Erin Pheil - How To Change Your Beliefs To Change Your Life

So a pattern is just. It can be emotional or it can be behavioral. Right. So it can be. We get triggered into feeling angry whenever someone gives us feedback, or we have a pattern of feeling anxious every time we're on camera. You know, like, that could be a pattern. It's an emotional pattern. So what happens is we have these different behaviors and emotions that we get kind of stuck in over and over and over. And what's really exciting is you can identify the pattern, you can work backwards and clear out the pattern once you know what it is you want to change. And when you clear a pattern and it's no longer there, it frees up so much possibility and so much energy in your life. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.

What's up, everybody? You're listening to the Hustle and Flowchart podcast with your boys, Matt Wolf and Joe Fear. Wiki, wiki wiki. We're going.

We are recording. Yes, we are. Red lights on. That means it's official. Watch what you say, Matt.

Never. I never watch what I say.

That's true.

You know why? Cause I can edit.

You have the last editing power.

But I don't edit.

Why not? Slacker.

No, I'm saying we pretty much never edit anything out of our shows. That's true.

Cause you're a slacker.

It's just because that takes time, and I don't want people to think they're not getting the whole package, so we give it as it is.

You give them the whole package?

I give them the whole pack.

The podcast. The whole podcast. The whole interview's there.

Yeah. It's a great package. Podcast package you have there.

Oh, God. All right. That went off the rails quickly, Joe.

Yes.

Oh, boy. Well, you told us your true beliefs.

Yeah, I did. We're talking about beliefs today.

You know we are. That was my segue. How do you know that was coming?

You're such a master at setting things up, Joe. No, today we're talking with Aaron File, and I really, really enjoyed this conversation. Like, she is a very fun person to have a conversation with. So what we're talking about today is how to get over, like, mental roadblocks that sort of get you stuck. And this isn't necessarily just unique to business. Right. These are, like, no mindset blocks for anything. Business, life, fitness, it's all the same concepts.

Yeah, right.

And she gave some real practical, tactical steps, like exercises that you could go do to sort of shatter existing beliefs that are holding you back in your business.

Yeah, no, she is, Aaron. And the three of us could have chatted like all night long because it's. Yeah. You can just see it's actually a really fun process. Even though if you do it a million times, like if you're a practitioner, maybe not so much. But it's interesting how Aaron describes these things that, you know, just hold us back in different things and typically it's some weird pattern that we're looped into and we just don't know why we can't get out of that. That thing.

Yeah.

So yeah, Matt and I were like, literally right before recording this episode, we were chatting about some things that were like, dude, why the hell are we not getting that thing done? Or these types of tasks. Like we procrastinate in certain things and it's like, oh, is that a perfectionist thing? Maybe. Oh, it needs to look good in the world because we want people to like us. Yeah. Probably at the end of the day.

It all stems from just wanting to be liked. Let's be honest.

Yeah. So like, obviously we didn't get, we didn't totally get to these answers. We've been doing a little post work. Yeah. Yeah.

Just to give a little more context. After this call, Joe and I have been talking for another hour and a half about the conversation that we just had because we started to like uncover mental roadblocks in our own business as a result of having this conversation. So you listen. Thanks Aaron. And we're actually a follow up call scheduled with Erin because she's freaking amazing and we're going to actually do some of this work that she does with her clients. We're going to, going to do it with her.

She's going to help coach us a bit there. So yeah, we'll likely report back with amazing things too.

Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, so you're just going to love this episode. You will. Like Matt said, this is a way to get unstuck and you know, just out of your, your own thing, whatever it is that, that thing, that rut, that pattern that, you know, cyclical thing that you're like, what the, like Aaron's going to get you out of there with questioning with these like this very, very simple. Basically her thing is like get you out of that. It's not difficult and it doesn't take long to do. So that's what Aaron's here to do and she's awesome and I think that's about it. I don't want to go too long with this because I think it's a great chat.

It hurts company.

Oh yes, sorry. It's mindfixgroup.com yeah.

So go to mindfixgroup.com she's actually got free videos and exercises that you can work through on there. If you want to hire her to get coached by her, that's where you'd go as well. So check that out.

Recommender.

We're taking notes on this episode, like we always do.

We are. And this will be another great one. So the notes, you'll get these for free. If you go to hustle and flowchart.com comp, that's hustleandflowchart.com comp for two weeks of this going live, you get this stack of notes for free. But yeah, it'll be basically Cliff Notes of this episode. You'll love them, definitely. Also, we have Ahrefs. Ahrefs are backing us because they're really cool people and they have an awesome piece of software that Matt uses usually a little bit more than I do. But this is Ahrefs. And Matt, what's the latest greatest thing you've been using?

Greatest thing that I've been using? Ahrefs.

First thing comes to mind. Go.

The first thing that comes to mind is like the. I think I've already mentioned it, but I'll mention it again. I'm using it a lot for PPC lately. I can actually go in there, plug in a competitor's website, and it'll actually tell me what keywords they're buying traffic to.

You're spying on them?

Yeah, so I'm kind of spying on what ads and what keywords they're going after. And then I can look at the actual ads they're run.

Running.

And me being egotistical when it comes to advertising, I'll go, I can beat that ad. And then I'll go and try to write a better ad against the competition. But no, that's one of the really cool features that I actually just sort of recently discovered. I don't know if they added it recently or I just was blind to it. Just recently discovered it. But you can go in there and type in.

A URL and it'll tell you if they're advertising on Google and what keywords they're advertising for. And you can actually see the ads. And so I'm going in there and trying to beat their ads. Do better ads.

Good motivation and sweet. Yeah.

But it also gives me, like all the organic keywords that I can try to rank for as well. And I can go. I do a lot of competition analysis, put it that way.

That's good. I mean, hey, they're kind of doing the prep work, you know, and then they're giving you kind of guiding posts, you know, like, cool, well, I'm going to beat you. Exactly. Yeah. Ahrefs gives you the cheat codes. I'd say that cheat codes. H or sorry, A H R E F S A H R ef s dot com. And they have a seven day, seven dollar trial.

One buck a day for seven. Buck a buck. Buck a buck. You should definitely go check it out for seven days at least.

I mean, why not? Yeah, seven bucks. Come on. Yeah.

Find out everything your competition is doing and crush them. Come on, crush them like the cockroaches that they are.

Get. Get them.

Go after them. Step on them and squeeze them into the ground. I'm starting to sound like I'm a vegan. I'm a vegan WWE wrestler. You got to get them.

Squash them.

Where are you squashing them at? That. That hand is.

I'm squashing him into the air, apparently.

I'm squashing my bare hand. That stinking competition.

You get them?

Yeah.

What gets you there?

Ahrefs.com.

That'S right.

$7 days.

Get Ahrefs best ad ever. Hashtag go. Share this everywhere. Ahrefs.

All right, let's go get our minds right with Aaron.

All right, Aaron, we're live. How you doing?

Hello. I'm. I'm good. How are you doing?

Great. I mean, I'm kind of jealous that you're in Colorado and it's. I don't know, it's beautiful up there.

But it's kind of nice. It snowed yesterday, though. I don't know if you'd be jealous about that. It snowed. It was snowing, kinda.

I like the weather. I mean, San Diego, you get a little spoiled, but I'm like, I'm bored of blue skies.

Yeah.

I know in San Diego, I get really excited when it rains because it only happens like 10 days a year.

That's true.

Yeah. Snow, though. That's interesting. Yeah, it's like scolding hot outside right now here, so enjoy it. But, yeah, no, we were chat. We had a good chat just now prior to recording, and this is the first time we've actually chatted, but we got hooked up by Lisa Buyer. So she was. I think her podcast just came out at the time of this. When this will go live a few weeks before, I think. Ish.

I don't try to claim, like, I know when episodes are coming out anymore.

But so people know who Lisa is and how awesome she is. And then. And she's like, Erin's next. You gotta chat with her. She's great. Her mind fix systems and all the stuff that you're doing out there is. She was just like, okay, this is great for getting people unstuck. And like, we're telling you, we're like, oh, it's funny because Matt and I just today we're talking about a lot of couple things that like we're individually and together stuck in. I'm like, oh, this is so timely.

So it's great to have you here.

Well, thank you for having me.

Yeah.

Well, cool. Let's dive into your backstory just a little bit. I want to kind of introduce the audience to you. So can you tell us like, you know, how you got into business for yourself, what you were doing before this and sort of how you got into what you're doing now?

Sure. So I am not one of those born entrepreneurs. Like, I never had the lemonade stand. I was never hustling candy in middle school. It never occurred to me. It just, it just wasn't on my radar. So I actually graduated from grad school with a degree in digital media. And the first thought was like, cool, I'm going to get a job. That's what you do. That. It was just what you do. And I moved to the mountains because I wanted to be able to snowboard. And I went to three web companies because there was only three at the time in the area. That was it. And all three of them were like, no, not interested. And that hadn't crossed my mind that somebody wouldn't want to hire me. Like, I'm brilliant, I have this master's degree, doesn't that mean something? And they're like, no, we're like two person company, we don't want to hire you. It's 2002. No, no. And I was like, okay, I guess I'm going to start my own thing. And so I started my own little one person web design company and within a year brought aboard a developer because I just did not like to code. And then suddenly there was a copywriter. And suddenly within a few years it was an agency. And we just grew like incrementally, very, very slowly. I had never really wanted anything big, but we became nationally ranked WordPress agency and had Fortune 500 clients, worked for well known startups, really great projects, good clients and good team. And then about 12 years into it, 12, 13 years into it, I started to go, I don't think I want to do this for the rest of my Life. The industry changed rapidly. Suddenly it was all about creating a pretty website. And then it was like, no, you have to have a mobile site, and you have to have social media, and it has to be Optim, and there has to be SEO. You have to have good messaging and good copywriting, and you have to make sure that.

There'S conversion, rate optimization, and, I mean, you name it, right? And everybody.

And the industry got so commoditized.

Your clients would want it all for much cheaper than what you could originally build a standard pretty website for, you know, 10 years earlier. And the, you know, competition went through the roof, and it became harder to differentiate, and it just. It just. It wasn't fun. It wasn't fun anymore.

Became more.

And yet I didn't know. I didn't know what else I could do. And.

So I stumbled upon this new direction totally by accident. What ended up happening is I was training for a mountain bike stage race, and I stepped off my bike and I had this little twinge in my ankle, and I didn't think anything of it was this little electric shock. But within a week, it grew. I could barely walk. I had pain. The physical therapists are like, there's nothing wrong. Within a month, it kind of like, crept up my leg, and then suddenly my shoulder was hurting. And then by three months, I'm going to all these doctors, and everybody's like, there's nothing really wrong with you. And so I suddenly became this person with all this pain. And I had been this athlete that I needed sports in order to, like, manage my stress. And it was part of my identity, living in the mountains, and it. It crushed me. It was absolutely devastating because I kept going to more and more doctors, and they're like, we don't know what's going on. We have no idea what's happening. So I started to. I mean, this went on for months, and suddenly, you know, one week became a month, became a year, became a year and a half. And I'm sitting around going like, am I ever gonna get better? What's happening? There's no, you know, MRIs, X rays. There's no explanation. So I started to get all sorts of depressed and anxiety and frustration and started to see this kind of like therapists, like, slash change agents. She called herself. I'm not sure, you know, something done in Denver.

Yeah.

And what happened is she was the one who introduced to me that it's not what's happening in your life that's so bad. It's how you are seeing it. It's how you're interpreting it that's making you so miserable and probably impacting your pain. And if you could actually change the lens through which you see the world, everything else can change, too. And I just. That kind of blew my mind, right? I think I've gone to therapy since I was a teenager. And she's sitting here like, it doesn't have to be this way. You can change. Change your lens, change your world. And I said, cool. How do we do that? And she didn't really have a good answer.

Come on, you left this hanging.

Left you hanging.

She. Well, her answer was like, you know, come back more often.

You're like, what am I going to get? Well, I don't really know. We'll keep talking about this theory, you.

Know, and it was kind of like, well, if you love yourself and, you know, have faith and stuff. But it was all very vague, and I was like, I need answers. I need a way to change my lens. And that's when I went off and tried to start studying myself of, how can I do this? And I started looking at the world of, like, how I know things up here, but I don't feel them here. Like, I know that I'm smart. I don't believe and feel that I'm smart. You know, like, if someone were to argue with me, I'd go, no, absolutely not. I'm smart. But behind the scenes, there's part of you going, no, you're not.

Yeah.

So I didn't know how to change, like, the feeling and the beliefs. So I started to study how to change, like, what you actually feel and how to change what you actually believe. And I study the work of, like, Morty Lefkoe and Lyon Goodman and.

All sorts of really incredible people who had been doing this type of work and figured out that, you know, it is possible to change your beliefs. And that's what led me towards the work that we do at Mind Fix. It really opened my eyes, and as I started changing, my world started changing and my pain started to go away, and I started to work with friends. And then I was like, you know, what if I took on a beta client just for fun? And suddenly it blew my mind. And they're sitting there going, like, this is the best thing that's ever happened to me. And suddenly I was like, maybe I'll take another beta client. This is the best thing ever. And I was like, whoa, I think I'm onto something here. And it lit me up so much to be able to help people compared to, you know, here's your website. Thanks so much. It's great that I was like, I think I found what I want to do the rest of my life. And that's how I stumbled upon mind fix work is having to go through this myself and realizing that you can help and change people without needing, you know, drugs and five years of therapy and all sorts of fancy self help techniques.

Well, that's just wild. It sounds like, I mean that just shows the power of the mind. You know, if there. It's literally that was part of a physical ailment that was debilitating your entire lifestyle and your physical self too. But then you started to fix it up here, up top, you know, and that it sounds like did that go away completely or it slowly went away.

There was never any diagnosis. They never said like what was wrong. They never said there was no reason for it. The scans and everything were totally empty.

So that's like. Because I've heard of those things. I mean, I can't remember but yeah, it's like a mental. You're just stuck in this belief or this like, oh, this is how it's supposed to be. I guess I'm hurt. So it's like, what is it like a loop, Right. That's going on and on and you just don't know how to get out of it.

Yeah, well, sometimes you can just be causing yourself so much stress that your body's like, you know what, I'm going to shut down. Like I can't keep doing this. You know, you're pumping up cortisol and your muscles just start.

Not liking you and so many parts get inflamed. Right. Because the stress hormones just keep getting pumped out. And that's entirely possible.

For what happened to me is that there was just so much stress and so much dissatisfaction that, that it just, there was so much. It was just a constant kind of inflamed state.

Yeah, I mean, I guess that makes a lot of sense because inflammation, I mean we've had some people on here, Theo Lucier was one of them. But it's like that can cause so many, you know, depressive, depressive tape elements or physical obviously health triggers and all that for tons of bad stuff. Yeah, yeah. And then, and then it's just. Yeah, it's interesting. So you have inflammation. So it's like causing this response in your body. Obviously your mental state is just like in this loop. So I guess mind fix give us like the quick like what's the overview? Like what you guys do there and then we can dig into some of these practical stuff.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. So at Mind Fix, we help people, especially entrepreneurs and high achievers, identify and then eliminate the biggest mental roadblocks and barriers that are keeping them stuck. And what that looks like typically is people will come to us and they'll have things like procrastination and perfectionism, difficulty setting boundaries, difficulty saying no things where it's like they've read the books and they've gone to the seminars, but they're like, why do I keep getting stuck in this pattern? And we're able to kind of come in, clear it out really quickly and then send people on their way. And they're like, I forgot that I ever dealt with that.

Wow, you already said some hot points on there. Like that completely trigger. I was like, yes, yes, and yes. It was like difficulty saying no check working on that. Procrastination. We talked about that. Like some of the most important tasks. Well, yeah, just till later. Like put them on a pedestal. They're important. So perfectionists. I know, I deal with that. So it's like, yeah.

They'Re so common.

I was just listening to podcast last night of a woman who runs an insanely successful, very well known business that's all that revolves around the science of happiness and helping people be happier. And it was fascinating because she has these really useful techniques, you know, like self acceptance and self compassion and gratitude and things that we've heard a lot about. And yet right in the middle of the podcast, she's. She was sharing her struggles with, her continued struggles with perfectionism and how much, you know, and she was saying that you can deal with it by being compassionate to yourself and give yourself self love. And I'm sitting there going, that is true. And you can really clear out that pattern so that you don't have to be dealing with the perfectionism on such a constant basis. You know, here's this incredibly powerful woman who's saying that she. It's still a struggle and it has been since childhood. But those types of patterns are things that we don't have to deal with for the rest of our lives.

Yeah, let's talk about patterns. And it seems like that's kind of really the root, right? I mean, so where would you start there? I guess, like describe some of these common patterns that you see high achievers struggling with and they might not even.

Yeah, as Joe and I sit here and go, yep, we have that one. Yep, we have that one. Yep, Seems pretty common.

They're so common. They're so common. Common. So a Pattern is just. It can be emotional or it can be behavioral. Right. So it can be. We get triggered into feeling angry whenever someone gives us feedback, or we have a pattern of feeling anxious every time we're on camera. You know, like, that could be a pattern, is an emotional pattern. Other people will have behavioral patterns. So someone might show up and say, every time I get on the phone and have a sales call, my behavior is I clam up and I can never talk about pricing. I can never bring up money. I just. Every time it's time to talk about money, I just. I go quiet and I change the subject. Right. That could be a behavior that's repeated. So behavior could be something you keep doing but you don't want to do, something you avoid, you know? You know you're supposed to do it, and you just don't do it. Like procrastination.

So what happens is we tend. When we sit down and think about it, we can usually come up with some patterns that. Where you guys are like, yep, I always do that. I always do that. We have these different behaviors and emotions that we get kind of stuck in over and over and over. And what's really exciting, as you can identify the pattern, you can work backwards and clear out the pattern once you know what it is you want to change. And when you clear a pattern and it's no longer there, it frees up so much possibility and so much energy and so much space and time in your life because you're not having to deal with it and push through the resistance. And I'm going to try and say it this time and stressing about it and different feelings, like, when it's gone, it's just not there.

Hmm. I don't know. That's awesome. Yeah. Because I know there's like, so many books, there's so many things, and, like, if it doesn't. It seems like if something doesn't resonate or like, you can do it for a little bit, but then you get out of that pattern. It's, I guess. Are these, like, habits, like, would you call them another term for habits or is that different?

No, it's. It's. We can have habits and we can have. But it's. It's not necessarily a habit. Like, it's not a habit that someone can't speak up for themselves, that they always clam up. That's not a habit. They really want to change it, and they try to actively change it, and they're like, I'm going to say something this time. I'm not going to let. So it's not. It's not a habit, and they're not. It's not an automatic thing. People will actually try to fight this, and they'll push against it, and they'll push the resistance, and it'll take energy. It's just. They're stuck in a way of being or feeling that that's. That's what a pattern is. It's not. It's different than just I eat popcorn every time I sit down, you know, and watch a movie.

Yeah.

Which is just a habit.

Okay, okay, got it. Wow.

Okay.

So then there's beliefs, and, you know, that's another element to it. Right. I mean, it seems like those would be tied pretty close to a pattern.

Exactly. And so what a lot of our work really revolves around is at the. At the core, humans behave according to what they believe to be true. Right. So.

If you're walking down the street and you see a cat and you believe that cats are dangerous.

How are you going to act?

I'm gonna bolt across the other side.

Of the street or something.

Get away from that thing.

Exactly right. And if you're walking down the street and you believe that cats are awesome and they're the best animals on the planet, how are you going to act.

A bushel of catnip and say, here you go.

Try to go pet it.

Have fun?

Yeah, sure. So we act according to what we believe to be true. We just don't always know what our beliefs are. But you can work backwards. So when you have a pattern, if we take this fundamental truth that humans act based on what they believe to be true, if you're acting or experiencing feelings in a certain way, you believe something that's keeping you looped in there. Right. There are beliefs because you act based on what you believe to be true. So a really a beautiful example of this is there was a woman I worked with who was. She did high ticket sales, and she was in. She had an emotional pattern where every single time she would not make a sale, it was getting to the point where she would almost have a panic attack. And if she would have, like, maybe she wouldn't close three sales in a row, it would almost be debilitating for her. Like, she couldn't work for a day or two.

Totally knock her out of the game.

Yeah, totally. Completely. And she couldn't do her work. And so the question is, if she's acting according and feeling based on what she believes to be true, the question is, what would she have to believe to be true? In order to be experiencing that. Right. So what we did is we posed that question, and when we worked backwards, we figured out she had a belief that what makes me safe is being perfect.

So imagine truly having a belief that what keeps you safe is being perfect. How are you going to feel when you start messing up and having three phone calls in a row? Then suddenly, in the context of this belief and the rule that we act according to what we believe to be true, it makes total sense that she's having panic. It's like A plus B, you know, one plus two equals three. It just. It makes complete, total sense. So suddenly this. I don't know why I'm acting this way. It makes sense. It totally makes sense. And when we dug in deep, what we found is when she was a child, she got beaten, physically beaten, when she would come home from school and her homework wasn't done properly, or she didn't have 100% on a test. So you go through that over and over and over and over and over through your life. A child's gonna come to the conclusion and, holy cow, makes me safe as being perfect. And so when you're not, there's gonna be this panic. Right?

Right.

So suddenly we uncover what one of these beliefs are, that we're keeping her locked in the same pattern. And when you can go in and you can clear that out and eliminate the belief, and suddenly she's a person who doesn't believe that she can go on phone calls and mess up and not do them. And there's no panic reaction. So there's no magic wand, and I don't know hypnosis, and I don't know how to, like, change people's brains like that. But when you work on the level of beliefs and you can uncover what somebody believes, that's keeping them stuck. So often you can actually help people get unstuck.

So once you sort of understand, okay, this is the belief that's keeping me down, what sort of exercises or things can I do? Like, once I've already identified it, which is probably a very difficult task, Seems.

Like a layered approach already, just to get that.

But once you've identified it, what can you even do about it to sort of work it out of you?

Yes, great question. So the first thing I want to clarify is, oftentimes, if you have a pattern, it's usually held in place by more than one belief. It's not usually like pattern belief. Pattern belief, you know, or you just pop a belief and suddenly the whole pattern, oh, there's only One belief about perfectionism and then it all goes away. Usually that cluster, you know, it could be one belief, it could be 15.

More. But. But I just want to make it clear it's not always just, yeah, it totally makes sense.

Yeah, yeah.

Just an hour ago, I was working with someone where there was one where he had this terror of being late. And we found out that based on how his dad had acted when he was younger.

He had the belief that if I'm late, people will not like me. And of course there was. He was always anxious when it came to being late. And it was a very simple kind of like one to one, got that and the pattern went away. But usually there's more beliefs than just one. So to go back to your question about what can people do once they find a belief? Like, how can you clear it? There are a number of different tools.

Certain people, it can be really challenging to eliminate beliefs for yourself. I'm one of these people where I have a very, very. I've been doing this for a while and I still have a very difficult time trying to do it for myself because the brain kind of puts up these defense mechanisms like, no, this is the way it works. So we're not going to allow you to change your beliefs. If it was super easy to change beliefs, we'd be train wrecks because we'd see a car drive by that's red and we'd be like, oh, all cars are red. Oh, wait, no, all cars are blue. Like, it's a good thing that it's not easy for us to change that easily.

Right, right, good point.

But there are, there are things that, that we can do. Oftentimes if you, if you state a belief like, you know, I am not smart or I'm stupid. One of the things that some people find is when you can challenge that and come up with other explanations or other, you know, the opposite, you know, kind of like the work, the work of Byron. Katie, it's like, is it true? Is it absolutely, 100% possibly, like absolutely the truth? Do you know that for a fact? Sometimes just challenging a belief like that, people can loosen the death grip that it has on you.

So it's like proving yourself wrong or right, I guess, in this case, actually.

Taking a belief and examining it and going, is it actually true? Is it the truth? Can I think of the proof that the opposite might be true? And I. They come up with an example of when I'm smart. Can I come up with lots of examples of when I'm smart and suddenly this truth feels a lot weaker. Another tool, though, that is really powerful. That is part of the work that I do with people, again, based on the work of Morty Lefkoe, is a really powerful question. So when you take a belief, let's say this fellow, I just worked with, the belief of if I'm late, people won't like me, which was causing him all sorts of anxiety. Anytime he was driving to any appointment.

One of the things you can do is you can go, where did I first see this in the world? And he was like, oh, every time my mom was late, he'd yell and he'd scream and he'd pound the car horn. That's where I picked it up. That's where I discovered it. So if you can go back to when you were younger and where you discovered where you picked this up, you can ask yourself this question.

Did I ever actually see.

If I'm late, people won't like me.

Did I actually see if I'm late?

Did you ever actually see it? And what you'll realize is you never saw that. You saw one angry man getting really upset with one woman on the planet. You saw one man reacting in a certain way in certain situations. You never saw that if I'm late, all people won't like me. You never saw that. You. You get very specific, like, no, I saw one angry teacher yell at me. I never saw that I wasn't good enough. No, I just saw, you know, a group of kids make fun of me. I never saw that I'd be unlikable by the whole world. When you can make the distinction. Because when we're kids, we. We make these, like, broad, general conclusions about these kids don't like me. I'm unlikable. But as adults, we can go back and ask ourselves, did I ever see this in the world? And when we're really honest with ourselves, we'll realize we just saw a very specific situation. We never saw what we concluded as kids. And oftentimes that when we realized we didn't see something, it's like the belief in Santa Claus. When your parents are like, honey, you never saw Santa Claus. And your brain's like.

That was a mall Santa. Those were boots. Those were Dad's boots. And, oh, my God, that was a picture of Santa Claus. That was a painting. And suddenly your brain's like, I never saw Santa.

Then it's like watching the Sixth Sense the second time around.

It totally is. And you don't unsee things. Right? Like you. You can't go back. You can't watch the Sixth Sense the way that you saw it the first time. That's what gives you the different lens that the therapist at the beginning, when I was, you know, she's like, you need to see the world differently. When you start stripping away these beliefs, you get the different lens and you see the world and yourself in a totally different way.

Yeah, it's interesting. It's like once you have this belief, you almost have, like, blinders on to the sort of information that's contradictory to your blinders. Right. It's like the confirmation bias is like you're only looking for the things that confirm what you believe. But you know that person that you're talking about, there's probably many times where somebody was late with him and he didn't hate the person. But you totally ignore that fact. Right?

Absolutely. That's exactly what it is. We always say that a belief acts like a pair of glasses, where it's like you just see things a certain way. It's the reticular activation system that just always looks to confirm what you already believe. So it's not like, when I'll see it or I'll believe it when I see it. It's the opposite. Like, it really is the opposite of that. So if we take a simple example, and if somebody has. If I have the belief I'm not likable, and somebody walks by me at work and doesn't look at me.

Confirmation, proof.

Proof. Right. So if we go in and we clear out, I'm not likable, and that belief is gone and dissolved. Okay. And rewind. And then that person walks by me again and doesn't see me. I'm like, what the hell?

What the hell? Are they having a bad day? Like, it doesn't occur to me that it has anything to do with me. And that's a hell of a lot of internal struggle and stress that just doesn't show up anymore.

It feels so much better. Yeah. It's like, goodbye, anxiety, all that thought.

Right, Right. And so the world just. You experience it in a different way, which is really powerful because then your life automatically is different instead of having to read books about, okay, how do I cope with people who don't like me? What's the technique? And what do I need to tell myself to make myself feel better after I get rejected? If you just don't feel rejected in the first place, then you don't have to deal with additional coping mechanisms on top of it.

They're all symptoms, it seems like, to the belief, like all these books and things, not all of them, but a lot of them. Most of them are solving or curing a symptom that, come on, it's just like covering it up with, you know, some drugs or whatever for a deeper issue that you really got to address.

You don't have to quite practice the amount of all the tactics and strategies and self acceptance and I'm okay. I'm okay. Which are all important tools and need to be used and. But it's just not the constant, ongoing. I have to do this.

So it's a lot faster, a lot easier, a lot stressful, less stressful. Yeah. That's really cool. Is it? I mean, so, yeah, I know. A lot of big. Yeah. A lot of these things take repetition. You know, it's like a lot of, like, okay, every day you got to do this. This mantra, these affirmations, whatever. I mean, in this scenario, it sounds like it's asking yourself kind of the same questions around just different beliefs that you identify over time. And then you're, what kind of proving yourself wrong. And then, you know, test that. Maybe test it in the world. You know, toss it out there and be like, oh, I'm still feeling a little tinge of something. Okay, I gotta work on that. Like, are there experiments that people can try like that?

Yeah. Yeah. So what's interesting is if you have the belief, right, that I'm not likable or I'm not lovable, and what we'll do in a second is I'll share the tests of how somebody can tell if they actually have a belief, because that is tricky. It's not as obvious as you think.

Wow.

But if somebody has a belief I'm not likable or I'm not lovable, then you're gonna have to do a lot of affirmations to try and tell yourself, I'm likable, I'm lovable. Right. Over and over and over and over. But you're fighting a belief that's there. That's exhausting. It's really tough. So if you just get rid of the belief and then you tell yourself, you know, I'm likable, I'm lovable, suddenly there's nothing there that's fighting it, and it can be absorbed. And you don't have to do it constantly. It can become part of who you. Without the resistance because you're not fighting it. So.

The.

Process, like when we work with clients and we take them through a very simple question process of clearing a belief, one of the things we have to do is confirm, do you have this belief or not? Right? And it's tricky because up here we can totally disagree with something down here, right? You can be a professor and know that you're smart, but underneath you're like, fuck. But maybe somebody's gonna figure me out. Like, kind of imposter syndrome. So how can you actually tell if you believe something to be true? You can run it through a couple different filters. There's ways, there's. There's easy ways that anybody can take a statement like, I'm not good enough, which is like the most common belief of all time, and run it through a few filters to see do I believe it? And here's the thing with most beliefs, unless it's something like, I am a female, I am a male, I am X years old. It's not like 100% of us believe it to be true. If I fully believed I'm not good enough, and I'm stupid and I'm not important, and mistakes and failure are bad, I'd never get out of bed in the morning. So this up here goes. That's ridiculous. I don't believe that. Absolutely not. You know, my prefrontal cortex, my higher brain is like, no, that. Don't be silly. But what we're looking for is, like a little part of us back here in the back of our brain, some little 2% of us that believes it to be true. That's that piece of sand in the oyster that causes the irritation, and it creates the problems and the resistance that we fight against. So what we do when we go, do I believe this? It's more of like, does some part of me believe this to be true? And we go hunting for, like, the little part of us that believes it so we can pluck that out so the resistance goes away. So the way that we can tell if some part of us believe something is we take a statement like, I'm not good enough. And the first filter we run it through is, does it feel true at all? Like sometimes people be like, yeah, it feels like. Feels like the truth. Kind of like feels like, my name is Aaron. Yep, got it. And it's that easy. Like some beliefs are just that easy. Like, uh huh huh. People are just nodding their head. Yeah, I believe that.

You're like, wow, all right, there you go.

When you're. When. When a statement doesn't really pass that filter though, and it's like, no, I don't think so. I don't believe that. No, of course I'm good enough. What you can do is you can take. Take a statement, say it out loud, and you can check, is there some emotion that I feel when I say it? Some people will go, like, I'm not good enough. No. Makes me kind of sad. Makes me actually really anxious to say that. But I don't think I believe that. But if there's some emotion, again, it's. Some part of you is, like, grabbing at it, Right. And then some people are actually really cut off from their emotions. I don't feel emotions. A lot of men, especially, it's like, it's not safe to their beliefs. It's not safe to express emotions. It's not okay to express emotions. So they're like, no, I don't feel anything. But, man, there's a tightness in my chest. There's. There's some physical response. It could be like, my throat closes up.

Yeah.

Feel some tension. I got some goosebumps.

Feel chest thing.

Yeah.

In the past, and certain things I forget what. But yeah, definitely, though, like, I.

Right.

Tent in your stomach. Like, you know, kind of like the butterflies are like an anxiousness tightening down there. You're like, what the hell did that come from? What was that thing?

So if you. If you make a statement, like, okay, let's see if I believe this. I'm not good enough. Ooh, I feel weight in my chest. Some part of you is grabbing at that. Some part of you is like, yes, that's true. And you can always compare, like, if you say something absolutely ridiculous like, I am a scarecrow.

There's. There's no emotion. There's no physical reaction in your body. It's just words. And so that's how you can test is. You can see. Does it feel true? Is there any emotion? Or do you feel it anywhere in your body? And if you do, it's likely that some part of you, some little part of you kind of believes it, that it's causing you some challenge.

Interesting. Wow. Okay, now I just kind of want to go around, like, I'll just catch myself tonight, like, asking myself random questions with, like, a notepad, walking around like a crazy person. Like, oh, that felt weird.

I thought you were about to say, I just want to go through all my problems and have you tell me what they are.

No.

Got way too many. Matt.

Yeah.

We don't have enough hours.

Oh, my God. I mean, I'm just thinking this is. This is like a big piece of. This is. You know, when you're feeling great, you can get more good shit done that you really want to get done and stop the self sabotage of this weird loop that you're catching yourself in when you're like, but I am good. And like, that's a, that's. I think that's the battle I know that I face a lot is like, I'm totally capable of this thing, but why the fuck am I procrastinating? Why do I keep pushing that off for like five, like a whole week or two when I. It's just gonna take me like an hour.

Yeah, that's a common. Joe and I were actually having that conversation before we got on this call about how the things that we feel are the most important that we do as quickly as possible are the things that we push off, even if they're not difficult things.

Yeah. It's weird that we both share that. So I don't know if like there's like.

But they're individual things too. That's what's interesting.

Not the same things.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. They're different things. So it's. But it goes back to some of these beliefs that we just got to tap into and identify.

There are, I mean, there are beliefs. Sometimes it's like you may just not like to do it right.

Might be a big piece of it too. It's like you're deleting sometimes.

It's like, I just don't enjoy it. It and you push it off. But if it's something where you're like, I really, I'm committed to doing it and I want to do it. What you would want to do is go, okay, let's slow this down right before. If I, if I say, okay, we're going to end this call and you're going to go do it right away. You're going to go do that task that you're putting off. What you want to do is almost like compress and slow down time and be aware of what are the thoughts that start showing up. Because the thoughts that show up are going to give you clues to what you believe. Because we only have thoughts based on what we believe. So if you. Again, we go back to cats are dangerous. What thoughts are you going to have? I'm in danger. This is not. Okay. Okay. Well, we can work backwards from thoughts. So what we often want to do when we're feeling stuck is write down and notice what are the thoughts that I'm having. And things may bubble up like, I'm not going to be able to do this well enough. I'm going to mess it up. It's going to take too Long and you can start finding out you guys may have the same pattern for totally different reasons. The list of but this, but this, but this, but this may be totally different for you. And it would lead to totally different beliefs. Which is why it can be tricky sometimes to do this work with groups is people can have the same challenges, but they're powered by different beliefs.

Yeah.

Yeah. And I 100% like the two of us. We'll chat and very similar patterns. But I believe the beliefs underlying those are probably totally different or different enough where it's like, yeah, this is an individual thing, but. But it's interesting that it's like the outcome's the same or pretty much pretty damn alike. Yeah. I don't know. It's kind of trippy. And that's literally just like an hour or two before chatting with you. It's like we're doing all of our research, reviewing our notes, and I was like, holy crap. I think this interview is like perfect timing.

Usually. Always is.

So you take something like procrastination and oftentimes it can be like, it can be. There's so many different routes. And with working with people over the years, you can. We'll find that sometimes it can be a perfectionism thing. Like if there could be beliefs if I make a mistake or fail, like something bad will happen. Or it could be a competence thing. Like I'm really not that competent at it and I'm not capable of doing this. And so it's like, I just don't. I want to push it off. So I don't because I don't want to feel bad about myself, you know? So it can, it can be completely different beliefs and patterns for different people.

I know for me, one of the beliefs that I hold on to, and I was actually talking to Joe about this before the call, is that I get all of my best work done after like two in the afternoon. Right. So I think a big reason why I push off, like the big, big tasks is I always tell myself I'm in most in the flow, like at 2 in the afternoon. Right. So I'll just push all the big tasks to later in the day for that reason. I don't think Joe has the same reasoning because Joe's more of like an early bird, wake up early and get shit done person. But I know that to me is like, I'm like, I do my best work in the afternoon. So. So the biggest rock of the day, I'm going to do it in the afternoon.

Is it true? Do you actually get your best work done at the end of the day.

I think so. But, but saying that it's, we were talking about it almost in the context of it's not the best. I wish I got more done in the mornings, but for whatever reason, I can't get into flow until the afternoon.

Got it. Well, I mean, for you, it's almost like there's resistance to what is. If you have figured out that that's when you're at your peak and that's when you perform your best. Like what I hear you saying is almost like, I wish I was like him, you know, And I, instead of honoring that, that's when you do it. And it's not a procrastination, it's more of a strategic timing thing for you.

Yeah, I would say that's true. But then also the issues that come with that are if I push it out till later in the day and then other fires pop up, then that biggest rock that needs to happen doesn't get done.

Yeah. And then it keeps getting rolled down to the next day into the next day and. Yeah, yeah. So interesting.

I agree with you though. Like, I think that's what I'm trying to do is go, okay, this is when I get my best work done, so let's put the most important thing there. But then often that leads to that thing getting pushed out further and further and further, which is why I, I, I've always wanted my brain to work in a way where I could get up at 7 in the morning and get the hardest thing done first thing in the morning. I just, I don't know, I guess I'm not wired like that. Or maybe that's an erroneous belief, I don't know. But that's, that's definitely one of my roadblocks is pushing stuff out further and further. And, and I've always thought I was just kind of rationalizing while I was putting why I was putting it out. But you know, maybe it, maybe there is a reason to the madness. I don't know.

Well, it's entirely possible that your pattern, you've figured out and acknowledged that when you're in your peak performance state and you have a specific time where you're like, this is when I do my best work. So I would say that your pattern is actually when there are fires that are coming up, it's not protecting that time and allowing yourself to get sucked into some of the small things instead of saying emails off, phone off, everything off. And I'm going to focus on this Right. And so the question would be, if I suggested you started doing that tomorrow, what's some of the thoughts of like. But, but, but. But some of the worries that might come up and we would play with those. Because what you believe. There's something that has. You believe that taking care of the fires is more important than taking care of the big rocks that you're saying is the most important work.

Yeah, no, that's definitely true. I think you're pinpointing it pretty well. Is that I let other things take over the priority in that window when I should, you know, keep my word and focus on that thing.

That's a good point.

Yeah.

So, like, the chats, like the calls that we have usually in the afternoons. You should probably move in the middle of the day after I get my best work done and then you can hop into yours. I mean, hey, there's some common ground here.

I like it sounds smart.

I like what you said, Eric, too, is like, you didn't try. You didn't suggest, like, hey, go change your patterns and go earlier. Or like, hey, I don't know, test out middle of the night, see if that's even better. But no one's bugging you then. But yeah, it's like, no, like, sink into what's working for you. Because I feel like a lot of us will resist our natural just carry traits, I guess, like innate things that are in us. And it's like, yeah, we're all wired differently and lean into it.

When you find something that works, like, stick with it. There's. I mean, I was in a coaching program and they're like, it was definitely a badge of honor to have a lot of work done by 10 or 10:30, you know, and to have all of your sprints and to have your whole day open up. And I think that's fantastic for the people who that works for. And it may be most people, but there are people with different circadian rhythms and who truly are in flow or they're night owls. And I think it can be tough trying to fit everybody into the same box. Like if, you know, timing wise that you work better later, if you know that you're not the type of person who's in flow at certain times of day. How cool is it to just to build it, to have the luxury of being able to build your schedule around that.

Yeah. Oh, my God, it's totally true. Well, just like. And again, it gets back to like, freedom. That's like the feeling of just like, damn, this feels good. Like, I don't have to worry about this pressure. Like, oh, I have my flow at 3pm but, like, you know, that's not normal working start hours or whatever. You know, like, it's almost like you're just giving. Your. Taking yourself off the hook. You're just like, chill out, bro. Just work with him. But, like, you know, don't let others seep into that time. For sure. Yeah, that's cool. No, I just like it. Yeah.

So, I mean, another thing I want to talk about too was imposter syndrome, because, you know, the audience of this podcast is a big entrepreneur audience, and I feel like that's a pretty common thing among entrepreneurs. I know I still suffer with it. You know, like, we'll go to. We'll be asked to speak at conferences, and I'll look at, like, who else is speaking, and I'll be like, you want us? Like, really? Why? You know, I still. I still have that, and I know.

I've talked about it quite a bit.

So I'm sure that's a pretty common thing among listeners as well. So let's talk about that a little bit because I know that's something that you help people through as well.

Yeah. So if we go back to our magic question of what would you have to believe to be true to feel like you're an imposter? A lot of times what we find is, it's. It's quite simple. It's, I'm a fake, I'm a fraud. I'm a phony.

I have to have X amount of education or degrees or certifications in order to be able to teach someone.

Or I have to.

Have X in order to be real, you know?

Yeah.

I would say, like a. An example in our world, I would say would probably be around earnings. Right. If I'm looking at the stage of people we're speaking on, I'll be like, those people all make way more than I make. Why do they want me? Kind of thing. I know there's a little bit of attachment to earnings with the imposter syndrome. At least with me. I mean, we don't make nothing. We make enough money to live in San Diego and live okay. But I look at a lot of times when I have the imposter syndrome, a lot of times it's tied to the amount of money that that person makes.

Perfect. And so what we would do if we're working together is we'd go in and we'd poke around and we'd find what the belief is, is that if I'm not making X. Or.

If I'm not making X amount of money, it means I'm not an expert. Or if I'm not making as much as X people, it means I'm not an expert. Something as simple as that. Think about it. If you have that belief, like someone's worth or someone's expertise is based on how much they earn, if you have a belief like that, then of course you're gonna feel self conscious, right? Of course. Whereas I was just talking with someone. His father is a radiologist and he says he makes the least amount of money out of everybody from his graduating class. But he lives in Vail and he mountain bikes like five days a week and he skis in the winter and he has this rich family life. And it's like, is he really actually an imposter? Because his bank account is not as big as some of his other peers. Right. There's other possibilities. But if you hold on to if part of you, right, we're talking that little 2%. Because up here you're like, I know that that's not. It's not all about money.

It's the grains of salt.

But if a little part of you, that little grain of salt, sand, or that little 2% back here is like, no, like, your worth is determined. You can tell how much of an expert someone is, or your worth is determined by your bank account or your annual income. And of course you're going to constantly be feeling less than and you're going to constantly be doubting yourself when you go to. When you're asked to speak. And so it makes sense that you would feel that way. If there's a couple of those beliefs there, you clear out those beliefs and then you just walk up on the stage and like, hey, I got some stuff to share with you guys. Yeah, well, it's funny because, like, anxiousness isn't there.

I was kind of laughing at. Not at Matt's beliefs around this, but, like, I was thinking of how Matt would, like, completely abolish these beliefs, like, instantly is like, you know, oh, yeah, this guy might be making a lot of money. You go to some training or something around something you're an expert in, like traffic or podcast, and you're like, wow, that's all bullshit. Or like, I'm way better than that. Like, that strategy was good. Five years, I don't know. And like, you would see all these proof elements. You're like, oh, I'm good. Okay.

Yeah. But it goes back to what we were talking about earlier. Like, you sort of try to confirm what you believe. So I don't know if I would see those things.

I guess not. With the money thing, yeah, you're right, because that's a different element.

And so what something like a mini exercise that could be done is kind of thinking back to where you picked up when you were younger that someone's successful or someone's worth is based on how much they earn. Right. And you'd want to go back and close your eyes and kind of sort for, where did I pick this up? Where did I learn this? And you'd bring up the memory in your head, and then you could ask yourself that question of, did I actually see that people's success was tied to their money? No. I saw my mom talking about how that person was so amazing because of how that's all I saw. I saw one person talking about how amazing one other person was, and that's where I picked it up. And it breaks apart the strength of that belief. So that's. That's a mini tool that people can use on themselves. Again, I have a very difficult time trying to get rid of beliefs, but a lot of people have success when they realize they never actually saw what they think they saw when they were younger.

Yeah, that's interesting. Okay, I get it now. Yeah, it's. This is interesting. And then I wanted to bring this up because I wrote it down. It was from our pre chat, but Solomon's paradox. Yeah, we brought that up because there's a lot of things that we just can't see in ourselves. And I think you wrote that down too. So I don't know if this might be a good way to bring this up here now.

It's perfect. So Solomon's paradox is this psychological concept where it's really difficult for us to coach ourselves or to give ourselves advice or to help to get our own selves unstuck. So we may have a problem. And we're like, I can't figure this out. Now, if our friend came to us with that same problem, we'd be like, all right, here's what you got to do. You're going to do A and B and C. It's so obvious. So much easier for us to be able to give advice and support and help other people. And so one of the ways to get around this paradox is to take your challenge or your problem and literally imagine that one of your friends is having it and really take it and put it in the third person. Okay, so Susie is going through this and she's. Oh, God. It would Be so obvious. Like, suddenly when it's somebody else and you're out of your own head, it can be easier to actually see things from a third person's perspective. It's easier to coach yourself or to give yourself advice or to think more objectively. It gets you out of your head. So trying to circumnavigate or just get around this paradox, it's not. It's an easy technique anybody can do is just put it into the third person and see what shows up.

That's interesting. Yeah. It's literally. It's like, make that completely separate. I know what. There's, like, the observer, I think when you get to, like, you've done a lot of meditation and really you kind of start to see yourself with your eyes closed, whatever. It's kind of that. Because I know I've experienced that, and it's. That's just sitting quiet, but I guess you can kind of do that. Here is like, all right, here's that thing. Here's that ball of things that this character. Like, I'm just gonna check out my mind for a bit, totally pick it apart and be like, oh, that's interesting. Like, why the hell is that person walking around with that baggage? Just chill out.

That's cool. Would you recommend things like journaling or some, like, exercise or modality to do this or get people's minds thinking this way?

I think it can be useful for people to.

Sit down and think about where they get stuck, where, if they had a magic wand, what is it that they'd like to change? What is causing them resistance or friction or frustration as they go through their work week or their home lives? Starting with the patterns can be useful because there's. We're made up of millions of beliefs. And if it's like, you can go eliminate a belief or get rid of a belief, great party trick. But you want to use this as a tool to really change one's life. So the way to think about it is, what would I want to change about myself? Is it that I beat myself up every time I make a mistake? Is that I get nervous every time I go on video? What is it that I want to change? And then I can ask myself, what would I have to believe to be true in order to keep experiencing this pattern over and over and over again? And you can start to come up with a list, and you can literally be journaling and sitting there going, like, wow, I believe that if I make a mistake or fail, I'm going to get rejected. I believe, like, I really am nervous that people aren't going to like me if I'm not perfect. And you can start, you can start creating these lists that are impacting and creating your patterns. And you have this incredible insight into what previously seemed like a mysterious way of being or feeling. And it makes sense. It makes so much sense. You're like, okay, it makes sense why I am this way. And then once you have your list, you can start to, you know, you can work with someone else or if you're one of the people that can get rid of their own, you can use one of the various techniques out there to try and clear out those beliefs to get yourself unstuck.

Wow, that's so cool. I actually wrote a little like or drew a little doodle here. I was like, you just reminded me because it's like this pattern, so it's like a loop that you're stuck in our patterns. But then you have these little clusters, these bubbles that are beliefs. So the more you're popping those bubbles, the faster you are to getting a better pattern down there.

Absolutely.

That's cool.

Absolutely.

I mean, that's interesting. I hope I'm one of the folks that can change themselves, but just on demand. But we'll practice.

Cool.

So I guess let's chat about what you have and how people can go find you. I think that would be. Or what do you offer specifically where if folks are looking for help or they're having a hard time doing this for themselves.

Sure. No, we're looking at building out different programs that'll allow people to do this on their own. And in the meantime, we are offering just one on one programs. We used to do really extensive, high ticket, big, you know, three six month packages and then, you know, Covid. So.

We'Re offering like a variety of different options for people to work with us one on one and be able to dip their toes in the water and see what it's like and start to experience how quickly change can happen once you eliminate patterns. So currently we are. Everything is still one on one. We have a free video training that kind of helps people understand. That helps people understand the differences between thoughts and emotions and beliefs and how they all interact. And that's available on our website, which is mindfixgroup.com.

Sweet. Okay.

And there's a Mind Fix group. There's a Mind Fix Facebook group where I'm sharing different tools every once in a while and giving people some insights into things they can do. But in terms of working with us right now, it is still all one on one. Even though we're offering much lower packages and making it a lot easier for people to work with us.

Sweet.

And if somebody did want to inquire about working one on one, they can do that@mindfixgroup.com as well.

Yes, sir.

Okay.

Nice.

Yeah. Well, we'll post the links in the show notes like we'll find the group and link it up as well. Direct people there. I'll go find it as well and join. I'm sure there's a lot of cool stuff. This is cool. So you mentioned a book, the work by Byron. Katie. Are there any other. Is there like another book that you'd recommend that you find so impactful? You just recommend it often.

My mentor is Mark Waldman and.

He does neuro coach and so he has a number of different books and ebooks out.

I blanking off the top of my head, but he has a lot of work that is the latest research in neuroscience that helps people kind of manage their emotions and get through their days with more ease. And like, shall I share? Because I know you guys are big into strategies and tactics. Would you like to hear like one of the cool, like two of the cool things?

Oh, absolutely.

Okay. So these I've learned some really awesome stuff. So I've been in conversations with him and we're going back and forth and back and forth and he'll finally be like, stop. Like people can only hold about seven pieces of information in their head, like plus or minus two, you know, you can't, I can't talk at you for 15 minutes and then say, okay, repeat back to me and you're going to remember like.

You know, five, seven things I said. So one of the really cool exercises that he has people do is he says you kind of drop into a state of mindful awareness. And then when you're talking with someone, you limit, you talk very slowly and you limit the amount of words someone can say to about 10.

So the converse, you can, you can put a maximum on the amount of words that people can say and it changes the conversation. People have to be mindful. They have to think about what they're going to say. And then suddenly you can have somebody rambling at you for 20 minutes and they're like, right. And you're sitting there going, uh huh, sure. So it's a really fun exercise to have deeper, meaningful conversations with a spouse, with a partner, with a. Between you guys. You could practice it, you know, for five minutes.

We're practically spouses. So yeah, pretty much that's true.

So that's been a really fun exercise to play with. And the other thing, one of the other really cool tactics that anybody can use anytime is the secret of mindful yawning.

Oh, I've actually. I've started doing this. I read Dan Brulee's Breathe book and. Yeah. Expose. This whole, like, relaxation technique is yawning.

And it's not just yawning. It's. It's mindful yawning. So it's actually bringing awareness.

Thinking about and fully experiencing what it's like to have a yawn. Because it's actually like a thermoregulatory mechanism that cools down the excitatory parts that are going on in your prefrontal lobe so that it brings you into a state of calm. It actually calms down the excited parts of your brain that can get going. And if you can do, like, three mindful yawns in a row, it can change your brain state. So he recommends two to three times an hour, taking 10 seconds, 15 seconds, and doing a few mindful yawns or starting a conversation with the other person where you're both doing a mindful yawn. And it can totally be a game changer for people. People and helps people manage anxiety.

It's like a mini quick meditation, like a instant.

Yeah. It's like, matt, let's go.

It interrupts the busyness of your. Of your frontal lobes. It's pretty cool.

That's cool. I remember in the. In that book I read, it was like, yeah, it might be a little awkward to just start yawning in, like, you know, a meeting that you're sitting in. Maybe you're a little stressed or, like, maybe someone's telling you a bunch of stressful stuff, but you're just trying to, like, chill out.

Yeah.

So you're like, okay, I could be. It's like, what do you not care about my problems? Are you yawning or you're like, no, chill. I'm like, I'm doing this for you.

No, but that's interesting, the yawning, because I've done it and it works. I haven't done the three in a work, but yeah, mindful, where you actually, like, feel it all the way through. It's like a reset button. It's interesting.

Totally cool.

What was the name of your. Your mentor again? I missed that.

Mark Waldman.

Cool.

Write that down there. Sweet. Those are great hacks. Thank you for sharing. You're all bonuses.

You're welcome.

Well, sweet. Well, mindfixgroup.com and we'll link everything in the show notes again. Aaron, this has been super cool. Thank you.

This is fun.

Thank you for having me.

Thanks so much for tuning into that episode. I hope you dug it. I know Joe and I dug it. I actually kicked Joe out of the room. He's not here right now. Because I wanted to tell you about a tool that I really, really dig. We use it in our business. We recommend it all the time. It's called Easy Webinar. And it's a tool that lets you do live webinars, automated webinars, hybrid webinars, and, you know, pretty much any other kind of webinar, if there are other kinds of webinars. But anyway, this tool is kind of like your all in one, do it all tool for anything webinar related. It's Easy Webinar. It's put out by a dude named Casey Zman. He's been on the podcast. If you haven't listened to that episode, it's a killer episode. He's a really smart dude, but his software is amazing. It does everything. It's, you know, the title tells you exactly what it does. It's an easy webinar platform. And we use this in our business to run automated webinars all the time. We don't do a lot of live webinars these days. We like to do the kind of automated webinars where somebody can register and then it, you know, they can either watch it like 15 minutes later or they can watch it the next day, but it's just kind of, kind of always running. And it's a system that helps us make autopilot sales off of our webinars. Super cool tool. If you haven't tried it yet, you know, it's an amazing tool. And Casey is actually hooking you up. He said for listeners of Hustle and Flowchart, I can't believe he's doing this, but he said for listeners of the Hustle and Flowchart podcast, he's giving 25% off of the membership. To use Easy Webinar. It's already super, super inexpensive for what it does and also the cool features it has. But he's hooking you up with 25% off because you're a listener of Hustle and flowchart. Go to easywebinar.com hustle. That's where you can get that 25% off discount. That's easywebinar.com hustole. It's a awesome tool. You're going to dig it. So just Go grab it. Check it out. Easywebinar.com hustle See ya. No, not see ya. You'll hear me in the next show. I don't know. I don't know how to close these things. Go get Easy Webinar. Talk to you later.

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