Dennis Yu — How To Build A Recognizable Brand Using $1 Ads

Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.

What's up, everybody? You're listening to the Hustle and Flowchart podcast with your boys, Matt Wolf and Joe Fear.

Hey, welcome back to another episode of the Hustle and Flowchart podcast, presented by evergreenprofits.com this is Joe Fear and I'm Matt Wolf. There he is. And today on the episode, we have Dennis Yu from Blitz Metrics that's going to break down some really fascinating things about Facebook and how to use just tricky psychology and different inception tactics with very simple, very budget friendly tactics. But before I get into kind of introducing him a little bit more, so just wanted to remind you of the purpose of why we're even doing this in the first place. The podcast Hustle and Flowchart, but also everything at Evergreen profits is to show you a completely different new lens, a different way to look at your job. If you have a job that's totally cool, but there's a different way, but also your business. If you're working in a business that you feel like you're kind of getting slogged into, you're getting a little bogged down. It's not what you dreamed that you thought it would be, but system, you know, but society kind of tells you, oh, just work hard. Hustle, hustle, hustle. You got to do everything yourself. We're here to show you that there are better ways to work and to ultimately live and spend your time day to day in a way that you can feel this way of quote, unquote, retirement, where you actually can, like, benefit from, from all of the work that you're doing in now. The business isn't here for you to serve it. It's the other way around. The business serves you. And that's what we're opening your eyes to and why we introduce all these cool guests on our episodes, like Dennis. So, Dennis, what do you like about Dennis?

So, okay, so we had a couple rabbit holes we went down with Dennis. So Dennis is really known for his dollar a day strategy and teaching people how to be really, really effective with Facebook ads. So we talk a little bit about what the dollar a day strategy implement it. We talk about Facebook advertising and some simple little tweaks that you can do to your Facebook ads to just really make them much more effective. We talked about what are some of the other things we talked about.

Biggie that I really loved is how to get noticed by the media. Yep. Like big things like USA Today, cnn. But also you can do this with folks who you want to influence so maybe there's a type of client or a brand you want to work with. Well, he's going to tell you exactly how you could do this for a dollar a day with strategic content and things like that.

Yeah. And another thing, selfishly, we learned how we're actually going to blow up this podcast in the coming months. He gave us some strategies to really make this podcast just get some insane reach and we're looking forward to experimenting with those. So if you have a podcast, you're going to want to hear that as well.

Thank you.

And lots and lots of great stuff. We cover a lot of stuff, mostly around Facebook advertising specifically, but action packed.

Yeah. So before we get into it, if you want to get ahold of us, get in touch with us to discuss more of the things we're talking about in the podcast or if you want to go deeper and actually talk on the phone, we're taking some calls. For folks that want to dive deeper into the strategies we talk about, not only on the podcast, but in all the other things, the stuff you see on our blog. We have some really cool ways to grow your brand traffic and bring the right eyeballs to your offers. Just go to evergreenprofits.com/consulting and fill out the little application and we'll hop on the phone in chat. Word.

Now let's jump in with Mr. Dennis Yu.

Hey, Dennis, thanks for showing up on the show here.

Hey, Matt and Joe. Pleasure.

Yeah, man, it was so what we had, I think it was two months ago, maybe you had a workshop in San Diego and that was our first introduction to, to you, I think it was. Our buddy Dan Ryan was like, hey, Dennis, you. He's got some good stuff going on when it comes to Facebook ads and, and just using content in such a creative and leveraged way. We're like, okay, we gotta get there because that's exactly our, you know, that's what we're trying to do all the time.

Yeah. No, I've got to say, that event that you put on in San Diego, as far as value for the money, just mind blowing how much value you provided for what we paid to be there. I mean, it was just crazy. So just appreciate so much how much you share so freely.

Thank you. Can I quote you on that?

Absolutely. Take the recording and share it around.

Yeah. So give us a little stuff for the folks who haven't heard of yet. I know a lot of people have heard of you, but might not have heard your strategies and all that stuff. Give us a little scope of a little Short of what you've done prior to getting to the point where who you're working with and we'll dig in.

Let me tell you what people think is important, and then let me tell you what actually is important.

Sounds good.

Do it.

So what people think is important is that I've spent a billion dollars on Facebook ads. I used to run analytics at Yahoo. I have multiple degrees from fancy places. I know a lot of important people. But that's not what matters. All of the success that our clients and our young adults and people in our community have had like you guys using the dollar a day strategy, setting up analytics the right way is not based on tricks. It's not based on magic. It's based on simply following recipes in the same way that you might have a favorite chocolate cake recipe. And you know if you have the ingredients and you follow the directions, you will get what you want. And thus we have put in the majority of our effort into building these checklists, which you saw from our workshop. And anyone who decides they actually want to put in time to follow checklists, and this is the Asian in me, who's good at math coming out. I like, you know, solving math problems. I used to compete in math contests. I used to fly around. I was number five in math counts. I actually went to the national Spelling Bee representing California in 1988. I went to Washington D.C. that's how competitive I was. And I thought it was all about studying and checklists and this kind of thing. And that has caused me and our team in the last 20 something years to put together all these recipes. Every time we learn about how something works, we want to understand how to turn that into a 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 process. So naturally, learning how search engines work and how do you get rankings, there's a process on how the search engine decides what goes into the crawl and what gets indexed and what shows up in the search results. Same thing for what drives conversions. It can be mechanical. Let's say you're selling through Shopify or you have some kind of shopping cart, or you're generating leads. There's a process on getting in front of a customer, getting them to watch, to click, to fill out a form, and then to buy. And you can troubleshoot every one of those pieces step by step. So if you have.

The recipe book on how to do that, and I'm not here trying to sell a secret recipe, you have it. You guys went to our workshop, you have that. That's what people miss. They think it's about the glam and the sizzle and the flash and the magic trick, because Facebook made this one change. Now you can do this. You can go chatbots, or now you can't do workplace targeting. They think it's this technical thing, but everything boils back to simple things. Like, you guys know that we give out gifts to people and in the mail soon, Matt and Joe, you guys are going to get socks with your faces printed on them. And I'm ruining the surprise. I know, but you'll get them. And it's still interesting nonetheless. And that's because there's a process on how anytime we have an event or a checklist or a new client, that kicks off something for someone else to do. And then all of these recipes, they flow together. We happen to run our business on infusionsoft. Not that infusionsoft is a magic tool, but we put our recipes in there and we put our recipes in our dashboard. Right now, Christian and I, we're working on this 300 page thing that we call the master presentation. You can't see it because it's a podcast, but it has tons and tons of diagrams like what you saw in our workshop in San Diego. And this is what we consider to be the treasure, because that's how we run our business. You know the value of McDonald's. Yes, they're real estate or hamburgers, but it's in their process on how they get French fries. You know, French fries, crispy and delicious every single time. And that's the way I see it, too. Any kind of business you want to scale, you want evergreen profits, you've got to be able to systematize your knowledge so that other people can follow those same checklists. Even if they're not as well educated or have the network or as experienced or as literate or whatever, they should be able to follow the recipe and make chocolate cake. And that's all it is. So we put the most valuable things out there, and people don't think that they're valuable. Just like people are afraid of reading books. They'll buy books, but they won't read them. They love to go to events. Makes them feel good. Tony Robbins and all that kind of stuff. But the power, guys, is in the checklists.

Yeah, and that's exactly what we've done with our business, is first start checklisting and soping everything that we can ourselves. And then obviously you hire someone like a project manager, ops manager, and then you just expand and expand upon those. And like you said with McDonald's, I mean, they're hiring minimum wage workers to produce the same consistent quality throughout the world.

Yeah. And instead of McDonald's, because people think McDonald's quality.

Or you can use whatever your favorite company is, you know, Apple, iPhones, whatever you are fanatical about, you know that there is a factory process on how they deliver quality at scale. We call that repeatable excellence. And all the things that people know us for, like they'll come to workshops or clients will buy consulting and will tune their ad account. And, you know, we figured out the thing that's broken and now they're making more money. There's tons and tons of case studies about stuff like that. That. And they'll think it's because we have some detailed, magical understanding of the algorithm. And I think we understand it well. But what they don't realize is that it's all a bunch of little lightweight optimizations, little iterations where you guys know that we see the foundation of Facebook marketing as one minute videos. You've got to create lots and lots of one minute videos. You can take your one hour webinars, podcasts, interviews, and chop them into one minute things, sequence them together, run them on YouTube as well. And the distribution and tuning and transcribing and modifying and recombining of content requires lots of checklists. So to be successful on Facebook, which is Sheryl Sandberg, their coo, who's basically running the company, it's not Mark Zuckerberg.

She called it word of mouth at scale. And we believe that. Not as somebody, you know, Facebook, corporate PR mega giant, kind of tagline, but we recognize that that's how their system is built. The newsfeed is based on what your friends are doing. So if you as a business, an entrepreneur, a startup, you want to grow your business, you have to create word of mouth of scale, which is getting the positive mentions that other people have said about you, sharing the expertise that you have in one minute videos. Lightweight touches, just like what friends would normally say. Like we, Christian, had In N Out for the first time yesterday. You guys ever had In N Out?

Are you kidding? We live in San Diego, so we grew up on it.

Christian, what do you think of In N Out? It was all that was hyped up to me. It was. But did you see any of their ads?

No, no, they don't advertise.

Nope.

No, they advertise on the radio, actually.

Really?

It's very, very rare, though. Yeah. Yeah, it's extremely rare in San Diego.

You do hear it on the radio from time to time, but that's about it.

But you go to an In N Out, and when they first open, there was literally a line down the street. That's not an exaggeration. And still to this day, at 10 o' clock at night, there'll be a line wrapped around the building and you're like, what the hell is so special with these things?

But is it that good?

I don't think I know. Matt doesn't. They're good, but they're not like groundbreaking good.

I mean, in San Diego, there's probably five other burger places I go to before In N Out. But whenever people come to town, they always want to go to In N Out.

That's right.

So do you think In N Out's growing because they have an amazing digital marketing strategy?

No.

Okay, so you know that for the last five years we've been running ads for the Golden State warriors and we have been spending maybe a million dollars and we'll generate $40 million in ticket revenue, provable through Ticketmaster. Right? That looks incredible. And that's legit revenue. Facebook will say it, Ticketmaster, the American Marketing association, all these guys, you know, the warriors themselves, they love that revenue, right? And some people will be cynical and they'll say, well, if you want to be the best social media agency out there, then you need to find the NBA championship winning team and have them as your client.

Right?

Come on, give us a little bit of credit.

Hey, man, you set yourself up with a good team to partner with, you.

Know, and so we knew that years ago, before they became, you know, dominant and Kevin Durant and all that kind of stuff. And we set up tests to show what the incremental difference was with and without the campaigns that were running. And it's the same thing with in and out. People like it, you know, sorry, if you're on the East Coast, I know people like five guys, but people like it because of how they feel about how their friends feel. And it's that word of mouth. And if you understand that the thing that powers the warriors and In N Out is the same thing that powers your business, then that completely changes your approach to marketing. And that means you have to. Well, first off, you have to have something people love. If people don't love your product or service, you're kind of screwed. Because Facebook's an amplifier. If you use our techniques of one minute videos and a dollar a day, that dollar a day is an amplifier because it keeps stacking. Because you go from a dollar a day to $10 a day to $100 a day. You have 100 items each spending a dollar a day. Right. It stacks. It's a multiplier. It lives forever. It's evergreen, keeps going, tell stories, topic wheel, three by three, all the techniques that we talked about. But the thing is, if you don't start with that seed of love, not just like, ah, they're pretty good. Yeah. You know, the double double is pretty good. It has to be so good, people wrap their line. You know, the line goes across, you know, like it's serious. Like, you know, Black Friday, people trampling each other at Walmart kind of stuff, right?

Yep.

If you have that kind of love, even from just a few people, you know that that's more powerful than. Than having a thousand people saying, yeah, it's pretty good, I guess, right?

Yeah. So speak on, because this is very cool and innovative. The way that you guys do this is you don't have to create your own content. Obviously there is a portion of that, but you leverage the folks who are really saying great things about you. And can you speak into that?

I wasn't joking when I said, can I quote you on that? When you were talking about coming to our workshop and the amount of value that you got?

Oh, yeah.

What carries more weight with your audience? What I have to say or what you guys have to say to your audience, to your people?

It's definitely us. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, I could go all day long and talk about how awesome I think I am.

And the truth is, in the last 10 years, I've been telling people that you shouldn't work on your personal brand. And people are like, what are you talking about? And I'm like, yeah, you should not be working on your personal brand. You should have other people working, working on your brand.

Right.

So, like Christian, who's sitting next to me, I'm working on his brand and he and other folks are working on my brand. You know, never work on your own brand because you want other people to be talking about you. If you're talking about you, then you're some self pompous, peacocking, you know, bragging, chest beating kind of, you know, you don't want to be a prima donna. Right. You want the customers to do the work for you, which means you need a process to gather that at scale. So what do we do? We have young adults and we have virtual assistants from the Philippines making three bucks an hour or more. And they're gathering all of these mentions. So when you guys see something positive, someone is putting that into this high tech thing called Google sheets and saying thank you and creating speaker reels and updating our marketing materials and using all. And boosting them on Facebook or cutting out the one minute awesome little things that you've said, sharing them on Facebook and YouTube and Twitter, boosting each of these little snippets where people are saying good things for a dollar a day in addition to sharing our advice, in addition to sharing all these other things. If all you do is boost testimonials or accolades, then people are like, all right, I've had enough of that. Right.

I get it. Yeah.

But if you share your expertise, like we're here in this podcast, we're openly sharing. You can ask whatever question I'll share. It's not like, oh, you got to come to our mastermind to get that. It's some secret. Like, no, there's no secret. It's all driven by checklists. Now, can we cover everything we know about every single checklist in 45 minutes? No. But, you know, you can talk about any one particular item if you want. Right?

That's right.

Secret, right?

I love it. Yeah. Yeah. And that's, that's the powerful approach is, is just leveraging others and the way you were saying. But I'm very curious and I want to hear your rundown because we've definitely explained this to some of our own clients. We, we've referenced it with just folks we talked to about the three part video sequence that you have for the dollar a day strategy.

Yep.

Let's go into that and explain what that is and how folks can apply it.

Okay. So there's a three part funnel that happens to work on Facebook and work everywhere in digital. Facebook calls it awareness, consideration and conversion, which is for the top, middle and bottom of the funnel. We call it awareness, engagement conversion, which is almost identical. So if you follow those parts of the funnel, that also aligns with know like and trust. Because people have to know you before they can like you. And they have to like you before they can trust you. That also corresponds with why, how, and what. So these are all synonymous for stages of a three part funnel. And you know, a funnel is sequential. So it's like going on a first date, having a first kiss, and then getting married, whatever the successive stages are in sequence where you build a deeper relationship. And because you know that in any kind of conversion item, even selling potato chips, it usually takes seven touches. Right. People almost never buy on an impulse, unless it's like your toilet got flooded and you need someone right now and it's an emergency but for most things that are non emergency, people will shop around and get feedback and word of mouth and get recommendations and that kind of thing. So this three part funnel of awareness to engagement, to conversion, which is also why, how and what requires you to create 1 minute videos at each step. So why is talking about who you are like what is your why? The Simon Sinek Start with why. You can create a series of those. It doesn't have to be about your product. Please don't make it about your product. Just share who you are. Something that happened when you were a child. When I was three, I was pecked on the head at SeaWorld by a seagull who stole my churro and ran away, says my co founder. That's not my story, that's his story. When I was 18, I dropped out of high school. I wanted to be a professional athlete and entrepreneur. That's my. That's true. That's what I wanted to do. Right. I didn't graduate high school, believe that or not. I could look it up. No one cares where I went to high school. But there's a whole story behind that and that gives you some insight into who I am. And it's telling stories in a traditional three part story arc. You guys have heard of the hero's journey. It's the same thing with Harry Potter and Star wars and Rocky and all those things where you identify with the protagonist. Then they have some kind of challenge where they get their butt kicked and at the end they win. Everyone understands that three part story arc. You have to follow the same arc even though you're not creating a movie. You're not Steven Spielberg. Right. So if you understand that people have to identify with who you are, that's the why. So they understand that your values. Or I was once dumped by a girl too. Or I also had a challenge where some people decide to put out these. Like I was hitting rock bottom and I wanted to commit suicide because I was an alcoholic. Or you don't have to have those kinds of traumatic life and death stories. It could be like I was cut off in the, in the parking lot by this woman and I got mad at her and she gave me the finger. It could be whatever, right? Just make sure.

Yeah.

People see that you're a human. Right. So that's the why. And the how comes after the why where you're sharing some kind of expertise. Like maybe we share. How do we tune our Facebook ads? Just one piece of expertise. Not everything, but whatever you can cram into a specific tip in One minute. Like, I can give you a one minute story on how do you order bobbleheads from China that will delight people and customize in the right way and have them not break, right? Who do we use and how much does it cost? Like, I can tell you in one minute how to do that, right? I can tell you in one minute how I use Southwest Airlines to maximize the amount of points that I earn using Companion Pass.

There you go.

And using their credit card, right? That's a piece of advice. So if you fly a lot and you fly Southwest Airlines, then you might find that helpful, right? You're just sharing expertise. At no point am I selling anything, right? And then after sharing expertise, which is how? Because I've gone from why to how, then what is what I'm selling? Hey, I've got this course on Facebook ads. Hey, I've got this package where we will implement your digital plumbing, which is all your pixels and your tracking and custom audiences and all that kind of stuff. Hey, we have this membership. It's $159 a month. And we cover things that you as an entrepreneur would want to learn about, like how do you hire people? How do you travel without getting ripped off at the last minute? How do you prepare for conferences so you get the maximum amount of leads? How do you build your personal brands? How do you hire virtual assistants? How do you get young adults to work at scale without flaking out? How do you do, you know, all, or you know, we'll teach you how to do all these things. And it's $159 a month, right? Then I have permission to sell. That's the what, what's the product or service? But if I came out, told you right away, hey, we have a three day mastermind in Phoenix. It's $7,500 for you to come for three days, right? You'd say, are you kidding? Imagine that was the first touch. There was no relationship building. There is no sharing of expertise. There is no trust. There's no amplifying what other people have to say about you. I'm just some stranger. We're having, you know, you're having dinner with your friend wherever your favorite place is. We actually went to. What was that barbecue place. We went to the Radizio Grill. We went to a Brazilian barbecue. Oh, yeah, yeah. It's where they go around and they, the gauchos shave these meats at you. They have like 15 kinds of meats. Have you been to one of these days?

Oh, yeah, with the swords and it's like red light, Green light.

Yeah, a little thing. It's red on one side and green the other, and you flip it over and then they come at you, and then you have to turn it over and it's red. But the minute you turn it over and it's green, they come swarm at you again. Yeah, but that was amazing. Now, if we didn't know about that kind of stuff from before, let's just say that we're having dinner there because we like to eat there all the time. I got fat from eating at places like that.

I was going to say you can.

Gorge, but you have to, because you feel like if you're going to pay, like, 50 bucks each and you only eat, like, two pieces of meat, that's like, you got to go when you're hungry, you have to eat past the point of being full. Like, you got your money's worth. So. But let's say that, you know, us four are having dinner at this place, and then some random dude comes up and says, hey, you should come join our mastermind. It's $7,500 for three days in Phoenix.

What would you do? Right?

You're like, bye. See you.

Go away.

Let's say that it was someone that Matt knew. And Matt's like, oh, dude, I didn't know you're in town. What's up, dude? Can you join us for dinner? And then they say, yeah, I'd love to. And then over the course of the conversation, when there's a lot of trust and you guys have built a relationship over time, maybe Joe doesn't know the guy, but let's say Matt knows this guy who sat down and has dinner with us. And in a natural sort of way, this guy recommends, hey, you know, you should come to our workshop. Or let's say it's me, and I say, hey, you should come to our workshop. Right?

Yep.

Then you have trust. And all of us understand that that's how selling occurs. But when it comes to online, people decide that they can just be jerks or that the real world etiquette rules don't apply. Sure. And then do all these stupid things like automate and spam people and have chatbots and have auto dialers and, like, all these ridiculous kinds of things. Like, you would never do that in real life.

Right. It's that keyboard warrior, the personality, the. The face. You know, just being a human just drops for some reason. And, you know, and that's where the power of your video strategy. And like you said, any piece of content can then you can. You can turn that completely around if you approach it the correct way.

Want to know something ridiculous?

Sure.

So I've studied. I've studied so much psychology, but I also have a degree in economics and a degree in finance.

Like, I've always thought that people where rational, calculating, logical people. It's like they have calculators as thought bubbles above their head. When they're in a supermarket deciding whether they want the large jar of peanut butter or the small jar, and they're calculating what the price is per ounce. I've always had the thought that people, when they make decisions, they're like rational, logical sorts of people. But proximity theory and other things, like game theory show that people will naturally choose what's most familiar to them, even if there is no actual expertise being demonstrated. For example, the likelihood of you marrying somebody, some girl who was a classmate of yours in college, goes way up if she was in one of your same classes or in the same dormitory. I mean, just people naturally hang out with other, like, people will do business with. It's just people are intellectually lazy. They'll just, like, do business, get married, be best friends with people that they just happen to meet.

Are you calling me lazy? Because I actually married a chick I went to middle school with?

That's awesome. Those are the best love stories.

No, it is. I know, but you're totally spot on, man. This is great.

And people have only a certain amount of energy, right?

Yeah.

And both. That's physical energy and emotional, rational, logical, kind of calculating energy. And that's why people go with whatever's easier. Like, I shop all day long on Amazon. Like the. The Amazon people come by our place like twice a day. It's like Christmas, right? Because I love Amazon Prime. I love one click. It's dangerous. So there's all this stuff showing up. But when you buy stuff on Amazon, are you there reading all the reviews? You could spend a whole day doing all the research, couldn't you?

Yeah. Yeah, for sure.

Just got an electric toothbrush, a Phillip Philips Sonicare, which is amazing, right? You could literally read, like, the best one. There's got, like 8,000 reviews, right? And you could try to, like, figure out exactly which one you want. But I'm the kind of guy, I'll go in there, look at it like, hmm, this one's got the most reviews. It's rated 4.8 stars. It's $79 or whatever it is. Okay. One click, I'm done. Good enough.

And that's the thing. Yeah.

In economics, that's something called rational ignorance. It means that people are intentionally ignorant because they're willing to rely upon a heuristic, meaning a substitute factor, an arbitrary factor, potentially, to make that decision. Right. And advertising and marketing is dependent upon maximizing the number of heuristic factors to create, to leverage rational ignorance. That's what you learn in psychology.

Got it.

And me is like a finance math kind of guy. That doesn't make sense because I want to do whatever is like, the most logical thing. But people are not when they're in relationships. So you. When you want to marry your middle school sweetheart, it's not like you're calculating how many points this one girl's worth and this other point. And then so the girls like, how many points of beauty, how many points of intelligence, how many points of money, how many point. You're, like, calculating how many points each of these women have. Right. You're not doing that, right?

Sure, sure.

Maybe somebody's doing that.

Some analytical guy. Yeah, yeah.

I used to do stuff like that.

Well, this poses a good question, because this is something that Matt and I were kind of stuck in for a while, and I think a lot of folks listening to this are probably feeling the same as direct marketing. You know, they're trying to measure from start to finish exactly what you're saying. You know, they're trying to make sure every dollar spent is perfectly going to bring them an ROI or. Or else they're not going to do it. Or if they can't track it, they're not going to do it. Yeah.

I think just being at the workshop that we were at, that was one of the things that we took away from that workshop was sort of breaking out of that. Thinking of everything we do needs to have a direct result right away, immediately. How much money in, how much money out?

Yeah. Are you a pickup artist or are you developing relationships over time? We're not saying blindly invest. Gary Vaynerchuk and I have had a couple disagreements, shall we say? So he knows that I love to talk about analytics. And he'll counter it by saying, what's the ROI of your mom? Right. To which I'm like, come on. I'll say, he's so fast. Like, you cannot get. Oh, he's like a standup comedian. He's so fast. Like, if you take even a half a millisecond to say something, he's like, already onto the next thing.

Oh, yeah.

You lose it instantly. I don't know how many. This guy's like, unlimited. It's like verbal diarrhea.

Today.

But what I would say to that is, to his point is the most valuable things can't be measured, and the things that can be measured by definition are not as valuable. And another way of looking at is saying the best things in life are free, but like love and respect and health or whatever. But the second best things in life are really expensive.

That's right.

So if you're a direct marketer and you realize that's the case, then you might think about how do you measure the value of your brand, of your company brand? Well, it's the sum, as you learned in the workshop, it's the sum of the positive and negative personal interactions that you, your community, your employees, customers, partners, all these people have. It's the sum of all those little transactions. It's like little bank account balances that you have with everybody. And some of them may be overdrawn, and some of them may be very positive, may have, like, big bank accounts with a few friends, because you've built up a lot of trust so that if you bounce a check once in a while or you make a withdrawal of $10, you're not gonna go negative.

Right.

And so we view at scale, when you are building relationships and building your customer base, you want to constantly be making small deposits, and you can measure what those things are. And that's why Facebook in their newsfeed. Because. Because how is Facebook deciding what shows up in the newsfeed? They're using something called EdgeRank, which is the algorithm that shall not be named. Facebook gets mad. They, like, can't use edge rank. Yeah, well, what do you want? What do you want us to call it? Call it the algorithm. Call it, you know, like, okay, whatever the big A word, whatever you want to call it. But the point is that even Facebook is assigning who. Because Facebook can't show you everything that's going on with everyone. There's just not enough space in the newsfeed. Even Twitter can't. Right?

Yeah.

So they have to decide who they think is most. Who, like, your best friends are. Right. And who has content that's most relevant to what you might care about based on what you like and your friends are doing and what's going on right now next to you and this kind of thing. So if you recognize that Facebook is using an algorithm to sort people and content, why wouldn't you align your marketing efforts along those same principles?

It makes perfect sense. And I love the whole. You're depositing, you're growing these, like, thermometers with all the folks out there who are actually engaged with you. And, like, what Matt and I have been starting to call it is almost brand equity. So monetary. You know, you might have one line doing something, but the brand, you know, especially with the dollar a day strategy, that can completely compound and. Whereas your revenue might not be in line perfectly, but it sure as hell going to rise with it. If you're doing, you know, all the way down to the what style Videos with call to actions and whatnot.

Yeah. It's patience because you're making. You know, it's the difference between being a gardener where you're planting seeds and, you know, it takes time. You can't just plant. I used to grow heirloom tomatoes. When I worked at yahoo. I had 12 varieties of heirloom tomato. I had every single kind of black creme Sweet. Was it sweet 1000 yellow peach, different beefsteak, different cherry tomato types. I had ones like green zebra, which are, like, purple and green zigzag stripes on them.

I have those. Those are pretty crazy.

Once you have them, then you realize supermarket tomatoes taste like cardboard.

They do.

They're just terrible. But the thing is that I was so careful. I bought multiple books on how do you grow tomatoes and how do you prepare the soil in the right way. You have to use room temperature. To use fertilizer. You have to dig holes three feet deep so that the root system can build. Right. Like, I was, like, hardcore into tomatoes. Okay.

Yeah.

And I understood that it took six to 10 weeks for these tomato plants to grow. They would grow almost 10ft tall. Wow. I would yield a thousand pounds of tomatoes from my tomato trees. Basically, people would come over and say, dennis, those are tomato trees. Those aren't tomato plants. What are you doing? I had these wire mesh cages, these trellises that they would grow because they were so heavy, they needed to be supported. Right. These polls and all this. And that's the way I view growing relationships and growing the brand equity that you're talking about. Because if I just was impulsive and I need sales right now, and I'm a direct marketer, and every dollar in. I need to see a dollar back right away. Well, fine. I'm just gonna go to Whole Foods and buy something right now. Yep. I'm not gonna plant tomatoes. Because these impatient direct marketers, they're basically. They. They're like, okay, give me the dollar strategy. All right? I put the seed in the ground, then I pull up the seed like, an hour later. Like, I don't have any tomatoes yet.

Well, hurry up, come on, speed up the tomatoes, bro.

Literally had. I kid you not, this has happened to me like 10 times. Where these guys that are gym owners, okay, they may, maybe they own like five or six CrossFit gyms or whatever it is, right?

Yeah.

And people come in over there, you know, January, because they have a New Year's resolution that they want to do whatever, right. They come into these gyms and of course the gym owner or the instructors have to say, hey, you're not going to get six pack abs by next week. Okay. It's going to take a little bit of time. We got to put a program together. Right? But these are the same, remember, These are what the gym owners are trying to do to set expectations with these new customers coming in. These very same gym owners come to us and then we tell them, hey, we need to build a funnel of awareness to engagement, to conversion. We need to sequence people through this different kind of content until eventually they get to the content. We can sell them when they are ready to buy, not when we happen to want them to buy. And then they get impatient after a few days, like, hey, I'm not seeing sales. I can't afford to just like willy nilly spend money and building my brand and getting more fans and getting more reach or videos. Like, I need to see sales right away. And I'll say, okay, you know that advice that you give to Aunt Sally who's like 43 years old and she's coming in and she wants to lose weight? You should take that same advice for your digital marketing. Yes, we're all about driving sales, but you can't behave that way.

Okay, now I love that analogy. That's actually a perfect analogy.

It is.

I mean, there's so much with business and fitness that you could like tie the analogies together and that's just a perfect way to do it.

Well, actually interesting enough, I think Matt has used the tomato analogy before we ever knew you were a tomato grower. The fact that you said that I was like, hell yes, it's coming to real life.

That's awesome.

No, yeah, go ahead, Matt.

So I have. How are you looking on time? Just. We're good, we're good. Okay. I've got two little rabbit holes that I think would be kind of fun to go down one of them. When we were at the workshop, you kind of had a little bit of a system or process for getting on the radar of publication. So if there's people out there that maybe want to get featured in like an entrepreneur Magazine or an Inc Magazine or, you know, or at least their website or something. You had some, some tips for people on, on how to get their attention so that you could potentially be featured on some of those platforms. Is that something you wouldn't mind discussing real quick?

Of course. I'll tell you all the secrets.

Sweet.

You guys probably know that my co founder Logan Young was interviewed on CNN and they interviewed him about the whole Facebook thing where Mark Zuckerberg went to Congress and he said, senator, we run ads, right? So CNN asked Logan his opinion on whether Facebook was in trouble. Does this mean doom for advertisers? What's going to happen with the government? Are they going to regulate? Like asking him all these questions as the authority on all this Facebook stuff. But how did he get there? Why would CNN pick this guy who three years ago was driving for Pizza Hut for nine bucks an hour and didn't even know who Mark Zuckerberg was and had no digital marketing expertise three years ago? Why would CNN Today ask him to be the guy to ask questions about live in front of millions of people? Right.

Yeah.

Why?

I'm assuming because he somehow managed to get on their radar using unique Facebook ads.

That's right. That's because he was featured three or four times on USA Today and USA Today asked him all these questions about, hey, so these Russians that had 170 million impressions and bought ads, how does that targeting work and what kinds of ways did they structure their ad campaigns? How does Facebook out, you know, how does their algorithm work and all this. And the way that he got on the USA Today was because he's taught workshops and because he's taken pictures and videos of himself at Facebook's headquarters multiple times. And he's been to Facebook's offices all over the world. He's keynote it at conferences all over the world. Right. Could be Social Media Marketing World or Traffic and Conversion Summit or any of these other big ones. You know what the names of them are. He's spoken at all these and that's created authority. Speaking at the conference is not enough because what are we taking at these conferences? One minute videos. And we're boosting them for a dollar a day against the people who work at CNN and the Wall Street Journal and USA Today and all these other places. And we've created audiences of all the people that work at these places. Not the people who read USA Today and watch cnn, but the people who work at these companies.

And when we've done that over time, just like our whole tomato working out to eventually get six pack abs analogy over time that results in media mentions. So some people will say, oh, okay, I got your dollar strategy. I'm going to target all the media, target influencers, target people in my industry, these really tight audiences of people who are influential. And so I tried that for a week. You know, I boosted one post and I wasn't on CNN the next day. So you're scam. Your whole system's a scam.

Yeah. So if I like do as many crunches as I can, let's say I just like do as many crunches as I can for four hours. Well, I have six pack abs tonight.

Unlikely.

You're getting closer, but not there.

Your exercise program's a scam. I tried it.

You see, it's just the unrealistic expectations and then they don't have good content. So then the next thing people say is, okay, yeah, fine. So you've got pictures of yourself with Mark Zuckerberg and hanging out at Facebook's headquarters and doing all these important looking sorts of things, you know, flying first class and eating at fancy hotels. But what if you are not, what if you don't have those connections? What if you're not keynoting at a conference? Right. They'll say, yeah, it's easy enough for you to say because like, you know, once you've made your first million dollars, it's easy to make another couple million dollars. That's right. It's easy for you to talk about all these things that rich people do because you guys already have a lot of money. That's not the approach. What you do is you, you interview other people. So if you're not on those shows, then find people who are B list celebrities. And this is when people say, oh, well, I want to get an interview with Richard Branson or Gary Vaynerchuk or Elon Musk. Dude, you don't start there. Start with someone in your community. Start with somebody that's approachable. Start by people who have podcasts that are really small and then start to build that influence up. And when you do the dollar a day strategy, here's something that one of my favorite mentees, Mark Lack, he's used. I love good students that apply what we teach because it works. And then they come back and say, wow, it worked. Yeah, it's because you follow the recipe, you get chocolate cake. So my buddy Mark Lack, five years ago, he was basically a brat, he'll admit that. And he went around and hung out with rich kids and he was a basically like a professional Paintball player, but didn't have any kind of, like, career or anything like that. And he started, but because he was hanging out in LA with all of these rich Hollywood kids and this kind of thing, you know, the. The kids of all these rich parents, because his dad's got money, then he realized that he could interview these parents. And he also started to interview with people that were well known, like, you know, John Lee Dumas or whoever it might be. He'd interview with all these people and get like 100 views or 200 views of these interviews, podcasts and YouTube videos and this kind of thing, but it wasn't getting traction. And he wanted to be the young Tony Robbins, which he now is. He wanted to get his TV show, which he has now. He wanted to speak at conferences, which he's done now. And it was from taking those interviews of B list people and boosting them for a dollar a day against their own audiences. So the thing that really broke through for Mark was that he interviewed Tai Lopez. And he said, no, why would Tai Lopez agree to this? Because he said, I guarantee that our interview together will get at least 100,000 views on Facebook. And all you have to do is let me film you in your office and in your garage with your books and the Lamborghinis and all that, and I'll be in and out within half an hour. Our guys will do the setup. We're not going to hang around. We know exactly what we're doing. Half an hour. I guarantee you 100,000 views. So what did Ty say?

Hell, yeah, let's do this.

So that's what he did. Filmed a good interview, did his research, didn't waste time. He knows how to talk. Both of them know how to talk. I would argue that Mark is a slicker talker, but Ty has more money. And then he took those interviews on Facebook and boosted them to Ty's audience and got these things up to 200, 300,000. Half a million views. Ty saw that, but guess who else saw that? Grant Cardone and Naveen Jain and Gary Vaynerchuk and Tony Robbins and Tillman Fertitta. And now Mark's had interviews with tons of billionaires. So why does he even care with having interviews with millionaires when he can have interviews with billionaires?

There you go.

He's interviewed most of the Shark Tank people. He's got a really good one with Daymond John. We've cut that into a few different segments and boosted that out there. So all you need is that one piece. Even if you don't have any kind of fame. You can approach someone who's B list or even A list. I don't recommend approaching an A list person if you, if you're not a pro at interviewing because you're gonna blow it. You don't want to blow your first one.

Right?

Right. It just looks bad. Okay. Like learn how to speak. Like don't just go try to keynote it. Well, first off, these conference organizers won't let you keynote unless you're a proven speaker, right?

Yeah.

Speak at a webinar, speak on a panel first, speak on a solo session before you want to be the keynote. Walking around making a fool of yourself.

Get something that is medium authority and boost it so that people can see. Just put 100 bucks against the thing, edit the 1 minute versions, find something that's working, get that cost per 10 second view down to a penny and then you can generate tens of thousands of views that gives you the perceived authority which then you take that post and you can reboost it to the media. Right. You can boost it. Mark Lack could boost that initial interview to Tai Lopez or to his fans and that'll generate tons of views because it's 18 year old males in California which people aren't targeting. So you get that traffic super cheap. And then once that thing's generated lots of social proof, meaning lots of views, likes, comments, that kind of thing, then he changes that boost or creates a new ad targeting the media or targeting the people that are going to be at the national association of Chiropractors or whatever. Let's say he's speaking at that conference next. You can take any of the content you've created. As you learned in our workshop. You can take any content, even if it's years old, and show it fresh to anyone that you want using the dollar a day tactic. You have to advertise. There's no other way to do it.

Right. That's absolutely amazing. I think that's what we love the most out of the workshop is because Matt and I have always dig big proponents of repurposing content. But the way that you can now put any eyeballs you really want in front of that content, connect the two to open up doors that you never thought was possible with sticking with, you know, I'm just gonna grow my email list and blah, blah, no leverage. You know, Facebook and I believe you could do this on LinkedIn as well as what you're doing as well. Right? Another platform.

Yeah, you can, but you can't do it off a profile or SBA company profile. It's minimum $10 a day. The cost is too high. You can still do workplace and job title targeting. A lot of that is being pulled away from Facebook, unfortunately.

Got it. Okay.

Principle of a dollar a day against one minute videos is evergreen. It'll last forever. It doesn't matter what changes Facebook has yet 99% of people, they'll listen to this podcast if your audience is like any of these other audiences, and they'll say, oh, that's really interesting, and not do anything.

That's right.

No, that's true. Yeah. I mean, when we went to the event, one of the things that was a big takeaway for me was, you know, we've always. We boost a lot of content. We run Facebook ads all the time, but it's always our content. Right. It's always the stuff that's on our website. It was. I was always very focused on getting more people back to our website. And one of the things we started doing after your event was we started rounding up in a spreadsheet anywhere we've been mentioned, any other podcasts we've been featured on, YouTube videos where people interviewed us, and we rounded all those up into a split spreadsheet and we started boosting content or boosting posts to other people's websites, other people's content that sort of boosted our brand, boosted our awareness, boosted our credibility. We started boosting that stuff and stopped focusing as much on boosting stuff on our own website.

And what have you noticed?

Well, one thing I can tell you that we've noticed is pretty much anytime we go to any sort of networking event or conference or anything like that, we get people coming up to us now saying, I see your ads everywhere. I know about you guys because of your podcast. And, you know, up until two months ago, we didn't know. You know, we never really heard much feedback about our podcast, but just in the last couple months, it's just constant. Every time we go anywhere, people seem to know us from our podcast. Even though we're boosting our podcast less frequently, we're actually boosting content on other people's site more frequently.

And that's the trick. If I had a choice of boosting a blog post that's on blitzmetrics.com versus a guest post that I've written on Social Media Examiner, I will spend money to boost the Social Media examiner post, meaning, and I've had this argument hundreds of times, I prefer spending money to send traffic to other people's websites and then they'll Say, why would you do that? Because then you don't get to fire your pixel and then you want to send them to your site because then you can sell them consulting and packages and all that. Yes. But we have to move through the cycle of know, like and trust. We have to establish credibility. We have to educate them. We have to show them that we know what we're talking about. And if they want to hire you, if they want to reach out, believe me, they will find a way to reach out.

That's right.

It's not about like your landing page design. They will find you if they want to find you. Yeah.

And not to mention too, that the more you do that kind of stuff where you boost to other people's podcasts, the more podcasters want to have you on because they know you're going to drive traffic back to them.

Yeah. And so we are going to spend our money to boost your podcast and send traffic to your site. Why wouldn't you like that?

That's right.

And that's the exact same thing we do with other podcasts we go on. So I love it. Yeah.

Because you're the media. You have to think of your. This is the, the whole Inception thing, the whole thing behind dollar a Day, which is the dream inside the dream inside the dream. You know, Inception, the movie, is that you, in order to influence the media, you have to become the media. You have to treat yourselves like the media because you have authority instead of you're just some salesperson. Buy my stuff. Buy my stuff. And that's the shift. When people have that bit shift in their mind, everything in Facebook opens up and they realize that the authority comes from them interviewing other people on high power stages or high power events. Right. And it's the sharing of that, where you're trying to make other people look good, that then they reciprocate. So nowhere here do I really want to talk about myself. But I know that if we share our knowledge and I give you our checklists and they're good checklists, and we know that if you try these recipes, because we've tried them many, many, many times and they work, then you're going to do our marketing for us. And that's when we want to boost your content. Because I want to boost the things that you're saying that are good about us, which has always been good. Right?

Yeah. Take that, direct marketers. No, really, it's a perfect combination. If direct marketers can wrap their brains around this and bring a little patience to their lives, put some money behind that, you pair this strategy along with some, some great strategies of firing pixels and all that, you're just going to exponentially help everything in the process.

Yeah. And then just like you talk about with Evergreen profits or building systematic, repeatable, hands free residual income kinds of four hour work week kind of stuff, this is exactly in line with that. Because the things that are producing US revenue today, most of them are seeds that we planted 10 years ago. Plus we could stop making content today and everything would work just as well as it has. We don't have to make new content. We love to because we're addicts and addicts can't stop. But I think they must put crack inside the in n out hamburgers.

That's amazing.

One little thing too, I remember you saying with content creation, a lot of folks kind of try to overcomplicate that stuff. And you made a really good point of when you get an idea for a piece of content, you just whip out your phone right there and you, I think you said you do an audio recording of the concept or at least get it out, get it out of your head while the idea strikes.

Yeah. It's the same thing with brainstorming. Don't overthink it or don't say, oh, I'll do it tomorrow, I'm busy right now. You would not believe the number of blog posts I've written from the toilet. I'll just like dictate something, right?

Yeah.

Because you gotta get it then. Like if you're in the shower, most people, they have their shower thoughts right, where they get some kind of realization.

Yeah.

But then by the time they step out of the shower and they're off to go to work or do like, they forgot about their thing. And then by then, by tomorrow, it's like too late. Right.

It's done. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

We actually set up a little automation where we make these videos with our iPhone. They automatically go into a Dropbox. When they go into Dropbox, we use a tool called Zapier which sends it to Rev.com so in our Dropbox folder, there's the video with the captions and the transcription. So now just by recording that video and throwing it in Dropbox, we now have video content. We can rip out the audio, have audio content, and the text is automatically transcribed from Rev. So we have written content. And then we actually hired somebody in the Philippines. Literally, we did this the next day after leaving your workshop, we hired somebody in the Philippines to load that content on a daily basis for us into.

Facebook and Instagram cut story. I mean, so many automations. Now she's boosting our posts as well.

It's one person start them off at like three bucks an hour. Then when they learn how to boost posts and learn how to actually optimize get, you know, move them up to four bucks an hour, still nothing, right?

Oh, man, she's raking us over the coals. We're paying her six bucks an hour.

Six bucks. Wow. She must be pretty good. You can give her our training too, right? So she can level up.

That's. That's actually a very good point. Yeah.

How many VAs do you have?

Well, VAs as far as social media, we've just got the one. We also have an operations manager and we've got a customer support person and we've got a couple salespeople. But as far as VAs for like handling that kind of stuff from the Philippines, we just have the one right now.

Oh, man. Once you get past three VAs or four vascular, you start to tap into magic because then you have VAs that are managing and hiring and screening and training other VA's, right?

Yeah.

This one girl, she's amazing. See if she might be able to train up other people and then you could even, you know, provided that you're a sharing kind of non greedy person, you could kind of farm her out to some of your friends and have her, you know, set up their stuff and then hire a couple more people. And then she's managing a team of people doing this across your clients.

That's funny you say that because we were literally just talking today of how we're gonna start doing a lot more done for you type setups for things partially like. And use her as to farmer out. But this is perfect. Yeah, absolutely.

And then use our. So send me an email and I'll send you our VA hiring guide and our processes. And it has all of our canned notes on what we Send to our VAs at every step of the process. Then that includes our training too.

That's awesome. Thank you. We will.

Now I had one last sort of quick question I wanted to ask before we wrap up here. And it was going back to Facebook ads. When we went to the event, you gave some really cool tips. I remember one of the tips was when you post your Facebook ads, start using the feelings. Right. I'm feeling happy, I'm feeling excited. And it seems like that kind of helps give a little boost. Are there any other little quick tips, little quick hits that people can do that might improve their ads?

Oh, yeah. So the reason why you do the feeling like I like to do, feeling inspired, feeling happy, or feeling angry as my favorite emoticons that I like to use. You can use traveling too, or other activities celebrating a birthday. The reason why that works is that's the kind of thing that a friend would say as opposed to brand or someone trying to sell you something would say. So the more you can make your stuff not look like an advertisement, the more it's going to pass that initial screen. And that's why the one minute video shot on your iPhone will often outperform the $50,000 professionally produced cinematography kind of stuff that you see made, because that stuff is obviously a commercial. So let me tell you four or five things that fit in that same kind of mindset. Getting ads to work because it looks like something from a person. One is have it come from a public figure page, not your brand page. So it's your face, it's your name. It's not Joe of Evergreen profits, it's first name, last name. Two, set up a chatbot. We really like mobile monkey. And a chatbot will deliver messages and simulate what it's like to have a chat with a friend. If you have lightweight touches where you're not trying to sell, maybe you collect an email address, maybe you share a link to something you're simulating what a true friend to friend human interaction would be like. 3 Is you share photos with short little captions, not paragraphs and paragraphs of stuff. Four, don't use hashtags. This is not Twitter or Instagram. Right. Five, do not put links inside your posts because then it looks like a brand trying to promote stuff. Right? Have everything look as human as possible, as if a user had put it out there and then boost it to the people that you want to see. So that even though it's going to say sponsored in gray, which means it's an ad, if you have enough social proof where it says Matt and Joe and Christian like this, that's what people are going to see. And they're not going to see the little gray sponsored thing, right?

I love how you have to describe to us how to be human.

Isn't that funny? So people come to us for tech geek stuff and here we are telling them about social etiquette and then they come out of these workshops saying, oh my goodness, my mind was blown. It was amazing. It was all this like technical stuff about the algorithm. Like, no, dude, just act like you would with your friends if you were eating at the barbecue where they're slicing steaks at you. Act like you there.

Okay, now I have a quick follow up question based on what you said.

Is there a place for the actual brand page? Because you know, obviously Joe and I were business partners, so I have a personal page, he has a personal page, and then we have the brand page. So right now almost all of our social media content is going out through the brand page because that's sort of our combined effort. So I was wondering what your thoughts on that are.

So you guys are a two headed dragon. So you should have a public figure page for each of you. Don't be like those people that have Facebook profiles where it's like you can't tell us like there's two faces in the profile picture and you can't, you know what I'm talking about. Girlfriend and her boyfriend's there, but then they're both like equally in the picture. So you can't like tell who's like which one. Don't do that. Have one public figure page, which is not a profile. One public figure page for each of you and then you guys are sharing. Remember we talked about why, how and what. So that's top, middle and bottom of the funnel. You're going to share your why and your how content from your public figure page. The stuff that you're selling, which is the what, you're going to have that on the evergreen profits brand page. So you're going to sequence people there. You can remarket. We don't have time to really talk about how you set up remarketing, but basically people who watch video one or engage with a particular page, then tell them about this particular product or service or consulting or whatever you have. Right.

Makes perfect sense. Yeah. All the relatability stuff comes from the public figure pages. You do all that engagement, get them hot and bothered, get them interested in what you're doing and then you hit them with the egp, which is still our brand. But then that's exactly.

You don't send them straight to the brand page because that is a hard sell and there's no. You got to warm them up like you said.

Yeah, I love it. No, it makes perfect sense. That was the debate we had and we have to adjust a few things. But that's okay. We're pretty close.

Yeah.

Cool. Well, Matt, did you have anything else?

We covered so much ground. This has been amazing. Are you doing more of these workshops? If people listening are interested in maybe seeing you speak and diving deeper on this, Are you doing more of those?

Yeah, we have Workshops every month. Our next workshop, which you guys should consider coming, we'll give you a sweetheart deal. Is August 23rd, 25th in Phoenix at Infusionsoft's headquarters. It's three full days and you can find out about it@blitzmetrics.com workshop or you can go to teamblitznation.com and you'll see that we have a membership which is 1,59amonth. And if you get the VIP, you get to go to both of the three day workshops which are in Phoenix in person, hang out with our team. It's an implementation workshop, not like a conference. It's a mastermind. Plus we bring our people to help implement everything.

Love it. Yeah, no, you guys are the real deal. And anyone listening, definitely the workshop is worth every penny, even if you don't take up the VIP thing. But definitely do that because let's take a lot of weight off your shoulders. You're already doing enough. Dennis, any books or anything that you like to reference on an ongoing basis that you'd like to recommend here to business related or even if it's outside of business, something that inspires you?

Yeah, I'd say three of them. One is my good friend Alan Gannett. He wrote a book called the Creative Curve and it talks about how you build creative power and talent and ideas inside your organization at scale. And how creativity is not about some moment of genius, but comes through repetition, comes through imitation, comes through having mentors. And it really aligns with the way I think about how do you be successful instead of like Beethoven sits down at the piano and all of a sudden this masterpiece comes out. That's not how genius works. So it's interesting. The Creative Curve by Alan Gannett. Number two is the Standards of Excellence, which is by my co founder, Logan Young, which is how do you optimize and figure out whether your Facebook marketing is working or not. So if you've got lots and lots of ads, you've got lots of campaigns, got lots of creative. How do you figure out what's working or not? Which kinds of things should you kill versus tune up and keep it going and try to figure out if you can make it better and put more money against it. Or maybe it's just not working because it's the wrong audience. Or maybe the content sucks, but it's the right audience. How do you figure that out? And that's@blitzmetrics.com.

Which is for standards of excellence. Number three. My last one. I've read 4,500 books in the last 40 something years.

It doesn't surprise me.

I'm surprised that you actually know the number of books specifically.

I have apps to track these sorts of things and I've also done so much moving that when I hire people on Craigslist to move my boxes of books, they don't like that they're being paid 10 bucks an hour. But I've read a lot of books and I'm very picky about the kind of books that I'll read. The recommendation I'll make to you guys is Snow Crash by Neal Stephenson. And it talks about what the world looks like in 10 or 15 years where everything's automated and technology and AI is caught up to the point where everything can be for free because we figured out how to produce things at mass production at no cost. And there's now a currency. It's kind of like Woofy and Cory Doctor of Down and out in the magic kingdom. But people are living in the metaverse and they're able to engage. And you see how humans behave in a combined virtual and physical world. I view science fiction as entrepreneurs that are just too far ahead of their time. Entrepreneurs are like five years ahead of current reality because they have to bring things to market within the window that's just ahead by crossing the chasm. Early adopters, Geoffrey Moore. But science fiction folks, the good ones are 20 years ahead where there's. It's too early to commercialize something. And so the way I learned about marketing, about what's going to happen in business, I do not read business books. I think they're crap. I've read so many of them, I think they're almost all crap. Including the management consulting books I read. I'm very selective. I read certain kinds of science fiction.

And that's how I learned that makes perfect sense. And I love the analogy, the whole the sci fi being really far out there. Because I mean, yeah, we've talked to a lot of folks where they might talk to a guy yesterday, he was like, 10 years ago we were doing SaaS stuff. We were trying to do all these analytics and tracking and all that, but no one knew what a SaaS was tracking. It was like way before anybody was thinking about that kind of stuff.

There's more science and fiction.

Yeah, that's exactly what it was. And then this guy's, yeah, it's pretty amazing because now he's like, yeah, I see like old, you know, people in their 65, 70 years old talking about sass and he's like, what the hell?

Yeah, no, I Love those book recommendations. You know, one of my favorite books of all time was the Ready Player One book. And I actually, somebody told me once, if you love Ready Player One, you gotta pick up Snow Crash. You'll love that, too.

Oh, yeah. And every time you hear about a movie like don't wreck it by just because the book's always better and you hear that, right? And it's true. It really is true in this case.

Awesome. That's great, Dennis. And to wrap it up, blitzmetrics.com and blitzmetric.com workshop are. Those are the best places for people to go check out.

Actually, blitzmetrics, I'm sorry, teamblitznation.com is the best URL to go to.

Got it.

Awesome.

Cool.

We'll link that up in the show notes for sure.

Awesome. I think that's about it, man. Well, we'll definitely keep in touch. And you'll probably start seeing our faces more and more. Showed up.

I see your pixel on evergreenprofits.com so I assume I'm going to get retargeted.

There's a good chance. Yep.

You will. You will. All right, Dennis, well, thanks so much for your time and we'll be in touch here.

Cool. Thanks, Matt and Joe.

Thank you. All right. Thank you. And I hope you just enjoyed this episode you just listened to. Now, right now, before we sign off, I have a few things I would love for you to do. So the very first thing is to go find our guest on Facebook and tell them that you loved their episode with us. That's going to help them just feel good about themselves, but also it's going to spread the word a little bit more for us. Go find them on Facebook. Everybody's on Facebook. And go say that you love their episode and maybe one cool thing that you learn there. The second thing is to go to itunes and subscribe to our podcast. Just look up Hustle and flowchart and hit the subscribe button. And the very last thing, the third thing, is to leave us a review on itunes or wherever you're listening to this podcast and help us spread the word more. That's how more people are going to get this awesome knowledge, this, this cool podcast training and a whole bunch of other cool, free training that we give out@evergreen profits.com. so that's about it. Go find them on Facebook, go subscribe on itunes, and leave us a review. You, you would be amazing if you did that, but you're always amazing. So thanks for listening and we'll catch you in the next episode.

You're awesome.