, I'm Chris Ross. Here we go. I'm going to. You know, Come on, man.

I thought you were that good.

Master of my own emotions, you know, I'm going to make an impact on all these people. Hell, no, man. The biggest battle I win every day is at 5am when I wake up.

So walk us through that. That was one of the things I wrote down. I know the 1% a day method you go through. It's very. Yeah, the spreadsheet. It's like you have different categories and all that.

I'm Just the kind of person where I like to try. I'm very methodical and what works for me isn't potentially going to work for everybody. I like to see it because I'm more of a visual type of person.

When I wake up at 5am, that's when my mind's had time to rest and my body's had time to rest. So when I very first wake up, your mind's the most impressionable the first 30 to 45 minutes of your day. Right. So the first thing I need to do is kind of like going to like a tub or a body of water. You got to pull the plug and dump all the bullshit out. Right? So whatever baggage or whatever I did that morning or that night or whatever's happened to me, I need to release all the pressure and release everything out of me and clear my own mind. So it's mind, body, spirit, mind, body. Get yourself into a sweat. Not work out that working out is later, but just getting yourself to a sweat and stretch out, you know, breathing, exercising, whatever you're trying to do to clear out your mechanism, clear out your mind. Then you pray. Then I go into my critical thinking. Critical thinking changes for a lot of people. For myself, I get the best work done in the shower. The shower. I get the most thoughts I have. You, I see that you have notepads. I have notepads everywhere in my house, man. I have an audio recorder. Like, you know those little. Well, you know, people laugh at me all the time and I have those little dictator phone thing. Yeah, like, like what are you, a doctor? I'm like, perhaps.

I'm like Dr. Love, you know, I mean, whatever. So you can go so many different ways of that.

So why do you use that instead of just like pulling out your cell phone?

Because I don't want to. That's the whole point. And I'm glad that you touched on that. I don't want to bring my phone into my place of recovery in my room. Gotcha.

That makes sense. The separation. Yeah, yeah.

You touch your phone, first thing you do in the morning, a lot of people. What's in your phone?

Everything.

Other people's bullshit fucking demands and wants and needs. And I don't fucking. I don't email you. I need to worry about me. Yeah, this is me. So if I can't fix me and if I can't get myself my superpower and get myself ready, then I don't go serve that day.

Damn right. Yeah. So many people don't. It's, it's tough man, and even I struggle with this all the time. I know, we all do, but man. Yeah, it's especially the one thing I'm pretty damn good at now is not checking the phone, not touching, other than the alarm, whatever goes off, but other than that. And I just changed my freaking alarm. It used to be like gratefulness and all that stuff. I had a hard time doing that. Waking up when I'm half awake with the baby, you know?

Yeah, you can't do that. You gotta.

My thing is it literally says Sprint, which is like go run a hill outside. Go hop on the bike and. And then I feel good.

Yeah, get the up. Yeah, right. I mean, but there's. Some days are harder than the others, right? So that's why I said the biggest battle I have to win every day is at 5am I have to win it. It isn't. It's a should or something I would like to do. It's something that's a must for me because I believe that that's the major, you know, component to my success.

Because if I don't get that done then there's a good chance that I'm going to breakfast and I'm gonna eat like five pancakes. Whatever it is. I'm like, man, fuck it. I'm just moving my calls a day because I'm not with it right now.

Check it out.

As in right now, my voice, I feel great. My voice doesn't sound good. But if I move this call, if I move this recording, if I had other podcasts that I was doing today, trainings, it's not authentic.

It's a slippery slope too, right?

It is.

Especially in the morning because that sets up your whole day when ideally your glass is full or empty, however you want to look at it. And either way it's positive however you manage it. But it can quickly get tainted and toxic if you're adding emails and, and responding to all the Facebook messaging, like.

No, that's the time that I deal with social media once a day is at 8am that's when I hit my computer. And that for that 30 minute period, I'm checking behind my team, I'm checking the post analytics or the reports, whatever. And that's the time that I do respond to the messages. I mean, for those who do follow me on social media, please do join the community if you, if you haven't just a lot of great content. I try to give away as much content as possible to people.

So where can they find you? Win Win Effective podcast.

The Win Win Effect Podcast I'm also. I mean, that's the handle for social media, for the Win win effect.

Okay.

That's on pretty much every social media channel platform. For myself, I went with the whole sales thing. This is Chris Ross because I had the most common name ever, America.

Hey, at least you got. This is though.

Or this is. Well, I went with that because that's. It went with my sales because that's how I introduced myself to people. This is Chris Ross.

Behind it. But I did win the battle of getting my handle for Instagram, so it is Chris Ross. So.

Yeah, I did win that battle because I had to pay for the rights for my name. Just because I knew the route that I was, you know, me working behind the scenes for so many years now. Yeah, I'm starting to pull. You know, I took the mask off and I went. Pulled my head behind the scenes, like, hey, yeah, I'm the guy.

That's what I told Matt because Matt was trying to find information, you know, and I had a lot already and, you know, all this. And he's like, I can't find much about Chris. I'm like, I think he's just now coming out with his own personal brand and all that.

Yeah, right. For the last, I think.

I say about seven months. About seven months. I started peeking my head around the corner, not all the way out. And I think I'm all the way out now just because I'm doing a lot of, like, interviews, podcasts.

Oh, yeah, you are.

Great stuff going on. I mean, I was honored to actually obviously be on your podcast. I mean, this one. I mean, because it's all about. This is my way of networking, but I'm not networking.

That's right. Yeah, dude. That's why we started this show from day one. That was the number one. Now we have all these other things.

But you could be the best in the world at what you do. But if no one knows who you are, then what the fuck's the point?

That's right.

So I have one last sort of sales question. I know it's sort of disjointed from the rest of the conversation, but I want to bring it up before we let you go. When it comes to. Objection. Handling. One of the biggest objections that I feel like most people come across is the money objection. And obviously when. When you're selling, you're not going to push somebody into something if you don't feel it's a good fit for them. But what if you have something that you know is just the perfect fit for this person, but they just literally do not have the money in the bank account to buy it. Like, how do. How do you overcome the money objection when it comes to things like high ticket sales? How do you get people over it if you know in your heart that this thing is the thing they need?

Right. It's about being. Being able to express that same feeling in the way that you just described it to them.

Listen, Mr. And Mrs. Prospect, I know that this can be a game changer for you. Maybe potentially you don't know this and you don't feel that yet. However, that's my role, and we'll talk about that later. Here's what I would. Here's what I could do with you right now is either I can say, hey, you can go to one of these funding resources. People made bad decisions. I mean, you got what's happening right now with this Covid shit. People who lost their businesses, lost a lot of money, man. Now I've been screaming on top of the freaking hill for the last eight years. If you're not online in the next, like three years, you're dead. So I'm not saying that I was smart. I've just had the right people telling me the same shit. So.

Question. What I try to do is I try to address that pretty much at the beginning, that very first encounter. Like, I can't. I don't know what's happened to you in your life, in your finances. Maybe potentially you've made some poor decisions. Maybe you got tied into the wrong people and it took your money and got scammed. I dealt with a lot of this shit, especially not talking about high ticket program, because that's drove me to build the companies that I built.

Ethical.

Yeah, it goes with everything I have. So I tried to address that in the beginning. I say, Mr. Prospect, listen, there will be a time in this type of program. There will be a time in, you know, in this type of situation or journey together that you're going to say, hey, I think I might want to look into, you know, making myself a little bit more flexible financially if I. If I do, if I am recommended for this program. Remember I talked about take it away. It's a recommendation process. So it goes with everything that I teach. So I say, listen, what I would do in your type of situation, we're always going to need capital. I mean, you can't start a freaking hot dog stand without capital. Let's be real. I love hot dog stands. As a next time, next thing I'm gonna do in London because There's zero hot dogs.

Abomination. No hot dogs.

Yeah. What the is going on? Where's the hot dog, man? So it's like, give me a hot dog. So you go to that type of conversation, that's a tough conversation with people.

Yeah.

But here's what I would do in your, in your situation. Think about if you got through towards the end and I did recommend you for something and you weren't able to come up with the right amount of capital or the financial funds to position yourself or to take action if you're recommended. How would that make you feel if you couldn't do it? Well, I would feel like shit. I would, you know, I would definitely like, man, I just wasted my time because I don't want you to go through this whole journey with me and invest all the time. Because time is the only non renewable resource you have in life. You can't get back that time, nothing. Every second it goes by. So investors investing my time with you, I need to make sure that I'm going to be taken care of as well. My assistants, my staff, my support, they're there to help you and guide you. They're there to assist me. My role is to assist you. Different dynamics. So if you got to that type of decision and I presented that type of program and that solution that could potentially change your life. Not just financially, spiritually, mentally, you know, physically, people, I say that they're like, physically, what the fuck? I'm like, dude, you create more time for yourself, you're gonna become a little bit more healthy.

Damn right. You will start making a little bit.

More coin, a little bit more financial worth. You'll be like, shit, I can do things I want to do.

So I should have jumped way ahead of that. To answer your question, Matt. Way ahead of that. Because here's the worst thing can ever happen. You get there's what this is. What I would say 85% of salespeople do is they wait until a buying decision to present the program.

That's right. That's like, yeah, everybody.

Like I need.

To know right from the beginning, are you with me? Are you against me? And if you, if I sense or if I feel that you're not 100% committed to what I'm willing to put into that type of relationship or that journey. It doesn't mean that you're not going to be dealt with or handled. You're just going to deal with somebody that I trained. You're not going to deal with me.

Hey, you recommend them another source solution Whatever it is. Yeah, right.

I got the perfect person for you. And here's what. I'm gonna edify them right at the beginning.

See, that's what I love. And we do very similar things in different scenarios, but mainly in the affiliate marketing game, you know, if we're not gonna be able to solve the thing for you, and, you know, occasionally we'll bring on partners or we'll consult, but, you know, most people can't, you know, don't want to fork up with the money or whatever it might be. But yeah, we have all these recommended other services or solutions for them products, and we'll edify them. And it's great because you still. You gain even more trust, I feel like, by doing that. And they come back to you for additional help, you know, so that trust isn't lost when you pass it over.

To someone, force them to do something they didn't want to do.

Sure, yeah.

You know, I mean, that's. That's a really good method. And I think that's one of the reasons why I met a couple of people that you've, you know, in your network is that, you know, at the time I was looking for people to help me with the podcast stuff, like the editing and videos and content creation and all that shit. I was like, man, my time is best well served doing other things. I just didn't think that the podcast would take off the way it did. And I'm very grateful. I'm very grateful, and I'm honored that so many people invest their time listening to myself. I mean, the people that we have on. And now we're in the second season of the. The podcast. I mean, these guys are streaming and downloading over 80,000 people a month. They're downloading our stuff. I'm like, that is nuts. It is like, it's nuts. I'm like, okay, well, guys, I mean, now I'm just trying to figure out how can I. How can I reward the ones that do it and how can I give them away? You know, that's just. That's me. How can I give them something else worth of value? So it motivates me a little bit more indirectly on. Okay, and I even have the guests. We have guests on. I literally break down the guests, and I'm like, listen, I don't think there's really gonna serve our audience. Like, what's. What's the point? It's not about just sales. It's about winning. Can you win?

What.

What's helped you in your journey to win? Walk Me through that process. I have guys that been in NFL. I've had, you know, that are motivational speakers. I've had guys that have worked with, you know, big names. Bob Proctor, you know, going in those types of realms with the sales side. I've had someone that, you know, they're obviously just different types of recruitment agencies internationally, working with Mindvalley, working with those types of, you know, type of companies, big names out there. You got.

People, affiliate marketing type of, you know, space people in the sales game. Maybe on a international type of level. In training. You have. I have even have a country singer coming on. It's was on the Voice, you know, these people, you know this. It's really cool because you start meeting different people. And I don't just want it to be about just sales.

Right.

But what I try to do is I'm trying to expose in every industry that it's sales.

Everyone's got sales going on. They have to.

That's. That's my little hidden, little, I guess, gym that I try to bring to every episode. I'm like, aha.

It's like a Trojan horse. Like, there we are. Sales came up again.

Yep, here we are. Here we are. Here I am again.

It's freaking relationship.

Yeah.

That'S true.

I mean, you just make it. That's the thing. And this is because I've, you know, I listen to a lot of sales stuff and we've had other guys, you know, even mentors of ours that are really, really good at sales and teach that it's your style is what I've attached to and why I got sucked into your podcast. Even though I'm like, I don't know what I'm doing here. I like Chris so I'll listen to his shit. But then it's like, I think it's just the way it's presented, you know, and it's just. It seems like everyone can pick it up and should be able to if they actually dedicate and think it through how it fits for them.

Right. And I appreciate you saying really nice comment because when it's not about getting people roped in, it's about. I'm trying to do is. I'm trying to explain it in a certain way where I can explain it to someone who doesn't know anything about sales. And I love meeting people that had never done sales before and they listen to the show and they're better salespeople. When they go and just do their.

Job, they will be. Yeah.

Because they get influenced. Once you have that Power to influence. And you're doing it morally and ethically. It's your moral obligation to obviously be a good person, is it not?

I have a. I have a rule in my business. You want to hear?

Go for it.

Absolutely. I'm the only asshole.

How so? You seem pretty cool.

Yeah, no, I am. But I can become an asshole when things aren't done right.

Sure.

But it's not about being a terror, you know, being that tyrant type of leader. It's about, I know when to drop the hammer, and I know when to listen. I know it's not your fault. What can we do to make it happen? What can we do differently? It goes with a leadership style. I train my staff to not bring me a problem, but bring me a problem and a proposed solution to the problem.

And what you're gonna do is what, are you gonna ask questions of that person and.

Same thing.

Yeah.

Same style. Like, so what would you do differently? What if you own the business? What would you say to me if I was, you know, like, it's all about training the next one up. Like, prior military. Right. So if I got shot, who's gonna take my spot?

Mm. Better be someone, because it's the same mission. That's right.

Just different leader. And I love talking to salespeople. Be like, I'm a great leader. I'm like, so walk me through your process and them not knowing it.

Yeah.

I'm like. I'm like, do I really need to sell you? Oh, no. Like, you're a manager.

It's not about being a dick. You know, it's about having them understand and feeling it. Because that's the whole thing with the people that want to.

They don't want to take ownership for their own stuff. They're like, I don't know. It's his fault. And they get the fingers.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

We've always done it this way. Like, yeah, but just. You can't do the same thing in trying to get a different approach. That's why you see the radical transformation and, you know, going from this type of sales or that type of revenue and profit share, and I turn it into 400, 500%, and next quarter, you're like, how the hell did you do that? It's not about what I did is what I trained your staff to do.

Yeah.

And it's about, how can I train them. So I trained them the same day, same way. I want them to work with their buyers.

And that all comes within.

It all comes in there. Yeah.

Shoot.

I was just gonna oh, so one last thing before we wrap up. I want to hit on that 1% better every day concept that you live with is that at the end of the day where you do that audit and we don't have to go through.

Maybe a lot, I guess it's a really good question and I'm glad that you brought it up because a lot of people, they go, oh, that sounds great. It's not a catch, it's not a punchline of what I say to on calls. And you know, because I really believe that. And there's a lot of areas in my life where I failed in my personal life and different situations where I've had to go back and realign and dig into my core. And it's one of the hardest things ever. When you hit a certain level of success, you don't want to be ashamed and admit when you failed in certain areas. You have to be 100% authentic and own that shit. And there's a lot of areas in my life where I've had to go back in and dig into same methods I use with people. And I go, okay, I need to fix this shit. It's gonna suck, but I need to figure out where I failed and where can I hold myself accountable and then forgive myself. So when you're Talking about the 1% every day, that typically happens towards the end of the day. But I check in with myself in different times. Gotcha.

Okay.

So when I go through my task, I don't write out. I write out my task for the next day, the night before. So the first thing that I see after mind, body, spirit, critical thinking, walking out of my sanctuary, I guess you would call it, in my room. It's like me walking into a 12 round fight.

Yeah.

That's how I feel is when I leave my bedroom and I go to walk into my office and start my day. And I'm attacked that day. Yeah, like you got Method man going on in my head or whatever it is. Whatever, whatever theme music you have. Yeah, that shit's playing in my head and I'm coming out hot. And the first thing I do when I walk in my office, I got boards all in my office. Like whiteboards other than the screens over here. Yeah, I got whiteboards and those whiteboards. Just four tasks. Four tasks. Boop, boop, boop, boop. And there's personal business, Personal business. Here's the things that I need to get done. Top all the way down to four. And everything else is on the next page. And that's. That's how I'm able to become 1% better every day is I hold my, I look at it every day. So if I don't hit. So here's how you break it down and measuring, reassessing at the end of the day and you don't hit your goals or hit your targets. These are targets. That's not a goal target.

You just, you just, it's part of the path.

Yeah, just part of it. If I don't hit that task, how does that, how do I need to measure and reassess and get to the same outcome?

Think about how many times in your life and you went man, I didn't do it that day and I did it this day and I didn't do it this day. Think about how much momentum. But your, isn't it your, you getting to your end designation and you getting to the big goal. Overall achievement. It's not about you just getting there. I want to blow right past that shit. That goal is always going to keep changing because I'm still involved, I'm growing. I'm never going to catch that damn thing.

That's right.

It's always going to get bigger and bigger and bigger. So it's like a never ending cycle. But if you don't do it every day, are you still going to get to that target? You'll end up, you'll end up in BFE somewhere because you've got a wrong coordinates. Yeah, it's like a heat sticking missile, man. You gotta move, bro. So I say a lot and I say it a lot because it's like more of an indication for me to put myself in that place. It's like every day ends in Y because it's true. I gotta be moving guys. Like yeah. If it day ends in why I'm moving.

Yeah.

So there's no days off. It doesn't sound great. But I don't turn. That's what happens with more non rural entrepreneurs. We think about this like I don't just not think about business when it hits Sunday.

Right. That's not how we're wired. That's how we work.

Nah man, it's not how. It's not because you. That's what kills me about people. That corporate America, they, they're usually shutting their brains off on Thursday. Thursday, Thursday. And then they don't see their self until Tuesday. Well they come back Monday but they're not really there.

They're not there. They're in a fuzz from whatever the football game was on Sunday.

Yeah, I mean they're out there partying. They're. And, you know, popping bottles of champagne and, like, they won the Super Bowl. But, like, what are you really celebrating? That your life sucks? Like, what's the whole point?

Yeah. Is this the end? It better not be.

Right? I'm like, yeah, not really cool. But I do appreciate you touching on that, because a lot of people don't understand it's, you know, the dedication and the hard work that comes behind that piece.

Yeah, yeah, no, it's huge, man. And honestly, you know, I. I've done your spreadsheet. I fell off it a bit, so it's like. Yeah, I'm working through it. I got my.

Yeah, but how does it make you feel when you look at the times that you fell off what happened in your life?

Well, that's the thing. Yeah. Something derails, and I don't like that. It's not a good feeling. But when you're measuring or when I'm measuring, you know, and doing the routines, like. Cause I have my own morning thing and very similar and feels freaking phenomenal. Like, you know, today's a podcast day. Didn't work out this morning, but we went on a long walk, my wife and baby and I, and it's like. Like, this is good. This is gonna set the day off. And, you know, just like, little things like that, man, consistent things set up the day to win.

And sometimes it's the it. Well, it just goes back to the human needs. Right. So you have certainty and uncertainty. How you rank that is different because of everybody. Like, I like a little bit of sporadic shit to happen in my day.

Yep.

Same unplanned things, and it happens. I'm like, all right, great. That sounds great. But if I walk in my office and get punched in the face with something, I'm like, whoa, I didn't expect that. And that's entrepreneurship, man.

Yeah.

Because there's certain days, man, I'll come in and have a plan, and that plan goes right out the window.

See, those are the days where I'm just like, damn it. That's. That's what gets me. But, you know, being consistent and doing the audits and check ins and helps minimize that greatly.

Do you like to use your humor with that? Because I use my humor when I have those off days like that, I'm like, man, I didn't expect that shit to happen.

I. I can. It depends. Sometimes my wife has to sometimes reframe me because sometimes I get a little short, and I'm like, like, damn it. Like, I should have done that or I could do this better.

You know, kind of goes with being a perfectionist. And if you, I mean, you have to live and die by a 75 rule. If it's 75 done up to your expectation, get it out.

That's right. That's a personal struggle of mine. You nailed that one, man. It's the perfection.

It's a never ending cycle, man. Because you're never going to perfect anything.

That's right.

Like just somewhere there'll be somebody listening to this podcast. Like, I was listening to the, you know, sales tapes from years ago when I was, you know. Remember the cassette tapes?

Oh, yeah.

I used to listen to these tapes, man. I'm like, oh, that's. I don't really. I could never get it done. I'm like, I. I understand the methods, spin and all these different methods and techniques, but I used to listen to this. There's some kid or somebody listening to these podcasts and that's how I feel about podcasts. Someone's listening, I don't know who it is, and I'll probably never meet them. And it's going to be 10, 20 years down the road and he's going to bring up my name.

It's true.

That's why I do what I do.

Love it. On that note, I think we wrap because that's amazing, man. That's why we're all here doing this podcast thing. That's why we're giving every day. That's why we're improving ourselves every day. Right. Thanks for spending the time with us, brother.

Man. It was time well invested. I've been looking forward to this and I know that there's. Guys, if you, you, you know, want to learn more about me, I'm easy to find. Just yell at the window, chris Ross, you'll find me. But other than that, you might get.

Chris Boss, but sorry, go ahead and.

Chris Boss, if you're ever listening to this, man, I would love to have you on the show.

And I'll hook you up. I got the end. I can make that.

I love it, man. I've actually watched his stuff. I was like, holy, this guy's great. I was like, man, I was like, you take one letter off the last name. We're the same.

But that might be how I introduce you guys. Is this your doppelganger?

No, I thought it was great.

I.

This is his way of his. His tonality and his delivery with. That was beautiful. It is beautiful.

Yeah.

Absolutely.

Well, yeah. TCR consulting agency.com or what's yeah.

TCR consulting agency dot com.

Nice.

Chris rossofficial.com the win win effect. Really easy to find. We're on every, you know, platform for, you know, podcasting and whatnot. But other than that, guys, just check us out on social media, whatever it is for you if you want to learn more about the free trainings that we have. Obviously with TCR Consulting Agency, I don't sell a front end product. I don't do it because it goes against the core values and what I believe. However, there are free courses that you're able to attend and go through. And at that time, you get one consultation call with one of my team members that I trained and what they're there to do is the same type of approach that I went through at the very beginning of this podcast and I went through and how to qualify and they'll point you in the right direction. Kind of like what Joe was talking about, pointing in the right direction. Different companies that maybe it could, could be the right spot for you. Because the stuff that we've built and I've developed over the years, it's going to take some hard work and dedication. If you're not ready to be successful, we don't want you around you. But I'll still help you.

Yeah, that's why the podcast exists, all that free training.

So, yeah, we'll link all those resources up in the show notes for anybody listening. And if you, you know, you grab the companion notes, they'll be there too. So everybody will know where to go to find more.

Right?

Bam.

Dude, I love the shirt, by the way.

Yeah, you see that?

We'll send you one.

Yeah, I just saw that. I was actually going back and forth with Wes Bayes, obviously co host for the show, which is love that guy more than death. I mean, I'm like his biggest fan, so follow him as well. West Bass, he's a cool dude. He's he actually not common name, so he's really good. But that shirt, and we're talking about the podcast, he's like, I love the name, man. Hustler.

We'Ll get you that shirt. Yeah, give us a Wes's shirt size too. We'll hook them up.

Awesome. Yeah, definitely. Indeed, guys. And I would love to have you on the show as well. Like, let's do it.

Would love to, man. Hell yeah. All right, Chris. Appreciate you, bro.

Take care.

Hey, hey, hey. Thank you for listening to that episode. This is Joe Fear. I'm sure you probably already knew that. And Matt is not here right now. But I'm pretty sure he enjoyed the episode just as much as you and I did because, you know, he went into the production of kind of making that thing right along with me. So thank you very much. And I want to give a quick shout out to our buddies over at Easy Webinar. These guys have been supporting us for a while, a long time, and Casey Zieman is just a super good guy all around. He's actually been on the show before. He's the founder of Easy Webinars. So if you look up Casey Zieman on any podcast platform you're listening to, go check him out. Go check out his backstory, what he's all about. You can learn, learn a lot about webinars as well. And right now, Easy Webinar, these guys are actually hooking you up with a great trial. It's a completely free trial to test out their software, Soup to nuts. Check it all out and see if it's a good fit for you. If you go to easywebinar.com hustle, that's H U S T L E. If you didn't know how to spell hustle, there you go. So if you go to easywebinar.com hustle you can go grab a free trial and EZ webinar literally lives up, up to its name. It's super simple, I mean, super easy. And it does all the stuff that you're looking for in any kind of thing with webinars, I mean, they literally cover every single type of webinar you possibly can do. So from live to automated to scheduled at specific times, and all these crazy features in between, can't even list them all out. I'll be here way too long. They give you a ton of advanced analytics. What's working, what's not. During your webinar, based off all these actions, you'll see who attended, how long they stayed, if they clicked the offer or if they didn't. Basically, you're going to make more money and you're going to work less with this thing and you're going to create better relationships with the folks that are listening because it's a good experience. You want to give that good experience along with some great content, of course, and a killer offer if that's what you got for them. So go try it out yourself. Go check out easywebinar.com hustle. That. That's easywebinar.com hustole. Alrighty. So that is the end of this episode. Thank you so much for listening to this episode, enjoying it. Hopefully you did. I'm pretty sure you did if you lasted this long. And go check out Easy Webinar when you get the chance and we will talk to you next time. Bye Bye.

Thanks everybody for listening to this episode.

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