Random Thoughts on The Psychology of Money

I always had, like, these markers where I'm like, all right. I'm kind of, like, mentally sprinting to this point. Be it a number, like, you know, initially, like something like 10 grand a month for my business, you know, back in the day. Or, you know, these. Maybe the kind of house I wanted to live in or the car I wanted to drive or the thing. And then all of a sudden, you get to the point where you have all the things, you know, I feel like I have everything I need, but, you know, like, now I'm just finding the happiness within those things and optimizing. You know what I got? This is an intro. Intro, intro, intro.

Hustle and Float.

Shark.

With your boy.

My boy, Matt Wolf. Joe Fear. Hey.

Hey.

Hi. Welcome back. I've been here.

So have I.

Funny to see you again here and you listening to us or watching us. Hey. Hi. How you doing?

Welcome back.

Good to have you.

Or welcome for the first time, maybe.

Yeah.

Thanks for being here.

It's great to have you either way.

Yeah.

Feels like family here.

It does.

It always has. Yeah. Well, there was that one time.

Just like the Olive Garden when you're here, your family.

Oh, yeah.

They're not a sponsor.

They should be. I want those breadsticks. And there's not one that far from us. It's down the street. That's true. That's a great idea. Why haven't we thought of that place for lunch?

I don't know, actually. I know Olive Garden, like, never is on my radar.

Why should it be? The breadsticks, the salad, the endless everything?

The endless everything. Yeah.

But still not a sponsor.

Today we're gonna drop some endless knowledge, maybe.

Or, you know, it's timeless. Maybe.

Hopefully.

Isn't that what everybody says about financial stuff? Or financial. This is timeless advice. This is a. Yeah, well, there's. Well, we'll break some myths, maybe, with what we've learned in a book that Matt and I have obsessed over a bit. I would say, Matt more than I. It's the best book ever. You said it's up there. Top 10 ever, ever.

One of my top 10 books.

No, it's a paradigm shifter. It's a good one. It's the Psychology of Money by Morgan Housel. Housel Housel. Yeah. That's it.

That's it.

That's the one. So, yeah, lead us off, Matt. What are we doing here?

So today we're gonna start off episode by talking about some of our insights and ahas and just kind of having some discussions that were sparked by this book. So that's where we're gonna go with this episode. We are gonna take notes on this thing. This could lead anywhere. We might start talking about the psychology of money. And it goes off in completely different tangents as we've signals as we've been known to do. So make sure you grab the notes because there's gonna be a lot of good stuff. I'm assuming in this there's guarantee.

We always make sure there are good stuffs in every note package that we give you. So@flowchart group.com flowchartgroup.com is where you want to go. And type in your email address when you see the option to. It's a Facebook group as well. That will get you into the notes. You have to be two weeks at the time of this recording. Dropping that, you'll have the ability to get them for free. So flowchartgroup.com.

Yes, go there.

We also have a lovely sponsor. This episode is sponsored by our friends. And here they are.

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You don't do that.

No, I don't really type.

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Okay. In all reality, this is a freaking cool tool. We were nerding out about it when we heard that Ahrefs was coming back for a sponsorship because it's a free tool, no credit card required. And yeah, you get a lot of key things that the bigger Ahrefs tool has in it. That this one basically has all the key things that every person with a website should have. This. So that is you, Is you listening?

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Yes, we do.

So this episode we talked about the book Psychology of Money is a book that we. You found. How'd you find this book?

It actually popped up on a couple YouTube videos. So first off, I saw Noah Kagan mention it. I don't remember it was on a YouTube video or if it was in one of his podcasts that I listened to. I think I heard him mention it on one of his podcasts. And then another YouTube channel that I watch, Ali Abdaal, he. He recommended it. Like he had a video that was like my top 10 books I've read in 2021 or something like that. And one of them was this book. And it looked really good and I went and picked it up and I blew through it. So I read it in probably a three day stretch, but, you know, sitting down, reading for like an hour at a time for three or four days and just cranked through this book.

Yeah, man. So you, yeah, you almost immediately were like giving me all your aha moments. And a lot of them really did come at the beginning of the book too, because I ended up reading the book shortly after. And you were saying, yeah, right there with rich dad, poor dad in the book that basically helped kick us off into business and thinking differently. He said this book is like right there with it. Right. So I mean, they're kind of different, but also they share a lot of similarities.

Yeah, well, I think one of the big ideas in this book was the idea that the pursuit of the money is not really the thing. Right.

I'm trying to think of how to word it without just like going straight to the book and like reading quotes. But the big idea of the book, I mean, you read it, right?

I did.

So what's the big idea of the book in your mind?

It's happiness more than anything and enjoying your journey. Optimizing, but being consistent. There's a lot of nuggets in. Cause I have some notes as well. I know we have a bunch of highlights here, but I would say overall is.

Really figuring out what is your ideal life and finding the happiness in that path that you choose. And money, there's specific ways to approach money, to use that as a vehicle or a tool to get you to that happiness that you choose. And it's a lot easier than a lot of people make it out to be. And it's consistency, it's creating nice systems and not moving the goalposts. Basically figuring out how to get your ego in check. And you know that. So a lot of that is mindset. It's like having a balanced life. Something that's kind of. It's just, you know, it feels like you got everything you need or that you ever want, or you have the ability to. You have access to anything you want within, you know, what you've created for yourself. At least that's my takeaway because, like, that's how I would apply it to my life, is it's going for happiness and enjoying the journey.

Yeah. And I think a big piece of it is also just, like, figure out how to be happy with what you have. So you don't really want for other stuff. So. Because a lot of people, they want to make more money, make more money, make more money because they want more stuff. They want bigger houses, they want bigger, better, nicer cars. And there's always this sort of lifestyle creep element where once you get that, there's always another. There's always, like, another milestone that you want to shoot for. So there's always something after the thing that you just got. You're always trying to, like, chase something new where if you can figure out how to go, you know what? I'm pretty damn happy with what I got. I like my house, I like my cars. I like the stuff I got. There's not a whole lot that I need to add into the mix right now. I'm pretty happy.

Yeah.

You still try to grow your income. You still go and invest, and you still, you know, work to grow your income. But if you're happy with where you're at now, that additional money that you weren't making before starts to pile and become that safety net that's available for you whenever you need it.

And see, that really, that was the thing that hit home for me the most, is figuring out how to move the goal. Stop moving the goalpost. We had a chat, maybe I don't know how long ago it was now, but I was telling you about part of the book I read. It was towards the end, I believe, where it kind of sank in, because I feel like that's a common thing during the Book is this concept of getting just your ego or your desires in check a little bit, where it's stop moving the goalposts. Meaning do you really need to get another house? Because you've like, you felt like you've kind of maxed this one out in terms of like, you know, I want something a little bigger or I see my buddy just, you know, did really well with his business or something and you know, like, he got that house or that new car. It's like, I bet I can. Yeah, I want to do that. You know, and then you just kind of keep pushing yourself. And that hit home with me because I feel like that was my internal. I always had like these markers where I'm like, all right, I'm kind of like mentally sprinting to this point. Be it a number like, you know, initially, like something like 10 grand a month for my business, you know, back in the day, or, you know, these. Maybe the kind of house I wanted to live in or the car I wanted to drive or the thing. And then all of a sudden you get to the point where you have all the things. I feel like I have everything I need, but, you know, like, now I'm just finding the happiness within those things and optimizing what I got. And to this book's point, basically talks about saving like a madman or Mad Woman and using vehicles like index funds and all these long term investment vehicles that you can then just compound your way into wealth while you're optimizing what you got right now. But yeah, moving the goalpost thing, I think that the perspection or that shift allowed me to kind of just chill out a little bit and feel like, wait, hold on, I don't need more, you know, because it almost trying to remember how. I mean, we had this conversation. Because you know what it was? I was thinking through this exercise with Angelo and Alpha Hippie, you know, and it was like future pacing. So I was looking out like 20 years. That's what it was. And I found myself still living in the same place. And I was like, that's interesting. How would I be? And before that, like, up until just last week, I wasn't thinking that way. You know, I was thinking, like, up now. I'm probably gonna get another place in the next, like, few years. You know, it's like, on to the next place. Cause I've always bounce bounced to another few years at a new location. So that was my goalpost. And I feel like that was like a lot of my drive in business. And it's like, okay, well, I need to make more, too, so I can afford that bigger place with more yard or a pool or something, you know? Yeah.

And, like, a big piece of it is, you gotta step back and you gotta look at the motivations for wanting a lot of that stuff. Right. Some of the examples that they used in this specific book was, like, when you see a Ferrari driving down the street, people strive to get these supercars and stuff, right? And we have friends that have supercars, and I actually think they're really cool.

Right.

But I've never really had a huge desire to own one. But you see these people driving in the supercars, and most people don't look at the person in the supercar and go, man, that person's really cool. I respect them because they got that car.

I want to know their story.

Look at that person. That person's amazing. People buy those cars thinking that others will look at them and go, I want to be like that person. That's cool.

Right?

But what really happens is when you see somebody in that car, you're like, I wish I had that car. You're not sitting there going, that person worked hard and is awesome because they got that car. That is so cool that they managed to do that. You're sitting there going, screw that guy. That should be me in that car.

Right.

Like, that's what most people think when they see those cars driving around.

I saw some crazy car the other day in my neighborhood, and it was like. Because it was after I read that part of the book, or that's kind of throughout the book, too. It's kind of like another concept, like, a recurring thing. And I caught myself in that position, though, like, looking at this car going, like, ooh. But it wasn't about the person. Like, I took a quick look at, like, I just always like to see the person behind a wheel, something. But I was like, I really want to just drive that thing around the block or just, like, you know, give it a shot and see what it's like. It wasn't like, yeah, I want to embody that person in that. No. Yeah.

No. Like, we.

Or respect for that person. It doesn't. No. Yeah.

So we've got, like. We've got friends who, you know, they've got supercars and they've got the car, and they're like, you know, I love the engineering. I know what went into the car. I know, like, all of the mechanics of how it works, and I love taking it to the track, and I love trying to beat my times and like they have this very like intentional reason that they always wanted this car and they got it and they use it in that way.

And.

And then we also know people that are like, man, if I get that car, I'm going to get all the ladies or like all the guys are going to want to be me and all the girls are going to want to be with me. Right. Like people think that that's the reality, but that's not really the reality. Now there's. I'm not saying it's bad to want those things. Like the first example, I think that's a great reason to invest that if you've got the money and it makes sense and cool. But the people that are doing it because they want others respect.

Like it's motivation. That's all it is in the book. But yeah, it's. Is it. It's happiness too. It's like what's happy to like, does that truly make you happy? Then shoot, whatever man. Maybe that, that fulfills your own happiness is trying to look cool to other people and that just somehow makes you look happy or feel happy, then good on you, Matt. You can. No, that's not you for sure. But so that's a. I would say that was a. That was a big one. One of the. I don't know, there's a lot of aha moments as I look at my notes. Right?

Yeah. Just pull one out and let's just riff on it.

I mean, from chapter one. Let's see here. It just showed that. And I've heard this from a lot of parts, but not a lot of people have really good money skills or saving habits, which is a big part of this book. So it said basically most Americans can't come up with 400 bucks from their savings to cover unexpected expenses. And I'm just like, man, that's wild.

I think it was saying obviously more of the business minded folks are people thinking about this. I'm sure it doesn't include them, you know, but I'm sure it could very.

I know business owners that are living.

Of course I've been there week to.

Week, month to month.

Yeah, I've been there. I know you've been there too. So. But it's when I read that I was like, wow, damn, that's like no buffer. Because you think of the pandemic and you know, the ripple effects that still come from that. Rising prices in a bunch of spots. That's pretty crazy. If like people are, you know, if that's. If that's it and because Basically, the book makes a point that everyone has the ability to save. If you have the right psychology around how money works and the use of it as like a vehicle to get what you want out of life now or in the future.

Yeah, no, I mean, how many people do you. I mean, to me, that's not that shocking. To me, that's like. Yeah, I don't think most people have much money set aside for a rainy day. Like, I know a lot of people personally. You know, a lot of the same. Same people who constantly talk about how they don't have money to do stuff yet they own a boat and a dune buggy and a motorhome and they own all of these toys, but they're constantly complaining about how they have no money to do anything.

Right, well. And that's being rich. Right. So the book was also saying that there's a difference between rich and wealth. Wealth is when you have those savings, and it also has wealth of time and freedom and happiness and all that. You know, it can come in many forms, but, yeah, rich, it was saying, are like the boats, the supercars, you know, the extravagant houses and things that just look like. I mean, it doesn't matter, like, because it proves the point that, yeah, you got to pay the bills of those things. So you're obviously making bank to afford that thing. You're not like, homeless, but, like, come on, like, you have an ability to get there. But is that. But do you really have a lifestyle still outside of those things?

Yeah. No, they suffer from the lifestyle creep kind of thing where as they make more money, they figure out out what more expenses can I add into my life to fill the new gap that I created. Right. So that's the lifestyle creep element. And I've definitely been there, but now I kind of feel like I've gotten to a place where I've sort of stopped that momentum. I'm in the house I want. I don't really desire a new car. I like the cars we got. We're good. I'm sort of stopping that train now while still trying to increase the income and invest and make more money. But that train of, like, finding new expenses has stopped for me.

Yeah. Yeah. And this. My combination of reading this book, you know, and mainly the few chapters, the first ones is where it set in, and then thinking of, like, my future going through this legacy thing, like, writing out how will I want to be remembered? It wasn't like, you know, part of mine was living.

You had a sweet Ferrari.

I mean, that's maybe that's what's going.

To be on your headstone.

I have a sweet Ferrari.

Had a sweet Ferrari.

Had a sweet one. Yeah. It'll be just a big Ferrari. I'll be inside of it.

Yeah.

Tomb. Ferrari Tomb. Yeah. So cool. Not sponsored by Ferrari, but we'll gladly accept a trade. Yeah. Do you want one too many?

Two?

No, no, no. Give him, like, the lowest possible model. I mean, it's still badass car. Matt, come on.

Why?

Because you're throwing me. I'm the dead guy here. I'm the one that needs to get buried with a Ferrari on my tombstone to be remembered in this light.

Fine. If this theoretical situation where Ferrari goes and gives us two Ferraris so that we can sponsor.

They can sponsor us looking at you.

Then fine, you can. I'll take the older of the models.

See? Come on. It's a good deal.

A lot of times the older models are more valuable.

Damn it.

Okay, we'll approach that bridge once we get there in our cool Ferraris. All right. There should be cool sound effects in there somewhere.

There they were.

That's it.

That was them. Now Jacob's just going to put that in the rest of the episode. He's going to clip out the joke like, vroom, vroom. And then just like.

That wasn't me. That was the sound effect. You have no proof that was me. None.

Okay.

All right, So I gave you some. Where were we? Ferraris. Yeah. Yeah. Legacy. Just how you want to be remembered. How I want to be remembered. It was like having a good time and not basically trying to stress myself out, sprinting to another goal all the time, I think. Oh, that was the other thing in the book. The guy chose, and he's 36 years old, the author of the book, Morgan Heisel.

Housel.

Housel.

I don't know how it's pronounced. I think it's housel.

Housel. He's 36, so that's how old I am. You're a couple of years older. You're geriatric. And.

I was like, okay, this is interesting because it's kind of like a time I'm my. You know, it's the same seasons of life that we're in. And he chose to pay off his house as, like, his thing. And, you know, his thing was like, I don't want the. I just want the freedom of getting rid of that thing completely and not worrying about it because I got my thing. You know, it's not the best financial advice he was saying, but he's like, I'm going for freedom, you know, I'm going for happiness. So it's like one less mental thing to, you know, put on. On your radar that you like, almost have to cover every month.

Yeah.

So I don't know, I think it was just like, it was freeing my mind of a lot of things where I was like, you know what? Yeah, what the hell? Like, what's the point of doing extra stuff and doing all these crazy things if I got what I want, but I can optimize the crap out of it and then also at the same time, build for the future using much other stuff. But it's not like a how to make money book. Yeah. Very quiet though.

Yeah.

Talking a lot here. Yeah, I would love to hear your thoughts.

Well, why don't we grab another like, aha from like chapter two and chat about that? Because I think we've beaten the horse to death of the. You don't let your lifestyle get away from you.

Yes, we beat it to death. Thank you. Match.

It is now just a puddle.

Ew.

A puddle of bones and guts.

Wowee. Okay.

Let'S see. So I. Okay. Risk and. Or, sorry, luck and risk. So the two factors that basically a result can come from. And I mean, I don't have word for word here, but essentially it was making the point of. A lot of people analyze their results based off of something they did, like an action. And that's usually. Where the heck is it? It's. There's like a risk factor to an action. Typically you kind of can predict more or less your risk tolerance, you know, going into something and you're. You feel something that's like, you know, it's your ability of doing stuff. But they say luck is like a whole different factor that you can't really quantify, can't really measure, but sure as hell plays into things like, you know, just meeting someone at a. At a lunch or something, you know, like a business lunch, some event that you go and you're hanging at the bar and someone's ordering a drink right next to you and you strike up a conversation and turns into like your next cool affiliate partner or something. You know, you can make a lot of money together. That was. Was that little luck. Maybe not completely because you're at the same event, the same people, but like the fact that you're right there and. Yeah, well, there's a lot of other factors that you can't really quantify.

Yeah, like there's an example with Bill Gates in the book of how like, people look at someone like Bill Gates and want to kind of model him and follow in his footsteps. Right. If Bill Gates can do it, then I can do it. All I got to do is do the same things that he did.

Right.

Like, they think that if they just follow those footsteps and follow some sort of process, it'll happen.

Right.

But when someone like Bill Gates. Bill Gates grew, like, was born and grew up in a town, and I don't remember the stats, some of this I'm just kind of making up because I don't remember it exactly, but he grew up in a town that only had, like, one high school that had a computer in it. And he happened to get into this school and be one of, like, 20 kids that had access to this computer in this school. And he learned how to program at this school on this one computer that was, like, the only computer, like, in the country. And, you know, how lucky was he to be born to that family in that town and get to go to that high school and have that opportunity? How can anybody sort of model that? Like, that's a piece of his story that nobody else is going to be able to recreate for sure. You know, that's.

And that was so much. So many factors that you can't even quantify. And that's. That was a big kind of an aha moment when you're studying. It says, like, when studying performance and figuring out what to do next, it's basically impossible to quantify luck.

Yeah. And most people study history, right? Like, that was a big piece that they were talking about, too, is that a lot of people look at history of what has happened before as an indicator of what to expect for the future. But, like, we're literally always in uncharted territory. Like, every day is new uncharted territory. So, like, trying to predict when the stock market is going to fall or when the real estate bubble is going to burst or any of that kind of stuff. Like, trying to predict that you're just guessing like everybody else, because the scenario that we're in right now today has, like, the set of circumstances has never happened. You know, last time there was a crash.

The Internet wasn't as prolific. There was different, completely different tech that everybody was using. There was all sorts of other elements going on in the world. So many other variables that happened at that time that made that last bubble happen. Like the housing bubble that crashed last time. It was because of a whole bunch of bad loans that people wouldn't be able to afford. Well, they stopped giving those loans away. So it's not the same scenario as last time. Right. Like, there's so many things that are different now. So how anybody can predict based on the history of things, it's, you know, it's still just a guess. Like, you can look at history and go, okay, this could happen again and sort of prepare for it. But like, any prediction of what's actually going to happen is just that, a prediction.

It is. And that relates to the whole idea of not studying a single person and like their, their journey. Like, you know, like Bill Gates. Yeah, exactly. Like studying him and him only and then modeling, trying to model your life or your business around the way that he's done things, you know. Instead, this book argues that you want to study things in broad strokes and look at trends and data and bigger sets of data. So you can then study more or less like angle yourself in the direction of where you want to trend, but you can't, you know, like, you're never going to know. But because everyone has their own factors and, you know, their past and their luck, that that follows them around life and their journey. So, yeah, it's like study. Don't just study a single person have, have broad strokes with pretty much everything. And.

Yeah, I think that's just kind of cool because it almost takes the pressure off a little bit more as well. That's why I feel like this book did a lot of his, like, take the pressure off of a lot of maybe common things that, that just shouldn't be like a mental loop or a desire of people when it comes with money or effort into going like work or whatever. It is like that. Yeah.

Yeah. And like any sort of stress that you have over money, any sort of anxiety you get over money, it's a pretty universal thing. Right. It's, it's. You're not crazy.

Right.

I think like, that's like the thing that's in the very first chapter. Like one of the first sentences in the book is something like, you're not crazy because this is the type of stuff that everybody sort of stresses out over when it comes to money. So just realize that if you are struggling financially or you can't wrap your head around finances or you have a hard time feeling abundant and all of that kind of stuff, you're not alone. That's kind of how everybody feels about money.

Yeah, there's always some factor. It might not be so obvious looking. Yeah. And still the rich person, the one with the supercars and all that stuff, doesn't mean, you know, they could be completely wealthy as well. But you Know, maybe on the outside these people just have the car. But like, because I look around this actually now that I've like read the book, I think about this and like as I'm driving around and I'll look for kind of nicer cars and not so nice areas. And I know it's kind of maybe a judging thing a little bit, but at the same time I'm kind of just like, well, it's interesting. It shows where maybe the money is put a little bit and maybe the person's visiting, I don't know. But I'm like, I literally, I'm like looking out and I'm like, interesting because you can see the inconsistencies because it's. They're all around us. The masses are kind of to a different tune financially.

Well, how many broke ass people do you know that have like barely any money but an iPhone?

Oh, prime example. Good point, man. You should have a flip phone and earn some cash.

I know people that are unemployment.

Live with their parents, but they have a MacBook Pro, you know, like.

Yeah, I mean you better be using that thing as a tool to do something that's gonna create more value and like pay for itself at least.

Yeah.

It'S crazy. No, but I do a lot of the same thing. Like I'm constantly judging, but not like I don't know the people. So it's not a judge on the person.

It's just kind of like observations.

It's kind of like interesting that there's that house with that car that doesn't fit.

No.

And we are just. Yeah, it's obviously a complete, you know, we have no truth behind this whole thing, but it's observations. I think that's a good way of putting it. It's like interesting that's out of place seeming and then moving on, you know, it's just noted. That's all it is.

Yeah, no, it's interesting. So I'm curious.

From reading the book, what sort of things do you like, what sort of tweaks do you feel like you'll be making based on like some of the stuff you've read? Maybe like mindset or even like actual like changes you're gonna make? You know.

A big thing has been releasing my mind to. It's almost like the anxiety part of me. It's not around money specifically, it's more around the things that would create the money and create the lifestyle or support the lifestyle, I guess, that I want and I have and that I want, but it's more of the things I. Have you even mentioned this the other day is the fear of losing. What we have, I think is. I think that's one of the most common things, actually. Once you, like, reach a point of, like, where you feel like you made the. The stability of your life.

I do. There's like a. Like, almost like this tipping point where for.

It's a fear of loss.

A big portion of our life. We're trying to get more. Get more, go bigger. I wanted the bigger house, the better cars, the newer cars, the newer computers, the newer equipment, the newer. The better the, you know, all the. All the latest, greatest stuff. And then it kind of got to this tipping point. And I think it was around the time I had. We started our family. Right. When we started our family, we wanted to.

Not me and you in a family like that.

No, not our family. Me and my wife decided to start a family and have kids.

Clarification for the notes, because Alana is reading.

We wanted to move back to San Diego to be closer to my family and her family. But once we got the house that we're in now, we were kind of like, I think we're good. I don't want a bigger house. I'm good with the cars we got. I'm good with what we've got. Right. I feel like there is that tipping point where you want more, more, more, more, more. And now you're like, I don't want to lose what I got. I don't want to lose what I got. I don't want to lose what I got. And I think I've sort of passed this threshold of now. I'm more concerned about losing what I have than I am about figuring out how to get more.

I think now I think I've arrived to that point, or maybe I don't know what point I've arrived at, but I completely understand that. And I think that is like, the most common thing from people who, like, maybe have won it big, like, you know, made a bunch of money, is the fear of losing it.

Yep.

But obviously, yeah, a lot of people do, unfortunately. But it's also, yeah. Success like this. Like, oh, my God, I'm now used to this lifestyle. I don't want to give it up, and I want to give it to my kids, you know, and if you have kids and pass it on.

Yeah.

Or at least the idea that this is possible, you can work, you know. Yeah.

Yeah. No, I think for me, the book has really sort of. I hadn't realized that since until I read the book. Like, reading through the book, I think gave me that realization that I feel like I've gotten to a point where I've really toned down the desire for things, right? I've toned down the desire to have. And even when I see cool gadgets and stuff, like, I used to be a little more impulsive, where I'd see, like, this cool drone and I'd be like, I need that Amazon buy now.

Right?

But now what I'll do is I'll be like, that's really cool. I'll put it on my Amazon wish list, come back in, like, a week, and see if I still want it. A week later, I'm like, meh, yeah, I'll leave it on there because I might want it next week, but I'll.

See you kind of keep skitting. You pushing the puck out.

Push it out, push it out, push it out. Next thing you know, I've pushed it out like three years, and it's an old model. I'm like, I don't really want that drone anymore anyway. And I delete it off my wish list.

Things a piece of crap. Get it?

It's not something I did methodically, but it's something that I've realized I do.

It's good. I mean, maybe it's good.

I don't know. I think it's. I think doing stuff like that, it's almost like you get the gratification of purchasing something by just adding it to, like, your wish list on Amazon.

Oh, interesting. That's a cool little takeaway, right? Yeah.

Like, I feel that, like, you find it on Amazon, you go, oh, this is cool. That's the thing I wanted. I'll put it on my wish list, right? Maybe when Christmas or a birthday comes around, somebody in your family will see it and get it for you.

Cool.

But if they don't, you still have that thing of, like, oh, at one time, I wanted this. And then every once in a while, you check back, do I still want it? You know what? I do really want it. Screw it. You know, it's been a month and I still want it. Let's go ahead and order it.

Pretty good.

Let's spoil ourselves. But for the most part, most things that I add, I'm just kind of like. And then I take it off my list after a few weeks, you know, I like it.

It's cool. Yeah, the little pressure release, like, the gratification. I almost purchased it.

I feel like. I mean, I'm no scientist.

That's pretty good, man.

But I do feel like you get the same sort of release by adding something to a wish list as you would like, adding it to cart.

You know, Dr. Wolf, I would subscribe to that prescription.

Subscribe to that prescription. Okay, thank you.

Subscribe, subscribe, subscribe to the prescription that you're giving of this doctoral advice.

99Amonth.

Wow. It's good. It's good, good advice. It's cheap budget. Okay. Yeah, yeah, I think you're right because the little dopamine release, that's what it is. It's dopamine release. Yeah. Well, you've been like a monster on a wish list things on Amazon forever now. I know that.

Yeah, that's more like my family's influence. I actually don't think to add like stuff that I want as like a gift to the wish list. So like a lot of times I'll be putting stuff like boxes of pens or like a new notepad gift or like some post it notes or something like that. And they'll be like on an Amazon wish list. Because I'm like, yeah, I'm gonna make an Amazon order like on Wednesday. So like throw it on my wish list so I remember that I want it right. And then like a birthday, I'll roll around and somebody will give me like a pad of sticky notes and I'm like, thanks.

What's on your wish list?

So I never really saw it as like the gift thing, but like now every time around like Christmas and birthdays and stuff like that, my wife will be like, my mom wanted me to ask you to update your wish list. And I'll be like, okay. And then I'll go and add like some little $10 items to my wish list so people have gift ideas.

Damn. It's a bummer that you're like thinking you're like knowing people are looking at this where you're just like, you should just load it up with like.

You can make private lists too though.

I know, I know, I know. Because that's, that's what I started doing. That's what I use. Yeah, I'm surprised you weren't doing that. But no, I'm just like, you should just be adding crazy things on there. You never know what's going to happen, man. Maybe, maybe one of your aunts or your, your mother in law just hit it big and they're feeling feel Matt needs this whatever fancy pants drone.

Yeah, well, typically what I'll do is.

I B roll for the Hustle and Fluid chart show.

Yeah. Yes. Come on.

But yeah, I mean usually I do add it to, like a private list. And then from the. From the private. Like when somebody says, like, hey, it's coming up on Christmas or whatever, you should probably update your wish list. I just go look at my private list and go, yeah, that would make a gift. That can make a gift. That could make a gift smart.

Okay. Yeah.

It's almost always books.

So we beat that horse to death, Matt.

We did beat it to death. What was the horse we just beated.

The dopamine release of going to Amazon and buying crap that you probably don't need, basically stopping the goalpost moving forward. But it was other. I think it was just like. I don't know, it was going back to the things. Right. Like you were saying you used to buy a bunch of stuff on Amazon. That's what it was.

Well, I mean, I would just order gadgets.

Like, I. Yeah, it was all the latest and greatest.

Like, Josh Bartlett's always on top of the tech. So I'd get on a call with him and he'd be like, oh, I got the latest Kodak Zi 8. And I'm like, oh, that's cool. And I get on Amazon while I'm talking to him and I'd be like, I just ordered one too. That was like a very Keeping up with the Joneses kind of thing.

There was also the. I know I was always guilty of The Tim Ferriss 5 bullet Friday, like, gadgets that were mentioned. It would always be like the latest whatever, like cre, like mixes or whatever. Yeah. Butt cream. Tim Ferriss says it's good. All right, I'll trust him.

Tim Paris puts it on his butt. I should put it on my butt.

Sign me up. I'll subscribe to that too, I guess. Oh, man, I'm not gonna have any money after all these subscriptions.

Yeah.

Damn. I gotta learn more about money. I guess it's my happiness, Matt. Yeah, But I think.

What are some on your side and, like, what's one that stands out that we might have been circling?

Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of topics. I don't think we're gonna hit on all of them in this episode. But, you know, another thing that I've started doing is I've started every single Wednesday just throwing like, little bits of money into, like, an index fund. And that was something that he recommended. He was like, yeah, just go to an index fund that follows the S&P 500. If you look at it historically, it goes up 10ish percent a year or whatever it was. And it's a Pretty safe bet that if you just kind of put some money in there all the time, in 20 years it'll be very valuable due to compound interest. And ideally the market keeps on going up. It'll probably have some dips, but it'll overall go up. I've actually started doing that where every Wednesday I go and throw little bits of money at the S&P 500 in an index fund. I also. He didn't say a pop. Yeah, I mean I just.20k here. Just what I find in my couch cushions. Exactly.

Perfect. Yeah, it's just stacks. It's crazy. We gotta get a picture of you on a couch with like money coming out from under all the cushions and you're just laying back.

Yeah, I have pictures like that. I mean, that's my couch, it's just my house.

But have your kid take a picture and send it over. Send it to Jacob.

I've actually started throwing little bits of money into crypto also. Just kind of like a side thing. So I'm throwing a certain little percentage of money every week into index fund and a little certain percentage of money every week into like, into an account that has some Bitcoin and Ethereum in it. I don't mess around with all the altcoins and stuff. I've learned lessons there.

We've been there.

But yeah, so I just, I throw it to Bitcoin and Ethereum. I think those have the highest likelihood of being massly adopted. So I think that's something that if, you know, not financial advice or anything, but I do think that crypto is over the long run is going to keep going up and up and up and people are going to look back at it and go, yeah, it's like the S&P 500 historically it goes up over time. So put money in it. Right. So I kind of feel like it's a. I feel like it's safe. But who knows?

Yeah, who knows? And I think that's another point from the book that is pretty big, is that no one knows. That's like the point I was making is like, man, there's only what, 200 ish years of financial markets to study and that's not that long. That's not that long at all. So who knows? I mean, yeah, it probably will be. Yeah. I would say the odds are in the favor that crypto of some sort is going to freaking be a big piece of the future for sure. So I think it's super smart. Yeah, I want to get back in doing on the crypto Side I am doing that crypto. Crypto side. Yeah. I think it's smart, it's balanced and it should be longevity. Like in the long term, it should be a consistent play. And that's again, just putting points from the book, you know, in kind of realizations. For me, it's like, it's the long game. Yeah. To play the long game, but be happy in the now and fund everything that you should be that you want right now. But also like, yeah, run it through your filters, you know, use your little buy your wish list mechanisms to release the dopamine when it's like, you know, 11 o' clock at night and you're like, I just watched really cool drone video and now I think I'm gonna be a cinema photographer. Cinema fat cinematographer.

Get it out.

You got it. You got it.

Ah, good job.

Thank you.

But like, yeah, just put it on the wish list, you know. Yeah. Save it for the morning. Yeah. Reassess. Do you still feel like that, a cinematographer like that?

No.

No. Good. You just saved yourself like five grand.

Yeah. I'm trying to figure out how we got back to that thread.

I don't know, but doesn't matter.

We figured out how to.

Was there a place you were trying to go, Matt?

No, I was just talking about being a little bit more automated with my investing and throwing money into like consistency index funds. Yeah. Into crypto. It just kind of like having a routine way to make sure I'm investing on a week by week basis. So I know there's always a little bit more money going into that thing and it's going to compound over time. So just kind of like making that a little bit more of an automatic thing that just runs in the background.

It's the best thing long term and it's a system, so I like it. Anything else?

No, I think we kind of covered a lot. I think we covered our biggest aha's that we've discussed.

Yeah, they'll pop up. But I think this has been a book that's found us at a good time in our career, in our lives, where we're kind of looking at patterns in our lives and stuff that we just kind of do naturally, but also the places we want to go. And this book, I think it gives you a lot of insights into ways to steer whatever your life is financially, but also just whatever. And it kind of like shifts the perspectives a bit, brings some clarity around stuff and gets you thinking deeper. Check it out. Psychology of Money.

Yeah.

By Morgan Housel.

Morgan Housel. Yes.

I Said it right. Maybe. Yeah.

And we'll do our best to try to get him on the show because we want to pick his brain on.

Yeah. If you know him or have desires on or know where to find him. Desires.

Do you guys have desires?

Desires of something? I don't know.

Yeah. Let us know, I guess.

Yeah.

Find us somewhere.

I actually tweeted at him, and he.

Liked the tweet, so working.

We're like buddies.

You are besties. We're like besties.

So we'll get him.

We'll have to run that clip and ask him if he thinks the same. Yeah. You guys best friends? Morgan. Really?

We've never actually met.

Do you remember that? Like that. Click.

He probably. He just saw. He probably has a team member who's like, looks for likes on his stuff and. Or looks for mentions and just likes them.

They don't have those. That's not real.

It's not real.

It's always the person. Always.

Always the person you think it is.

Always. Well, yeah. Yeah. Tell them the truth. All right, so we'll bring him on the show. If you know him, we'd love an introduction. That'd be great. This is how we get guests on our show now.

Yeah, we just ask the audience to introduce us to guests.

Hey, we'd make it entertaining, fun to listen to or watch.

Could work.

You should go watch us. If you're not watching us, go over to YouTube at HustleandFlowchart TV.

HustleandFlowchart TV.

We're trying to improve it day by day. We are improving it day by day. I'd say we're doing a lot on the Hustle and flowchart brand, so it's fun. You should go subscribe and like and watch all the videos and increase our watch time and, you know, help us out over there in the YouTube lands.

Yeah. Also on these Tuesday episodes, we like to answer questions from the audience. We decided not to today because we wanted to talk about this book, and not a lot of people submitted questions. So submit your questions over@hustleandflowchart.com ask right now. I think it redirects to a Facebook post where you can ask your question on the Facebook post. I actually think I might mix it up. I might make it go like a Typeform or something like that, but we'll see. But either way, if you go to hustleandflowchart.com ask, it'll take you to a place where you can ask questions, and we'll answer them on our episodes.

We'll Actually answer them. We will. Oh, we don't just gather a bunch of questions. What do we do with these?

Well, last time we let an automated robot ask us questions. It was fun. So that. That worked too.

We'll do that if we have to fill time next time.

Yeah.

All right. Well, what else we have, we had the notes. So hopefully you found some wisdom here. Or if it's not our wisdom, it just rehearsed it from Morgan.

We just rambled about a book that we both read in, like.

So that's about it. So if you liked what we said in any form, you should go over to flowchartgroup.com and get the notes by entering your email address. But being quick, because you probably listened to this around the time it came, it got live, it got released. Whatever showed up in your podcast app, go do it now. So flowchartgroup.com see you there. Yes, go there.

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A money machine. Are we. Are we telling them that Easy Webinar is going to make the money? Because I don't know if we're allowed to do that.

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Ethanor.com hustle Let us know what you think about the show, if you're liking this thing. We're testing out new stuff. We're testing about. We'll get some ideas for the future too. Maybe some.

Game type stuff.

Yeah, we're gonna test some interesting styles for podcasting. We're still gonna do a lot of interviews. Thursdays are still gonna be interviews. Tuesdays, we're gonna. We're gonna.

We're gonna just play around a little bit here.

This episode was a little bit of an experiment where we were just kind of like randomly riffing on a book that we both liked.

I think it worked.

Yeah, I think it worked.

Real time thoughts. I'm serious.

I think it worked. I think we got a little bit, like, tangenty, a little. Sometimes a little too tangenty on some of the topics. But other than that, I think I like talking about the book. I thought I was.

I mean, I was thinking about kicking you off the podcast anyway, so I'm like, yeah, no, no, that's. Yeah, no, the tangents were fun. Yeah. But, yeah, the tangents, they went a little long.

So.

Yeah. No, but I'm curious what you guys think. Do you want to hear us talk about some of our favorite books? We're talking about doing some, like, game elements to the show, and there's gonna.

Be hella long tangents. Yeah. Because you ain't getting rid of me. Damn it. And you. Yeah, I'm the king of tangents, though.

Are you now?

That is too.

I don't know about that.

All right, Holds it in for you guys, though.

Yeah, I think that's everything, though. If you like this, go leave a review. We will read reviews on this show sometimes. So go do that if you haven't yet.

We would love to read reviews and big time reviews.

Big time reviews.

Ratings. That is big stars.

Five. At least.

Five. Five things.

Five minimum.

Five stars. Yeah. That's what we want.

Yes, please.

Thank you very much. All righty. Till next time. See you guys later. Adios.

Thanks, everybody, for listening to this episode of the Hustle and Flowch podcast, for taking the time to listen. We want to give you something a little bit special. Every single episode that we do, we actually have somebody on our team take notes. We basically have a Cliff's Notes version of every episode where you can go and find all of the tips and tactics that they laid out, all of the resources that they laid out, all the good stuff from this episode. We actually have a nice, simple notes version that you can find on our website. So go to evergreen profits.com, find this episode that you just listened to, and give us your email address, and we'll send you the notes. Thanks for listening.

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