Matthew Woodward - The Practical 5-Step SEO Framework

Boom, boom. Boom. Boom, boom.

What's up, everybody? You're listening to the Hustle and Flowchart podcast with your boys, Mount Wolf and Joe Fear. Buenos dias.

Bueno.

How you doing?

Amazing.

How was your weekend?

Weekend was good.

Just remember this is a weekend a couple weeks from now.

Jesus, you expect me to remember that Many weekends ago. Yeah.

To be honest, this is coming out today, but I don't know what day today is.

It's been hot in San Diego. I know that. Yeah, but it's San Diego in the summer. Makes sense.

Yeah.

Well, yeah, I'm not gonna say the date. I guess we're recording this. Cause that's not the date. We're listening to this.

It's true.

All right, so my Siri is going off on my phone. I should probably turn that off. It's gonna be really weird. Dude, my head is like exploded with. I know.

There's frickin a mess everywhere.

Jesus. Horrible. It's knowledge. I gotta pick up the SEO pieces and connect the dots now, you know?

Yeah, man.

Dude, today's episode. Who we chatting with?

We're talking to somebody with the initials mw.

Oh, my God. And his name is Matt.

Yeah, we're talking to Matt W. Today.

Oh, geez. It's not confusing at all.

No, it's Matthew Woodward of Matthew Woodward.co.uk you got to check out his site. His site is all about SEO and blogging and online careers and cool stuff like that. With a really, really strong emphasis on SEO. He is an SEO ninja. What are you looking for?

My squeaky chairs. So squeaky. It was actually funny right before the recording of this, like the chair, I sat down in it and it just went.

Yeah, it crashed down. That was a nice icebreaker. Before the conversation started was like, hey, Matt, nice to meet you. Joe just fell on his butt.

Lardy Joe over here.

Yeah, it was a good icebreaker and chairbreaker. So now I'm on a squeaky chair.

Yeah. No, today Matthew's breaking down his five step SEO audit. We dive pretty deep into, like this, this. These five things that you should really pay attention to on your site. I was about to go into them, but I won't let Matthew go into them.

But the audit. So don't be scared by the audit title. Maybe the title of this episode. We should not put audit in the title.

Yeah, that will scare people away.

Just to make it a clickbaity thing. But clickbait. So you benefit because after you go through the five steps and it's not some boring thing like Matthew. Matt. I'm gonna call him British Matt actually. That's what we established.

Yeah, British Matt, American Matt. Gotcha.

Yes. Okay, so British Matt, when we're talk.

It very clear, like it doesn't take crazy technical skills to implement the changes. There's a bunch of tools out there that are free or paid if you choose to. And like he was saying, if you just focus even on a couple of these things, you're going to be light years past like where you're currently at in terms of like site speed and mobile stuff. I'm going to stop there. But just little things like that. It's like these little tweaks can make everything so much easier on your website. Yeah.

And at the end, we even asked him for a couple quick wins. You know, I asked him, I wanted to know, like, what's your favorite backlinking strategy to collect backlinks and then what's your favorite on page SEO strategy? And the on page SEO strategy, give us the end fricking ninja.

We challenge you to actually do it and let us know the results because literally the results, he said, can be instant. Maybe five minutes at the max. Yeah.

And I think you made a comment, you're like, nobody listening to this is probably actually going to do it. So there. Gauntlet, throw down to you. Yes, you, Mark. Mark, I know you're listening, Jim.

It's. It's not your day today, but you could do it too. But Mark, we really want to hear from you, Mark. Yeah, like, we know you got it in you, right? So I mean. Yeah, so just go do it. Mark.

Mark, just get on it. And if, if your name's Mark and you're listening to this and you're like, wonder if he's actually talking. Yes, we're talking to you, Mark.

We're. Yeah, we're not watching you. We're just talking to you. It's not that creepy.

So gauntlet, throw down the strategies at the end, implement them and let us know.

Let's do it. The challenge is in your hands now.

Also, notes. We mentioned a few times that we were taking a ton of notes on.

This show and you need these notes like they. Holy crap. And even actually it was funny because British Matt, when he reached out to us, he was like, all right, my pitch, essentially his pitch to us was these are going to be the most epic notes you're ever going to have. And I know he achieved that. He over delivered. Yeah, 100%.

So hustle and flowchart.com comp you can get them for Free in the short window that they're available. I just want to remind you, they are only available in, like, a short window. So when this episode goes live, go and get those notes as quickly as you can. Otherwise, they get locked into our Evergreen Profits vault. Our what? We're actually rebranding Evergreen Profits membership. Should we. Should we unveil it here?

Yeah. It's going to be epic.

It's going to be epic. Evergreen Profits Insider Club Epic.

Let's put her here. So do you want to be epic with us?

I do.

Oh, do you?

Okay.

I was waiting for someone to respond. I was like, wow, this is not that epic anymore. Yeah.

So I mentioned our notes. They get locked down into the vault. Well, the vault is now the Epic Vault, the Evergreen Profits Insider club. So make sure that you go grab them for free while you can, hustleandflowchart.com comp. Otherwise, they're gonna get locked into our epic vault.

Epic vault. So don't. I mean, definitely grab them if you, you know, within the span of time. Because, like Matt said, it's a short span of time. So if you want to get Matthew's notes, British Matt's notes, all about SEO and all that stuff, be quick, because epic. Be epic. Don't be epic.

Don't be a T. Rex.

Yeah, well, T. Rex, you know, the small arms, you know, it's.

Can't reach their pockets.

Can't reach the. Unless you got long pockets. And that's cool, too. But at the same time, it's just. Do you really want to be a T. Rex?

No, I don't want to be a T. Rex. Are you sure? No, I want to be epic.

Okay. So you could be epic and actually get access to everything. We have a whole bunch of all the previous notes. So if you happen to miss this little tiny window of time, don't be the T. Rex.

Don't be the T. Rex. Just go get inside the vault. Epic vault.

Yeah. Got to reach the pockets. All right.

But notes are available for free for a limited time. Hustleandflowchart.com comp and also.

Yeah, this is cool. This is a perfect segue.

Yes.

And I have a little note, because, actually, British Matt, Matthew Woodward referenced Ahrefs many times, obviously. SEO tool. They are a sponsor of the show, and he said one of his favorite tricks with Ahrefs was actually stealing other people's links.

Yeah, let's let him explain it. Future in the episode, we'll open that loop that he's gonna explain how to steal other people's links and using Ahrefs. And right now you're gonna hear him talk about how we use Ahrefs and we. We use it too. It's our SEO tool of choice. Seven bucks. Seven days. That's all it's going to cost you. So, you know, in those seven days, you can go steal all the backlinks you want from people, but use Matthew strategy. Be ethical about it. Don't be.

Ahrefs. Ahrefs.com. they're an amazing sponsor. They're an amazing tool. We use them and we talk about them in this episode. So check them out.

Ton of free tutorials on their YouTube channel, all that stuff. But go check them out, ahrefs.com you're gonna love them. Free seven. Not free seven day trial. That doesn't work.

$7.

$7.

Buck a day.

Buck a day. Buck a day trial for seven days. I like that.

All right, let's go talk some SEO stuff with Matthew Woodward.

Let's be epic together.

Remember, be epic. Don't be a T. Rex.

That's my epic, epic sound. That's not a T. Rex sound, I swear.

Yeah. No. Joe Rogan.

Hey, Matt. Welcome to the show.

Hey, how are you doing? Thanks for having me on.

Yeah. Not to confuse you with the other Matt in the room here.

Which we do often do.

British Matt and American Matt. That works. That works because we often do shows where like, Joe might interview me or I might interview Joe. So we start off the shows like, hey, Joe, how you doing? Or hey, Matt, how you doing? So.

Yeah, man, I mean.

It just seems like you are doing some interesting things. And we were talking about prior to the hit and recording, like the SEO EP do extremely well on this podcast.

Yeah.

I feel like it's something that everyone wants to kind of keep their finger on the pulse and it's always changing. So it's perfect.

Yeah, it has people's attention because it's kind of like the black art and people always looking for little tidbits here and there and things that they can integrate into their own strategy and, well, if that's you, you're in luck today. So.

Yeah, and I saw that, well, you've been doing this since you're 13 years old online. Was that all SEO focused or was that just when you kind of.

Oh, no. I started building websites then I was into competitive gaming. YouTube didn't exist. We had nowhere to share our demo videos, which we were recording with, like, video out from our PC to a VHS player on a VHS tape and then a video capture Card and you press play on the VHS card. On the vhs. And then you'd press record on the computer and VHS would play into the computer. Computer. Oh man, those kind of times.

Yeah. That's funny. You reminded me of this. I read something on Reddit today. It said like, now there's this hack for Nintendo 64. You can plug on this like little thing that polishes all the pixels so it looks like games nowadays. I'm like, oh, it's kind of like the VHS days. Those were kind of, you know, overlapping. Pre YouTube. I was like, gaming. Yeah. Game is crazy.

That's crazy. That's what drove me to kind of build websites and, and you know, and in essence build a community. I mean, I didn't know it at the time, but I guess back then I was learning all the skills that allowed me to become successful in today's world.

But yeah, I mean, I had a paper round, you know, to pay for the server. Wow.

Yeah. The fact that you have a server. Yeah. Or had one. That's huge. So what's the, what did the progression look like for you? So you started gaming, doing all this cool recording stuff, video. How did that shape up into where you're at now?

Always had an interest in kind of sales. Yeah. I was always finding a way at school, you know, to make a bit of money here and there and.

Kind of. It took me a while to realize, hey, you can make money with this Internet thing. Like the two, the two worlds are connected. I didn't probably didn't realize that until I was about 17, 18, got into the corporate world.

Data entry for web and ended up as head of online marketing. Any of you that's listening that are currently in the corporate world or have ever been in the corporate world, know how much it sucks. Yep.

In there. That's right.

So yeah, I got out of there and I've been doing my own thing for the last ten years or so.

Yeah.

Yeah. Wow.

Okay.

It's been a journey.

So what was like your first, I guess, money making adventure online when you started to connect the dots a little bit.

Do you remember years ago when people were like, hey, get a free ipod touch. Just refer to 12 friends. Yeah, free ipod. Yeah, that, that. I absolutely killed it. I was ranking number one for free iPod. Free ipod, free insert, whatever you, you can think of.

And I've done a deal with the network, so I was getting paid on a commission on a, on a money basis rather than a freebie basis. And.

Back in, in the uk, the deal to promote at that time was we had a service called Love Film, which was DVD rental by post. And basically the front end deal to the consumer was if they sign up to get two free DVDs, which obviously everyone wants to do, then I got paid $30 on the back end.

Ah, okay, got it.

So it was just like, yeah, it was just so easy. It was unbelievable. And that's, that's when I started making an awful lot than my very well paying corporate job. And I was like, yeah, eject.

Got it.

That's awesome. So it was SEO from the very beginning and you just paired it up with an offer or a trend that you saw online?

Yeah, yeah.

Been sharpening the tool set ever since.

Nice. So what does it look like now? I know you have a blog over@matthewwoodward.com Co UK and yeah, you have like amazing topics there all around SEO, all that stuff. So what's the business model and where's your focus at these days?

I did a lot of price comparison type sites.

As opposed to just doing the Amazon affiliate stuff, but cleared my deck of a lot of sites last year. So have then been with new learning, starting new sites and building those up.

Of course there's a Matthew Woodward blog, there's the agency searchlogistics.com if you want my team to do all the hard work for you, and a few older cash cows that have been steady over the years that.

More than keep me comfortable.

So I guess I'm just always playing and evolving and reset in play and revolve learn.

Yeah. Well, sounds like in the SEO world you got to do a lot of resetting and replanning because I mean, it seems like a lot of the, the tactics and the rules change all the time. I mean, I think we'll probably get into this, but a lot of the core rules never change, but a lot of the little tactics that work once seem to change often.

Yeah. And it's not strictly in the SEO world. If you think about everything you've learned about podcasting and if you could start from scratch and design it from. With all of your current learnings, it's like, oh, I wish I could be a teenager again, but knowing what I know now, you know, like applying that to your business and using that to evolve not just in SEO but in everything from like how you produce content, how you. Everything, everything.

Yeah. And like you said earlier, you've just been sharpening the tool set, the toolkit, every single time. Yeah. Like podcast. And if we actually stuck with it back in the day, we'd be Joe Rogan now.

But we're not Joe Rogan.

Yeah, we're not Joe Rogan. But yeah, like, we started podcasting way back when, before it was like the top of mind thing, I guess. And SEO, you hopped on that when people weren't thinking about that with the freebie giveaways or, you know, whatever.

Yeah, I mean, I remember when link building wasn't really a thing. Yeah, interesting.

Back when you can put a whole bunch of keywords in white font at the bottom of the page.

Oh, man.

Yeah, it's like, who can get like to 5000% keyword density?

Definitely remember those days.

Oh, yeah.

So, yeah, I've seen it all. I've seen things go. I've seen things come back. I've seen people say, this doesn't work anymore. That was my currently number one strategy. I've seen it. Yeah, yeah, you name it, you've seen it.

So what are some things that you just spot that people are still trying to do with SEO that you're like, no, dude, that's not going to work anymore.

The classic one is like pinging.

Ping your links, ping this. No, man, that's not been a thing for.

A long time. It's been so long, I can't even remember how long. Seven or eight years, something like that.

Oh, my God, that long? Okay, yeah, I've definitely done it. I've done it prior to that point.

Since then, we've definitely. It's been a while, but.

Okay, that's a good one. Anything other top of mind things that.

Pop up to you, really.

Nothing'S really changed that much. It's still all about, just as it always has been, creating content that matches a user's intent, supported by links. It's always been that. It's just that before, as SEOs or the SEO community weren't doing it with people in mind, now there's been a mindset change in the community, and they're doing it with people in mind. But the people that found success in the early days realized that they were building sites for people and were creating content for people, much like you would a magazine or anything that nothing's really changed, just that the model of delivery has changed. The content that was previously delivered in a magazine is now delivered online. And SEOs were not approaching things with that same mindset. They were just like, right, 500 words, 3% keyword density, smash it with links, Whoa. And not really thinking about, oh, well, what happens when someone comes on the page is this, you know, so now.

Google's forcing people to think about that. Whereas previously it was optional, but the people that were finding success were the people that have always been doing that.

So it's like any industry, right? Do the basics right. If you do all of the basics right, you find success. And many people don't do the basics right. They want to run off and start building links. They want to run off and do this, that and the other. But they haven't taken the time to build a foundation that neither Google loves or any intelligent human being would love. You know, like people aren't building that basic foundation out before they run off and start worrying about other things. So yeah, I guess, I guess that's one of my approaches to SEO. Just do the basics right, keep it simple.

Nothing's really changed over the years except for Google's just making us work a bit harder. But if you weren't doing that in the first place, you probably weren't finding success.

So yeah, I do remember like, I don't know, maybe seven years ago or something, you could go on Fiverr and buy like 300 backlinks and just like rank real quick. And then, you know, a couple years later, everybody who was buying those backlinks was regretting it.

Yeah, yeah.

And then you had all the article spinner days where everybody was trying to take the same article and spin it into 30 different articles and then post it on 100 different sites.

Yeah. And look, all of that still works. Google will still index that content and there is a time and place to use that kind of content. But people try and use it on their front facing money sites. They try and use it to like as guest posts, you know, like. Yeah, it's just not. So. Yeah, I guess that's the most common problem I see is people trying to take shortcuts. Really.

So it's basically like start off. Yeah. With the money site. Like you said is like your like would be your Matthew Woodward site and for us, Evergreen profits. But yeah, so it's like build that solid foundation of great content there and have a great user experience. So Google sees your on time, you see the engagement, they're flipping through your pages and stuff like that. But then yeah, yeah, do all your other stuff maybe on, I don't know, Medium or all these other, I don't know if Medium is a good one. But you know all these other. Other sites or guest posts.

Yeah, just build a foundation that Google loves.

Not that Google loves. That your visitors love more than anything else.

We're going to be talking a little bit about SEO audits Today. And I'll tell you how listening to your visitors ties into an SEO audit. Because most people that are doing technical SEO audits miss the human factor.

It's, it's the humans are the people at the end of the day pulling a wallet out, finding the card, typing that irritating bloody 16 card digit number in and address and all that, you know, to give you their money you'd like. So they're the people you want to focus on. You can't, you know, you can't create great SEO content if it wasn't great human content first.

Yeah, absolutely. Well, let's go ahead and shift into that because I think that was the next place we're going to take the conversation anyways. You know, you've got your five, your five point SEO audit. Let's, let's go ahead and just dive into that.

Okay. So.

The problem with technical SEO audits is they're technical. It makes them out of reach for some people, first of all, in understanding, first of all, what to look for and then second of all, once they find something that they think they should fix, how on earth to fix it.

So that makes SEO audits unreachable for a lot of people.

Now what's also interesting is when I send out SEO audit or anything on page to my list, the open and click through rate is awful. If I send a link building strategy, everyone's on it like wildfire.

Interesting. Okay.

Funny thing is I very, very rarely, and I mean like possibly only a handful of sites a year do I see that have on page. Right? So if you're listening to this and you're probably like every other person in the hundreds, thousands of people that have gone, no, my own page is perfect. And you're that person that's thinking that right now statistically like 99.95%, you're wrong.

And you should be paying attention to them. Now I'm showing people where just by applying an SEO audit increases of search traffic by 45%.

Wow.

People are interested. But you have full control over an SEO audit. You have full control over your page. You have full control, which is rare in SEO. So it's something you should pay attention to. And I figured the reason people were turned off by SEO audits is because it sounded scary and technical. So I decided to create the common sense SEO audit and break it down into five steps so that anyone can do it.

Hopefully that changes.

Review audits because if they can just do some simple stuff and see results, then they might want to invest in it a little Bit more. Because let me tell you this, once you build a solid foundation that Google loves, all of your other efforts, like link building on off site efforts, the value of that is amplified 10 times. Like if you do what we're about to explain, right, then.

You'Ll save money because you'll need to spend, invest less on link building. Not only that, the sites will attract links naturally. So previously, where you might have to invest 50, 200, $300 per link, well, you could attract 10, naturally, you save thousands of dollars. So yeah, I'm going to talk you through.

No, that's great. Yeah, I love the preface there because a lot of folks, I think, get intimidated when they go to Semrush or Hrefs or something like that and do the site audit and they're like, whoa, what is this thing? You know, and what do we do? So, yeah, it's very technical and I think that does stop most people, but it's super important.

Yeah. So I mean, we've touched on this a little bit already, but the very first step in any SEO audit is to listen to the visitors.

So before you use a tool or scary tool like Semrush or this, that and the other, first of all, you need to, well, listen to the people. What do they want? So.

You usually have some kind of access to your visitor base, social media, email, or whatever it is. You just need to ask them what they ask them. Well, in my case, I ask people, what content do they want to learn about, how do they want to consume that content, and what do they like or dislike about the current site.

And those questions, first of all, tell me what direction to take the content strategy in terms of topics. Secondly, it says, how should I give them that content? Maybe it's in short blog posts, maybe it's in Ultimate Guides, maybe it's in videos, maybe it's in infographics. How do they want to consume the content? And third of all, from a user experience, what do they like and what don't they like?

I like that. Okay.

Once you've collected that data across even, even if you just collect that data of 10 or 15 people, it gives you good indications as to where your SEO strategy as a whole should be going. No tool can tell you that. But in a world where we're distracted by automation and tools and numbers and statistics and graphs, we forget about the human element.

And that's something AI can't. Yeah, AI can't handle that for us or some software. It's the creativeness. You want that human touch.

Yeah. Yeah, and it's simple. Like we've lost touch of the basics. Like if this was a brick and mortar business, do these things, you know. So why is this business any different? We've been doing surveys like this for hundreds of years. Yeah. So.

In my case, people came back and said they liked. 70% of people said that they liked SEO content. Figures.

Makes sense.

65% said they like traffic generation. And I know that adds up to more than 100%, but people are allowed to pick more than one topic.

And 50% said they like making money content. 40% hate blogging content. So straight away I knew that I'm never going to produce any more conversion based content, social media based content, income reports, or anything else that doesn't align to SEO, traffic generation, blogging.

That's smart, man. That just saved yourself a lot of work and mystery of what to write about.

Yeah, yeah. And tons of money. Tons and tons and tons and tons of money. People also told me that they like reading blog posts and watching videos. In fact, 80% liked watch reading blog posts, 70% like reading videos, and ironically, 20% only like listening to podcasts.

Interesting. Thank you for hopping on the show here.

So I had been thinking, oh, maybe I'll do a podcast. You know, everyone's doing podcast. Yeah, yeah. No, no. My readers are telling me they don't want that. So I save myself a ton of time. Yeah. You know, it's not just about SEO, but in the resource of the business as well. Then what do you like? What don't you like? People love that. It was easy to understand. There was lots of free information. The content's helpful, detailed, step by step processes. They love that. It's comprehensive, covers both sides of the coin. It's transparent, it's honest, original ideas. After feedback like that, trust me, your head inflates and you're like, just before you skip to the next page of negatives, you're like, well, what could possibly be wrong?

I'm perfect.

Yeah, I'm perfect. Like 10 out of 10 retire.

But then next page, what they didn't like. Design looks dated, cluttered with graphics. Thumbnail designs look cheap that. Well, that's because I did them.

It was hard to find and refer back to tutorials. Search results are terrible. Pop ups were annoying. Low frequency of articles. So like.

You know, I learned a lot.

In just asking those three questions. Yeah.

Now how are you conducting these surveys? Do you use like a survey monkey in your mail and your list or.

You know how Surveymonkey. Yeah.

Okay, perfect. Now what Would you recommend for somebody that maybe hasn't really started building a mailing list or they don't have a following yet?

Okay, well, SurveyMonkey costs money and it used to be pretty cheap, but they keep upgrading.

So just use Google Forms. It's free, it'll do exactly what you need.

If you haven't got a list.

You'Ve usually got some kind of connection with your audience somewhere, whether that's in social media, whether that's in just displaying a header bar along the top of the page. So any current active visitors get invited to click and take the quiz one way or another. You can get that in front of your visitors eyeballs and you don't need a lot of answers to get at least a direction.

And you were saying what, 15, 20 people or so is a pretty good barometer.

It gives you a direction. More data, the better. And I wouldn't like to see less than that.

Sure.

15 to 20, you're probably going to start seeing some kind of pattern in what people are saying. Yeah.

And are you leaving these, these questions just like open ended forms or are you giving them like options to check.

What type of content they want to learn? Was multi choice based on the types of content I already publish.

What their preferred method of learning was multi choice.

What they like, what they don't like, completely open field.

Gotcha. Cool. Okay, makes sense.

And then I went through and categorized each one manually by hand, except my responses had like 700.

Hey, but that's great. It's time well spent because you're actually digesting all the content, analyzing it while you're organizing it.

Yeah, I mean all our jobs is to give people what they want. Right. So let's find out what they want and then we'll give it to them.

Sure.

Yeah. Yeah. And I guess you could kind of use the tag clouds a little bit to get like a rough idea and then dive deeper.

Sure. Yeah.

I like doing it by hand, I like processing it, I like taking it all in, categorizing it myself. And in doing that in your mind, you absorb the information a different way than if you were to rely on a tag card to generate it for you.

Right. No, it's really cool. I mean, we're actually hopping on the phone with a lot of our customers more and more now, and we're hearing so much more just direct feedback and it's all verbal and it's very similar to what you're saying right here. So it's invaluable, this information.

Yeah. And once you learn that when you start looking again at your own web properties with that information in mind.

It changes how the perspective you look at it and you're like, oh yeah, they are right. The navigation is a mess. They are right. There is no clearly defined. Like it was really difficult for people to connect their problem that they had with the solution. The solution existed. It was just on page seven.

Yeah.

You know, like, so there was a disconnect there and.

I wouldn't have known that without.

Doing that survey. So that's where every SEO audit should start. It should start. Step one, ask your people, what is it? What types of content do they like? How do they want to consume that content? What do they like about your site and what don't they like about that? It forms the basis of everything.

Got it. Okay. So that's step one. Listen to your visitors. Got that?

Yeah. Now.

One of the things, the bits of feedback that I had was that things looked kind of shabby on mobile. So once I had all of the feedback, I went through and did all manual observations myself. Each piece of feedback, I went and tried to replicate that experience. So when people were saying it was hard to find a solution for this problem, I just hit the homepage. Right. How would I get to this from here and experience it? And I do the same on mobile. And on mobile it raised lots of red flags. And the reason that mobile is important is because Google recently moved to a mobile first index. If you don't know what that means, it means that the performance of your desktop site is heavily influenced by how your mobile site performs. It means if your mobile site looks bad, has bad user experience, higher bounce rates or everything else that will be reflected in the performance of your desktop site and Google search results.

Good to know. Okay, gotcha.

So like go load up your site on a mobile device right now as you're listening to this, if it looks bad, if a pop up comes up that you can't close properly, if it sideways scrolls or just the user experience isn't there, or you're finding errors or issues, just go and fix them right now. Because it's affecting you globally and many people don't know that.

Good to know. Thanks for bringing that up. That's huge. Yeah, I think people hear the stats of like, oh, more people are using mobile than ever, but the fact that Google actually is preferencing that over the desktop and then it just takes everything down. If your mobile looks like crap.

Yeah, yeah. Mobile first indexing. If you set up in Google search console, it's possible they sent you a message saying, hey, by the way, your site's now doing this and not every site has been moved to it yet, but the majority are and will be. So it's better just to assume it's happened.

Sure.

Because if it hasn't happened yet, it's going to happen very, very, very soon. All my sites are. I haven't got a site that isn't on mobile first indexing anymore.

Gotcha. Now, do you recommend the, like optimizing for the. The amp, the accelerated mobile pages?

I don't do it myself. Okay. I don't do it because it takes away a lot of.

It. It's feeding Google's ecosphere and taking away a lot of your opportunities of monetization and things like that. Yeah, that makes sense. It's a little bit too much. And if you look at Google sites and ranking, you'll see that there isn't really that many amp results. If you actually search and look, there isn't really that many. Maybe if you had a competitor that was absolutely smashing you and it was the only way to get an advantage or something like that.

The negatives of things that you can't do still align to your business goals. Maybe in that circumstance, yes. But as a general rule, no. Not something I pay attention to. But I do pay close attention to mobile page speed because again, that directly impacts the performance of the desktop. So pay close attention to how mobile loads.

Google PageSpeed tool, but also tools like GT Metrics or WebpageTest. You want to make sure that your page loads real quick from a mobile device. And you also have to appreciate. And it's often easy to forget not everyone has 4G.

Some people are still on 3G.

Yeah.

So the site's got to be. It's got to work for everyone, you know, from a mobile perspective. So make sure you take that into account.

In when you're doing your testing and reviewing things. Definitely.

Now, I.

As part of.

The feedback, I identified that as an issue and I went and fixed that on some pages. So even though I know it's an issue, I still had it.

It's actually pretty cool because we saw your website. Matt made a comment. He's like, oh, he actually changed the design of his site since the first time, I think.

Well, yeah, no, it's funny because I think I've actually participated in a handful of roundup posts that have been on your site before. And so I viewed your site back when I was involved in those. And when I just checked it out today, I was like, oh, it's different now.

Yeah, yeah, completely different. And that was part of what we've been talking about. My audience is saying they can't find solutions to the problems. And that's because if you write a blog, they're very inherently selfish. It's just a list of blog posts I've written. Me, me, me, me, me.

Right.

There's no real focus on.

The person that's reading it. So if you take a look at the homepage now, you'll see it's very, it's focused on problems. Do you want to increase your search traffic, do you want to improve your blogging or do you want to start learn how to start making money online? It's very segmented and you know, if you go into an SEO, it's like, okay, well do you want to learn about on page link building? What's your problem? And it is very. The whole point of it was focused on connecting people's problems to solutions as quick as possible.

Sure. It's perfect. We have it on the screen actually right now. And you address the main rocks, the big three things that your customers and visitors have told you they're interested in and then you just extracted those into. Okay, well here are the steps of doing that or getting that.

Yeah, so you can see how I was talking about. And I, I guess if you listen to the podcast, you can't see right now, but you're probably going to go and look. But you can see how that survey fed into that.

Yeah, it's brilliant. No, I love it. And we'll link that of course in the show notes so everybody can check it out.

Of course. Awesome. So.

That really was the first two steps. We kind of merged into them there.

So step two would be make sure you're optimized for mobile.

Step no. Step one, listen to the visitors, send the survey, observe, process the information. Don't rely on tools to automate it. Step two, make your own manual observations with that feedback on board. Go through it, Go through it on a desktop, go for it on a phone, go for it on a tablet. See, like how does it operate? Does it operate the same? Is the experience the same? Is there pop ups that are annoying? Is there.

What is there out there? That's like the experience. Make sure that the experience is coherent across all of them.

Step three we pulled into is doing our own technical spot checks. The first we talked about mobile indexing.

Why that's important. Your site has to perform on mobile for Google to take your desktop site seriously.

How can we check that very quickly? Well, let's drill down a little bit more. We kind of touched onto it.

In page speed and metrics and things. What you should do is you should take your homepage, a category page, and then a page that you feel is heavy, whether that's heavy in the amount of content it has, heavy in the amount of images it has, just a page that you know is a monster on your site, the heaviest page on your site. And then you want to do a couple of basic checks. First of all, Google actually has a mobile friendly. Test.

Each of your URLs through those and just make sure that Google thinks your site is mobile friendly. Now, it's important to tell you just because Google. Just because Google says that your site's mobile friendly doesn't mean it's mobile friendly. For example, I had a bunch of people telling me my site sucked on mobile. Mobile friendly, test pass.

So we just want to make sure that whatever Google's using to decide that a site is mobile friendly, that Google thinks that our site is mobile friendly, beyond that, it doesn't really mean anything that makes sense.

Doesn't necessarily mean that it's going to look good on a phone. It just means Google thinks it looks good on a phone.

Yeah, you got to go check it because mine sucked.

I believe it. Yeah. No, Google doesn't catch everything, but make sure that experience looks great too.

So the second one, mobile page versus desktop page speed. Google has a tool again, the Google Page Speed tool. It gives you a score on mobile and a score on desktop. Again, these are just scores. It doesn't necessarily reflect how quickly or slowly your website's loading in the real world. It's just Google's running a technical spot check. And what it observes may or may not be slowing you down or causing you a problem, but you want to make sure that on mobile devices, you're getting a page speed score of at least 65. You don't want to be going lower than that. Okay, you're lower than that. Go get it fixed right now. Desktop, you want to be pushing mid-80s minimum.

Go fix that right now. If you've got those problems, it's holding you back.

And that moves us on to actually checking how it performs in the real world. Because the page speed score is one thing, but how it actually loads is another.

While you've been doing your manual observations, you've probably felt that as you've been using your phone and everything, but you can use tools like GT Metrics, WebpageTest, and have that tell you how quickly your site is Loading from various locations and various devices.

You. I mean, if you can get it under a second, you're a God. If you can get it under two seconds, you can be very, very, very, very proud. If you get it under three seconds, excellent. Anything above three seconds, you. You really want to be paying attention to that.

Gotcha.

Now. The quickest way of fixing that for many people if you're running WordPress is to install a caching plugin. If you're not using one, you can use W3 Total Cache, it's free. Or you can use my preferred method, which is WP Rocket. Costs a bit of money, but it's got a lot of things that free caching plugin hasn't, like optimizing Google Analytics scripts and Google Fonts and things. And then secondly, using something like Short Pixel to optimize your images again costs a bit of money. You can use WP Smush, which is free, but Short Pixel took images that had already been compressed with WP Smush and compressed them a further 60%. But all those short Pixel and WP Rocket together will do wonders for your not just your Google Page speed score, but how it performs in the real world as well. And it's literally two plugins, few tick boxes, boom, done.

So it removes any of the technical aspects of it.

So the next spot check I like to do, once that we've taken a look at Google Page Speed and how it performs in the real world, we know that it's mobile friendly. I like to pay a little bit of attention to structured data. Now if you don't know what structured data is, rich snippets, schema data. Google has a tool, the Structured Data Testing tool and you can run through your URLs through those to see if you have any existing structured data.

If you don't, that means you have an opportunity and adding structured data again to plug in a way if you don't know what it is, it's like we can add more information about our business, phone number, address.

Opening hours in hidden code in the page. We can add things like information about recipes, how to do them, ingredients that are required, information about movies. We can include information about our articles, the author, when it was first published, when it was last updated, the category, the number of comments. There's lots of different things that you can embed in hidden code with structured data. It may very well be that if you're using WordPress or any of the popular SEO plugins, you already have this data being inserted into your code, but you need to Check is it, does it have any errors? Well, does it exist? First of all, if it doesn't exist, you need to look at adding structured data to your site. And if it does exist, are there any errors? We're just spot checking that.

And once we've done all of that, at that point you will have a very good idea of the things that you need to fix with your site.

You've done the survey, people have told you what's up, you know exactly what you need to change, you know how well it's performing on mobile, you know that it's fast, you know that you've got the content right. Because you people have told you at this point, the, this is the point where you can scan your site with, you know, a scary tool.

Are we talking like the Ahrefs and the Semrushes of the world?

Yeah. Ahrefs have a site audit tool. SEMrush have one website auditor from the link assistant team. There's Deep crawl, screaming Frog. There's a bunch of different tools that you can use.

Okay.

The most user friendly in my opinion is the Semrush one. Because the Semrush one prevents everything in a nice graphical interface. It gives you kind of an overall score, it tells you exactly what's wrong on what's page. But it's also got a lot of little helpers. So if you don't understand anything, you can just click and it explains it a little bit more and it tells you how to fix things. It's very user friendly. And not only that, you can set it to run every month and every month it'll just say, hey, you've got this problem or your scores dropped or you need to pay attention to this. It's a very user friendly way of approaching site audits, the Semrush tool.

So I mean it's never going to compare to a full technical audit. But for most business owners, if they just apply the steps that we've spoken about today and then.

Run through this, they're going to find 90% of problems, 95% of problems. And they'll see huge benefits in fixing them.

Awesome. This is cool. Okay, so what step are we on now?

We've been taking Step, step, step five. Five, five.

What was, what was four? Just, just to make sure that we.

Caught that reviewing structured data.

Okay, so that's structured data. Got it.

Okay, so to re. Recap, step one, listen to your visitors send the survey. Step two, manually observe the problems. With that new learning in mind, go through manually observe what problems do you find third technical spot checks? Is the site mobile friendly? Does it run? Does it get a good Google page speed score? Does it load in under three seconds? How, how you know, does it pass all of those things? Structured data, does structured data exist? If it doesn't, you've got a great opportunity. If it does, is it providing any errors? If there are, fix them and then scan your site for problems. Use a tool. If you want to go full technical, go Screaming Frog. If you want to go full user friendly, go Semrush.

Once you have the answers to all of those things, you have everything you need to create a plan of attack and fix most of your on site issues. And if you do all those things, and let me tell you, if you find that you're having big problems of load time and mobile, if you fix those things, you're gonna see increases in your search visibility very quickly. If people that typically suffer from those problems will typically see great results. Because.

If you've got a page speed like 12 seconds and page speed score of 2 on mobile and you change to be 2 seconds and mobile page scale of 80, you're going to see increases in your search visibility.

This is amazing.

I could see and this is not technical like you kept saying, it's this whole five step thing here and we have Matt and I have like pages of notes already like scribbling and we definitely take notes as well. So don't worry like if you're driving or whatever. Well, we got it for you.

This is by no means a substitute for a true full technical SEO audit is an accessible process for most people to perform their own SEO audit and actually probably make more intelligent decision, intelligent decisions than a technical audit because it's taken into account the human element, which as many technical SEOs fail to account for.

For me, we've talked about it. You've seen how I change the homepage design. You've seen how the homepage now flows into different specific portals. SEO, portal, blogging port. Like it's a much better flow. It's no longer a blog that's about me.

There's some other little things and I guess you guys will link to the full tutorial, but there's other little things that we implemented that gave us quick wins. Like.

We did a little content optimization process, four steps. One of those steps was how we were able to tweak existing content to steal featured snippets away from competitors just by making small little tweaks. And the full process is explained in the post. And you need to Read it to. Or actually there's a video that explains it as well. Because they want to learn via text or video. There's a video that is a 30 minute video that takes you through this, it takes you through the five step process and then it shows you the application of that process and what that actually translates to in the real world, why it translates to that and how it translates to that. Which is an important part because although the process is the same, that what you have to change will be different for every business and how it's applied will be different for every business and what you discover is going to be different. So there isn't a one size fits all solution, but there is a one size fits all process of discovery.

So I like to tie that down and show you what that actually meant in the real world, the changes I made and how ultimately it led to an increase in 40% of search traffic.

That's amazing. I mean we're just as you're talking, we actually found the FAQ rich snippets post under the on page SEO. Like your site is just organized so damn cleanly. Like, yeah, I don't think we even dug that. Like, you know, you go from the homepage and then it goes into other categories and then that links you to specific blog posts that I'm sure you figured out are the most popular.

Yeah, and it's just people were saying, look, I had these, all these blog posts on all these different topics, but it wasn't organized. It was, it had no structure. It was no. So you couldn't find what you want. Now you can find it.

Oh yeah.

And it's one of the big problems with blogs and websites. Often our best content gets buried.

Yeah, agreed. Totally.

And the more content you publish, the more buried it gets. The more buried it gets, the more disconnected it is from the people that it's there to serve.

So you mentioned previously that you did a lot of the graphics and all that stuff. Did you actually design your first website or the, you know, the blog that you had at the time?

You know, I, I've done every from, you know, when you've been playing on the Internet since before Google existed. You've tried your hand at everything.

Sure.

Luckily. I mean, I started a blog as an SEO experiment. I never intended it to be successful. I never even really planned, just exploded. And all I did was I was sick and tired of hearing Matt cuts bang on about, forget about link building, create high quality content. And he kept banging on about it and, and I was like, all right, let's see what happens then. Let's take it as a gospel. And there's actually a zero link building case study. This was a zero link building case study. Can I rank a site without link building just by creating high quality content? And as much as I hate to admit it, he was right.

So with the really high quality content, if you just put out high quality content but you don't try to build any links to it, it's it can rank or do other things on the page already have to be ranking. So you're kind of passing. How would it work?

My entire strategy for matthewwoodward.co.uk, was first of all, look at forums and see what problems people have got. Secondly, create content that solves that. In many cases, I was just recording what I was already doing. I wasn't reinventing the wheel, it was just stuff I was already doing every day. I just recorded it and put it in a video.

Was where it really started. And then I'd go back into those same forums and communities and groups where people were having problems and I'd say, hey, you know, I'd offer them a bit of advice, talk them through it and eventually push them into the tutorial and people just blown away and share it and tell other people. And then it got to the point where anytime, any question about tiered lingual and ever came up anywhere on the Internet, there was someone there to answer it with a link to my tutorial.

That's awesome. Yeah, that's actually essentially how we started, honest. We did our first blogs, we just went into forums and answered questions. It was the best way. Still probably is the best way. Yeah, Reddit is great for that kind of thing today too.

And look, all that connects back to the first step of the common sense SEO audit. Speak to the people. We forget the human connection. We've got so many tools and analysis and, well, tools that claim they use an AI, but we just know it's if then else. I don't know who you're trying to kick.

Because AI just sells.

No, it's not if then else. And it's not even very good implementation of it. That's true, but we forget about the human and it's easy. Like with search engine, optimize it. We're optimizing for a computer. No, optimize for the people first. You can't optimize for an algorithm before you optimize for the people.

We forget that. It's easy to forget in all walks of digital business, not just SEO, when you're looking at Google Analytics. Whoa, we got an extra hundred. Doesn't sound that great, but it's an extra hundred people. Yeah. Absorbed the information, processed it in their mind. Like we forget about that. And it's important to keep that at the forefront of your mind in everything you're doing. Really.

It's the whole thing of, yeah, get away from your computer a little bit and look at 100 people. Like, whoa, that many people are looking at me like they're watching my stuff. Cool.

Yeah.

Well, I know this is sort of counter to what we were just talking about, but you know, a lot of people, obviously you sort of alluded to it earlier. A lot of people think link building strategies are sexy. You know, when you mail your list about a link building thing, you get way more clicks than if it's, hey, let's talk about your audit.

Right.

I'm curious if maybe you could share like maybe one or two, like quick win sort of link building things for the listeners.

Well, link building.

I'll give you a link building one first and then I'm going to give you an on page one second.

Perfect.

On page one is much better than the link building one. So link building look, lots of people struggle with link building and the process that I apply to every single site. And if you've been reading my blog, you're probably sick of me banging on about it. Is to just steal your competitors back. Look, look at the sites that are ranking in the top five for your target keyword. Now use a tool like Ahrefs. Ahrefs has the best backlink database. So Ahrefs to pull down all the backlinks for those sites and then just work through them and steal them. Like observe. How did they get the link? Maybe they just replied to a forum post. Maybe it was a guest post, maybe it was a comment. Maybe they made a donation to a charity and got listed on that charity page. Like, how did they get the link and replicate it? Just work your way through the list. It's budget friendly, it's easy to do. There's absolutely, you know, you don't need any technical ability to do it. You just need a web browser and a list to work through. It's all you do. It's a strategy I've used for the last 10 years. It's more than stood the test of time because every time you do it, it's based on what's working for people that are ranking right now. You're just taking what works and replicating it.

If you want to make it easier. You can hit the homepage on my blog and there's something that's going to annoy you to download my intelligent spreadsheets. Just bang your email address in there and I've got spreadsheets that will go through and tell you which the best links are in which order to replicate them, remove the spammy ones, and it'll also tell you which keywords to target, in which order and why as well.

Oh cool, I'll download that. That's worth an email address for sure.

Yeah, it's, it's, it's, there's two, two sheets that they're built in Google sheets, but they're not your average Google sheet. And it's how I scope out a new niche and it's how I do link building for any new niche. And it removes a lot of the headache. You can literally just pass it over to a VA and say, just replicate those.

Wow, cool. Thank you.

So that's, that's, that's, that's like link building doesn't have to be complicated. Just use your eyes, use the computer between your ears and replicate what's already working for other people.

On page trick.

FAQ rich snippets. Nothing new. They've been around for a long time, but what is new is how they're performing in search results. Now, when I tested it in January, they weren't really worth bothering with. But right now, if you add an FAQ rich snippet to your content, it instantly appears in Google search results. Now if you don't know what that looks like, basically it means instead of just having a result in Google, you have a result and then an expandable list of questions that are attached to your result. You might have seen the people also ask box in search results. It's literally a people also ask box just for you. And you can control what content appears in there and you can have it appear instantly. So I've built a tool. You can hit my site, hit the homepage hit to increase search traffic. Under the on page SEO section, you'll find FAQ rich snippets. Watch that tutorial and you'll learn how to instantly increase the visibility of your site. On Google's first page of results.

That's amazing.

Instant. It's like I say to people, you can do it in five minutes, but people are hitting results like instant. Like they request the indexing in search console, they do the search again and it's there.

Yeah, we watched just your video pretty quickly and we had a timer, I think on there. Like the clock. And yeah, it was under like five minutes. We're like, what?

Yeah, I thought, I think I'm gonna edit this part out. I don't, I don't know if I.

Want to share this strategy.

Yeah, well, it's out there and I didn't invent it. Look, FAQ Rich Nipple are nothing new. We've known about them for a long time, people playing with them. There's lots of stuff published about them. Semrush have done a piece. It's all over Search Engine Journal. It's nothing new. What is new is how they're performing in search results.

Well, how about this for the listeners? We're going to keep it in here because most people don't take action. But if you're taking action and actually do this screenshot, this, send it to us. We'll share it with you too, Matt. And it just show like, hey, this is actually working for others. It just be kind of cool to see the results from these podcast listeners here.

There's hundreds of comments all over Facebook right now of people doing this with great, great, great, great success. I actually built a tool that will generate the code for you. So I'll first of all, in the tutorial, I'll show you exactly what, I give you lots of different examples of how I've used them and then I give you the tool to generate the code to do it.

Now it's important to say that make sure that you don't go out and abuse it. There's Google guidelines published on how you should integrate this. Make sure you read them. Make sure you integrate against guidelines. If you go and abuse it, don't be surprised if you get penalized. It is open for abuse right now. Google are blindly trusting that whatever you Write in the FAQs are relevant to the page and everything else. There is a lot of belying trust from Google in how they display FAQ rich snippets from, from people right now. If that trust is abused, which it will be where SEOs, that's what we do, there will be a penalty for it. So I'm telling you right now, before it's abused, there will be a penalty for it at some point. Do not abuse it. Only add FAQs that add to your user experience in genuine ways. If you feel like you're trying to force it in, then it's wrong. Don't do it.

FAQs are often genuinely part of product pages. You know, when people are asking questions about the product. Sometimes in tutorials where people have common Questions about a subject that they're learning, do not go and force it. In. In the tutorial, you'll find guidelines. Read them, follow them, pay attention. Don't abuse it. Don't do what most SEOs are going to go and do when they learn that information.

Yeah, no, thanks for that warning because this is like the typical Google thing, right? This is just an experiment they're putting out there. And yeah, the people that abuse it.

Yeah, I believe it's something more than that. And I was thinking that maybe once I put a spotlight on this, Google might fix it. But it makes sense that they don't because I think the reason that Google are making this so visible in search results right now is so that all the idiot SEOs like me run off and go and deploy them all. Why would Google want me to deploy all of that and give them all of that data? Because of the $60 billion a year voice assistant market and what Google. Google's advantage over both Apple and Amazon is they've spent the last 20 years organizing the world's data and they have an army of tens of millions of webmasters on hand that are ready to give them data in the format that they want it, when they want it, in order to get an increase in search traffic. So if I was going to win that market, that's what I'd do. I'd just make people give me the data in a format that my assistant wants it. And if you've been paying attention to the news or anything, you'll see that Google are consistently winning in terms of accuracy and they're actually named the most accurate voice assistant for giving medical advice.

Wow.

It's a whole different ball game.

I've never even heard that part, but that makes perfect sense. And think of how many lives I hope that helps. You know, if the data is correctly. That is correct.

Well, some of you might recall in recent history, in terms of SEO the Medic Update, I've heard of it, yeah. Google used that to essentially raise the profiles of people that are real qualified to be giving life changing advice, whether that's medical, financial or whatever. They, they found a way to elevate people that are genuinely qualified to be giving such sensitive advice. And they found a way to knock down people that weren't. On top of that, they're now bringing FAQ rich snippets, the combination of which gives them the ability to answer questions with supreme accuracy from qualified individuals in any niche on the planet.

Wow.

Freaking Google. Yeah. So why does FAQ rich snippets work really well because it feeds into Google's current business goals. That's just what I think. That's just what I've observed. I don't know that I know it is truth, but as I've seen Google dominating the voice assistant market in terms of accuracy and I've seen them integrate in more like how to snippets, FAQ rich and how if you go and do the voice search, it usually matches what the snippet is. Yeah. To me it just seems that it all aligns to their current business goal which is to dominate the voice assistant market.

Got to feed the machine.

Feed the machine.

That's all it is.

Usually when we feed the machine we don't get much for it, but right now they're giving us increased search visibility and everything else. So that's great. Like take advantage of that, don't abuse it.

Yeah, no, I love that, man. Well, let's. Maybe we should wrap it up here before we go down any more rabbit holes because this is so good.

We definitely do a round two at some point if you're interested because we know, we know our audience eats this stuff up and this has been amazing.

Oh yeah, there's a lot of things I want to go now.

Today we mostly focused on on page we haven't even touched. You know, I can tell you some amazing keyword research things, link building, you know, wherever you want to go.

Yeah. If you want to do follow ups, if any people are listening, if there's any subject you'd like to hear me talk about, if there are any topics, questions, issues, problems that you need solving that we could solve on the podcast, please let the guys know and maybe we'll do a follow up and we'll get to all of that.

That sounds great, Matt. Yeah, yeah. You know how to reach us. Just go to the show notes page and it's all there. Thank you so much, man. Just to wrap up, we always ask if you are a reader and you recommend books, are there any books that just resonated really well that you see yourself going back to or you're recommending others to check out?

The book that I've read the most times.

Is Think and Grow Rich. Napoleon Hill. Classic, Classic, classic, classic. And I've probably read it five or six times in my life, a few years in between each time. And each time.

It brings something new to light each time based on each time I read it, then the next bit of experience of business or life or whatever it is, the next chapter, so to speak. And I Read it again. And yeah, I'm always extracting new things from that. No matter.

That's awesome.

How many times. And it also serves as a good point of reflection. You're like, oh, yeah, yeah. Well, yeah. So that's the book that's perfect.

Yeah, it's like an onion, you know, it's like these best books, these great books that are timeless like that, you just go do it with a whole different, you know, fresh pair of eyes after some experience in life and then reset.

Read it again and. Yeah.

Yep. Didn't see that before.

Awesome, Matt. Well, best place to find you, I'm sure, was matthewwoodward.co.uk is your blog.

Yeah. You can find me there and hopefully you'll find a solution to your problem. If I've done a good job. Well, we're gonna find out.

I'm pretty sure they will. And go opt in for the. The cheat sheet or downloads, all that fun stuff, because it's worth it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Awesome, Matt.

Well, thanks for having me on.

Of course. Thank you for dropping all this knowledge. This is crazy. So we will do a round two for sure. We'll get you back.

Sounds great.

Take care.

Thank you. Bye Bye.

Bye, bye.

Thanks, everybody, for listening to this episode.

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