Marx Acosta-Rubio — Why Some People Are Successful And Others Aren't

Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.

What's up, everybody? You're listening to the Hustle and Flowchart podcast with your boys, Matt Wolf and Joe Fear. Hey, Joe.

Hi there.

How you doing?

Doing great.

What is that sound?

I'm havening.

Oh, yeah, that's what you're doing now?

I'm tapping.

God, this could sound really bad.

What's so funny, man?

Why are you doing that to your arm? That's just really awkward looking. That' havening or tapping. Okay, what are we doing today here?

All right, we actually have a fourth time guest.

Yes, that is correct.

So this is Marx Acosta Rubio, who we're talking to today. And we did one prior call with him where we kind of got his backstory and a whole bunch of, like, mental sort of hacks that you can do. Mindset, cool stuff. We brought him back when we interviewed David Allen, and we also brought him back when we interviewed Dr. Steve Rudin. And now he's back for a episode just with us interviewing him. And we had an amazing conversation. Like, this was just such a fun conversation.

We were literally just saying. We're like, how do we title this episode? I don't know. But you know what? I'm thinking about it now. I think at the end of the day, this conversation was all about the pull and push that we all experience in life. This kind of. We might feel a disconnect in things when we're consuming content or when we're being told, quote, unquote, what to do or what we should do and, you know, not really understanding, okay, what's right for us. Or why do I. Why do I always just get halfway through a book and then stop? Or why do I never listen to this podcast or implement anything? Or I listen to it but don't implement anything. Or I'm a seminar junkie, spend thousands of dollars to go to traffic and conversion, but I don't do shit with it. Like. Yeah, why is that? Well, we talk about that.

Yeah. To really sum up like. Like, the big overarching thing of this thing is, is essentially like if you went to a conference and you sat through the conference and you took great notes and you had the same resources as everybody else in the room, same amount of money, same connection, same network, why is it that a very small percentage of that room will actually go and implement this stuff, and a very large percent of that room will never, ever, ever take action or do anything on it, and we really, really, really deep dive and dissect on why some people will consume information get really, really excited about it, and then never do shit with it versus why some people will consume a ton of content, get really excited about it, and just make stuff happen.

Totally. Yeah. I'm going to say, and I think I said this on. On the air. Well, this is a long podcast, by the way, so don't be deterred by it. You know, even if you can, only if you can listen to this in chunks, it's worth it because I'm not gonna lie every time I talk to Marks. And thank you, by the way, Dan Ryan. I know you're Dan for introducing Marx to us and.

But I'm glad you said that. He'd be offended if he didn't get mentioned.

Of course, Dan's. Dan's fragile ego. You know, I'm just kidding. Happy Dan. But every time I personally talk to Marx, I feel like I just, you know, I knock up a few more freaking IQ points or emotional intelligence points.

I was wondering where you're going with. You knock up a few and then.

Of course you would. Okay. But I just feel smarter every single time. And there's a reason for that.

You understand a little more about how your brain is working. Like, you get these little insights every time we talk to Marx about, like, that's why my brain is doing that.

Some new switches flip every time we talk to him about this is how we're wired.

Sure. And it felt like the conversation kind of goes all over, but that main concept is what we chatted about. This pulling this tug and back and forth disconnect feeling that you might have. And for me, after listening to this, it's empowering. It's something that where you understand yourself a little bit further. At least I understand myself further. And you can let yourself off the hook for certain things, or you can ask better questions. You can figure out your purpose and your interests and all these things and then figure out what is your life. Actually, yeah, I told what your life is.

I finally got the answer to one of my biggest questions in life around why people like Jiu Jitsu so much.

Well, Mark's time we know.

And it has to do with grabbing guys balls.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

Okay. I won't go there.

That's why Aaron Fletcher likes it too. So. Hey, Aaron, I don't know if you're listening.

He's turning into a roast. All right, all right. So before we get too off track, this is already a long episode. Don't want to make a long episode longer. We are actually doing a special webinar With Marks, if you go to hustleandflowchart.com Marx M A R X. Yep, that's hustleandflowchart.com Marks. We're gonna do a special webinar where he's actually gonna walk you through some mental mindset exercises. So go check out that URL. Depending on when you're listening to this, we may have already recorded it. So you may be able to tune in live or it may be a prerecorded one that has already gone out. It just. It depends on when you're tuning into this. And he also has a really cool audio record recording that you said really has had a big impact on your life. I haven't heard it yet, but there's an audio recording that he said that you had a big impact from. We're going to throw that in and give that to you as well. When you register for this upcoming webinar, it's@hustleandflowchart.com Marx. So go there, get registered, get that free audio, and you're going to. We'll give you more context around this audio and what we're going to talk about on the webinar once we jump into this call. So let's just jump over and start talking to Marks.

Marks, you're back. How you doing?

Hey, guys. Thanks for having me.

We're on video this time. I think this is gonna work better with you on video. We don't always do it, but we just know it'll flow well.

It's got a good connection to me, too.

Yeah, no, this is perfect. So for anyone who hasn't talked to you before, listened to you or anything, definitely. I would probably pause this. Maybe not pause this, but listen to the previous episode. Six months ago or so is what we did. Maybe longer.

Probably longer. Yeah.

Yeah. Deep dive into the brain. How you know the interesting things you've done, but also the interesting things you've studied. And I think that is what' really been fascinating the most. Just all the books behind you. Were looking at your bookshelf, and I don't know how many books are on there. Hundreds.

There's about 3,000.

Damn.

Yeah, there's 3,000.

You have a ladder and everything, right?

Yeah, no, we do, actually. And this is only one of three libraries in the house. Oh, wow.

That's amazing.

Yeah, that's cool. Because you can't fit them all in here.

So we had to stop you right prior to this recording because we're like, wait, wait, wait, wait.

We're talking about really, really Good stuff. And then all of a sudden we're like, we should be recording this.

So we hit record.

So let's, let's, let's just cut into it. What were we lead it off to what we were chatting about and let's just continue that conversation.

I have no idea neither.

We're just riffing. We have no idea what's going on. Talking about the brain and the dissonance, the cognitive dissonance or the disconnect between somebody saying, for example, you know, a story is what gets us to either be successful or not successful versus reality, you know, And I'm noticing that in this space, right? Because when I say this space, I mean entrepreneurs, right, who are craving and hungry and just have an insatiable appetite for knowledge. But really it shouldn't be knowledge, right? It should be action, not the knowledge of it, right? Because without doing something, we all know it's sort of mental masturbation. Which begs to ask this question. Why does somebody take an information piece or read a book or listen to a podcast or attend the seminar and then do something with it and somebody else doesn't do that? And it's a question that I think everybody has asked. And of course, our good friend Richard Koch would say it's an 80 20. Jim Rohn would say 3% do, 97% don't, right? Tony would say, you don't have enough. Why? Which he stole from Jim Rohn. And we can go down the list of all the greats and the not so greats, right? The other guys that curse on podcasts and the guys that say all kinds of crazy stuff about, you know, if you don't have a million dollars in the bank, you're a loser. You know, those guys to me are sort of the modern day con men who are really good at marketing and make a lot of money, but the content that they deliver I think lacks. It's like if we could think about McDonald's, right? I don't know if McDonald's is still the number one franchise in the world, but let's assume that it is.

It isn't in Tijuana, Mexico, it's Carl's Jr. We just saw that firsthand.

But yeah, they provide what the masses want, right? But then when you look at other franchises, for example, like In N Out, which is the most profitable franchise per location, they're not as big because they still have a quality control. And if we keep going up to better restaurants like Etchigo in California, if you haven't been there to eat sushi you should go. It's on Bundy, off of Santa Monica Boulevard, above a Pizza Hut. One of the best sushis. Super inexpensive. It's amazing. You can't franchise that.

Right, right.

So there's a. So you can. If you dumb down the message, you attract the masses. In fact, Robbins, Tony Robbins once told me, he said, marx, in order for you to eat with the classes, you must learn to serve the masses.

Interesting, right? Okay.

Isn't that interesting? And he meant. I don't know what he meant because not in his brain. But if we look at the analysis of that statement, it basically means you gotta give them cake and just give them stuff, but not the elite stuff. When I was training martial arts with Daniel Santo, it was the top of the top of the guys that went to study with him because everybody else couldn't handle the training or the getting beat up. Does that make sense?

Oh, yeah.

Okay, so this is what happens with entrepreneurs. You've got one ofpreneurs who all they want to do is to feel good. Right? They just want to get that, oh, I listen to the podcast or the tape or the sound. I just feel bad.

Yeah, it's the dopamine, Right?

It's exactly what happens. Right. And now we know on the brain, it's the anticipation of it. Not the actual release, but the anticipation of the release. Right. There was Kenny McGonagall, and was it Kenny McGonagall in a book called the Upside of Stress that talks all about that? And so it's that hit. Those guys are cool. And then the guys and gals that they don't want just to feel good, they have this masochistic desire to produce results. Because the only way you can produce that is going through pain. Right? You know, success, able to handle pain. And what separates that person versus the hoper. Right. The hope versus the action. So I'm asking you guys that question. What do you think separates the guy or girl that goes, oh, it feels really good. I went to the seminar and I had the podcast and then I do nothing. And the one that goes, I can't wait to get out there and try stuff.

So I gave you an answer prior to this. I'll say it again. I want to hear what Matt thinks as well.

Me too.

I think a lot of it. For me, it can be the internal dialogue, the metaphors that I might be or that I am telling myself in that specific scenario, because I think that can change depending on our comfort level or what we're ready for. But if we have this open learning, if we're at a seminar and we know that this is good content, changing whatever that metaphor is, to almost become a glue where we are receptive to things that resonate to where our vision is for ourself as well. And that metaphor allows that to kind of enter maybe the subconscious or a different level of our thinking, that it's more at a core level rather than, oh, it's a great idea, boing off the brain or on the notepad, never going to look at it again. But that metaphor inside of our heads that we're replaying all the time. Yes, Theory of mine.

Yes, but hold that thought. Matt, I want to interject that the question we asked last time was what metaphor? Right. What story? That to me is fortune cookie. No offense, it's fortune cookie answer. Right.

Right. It's not that it's bad, it's that. Okay, cool. I understand your hypothesis. Now defend your position. What are you going to say, Matt?

I was just going to say that you were asking about, like when somebody goes to an event and they're sitting in the room and same opportunity, same information, why does one person succeed, one maybe doesn't go implement it. And for me, I was just thinking if the end result, the thing that you're striving to do is a strong enough motivator for you to go and implement, then, you know, I think it all ties back to that end result that you're trying to achieve. If you go and sit through a seminar and you hear something and go, wow, what they just said, if I go and implement that, that gets me this much closer to this thing that I'm striving for, then you're much more likely to go do it. If somebody goes and sits in a seminar and they hear all these cool ideas, but they don't really have a light at the end of the tunnel. They don't really know what they're shooting for, well then they're less motivated to come home and actually implement the steps because that sort of North Star, that thing that they're shooting for, isn't as concrete as maybe the other person.

Okay, so I think I understand the answer you're giving and let me give it back to you in a different light and see if you agree. There's, you know, Jim Rohn, one of my all time favorite people, said that purpose is stronger than object. Right? Than object. Is that what you meant? That the reason is what matters more than the actual object itself.

Right? The why behind it, the purpose, the what you're shooting for once you get home and you've sort of had some time to digest all this information, I feel like the people that are going to take the most action are the ones that have more clarity in what the outcome at the end of all of this is going to be.

Well, clarity may or may not be true because for someone like Joe, clarity might mean what he tells himself, not what he sees. Right. And he said up and down, which is an affirmation subconsciously that it's true. But I want to go back a little bit and ask, is it because they have a stronger purpose or is it because they're tied to. To a purpose more strongly?

Tied to a purpose more strongly, I believe, because, I mean, it's a subjective question. A stronger purpose is very subjective.

Right. My purpose is different than yours. Just. I know personality wise, I'm looking for fun. I'm looking for this new experience. I'm constantly kind of looking forward, thinking. I know for me personally, that is 100% where I'm at. So my, the story I tell myself now is slow down, think of, you know, peel the onion more. So find the core reason of what is it that I'm seeking. And we'll get into this a little bit. But that's how these shower meditations that like, since we last talked is like, it'll start off with like, what's this, like, crazy crap we're doing? And I want to do all this stuff from overloading my play. Why can't I stick to GTD or whatever it might be? But then I'll get to this core thing and be like, ah, okay, that's, that's the one. Be more decisive, prioritize. And there's probably even more a core level than even that. But that is more of my deeper purpose, you know? And for you, it's gonna be completely different. Of course.

Yeah. I mean, it's less about having a very clear vision and more about how sort of attached to that vision you are. I feel the people that have like a real clear vision that are very sort of tied to it and motivated by it, and that's the reason they wake up, you know, Like, I don't know if it's a great example or not, but like Gary Vaynerchuk, right? He always talks about how one day I'm going to own the Jets. One day I'm going to own the Jets. One day I'm on the jets, right? Like, he's got. He sort of has this filter that he constantly runs things through of, you know, is this getting me closer or further away from that goal, you know, whether, however you feel about Gary Vaynerchuk or whatever. I'm just saying like that he has this sort of North Star thing that is a filter that he can run everything through.

Well, first of all, I don't know him. I never met the guy and I've never really listened to much of his stuff. I just know a little bit of him, so I can't speak to him individually. I can tell you though that there is a big difference between filtering everything through a main objective and having a clear vision of what success looks like to you. Because filtering things through a main objective is probably not a good idea because here comes your kid. Hey, dad, you want to play? No, I got all the Jets.

Good point.

Hey, you want to go have some good food? No, because they won't get me closer to the Jets. I mean, it becomes a little bit weird, right?

Yeah.

And the brain actually will have an opposite reaction to someone like that in the sense that the more obsessed you are about what I'm going to do, the less the brain is going to actually help you achieve it because it knows it's going to be hurt in other areas.

Almost all of the.

By the way, setting goals is to become something that attracts the goals, not for the achievement of the goals. So it's the present change that occurs in the way to the goal. That's really what it's all about. I'll explain that in a minute. I don't know most of the successful guys I know. And by success, I'm not saying that they're just financially independent. I'm saying that by their definition. Right? By their definition, if you ask them, are you successful? They say yes, which means that they have enough money, they're happy, good relationships, healthy children, whatever that definition is for them. Most of the guys and gals who I know who are successful are not rushed. They don't curse very often. They're not rushed, they're not manic.

They'Re not boisterous. They have sort of a calm, relaxing, obsessive and character driven personality. And I'm talking billionaires to 100 millionaires, right? To sports athletes, I don't know of any. It doesn't mean they don't exist. I don't know of any successful entrepreneur or business person that is like, hey guys, what are you gonna do? Let's go, come on. They're manic. It does. I don't know any of them.

Well, do you think that is a learned thing? So, because we all have different personalities. All these different things that are happening, you know, it's boiled inside us. Do you think that's a learned trait or did they harness this? Like, for me, I am inherently a quick starter. I'm more. I'm much faster of, you know, let's just do it. Let's try it. If it doesn't work, let's redo course a little bit to get back over here. It's not going to kill us if we try this thing for a couple days, let's say. So with these successful people, is that a learned thing over time, at least as far as, you know, have they honed in some of those traits that they feel like are a little squirrely or they could do better on?

So basically the question is, can somebody's like, core personality kind of be altered over time?

Not change, but. Yeah, but alter these little things to set them up for success better?

Okay, so the answer is yes. Personality, you can change. You can become an extrovert. If you're an introvert, I mean, you can change your personality. It's neuroplasticity. Right. Epigenetics. I mean, you can, you know, two twins, identical twins, grow with different personalities. I mean, how do you explain that? Right? You do make up who you are. And I mean, there isn't anybody who I've ever coached or put through a program who has not become significantly more successful. Right. Because I have the secret sauce. I mean, I figured out how to do it. And it's not as hard as you think it is, by the way. Pretty easy. So I think. And successful people are as different as fingerprints.

Sure.

I mean, you look at. Look, I've been studying this since I was 21. Right. I'm barely 49 now, so it's what, 28 years? And I'm not a billionaire. I'm not worth hundreds of millions of dollars. Right. But I'm pretty darn. I'm the wealthiest guy I know. I mean, sure. And I know billionaires. That'll tell you something. How I define wealth and success.

And I don't have the answer. Right. Because what I can tell you is there are commonalities because they're all very different. They're commonalities. And we can go back to Napoleon Hill, one of my favorite Napoleon Hill, think and go rich. We can go back to Wallace Wattles in the Science of Getting Rich. And also Sweden Martin. Right. And we can go back to Emerson, who really was sort of the genesis of this. We can even go back all the way to Socrates, if you want.

Right.

Socrates is probably the most influential philosopher of all time, who obviously was broke and married to a hag, ended up taking poison because he didn't want to renounce what he believed in. We can study Marcus Aurelius, Alexander the Great, we can go to business tycoons that you guys may not know who are like Armand Hammer, who started Occidental Petroleum, or J. Paul Getty, which you guys are. We can. Walt Disney, we can look at all of these guys. If you take the book Think and Grow Rich and you overlay the 13 principles, you'll find them common in all of them, for the most part, right. Maybe they have 7 or 13 or 10 or 13. If you take Hill's later works, for example, his last book called how to Grow Rich with Peace of Mind, which wasn't as organized, but a really good book. He explains what they missed. All that to say that I think you can become whoever you want to be and you can change to whatever you want to change and you can achieve whatever you want to achieve. Here's the problem. This is the problem. And there's only two problems in life. Not knowing what you want or knowing what you want, but not knowing how to get it. That's a quote from Steve Snyder. The guy told me to speed read. Brilliant guy. But here's the problem. What we think we want isn't what we really want. And hence, as long as that disparity of incongruency exists between what we think we want and what we really want, we will actually do neither. And then we become unsatisfied and unhappy. So the trick to success is getting rid of the thing you think you want, understanding what it really is you want, and then moving that bar to where you want it to go. But if you don't get rid of what you think you want and go to the true. Know thyself, right? Go to the true. Course, you can't move that. So let me give you an example. I had a next door neighbor. This is when Nancy, my beautiful wife, and I got married and we bought a house in Tarzana, California. In fact, Nick Lusche's brother bought the house from us anyway. And.

Across the street from us lived this guy. He was a grip. I had no idea what a grip is. You guys know what a grip is?

I know they're on the movie sets and all that stuff. Exactly.

I had no idea. I mean, I was ignorant, 20, whatever, six year old guy. So he's a grip. Big dude, handsome guy, right? And he wore A beer before beers were, you know, were in, right? He was yoked, perfect set of hair, you know. Yeah, exactly, right?

That's me. Yeah.

Just like you, basically. A little bit taller, a little bit bigger.

I'm telling. That was public knowledge.

And. And he worked in the set of the Titanic, right? And I can't remember his name. Anyway, always happy, beautiful girlfriend. His uncle lived with him. And we're talking our house was 1300 square feet, right? This is a middle, lower class neighborhood. And he was always happy. And I'm, you know, I'm pumping to become a millionaire and I'm working hard. I just started my company Now I'm 28, I'm, you know, hey man, we could do this and yada yada. And he's super happy. And I said, so what, what is your dream? Like, what's success? Let's go be this and that. And he's like, dude, I'm happy as is. He goes, he goes, I make about 10,000amonth as a grip, which back then was a lot of money. I've been buying these trailer homes, I rent them out and my aim is to make 10,000 of a trailer home so I don't have to work anymore and just hang out in my house and work on my boat and do this. And I'm like, no, no. I'm trying to push him to do more, right. I'm trying to tell him what it is that he's supposed to want. But he was so congruent on what he wanted. They achieved it. And what do you think happened after he achieved it?

Yeah, maybe he got depressed and was unhappy or I don't know. It just seems like the milestones that you're shooting for, whenever you hit those milestones, there's just another milestone beyond it that, you know, seemed like this guy.

Was pretty tapped into what he actually wanted at a core. And I'm assuming that maybe allowed him to scale further as his core reached that next point and then he kept moving.

Exactly what happened? He was so congruent with who he was, you know, and you know, he called himself sort of white trash because, man, I'm white trash. This is my dream. Right, Right. And once he got it, I remember having a chat with him and he's like, you know what, I think I want this now. But it was congruent. He genuinely want. I don't remember what it was or something silly like I want to do X, Y and Z.

Right, sure.

And he just kept put. And that, that thought made me go, wow, isn't that interesting. Maybe I'm not getting what I really want. So I step back and go, what do I really want? And at the time, I wanted to be a millionaire. But what I really wanted was to do jiu jitsu six days a week.

There you go. Yeah.

So I. I took my entire life and said, I'm going to just do. I'm going to work. And then at 5:30, I'm out to do Jiu Jitsu for six days a week. And then what happened after I became congruent in that capacity, Something else showed up, and something else showed up. And then I remember setting goals for things that I really wanted. Look, when I say my retired bazillion years ago, whatever that was, I was like, well, maybe I should go be worth $100 million. Let me go get this and that and the other. And I tried that for a little bit, right? I was like, yeah, let me go. But it wasn't. I was sabotaging. I was being. I was becoming a total prick. I was sure I just wasn't what I wanted. I thought, what do I really want? I want to hang out with my kids. They were going to go to college at some point, right? In the near five, six, seven years. And now two are in college. I still have one.

And I'm like, I want to be with them. So how do I set everything up? You sure I want to still make more money? Of course.

Yeah.

I want to do all this stuff. But to build around this. The difference between the person in the seminar or the book or whatever that gets all pumped and excited is they're chasing what they think they want, not what they really want. If they get rid of that and go to the really want, then their neocortex, all the parts of the brain try to become congruent. Then the brain says, you know what? There isn't anything we can't do as long as we really want that. That's the difference, right? The person that actually takes action is more congruent in what it is they really want. Hence to our point earlier, Matt, the purpose, like, if you guys say, hey, man, you should go and build the company and buy the jets. I have zero interest in any of that stuff. Right.

Same.

Like, nothing. Now, you might inspire me for a different goal. You might say, hey, Marx, run for public office. That sounds interesting. I might want that. And that might be kind of cool, right?

Sure.

Or X, Y and Z. You could give me external stimulation to awaken something inside of me that maybe I kind of think I want, but I'm not sure you could help me achieve that. But that's what I don't like about a lot of these books and seminars. I know we're sort of off topic is they're trying to feed you that you suck or you should want something else. Joe.

Yeah, well, you're on a good tangent. I mean, this is just going great because with all the books that you have behind you, all the books you've read, and I know this is all throughout a period of your entire life, I'm just thinking, okay, like, on this podcast, we always ask people, what's a book that you recommend that you think would be really good, resonate with others, that you recommend to others all the time? You know us, we're like, oh, man, that'd be a great one to read. Okay. And we more than likely will read it within the next handful of months because there's so many books, you know, and is there a process you go through that is like, okay, I know you speed read, so maybe this is part of the solution. How do you know that that thing is part of your core? Like, where you really want to head is there. Do you just do a quick skim? It's very tactical.

So basically, like, what. What kind of content do you. How do. How do you deem this is relevant to getting closer to my real goal?

It could be listening to more podcasts, going to seminar, talk to whoever.

So I am. I mean, I'm gonna answer that in three ways. One is, I'm a glutton for knowledge, right? So I just. I feel happy when I'm learning, right? So if I'm not learning, I'm like, this is lame, right? If I'm learning something, I feel good. It's exciting for me because I can think about how I can apply to my daily life. Earlier in my life, in my 20s and 30s, I didn't know what I wanted. So I read everything I get my hands on.

Sure.

Because I didn't know. Now I read for three things. I read to gather information, identify principles, and write down quotes based on my definiteness of purpose or my magnificent obsession. Whatever terminology you want to use for what works for you guys, I would say, if you want to read a book, trust your intuition. It will tell you. If you quiet the voice, it will say, hey, you know what? You need to read this now. And it may be something like, I'll start a book, and I'll be like, you know what? I'm not interested right now in this book. And I'll just go off to a totally different book, and I might jump to three, four, five books and then come back and finish it.

Yeah, I do the same exact thing.

Yeah, I do it, too.

I used to beat myself up over that and still kind of literally, I noticed I make to halfway throughout the book, and I have 10 books on my bookshelf, and I see a freaking halfway marker. I'm like, how the hell does that happen? Well, I consciously think the thing is.

Though, like, if a book really, really, really grabs you and you're just like, holy crap, this is super relevant to our business, you'll finish it. I know you finished Clockwork. I know there's. There's been a handful of books where you'll get into it and you'll just devour 100%, and then there's a lot of books where you get maybe, like, 50% through. And I think that's probably, like, a sign of. Okay, this. This isn't really bringing me closer to that. That thing.

Yeah, well, I. I'm not, so. So you may be right, Matt. That may be what's happening. The other thing that could be happening is that it spawned a different question that your brain has to go answer, and you go look for a different book.

Right.

I could see that.

That's what happens to me. Like, I started reading Hammer. I reread a lot of books, which I recommend you guys do, right? Because I think it's better than. I'll tell you why. That's my number two point. So I started rereading this book right here, this book called Hammer.

Hammer by Armin Hammer. Yeah.

Yeah. You can't. You know, it's a biography. You can't get it that much anymore. And I got to page 100 and something, and I thought, you know what? I want to read this book. And then I picked up three other books, went through them, and said, oh, I got to read these guys. Finish those guys. So I haven't come back to them yet. This has been months. But I wouldn't have read those other books or wouldn't have. I started the Point of It all as a Christmas gift for my kids and got two thirds of the way to, you know what? I'm going to reread. The Power of Habit. Got halfway through that, and I'll always finish them. But I do trust that my brain will tell me, you know what? This is. Enough of this meal. Go over here, and then come back to it at the right time. It took me a while to figure that out, and, like, You. I was used to beat myself up. It's actually the opposite. It's exactly books of book. But here's my third point. So my second point is trust your intuition to whatever book. You can read multiple books at the same time if you want. The third point I think is the most important point.

Why do you read a book personally?

It's a seek for knowledge. It's very similar to what you were saying. That's the one thing I just want to learn.

Well, I mean, so I mean, I read a lot of fiction and nonfiction and I have different reasons for reading each, right. So if I'm reading fiction, reading fiction is I just want to get lost. I mean, it's like my escapism, basically. But nonfiction, it's typically because I want whatever knowledge is consumed within that or contained within that book. I want to basically extract what the author knows and implant it into my brain, basically.

Great. So I used to believe that too. I used to believe I read books so I can get something from the book. And then one day I looked back at all my books and thought of all these books I've read. And by the way, it's books I've read, seminars I've attended, audio cassettes and CDs I've listened to. I mean, I showed you guys my man locker. It's a cave that has thousands of hours of material and stuff since I was 21 years old. And I'm a glutton for that stuff. I thought, how many have actually made an impact in my life where they either changed the trajectory, so I was going this way and then now I'm headed this way. So that's important. Or changed my behavior. Also very important. Or changed how I viewed or thought.

And so how many books do you think? CDs, tapes. I've counted for that. What do you think?

I had to guess. I'd say it's probably a small number. Five or six of them, maybe 1.

2, 3, 4, 5, 6. Six are on the shelf now that I pulled out.

Nailed that one.

No, I mean, I'm just kind of thinking about my own experience. I read a lot of books too, and just trying to think back right now of the ones that have really had an impact that sort of of change the trajectory of my life. I could maybe name three, honestly, and that's not uncommon.

So here's the question. Point 3. Is it what you get from the book or is it what they get or the book gets from you?

I think it's the book gets from you.

Correct.

That's exactly. Yeah. And I'm just thinking now it's.

Can you explain what you mean by that?

Oh, yeah.

What do you mean by what the book gets from you?

So let's say that give me a book you read that you like.

Let's just say, I mean, it's cliche, but the Four Hour Workweek was one that legitimately sort of changed our trajectory and thinking on business.

And a lot of our listeners too. I know that's what they're talking about.

It's a book that comes up commonly.

I heard Tim Ferriss did a podcast I didn't listen to, but I heard he did a podcast about how arrogant and dumb he was when he wrote that book and how he is embarrassed on the things he said. Is that correct?

I've heard similar.

For us, it was more of that eye opener like. Like when. So we worked in a company together back when we read that book. And our vision of a company was this manufacturing thing where you've got 30 employees and crazy overhead. I mean, like our break even was like 100 grand a month. And that was our vision of what a business was at the time. The four Hour work week changed that perception for us of you can do this from anywhere in the world from a laptop and hire, like, hire contractors to make sure the thing keeps lower. And so that was the big shift that we had was just like our vision of what a business should look like was completely altered as a result of that book.

So what did that book get from you?

It got me personally asking better questions of the way that I wanted to.

Get what you got from the book.

I don't know because the book then would provide different answers for me if I ask different questions. It's the perception of what I'm reading changes. I know that's the case with anything that's impactful. I'll ask better questions and it kind of refines what I'm. Now maybe I'll listen to it again, like some of the content you've sent to us, Marks.

So yeah. So the definition of that is exactly what happened with you with the Four Hour Workweek. The book got something from you, got you to do something, change what you were doing.

Right, okay, now I understand the question. I didn't understand it until you just clarified it right there. Now, okay, what did the book get from. Okay, got it.

What.

What did the book like pull out of me basically?

Right, okay. It was already there. Right. It didn't. It didn't plant that seed. It watered the seed that was Already planted in soil.

Yes. Okay.

Right.

Because that is true.

How many people have read that book and not done what you did?

Right.

So it's not like the book, you know, it's not. The people who read the book who haven't done anything probably got the same stuff you got from the book.

Yeah, got it.

The book got something different from you than from them.

Totally. I'm clear now. Okay, I got it. So after we read the book, what the book got from us was that was the catalyst for us to start our first online blog. That was the catalyst for us to go fire not fire. Hire our first outsourced team members for our business. That book was the catalyst for us to take a bunch of those actions and move forward for us.

Correct. So I think when we're reading books now, the question I ask myself is, what is this book going to get from me? And so I don't look for what am I going to get from the book? I look for what's the book going to get from me? And that changes everything.

I had my yearly physical and my cholesterol was 292, which by conventional standards it's supposed to be pretty high. So my doctor goes, dude, your cholesterol is kind of high. And my glucose was high. Right. And I was like, that's interesting. And he's like, hey, we got to lower your cholesterol. You got to change more to a plant based diet.

And I was like, that's anti you.

Yeah, I don't know if you know what. I know, doc. And then he said. I said, look, I want to do a stress test. I'm 49. I want to do a stress test. He goes, no, let's go do a calcium. The CAC test.

I haven't heard of that one.

They put you in an MRI machine that's like a donut. And they take an MRI of your heart to look to see if there's any calcium deposits in the vein.

Got it.

No calcium, no osteochlosis. Calcium could have osteocorosis. They rank it from a zero to whatever. Right. So I went and did that yesterday. And so I went. I thought, you know, of all the stuff I've read, cholesterol actually is irrelevant to heart disease. You know, in fact, the lady who lived the longest in recorded history had a cholesterol of 270.

Wow.

So, yeah. And according to Dr. Perlmutter, those with higher cholesterol have high cognitive function.

And it's actually the particles, whether small particles or big particles, based on the Gut. Without getting into this whole component. He doesn't know what he's talking about, and I already know. So I'm like, yeah, whatever. I eat a lot of yummy stuff. And then the glucose, I thought, you know what, dude? That can't be right. My glucose can't be What? It was 193. It can't be 193. That's too high. So I leave the doctor, and I'm the one that said, I want the test. So what do I do? What does the doctor get from me? I got information from him. What does he get from me? I'm like, you know what? Screw this. I called, I said, hey, schedule the cac. I want to look at my heart, see what's going on, make sure it's okay.

Sure.

And I went and bought a glucose ketone monitor.

Aha. There you go.

What's my blood sugar? Really? Right. And went, bought it, got it tested. It was 88, which was perfect. I was not in ketosis. It was 0.2 and then 0.8. So I got to work more on that, which was surprising to me when I did the CAC and came out at zero. So I'm totally healthy, no problem. Right. So what that got for me was actions to do something, to take control of myself and be verified. I also bought two books on keto eating to read those as well, because I've read all the other ones. We've all read from bulletproof to Dr. Baumotta to Dr. Bragadry. So it gets me to behave differently.

It met you at this time in your life where it mattered. It resonated with what you really want for yourself. And maybe it went against your beliefs of what you already know. You're like, hold on. No.

Okay, he changed my beliefs. The nice thing I thought of yesterday was, I need a new doctor, because if I got to educate this guy on cholesterol, he's not the right guy for me. I'm not saying that he's dumb. He's a lovely human being. She's been a great guy to me. So that's what that gets from me. And this is what entrepreneurs miss, is that they consume podcasts. And except for yours, yours are awesome podcasts and books, and they watch Instagram and Facebook and people yelling at them, telling that they're worthless, and if you don't have a million dollars, you're this. And they just consume, consume, consume, consume. And they're getting something from it, but it's not getting anything from them. That's the difference, I think, between a master communicator like myself and you guys, versus somebody who communicates to entertain. Look at one of my favorite people, right? Tony Robbins. 17,000, 10,000, 9,000, 8,000 in seminars, how many do you think leave there and make changes that significantly impact their lives?

I'm going to pull the stat that you gave me about completing courses. Probably 3%, if that.

And I know I'm not going to say how, but if that. Probably out of 11,000 people, 10,000 people, let's say maybe 50 people, 75 people. Just put in real numbers component. Okay, how about a big conference, right? That just happened. How many will do it? Probably less now. It's something now because he's mastered the external communication. But the individual receiving the information has not mastered their internal communication, right? They don't. Okay, so now it's going to talk to a guy like Jim rohn. Jim Rohn's biggest seminars are 2000. How many people do you think, after going to Jim Rohn seminar, Get affected to change their life?

Just based on the fact that you're asking this question right after the Tony Robbins question, I'm guessing a lot higher. 80, 20, maybe 60%.

Well, Tony worked for Jim rohn, right?

Mark Hughes, who started herbalife, worked for Jim rohn. And we go down the list, right, of all those guys who influenced them, why? Because Jim understood how to ask questions that present information. That lets you, the listener, get something. That lets you, listener, not just get something from it, but lets the information get something from you.

Right? So that you don't just go, wasn't Mark's awesome? Instead, you go, I'm going to do this now. I'm going to do that now. That's a big difference. So now let's take it one step even lower down, right? How then do we master that within ourselves. So that we get ourselves to take the action we have to take in order to do the things. Because the reason why you fall off of not you, but I mean, anybody off of GTD or 80, 20.

You know, working out, eating, you name it. The only reason, it's not because of the metaphor necessarily, right, Joe? Because I got to tell you, buddy, you know, I do egoscue every morning, right? That my first thought every morning when I get up is, I do not want to do egoscue.

Wow.

That is a fact. It's like, I just. I go, he's human.

Right? I was like, I don't want to do it, man. I do it. Well, that failed every single day. And then I'm doing 40 pushups after the Agoski, right. I started with five and then went five, 10. So now I'm 40. I'll go 45. I want to get to 100, right, to add to my menu. I don't want to do them. I just don't. I do them. So how come I get this? I don't want to, but I do it. What, what is that bridge that forces the.

The struggle between the lack of wanting to and actually doing something? What is that?

It seems like it's back to that point of you have figured out what you do want for yourself. You see what's potential there for yourself, where you want to head in the future. It's nothing that's pushing you. You're accepting. You've created this routine and these systems around you because they're important to you and there's a reason why you do egoscue every morning. So if you're going to freaking get out of bed, doesn't matter if you, you know, your legs are barely, you know, they're numb, you're going to figure out how to turn those bad boys on and do some squats or whatever.

You're more focused on that future gain than you are focused on the short term pain.

Right.

I think that's kind of like summing up what you're saying.

Yeah, yeah.

Well, I was listening to this is actually, I think Tim Ferriss was interviewing Matt Mullenweg, the creator of WordPress. And one thing that Matt Mullenweg said that actually like really stuck with me. I don't know why this locked into my head, but this one thing he said was, you know, Tim Ferriss was asking me about like his workout routine and he said, my goal is just to do one push up a day. That's it. I just want to do one push up a day. And Tim kind of asked him to elaborate on it. He said, well, if you get down to the floor and you go to do one push up, you're never going to stop at one push up. You're going to keep on going until you're done. But taking that first one push up is the hardest part of doing push ups is doing that first one. So he kind of decided, you know what, I'm just going to take that first step. I'm going to let myself off the hook and say, I'm just going to do one push up today. And it always, every single day, without fail, inevitably turns into much more great.

So hold that thought and I'll tell You why? That's why that's a dangerous thought. If we don't. If we don't qualify it. And this is the difference between what a Jim Rohn guy would say, what I would say, what Tony would say, what somebody else might say, and here's the difference. So some people will go, I'm going to start doing one push up a day and they're going to copy. And by the way, I think Matt was. He did WordPress with polyphasic sleep, which is something I would never want to do my entire life.

I think I've tried that. That's. Yeah. Sleeping like small chunks of time and then basically getting back into it.

Sounds miserable to me.

I did it for a few days. I remember from Tim Ferriss.

This is horrible.

I hate this feeling.

I can't do anything.

Okay, good.

I read and I was like, nope.

No desire. So that's dangerous, right? Because I'll tell you why a minute. So here's what's dangerous with that. A lot of guys, in my view will talk about that. Here's how you do it. Do one push up and there's value to it. But sometimes that's more harm than good because you're not identifying the principle.

So w. Clement Stone, one of my heroes, who's the guy that put Napoleon Hill on the map. As you remember, he had a formula called R2A2. He said when you read a self help book, you recognize, relate, assimilate, apply the principles of the self help book. So you recognize them, which means you have to know what they are, you relate to them. Hey, this is how I can relate to them. You assimilate, you make them into your own personality. Not my personality, but your personality. And then you apply them, but that's individual. So the principles are, as Ray Dalio would say in the book, principles, right, are great. The tactics, not always good. So the principle I think that we're missing to answer the question was it's mastering the internal communication. That's the key. I don't care if you tell yourself, one pushup, I got to do 10 push ups, I got to run naked, it doesn't matter.

Because see what happens is if you tell me, Mark, start with one push up a day, I might go, you know what? You. It doesn't feel right for me, right? It doesn't feel right for me. But you might say to me, hey, Marx, you know what? What do you have to say to yourself? Or what do you think you can do that would get you to do what you want to do now, you let me, as per Ericksonian hypnosis, fill in the blanks, right? Versus. Here's an example. If I said to you, dog, what do you think of cat?

Sit.

Great. What do you. What is it?

Sit.

Okay, great. I think of my dog Zeus, which is Doberman. But if I said to you, dog with purple hair, I have no longer given you the freedom to think cat or sit, I have taken away your individuality.

Hence, I'm no longer inspiring you. I'm just dictating to you. So internal communications, learning how to inspire yourself, whatever that is for you. And there are certain basic techniques on how to learn how to master internal communication versus external communication. There are certain tricks, hacks, we can cover, all that kind of stuff.

It sounds like, just to summarize, or maybe say this into different words, that you're finding the principles. You're trying to locate these principles within maybe the things you're learning. Obviously you have your own set of principles as well. But you figure out. All right, well, this book seems like it has a pretty good message. The big why, the big purpose behind it. And then you bring that in. It might have some tactics in there. They might not be your tactics. You might use some, but a lot of them, you probably are going to say, bye, F off. I'm going to figure out my own. But I know the core meaning behind this thing. And for you, that's when you'll start to adapt your own tactics to your life.

I love how you just censored yourself.

Did I? I didn't even notice.

What did he say?

I said, I love how Joe just censored himself.

I'm like, I don't even notice. I don't know.

And look. And you may try all of them. That's okay. This is why I think morning routines are stupid. And we've had this discussion for some.

People, maybe, I don't know, Maybe.

Maybe you're 100% correct, right? So because you now have made yourself a pigeonhole, like, I have to do this, and then that loses all component. You know, the only thing I do every day, every morning besides wake up is egoscue. Why? Because if I don't do it, I'm gonna have pain throughout the day, Right? There's my purpose. Avoid pain. Okay, so let me go do it. Right. But I've mastered my internal communication. Look, I didn't want to do the CAC test. I was freaking the F out on the way there. Heart rate was beating, having thoughts in my head. Oh, my gosh. What Is this my wife's? Like, dude, calm down. It's a freaking mri. Doesn't matter what she said to me, dude. I was like, I was freaking out. My mouth got clammy in my hand and I'm a master communicator, right? And I'm like, you look. And I was pale white. I looked like, like I was scared. The lady was like, are you okay? Are you claustrophobic? I was like, she did it. But here's the difference. Yeah, I felt those emotions. I'm not going to deny it. But I did it. I was able enough to move my body to get the test done. That's the difference. I didn't. I didn't repress my thoughts or my emotions. I didn't try to tell me, you know, dude, be excited. No, it was like, I'm freaking the fuck out. I'm nervous. I don't want to do this thing. I'm worried something bad's going to happen. Hey, I'm a human being, but I made the appointment as soon as possible. I drove there, I got in the machine. You know what I mean?

You had that purpose. I got to go figure this out myself. It's me. This isn't right.

Despite the fear and the anxiousness. And then I go myself, hey, you did it. Great job. So when something else shows up that I'm going to be nervous about, I'm still going to do it anyway, right? Because I'm building that muscle that's mastering sort of communication. If I hadn't done it, postponed it, neglected, avoided it, whatever that means I'm not communicating with myself enough to override the limbic system, the reptilian brain, right? I could have tapped. I could have done havening. Dude, I don't have time for that. I got to get it done.

So I want to. Now that we're on this vein, you had a little freak out moment. You and I have been talking the last couple weeks on all sorts of things. Check in some content you're creating out there. I told you that day one of this little thing that you have out there. I'm trying to be vague on purpose, but it's up to you how far you want to go. You have this exercise that I don't know if you're open to it. That'd be amazing to walk through just that little quick exercise that folks can just try.

Well, I'll tell you what, why don't we do this instead of doing that? Why don't we let them somehow opt in somewhere and I'll Send them the audio for free.

That'd be amazing. Yeah. Because that's. And I'll just preface why this is important without giving it and giving it away. It literally is reframing these potential thoughts or things in your past or these patterns that you're finding in yourself and you're just letting them go. And you're essentially saying specific words in almost like a meditation form. You can combine it with tapping, Havening. You know we've had.

Yeah. Dr. Rootman, Dr. Was on the podcast and he had Agoscue Brian from there too. So. Yeah. And then you say this. And for me, I've been doing this for over a week or so. Multiple times. Like I said a couple times I'll just take a freaking hot ass shower, hot as I can. Totally. I don't have a spa or I would just go there. But you know, say this, let myself off the hook. And I'm not lying when I say the last two weeks I felt like I've had a mental like just unloading of this freaking sumo wrestler has been squatting on me for way too long. It's very weird visual. Don't get it out of your head.

No, it's great. It's good. We know you like sumo wrestlers.

Yeah. So, yeah, show notes. I don't know what the URL is, but we'll link it up in here. If you want to opt in and get that audio, we'll put a link.

In the show notes for sure.

Yeah, yeah.

So to answer your question is yes, yesterday I did the exact same thing in the evening shower to get rid of the bad stuff through the day.

Yes. Yeah.

And that's what I knew is I knew it was like I knew, hey man, this is going to be uncomfortable. Right. It's not going to kill me though. I'm going to go through it and tonight I'll just get rid of it.

Yeah.

It's a weird vulnerable feeling for me because it's a new thing. I've done a lot of stuff like this, but this is one that really resonated when I heard it from you. It's like, holy crap, it's so easy. And you let yourself off the hook like that and that can stop this negative cycle of talk, the self talk in your brain and, and just be like, oh, there's actually something constructive I could do here. I can let myself off the hook. And now this is my future. I'm in control.

And that's mastering communication internally.

Right.

And these are little. And now, mind you, I didn't tell you what to say. I told you a framework of certain words, and then you fill in the rest.

Correct? Yeah.

Right. Because, hey, look, here's. And I told you, here's what you know. I said, here's how you can do it this way. This way. Because it allows you to go, I'm in control. The biggest fear, according to. Remember David Allen? We had him on the podcast, right? Gtd.

Thank you.

He said the biggest fear is the fear of being out of control. That's what he said. If that's true, then when somebody tells you what you should do, it's not taking away the control from you.

It's imposing something on you that you feel like might be foreign to your core purpose to who you are.

It's going back to what you think you should want versus what you really want. And that creates a cognitive dissonance, which creates paralysis. Right. It grades not to move much.

Now, just so we've talked about that concept of, like, what you think you want versus what you really want. Do you have any sort of, like, exercises or anything that you work people through to help them get to the root of what they really want? Because I feel like that's something that even Joe and I have talked about, we've struggled with in the past of thinking this is what we're striving for. And then. And either we get there and it really wasn't what we wanted, or our minds change and we're like, maybe that's not really what we want. A lot of times I don't feel like a lot of people have clarity, ourselves included, oftentimes, on what that thing is that we really want. So what sort of things would you walk somebody through to help uncover that kind of thing?

That's exactly what I do the first time when I first get a paying client or anybody. That's the first thing I do.

Got it.

Remember the whole thing about, you know, what do you want and how do you get there? And you got to know what you want first and what you really want, not what you should want, not what your wife wants you to want. I mean, remember one of the recordings, Joe? I don't know if Matt listened to it. It's how everybody wants you to fail. Nobody wants you to succeed, even your spouse.

I told him about it.

Yeah, Joe's listened to a bunch of them and told me about them. I haven't gotten around to listening to all of them yet, but.

No, I'm just kidding.

It's okay. I get Cliff's notes.

I Mean, basically, the whole concept is that nobody wants you to succeed. Not your kids, not your spouse, not your best friend. Nobody. The only person will want you to succeed will be a guy like me or someone. You pay to end yourself. Right. And sometimes not even yourself. Right. Because we have personality.

Good point.

Mountains it. And it's not that they mean evil. It's because they're afraid of change and all these components. Right. And that's the reason why you should become successful by your definition. So to answer your question, is there is a process that we go through that now, after almost 10 years of doing it is foolproof and it's actually kind of painless. But it does require you to think. It does require you to.

I had a call yesterday by a guy that heard me somewhere, wanted to chat for a little bit, and within five minutes I got him telling me how much he owed, what his life was like, he never met me, doesn't know me. Right. This phone call he sent me, his whole life problems. Then he goes, I can't believe I'm sharing this with you, but I feel so comfortable doing so well, because I don't care. It's about, how do we get you. And at the end of the call, the one hour call, he realized what he thought he wanted wasn't at all what he wanted. And then he felt liberated. Joe, when you do the exercise in the shower and you feel light, like, whoo, that's all right. That's when you know that's the evidentiary procedure you have or I've experienced when you get to the truth of what you really want. So back to the question, Matt, is there is an easy way to do it. Right? We can't do it in five minutes because it is a process. And it wouldn't be ecological of me to go, here's how to do it. I'd have to actually legitimately walk people because it would do more harm than good if we don't do it the right way.

Makes sense.

Yep.

But I think ultimately the.

Greatest. The greatest happiness and success, in my opinion, is being true to thyself right? Now. That doesn't mean that if you're married and you want to go, you know, do something stupid, you know, it doesn't mean that you should go, you know, neglect your kids and go snort coke. Right. Because you think you truly want me.

Don't do that. Right.

We gotta be, you know, character driven, and we have to understand. Right. You know, But I think most people that I've helped or hung out with ultimately always Pick really great things.

That they want. So maybe what we could do is we could do a webinar, a free webinar and actually run people through it. Like, we'll just go ahead and do.

It and that would be fun.

They could take pen and paper.

Cool. So maybe instead of the opt in just for the audio, it'll be audio as a bonus. Here's your immediate little dopamine hit and then get ready for this webinar.

Yeah, there you go. There you go.

Just making it up on the fly, huh?

I think it's fantastic. I think whatever you want. I will tell you that. That it is an ongoing process.

Sure, sure.

And it does require, in my experience and opinion, it does require that you have.

That you do things daily, for lack of a better word. Right. I want to. I don't want to give away. Yeah, because if you're not. Because here's the problem, right. Is that if we don't do it right, it becomes just another thing rather than a compass, which is what you want it to be.

Right. I'll give an example. Well, so some of my shifts in the last two weeks and. And you are a lot of that shift. There's.

I'm all of it, buddy.

All of it.

I'm terrible.

You can't be that. Credit you a ton of it is changing. And this was a phrase I heard on a podcast from a guy, Jonathan Levy, that was just on. I shared that podcast with you. I think you love it, by the way, becoming superhuman. There was something in there. There was a quote that. And I'm going to butcher it. But essentially the time you change the perception of what others think of you, because that's never going to get easier. It's only going to get harder the more you're trying to please Marx or Matt or for me, talking here, until I own what's my perception of myself and become my own biggest fan. You know, how can. So the root of, like, what can I really cheer for in myself? What are my actions? What are these beliefs?

But that's actually probably not the right way to go about it, in my opinion.

It's making me feel so good, though.

Yeah, but what did it get you to do?

It's got me to actually become more committed to things like what you've sent me. So knowing that it's actually, well, they're positive things as of yet actions.

I could see some downsides becoming maybe a little less helpful, like doing good for others. I will. And it's interesting because I've fought with this back and forth, it's like, okay, me first. But at the same time, because I've noticed I can give a lot of energy to others and neglect myself in the process. That's essentially the root of why this resonated with myself.

I know what you're saying.

Look, there's. There's a difference between not caring what others think and then becoming a complete asshole or a recluse monk. Right.

Or you know what?

Screw you. I don't care. Right. And being a people pleaser. Like, let me. Let me. Let me please you, because I need your approval. Right.

Right.

I think. And there's. Those are the two extremes. Look, there's a difference between, you know, to go to the early example about the Jets. I'm on the Jets. I'm on the Jets. To me, that's. To me personally, that doesn't work. I rather have a compass. I'm headed in this direction. That to me is way more exciting. Whatever brings. Right. And you can have goals and maybe goal is to own a sports team someday. It's not, by the way, because. Not that it's bad, it's just not my thing, but I think direction is more important than an objective. Right. The goals are important. I mean, I have tons of goals. That's part of the process. We have to set in the right way. Nobody knows how to set them the right way. They all do it the wrong way. So important. But. But I think the direction is more important. You know, like for me, everything I do has to relate somehow to the welfare of my kids and wife. Right. And along the way, I get. Sometimes I don't get joy, but I get happiness out of it. Does that make sense?

Yep.

And I choose happiness over joy all the time and fun and happiness, or joy and happiness are not mutually inclusive. Sometimes they're exclusive, Many times they're inclusive, but sometimes they're exclusive. You know, going to see my daughter perform as a dancer for America's Got Talent here coming up on March. No desire. Right. But I'm doing it because I love my daughter more than anything in the world. Right.

Yeah.

Will I be joyful? I'll do my best. Will they make me happy? Absolutely. Super happy. Make sense?

Yeah.

I'm headed. To me, that's way more important for me personally than owning a sports team or whatever. Right. Ultimately. Okay. So the problem with that is if we're not careful about why we're doing it, about the purpose behind. Because the reason you clear everything at night, for you, Joe, I'm guessing it's to be a better husband, a better business person. Right.

100%.

It's to give more.

And I see it as part of an evolution process. This is one piece that's allowing me to more or less ground myself first before I try to bolt on more things, you know?

Absolutely.

So that's where I'm seeing this as like, all right, this is an amazing first step for me.

Put on your own oxygen mask before providing it for the other one. Yeah. The people around you.

Yeah.

I mean, look at. You're right. If you're doing it for your own personal character development, to become a better you, that's exactly the reason you should do it, in my opinion. Right. Rock and roll. It rocks. If you're doing it to avoid something or because you're self centered, you're going to have a problem.

Sure.

You're going to become one of those celebrities that needs only red M&Ms. And you know, and then they throw tantrums and.

Right. You know, luckily we haven't made it.

That short just because green M and Ms. Are disgusting.

Exactly.

When I met Muhammad Ali, I was in my early 20s. I think I told you guys the stories in my early 20s.

I don't think so.

He had Parkinson's disease. And there was a bunch of sports athletes and I only cared about Muhammad Ali. But Steve Garvey was there, Dennis Rodman was there. Kareem Abdul Lamel Jabbar was there.

Right.

And a bunch of guys I don't know. And it said big bold letters, you will not get personalized autographs. Don't talk to the athletes, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Right.

And there was Karim Abdul Jabbar, who I think is a dick. I've met him. I don't like him, I can say because I've met him. He was signing autographs. Like, you come up and you just sign and move on. Wouldn't talk to you. Just like you're saying, scum of the earth, lower than low. Right. And then there's Muhammad Ali. Remember, he can't really talk. He's got Parkinson's disease. So it's shaking. And the line was really long. And he would look at you.

And point and shaking. I'm doing this on the video. And his son, one of his sons would say, what's your name? And he would write to da da da da. And then sign it. And the guy in front of me had a poster that said Cassius Clay. Now remember, Cassius Clay was Muhammad Ali's name before he became Muslim and changed it. And people on the line were like, oh, no. Oh. Like, what's Muhammad gonna say, right? And I'm right behind this guy, and I'm like, we'll see what happens. He shows up. Muhammad Ali looks at him, points the finger. His son says, what's your name? The guy says his name, and he writes to so and so Cassius Clay.

Oh, wow.

What an incredible human being. And then it was our turn. Asked for my name. He signed a biography by Thomas Hauser, 2 marks. Muhammad Ali dated it, and then we took pictures with him. And you're not supposed to do any of it. He did all of it, right. I was already a fan, but he became one of my most favorite people in the entire world. And I've experienced that with Jim Rohn and a bunch of other people contrast to Kareem Abdul Jabbar or Steve Harvey, who just think that you're there to serve them, right? Like, I'm the celebrity, you're the bitch. Be at my whim, right? And the only other person who I thought was amazing at that night was Dennis Rodman. He would not leave because they closed it up, right? And people left and stole my. He would not leave and neither would Muhammad Ali until everybody got signature.

Nice.

I mean, you know, to me, think what you think of those guys. That's true success. That's true happiness, right? So of all the guys I've met and gals I've met who I admire the most, right? They tend to be those kind of people where they will talk to you. You know, Jim Rohn, the same thing where I was making $5,000 a month. I said, hey, Jim, I'm making 5,000amonth. I was like, 25 or something. And he's like, wow, that's amazing. And he sat and he talked with me, and there was a line behind us. At the seminar, he signed my journal, and he was like, it was a million dollars, right? He made me feel so big, and I was like, hey, I know you got people behind you. I gave him a hug, I moved out, and next person, same thing. He didn't care if the person behind me left. It was my moment, my time.

Yeah.

That to me, is defined by greatness. And we all recognize that inside of ourselves, right? Because now we're getting something from the podcast, right? So when you get that same feeling of greatness, that's when I believe in my opinion, you know, you're doing something right for you and for others.

Yeah.

If that feeling doesn't over, over. If that doesn't drape your Body. If you're chasing the money but you feel uncomfortable, then it's the want versus what you truly really, really, really want.

Yeah, the disconnect is in between there. Yeah, yeah.

It's interesting.

Muhammad Ali is actually almost coming back to Joe's point of like being your own biggest fan. That was one of the things Muhammad Ali was notoriously famous for, was kind of being his own biggest fan.

The greatest. Yeah, yeah, that's true.

Muhammad was. He got that from a wrestler. I don't know if you guys know that.

Yeah, there was a. Yeah, no, I've heard that before. I don't remember which wrestler it was though.

There was a blonde wrestler in like a WrestleMania kind of thing. Like a Hulk Hogan looking character that would say that in wrestling And Muhammad Ali was impression by him when he was young so he adopted it. But what people don't realize. Muhammad Ali wasn't talking to you when he was saying those things.

Yeah, those were his affirmations himself.

Man, that's self talk affirmations.

Now of course others, you know, played into it and he would talk to George Foreman when he's beating him up or whatever have you.

Sure.

I mean again it's, it goes back to mastering internal communication but there's a difference between saying it and being a dick about it and boasting it about it. Right, right moment he said it because he believed it, you know and he used to be, he, I mean he used to message Joe Fraser and all these guys and so you know, and again style, right. That's one style another you know. Henry Ford. Right. If you know some people don't like him. Some people do like him. His handshake was like a noodle. Then he was very soft spoken Again, Henry Ford, I mean come on. The guy that invented the mass automobile factor. Right. Different personalities but both achieved what they thought was success and happiness.

So modern day example, Conor McGregor, is he a dick or is he just have amazing self belief?

I think he's amazing self belief. I don't know him personally yet. I like to meet him. But my intuition of what I've seen him talk. I think he's a good kid, I think he's a good guy and I think that he is. What you guys don't know is that he read, think and grow rich and he and his wife started a mastermind and together every day they spent an hour talking about the money they're going to make and the what they're going to make. And if you look at his record, he's got A few losses in there, but he's the highest paid MMF fighter in history. And there's a reason for that. Right. He knows how to master the external communication as well as the internal communication. You know, I mean, he lost Khabib, which I think he trained him properly for and looked, he was an incredible fighter. Boring, in my opinion, but incredible fighter. But, yeah, McGregor's mastered internal communication and external communication now, you know, he has issues like everybody else. I'm sure he's got, you know, nobody's perfect. Right. Except for, you know, maybe Jesus. Right. But other than that, we're all highly fought individuals, so. But, but I think, to answer your question, Matt, I think he's a brilliant kid and I think he's the kind of guy.

Here's how I, you know, to me, friendship is about being reliable. If I called you at 3:30 in the morning and I'm unduly imprisoned in Mexico, if you're a friend, you will go get me. If you're an acquaintance, you'll be like, hey, come when you get out quick.

Yeah, agreed. Yeah, you're right.

I think McGregor is that. I think he's the guy that if his buddies called him and said, hey, I need your help. And not like bs, but like legit, I think he would be there.

I agree.

I can see that. Yeah, that's. Yeah. This is interesting. I'm just thinking of Floyd, Floyd Money Mayweather. He's. He's another one that's. He's different. But yeah, I saw an interview with him and Kevin Hart and Cold as balls. I don't know if you've ever seen that on YouTube.

I saw that too.

It's hilarious. But that. I didn't know much about him, but I was looking at his character, I was like, I like him. I like his. Like, he's similar to McGregor and he's definitely outspoken, but he's a little bit more reserved. But you see that fire in him. You're just like, oh, damn, this is why this is success.

He was the first guy to bring true entertainment since Muhammad Ali to the boxing world. I mean, the man has generated over a billion dollars in revenue.

Yeah, it's crazy.

He's only 40 years old. He doesn't even know how to read, by the way.

Right. He's dyslexic.

Yeah, yeah. And he's worth hundreds, millions of dollars right now. I don't know him personally. I'm sure he's got flaws and issues, but he's mastered internal communication and external communication. And I Think Kevin Hart. Again, not a perfect human being by any stretch. Imagination. But I love to see his development.

As he grows as a human being. It's really cool to watch because one thing about Bruce Lee was. Danny Losanto told us, if you saw Bruce Lee in this date, six months later, you'd see him again. He'd be doing entirely different martial arts. He was always progressing, looking for what's better. What's better, what's better, what's better. And to me, even though fundamentals don't change, it's the application of those fundamentals to see people grow. If you meet somebody that you saw a year ago and they're the same as they were a year ago, to me, that's.

Yeah, yeah.

I'm thinking of our journey, Matt and I. Like, for 12 years now, it's just been constant experimentation because we're genuinely curious.

Well, there's nobody. I don't care. I don't think anybody who knows us would even say we're the same person now that we were one year ago, even one year ago.

Well, you're not the same person I first met when we started chatting, that's for sure.

Right. And it's about a year ago or so. Yeah, probably. Yeah, you're right. And that's.

Think about all the things that. You know, it was actually in the summer, because I remember I took off in for Europe in July, so it was July, so like, nine months. But yeah. So whatever you're doing is getting something from you.

Yes, that's the key. And that's a good way to just probably put a nice bow around this thing is like, hey, if you're perpetually doing this, then it might not seem like you're making. Maybe you're not making a million bucks yet or something like that. But, hey, are you having fun in the process or whatever that purpose is? That evolution process should be the time of your life. That is your life.

It goes back. Sorry, Matt. It just goes back to. Is that something you really want?

Because, I mean, I'm telling you, it's. You know, David Allen told us. Or maybe he didn't say it on the podcast, but he said to me, he goes, he wants to do interesting work with interesting people. That was his thing. And same with Ray Dalio. Right? Only a little bit different. Right? So these guys, everything they do is interesting work with interesting people. It's not about owning the jets and about, you know, I mean, Ray's worth, what, $17.5 billion, something like that. David Allen's changed the World and worth, you know, got so many million dollars he's worth, right. Lives in a tiny apartment in Amsterdam. They're living. They're not perfect, but they're living their life their way, whatever that is for them.

Yeah.

They somehow got connected to that. Right. That exercise that we do. Connected to what they truly really want. Now that changes. Right? But you got to be connected. What is it? Who was it that said, so the known self be true, and then it follows, like, day, night, that you can't be false to any other man. I think I'm butchering Shakespeare's quote. Right? So that's self be true.

Right. It's an older one.

That is the truth. Right. So maybe it's not a million dollars. Maybe it's 250,000 and then half a million. It's okay, you don't need. Goals become demoralizing, and they fake you out. When they're out of reach, it's very easy to go, I'm gonna make a billion dollars. And you know, deep down inside of the recess of your brain, no way in hell it's gonna happen. That alleviates the pressure.

You know what's interesting? I was watching a TED Talk. Are you familiar with Derek Sivers?

No.

Okay, so he. He started a company called CD Baby back during the dot com boom and managed to actually sell the business before the big collapse. But he's. He kind of turned into this sort of, like, marketer, entrepreneur, philosopher type, and has a really, really great book that I would recommend anybody called Start with Jesus, Getting everything you want, I can't remember, but I'll link it up in the show notes. But anyway, he had this TED Talk where he was talking about goal setting is a negative thing in the sense that there's something that happens in your brain that when you decide, okay, this is a goal that I'm reaching for, and you actually write it on paper, oftentimes you get some sort of, like, release. And, like, you almost get a little bit of, like, that dopamine hit, as if you'd completed that goal just by writing down that this is my goal. And that actually makes you slightly less motivated to achieve that goal. There was this real interesting TED Talk that he did, and I'm probably totally killing the concept, but he was basically saying, when you set a lot of goals, a lot of times those goals actually get harder to reach. Because just the act of declaring them as goals actually sort of sets you back. I don't know if that makes sense.

To you, but it makes total sense. He's right. Half, half right. That's called cognitive distribution.

Right.

Which is just the reason why when you do GT you write things down, you feel better because it unloads it from your brain. Right. So he is right that you get an alleviation of the pressure. He's also wrong in that he thinks pressure is what motivates him. And maybe that's for him. That's not true at all. Pressure is not what motivates.

And also, just to give him a little more credit, I could totally be butchering the concept, but I will link you to the TED talk.

But.

I think his point is well taken and I agree with that, which is my point. The other thing is that when you write those goals down, if those goals are things that are not believable, hence not what you truly want, yeah, you're never going to achieve them. But the reticular activating system, the way the brain works, it's a teleological mechanism. It cannot not achieve a goal. Like it cannot think of not achieving something, whether it's going to eat tying your shoe. It's the way the brain works. The question is, are you giving it the right things to focus on? So I would argue that he's right. And then most people who know how to, who set goals do it wrong and do it really poorly. And goals become a demotivator. Right. And then people keep goals inside their head because they think they'll forget about them. If you know how to write down goals the proper way, which is the way the brain works, which has been taught to us since biblical times, Right. If we just we lost, we had the fundamentals and the principles down in the gosh, 3,000 years ago, up until about 1950s and then 60s, 70s, 80s get a little mixed up. 90s bad. But now we're so off track with such an being inundated by everybody telling you how to set goals, how to do this, how to do this, that they had to come up with something new to try to get your attention, they've lost it. But if you go back into the before the 1960s and look how people set go goals, they achieve them. And it's not smart. Smart doesn't work. We've proven that to be the case. But you have to link the goal as first, it's got to be something you really, really want and you have to link it with something else. Once that linking occurs, the goal becomes something you truly achieve. Your brain does it automatically, naturally. If you want to tell your brain how to do it, you have to Think about it purposefully, and we'll cover that in the webinar. His point is valid, but it isn't the end of the story.

That makes sense, and it depends on the person. It's whatever that motivator is, that thing that gets them to move.

That's part of the trick, right?

Is I mean, I certainly have a lot of goals that I've written down and have accomplished. So, I mean, I know it's not a blanket statement, but it's interesting to think about that.

I think a better way to say it is to say that if you put down goals that are not believable for you, they're a demotivator or they relieve the pressure. So I think qualify the statement with the kind of goals you're putting down. I agree with him, and maybe he said that, I don't know. But to say goals do X, Y, and Z, that's just silly. Like Stephen Heller taught me. He said that affirmations only work with those who don't need it. I was like, what the hell does that even mean? And he was partially right. What he meant to say was, those who don't need affirmations already have figured out the principles for affirmations to work. So doing it internally. But if you teach somebody the principles of affirmations and for them to do it right, they'll get the benefit. Now, they might get, like the story of the sword in the Bible. They might get 30%, 70%, 100%. Right. You know, the results will vary, right? But everybody will get something from it. Does that make sense?

Yeah, totally.

So for your audience, the Internet marketer, you know, and I don't teach, I don't know any tactics. That's your guys's, you know, genre is beyond what I could ever comprehend. What you guys do is pretty amazing. And I can tell you that anybody who wants to succeed in any business, particularly the entrepreneur, has to master the two skills, internal communication and external communications. And then, of course, they have to master numbers and people, right? That's what I tell my kids. You know, hey, learn internal and external communication, numbers and people that quadrant. You'll be okay now. And the two biggest decisions you'll make in your life are what you do for a living and who you marry. And you can change either of those two, right? Hopefully you won't change one, but you can always change the other if you don't like it. But this gives them the filter to go, you know, do I really want to date that person if I don't think I'm going to marry him. Why bother dating him? Or they could say, I'm going to. Like one of my sons does that. He goes, dad, I have no desire dating her because I don't think I could see my future. My other son's like, I'll date her, but I'm going to be clear that it's not going to go anywhere. Two different approaches, but the same principle, right. Of what happens to them. And of course, the career. It's like, hey, man, choose something. The whole passion thing I don't believe in. Right. Choose something that's interesting to you, not passionate, because you can be passionate about playing basketball. Be five foot three and you're gonna have a very tough time. Right?

Right.

Do something that interests you, where you can become better at it. I mean, if you look at the things that you've enjoyed in your life, hobbies or business, you've probably at some point or another realized you were interested in it. And you might have been really terrible at it.

Sure.

But somehow something and that interest allowed you to overcome, allowed you to have resilience, set goals. Right. Be persistent. That positive self talk, that interest promulgated that. And then the skill increase, and as a skill increase, your competency, then your confidence and sort of this cybernetic positive feedback loop that occurs. But that's because you were interested in something. The minute you lose interest in it, drop and go to something else. Don't force it. Like the book, Right. Like, my wife and I started rock climbing, you know, indoor climbing. Loved it. And we were like, this was awesome. We're gonna do great. This is fantastic. We're gonna set up for a membership, right. When you pay you. And we're gonna get the whole shoes and the thing and that. And we're driving home and we're like, you know what? Let's wait.

Let's keep going until we're not interested anymore. We went, went, went, went, went, went. Stop going. We may go back. But one day we're like, it just wasn't interesting anymore.

It's not bad. It's great. It may pick up another. I don't know, Right. I learned to trust that in myself because if I do that, then I become a hyper, disciplined individual versus an undisciplined person. And there's a difference, Right. If you follow your interest in intuition and you become disciplined, which is the key to success, if you have to force it, you no longer are disciplined.

Right. And that's the whole thing of the constraints to no constraints thing is like, there's more freedom with these constraints and the structure around you, rather than the opposite where it might be. I don't want anything's possible. Let's go anywhere, anytime.

Yeah, look, I'm super interested in egoscue. That's why I keep doing it. The way the body, the mechanism body works and doing some exercises changes the posture, changes the pain, which changes the performance. To me, it's just fascinating. So no matter how much I hate having to do, you know, runner, stretch and whatever, I do it. It's an interest that I have that I've had for a very long time.

Yeah.

So that allows me to be very disciplined. Right. You guys are interested in how to generate more traffic, which allows you to overcome the challenges and all that stuff and gets you to be the world's best at it. Right. This is where people. This is again going back from what you think you want versus what you truly want. So our goal is to master internal communication and external communication to get what we truly want. You know, Tony Robbins is a master at both, but he doesn't teach it very well. You know, when he got divorced from Becky, people like, you're Tony Robbins, you talked about being perfect and how you're wonderful and you're married with kids, and now you, you know, apparently you divorce your wife in the room, that you cheat on your wife, and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So Tony's business, which was similar at the time was over 10 years ago, was going down. It was like going to seminars, right. Because he's no longer congruent. He talks to talk, but isn't walking the walk. But Tony, knowing what an incredible human being he is and mastering the internal communication, said to himself, I'm only assuming. How do I turn this into a positive? How do I make this experience a great experience? Do you know what he did?

What did he do?

I'm not sure.

He created a relationships program with his new wife, Sage.

I do remember seeing that. You're right. Yeah.

That was a turning point for Tony. It was that moment that his business went like this and went to what it is today, which is the juggernaut that it is now. What happened for him was he mastered his internal communication. And then, of course, he knows external communication. He went out and started selling. Because it's all about being a selling machine, Right? Started selling, selling, selling. And then that developed in something else. Something else, something else. And now he is continuing at 59 to be a juggernaut and powerhouse. Now, I don't think he teaches it well, but he Models it beautifully.

Mm, definitely. Yeah.

So if you look at. If you look at. Look at. You know.

I don't want to talk about politicians because, you know, they're polarizing for a good reason. But you look at anybody who you admire that has had difficulties, what's changed for them was the internal communication. They got something from them. A change of perception, a change in behavior, a change in attitude that then allowed them to achieve something else. And it's because of what they truly wanted, not what they thought they wanted. Right. And so if not for Tony getting divorced and having gone through that and didn't let him put it, he probably would have been just another speaker today.

Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah, it's this. When others are getting something from whatever it is you're putting out there, if you're actually interested in that thing and you're working to be better or whatever it might be, you know, that fire inside of you is just going to go like, ooh, all right, I can do this better and better and keep growing and always. It's just. I could see it now. It's all kind of full circle.

Here, look. For me with martial arts, when I was heavy in the martial arts, every day. Not every week, Every day before going to class, I got the shits.

I was always like. I'd go poop because I was nervous.

Wow.

And it wasn't like I got over it. No, dude, it was. And when I started up again last year with Jason at Samson Ma, you know, I was doing privates with him, doing MMA stuff with him. Hey, man, I'll be there a little bit. Running late, taking a poop. Nervous, right? Heart beating, mouth dry. I got there and I was like, okay. And of course, I loved it. And it was fantastic. Right? So, you know, it's the interest that allowed me to overcome and override that fear or that lack thereof. Right. If I had no interest on it, you couldn't pay me to do something like that.

Yeah. Right.

So this is gonna. It's sort of a shifted topic, but sort of along the same lane when it comes to Jiu jitsu. So I know so many really successful people that absolutely love Jiu jitsu, and I'm curious, why do you think that is? Why do you think, like, Jiu jitsu and, like, successful people, there seems to be some sort of correlation there?

Well, I think. I think there's a trend. Right. I think it's sort of. It's permeated, like a thing. Right. Like pants with ripped jeans in them. Right. It Just became a thing because, you know, guys talked about it that were influential and go, let me go try it. They tried it. I think that's what happened. But the other component of it is that anything that gives us a flow state.

Releases chemicals in the brain that makes us feel good. Jiu jitsu in particular has a problem solving component to it. You're in the zone and you're solving problems. Plus, there is that psychosensory therapy. You are getting touched and caressed on. And I know this is going to sound weird for some guys, but sometimes a hug from another guy is more valuable than a hug from a woman if you're a guy, right? And so that male to male energy, right? When you can slap a guy and, you know, I can't tell how many crotches I've grabbed by accident, right.

I felt more penises than a hooker.

You know, you're just moving. My bad. You tell the guy, sorry. And you know, and I'm not talking like, I think I glazed my blunt. I can draw it, right? Like, I can draw.

The right testicle is bigger than the left testicle. The guy punched the left, the whole thing. Right? And mine's been grabbed a bunch of times, too.

Oh, yeah.

Like, hope you got a good feel. I know it's not much, but at least, you know, I have one.

This is going to be the clip that we promote this podcast with, by the way.

I think when you combine the male to male contact, when you combine the psychosensory therapy with it, when you combine the problem solving and you combine being in the flow, you combine learning and progressing. Because we, as human beings, we are wired to get better. And so when you see, like, I can now do something I couldn't do two weeks ago, it's very motivating, right? So I think. I think for the. And there's a camaraderie that exists. You know what I mean? Like, if I'm in the airport and I see somebody with cauliflower ears, either wrestler, MMA or jujitsu guy, right? Instantaneous. I don't have cauliflower ears, thank God. But instantaneous rapport. Hey, you do. Yeah. Boom. We know each other. It's a community, right? Because there are things that only he and I or she and I can relate to.

Mm.

And look. And by the way, if anybody hasn't tried it, you should definitely go try it.

Yeah.

I mean, it's even if you just want to roll. And by the way, the best jiu jitsu is flow roll. To me, flow roll is when you just, you know, let's just roll and you roll, and there's no ego. You're just. You're flowing. You tap. No big deal. There's no competitiveness on it.

Yeah. You're just maneuvering around each other and learning in the process. Okay. Yeah.

The problem is, you know, in your 20s, not, you know, you can. You can go hard every day, but as you get in your late 30s, early 40s to late 40s like I am, you know, you want to go often, and you can't go often if every time somebody beats you up and every now and then, you should, you know, once a month, go balls out to the wall. Right. Give it all you got, and then, you know, take a day off to off it. But I think that's probably why I think rock climbing is the same thing. You know, I was gonna say, even.

Working out, weightlifting, I do CrossFit type stuff. I don't do it in a group environment anymore, but similar thing. There's body movement. If I don't move right, I'm gonna freaking pop my back or something else, you know, so it's a little.

I think it's a little bit different than you. You lack some of the components, but you have some of others.

Well, there's no crotch grabbing, typically.

This is what. This is a challenge when you spot with women.

Right, Right.

You know, I spoke with women at the time, and, you know, I. I'm always very conscious that, hey, they've got three places. No, no, right. With the guy you've ever got. It's my bad, buddy. But here's the thing is women will tell you I don't care.

Right.

They're like, you know what, dude? You know, until, like, sometimes you go, my bad.

Yeah.

I mean, they know it's not. They know it's not a sexual thing. They know it's not.

Yeah, dude.

There is.

There is zero sexuality in. In investing, you know, and sometimes you grab it, and honestly, you don't think about it twice. Neither do they. So there's that. That camaraderie still exists. Right. In that felt. Are you guys doing jiu jitsu?

No. It's something I've considered. So for me, when it comes to, like, exercise practices, I haven't really totally found something that I just really enjoy. That's not to say I ever will find something I really enjoy with exercise, but, you know, I'm trying to find something and experiment with different things, you know, like, I can't just go to the gym and lift weights. I don't really like it. I don't. I'm not a big fan of, like, the. The CrossFit style thing. I've tried going for runs, and, you know, right now I. I take my dogs for really, really, really long walks. And that's my exercise because I listen to podcasts, and that's sort of my sort of zone out free time. But, you know, I've been kind of trying to find some things. I've done surfing for a little bit. Never totally got into surfing. And so, I don't know, like, jiu jitsu might be my next sort of rabbit hole. I test.

You know what? I think you're doing it the right way. You know, we.

We.

My wife and I said, my wife and I, because, you know, now we try to exercise together just to spend more. And we spend all day together every day, because we're working from home. But, you know, it's just. I don't want to be like, I'll see you later. I'm gonna go do X, Y and Z. Right. If you can do them better, that's what we do. Right, man? We just go, hey, let's go try this. And if we like it, we keep doing it. If not. And here's the thing is, I don't care if I do, you know, rock coming for three months, tennis for three months, biking for three months, and swimming for three months. Right. @ least I did a year of exercise. Yeah, that makes.

Sense.

Yeah. So I follow. Dude, test it all. Follow whatever interests you. If it doesn't interest you, don't do it. Yeah, it's stupid. You're just wasting your.

Time. Yeah, people beat themselves up too much for trying something, not enjoying it, deciding not to do it, and not sticking with.

It. Everybody else is doing.

It. But like you just said, like, you can jump from a different sort of activity every quarter. And at the end of the day, you still got exercise all year.

Long. Absolutely. And sometimes we'll go bike riding in a day, and another day we'll go running. Another day we'll go rock climbing. Another day we'll do what's called body walk, which is egoski patch. We'll be like, hey, you want to do this today? I find it more stimulating for me now. When I was heading to martial arts, it was every day, five hours a day. But that was then. And maybe, who knows, right? It's like, look, man, we got to stop imposing absolutes on certain people on certain things. Like, you know, there's certain absolutes, but there's, you know, don't kill.

Anybody. Right.

Right. No, absolutely right. You know, don't, you know, don't do this. I mean, but forget about that, right? I mean, in terms of how you live your life, focus on principles and then let. Let that guide you. Rather than, I'm going to own the judge. I'm going to own the judge. I'm going to have the judge. It's just your mind. Whatever, dude, you know, that makes you happy. Rock and roll. It's more like direction. Here's a better affirmation for me. I want to be the kind of guy that could buy the.

Jets. I see what you did.

There. Both you guys went, oh, that's a good one. Right Now, I don't, by the way, let's be clear. But I think because it takes the object away and puts it in me as the developing human being that's lacking maturity from somebody not understanding how the, you know, internal communication, whatever have you. And a lot of these guys, and I'm not saying this about Gary, particularly a lot of these guys, because I don't know him, but a lot of these guys will think they're saying what has made them successful, but in reality, they have no idea.

Like, here's what I did and no, it's not what you did. You know, here's how you become successful. No, it's not. Now they have success. They've achieved success. They somehow have managed to master the internal communication, but they haven't been able to get into the external world. That's what made Jim Rohn so incredibly good, was that he could take the internal and put in the external so that you could get it, too. That's why they called him a wardsmith. Make.

Sense? Oh, yeah, totally. It's that connection. Yeah. He's making that deep connection where they can figure out whatever he's putting down that's working for him, but he's passing the right words in the right way so they can emotion and. And everything, all of that.

Stuff. Right. And so, you know, a guy like Tony models it for us brilliantly, but I don't think he teaches it well, at least not in my opinion. Maybe I'm wrong right off the list. Guys are that.

Way.

Yeah. So. But, you know, but a guy like Gary, I mean, he's clearly got communication mastered, internal and.

External.

Right. Because he's, you know, successful monetarily. So I don't know him personally or anything in nature, but, you know, but is he really teaching the right way to do it? You know, and I, from what I've heard my answer. Would say probably.

Not.

Right.

But it doesn't stop him from being.

Successful. Right, Exactly. That's what's.

Interesting. We see a lot of that. Napoleon Hill was broke. Well, he became rich, and then he lost around the Depression, and then he struggled all the way until the 60s when he met W. Clement Stone. So this is the guy who wrote the definitive Bible, Personal Growth and How to Get Rich. And like a good friend of mine says, don't judge the art by the artist. Meaning don't dismiss his work just because he didn't apply it. Well, part of his life. Right. So, you know, because sometimes there's like. That's like saying that Peter Drucker is a failure because he never owned a successful business. Are you freaking kidding me? He revolutionized management. He is one of the thought leaders of our time. He never owned the business. But, man, the guy knew how to say. Right. It makes.

Sense.

Sure. So, you know, like, Ayn Rand's work and Atlas Shrug was incredible, but she was a disaster as a human.

Being.

Right. So I'm not going to say, well, her work is crap because she was crap. No, no, no. I'm a big boy. I can separate the.

Two. Yeah. And I think a lot of folks don't know that or know how to separate this, or you take the time to understand. Understand the two pieces that are out there. You're.

Right. Well, that's like saying that the art would only be valuable if the artist was great. I'm sorry, how many artists were screwed up in the head? And I think it was a.

Requirement to be an.

Artist.

Right. Van Gogh cut his ear.

Right. I mean, it wasn't Picasso. A.

Philanderer.

Yeah. But incredible artist. Right. So I may not like Picasso. I may not like, you know, Michelangelo. I loved Raphael, actually. I like Michelangelo. But the artwork itself stands on its own. Does that make.

Sense? Yeah, yeah. No, that makes perfect sense. They're independent, and it's up to us to decipher that and to figure out whatever is really true in us. The interest level, you know, and.

Then. This is the world's longest.

Podcast. I was going to say, we're watching you on video and it's slowly getting.

Darker.

I.

Think. This is actually. Actually an amazing podcast. This is the type of podcast that we get the most amount of feedback on, is when we kind of start doing this sort of deep mindset work and. And helping people uncover some of these things and giving.

People.

Aha. Moments about how their brain is working and why it's doing the Things they're doing and why they fall into the habits they're falling into. I think this is probably going to be one of our more talked about episodes, to be quite.

Honest. Well, let's.

Tease. I hope so. I hope.

So. Yeah, let's tease the webinar just briefly. I know it's literally, we're coming up with it on the spot, but you have a lot of material.

That'S. Go.

Ahead. Yeah. I mean, a lot of this stuff. Oh, the.

Lights. There we.

Go. It looks a lot better on video.

Yeah. So we could tease this webinar. What are some points that you think that you would love to present on there for folks? Obviously we have this kind of affirmation or this system, the audio that we were.

Referencing. So here would be. I mean, we'll give the audio away for free. Right. Even though it's part of the package of the other stuff. But here's honestly what I like. Right. So here's my outcome. At the end of the webinar, I would want the attendees to have a transformational event where they begin to do things differently and feel differently. Right. And I think the way for us, because look, the way the mindset impacts everything in your life, your relationships, your health, your business, to make more money. So I think at the end of the webinar, I'd want people to have a transformative experience where they might make small changes that lead to great results later.

We can talk about. We can do things like tactics. But what I'd rather do is have an experiential webinar. In other words, I've seen webinars where they just go, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And they just dictate.

Right?

Sure. I like to run them through a process.

Like, hey, guys, here's what we're going to do. You know, show up with pen and paper, or journal paper, whatever you can. I'll explain the principle of why. And then you look like, like my audio. I get to do it, don't.

I? Oh, yeah. And that's exactly what. What I felt like. It's an experiential process. And I feel like that is the best way that we could present. That's how you work. I mean, throw out some principles, of course. But then let's. Let's be actionable with this right here. And there's. You do it right on the webinar just like you do with the audios. That'd be an amazing.

Thing. I think that's what it would do. It would be about getting them And I think the outcome would be to unhook some of the negative experiences in past that they have.

And propel them like a slingshot forward to what they really want. I'd like for them to be able to learn how to be self motivated, even when they don't want to be self motivated. I know it sounds kind of cliche, ish or silly, but I wanted to really go, oh, I don't feel like doing egoscue. Do it anyway. I'm petrified of going in that machine. You go on anyway, right? Because that is the truth. To me, that's true. Success is we should get so excited about making ourselves do the things that we know we should do but don't feel like.

Doing. It's life, right? We got freaking life. And a bunch of unexpected stuff's going to hit us at times. And. And if we can weather the storm with this solid mindset and knowing what we are personally working towards, then what the hell is going to stop.

You? Do you guys remember? You're just reminding me of this. Do you remember the movie World War Z with Brad.

Pitt? Oh, yeah.

Yeah. Zombie.

Movie. Oh yeah, that's.

Right. Okay, that is my wife's most watched movie of all.

Time.

Interesting. Okay, he's watched it and I'm not making this up. Over 50 times. Whenever she doesn't want to watch. Just puts in the background, washes dishes back, whatever. Right. And I watch it because of that a bazillion times. We love it. It's like a roller coaster movie. There's a scene in that movie where Brad Pitt is taking his wife and two girls through the apartment complex and ends up in the apartment of the Hispanic family. Remember.

That? Vaguely. It's been a long.

Time. I have to watch it.

Now. So anyway, so he's running up, he's running from the zombies, goes into an apartment building, goes to the top, sees a kid, chases the kids, knocks on the door. Kid opens the door, walks in, close the door. And it's another family of a boy, the mom and the dad. The boy speaks English and Spanish, the mom and the dad don't. And Brad, Kate, as you remember, the character was before a un special, not force, but a special guy, whatever the case. So he knew what was up. So they spend the night, they're going to get stuff. And then Brad Pitt tells the homeowner, we got to keep moving. And then the little son repeats him in Spanish, right? Quier nos mue mos teremo que muvernos. And Brad Pitt says, movimento es vida, movimiento esmida. Right. Life is movement. Life is movement. Meaning you don't ever stay put. You must always move. And I think that is probably the biggest key to understanding proper, successful, happy mindset. Always keep moving. I love it. The brain serves a purpose and that is to move the body.

And if we're not moving, we're not growing. And so the difference isn't whether you feel like it or not, it's whether or not you're able to do it despite not feeling like doing it because you are interested, because there's a purpose behind it, because the mindset is. My mindset's right with egoscue. That's why I do it even though I don't want to do.

It. Yep. It's right though. Yeah. Love.

It. And the more I do it, the more my self confidence increases, my more the self efficacy increases, the more my discipline increases, the more my self esteem increases. Right. The more everything around my life gets to be better. You know, it's that, as Charles Duhigg would say, that keystone.

Habit. Right.

Right. But I think the real keystone habit is getting yourself to do the things you want to do, even when you don't feel like doing.

It. That's it. Love it. All right, man, I think we've teased it enough. I don't. We don't know a date for this yet. We'll figure it all out.

Later. So let's just say it's going to be at hustle and flowchart.com Marx M A Rx and we'll make sure that by the time this episode goes live, that link actually goes somewhere. So. Hustleandflowchart.com marksmarx and that's where you'll be able to register. Is there anywhere else you want to send people after listening to this? Any. Any website, website or social media or anything you want people to go and check.

Out?

They can email me if they want. I'd rather have communication with personal@markscallmarks.com C A L L M A R X.com marksallmarx.com youm can put the link at the bottom and if just hey, email me what you're interested in and how I can help you. The other thing is if we can somehow put a way for them to send comments about the webinar. Hey, I'd like to cover this. Hey, here's my problem. Hey, you know, the more feedback we get, the more I can tailor, make it for that specific group of individuals or person.

Right. Yeah, we could do that. Maybe after you reserve your space, have a little comment box. Have a.

Little. Yeah, we can definitely do that. That's not a problem at.

All. Good idea.

I'm just going to say if you're listening and you're thinking about reaching out to Marks, it will be a good thing you reached out. But you better get ready. Get ready for the thunder because he'll hold your ass to the fire and make sure you. You do whatever you're. You know, you're going to do what you want to do.

So. Well, it's about making sure that you take.

Action.

Sure. You know, look, I.

The great. I think the greatest reward that someone can give themselves to your point earlier.

Joe.

Yeah. Is encouraging and holding yourself accountable to the standard that, you know, that you should.

Be.

Yes. Keith Cunningham once told me he said. And people stole this quote, but I want to attribute it to Keith Cunningham. He said, hell on earth is meeting the man you could have.

Been.

Yes. And a couple of posers have stolen it and they don't give him credit. And I don't like that at all because that's not cool. But that changed my life. Like, holy. Because I wasn't that guy. And wouldn't that suck if you walked up and said, hi, I'm Joe, the guy you could have been. Hi, I'm Matt, the guy you could have been. I mean, that's.

Terrible. Yeah. Well, that's the whole common thing on, you know, someone on their deathbed, what I could have been, what I wanted to do in life.

Yeah. I heard something on the Joe Rogan podcast that somebody said that. That most people on earth have the most profound insights of their entire life in the last five minutes of their.

Life.

That's true. But that totally.

Blows. Yeah, it blows. And I could see it being.

Yeah. But there was a book called the Five Regrets of the Dying, and this woman wrote a book about. She was a caregiver, is a caregiver and wrote a book. And the regret was, I didn't love the right person. I didn't do what I want. It wasn't. I didn't work enough. I wasn't true to myself. Was. The general theme of it. Right. Goes back to what you want versus what you really, really want. And I think people that die with no regrets, and there's plenty of them, they have. They've had challenges and failures and issues, but not like I wish I had kind of thing, are the ones that are true to themselves, you know, and they become very happy and very.

Successful. Love it you know what I mean? Very interesting. I was just thinking, like, I gotta call my dad because I want to hear him. And like, I'm like, I'm going to ask him, what the hell do you want? What do you want? I don't talk to him a lot, by the way. So this is like literally just vulnerable, random thought. I'm like, I should just ask him, what does he.

Want?

What? Last point and we'll end with.

This and then we'll wrap.

Up. Yeah, sorry. I.

Know. It's.

Okay. So my wife and I, we were going through a tough time when I lost our first fortune, right? And I think I might have told you guys this story, but I want to tell it again. And this is, gosh, 11 years ago, long time. And we were broke, right? We're living in this big beautiful mansion in California. You know, kids, the whole thing, stuff. But we can't, you know, like Zig Ziglar said, if it took two nickels to go around the world, I couldn't get out of sight or whatever it is. We were just poor and we were just not getting along that way because money fights and we're young or whatever have you. And so I walked up to her and I said, hey, baby, do you want to go do something crazy? She goes, yeah, because she's totally adventurous. She goes, yeah. I said, let's go to Europe now. We had not taken a vacation in forever and we'd worked like crazy and now we're 37, 30, sorry, 38. And I had my assistant book us first class flights with American Express points because we had no money the following week. And then we would. So like literally a week later, we're landing in Italy. The boys are being helped by my mom at the time and my daughter. And we had an amazing eight day trip, spend money we didn't have. And they went to a restaurant in Venice. And it was a little corner restaurant that. Because we told the guy at the hotel in Venice, hey, we want to mangia moto Benjamin. The guy's like, oh. I was like, no, no, I want the authentic. Where you would go. He goes, okay, go to this little place, a tiny place, four tables, right? The chef was the owner, a woman who opened the restaurant across the street from her husband because she didn't like working with him. Really funny.

Right?

Yeah. So we get there and I said, I'll order whatever. She gave me like squid, spaghetti. It was amazing stuff. And we're eating, right? And I never asked my wife this question. This was a life changing Moment. And we've ordered a bottle of wine. We didn't drink, so you can imagine what happened. We got totally drunk and I said to her, I said, baby, what are your dreams? I been with her since we were age 18, 20 years together now 30, 20 years together. Never asked her. It was always what I wanted. And she went on for two hours. My wife doesn't talk much because obviously two hours non stop. Just. And just everything she wanted to do and I had no idea. And those were things I didn't ever think of doing. Basically it was to travel a lot and do all these things. So I have dedicated the last 10 years of our lives to achieve all that she wanted to achieve. And we are right. But boy, what a great question for her to sort of get out what she really wanted for your dad, right? What she really wanted. And because I love her almost as much as I love my kids, right? It was about, hey, it makes me happy to make her happy. So. And that changed. Our relationship went from 7, 6 to a.

12. I love.

It. Right? And I mean, so that's why earlier on you talked about, you know, for yourself. I totally get it, but really it's. Do you get happiness in achieving goals for other people? I do.

Yeah. Oh, yeah, 100%. I join you in that. So that's why I thought of my dad. I'm like, man, if I know this about myself and what's possible, how about others? The other people I love that I know and need a little bit of that push or that little whatever that spark.

Is. So. What a great question to.

Ask. Yeah, it'll.

Happen. Well, I hate to feel like we're rushing at the wrap up, but we actually do have another call in about eight minutes.

Here. It's our last.

Podcast. I have a feeling this isn't the last time you'll be on our.

Podcast. So smarter every damn time we talk. So, yeah, why would we.

Stop? This is the fourth time we've been on the.

Podcast. Yeah, well, expect a lot.

More. Alan Rudin and Negin.

Right? That's.

Right. I have a feeling it won't be the last. I'm sure our listeners will be hearing from you again and hustleandflowchart.com marks is the link we want people to go.

To. And appreciate you, man. Yeah, this has been really.

Good. Appreciate you guys. Thank you so much. Hope it was useful and for the listener. I hope and I pray that you do something with this, not just.

Listen.

Yeah. Love.

It. All right, my man, take care. Have a great.

Night. Thank.

You. All right. Thank you. And I hope you just enjoyed this episode you just listened to. Now, right now, before we sign off, I have a few things I would love for you to do. So the very first thing is to go find our guest on Facebook and tell them that you loved their episode with us. That's going to help them just feel good about themselves, but also it's going to spread the word a little bit more for us. Go find them on Facebook. Everybody's on Facebook. And go say that you love their episode and maybe one cool thing that you learn there. The second thing thing is to go to itunes and subscribe to our podcast. Just look up Hustle and Flowchart and hit the subscribe button. And the very last thing, the third thing is to leave us a review on itunes or wherever you're listening to this podcast and help us spread the word more. That's how more people are going to get this awesome knowledge, this, this cool podcast training and a whole bunch of other cool, free training that we give out at evergreenprofits. Com. So that's about it. Go find them on Facebook, go subscribe on itunes and leave us a review. You would be amazing if you did that, but you're always amazing. So thanks for listening and we'll catch you in the next.

Episode. You're awesome.