Jason Moffatt — How To Live Like You're Permanently On Vacation

Welcome to the Hustle and Flowchart podcast with your hosts, Matt Wolf and Joe Fear.

Hey. Hey. And welcome back to another podcast. And this one is gonna be good. Got Facebook Live cranked up to the left of me, so who knows what kind of shenanigans are gonna happen? And we got the. The one and only JMO on the line. Jason Moffat.

What's up, fellas?

Hey, yo, yo. So, dude, I don't know how long ago we first met. I know it was at Frank Kearns, one of his seminars, something back in San Diego. But back then we're like, dude, this guy's a nut job. He's got a sombrero on. He's drinking some crappy skunk beer Corona, but he's kind of cool. We got to talk to him.

So that was at ten o' clock in the morning.

You know, I was.

I was actually trying to get the.

Hard Rock Hotel to let me bring a donkey and a mariachi.

Sounds pretty accurate.

Yeah.

They would not go for it.

I can understand the donkey, but why not a mariachi band?

I don't know.

Yeah, dude. So since then, I mean, just to kind of preface to everyone, we've stayed in contact, we've hung out, it's been more or less just around surfed. We've what, stand up, paddleboard. And now this guy has gone on adventures all around the country. And off to Maui now and an.

Epic water park trip.

That's true.

I think we floated through one of Matt's, like, urine pools in the. In the lazy river or something too.

It got pretty warm.

Yeah, we got video proof of that too, somewhere.

Not the urine pool. Video proof that we went to the water park.

Okay.

So. Yeah. So, Matt, what are we doing with this thing, huh? What are we going to talk about today?

So, you know, the. The whole theme of the podcast is obviously automation, processes, systems, basically figuring out how to keep a business going while working less and less and less. And we kind of felt that, you know, Jason, he's, you know, he's out living the life in Maui and he's still running a business. You're still surfing all the time, aren't you?

Yeah, dude, I would probably commit suicide if I wasn't doing that.

So, I mean, you must have some. Some very simple processes in place to make sure that stuff keeps working while you're out kind of having fun.

Well, I've always been simple, mostly because I don't know how to do a lot of difficult things. And so it always seemed to me that building elaborate Businesses was kind of a headache. And I've always been of the school. I'd rather make a couple hundred grand a year or a few hundred grand a year by doing very little than by working all the time to make 4 or 5 million. I know I could make that kind of money just doesn't seem all that appealing. Healing what you need to do to be able to generate that kind of income. So I've always been one person to really focus on the things that I want to do in life the most first, and that's usually surfing or meditating or yoga. Now hanging out with the kids, and then to create a business to support that lifestyle. And when I break down the balance sheet of how much money I need each month to live the ideal life that I want, you know, it's not that much money. So why spend all my time working if it's going to get in the way of the things that I truly want to do?

Yeah. So I guess run us through. I'm actually ironically looking at a picture of Maui on the. Blown up on Matt's wall right here. So that's. That makes me feel good. It's like we're there, but because you've got. Since the time we've known you, I think you've had a house in La Jolla that seemed expensive. It was big. You had an rv, massive RV that you went around the country. And now you're. Now you're in Maui. So I guess how do you set these goals? Do you actually make an official sheet that you figure out your income goals, or is it just kind of just go for it?

I have.

Over the years, I've kind of.

But I've created such a simple life.

That it really isn't all that hard to achieve any of that stuff. And so, you know, the houses and.

All those kind of things.

My budget has always been around ten grand a month. So all I need to do is make that. So, you know, if I'm selling a program, it's $1,000.

You know, per sale.

I need to make three.

One of those sales every three days to be able to afford that lifestyle. You know, it doesn't make me any more. But so I've kind of simplified it really down to that. I think it was from one of Frank Kern's presentations where he walks you through your perfect day, and then you create all your goals and what you want your day to look like and figure out what that would cost you. And it was actually a really interesting thing to equate everything into Ebooks.

If I want to buy that new.

Surfboard, I don't say it's $800. I'm like, oh, that's 16 ebooks, dude.

Well, it makes it a lot more, you know, manageable, I guess. You know, I mean, we do the same thing with our newsletter that we're sending out. It's like, if you focus on one thing, I mean, maybe you have a couple things, but focus on one thing and just figure out, all right, I gotta. We gotta get two people in per day to make whatever lifestyle we want, you know, ain't. Ain't that bad.

Yeah.

So, you know, and things have changed.

Dramatically for me in the last two years, being that I, you know, have a new girlfriend. Not new now. Lindsay and I've been together for about.

Two years, and she has two children, one of them having severe autism when.

He moved in with me. So business, everything took a massive backseat when that happened. And, you know, I basically dumped all my money and basically my whole life into that.

And so, like, any processes or the idea of taking it easy and being.

The slacker surfer bomb has kind of.

Been thrown out the window. And, you know, I'm keen on hearing the future podcasts that you guys have on this because I need to kind of get back into the flow of, like, working more often. But that just makes me cringe to say that. So I want to be. I want to be up to date on how to automate a lot of these processes and stuff, too, and.

Good. Well, dude, I mean, I don't think we even told you the name of our podcast. It's a Hustle and Flowchart podcast, so it's.

Figured he'd like that. But, yeah, I mean, like, it's.

It's.

I know you as the hustler. I kind of feel like I've always had that in me too, is just grind for clients. And then I've always had the lifestyle business, so it's like, yeah, when. And I've typically been around the 10k mark as well, per month. So it's like, you nail that with a few clients. For me, I'm good, you know.

Yeah.

And to be honest, for. For quite a few years, I kind of got stuck in that client trap where it's easy to kind of go to the. Well, grab a few CL clients and, you know, make. Make ends meet for that few months, and you could kind of coast or whatnot, and. But then you got to go back to the client. Well, if you're not selling all the time and what I found is, you know, those clients were great, and I would make, you know, really good money from them. And but at the end of our three month or six month stint or whatever we would do, I would look at it and be like, well, great, I made this guy a bunch of money, or this woman a bunch of money, like I was supposed to, but.

I'm not getting paid any longer.

That's right.

And so I was like, man, what can I do that would enable me to get paid? And so I stopped taking so many clients and instead started taking on partners. And now I have about eight partners with eight different businesses. And one thing that I learned through this process, I've tried this a lot, and sometimes it's worked, sometimes it hasn't. And I've noticed that the times that it hasn't is because I've partnered up with people that have a lot of the same entrepreneurial traits that I do, and a lot of us have the same ones. And if you've ever taken the Colby assessment analysis, like the assessment A, I'm a 5, 1, 9 4.

Which means.

On the 1.

It'S on a scale of 1 to 10, I'm.

A 1 when it comes to follow through.

Horrible.

It's amazing that I even made it onto this podcast.

I was going to say you were made on time and everything.

I'm actually a very punctual person.

I think it's rude to not, but.

I'm a nine when it comes to quick start.

At first, I was kind of demoralized by that score of being a one when it came to following through. And obviously we all have to follow through at some point on some things. But instead of beating myself up over it, I realized, you know what, I should just spend almost all of my time in the quick start mode. So when I started partnering up with these different people on these ventures, I had to start realizing I need to partner up with someone who's diametrically opposite.

Of me on that Colby assessment analysis.

Otherwise, I'm going to find someone who's like me. They're idealistic ideas. Great. We brainstorm and mastermind all this stuff, and then it just sits on the drive and nobody does anything.

Totally.

Yeah.

And so once I got clear about that, I started noticing the processes and the flows and people knew their place a lot better. And, you know, I'm really hoping of these, like, eight projects I got going.

On, I just need one of them to, like, crack 10 mil and then I'm going to. And I'm going to throw my computer.

In the trash.

And throw my computer in the trash and just live off the land.

I want to have a personal assistant. I'm still going to collect email and all this stuff. And, you know, I'm on the Internet, but I want to have a personal assistant who comes to my property every.

Day with, like, a big biblical scroll and he unrolls it and he reads.

To me everything off the Internet.

I love it. Trump did this today. You have this many email subscribers. Wasn't that, like, that's. It's weird because we're. And I think you, out of everyone I've known, you've been the most, like, liberated from technology, but you've always had it with you. You've worked remote everywhere. But, like, that's kind of the goal. It's weird. It's like, get back to nature. At least for me. I constantly think of that. Like, I just want to hang out, read books, hang out with my friends, kids, when they come around, you know, when I get them, and chill.

Yeah. I mean, some of the best times are when you're, like, out of the country and you can't get cell service, and then you're pissed off about it for the first, like, day, and then at some point, you toss your cell phone in a drawer and don't think about it for a week, and then you tend to have the best time after.

That sounds amazing.

But, yeah, it sounds.

Like you've got a pretty good sort of system process for your own business. I mean, the fact that you go around and you find other businesses, you help them get started up, and then you let them kind of take it from there, I mean, that in itself is a pretty good sort of system or takeaway that. That people that feel they might have similar traits to you could take away from this.

It's brilliant.

So. And part of the thing, what I.

Teach in my niche, famous course, is, you know, I've been online doing this for a long time, so I've developed an audience. I have, you know, a wide variety of skills from. From copywriting to. I wouldn't call myself a web designer.

But I'm proficient in pretty much everything out there. And where I'm not, I'm connected with somebody who does everything out there. So there's nothing that I'm not tapped into into my network. And so there's a lot of entrepreneurs out there that have fantastic ideas or fantastic products, but not the network that I do. And so for them, it makes a lot of sense to partner up with me and to tap into that network because, you know, 50% or 30% of a whole lot is a lot better than 100% of nothing or nil.

That's right, man.

Ye basically built a platform. I mean, one of the things that, you know, you look at someone like Tim Ferriss, and one thing that Tim Ferriss has done really, really, really well is he built this platform of millions and millions of listeners for his podcast, and now he just brings somebody on his podcast, and that person basically becomes famous overnight. You know, they. They borrow that credibility from. From him, and they're, you know, they're everywhere. Everybody knows who they are after they've been on his show. And it sounds like you're kind of taking a similar approach. You built that platform. You spent the time, the energy, the money to. To build the cred and the platform you have now, and now you're kind of leveraging that platform to help people get started and gain some initial traction.

Absolutely. If I only had the work ethic of Tim Ferriss.

I would be able to, you know, 100 exit like he does.

Did you guys. Did you guys see him on Jimmy Fallon last night?

No.

It was.

Mike Myers was on, and that was hilarious because him and Fallon worked so.

Well together being Saturday Night Live guys.

And then, yeah, then Tim Ferriss came on and, like, started doing some acro.

Yoga with Jimmy Fallon and spinning him around on his feet.

Dude, I just looked it up. I have to watch it after this. Love it.

Yeah, the nice thing about all the Jimmy Fallon and Jimmy Kimmel and all that kind of stuff is they all end up on YouTube the next day.

So it's already on there.

Yeah. Yes. Same thing with Conan o'. Brien. I remember when he moved over to tbs, I was actually considering, like, tapping into.

Like, seeing if I could get them to tap into his crowd. And like, imagine if Conan can get his audience in the email. Oh, yeah, imagine they all opted in. And then imagine if Conan actually, once a week or a couple times a.

Week, emailed his list.

We all think about it, and I don't know who it is for you guys, but everyone has a handful, or maybe it's just one or two or three people that when they email you, the name just sticks out and you.

Read it every time you have to.

Yeah.

And all of us are so swamped.

With a thousand people emailing us that.

It'S kind of hard to deal with email. But there's always those couple that you read no matter what. If Conan did that.

Well, I'm looking.

At his page right now. He has 4.69 million subscribers on YouTube alone. And I never do it, but I was at my dad's place a couple weekends ago, and he was listening to Howard Stern, and they were actually talking about Conan specifically and how he's actually trying to look for a new contract if he's going to go TBS or strictly actually on YouTube because of the amount of subscribers alone, he could demand all that attention and then money, ad dollars, but.

Wow.

And I was thinking that exact thing, and they actually were even saying. They're like. They started talking about email lists on Howard Stern, and then I was like, oh, this is great. And. And they were like, you know, and Howard's like, I don't get it. And then, like, they explain it, and he's like, holy shit. That's a lot of people. Okay, I guess that makes sense. Now. He could demand a bunch of money. But, yeah, so Conan, I don't know. That's. That's kind of a unique thing. That's mainstream, and we might see him just create his own network. You know, he's. He's his own brand.

Well, I mean, you know, Seinfeld kind of did that, too, with his riding in cars with comedians. He's got. You know, he's on Crackle or whatever. And.

No, he just signed a thing over.

I think, with Netflix now.

Mmm. That makes sense. There you go.

Yeah. I think HBO missed out big time.

You know, there's a book I read called.

I think it's called the Battle for Late Night. And it was when there was all the drama between Jay Leno and. And Conan, when Conan got the show, and then they were taking it back from him. You know, he was just demoralized.

And that book was so amazing. It was just really going behind the scenes of NBC and showing, like, how.

The, you know, all the CEOs or all the management and such was, like.

The inner fighting that was going on, how Conan was really getting screwed over. And Conan's actually always been one of my favorite people. Coincidentally, him and I have the same.

Birthday on April 18th.

Crazy.

And. And we're. He's 12 years older than I, too, so he's a rabbit on the Chinese calendar. And I've always felt, like this kindred spirit connection thing with Kona. Like, I could literally finish that guy's sentences. I know all his jokes.

I know all his, like, body movements. Yeah.

Do you have the dance down the.

Yeah, do the string dance.

Yes. I love it.

That's awesome.

No, Conan's. I followed that guy since I Was in probably, what, middle school or something like that, like, way back and then old school.

Yeah. Now coming back to processes again, started to, like, completely shift the focus. But I'm just curious, when you said you're partnered up in about eight different companies, what sort of criteria do you look for when you're about to partner up with somebody? I want to give, like, the listeners some. If there's people out there that are listening, that are like, I want to do that. I've got some knowledge, and I'm a good, you know, good starter, but I'm not a good finisher.

Or the other way around. Maybe as analytical or the other way.

Around, you know, what sort of advice? What do you look for, when to find a good fit for that?

For me, I just look for someone.

Who can follow directions, to be honest, because what we do is not rocket science. I mean, we create offers, we send traffic to it. It either works or it doesn't. And if it doesn't, we tweak and we just keep doing it. It does not take a genius to become successful in our business. What it takes is somebody who's persistent and who's willing to, you know, maybe mess up or, you know, or run.

A few tests and not work and not give up and just do something different. And if everything fails and whatever, you go and do something else. So for me, it's just about finding.

Someone who's persistent and is willing to.

Take the crazy ideas that come out.

Of my head and help me, like, help me channel those, like, into tangible content or to get offers up or whatnot. And so that's mostly what I look for, because it's all dependent upon where your strengths are. And it's really hard to know who.

To partner up with if you haven't.

Really done that deep analysis on yourself and kind of removed your bias. So you're not thinking you're strong in a certain area. You're knowing where you're strong, knowing where you're weak. Probably even more importantly now, do you.

Go in and if you're about to partner with somebody, do you require they go and do the Colby assessment first?

Lately, I have. It's been. It's been a great thing.

Sometimes I can tell just by history.

Of what somebody's done. I mean, if you come across somebody and they have 300 podcasts, you're like, whatever, that guy's a finisher, you know?

Right.

So I think that kind of assessment.

I also, you know, I have probably.

20 different niche idea businesses as well out there. I Can't do them all.

And so I'm more than happy to throw somebody on to that type of.

Business and I'll give them my time.

Even if someone doesn't match up with me perfectly, I'm still willing to take.

A chance on them, you know.

So I require a pretty hefty investment to do these partnerships. And the way they do it is I'm like, hey, it's a hefty investment.

Down payment.

We'll split the business 50, 50. I won't take a dollar of the profits from the business until that person.

Has gotten their complete investment back.

That's cool. Yeah.

And so then it's a mutually beneficial thing.

I'm supporting them in every way that I can. And then if people fizzle out and they don't do what we're supposed to be doing, which does happen, at least I got paid for the time that.

I was investing in that project.

Oh, that's really smart. Now, is there a specific type of business model you go after? Is it pretty much all info businesses or is there like, you know, various types of businesses?

Most of it is info businesses, but I started a recent one, a new.

One recently called the Brand Emporium, which is at the brand emporium.com the website's still probably not about halfway done.

But, you know, I've had success selling.

Domain names over the last 10 years. Not a lot, but sell a domain here or there for 300 bucks, 1500 bucks, 10 grand.

And so I decided, wow, instead of just selling the domain names, what if we sold the complete brand already ready to go?

They got the domain name, they got the Twitter, the Facebook, the Pinterest, all that stuff pre populated, maybe had a WordPress install with some essential plugins and analytics.

And we create these brands around niches.

That, you know, there's affiliate programs that match.

So all the person has to do.

Basically is just start creating content. Everything's created for them. So, you know, a lot of people are intimidated by setting all that stuff up.

Or some people, you know, struggle with even coming up with a cool brand name. So like, wow, what if we have all that stuff already ready for you? All you have to do is start making blog posts and pitching stuff for sure.

Now those domain names and those various brands that you have, was that kind of a good timing thing? You got those at the right time, or is that, is that something that you actually kind of have, like a system for that you're constantly looking for, that kind of thing?

Well, I'm always kind of, I'M a digital asset hoarder.

So you know, I'm sitting on tons.

Of websites, tons of domains and such. And you know, obviously domain names now they're not, you know, all available, so.

It'S hard to find a domain that's all available.

So with brands though, you don't always necessarily need to have names that make sense.

You can be like Bucksley or you.

Know, or Startup way.

Yeah, yeah. Or use a.IO on the end or you know, there's so many ways nowadays to kind of tweak that word and do a little misspelling and you know, it's not as good as the normal.

Spelling but you do what you can.

So I think, you know, if you're a creative person like me, you can sit up all night on GoDaddy or use a few different domain tools and come up with a ton of great domain names.

Right.

And so I don't think it's the domain name so much that's worth the money. It's then once you, you know, if you can get that domain name and the pictures, Twitter.

You know, Instagram, Facebook, if you can get them all matching, you know, get the Gmail account, all that which will attach to the YouTube.

Then that name has significant value.

I love it. Yeah, you're creating a brand. I mean you're kick starting a brand, your strengths and maybe you have a partner, maybe you don't. You know, you could throw that thing on. What's that, what's that website?

Flippa.

Flippa, Yeah, I mean that's from back in the day when we used to do something like this too. But that or just go after partners.

Yeah, there's. I have a great partner, JT on the project with me and so I'm really stoked to have her on board. And you know, Flip is an interesting site. I don't see it yielding.

The kind of.

Fees or the kind of prices that maybe like a sea do sometimes or GoDaddy auctions is good afternoon as well.

But Flippa Flippa is interesting in the sense that, you know, for people who, you know, they're just trying to hustle, you know, maybe they're not trying to.

Bang out ten grand sales or fifty grand or something.

Sometimes you can buy a domain on GoDaddy for 8 bucks and sell it.

For 80 on Flippa, you know, it's.

Not, it's not a ton of money but it's 10 times what you bought it for.

There you go. It's arbitrage. I mean you get something that, yeah, build Some little hype behind it and boom, you got some money.

For sure, for sure. Now what, what is your main sort of business model now? Because I know you're doing these partnerships but you also have a bunch of your own courses and things online. What's, what's sort of the bread and butter for you that's paying the bills right now?

My niche famous course.

Niche famous course?

Yeah. So I mean I have a few different things. I have a copywriting course, I have a quick money hacks for people, you know, that just need to scrounge up some money to make rent or whatnot, kind of an intro stuff. And I have an email marketing course.

So I have a bunch of different.

Internet marketing courses that cover a lot of the different things we do. But the niche famous course is definitely the thing that, that I should be promoting it a lot more.

And I plan to. I actually just finished the module 6 yesterday. It's a 92 page E book and.

For somebody who struggles to finish things.

I will felt so damn good publish on that. I was like oh my gosh.

But essentially I consider it a, a modern day version of how to win.

Friends and influence people.

And if you look at the kind of the state of where Internet marketing.

Is, it's very difficult.

It's gotten so much harder because there's no shortage of talent on the Internet now. Any niche you go into, there are massively proficient, massively talented people that you're going up against. So you can't just come in with a mediocre product anymore and think that.

You'Re going to somehow start making a bunch of money. So what I noticed years ago and.

What a lot of gurus you'll see.

Are talking about, I've noticed a lot.

That do the predictions at the beginning of the year, they talk about personalization.

In your business is what really matters nowadays.

And so in the niche famous course.

It'S exactly what we teach.

We basically, you hear the cliche phrase get. You need to get people to know like and trust you.

Right.

Well, other than the book how to win friends and influence people, who really teaches that?

It's a good point. And that's a money book, man. I think everyone should read that one and then read yours, the updated digital version.

Yeah, I mean that book is timeless, it'll be forever applicable. But I think a lot of us take it for granted and just kind of assume, oh yeah, I know that. But how many people spend time to actually work on their authenticity? How many people spend time to really, you know, craft their stories into a metaphoric, like a therapeutic metaphor that helps people get from one place to the other through those stories. How many people really work on the way that they communicate with others and building friendships or just sometimes just saying happy birthday to somebody?

Yeah.

So I really go through like step by step of showing people how to not just give lip service to know like and trust, but to actually take the actions so that people can instantly like, oh yeah, I know, I love that guy.

Yeah, I totally would buy from that guy.

Not too many marketers do that.

People in general don't. And actually something we wrote recently in our Evergreen profits letter was a section I wrote that basically kind of gave people a lot of ideas of how to stay top of mind with anyone you want. And it's exactly what you're saying. Like instead of Facebook commenting on some freaking 50 comment thread, happy birthday, send them a text message if you have their phone number. If not, PM them because immediately you're cutting through all that clutter that's out there.

Yeah. So I actually teach a lesson like that in my niche famous course too where.

I do something and it's obvious that it's done for it. But I have a video where it's like we're having a one on one.

Date and I'm cutting you cake and.

I'm pouring you beer and I post that. People absolutely love it. In fact, Mike Hill from the owner of the Internet marketing super friends group, when he saw that video of me, that's how I got on his radar. We became friends. We've been friends for years. Joe Polish does one where happy birthday. Yeah, he's with Richard Branson, Tony Robbins, Happy birthday. But even yesterday, one of my partners, Jake Doocy, his girlfriend's birthday was yesterday and I got the whole family together and we all sang happy birthday and sent that in a text to her. She was like, that video made my entire birthday, man.

That's awesome.

Jake's a cool dude. I met him before too at Amisha's place. He's a smart kid, man.

Dude, he is the smartest guy ever. And I'm surprised amician take he did.

For a little bit, but I don't know what happened.

I knew Jake was going to be a winner the first second I met him. And he's just relentless. And the goodwill that he spreads to people. And I was just like, man, somebody should take that guy under their wing and do everything because he's going to be a massive multi millionaire.

No doubt.

And the only reason I didn't partner up with him early on is because I liked him so much, and I knew that I sucked at finishing things. I was like, I don't want to take upon something so special and not.

Be able to finish it, Screw it up with it.

Yeah, you just hope that he can run.

So, to be honest, I believe in Jake so much that I am devoting more than 50% of my time to.

Jake's business more than mine.

Wow, dude. Well, yeah, do it. I mean, that's. That's partnerships. It's evergreen income. You know, once you get your thing up and running and maybe a big buy. I mean, knowing him, he's a brand, like a Tony Robbins guy that'll just be around for a long time.

Absolutely. And so.

And I like the idea.

After doing this for a dozen years.

And stuff, I actually enjoy being able to get away from being the guy.

In the spotlight, on the camera at times, you know, and so I'm conflicted.

Sometimes I want to be the guy in front of the camera, and sometimes I just want to be the guy pushing buttons.

Hey, being famous comes, you know, comes other consequences, man. It's like, would you rather be rich and famous or rich or famous? You know, it's. You got to pick your. Choose your battles wisely.

I'd rather be rich and nobody know me.

Hell, yeah. All right, so we're wrapping. We're getting close to. Because we try to keep these kind of concise. About 30 minutes or so, we'll have another bonus section where we can extend the conversation another, like, 10 minutes or so right after we stop this. But what's one question that I guess we should be asking that we haven't asked yet or someone should ask you?

Someone should ask me.

Oh, man.

Could be crazy. It could be out there. It could be whatever, man. I like this.

Could be where to find that mushroom that makes women orgasm as soon as they smell it.

You're a mushroom dude, so you would know, right?

Yeah. So it's rumored to be in Hawaii, and I been hunting all over for it, and I have not found it. I have found that it is just.

A rumor, though, and it's not real. Oh, man.

Come on. That's good. Stay on the hunt, my friend.

Well, where can people go and find out more about you and your products and what you're up to?

But back before that, too, I think the one thing that I would say being serious is so many people work on their business and doing things to tinker on their business, and when you look at almost all the successful people Particularly in our industry and in other industries. To me, I noticed one thing in common with almost all of them and is that they all have some kind.

Of background in personal development.

And that focus was more important sometimes than the business, and it made the business so much easier. And whether that personal development came from a landmark forum or Tony Robbins or from your church or wherever you get that, I feel that that fuels people to be successful way more than the time spent in the trenches learning SEO, learning copywriting, learning all those other things. I feel like those things kind of come naturally to the people who spend a lot of time in the trenches.

Doing the personal development.

And I leave it up to you.

To decide what that means.

But just as long as you're growing as a person each day and you're noticing it and other people are noticing it, I think that your business stands.

A dramatically better chance of success than just kind of being a blah, blah, same old, same old dude.

Got it, man. That's so true.

And that's. That's definitely a trend we've seen as well.

It's principles over techniques or tactics. You know, principles last through everything.

Totally.

All right, Matt.

So. Oh, yeah. Where can people get you.

Where can. Where can people go and learn about you and your stuff?

I. I guess the best way would just go to nichefamous.com I have a.

Seven day free training series.

We cover each of the modules each day. Kind of give you a sneak peek into exactly what it is. And yeah, it's nichefamous.com total freebie giveaway.

And if you guys want to invest in a full course, you can, you can do that or you can learn a whole bunch too, just by watching the free content.

And that free content, I'll just say, is badass. And you always keep it interesting. So if you're just looking for just learning, learning a handful of things and getting a good laugh, I guarantee I haven't seen this new niche famous stuff, but I mean, come on, I know you're not changing much.

You're very. You're very good at blending entertainment with education.

Hell yeah.

So what do they call it?

Infotainment.

Infotainment. Infotainment. All right, man. Good chatting. Thank you.

All right, brothers.

All right, man.

Thanks.

Peace.

Hey, thanks so much for tuning in to this episode of the Hustle and Flowchart podcast. Now, if you don't know already, myself and my partner, Joe Fear, every single week we put together this killer weekly newsletter that's completely free. If you go to theweeklyprophet.com you can get on this weekly newsletter. And what we do with this newsletter is we scour the Internet.

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