The One About Naming (From The Car) - I Love Marketing With Joe Polish And Dean Jackson - Episode #21

I'm dean jackson, he's joe polish, and this is the I love marketing podcast. Hey, everybody, it's Dean Jackson and Joe Polish, and we're driving in the car today.

We are driving in a car.

We've got an hour right now. And we thought, you know what? It's been a while since we did a out of marketing. Just me and Joe in a car. In a car. It's been a long time. This is the first one we've ever.

Done in a car. Yeah. You know, last time I did a Genius Network interview was back in a car. It wasn't even called Genius Network back then. It was called the Joe Fowler Superstar audio tape of the month program. And that was in 1996. Was that with Terry? Yeah, it was Terry. Terry Hennefeld. Yeah. It was ridiculous. It was one of the highest rated interviews at the time that I did because he had come and see me do a full day seminar to professional cleaners.

And.

It was interesting. So we were driving from Detroit to. I don't even know where. Chicago, Grand Rapids. Yeah. Something I don't even know. But it was funny. So we decided to do a I Love marketing Carcast. Yeah, carcast. And here's the deal. We are waiting to get a call from Bab Smith, who runs Strategic Coach, Dan Sullivan's partner, and also David Bach.

It might happen.

So we're waiting to get calls in the car from the.

We're going to have special guests.

Yeah. And you know what the deal is? If that happens, I'll probably hit pause. So this is not going to be some, you know, we're not going to edit this thing. We're just going to talk. And we're on our way to lunch with a guy by the name of Craig Ballant. Real smart dude. He has a program called Turbulence Training and he basically teaches people how to get in shape. He's written for men's magazines and has sold tons of information products and training materials for people wanting to get in better shape. The reason I bring that up is it makes me think about one of the subjects we're going to talk about, which is how you name things is one part of it. But there's a bigger picture that we wanted to talk about on this episode of I Love Marketing in the Car. And that is naming things and how locations and names change. The response that you get from your marketing. The name turbulence training, Turbulence coffee. I don't know, would work as well as maybe turbulence training, because if you think of the term turbulence in an airplane, it's Shaky moves around. But in the area of fitness and changing things up in your workouts, it tends to be kind of a cool name. It sounds pretty hardcore. It sounds pretty awesome. But anyway. So, Dean, let's first ask you, what do you think of the importance of naming your company, your product, your service, packaging, anything along those lines?

I really like naming things so that it's exactly what you get. I like names like stop your divorce, where you know exactly what you're going to get. You know, one of the best names that I've come across lately, and I was going to do a little video. I'll do it when I get back to Florida. In the food court at the mall, there is all these. All the restaurants are there. You've got Taco Bell, you've got Sparro, and you've got China Buffet or China Panda or something like that, and an ice cream place. And then there's one place called Tasty Burger. Tasty Burger. You're thinking like, got to try a tasty burger. You feel like Samuel Jackson in Pulp Fiction tasting it, going, mmm, this is a tasty burger. But when you say things like that, when you name stuff that is going to be that, people know exactly what it is. You know what always reminds me of Dan Kennedy would always tell a story about this guy that came and had a weed killer that was named like Formula 5X or something that doesn't give you any indication of what it is. And you got to imagine the end user. You're going through the. You're at the hardware store or the Home Depot or whatever, and you're looking in the weed section and there's formula 5x and there's all these things Dan recommended that the guy call it kills weeds dead. When you're looking at the thing, it's like, why is somebody buying weed killer? Because they want to kill weeds dead. I mean, what does this one do? Because you look at them and the labels all say, this is for ragweed and dandelions. You got to look at the label and see what it's for. And his was kills weeds dead. It's like a perfect name.

I love it. I love it. It's obvious. Well, the thing is, why do you think people get so fixated? For one, I think most business owners that don't understand marketing will spend more time coming up with a log with a name. And the name, I think, is infinitely more important than a logo could ever be.

Yeah, of course it is. You know, the history of logos came around when, you know, back in the day when people couldn't read and they would have a logo so that people could identify it by what it looked like, you know. And so you start to think about, you know, logos are just so much less important than a name.

Well, yeah, so much time is spent. I mean, I think people will spend more money hiring graphic firms and design and stuff than they will ever hire copywriters. I know people that have always paid to have layouts done and have graphics done that have never spent money on a copywriter.

That's interesting.

And a copywriter is so infinitely more important and more valuable than design. Now the truth is I have a full time designer on staff. We have Piranha Marketing design. We actually have a design company within my organization. But one of the things we're very clear on is that any sort of design, be it a photo, a picture, artwork, animation, anything along those lines in illustration, it really is there to enhance the copy or vice versa. It's not as a standalone. I have never seen anyone that is a small business owner that does have a gigantic company that already does have a quote unquote established brand. Ever be able to sell anything based on just a graphic? I mean, have you?

No, you've got to. And it's such a. There's a great deal of comfort that you maybe get from something that is designed really well. Like you look at design centric companies, like Apple is really a design centric company, but it's secondary to the fact that they've got a very good product. I mean the product is killer and it's wrapped in a killer design. And I think that goes a long way. But you can't just kind of put lipstick on a pig and think that that's the best thing. I've always been kind. My approach to design is I like things to look good. You do feel good when things look good. But I think that comes secondary to the results and secondary to the actual information or the product.

We just drove a semi truck. We're on the freeway heading from Georgetown to Toronto and there's a semi that said very Big Mac. Now if people were not associated with McDonald's, what would that even mean? But you will see so many companies that try to emulate these. Emulate, can't even say the word. These big brand companies thinking that's going to do it for them. But the bottom line, I understand when people say brand building and what they're trying to get at, which is, oh, people are going to know me and they're going to do business with Me and that sort of association. But most of the time, I just want to cringe because I think my favorite definition of brand building came out of or her brand came out of. Ogilvy on Advertising by David Ogilvy, where he talked about, your brand is really the personality of your product or service. And that's just a great way of looking at it. People spend so much time when I hear, oh, yeah, I need to build my brand. I need to build my brand. I spent a great deal of time with Richard Branson. Virgin really is a brand. Richard and his company Virgin, gets paid nowadays. It's kind of like what Dan Kennedy said in our interview with Dan. Not for what they do, but who they are. Because you can now slap Virgin on a lot of different products or services and make an immediate positive association, depending, of course, on the particular area. There are certain things you can't slap just a brand on and make it work. Virgin is one of those unique things where it really can work in many different environments and many different sorts of things. But most companies can't do that. And certainly most small business owners, if they're going to go out and just say, oh, I want to build my brand. Well, what does that actually mean? And what they start doing is they start focusing on logos.

That's what I was just going to say. That's what most people confuse with their brand. They confuse as the visual elements, the logo and the colors and the look and all that stuff.

When I hear my friends that really don't understand marketing, they're like, yeah, I want to build a brand. I want to build my brand. It's like, what are you even selling? I mean, are you selling anything yet? Well, no, no, I. To build a list. I want to build my brand. It's like, well, you know, you can't deposit name recognition in the bank. You just can't. You can't go down to the bank and say, here's my brand, here's my logo. How much will you give me for it? I mean, all you can deposit is checks. And if you even use checks anymore. I don't think Internet marketers understand what checks are.

Those paper things.

Yeah. You know, those people write on them. But, you know, the point is, you cannot off name recognition alone build a business if you don't have something of substance. I mean, you can come up with a very clever slogan. You could have a really nicely designed artwork. But your analogy with Apple is true. There's a lot of really cool electronic components that are created that never sell anything. Because there's a whole method to it. Apple is elegant because they have also spent billions of dollars over the years developing the.

And so anyway, and that's the thing though is that I designed forever 21.

Now here, look, driving by something. And now that's cool. It not only says Forever 21, but on the outside on the freeway, it says Forever21.com which is much different than just the name.

So go check that out and call us and tell us what it is. But it doesn't tell us what it is.

Well, I know what it is. It's a women's clothing.

Oh, is it?

Yeah.

You know about women's clothing?

Of course. And how could you not?

Is that where you get all your sexy negligence?

You watch Martha Stewart every night? Why do you watch Martha Stewart? Let's talk about that. Because this is a brand.

Martha Stewart has certainly built a brand, but what her focus has been is on creating great content. And that's really far more important, I think that the brand is driven from the content more than the look. Now it just happens that part, part of her brand is the aesthetic because she's very focused on that too. But what I started to say when you talked about forever 21 is that I would put expenditures like if I'm spending my money on things and I have a limited amount of money to spend on something, I wouldn't put the design at the top of that list of things to spend money on. I would put the money into creating a great product and selling it.

Before.

I put it into the branding, into.

The.

Design elements of it. I mean, you look at for years, you'd have to agree that as much information products as, as Dan Kennedy has sold, he has also put out probably some of the ugliest products that you've ever seen.

Oh yeah, absolutely.

And still does and doesn't put any emphasis on design at all. But the content is killer, Right?

And of course there's certain types of audiences and there's certain sorts of packaging where you use things and not for instance, like in the DVD and information marketing world, if you have a really pretty full color DVD as an example, in a case, it's going to look like a movie that you can buy at Target or Walmart for 15 bucks or 20 bucks or 30 bucks, 40, 50 at the most maybe. If you're going to sell a DVD with really killer information, like my XXX Halbert recordings, which are recordings of audios I originally recorded on a cassette tape, then have put on cd, they have a cover, but they're not made to look like some Hollywood production because we sell them for hundreds of dollars more than you would sell in audio music. I agree. The point is that you really have to focus more on the substance of what you're selling and less on your image. That's not to say you should look like crap, but if you're.

But here's the thing though. I think if you're not going to look like crap, I think you go the opposite way and go undesigned. That's what I mean by stop your divorce. For instance, the printed copies of Stop youp Divorce are 8.5 x 11 plain white cover with just the information of the book inside, no design work at all on the COVID completely blank white pages. And we've sold millions of dollars of that. And it's not about that, but we sell that book. It's a hundred page book for $99.

And why do you not have any? I mean, I know why, but I'm saying this for our listeners that I love marketing. What is the logic behind that?

Well, part of it. First off, you hit on it before. If you make it look like a book that they can get at the bookstore, it's like, why am I paying $99 for this when I see bigger books than this for $19 at the bookstore? That's part of it. Then the other part of it is the sensitivity of realizing that it's a sensitive subject that nobody wants to be sitting at lunch reading a book with a big cover, stop your divorce, cure your hemorr or something. It's like, that's not the kind of thing that people are going to want everybody to know that they're reading. So just think, sometimes design is about being sensitive to what's appropriate.

Yeah, exactly. And so how would you recommend that people go about naming something?

Well, and let's set, let's expand what we're talking about with naming because we've been talking about naming products and naming companies, but naming anything. Naming your offers is something that is one of the best ways to increase the likelihood that somebody's going to ask for it. I've mentioned before this whole idea of just leaving things to chance where it's like me inviting you into my living room and saying, hey, there's lots of stuff in the fridge, go ahead and help yourself. Or coming out with a plate of freshly baked cookies and saying, hey, would you like a cookie? It's so much easier for people to take it. But if you can name what the next step is, the Thing I'm thinking of immediately for the realtors is having our daily house tours where you name that and you're saying, here's one of the things we do is these daily house tours. And it makes it like a menu of things that somebody can order. It makes it easy for people to have confidence in something too. I think you can name an offering, you can name a process.

Yeah. Some examples that I have, of course, for my professional carpet upholstery cleaners, we name everything from the process where people used to go. And I invented this, called it a carpet.

Carpet on it. Right. We talked about that.

What's funny is that Dr. Daniel Amen, who wrote a whole bunch of books on the brain Change youe Brain, Change youe Life, and a bunch of books, and he's raised millions of dollars for public television. Super sharp guy that's in my 25k group. And he listened to my whole Nightingale Conant program. And he created a brain audit. And now people can go to Daniel Am. I think it's Dr. Amen. Whatever. If you do a search for Daniel Amen, he has many sites, but I'm saying I can't remember which one has the brain audit. But someone can do a whole brain audit and they can answer questions and evaluate how well their brain is, how well their brain is doing. And he will then give people recommendations on how they can improve their thinking, their focus, their health, everything all around it. But the point is, it allows people to understand, you know, what something other than you're gonna get a quote, you're gonna get something of value. So when you make an offer, if you're using education based marketing, which is obviously the stuff we believe in, you not only can use the name to get people to understand what it is you're doing, but you can also provide them value in the process by taking them, taking them through it.

Right.

Okay, so as far as, like, you mentioned something that I have to bring up again, although we've talked about it, is cookies. Now, when we talked about the cookie, you know, I had someone contact me, which, you know, we won't name names, said, you know, can I order the breakfast cookies in Canada?

Yes.

You know, now I just ordered.

I got two dozen of them.

And so they're in Florida. But because of the I Love Marketing podcast, it's like wanting to order breakfast.

Oh. They've had other people call and order.

Too, which is fantastic.

So it's great.

But I mean, breakfast is good.

I know.

I mean, it's like you can slap breakfast on Pretty pretty much.

Well, we were just trying to. We were just talking about the cafe that I go to up here. We were just at Skolachi's and we were telling, we were talking with Tracy, the owner about breakfast pizza, about creating this because they've got the pizza oven and they've got this nice thin crust pizza, but you could have breakfast pizza with eggs and stuff on it. It's funny. But I think that naming something like, I think it goes a long way and it goes, I think anything that people are going to see and you're hoping to make an impression with even starting with your domain name, the name of your dot com is a big thing. I think that a lot of times people make the mistake in their domain names about by making it all about them. You know, like when you have.

That's why like Dean Jackson.com or Joe Polish.com.

Well that's. I think you should have that if you have the ability for people who know you. But that's not the only website that we have, you know, that's not the one that people are gonna, that you're hoping to sell stuff to people. Like if you say the domain name, if you say stopyourdivorce.com, is there anything confusing about what that could be about?

No, not really.

Not at all. Or doubleyourdating, doubleyourdating.com.

Did you have any say in that name?

Yeah, well, we brainstormed a bunch of different ones but that was the winner. And then moneymakingwebsites.com if you can get the benefit in there. But one of the mistakes that people make, especially even in real estate, is they try and put themselves into the equation. They're selling like homes by Dean or Dean Sells Georgetown or Joe Clean's carpets, trying to make themselves the star of the website. And that's a big mistake because nobody's really interested in you. That's not what they're about. So the more you can focus on the cheese, on what the exciting thing that your prospects really want, what would be a dream come true for them? What would they look at a domain name, you got to imagine if you see it in a lineup, if you see five or six domain names that they can choose from, what would make yours jump out at them, what would make yours. And you can have lots of different domain names. I'm sure you probably teach your carpet cleaners this, that they can have an allergy related name or a name that goes into that health type thing or an emergency carpet cleaning type of name. Things that are going to speak exactly to, to the audience who's listening.

We publish a healthy home newsletter. We have healthy home audience. There's all kinds of stuff related to packaging there. Now, how does that relate, Dean, to the old, but still very wise, unique selling proposition? Just even taking someone through usp, I hear people saying, oh, usp, that's old hat. That's old stuff.

Well, there's so many confusing definitions of it. And that's the thing I always focus on. What's the thing that is going to be outwardly focused, that they're going to say, that's exactly what I need. That's really what the answer is. Are people going to look at that and say, that's exactly what I need? One of the best examples of it is Excedrin Migraine. I think I showed you this in the drugstore. I'm going to talk more about it at our conference. Excedrin Migraine. I had a friend who's coming down to Florida from Toronto and you can't get Excedrin migraine in Canada. We were looking for it in the store. The pharmacist, I know the pharmacist there, we were asking him about it and he would say, well, you know what? Extra Strength is exactly the same. Same thing. Sure enough, I looked at the packages and you should do this sometimes. Look, get the Excedrin migraine package and get the Excedrin Extra Strength package, and it is exactly the same thing. There's absolutely nothing different about Excedrin migraine than Excedrin Extra Strength except the name. When somebody has a migraine, they're looking and looking and thinking, what do I need? Well, that one's specifically for migraines, of course. That's what I need.

Dr. Well, I'll tell you this. I noticed this a couple years ago in Target where they had Huggies diapers and they had Huggies with white babies on it and Huggies with black babies on it.

Did they really?

Yes. It's like going, how funny where you, you just literally now they are making these race associations so that the white couple's going to go in and who.

Knows, oh, that's our baby.

The media is like, well, I have to see that.

I have to look for it.

But see, people should really look at things when you're driving around, when you're in stores and see the unique packaging and stuff like that for like USPs, with my cleaners as an example. Unique selling proposition. One of the things one of my guys years ago came up with the most Thorough cleaning ever, or it's free. So instead of the name of the company, the big thing that they would put in the ads that many cleaners put. I even trademarked it at this point, it's the most thorough cleaning ever. Or it's free. If you don't get. I mean, that says something that's meaningful. And so with the associations of stuff that exists. Even Dan kennedy, when he used to sell. Magnetic marketing is one of his primary products. He still has that and he always updates it over the years. But magnetic marketing, when he first started selling that, I mean, gosh, almost 20 years ago, probably it's one of the.

Best programs ever, though.

Yeah, absolutely. He would actually, when he would speak at herbalife, as an example years ago, he would speak it like herbalife, the multi level technique. And he would put a green and white cover over magnetic marketing. Or if he would speak it to mary kay and put a pink cover on magnetic marketing. It would bump his response 10 or 20%. Simply because they thought, oh, it was associated just with this.

That's funny.

Yeah. And I remember him doing that. Everything that you do could have a link. Like, for instance, I'm staying at your house, dean. Which is. No one really wants to know about any of that. But your wife. Sony. So you have two homes. You have one in the toronto area and one in florida. And I've stayed at your homes at different times. So you have a basement in your home in georgetown. And so I was taking a shower, because you have a big bathroom down there. And in the shower there is shampoo. And usually if I stay at hotels, I don't carry my own shampoo. There's a. A bed head product that was like. What was it called? I think it was like sexy curls or something. It was in a purple bottle. And I'm sitting there thinking, you know, honestly, like, is that really what you.

Were you afraid to put it on?

No, but if you just think about that, like when they're making shampoos. Is there that much difference between now? Maybe there is. Maybe there's some formula of the soap and the.

Maybe that's it. We'll see. He's got sexy curls.

I'm thinking, this is totally hysterical. That they would just name something that. But nobody thinks about that. And that's why. Oh, that's for me. I have curly hair. I'm going to get curly hair out.

I wonder. You're absolutely right. What could the formula be? It's like excedrin migraine.

It's funny. Yeah. Lather rinse repeat. The power of.

Do you want to know one of the funniest naming things? Just the reframing is Eben Pagan and I, Eben was down in Winter Haven and we were talking about Walmart and found out that Walmart apparently sells 25% of all of the jewelry sold in the United States is sold at Walmart. So we had to go see what that was all about. So we walk into Walmart and we went over to the jewelry section and see how that goes. And there was a sign, there's a collection of rings here and there was a little sign that labeled it the right hand ring collection. And there is a little description there that the left hand is for expressions of love and you know the ride right hand is for self expression. So you could just, I mean the evil psychology of these women going in there with low self esteem thinking oh I wish my husband would buy me something like that. And then they see this sign that says the right hand ring collection is for your self expression. And all these rings are specifically for your right hand hand. It's like unbelievable the evilness of that. The right hand ring collection. Like what makes a ring for your right hand or your left hand? I mean, good grief, it's funny. But it makes it okay for a woman to buy herself a ring. Yeah, because I'm wearing it on my right hand. That's my self expression.

So if you want to unload more rings then you come up with clever ways to do it.

That's exactly right. And that is clever.

Well, let's talk about something. I think we should just reveal ourselves publicly here.

Dean.

We watched Never say Never last night.

We did Justin Bieber second time for me. I watched it again with you.

Now let me say this, everyone listening to I love marketing. You need to order the DVD or you need to go online and you need to download it and watch Never say Never. The reason being is I never really had seen Justin Bieber on YouTube. I sort of know the story, but I didn't really know the story until after watching that movie A couple weeks ago I was in LA and Guy Kawasaki was speaking and he had talked about how that is one of the best movies ever. If you want to understand marketing. The cool thing about it now, it's not going to teach you how to write copy or do direct response or any of the stuff that we talk about on I love marketing. However, it will give you a perspective of social media and what can be done with talent packaged and put out into the world and hard work. Yeah, and more than anything, hard work. I mean, the kids doing 86 tours straight, that kid works his butt off. He's.

But, you know, before he ever got that, the fascinating thing, I mean, if you look at the arc of the arc, and it truly is testament to the fact that the cream does rise to the top, that he started just singing. He's always been singing, always been musical. Started putting up his videos on YouTube. And Scooter Braun, the guy in Atlanta, discovered his videos and introduced them to Jermaine Dupre and Usher and all that. But here's the thing, is that even though he was in that kind of.

Company.

There was still. He had to go out and make it happen. I mean, they showed this whole segment of the movie where he's out. He went to basically every radio station and played his music live right there for them, because they weren't playing them on the radio. And he went out and went on tour and built that base of radio stations that played it. But the fact is that he had a product that sold itself, and that's, I think, part of it.

And he cares about his audience now. We talked about it. It's curious to see what's going to happen to him.

Ten years, that's what we were talking about.

Which way is his ego going to grow so huge at some point that when someone becomes that big and is not tarnished yet, there's many people waiting for the crash, waiting for him to do some drugs or get caught. Caught with the wrong woman or whatever, because he's this young guy. But it's such a great success story right now, 2011, and last year, in the last 12 months, I think 51% of all music purchased was Justin Bieber.

That seems crazy.

Yeah. And if you think about that, I mean, bigger than Lady Gaga. I mean, big right now. And so, yeah, but it's interesting, man, and we'll span a couple years out and see what happens. But in the interim, talk about hard work, talk about engaging with your clients, engaging with the media. When you see him go to these different radio stations and all the DJs know him, and he broke a mold, and if you want to have a breakthrough, you got to break something. And he very much followed that, and he used Twitter and still does YouTube. I mean, it's just a great success. So I think you'll learn a lot about positioning by going and seeing Never say Never. And, well, it's not in theaters anymore, so now it's more like just order it, but do that. And as we drive through If I see anything that really strikes me as kind of interesting with billboards.

Well, look, we're coming in. This is an area right now. We're just coming into Toronto downtown on the Gardner Express way. And it's like Cannabis Red. Yeah. This is so much. There's so many billboards right around this area.

Smart Water.

Okay.

And is that Jennifer Aniston? Yeah. Okay, so Smart Water has an endorsement with Jennifer Aniston. And that's better than Dumb Water or just water.

What makes that water smart? What makes that water so smart?

I don't know. And then there's the all new, all powerful super superphone. It's not even just a smartphone now. It's a superphone. Like a supermodel. What's the difference between a regular model, Dean and a supermodel?

That's true. It's a name.

So I'm just going to see if we can point out any billboards that look kind of interesting. There was one that I remember. I was down here several years ago. I don't know if they still have this billboard anymore. I don't even know the company. But it was some sort of alcohol, some liquor. And it said we use the most expensive ingredients and pass the cost on to you. And I love that. I love that. I think that is fantastic because it really speaks of high end. Now, for instance, you're going to stay at the Hazelton Hotel tonight. I'm going to stay at Dan Sullivan's home with Dan and Bass.

Have you decided that now?

Yeah, probably. Because, I mean, why not, right? Why not either hang out around you in a hotel or I'd go hang out with someone smarter than you. I'm kidding. It's supposed to be a joke.

I understand.

You need to say something because people would think I'm being mean here. Okay, so now that right now is right across the street from Four Seasons. And you know, during. During 9 11, I think Four Seasons was the only hotel that did not drop their price. I think during.

Is that right?

Yeah, I believe so. I could be wrong, but I believe that was the case. And they still maintained a pretty good occupancy rate. And now I think we're maybe getting a call. Nope. All right. So Dean, let me ask you for everything we've talked about here. What are some of the takeaways that people listening need to go back and think about their name? Not only the name of their company, but the name of their products?

Well, I think they should do a naming audit and look at every element of what they do that either has a name currently that's under optimist or could have a name. One of the things that people often do is they try and name. They try and have something broad enough as an umbrella to fit everything that they do rather than have a specific name for each service or each offering that they have. I think that if they can look at, at segmenting things and look at what would be the best. What would be the best name that they could have for any segment. And it usually starts with the segments of their market, the segments of the market that they serve. If you look at, if you did the carpet cleaning, we talked about this idea of some people want to get their carpets clean because of the allergy related stuff. Allergy proofing their home. Some people only get their carpets clean when they've got to get out a tough stain.

Hold on, there's a Jack Daniels billboard that has Jack meets Ginger. They elope and it's simply giving them a way to come combine Jack Daniels with ginger ale. There you go. Okay, so that was the billboard. So talk about this association there. Not that anyone should be doing that. No, just bringing it up.

And that's the thing. Part of the. I think billboards are one of the toughest things to actually have an impact with unless you have a really powerful name. And that goes a long way.

Well, you know, what's great is you can't. It's not. It's typically never a direct response on boards because how do you know? And the way they sell it is this many impressions, right?

This many people drive by here, but everybody's in a coma when they're driving by here.

But there's plenty of big corporations that have these ad budgets where they piss away money down a big black hole and they have an ad agency that's throwing in this and throwing in that. It's kind of amusing actually.

Getting back to this naming audit, I think starting with the domain name and starting with even the name of their company or their dba. You know the guys who did Big Ass fans.

Oh yeah.

And so if you ever drive down, if you ever driven by their thing on Highway 75 in Kentucky, you'd drive by and from the highway you could see their big thing. It says Big Ass fans. But you know, before they named it Big Ass Fans, it was a pretty generic name. You know, it was like what they do is they make fans for big factories, their high velocity, low speed hvls, you know, HVLS Technologies or some kind of name that was just completely meaningless. But Every time they would install one of these fans, as soon as people came in to see it, the first words out of their mouth would always be that's a big ass fan. So they just went ahead and named the company Big Ass Fans. So you think about how much of an impact that is they're getting mixed from HVLS Technologies or High Volume Fan Solutions or whatever, all the technical terms for it, and here's a chance for them to name it something that people actually what they say when they do it.

That's awesome. I think one of the things that is also been useful to me is listen to what your clients say, what they say. Why do they buy from you? What are the questions they're asking you? What are their biggest concerns? What are their biggest objections? Those sorts of things allow you to piece together what you're going to call something, how you're going to communicate it to people. It's the same way that I put together my consumer guide for carpet cleaning. What I ended up doing was what are all of the things that people didn't know that they didn't know about carpet cleaning? And that's how I ended up coming up with seven questions ask a carpet cleaner before you invite them into your home. And if you're a graphic designer, seven questions to ask a graphic designer before you hire them. 6. Costly misconceptions about carpet cleaning in your particular business it might be 4 or 5. How to avoid 4 carpet cleaning RIP offs in your particular industry, Whatever, if they're there are rip offs, anything that has to do with misconceptions, questions, misrepresentations, concerns that people have, how to make an informed buying decision, the difference between X and X, value and price. All those sorts of things allow you to communicate more effectively and get people to buy from you. And you don't typically need to come up with them. You decide simply need to listen. You need to look at what people are saying, what they're talking about, what they're asking you questions about. If you need some feedback, just not only ask people that buy from you, who your best customers and clients are, why did they buy from you? What is about you that caused them to not only do business with you the first time, but why do they continue to do business with you? And then also, also, and this is a more difficult conversation, people that have never bought from you that you've made an offer to, but they didn't respond, especially if they went to someone else. If you could ask them, say look, I'm not even trying to Sell you anything? I just out of curiosity to improve my own business, why did you not buy from me? What was it that was not convincing or that did not convey value? And you vary. You may very well find some of the most effective fodder, the most effective ingredients needed to improve any of your marketing by people that simply have not responded to you. That's how you win them over in.

A lot of ways.

It's just finding the bait that you're going to put on the hook that's going to get the fish to bite. If the fish are not biting on your current bait, is it something wrong with the name? Is there something wrong with the product? Is there something wrong with the service? Is there something wrong with the delivery? That sort of stuff. I mean, that's how you improve anything. If you simply improve the communication, especially if what you have people want and they need and it benefits people, why are people not getting it from you? What is it that you are not saying or doing that is not getting them to buy from you? Now, we've only got a couple of minutes left and we could go a little bit longer, but that would require us to actually pull over and we're almost at our location. So you mentioned the thing about cheese and we did talk about that on a previous I love marketing podcast. And I think if you have not listened to the very beginning of I love marketing, it's great stuff and I would recommend you listen to all of our podcasts to the best of your abilities. But the cheese. Cheese analogy, what is that again? Could you talk about that? Because I think it really helps create a context about presenting yourself.

Yeah, absolutely. You know, part of really crafting the right words and the right offers and the right sequence of events is thinking about how your prospects are interact with your business. But not only your business, but the category of whatever it is that they're doing. I found out that why scientists use mice in experimenting with things is because they are very similar genetically to humans. They're brains are much, much smaller, but they behave 95% the same as humans in terms of the critical functions. With a small brain like that, you really think about that. The mouse brain is imprinted with two prime directives, and those are get cheese and avoid. Avoid cats. That's the two things that are utmost in their minds.

That's like a RoboCop crime director. Remember that movie RoboCop?

Yeah, exactly. So when you know that, when you know and your prospects are exactly the same way. A lot of people have used that analogy of that they're mostly frightened. They're afraid of making the wrong choice. But they're also driven by their decision, desire to get cheese. And I think cheese is a great term, a blanket term to mean something good. The good thing that they really want more money or the benefit or the result that it is that you offer. They all want the result and they want to avoid getting ripped off or losing or being made to look foolish or all that resistance. People are always on a real subconscious.

Level.

Weighing the odds of them getting the result that they want versus what are the likelihood that I'm going to. What's the worst thing that could happen. And if you can remove all of those things and make something all about the cheese that they really want without it being about you, it's almost like it sets it into motion, it sets it into autopilot that when they take advantage of something, an offer that you've made them, then you are thinking not just immediately about making the sale, but about two or three moves down the road that that's going to lead to the sale. One of the best examples of this is the evolution of this listing getting system that I have for real estate agents. Where I started out with postcards that would say sell your house in 90 days guaranteed. Which worked out well, you would get people who were interested in selling their house quickly. But then I started able to get more response by offering a postcard that said find out how much your River Oaks home is worth for free over the phone. So that was a bump in the response. But the biggest bump was when I took completely out of the equation the thought that you're going to be selling your house or listing it with me. And moved into just off offering the free June 2011 report on River Oaks house prices, which is something that we're not implying at all that you're going to list your house with me or that I'm going to sell your house. But by virtue of you raising your hand and asking for that, there's a really good chance that the reason that you want that is because you're thinking of selling your house. It's the same thing when you look at any situation is what is the outermost ring of the decision process that people are going to go through to buy whatever it is that you sell? What's the information? What's the thing that they need to know ahead of time before they purchase?

Yep, going through that decision tree is so valuable.

Yeah.

So I love it. That's good stuff. And as usual, as usual, you're just A man that strides the world like a colossal. Okay, so what we're going to do this year at our conference which is going to be September 21st and 22nd in beautiful Phoenix, Arizona during that time of the year, it's going to be awesome. If you are not registered for the I Love Marketing Conference, get your butt registered for it. You can get on our list@ilovemarketing.com and get details sent to you. Nothing high pressure. It's just going to be an awesome event. We're going to give you. Those of you that attend will get a big awesome million dollar marketing manual filled with ad templates and strategies and copy and some examples of the best, not only sales promotions and campaigns for online and offline marketing, but also things related to everything we talked about today. Naming and packaging and unique selling propositions and powerful offers and guarantees and all that sort of stuff. So we are at our location. Dean. So any famous last words from you before we wrap up our first ever driving around I love marketing call. I mean, I hope this was not completely distracting for everyone listening. I mean, I'm curious to see what the comments are. Did you guys like this? Guys and gals? There's a giant rock out here in Toronto. What is that? What's that called? So people kind of know where we're at.

That's a big. We're in Yorkville right now. We're on Cumberland.

And what is the deal with that gigantic rock?

Yeah, it's just. That's a big rock that was right there in the middle of the.

You don't know the story about it?

I don't know the story.

Someone told me the story about it before but I forgot because it's a rock.

Here's what we're eating for that sassafras right there.

Wonderful. So that's what we're going to go eat tonight. All right. You needed to know that everyone at I Love Marketing.

So the naming audit. Look at the things, look at your domain name, look at the name of your company. Look at the name of the service you provide. Look at how you could name the service you provide. Name the different services you provide if you don't already have a name for them. And really think about outwardly focused. Think about the benefit and name it something that somebody's going to go, that's exactly what I need. Give us some examples in the comments. Give us a some examples of what you've come up with. I'd love to see some of those. Right.

And if you go see Justin Bieber never say, never make a comment about what you learned from the movie and how it applies to progress and success in life. And I think if you really watch from that standpoint, if you're a guy, your friends will make fun of you because you watched a Justin Bieber movie, especially if you're over the age of 20. Okeydok. And so that's it. So on behalf of myself and Dean Jackson, this is wrapping up. I love marketing. Car cast, BMW cast. What do you call this, Dean?

Yeah, the X5 cast. There we go.

All right. There you go. So have a great day, everyone, and we will talk with you next time.