Therapy Sessions 👥 The Perfect Podcast Business Model

Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.

What's up, everybody? You're listening to the Hustle and Flowchart podcast with your boys, Mount Wolf and Joe Fear. What is up, everyone? Welcome back to the Hustle and Flowchart podcast.

Oh, we are actually recording.

We're recording now.

I'm just eating carrots, so don't mind me.

Yeah, just ignore Joe's crunching and snacking. We're actually on location for this episode.

Which location are we located in?

We're in Orlando. Ish.

I don't think we're technically in Orlando, but we're near Orlando.

It's raining a lot. There's some thunder and lightning around, which is not common for us type of Southern Californians. Yeah, US folk.

Now we're out here for Podcast Movement 2019. We're recording this during podcast movement, although I believe this is getting released, like, a couple months after podcast movement has already passed, most likely. But we're recording it while at podcast movement. And it's been raining and thundering and lightning, and there's been alligators, and so.

Many alligators just take place.

Eagle fly at us, right at our face. That turned out to be a crane.

Mm. Yeah. Matt was freaking out. He thought it was gonna come. Come take all of his. What do we got over here? Some carrots, some celery ranch, some salami.

And grapes, but it flew into the screen and died, so it was all good.

Oh, yeah, we do have a screen protector because we're in Florida. Yeah.

And also that didn't happen. And also we haven't seen any alligators.

No, we definitely have.

But hey, a good food spread between us.

So if you hear some random crunching, you know where it came from.

Yes. We've got carrots, celery, salami, and grapes.

Yummy.

And this episode is sponsored by Ahrefs, by the way.

That it is. They are our go to SEO tool for all the ninja stuff, like research. Research and things you could do. I mean, there's like, about a billion things you could do with hrefs. Huh. Very ninja Y Ninja. Yeah, I was making that up. But you know where I like to go get some more Ideas is their YouTube channel.

Yes, like their YouTube channel.

It is pretty damn legit.

Yeah, you keep saying that.

Yeah, I know, because it's awesome.

Now, they do have a good YouTube.

Channel, so check out the YouTube channel. You can get all these fun ideas of how to use SEO to your benefit in your business, no matter what your business is. But their tool just makes it easy. So they have a seven day trial for $7 buck a day.

If you listen to our last, like, I don't know, 10 podcasts before this, we kind of give like a little tip, like secret way that we use Ahrefs in the intro of each podcast. So some little Easter eggs there for you. You can go back through those episodes and get all sorts of SEO tips from our past handful of podcasts.

And.

And right now they got a $7, 7 day trial at a hrefs c o m. Do we need to spell that out?.comahrefs.com $7. Don't be cheap. Don't be a T rexer.

Don't do that.

Don't be doing that.

Go spend the money. It's worth it. You're investing.

What was the new term that we heard yesterday? Somebody was like making a new term, like a don't be a seagull.

Seagull? Oh, yeah, because seagulls are takers. They come in and then they take the food like that eagle was trying to do earlier.

No, this is what it was. He's like, don't be a seagull. Don't be that person that comes in, shits on you and then leaves.

I think they said, take your stuff. Like take your food. But maybe you took your. No, no, they literally, literally said, whoever.

Said it, Somebody said it from stage yesterday at Podcast movement.

Is that what it was?

And they said, don't be a seagull. Somebody who, who, who flies in shits all over the place and leaves. And he was talking about, like coming in, handing out all your business cards and disappearing.

Like someone at a party walking up to you with a stack of cards, like interrupting your conversation of friends. And then the guy's being a seagull because he just shits all over you with his business cards.

Yeah.

And then he's like, hey, let's talk sometime. No. Yeah, let's start a fire with your business cards.

So it has nothing to do with Ahrefs.

I don't know why you brought that.

Up, because I was saying don't be a trexer and I was trying to figure out what was the other. What was the other analogy we heard yesterday that I thought was funny?

Slightly different meaning, but yes, but listen.

To our past episodes for some cool tips on Ahrefs and go grab their $7 day trial.

Hopefully Ahrefs doesn't mind this commercial because we have fun doing it.

The money's already in our pocket.

Jesus.

I'm just kidding.

No, I'm not. He's Not. He's really not. That's how spot podcast sponsorships work, y'. All. If you're not doing.

No, but we. We legitimately use and love Ahrefs, and I think this is a long enough Ahrefs commercial.

I'm pretty sure.

Yes.

There's money. It's worth. Yeah.

So this episode, just like any other episode, we are taking notes on. I'm not. It'll be. Well, we're not. But, you know, sue is taking them for us.

Thank you, Sue.

And sue is awesome, so. Hey, Su, you should write in the notes. Sue is awesome. Just put it in the notes.

Yeah, I mean, you write in the notes. You have the power to write that in the notes, Sue. So go write them in the notes.

Yeah.

So if you want to hear or see if sue actually wrote those in the notes, along with obviously, the amazing notes that are going to come out of this episode, as they always do in episodes. You have a very limited span of time to go get this for. Absolutely. Freezers. That's over@hustleandflowchart.com comp c o m P. But you do gots to be quick because we put those things locked up in a vault after a while and they go into our epic community. It's so epic, Matt.

It's so epic. It's the Evergreen Profits Insider club. And I'm currently choking on a piece of salami.

Alright, I'm not gonna say a word. I'll let that sit for a sec. And yeah, you didn't die.

Okay, good nil salami has gone down my throat now. It has finished clearing my passageway.

I can confirm that, I guess. Moving on.

Moving on. Hustleandflowchart.com comp go grab them notes if you're not a member of our epic community. It's cheap. Dude, it's like 15 bucks a month. Don't be a T Rexer.

Yeah, I mean, I don't like to call it cheap, but it is pretty damn cheap. Yeah, it is.

Inexpensive.

Inexpensive. Whatever the word is. You get the point. There's that eagle again. We're looking over, like a lake in the back of this balcony thing. But yeah, that thing, the Epic Community. We've been rebranding that, but that. Yeah, it's probably the cheapest community newsletter and printed thing you can get freaking to your house. It's pretty cool. All right, moving on. Moving on.

You know what?

But are we really moving on?

Let's actually not move on. Let's talk about the epic community for a second.

Yeah, let's do that. And then actually, that will tie in perfectly to some of these conversations we've been having here at Podcast Movement. So go on.

Yes, please. Yes. So, epic. It stands for Evergreen Profits Insider Club. Thank you. Brad Costanzo. You actually named our membership for us. So the Epic membership.

He's a branding expert. If you ever want to go, hit him up.

Yeah. And, Brad, we expect 25% of anybody.

Who reaches out from all of your income.

Yeah. We are sort of reworking the community. So all of you listening that are already members of the Epic community. This isn't a pitch anymore. This is actually us kind of getting into talking about what we're up to these days.

Matt, you can't stop pitching.

I'm always pitching. Always be pitching.

Abp. It's a new acronym. It's gonna catch on.

Yeah. So we're kind of reworking some of the things in the membership. It was funny at one point we thought, let's take this membership and let's just make it digital only. You told us otherwise.

Yeah, you, the listener. Barry.

Yeah, Barry.

Barry, you wrote in. No, I don't know. It wasn't Barry.

Wasn't Barry.

No, I don't know who wrote it, but I'm talking.

Was it Steve?

Sure, yeah. Yeah, it was Steve, actually. No, Steve, you told us, and we listened to you.

Yeah, and it was actually more than just Steve. A handful of people wrote in, and we actually got a bunch of feedback going. No, don't make it digital only. I love my prince newsletter, tears and all.

We got the tears in the emails that we were sent.

Yeah. We even mailed our list and said, look, it's going to be digital from here on out. So we had already kind of in our minds, planned on being fully digital with it. And then we got the feedback of, no, you got to stick with print. We love the print newsletter. And we backtracked, and now we're back to doing the print newsletter.

Yeah, no, it is very interesting. I guess we didn't really talk about that, huh? Because we threatened to take that away and then very quickly got shot down by the customers. I mean, this is just a case in listening to your customers. They will tell you what they want. And thank you for letting us know, you know, if you're one of the folks that reached out, because. Yeah, I guess we didn't. We thought we. It. I don't know, we thought that it was interesting and awesome, but then no one really spoke of them, you know, like the letters specifically of saying, like, hey, I love these Things. Yeah, I want these things and keep them coming. So we're like, oh, well, I guess you can move it to digital and be fine. It's the same effect. Yeah. Psychologically, they're not going to, you know, get in their inbox, their mailbox at home every month and physically have it in their hand. But we're like, yeah, maybe that's just negligible.

Yeah.

But then, no, we found out otherwise, it's completely massive. And when we told this to, what, Brian Kurtz when he was on the show, we, you know, he was like, oh, man, you're doing like the whole on, off on strategy. Like, you're starting online, taking them offline, and owning that inbox, more or less being there when other people aren't really paying to be there other than all the bills and people trying to hockey credit cards.

Yep.

It's all the stuff you're gonna toss away or you hate to see, but you see this freaking big package that says exclusive newsletter. Mm, that's pretty cool. So it's like, we're for not a lot of money. We are paying for prime real estate offline.

Yeah. Well, we actually did have a handful of people email us saying, hey, I'm getting your print newsletter. Would it be possible to just get it in, or could I get it faster if you just send me the digital one? So we did have a handful of people asking for the digital. And because most of the emails we were getting at the time were people saying, hey, I'm fine with the digital. I don't need a print version, we thought, oh, maybe this is representative of our whole audience. Maybe our whole audience wants the digital version. Let's just go digital. We'll save a couple bucks on printing and shipping costs.

There was a little bit more profit if we were going to go that way as well, let's be honest. But we were getting some requests for that, so we thought that was representative of what you guys wanted. And then as soon as we sent an email saying, look, we're changing to digital, we got way more emails from people going, no, we want our print newsletter than we ever got from people asking about getting it digitally.

Yeah. And I guess this goes into the whole model of. I've been talking to a lot of folks who have reached out about our podcast consulting lately. And the most interesting thing I guess that we do in their perspective, and this is after talking to maybe 30 people now, is, you know, a lot of folks are interested in not only starting a podcast if they haven't or optimizing what they got. But it's how do you monetize or how do we monetize, like, do this with our community and our newsletter and like, what does that process look like? And it's way too much to go into depth right now as there's a gecko that just like started freaking licking. I don't know, there's a weird looking lizard. Squirrel just hopped in front of us. I know, but there are a lot of steps involved. There's a lot of pages and emails and all that stuff. But the whole thing is that it starts with the podcast. Everything in the newsletter form and the community form starts right here with us just speaking it out. And it's like a whole lead gen funnel that goes into a continuity that any buddy can do with an audience is create kind of like this low ticket continuity offer that allows you to then create a new audience pool that you can fish in this pond. And we leverage those and those all the pools that we have. So, you know, the podcast audience pool, the paying subscribers and our consulting clients, we have all these different pools that you can then, you know, do your sponsorship type things with. That's how we work. The href. Steel. The 1. The sponsorship on here.

Yep.

And full exposure. I mean, like, that's literally what our business is. And it's interesting when describing that to people at Pod, Podcast Movement here, keep.

Wanting to say PodFest.

I know it's because Chris from PodFest was here. So everything's blending now. And it's in Orlando. The same damn city.

Worlds are colliding. Yeah.

But it's. It's really cool. And this is where I think it'd be a good time to talk about our system too, and how it relates to podcasting is we'll speak to some of these folks that have a good sized show here, or they just. They just don't know how to monetize their show, whatever it might be. And we tell them what we're doing and they're like, what? Yeah, like how? And it's just such. Everything's happening behind the scenes, but unless you actually go through it, then you kind of see the pieces all come together.

That's what's been interesting about podcast movement and, you know, even PodFest to a certain extent that, you know, there's a lot of tracks, there's a lot of speakers, but most of them are speaking to the beginners. Right. There's a lot of. And I think it's important that they do this. I think it's necessary. But there's a lot of presentations where you can tell the speakers are kind of trying to speak to the lowest common denominator. And I don't mean that in, like, a real bad way. I just mean, like, they're trying to speak at where the audience is at. They know a big chunk of the audience is brand new to podcasting, so most of the speakers are speaking to them. And what we. What we've been finding is as we walk around in the halls and we talk to the various exhibitors and we talk to people in the sort of networking events outside of the room that, you know.

Most of the real growth strategies and tactics and like, just like ninja shit that's blowing people's minds isn't the stuff you're getting in the rooms, it's the stuff you're getting in the hallways.

Yeah, no, that's definitely what we've been told and what we've experienced, for sure.

Yeah. And it's just. It's been interesting because we've talked to a lot of people here just, you know, walking around the halls and last night, we're actually out pretty late last.

Night, admittedly, our voices. Yeah.

And, you know, we were just networking. We were talking to people, we were getting to know their businesses, we were giving them ideas, they were giving us ideas. And, you know, we're just finding out that some of the tactics that we're doing, I mean, we're not just finding this out, but we're realizing that some of the tactics that we're using to monetize our podcast and to grow our business are considered fairly groundbreaking to most of the people that even have been in podcasting for years and years and years and years.

Yeah, it's interesting because you're right. I don't know. I guess we're just so close to it. We kind of take it for granted because we have these, like, both of us, Matt and I have different perspectives of things, but at the same time, we have a marketing perspective. So that's how we approach everything we do in life, not just podcasting. Like, oh, how can we get more downloads? How can we create better content? How do we get better, you know, like up level or guess. We're always thinking of all these different ways to optimize something, and that's like, marketing is kind of the heart of it. Like how we're doing that and then we do that with freaking everything. But yeah, the fact that we've chosen to go deep with the podcast, but then. Which I think is the most important part, where a lot of podcasters don't think about it. Is how does this integrate with my business as a whole? Like, for us, we integrate it completely. Everything talks to another. Like these. Like. Yeah. That's why we have the newsletter membership thing. Epic. Which completely derives from the podcast, but also ties in with, like, this whole. All these products that we have and affiliate offers and sponsorships and fricking consulting.

Yeah.

Rent, share, equity deals. Like, everything comes from these pools. Yeah.

I mean, I actually don't really mind breaking down our business model. That's been, like, kind of blowing people away.

Well, that's where we're gonna go. That's where I was naturally gonna lead this bad boy. Yeah. It's blowing people away. So I'm like, let's share this.

Yeah, let's. Let's just talk about it and really explain it out. So it obviously all starts with a podcast, Right.

Oh, before we break into it, I wanted to bring up a couple conversations. Like, why Going. I want to rip a little bit further on what you were talking about content and what we're seeing how a. It's surface level, it's kind of, like, watered down a little bit, but at the same time, I think a big disconnect. And this is what we heard in the parties last night, is that it's very siloed. Like, the common thing that we kept hearing is, oh, you're not gonna get rich with a podcast. Yeah, like, well, that makes me feel great. Yeah. Like, obviously. But at the same time, I think it's a big. Not a good way to approach it because you're not integrating it with, like, a way that you can actually make. Get rich.

Yeah.

So I know we're not all, like, you know, not every podcaster there or in any conference or entrepreneurs, but they kind of are.

It's such bullshit.

It is.

You can get rich with a podcast. It's just the people's perspectives on the podcast and how you approach the podcast.

And that's the thing.

It may not be the podcast itself that makes you wealthy, but a podcast could definitely fucking make you rich.

Yeah, exactly. And that's where I think the disconnect is before we break it all down and, like, the granular. But, like, I feel like there is content that's just. There's a gap right now.

Yeah.

And hopefully we can help some folks to fill that gap on this show. Or just speaking to people in the hallways because it seems like it turns the light bulbs on.

Yeah.

And we're hearing this from a lot of folks that, like, there's no, like, integration of. Okay. I have a business that does well here. This is what I'm hearing on these calls too. Business over here. Oh, I hear podcasts are really hot. Yes, they are. Oh, content's important. Yes, it is. Podcasts are easy to make if you have good systems and all these things. Yes, they are. Because we're just doing this in the flat balcony in a hotel room right now. But from this freaking talk around our grapes and all this stuff and talks about eagles that don't exist out here.

This thing becomes notes and then the whole system that Matt's about to freaking outline because that becomes our business. It integrates with our email list, our ads, our friggin consulting offers, and all these partnerships we've done now.

Yeah, I don't, I think a lot of people don't really see how it all ties together. And I mean, walking around this podcast movement, I think it's become very, very apparent that there's just a lot of people that are like, oh, I just, I love podcasting, but I don't see how it can ever be a business or, you know, I just love talking to people, but I'm just doing it for fun. I don't ever. I mean, we were talking to somebody yesterday who has a business podcast and like, I think they're getting like 10,000 downloads a month right now or something like that. And they're saying, yeah, we haven't even tried to monetize it yet. We want to get to like 50,000 downloads before we try to start monetizing. I was like, what? Why not, dude? We started and then he asked me, he's like, when did you start monetizing your podcast? I said, episode one before it even started.

Yeah. And Jesus Christ, we can like list out 50 ways to monetize a podcast. Yeah. And even a lot of ways that you could do that without even having a podcast live yet. Yeah, you can. You can do a lot of things and you. And yet here. Not just here. And I can't like just say, but in training. Typical ways of monetizing are sponsorships. And typically people don't know the metrics behind sponsorships, but it's like $20 CPM getting paid 20 bucks every thousand downloads. That's a shit ton of work to get a thousand downloads per month. Any, Anything. So, yeah, you ain't gonna get rich off of that. I agree with that. If you just go that. What that model. But you got to get out of that model is the whole thing.

Yeah. I mean, sponsorships have its place. But to be honest, we didn't even really consider sponsorships until, well, by the time this episode came out two months ago.

So, you know, it's. We've been doing the sponsorship thing for very. A very short amount of time, and it's just been some additional found money. Just kind of an easy add on to the business. But that wasn't how we were monetizing for the first two years of this podcast.

Not at all. So, yeah, so we were, I guess now prefaced, I feel like the ground pretty well, like been blowing people. And see, we have not. We're just explaining our business model. And most people are floored to hear that we can actually sustain a great lifestyle with a podcast as the business, even though it's not the business. That's a. That's the weird thing. Everybody's like, oh, you can make a living off your podcast. I'm like, well, yeah.

Mm.

But there's more than just the podcast. But yeah, this is where the siloed thinking. And I think it might be because of the training out there and what's available. Yeah, I don't know. I think that needs to change. So maybe this episode, we could do that by breaking down our model.

Yeah, we'll break down our model. It's something that, so far, as far as I know, I haven't seen anybody else follow this same model. I mean, there's some that come close, but nobody that's doing it quite like us. But it all starts with this podcast. Most of them are interview shows, as I'm sure you're very aware. So we bring on guests and we interview them. And part of our marketing strategy is these guests. We try to get bigger names. We try to get people that are willing to share to help spread the word of the podcast. We interview them. And then when we interview them, we have somebody who takes notes on every single episode. Hey, Sue.

Hello there.

She takes notes on these episodes and she writes the show notes for them. And then our freebie opt in is to go grab these notes@hustleandflowchart.com comp, like we say at the top of every show, you can go grab those notes. That's how we get you on our mailing list. Once you're on our mailing list, we're going to sell you on our epic membership, the Evergreen Profits Insider Club, where you get a print physical newsletter mailed to your door each month with all of the notes for all of the episodes for the past month. So for those people who you know, don't have the time or don't prefer podcasts. You don't have to sit through an hour, hour and a half, two hour episode twice a week. You can get the notes and find out all the high level takeaways from every episode. So that's sort of the core business model, right? You've got your content that drives people in. That's like your sort of free thing that attracts people to you. That's the podcast. You've got your freebie opt in, which is the latest podcast episodes that you can opt in and get the notes for. And then you've got your continuity membership, which is our recurring revenue model, which is the actual newsletter which also comes with a membership and a community. And we had all sorts of training in there. One of the things we've been doing a lot lately is going to past guests and saying, hey, do you want to contribute additional content that's exclusive for our members? And we're starting to get a lot of exclusive training and content. We just recently recorded something with Greg Merrilies where he did an audit on a whole bunch of our members websites and gave feedback on what he would change about their website.

That was gold.

It was really, really cool. You know, we had Shana Weisinger, she made a bunch of content on how to do repurposing properly. So we're adding all this additional content that's created by a lot of our guests and then Joe and I will contribute content and our team members like Shannon will contribute content from time to time.

It's this kind of closed loop system. We're creating the content once with the podcast and then we're finding ways to repurpose it. The thing you're opting in for is repurposed versions of this podcast. The thing that you're actually buying is repurposed versions of this podcast and timestamp savings of not having to listen through the podcast, plus you know, obviously the community and all the bonus training and.

All that kind of stuff and whatnot.

And our insights and yeah, you're getting all that. And then the sort of next tier beyond that is Joe sort of alluded to the pond concept earlier, right. We're creating these little ponds. So one of our pond is listeners of our podcast. That's like our biggest pond, right? That's like at this, at the time of this recording, that's like 50,000 people. So that's our biggest pond. We're throwing our lines out in the pond and we're trying to grab people onto our list. Right by.

And we do that with the free notes.

With the free notes, yeah.

That's what we're doing now.

That's our secondary pond. It's a little bit smaller of a pond, but it's a lot easier to catch fish in that pond.

Right.

So in that smaller pond, that's our email list. We're throwing our lines out there for our evergreen profits membership, our EPIC membership, and we bring them into our EPIC membership. And now we just created a smaller pond of just customers. A lot smaller pond, but a lot easier to fish in that pond.

And if you visualize a pond a little bit here, if you think in the podcast pond pond, it's not as dense of a fish, if you think like the easy catches or just catches in general. But then you build a pond of buyers, which is why we chose a very low level continuity buyer pool. That's like this one side of the barbell analogy and we've kind of stolen credit to Jeff Moore is that's that pond that you say, but that's a dense pond like that one.

When you throw an offer out there, it's a lot easier to get another buyer.

Yeah, you just drop your line in and you're getting bites. And then so now we have this smaller customer pond. What do we do? We throw our lines into that customer pond and we try to land consulting and done for you clients. We now offer a done for you service where we'll actually build your podcast assets for you. Your intro, your cover art, your show notes, we basically deck it all out and then we'll actually have our team manage your podcast for you on a weekly basis or whatever frequency you choose. And then we also have our podcast accelerator, which is us teaching people how to do a lot of our growth and monetization strategies themselves. And we really get hands on with a lot of businesses. And so we get to fish from our smaller customer pond of EPIC members to get our accelerator and our done for you clients. And that's really like the main flow. But then we also have these offshoot revenue streams that are kind of just like bolt ons, like affiliate marketing. You obviously you hear us mention designer and ThriveCart and Snappa and Convertbox and all these other tools that we're affiliates of that we use ourselves in our business. And we drive another giant chunk of revenue through that affiliate marketing. And then most recently we've added sponsorships into the mix. And the sponsorships, we approach it completely different than everybody else.

Right.

So with sponsorships, most people would go and say hey, it's $20 cpm for every thousand downloads we get. You pay us 20 bucks if you have 50,000 downloads. That's, you know, 50 times 20, whatever that math works out to, it's what, a thousand bucks?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So, you know, you might make a thousand bucks a month off of one sponsor on a podcast that gets 50,000 downloads. Right. We don't approach it that way. We sell our sponsorships at a very at a flat rate fee. So it's not based necessarily on cpm. We just say this is what it costs. And the reason we do that is you get shout outs on our show. Like you heard us shout out ahrefs at the beginning of this show. But then we also get to mention you in our newsletter. So we're going to actually extend. We're basically putting your name in more ponds, right? So we're building these ponds and we're mostly building them so that we can fish out of them ourselves. But by somebody sponsoring us, we're essentially giving them access to our ponds. So we're giving them access to our podcast pond. That's us giving a shout out at the top of the call. We're giving them access to our customer pond, our $15 a month subscriber pond, by mentioning them inside the newsletter. And then we're giving them access to the people that land on our site, that is another pond of ours, by rotating their banner in. And that's how we generate sponsorship revenue, which allows us to actually get closer to a $200cpm when sponsors come to us versus $20cpm when sponsors come to us. And so that is literally our entire business model. All of that right there. It goes from podcast to use that podcast for an opt in to use those people that have opted in to sell them on the memberships, to use those people that are in our members area to sell. Done for you and accelerator. And then we have two offshoots of affiliate marketing which we make some good revenue off of and another offshoot of NOW sponsorships which had additional revenue and all of that.

There's a lot of partnership stuff like equity deals, there's Rev Share, there's all these different projects that can come from that pool of people. Yeah, and that's where that gets really interesting because then smart people, typically these are the ones that are like really have worked with us closely in some form throughout our community and has like probably purchased a handful of things.

Almost inevitably. We always get asked, hey, can we just like team up on this project together or can we just do what you guys do here and apply it to what I got going over here.

Yes.

And that's where it gets really interesting because it's high leverage and it all came from that system you just pointed out there. Yeah. And it's not us needing to recreate anything new. It's using a system that we have proven and now we can essentially just bolt it onto another whole business, slash, podcast, whatever it might be over there. Yeah.

And I mean, so anybody who says, like, you know, you can't, you're not going to get rich off of podcasting. Well, just that little system that we broke down alone, without the partnership deals, without the rev share deals, without all the other stuff that we're involved in, it's a seven figure business. Right. It's generating seven figures and we're only getting like 50,000 downloads a month. We're not like the largest podcast in the world. We're having the largest business podcast in the world. We're probably not even the largest marketing podcast in the world.

That's okay, but you don't need a bit.

I can almost guarantee this podcast generates more revenue than podcast five times, 10 times the size. And then, you know what you just said, anybody who says you can't get rich off of podcasting, they need to look at that shit. Right? Like, podcasting is the best networking tool on the planet that we've found so far. Like, we invite people to be on our podcast. We get to spend like an hour with them. We usually talk to them for a few minutes before we hit record, talk to him a few minutes after we hit record. And then once we've done that interview, we are now connected. That person, if we ever see them at an event, you know, we'll come up and hang out with them and spend time with them. We always give our numbers to the people. They have our email addresses. We usually stay in communication with most of the people that come on our podcast. Now they're our contacts. Now we have a bigger list of people maybe we can hit up if we need funding for something or we have an idea for a partnership or they're thinking of us. If they have a partnership that maybe involves podcasting or SEO or traffic or something that's in our wheelhouse. And now we get all these kind of deals that flow to us all because of who we've interviewed on our podcast.

Yeah. There's so many benefits to that. And if you can create a system to actually sustain your podcast, because after talking to all these folks on phone calls, of people in our ponds that have reached out to either start a show or optimize what they got. That's the most common thing is everybody thinks that the money is made on sponsorships. I would say 90% of folks will say, okay, well, I'm gonna launch a show, but my goal is in the first four to six months is to get some sponsorship deals to pay for everything. And like, no. And you could. Well, I'm not gonna say no, but not the typical sponsorships. And you could definitely, you know, like pre fund a show without creating all these systems we just laid out. Or, I mean, it's really not any crazy systems that we just laid out there, but it is a blend of digital marketing, podcasting. And I think that going full circle back to what we're seeing now, getting immersed in some of the biggest podcast events is we're not seeing people blend those things together and blending their current offers, whatever those might be. Like one of our clients that just signed up, they run a pretty big agency in the E. Comm space and they want to optimize their content and they have a podcast, but they just haven't figured out how to really blend the two together. And what's interesting is they got the high ticket stuff down, but of course that's not super leverageable. If it's an agency model, it could be very lucrative, of course. But what he really was interested in is how do you create a system that's going to be just a feeder of like the best leads. So if you're thinking, you know, start at the bottom, work them up, and that's what's really cool, is the trust is built on a podcast. That's where the consistency, that's where all the free. I mean, we love to give our best stuff away for free. Not everyone does that on a podcast. But sure, yeah, let them do what they got to do. But that's where you're going to really bond a lot with folks listening to your show. But after that, you want to let them go deeper down the rabbit hole with you if they choose to. They really enjoy you. Getting them on the email list is only going to be another extra touch because they're not going to not stop listening to a podcast now. They're going to get emails when the next show goes out or some other cool stuff you might be interested in teaching and selling. And then, yeah, you got the membership. If someone chooses to actually spend money now, they're going to get the inbox, actually physical inbox of our newsletter. Every single Month. Trust goes even deep. Even better now. Deeper. I don't know where trust goes. It's better. It's a higher trust. That's it. And the idea is we're just layering. Boom, boom. The more you layer on, the more you can then get up to a higher level offer. Like this agency that we're working with, they wanted to figure out, okay, how do I just create these pawns that can feed my higher end offers? Well, this is how you do it.

Yeah.

And you could do that from day one. Yeah. And you don't need a podcast to do that either. You could use a blog or whatever, YouTube channel if you're a YouTuber. Yeah, like, that's cool. But this is just how we apply it here.

Yeah, I mean, just kind of elaborating on that pond concept a little bit. Like the pond you create when you're podcasting isn't just a pond of potential email subscribers, isn't just a pond of potential customers. It's also a pond of potential future business partners. It's also a pond of potential investors. You know, we've had a handful of people reach out who listen to the podcast religiously, and I'm sure a handful of more listening to this episode reach out and basically, you know, want us to get involved with real estate development deals or invest in their SaaS company or advise on their software company or, you know, like, just because we have this podcast and we're creating this pond, we're not even like fishing in the pond. It's like sometimes these fish are just freaking jumping into our nets, you know, jumping fish. But the podcast is just so powerful in that way is that you never know who's listening. You never know how powerful or influential or wealthy or, you know, famous or whatever sort of positive attributes you can think of. You really never know how many of those people are listening into your podcast. And that's where you know you ain't gonna get rich off a podcast. Bullshit. That's where you get rich off a podcast is you make deals, you find people to invest with, you find, you know, there's so many opportunities lying in your listeners that you don't even realize.

I think the big thing that I'm hearing when you're saying that is collaboration.

Mm.

You can't. We can. None of us can do this stuff alone. And I. I know chatting with a lot of the folks who reached out to us, I love hopping on these phone calls with podcast listeners and customers of ours, but unfortunately, a lot of folks are just trying to do everything alone. They're trying to be very siloed back to what we're seeing as the common takeaway of most of this podcast content is everything's very siloed. The podcast is siloed. The podcaster is siloed in that they don't have help for editing or marketing or whatever. And we're realizing the more and more we just want some help or need some help with something, we're stuck on something in the business, or if we're just trying to grow the show and trying to monetize the show in different ways, just reach out for help. There's all these folks and resources out there, and if you can collaborate and even if it's just hopping on a call with someone to introduce you to a new, I don't know, referral partner or whatever contractor that can help you out.

It just seems like everything gets easier and it just goes in and integrate everything you possibly do. If that's collaborating with folks, if you're, you know, if like you got a frickin. We've had buddies with a big show reach out to us. And, you know, if we have many folks with big podcasts reach out and they're like, hey, we're great at growing shows, but we're not good at monetizing cool, we can help you out there and vice versa, you know, like, okay, so what are some growth hacks that you've used that we can use? And it's just helping each other and it's being cool and doesn't mean that we're selling that or even taking a piece in things, but it's just hop on a little informal mastermind, for instance.

Well, even when it comes to, like the affiliate marketing stuff, I don't think you realize how much easier it is to be an affiliate marketer if you have a podcast. Because what we do with our affiliate marketing is a lot of times we bring on product creators, interview them, and then actually kind of get to know them a little bit. And you know what happens? We usually get higher commissions than most other affiliates. They'll usually like, white label us for their higher premium affiliate tier. So we're getting, you know, 50%. So the 20%, in one case, they're giving out 30% on average. And we interviewed the founder of a particular company and they bumped us up to a 70% commission per sale. And do you think that motivated us to push more of their product? Yes, it did. Do you think.

It was a win win for everybody? It motivated us to push their Products, they got a lot more traffic and a lot more customers. It was a tool we were using anyway. We only ever promote tools we were using anyway. And it made us a lot more revenue and made us a lot more motivated to push it. So win win for everybody.

Yeah. And that leads to other opportunities of getting content blog features on these companies websites as well. Like we've done that where a lot of folks that we will collaborate with as a partner or affiliate partner, whatever kind of partnership typically can, you know, figure out maybe some content type swaps as well. So you can get link backs or you can get preferential SEO placement maybe mentioned on a blog post that's ranked already. Like there's so many ways that we've kind of worked out win win deals, but maybe an end result is also us getting featured in a pretty prominent spot or getting our show featured for instance. And that all comes through collaboration. It starts with the podcast and like you were saying, follow ups, giving more value, helping them in places where we maybe we noticed something in their business that we're like, ooh, dude, I think you should really change this. Or like I would suggest you do this. Like we've seen that really work. Maybe it can work for you too. And I mean even if they never implement that, just the gesture alone will open up doors and the opportunity to. I put air quotes around negotiating that commission that you just mentioned from 30 to 70%.

Best negotiation ever, I guess. But either way I know he's winning and benefiting from that as well. So then it's, he's happy, it doesn't matter.

Yeah, we had another affiliate just recently who we've talked about quite a few on this podcast and mentioned on our blog reach out and go. Yeah, you know we've, we do Most affiliates on 30 day payout. We've been paying you 30 days after the sale. But you know, because you have the podcast and you actually mention us so often, we're going to put you on instant payout. So now we get the commissions the same day we make the sale on that particular product which we promote fairly heavily.

So GNM's another one that we were their first affiliate and we did I guess well enough in their eyes where they actually created a whole affiliate program around what we started with them. Yeah. And we kind of, kind of advised them on how to do that and, and how to frame this in a lot of the marketers. Now there's, there's a lot of people now on that affiliate program and it's really cool because we were kind of the genesis of that whole thing and opened their eyes to the potential of affiliates, which I don't think they came from that world. But then, you know, that door still open, even though it's been over a year or so. Yeah, they've grown tremendously. But it's really cool, you know, we've had MO on the podcast, I think, as an after result that wasn't even before. So the fact is just, it's really cool to collaborate. That's. That's really why we even came out.

To podcast movement, you know, find more collaboration opportunities.

We have a lot of friends here that we've either mastermind with over doing business together with, you know, in some form or another. And this is one of those, you know, Roland Frazier says it often is like, put yourself in the middle of things and just kind of be open to the opportunity. If it's like, okay, go to dinner with someone or meet up for coffee or just find someone in the hall. You never know what, who you're gonna run into if you put yourself in the right spot. Yeah, we were actually joking about this last night. He was. Our friend Phoebe was.

Saying, like, is there anyone here that you really want to meet or, you know, people you want to really collaborate with or whatever? And like, you know what? Matt and I have kind of realized when we go to events that the right people will show up to us without us needing to seek them.

Yeah.

And of course, this is at an event that maybe we know some folks there, that definitely helps. But what we'll do, instead of just scouring the halls and walking around aimlessly or whatever, looking at things, are going to areas we know the values in the freaking networking halls or in the just sitting around. So we'll just plan up on some chairs. It could be a freaking wall in front of us, kind of hidden, but somehow the right person always shows up and it leads to a great conversation. Maybe it's a podcast guest referral that's happened many times. Like, oh, I got this really good person to refer you to, actually. We had Angela Hartman. Remember yesterday we were sitting in the lobby, which in like a very obscure part of the hotel. And Angela's awesome. She listens to our show and she's referred people our way. And she was like, oh, remember she said she was going down the elevator and she was like, oh, yeah, Joe and Matt said that they were gonna be here. I wonder if I'm gonna run into them somewhere around here. And we were the very first people she saw when she Got off the elevator and she's like, holy shit. How cool is that? Yeah, I'm like, meant to be. And we were just sitting there just like, eh, we have no agenda. Someone's probably gonna show up. Oh, bam.

Yeah. And then, like two minutes later, the guys from Optimal Living Daily, Justin and Lee, you know, they wanted to go meet up for lunch or dinner or some meal at that time.

Kind of a weird hour time out here when you're not on the time zone.

And so we were sitting there going, huh, I wonder if they're gonna be able to find us where we're sitting in the lobby through, like you said, a weird location. So Angela walks up, we're talking to her. Five minutes later, three minutes later, a couple minutes later, those two guys walk up and walk straight over to us, and we go get lunch. And it's like everybody just kind of floated to us.

Yeah. And that just goes into the whole thing of put yourself out there. And that's. This is all podcast does for you. This is. That's why I bring it up is it's very similar to networking in person. If you just put yourself out there in kind of the right area, maybe the right vertical, and then you kind of have yourself networked with the right people for guests. Yeah. You can more or less start to have the right people show up at your virtual doorstep in your podcast. Like, literally knocking and saying, hey, I really think this person would be a good fit for your show. Oh, hey, I think you should, I don't know, affiliate offer this thing, you know, and somehow collaborate with me on this thing, whatever it is. There's a lot of stuff that happens if you just kind of put yourself out there in the right place, but then be open to collaboration, agree, and then monetize in a very smart way.

So before we wrap this thing up real quick, I do want to touch again on podcast movement and see if you've had any.

Any, like, personal, like, big insights or aha's, you know, from the handful of sessions we've been in or just like talking to people outside.

Hmm. I like the way that podcasts move. It's different than most events we've got. We go to, actually.

Yeah, let's. It is kind of interesting. I want to.

Different.

Yeah. Like, the way they have it set up is it feels more like you're like a convention than like a conference.

This is our first time here, so this is like the very first exposure we've ever had to this one. Yeah.

It's set up in a Way where like there's all the booths and all the sponsors and stuff. And then like the actual breakout rooms where you watch the conferences are kind of all attached to the main sort of exhibit hall. And some of them are even like glass boxes, like fishbowl looking.

Yeah. It's kind of weird.

Wanna lie and see the speaker.

Everything in me to not want to fog up the window while some like packed house thing is having just like. Right. Hi.

And just look at them awkwardly. No.

Well, I know. So yesterday we saw. We. We watched a panel on monetization through memberships, which we were kind of sitting there going, man, I wish I was on this panel because I've got some cool ideas to share. But that's neither here nor there. Also sounded very egotistical. So anyway. Oh, self reflection. It's a bitch. No.

And so fast.

Yeah.

No.

And then we also sat in on a panel on how to build your audience. Right.

Yeah.

And I know you had kind of an interesting takeaway after the membership one about a potential like additional monetization strategy.

Yeah.

Did you want to talk about that?

Yeah.

Under wraps.

No, I'm just. I don't. I don't keep anything under wraps anymore. What's happening?

Nothing.

Nothing. Nothing. Joe, put it back in your pants. Matt, don't get excited. No, I. As I'm chewing on grapes. Starving.

Yeah. So, I mean, it's weird the way that I guess I always digest content. I don't take it literally. So, like a lot of this stuff that was there being. It wasn't. It was a panel. So it wasn't like a straight up content thing anyway. It was more Q and A. And there was something mentioned with. And this is a great way to probably maybe pre sell a podcast, if you're thinking about it is they were talking about executive producers. Someone said that it was literally probably no one else in the room even caught this. It just one of those things just like clicked. I was like, ooh. Because something we're thinking about is like, okay, well how else can we monetize our show? Because there are a million ways to do that. And if you have these little areas, it could be found money, but also a great win for someone else. So executive producer credits can be sold on shows and a lot of these are done typically in a narrative type podcast. Because this podcast movement is not just marketing people. It's probably a very small sect is marketers or marketers. Like that's what I said earlier. I'm like, I don't know how many actually have A business. Most people are podcasters here, which is cool. Not a lot of aspiring. There are still some, so. But this narrative thing, the lady was saying. Yeah, we sell about $100 a month for executive producers and we love them because they stay on forever, because they just love having their name as part of the credits. Yeah. And I was like, we get approached all the time for folks asking how to sponsor on our podcast or somehow on our platform. And yeah, I think you walked out of the room. But I was, I was, I heard this part and I wasn't in there.

When they were talking about that.

And that's right. And I wrote that down and I didn't. Didn't take it literally, but I was like, you know what? We could probably add credits to our podcast. And credits meaning like, hey, here are our, I don't know, like silver level level sponsorships. Maybe the gold are, you know, like the top tier, like hrefs, for instance, in this show. They're paying the substantial amount to be kind of published everywhere on our platform. But like, no, we can have. There are these other people that can maybe for a lower. I don't know what price $100 plus per month can get featured at the end of our episodes as a featured partner or silver sponsor, whatever the heck we want to call it. Yeah, it's extra inventory. And that was like a way that you can kind of monetize or we can monetize something that we currently have. It's not any extra work. I know a lot of people listen to the end of all the shows. We have stats on that.

Mm.

So it's, It's. It could be great exposure. And that has not fully been fleshed out as an idea, but little things like that. Yeah, that was, that was kind of cool.

I do the same thing when I'm in like a lot of these rooms. Like, I'll hear what they're saying, and my notes are usually like, not even related to what they just said. It's just kind of like something they said triggered a different idea in my brain that I took notes on.

That's almost always like, if I need a friggin process, it's okay, download the video, you know, or buy the videos or download product, whatever you got to do.

Yeah.

But typically, I feel like every process in our business, we have created, but it's been more from some idea or influenced from something like that. Yeah. Like, that's literally how our thoughts will. Like, that's where the newsletter concept kind of originated from. It's just like, or just how we insert that into our business. Yeah, it's always a fusion kind of thing. Yeah.

I mean, for me, a few. There's a few sort of takeaways that I've had, and a few. There's been a few times I've kind of caught myself, like, listening to speakers and just in my head going, bullshit. And actually, one of the times it wasn't even in my head, I actually said bullshit.

Yeah. But, you know, what was the bullshit thing? You don't have to name the speaker, but.

Well, there was somebody that was saying, just focus on Apple. Don't worry about Spotify and Stitcher and all the other platforms. Just focus on growing it on Apple. Because Apple's the biggest player and he showed a bunch of data and he's like, Apple accounts for like, 80% of podcasts. I don't know if that's the actual number, but it was a large.

It was like.

It was the majority.

Plus. Yeah, it's huge.

It was the majority. And then like, Apple and Spot, or Spotify and Google and Overcast and all that combined all add up to, like, 15% of listenership, you know, and he was like, yeah, so just focus on Apple. Don't focus on the other platforms. And I just. I don't like that concept because I think there's still a lot of value to being one of the top players in a small pond coming back to these damn pond analogies. But I'd rather much rather be, like, one of the top fishes in a small pond than a very tiny fish in the largest pond when it comes to podcasting. So I think this whole concept of, like, just focus on Apple is not super smart because you're basically just going, hey, look. Look at that haystack over there. I'm a needle, and I'm just gonna throw myself in it and people are definitely gonna find me.

I like that. Right.

Where it's like, maybe going over to Spotify, there's like a pile of 10 needles and you're throwing another needle into that little pile. Right.

And we know it's very. Yeah, Spotify right now, it might not be the largest. We know it's not. The data shows it's not. It's growing. It's definitely growing. And it's. It's. And we've heard it's growing more in countries that have Android or non iOS devices as a predominant podcast player. So that's where Spotify, that's where itunes is gonna get, like, rude awakening. But, yeah, it's the whole What Wayne Gretzky Puck is going exactly like, where's the puck going? Well, yeah, Itun. Well, it's. Apple podcasts is not going anywhere, but sure as hell not the only player in town. And we've heard, you know, with Spotify, we haven't done a total focus on like, growing specifically Spotify, because there's a lot of ways. But we hear like, no, it's actually very simple to get, you know, kind of discovered on. On Spotify right now because no one's really focusing on it.

Yeah.

But guess how many people are freaking using Spotify. Millions and millions. Millions. And they're investing. You know, they invested, what, 400, $500 million this year for podcast growth of their business. So, yeah, think the puck's headed that way a little bit.

And there's also the same concept. If there's so many people out there perpetuating the idea of, like, just focus on just Apple. Just focus on Apple. Well, you're sort of like, help. You're perpetuating the problem.

Right.

You're making it so that other apps never grow and no other apps ever sort of make an impact in the podcasting world. And, you know, it's like, yeah, you know, go out there and tell everybody, just focus on Apple, and none of the other platforms are going to grow. And you're actually sort of hindering the industry as a whole by going out there and perpetuating that idea. So, you know, I just. That was one of the things where I actually verbally found myself going, bullshit.

But, yeah, and I would say, I mean, all honesty, we haven't gone into a lot of the content. I mean, we don't do that a lot at podcast or at any conferences, but we love to. It's just all networking for us. Like, that's the biggest part. And really getting face time with the people that we already know. And the only way we network really is just referrals through other people or just getting a life of the party. Yeah. We attach ourselves to someone like that who then is just gonna freaking make his way around the entire room and then bring back the best of the best.

Yeah. Looking at you.

Thank you, Lee. Luckily, we are good buddies with one of those guys and he'll find the best people that we need to meet. So my suggestion to you is find one of those people in your life.

My suggestion is go to hang out with Lee from Optimal Living Daily.

He's a hell of a networker, man. Best in the biz.

And then the other thing is at PodFest, I'm just going to reiterate what happened at PodFest is we go to a lot of digital marketing events that are focused around marketing, and there's a lot of egos. I mean, there's a lot of great people, too, but there's a lot of egos. There's a lot of, you know, people pulling up in their Lambos and parking them in front of the hotel, and, you know, they're all doing it for the gram and all that kind of shit. And you come to, like. Like a podcasting event, both PodFest and Podcast Movement, and it's. You don't get that feeling.

You haven't seen a single Lambo anywhere.

No, you get the feeling that, like, everybody's in this together. Everybody wants to help each other grow. Like, me helping your podcast is a win for our industry. Like, that's the kind of feel you.

Get that is, like, feels very collaborative thing.

And even, like, the companies that you think would be competitors are, like, sort of working closely together. You have PodFest, you have podcast Movement. There's actually a Pod Fest booth at Podcast Movement.

That was amazing. And we walked up and Chris Kurmitos. Yeah. Who's been on the show, actually. So if you want to go back, you can look up Chris and hear all about PodFest and our experience there. Yeah, he was right here. He has a booth at Podcast. Podcast Movement. And I was like, wait a minute, this is rad.

And then he was even talking to somebody who's a very prominent event creator as well. And we were kind of in this circle during this conversation, and he was. He was basically giving her all of his secrets. He's like, these. This is. These are the ways that we've grown it. These are the ways that we maximize engagement. This is how we get people to show up early. This is how we get people to stay late. This is how we get people to all the booths. And like, technically, they're kind of competitors. They even have events happening in the same month.

Yeah.

And. And they were sharing notes on the ways to better grow their events. And I was just like, this is awesome. You don't have see this kind of collaboration as much at a lot of the digital marketing events that we go to.

That's interesting. Yeah. And that's. If that just happened more and more. Just think of, I don't know, the awesome stuff that can come of it. Yeah. But that was amazing to see. And luckily, yeah, I hope good things come of those events, because I know podfest is absolutely amazing. Podcast Movements, great as well, it's also.

Cool to see that we're probably the ones that made that connection. So if something huge blossoms out of it, we had a little piece of that, which will be cool to see. Which can't give too much detail. So I'm being fairly vague, but.

Yeah. Yeah, it's just awesome. Again, goes back to. You'd be very surprised if you start just kind of collaborating, asking for help, and goes. Even for people that you don't feel like you're super close with, there's probably some way that you can bounce ideas off each other and just help each other out. Yeah, for sure. Yeah.

I don't know. So far, it's been a good trip.

Takeaways. I wanted to just wrap that. I would say, like, here, what Podcast movement. So if anyone is thinking podcast events, I guess I would say the big difference here is. Yeah. Pod Fest, since we had kind of an episode on that one, is a lot more content focused, and they did very good at networking as well. It's much more of a. It's a smaller event and it's much. I would say it's a tighter, like, family kind of feel.

I also felt like Pod Fest, a lot of the topics, they did get a little more tactical than what I've seen at Podcast movement.

Yeah, I could see that. Yeah. And it's. It. Yeah. Okay. I agree with that. And then Podcast movement here is, like Matt was saying, it's a little bit wider. There's actually. It seems like they pull in some pretty big names in the podcasting world, but doesn't mean it's totally relevant to you, though. It definitely wasn't to us in certain regards. We're like, oh, cool, they're live podcasting on a stage over there. But it's like, meh. Yeah. But it's really cool to see that because it's showing all facets of podcasting and how many verticals there are. Just the fact that they got, what, Guy Raz from npr. I know you didn't really know who he was at all, but if you listen to podcasts, especially npr, which I think it's the largest publisher of podcasts. Like, Guy Raz is the name.

Yeah.

And, like, they're bringing people like him out and they're bringing all the other big podcasters that, you know, it's just interesting to see this whole mash. But it's much more of a conference or it's an expo feel, I guess. Yeah. Rather than a training conference, it seems like.

Yeah. I would say this one more People come to this right now than come to PodFest. So this one, I would say, like, the networking opportunities are a little bit bigger than PodFest. Pod Fest, I agree, is more content focused. You kind of want to be in the rooms a little bit more. PodFest was also a little more spread out. This is all kind of like, you know, the event space where all the sponsors are and where all the rooms are and all the speakers are, is all in a kind of a more condensed space where PodFest was sort of spread out wide over a larger hotel.

Yeah.

So, yeah, interesting. I'm trying to think of any, like, big takeaways that I might have had from, like, conversations, and we've kind of covered it all, I think.

I think the biggest takeaway, I think, is what we covered here.

Yeah, I did. I did take some notes during a couple of the panels, but again, it was, like, not stuff they specifically said to do. It was kind of like a spin off idea of what they might have said, you know?

Yeah. I feel like that's all the gold, though, comes from there. It's how it relates to what you already have going. Typically, like, with us, I know the downfall we've had a lot of times is if we just totally crush something that maybe was on an upward trajectory or like, maybe it flatlined and just needed some modifications and we were just like, screw it, kill it. Start something new from scratch. It's like now we're like. That's like. We're averse to that. Yeah. Because that is a lot of work and we're just killing our momentum. Yeah.

Well, we are going to probably do a deeper dive podcast movement debrief, where we kind of go through our notes and record some of the stuff. We talked about doing that for our members.

Oh, yeah. So we'll put it in the Epic membership.

Yeah. So we're gonna do it. We'll do another deep dive. We'll probably do that one on video and put that in our membership site. By the time this episode's released, that should already be in the members area, where, you know, Joe and I were literally gonna pull out our notebooks and kind of compare notes and record it and share it with the community. So that'll be inside the Epic community pretty soon. So if you're not a member, make.

Sure you are a member. Be Epic with us.

Joe, if somebody wants to go learn more about you, where can they go to check you out?

Oh, I never thought you would ask. Yeah, they can find me in Orlando.

No, they can't. This Is this is coming out two months after we're in Orlando.

When's this going out? Where might I be then? I gotta look at my calendar really quick.

I don't know.

August. I might be at home.

Timber. October.

You could find me in San Diego October sometime. Buy me a coffee.

Maybe September.

Okay, well, I'll be prepping to have a baby month to follow or two, so. Yeah, no, I might be in Sedona, actually. That'd be great. But you can find me on the interwebs@evergreenprofits.com it's probably the best place. Cool.

You can find me@hustleandflowchart.com comp.

Okay. That's where you find Matt. He's where you find notes. I live in the notes and I just live, I guess, I don't know. @evergreenprofits.com. you know where to find us, guys?

Yes. Go to hustleandflowchair.com computer. Get that shit. Don't be a T rexer.

What's a T Rexer?

Somebody whose arms are too short to reach their pockets. They're just walking around, like, growling, going, I'm angry because I can't get to my pockets.

They might have deep pockets, though.

Yeah. Yeah. It's not the same as a seagull, flies in, shits on everyone and leaves.

You don't want to be there, I guess.

He doesn't shit on everyone. Shits everywhere is what they said.

And then also does take your shit too.

They will if you're at the beach.

It's kind of like. It's a double whammy. Yeah, it's really. They're little.

Yeah.

San Diego is covered with them.

Nice ice hockey team in San Diego after the goals. Yeah, that's true. That's horrible. Can't be a fan anymore. Yeah. All right, so enough rambling. It's probably gone on far too long already.

Yep. We're just grab the notes for this episode. Go become an epic member. Go become part of our Accelerate program. Go let us do your podcast for you and then let us partner with you on your multimillion dollar idea. No big deal. That's the entire Ascension model right there.

Just reach out to us at our support desk. You know how to get us info. Greenprofits.com.

Alrighty, guys. We appreciate you. Sorry for the rambling and ranting and screwing around at the end.

We told you we were up late last night.

We're delirious.

And it's. We're sitting in thick, thick humidity that we are not used to.

Although it is not downpouring anymore, which is nice.

We wanted to get, like, some good thunder in the background. That's why we sat outside. And now it just stopped raining and no thunder.

There's a weird, like, turkey, chicken things tur.

Chickens.

I don't. They are. But they look like chickens, and they. But they have, like, their faces look like turkeys.

I don't know. Should we. I heard. I see there's grills around here.

You want to go on a hunt?

We could go hunt one out.

We'll probably start raining and put out the grill.

All right, guys, so I'm gonna have a video. I'm gonna shoot a video of Matt trying to wrestle a tur chicken.

No, he's not. That video will not exist.

Okay, well, that was fun.

I don't know how to end this episode. Two seconds. Let's go ahead and end this and say, go to hustleandflowchart.com comp and thanks for listening.

Thanks, everybody, for listening to this episode of the Hustle and Flowchart podcast. Before taking the time to listen, we want to give you something a little bit special. Every single episode that we do, we actually have somebody on our team take notes. We basically have a Cliff's notes version of every episode where you can go and find all of the tips and tactics that they laid out, all of the resources that they laid out, all the good stuff from this episode. We actually have a nice, simple notes version that you can find on our website. So go to evergreenprofits.com, find this episode that you just listened to, and give us your email address, and we'll send you the notes.

Thanks for listening.

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