The One Where Dean And Joe Catch Up And Discuss Advertising - I Love Marketing With Joe Polish And Dean Jackson - Episode #120

I'm dean jackson, he's joe polish, and this is the I love marketing podcast. Hey, everybody, it's Dean Jackson and Joe Polish. And look at us. That's right.

Together.

Just you and me.

Yeah, it's very powerful. You don't see this every day. Yeah, yeah, exactly. All right, so what we decided to.

Do, I was just saying we got a lot of catching up to do. We haven't. We've barely even talked outside of doing the podcast. But I was in the airport the other day. I picked up my copy of Inc Magazine and Success magazine and Forbes magazine and Fortune magazine. And there's my little buddy all over the page. All up in the pages of every magazine in the country.

That is true. We're also in US Airways too.

It's pretty exciting.

People are writing about me. I mean, it's, you know, you're sweeping the nation. Really.

Yes, yes.

Well, see, that's what advertising can do for you. It can actually put you out there. It's really interesting too. You know, what's the funny thing is everyone keeps asking me what ads bring it in the most and it's like, well, that's hard to say because this is a. Selling is a process, not an event. This ain't like going to the carnival and throwing a ball in a bucket. And either you get it in there or you don't. I mean, there's a long term strategy here. It's kind of like planting a seed. Which one's producing the most? Well, it has everything to do with what I'm doing with the harvest after the gestation.

Nurturing.

So there's real. What's that?

Yeah, nurturing them. I mean, if we look at the profit activators, each one of those is a little bit different target market. I think that the readers of Forbes are a different person than the reader of Entrepreneur. And, you know, so you select that target market, you figure out what's compelling to them, and then you've got all these people now in profit activator 3, where you're educating and motivating them. But you've started the job, the ad has done its job if it gets you in conversation with them.

Right, exactly. And so, yeah, so, I mean, how well they're doing has a lot to do with my future interactions with them. Also knowing that probably every magazine is not going to be, you know, equal. Well, not. Not maybe absolutely 100%. And I mean, I know what magazines are producing the most and which ones are not in terms of lead generation and in terms of if you were to think of it as fishing. Which ones are catching those fish?

Where are those fish? Yeah, yeah, right.

So I know that now that stuff I'm not going to make totally public. I'll talk about that at 25k and we'll share pretty much anything, any numbers, anything with 25k members. I don't make that stuff public though, because certainly you don't even want the magazines to know because then they try to negotiate with you and exaggerate the importance of their media. And some of the magazines, it's another thing too, some of the magazines are very pleasant to work with and others have sort of an arrogance about them and not the ones that you would think, which is interesting. And so there's a whole thing that you learn about phishing and about marketing by spending money on advertising and in seeing the claims that certain media make about. Because until a direct response ad is written, everything that someone says about how great they are, you have no idea. And so it really puts it to the test, especially when you're running the exact same offer in the exact same ad in the exact same.

Yeah, because. Well, that's really the only way to know, isn't it? Because if you're running different ads in every different publication, then you don't know was it the ad or was it the publication. But if you're running the same thing in every one, it's crystal clear. Right, right, right.

You know what's really funny is when I first started running the full page ads, I got an email from Brian Tracy, basically along the lines of you have pretty big cojones for all the advertising that you're doing, which is really coming from a lot of people. Because the reality is the reason you don't see people running full page ads is for seminars is because they can't make it work. You'd see a hell of a lot more people running ads to promote seminars if they knew how to make it work. You take a guy like Brendan Burchard, who's a 25K member, who's going to be in New York, who's a good friend of ours, who I spend a lot of time strategizing, running the ads because he spends money.

I was just with him two nights ago.

Did you have a, did you get into like a fist fight or did you play a game of twist or anything?

Jello wrestling? No, we had Garrett Gunderson and he and I were up at his, up at his villa.

Oh, that's cute.

It was cute.

That's very sweet. Did you Play Twister.

Yeah, we did.

Okay. That.

Garrett's pretty flexible.

Yeah, he is. He is. You know, he wrote the book Killing Sacred Cows. Yeah. You know, I mean, you know, whatever, but. So. Well, first off, let's talk about that. What was the point of going up to his villa other than just hanging out? Did you guys spend more time working and pretending that you were at the villa in order to have, like, some vacation with your marketing buddies, or were you like.

That's right. No, no, we were literally. We were just having fun. It was all serendipitous, but it was. He's got a cool villa.

What's it.

Yeah, yeah, it's beautiful.

But the reason I brought that up.

Just because you said. You mentioned Brendan and he's in the same magazines. He's got the same. He's got ads that are running in every one of those magazines, too. And he's been doing it for over a year now. Right.

Well, he's not in all. We're not all in the exact same ones, but we're in most. And see, the thing is, is Brendan still sells se, but he's not selling a seminar directly out of the ad. What he's doing is he's offering his book.

Yeah, exactly. That's where a lot of people get caught up. And this is a really good opportunity to talk about something that it's not necessarily. You don't have to sell the end result from the ad if you know where you're going with that. Right. Like, if you know Brendan's offer is for a free copy of his book, the charge, pay, shipping and handling, and off you go. Now, they don't know that ultimately they're going to be offered his $2,000 experts academy program or his high Performance Academy or any of the other world's greatest speaker trainings that he does. They don't know that by looking at the ad, and it doesn't matter. And a lot of times, one of the mistakes that I see people make is that they feel like they have to advertise what the end result is. You know, they're trying to do the convincing in the ad when all you really want to do is turn an invisible prospect, somebody, the reader of one of those magazines, you want to turn them into a visible prospect, somebody who you're in dialogue with. So often it doesn't matter what the actual offer is, as long as it's in the right family and you're kind of moving them towards something, you know, it can be the first step.

Right, exactly. And see that, so to go back through the profit activators, let's kind of go through it. So the first one is narrowing your focus and selecting single target market.

The readers of Entrepreneur magazine that might be, that would be a target audience, right.

Or Forbes or Fortune or US Airways, etc.

Right. And you would have to imagine the way I'd go through this thinking process is to think, well, what would be, what's the main premise of the magazine? Like, what would differentiate the reader of Entrepreneur magazine versus the reader of Forbes magazine or the reader of Fortune versus the reader of Ink? You know what, what are the characteristics that just by looking at the information would give you a sense of a difference between them? Because there probably is a difference and I imagine without knowing the numbers, and I can't wait to have a conversation with you later about all the exact numbers, but I imagine that one magazine, because you're running the same ad in each of them, that one magazine is outperforming the others. And.

Yes, yeah, so some of them, without.

Telling us which out, without revealing which of the magazines is pulling the best. What's the difference? The gap between the highest performing magazine and the lowest performing magazine? Maybe in terms of percentage, if you can figure that out or do you even. Do you know that?

Well, very, very similar percentages in terms of lead generation, like clicks, like the amount of people that go to the site versus how many people opt in. So there's a different commitment level from the visiting the website and how many decide to go further out of one particular magazine versus the other one. Very, very similar percentage points. But the biggest disparity is almost twice as much. Like one magazine will produce twice as many opt ins after they visit the website than another magazine. What's really interesting too, what's that on.

The same traffic, basically like you get the same number of visitors from each of them, but one of them.

Let'S say 100 go to the website. Okay. From one magazine and another hundred go to the other one. One may have 30 opt ins, the other one may have 15.

I got you right?

See what I'm saying? So it'd be like twice as much. So that's a big difference. Another thing, which is an interesting one, is banner ads. So some of the magazines were actually also running banners. Like for instance, Tim Ferriss, who's speaking at my New York event, was on the COVID of Inc Magazine a few issues ago. And so we started running a Tim Ferriss banner ad utilizing the fact that he's on the COVID of the magazine where it would drive people to a 25kgroup.com website that actually had a video from Tim talking about how he's going to talk about angel investing and that sort of stuff at my New York event. And so there's a short video of Tim. And so we ran that driving people there and it's surprising the response. I mean, I won't totally reveal it, but it's not what you would expect, right? Yeah. And so there's all kinds of interesting things. But see, the cool thing is I'm keeping track of this is working. This doesn't. A lot of this is literally gambling with six figures. I mean, it really is, but it's gambling intelligently. It's gambling strategically, but it is gambling because I know some of it just ain't gonna work. It's gonna cost me more money to figure out the formula than it's gonna even bring in in some cases. So, you know, I met with a guy that flew into town on a private plane a week ago to meet with me. And he is a venture capital guy. And that is a world that I'm learning more and more about simply because of people that are in my 25k group that run these sum a couple billion dollar funds. It's interesting. And I don't know anything about that world. I mean, I mean, I'm learning more. But the funny thing about the deals that succeed, I mean, they'll throw numbers around depending on who you talk to, that, yeah, one in ten will hit it out of the park. Two or three might do okay. The rest of them are just total failures. And that's if you're selecting companies very intelligently and very strategically. Now, of course you're going to hear different numbers. So what I just said is by no means, advice or anything. This is something I've heard from different people. But the point is, these are some of the best investors on the planet that are going into these deals knowing that in order to have the one that hits it out of the park, the vast majority are just going to fail. That's with intelligence going into it. That's with due diligence. That's with selectivity, that's with strategy. And you know, it's almost the same thing here. So people that are continually frustrated that their marketing and their advertising isn't working. I mean, even the best marketers on the planet are frustrated when their marketing and their advertising isn't hitting it. And these are people that really study it. They really try to do a lot, including us. I mean, we think this stuff through pretty thoroughly and we're doing a huge service to people just simply talking about it. I mean, just getting people to really think it through is, you know, half the battle to be like, you know, before you step on, you know, before you step up to the plate, you know, what's, you know, who's throwing the ball, you know, what, what's the weather environment, what sort of bat are you using, what sort of shoes are you wearing, what sort of, you know, what are you trying to do, right, what's going to give you the highest, you know, highest possibility of success. But you know, in order to hit the balls, you're going to have some strikeouts. It's just part of the game.

Yeah, I agree. So you're seeing that it's interesting because you're getting information that is 100% accurate from your own experience. And that's the valuable thing. Right? A man with an experience is never at the mercy of a man with an idea.

Yeah, exactly. No, exactly. The thing going back to giving the listeners useful stuff, which I would hope everything we're talking about is useful to give them things to think about is my objectives is not just selling my New York event. There's a couple things that I'll talk about. Why I'm running these ads, because everyone's asking me, why are you running these ads? No one can make money selling, you know, events. Well, for one, I have a very exclusive, very high priced event and at the time that we're doing this podcast recording, we've literally got nine spots left for, you know, the New York event.

That's awesome.

Unless I want to stuff people in there like sardines. And so it's going to be, it's going to be a sold out event, which is incredible. And secondly, I want, this is a long term strategy for as long as if I can figure out how to make advertising work that other people cannot figure out how to make advertising work, I'm going to do it. Because it just simply means that many people can't play in that playground because they don't know how to make it work. Right. You know, just like Walmart has a strategy for selling at the lowest prices they can sell for, it's very hard for people to compete with them because they're able to play in an arena because of their purchasing power, because of their distribution, because of a lot of factors that the average person can't. So it gives them a competitive advantage. Well, you also have a competitive advantage if you can actually spend more money advertising or you can actually advertise and fish in areas where it's too stormy, too risky, too whatever for the average person because they can't sustain it. That actually is an unfair advantage that gives you a competitive advantage. And so, you know, part of this is my willingness to lose money in order to figure out where I will make money. And you know, along the way, for every, you know, people see the ads and believe me, I mean I'm getting, the interesting thing about this is how many phone calls I'm getting from very high level people that are really fricking smart marketers and advertisers trying to figure out how in the hell I'm doing this. Because they're like, well, I thought you were going to be in one issue of Forbes, but now you're in three. I mean, what the hell, you've got two full page ads in the current issue of Forbes like how are you doing this? What are you actually doing? And it sort of cracks me up and what I tell people is like, well why don't you quit asking me questions, go pick up the magazines, get on my list and watch what I'm doing.

Right?

And you know, you know, I mean, you know, you're getting a fricking, you know, you're getting an education by just going to the magazines and watch, you know, and don't just get on the list, look at what I'm, you know.

No charge, no charge to watch.

Yeah, and watch the shit that I'm sending people. I mean this is not, it's not manipulative, it's not a sale. I mean I'm literally delivering people like again, let's go back through the profit activators. I'm delivering people tremendous value in the process. Like use profit. Activator number two is use direct response offers to compel people to call you, to visit you. And then the third activator is patiently and systematically educate and motivate people to meet you when they're ready to meet you. And then the fourth activators present your unique service offer in a way that makes it easy to get started. So you know, we're following up with videos from me, videos from my 25k groups, you know, things like that. And then, you know, then, so that's all getting into the before and then the during units. And then, you know, deliver dream come true experience design from your client's perspective. You know, so by the time someone's at one of my events or coming in New York, I mean they're going to, they're going to get an amazing experience. You know, it's $10,000. But see, the biggest distinction I have to make is this ain't a seminar. This ain't just a mastermind. This just ain't a coaching club. This is a network of geniuses that have never been gathered before. I mean, this is higher level than almost any event with this subject matter. Like almost. There is no higher level. There is no higher level gathering of the world's greatest marketers than at this event. There just isn't one. It has never existed at this level. And so part of the distinction is not just telling people what it is, because that's hard enough. It's telling people what it isn't without telling them what it isn't. Because I don't want to go out and insult other things. I mean, that's not, in my opinion, a very smart strategy because I appreciate and respect all kinds of events and attend them and pay for them and go to them and all that sort of stuff. It's just, you know, this ain't that, you know, and so that's the whole distinction. And that can't be done in an ad. That is a follow up, ongoing process. I mean, there's only so much you can do. And the thing that, you know, the people that really do the best off of what we teach is realize that, you know, Joe and Dean aren't telling you how to do one step selling.

Right?

None of this is around one step. This isn't about the magic ad, Even the magic nine word email.

That's just to start the dialogue, starting point, right?

Yeah. And so, you know, so that's the whole thing. I mean, this is people see the tip of the iceberg and they'll see an ad. But, but the real selling, the real rapport building, the real delivery, the real follow up is figured out. This is mining for gold. And part of the ad is just to start the first whack with the pick in order to go into the mine and start mining for gold. And that's what I'm doing. And that has a lot to do with how effective my follow up is, my messaging. And you know, I'm noticing along the way a lot of, you know, every single day I determine, oh, I could have said this, Oh, I shouldn't have said this. Oh, I should have done this. And you know, I use the word should because it's a guilt inducing word and I want to make myself feel bad about some of the dumb stuff that I'm doing so that I can.

You know, but you know what the important thing is too, that you know, you're not putting the pressure on this ad to pay this month's mortgage or to, you know, that you're not looking for, like to turn this into money as fast as you can. Because you're going to be doing 25k for the next 20 years and you're going to be doing these annual events. And it may not be this year that they come, but after a year of being in your sphere, you know, they may, they may choose to come to next year's event or they may join 25k at some point. You know, it's just taking that portfolio value over a period of time. I mean, if you were to just condense and take all of the leads that you generate, all the relationships that you start as a result of running all of those ads, and then project that out or follow this, and you will, because you've tagged everybody, of course. But you look at, if we're having this conversation 12 or 18 months from now, the value of those is they're just going to continue to grow. Yeah.

You know what I'm going to do, Dean? I'm going to place my headset down and I'm going to grab a. Because I have no issues the magazine sitting in of front front of me. But I wanted to point out a couple of things here. So while I'm doing that, if you could share the remaining profit activators, just to put all this in perspective, because a lot of these come after the fact. But I'll be back in like 30 seconds.

Okay, perfect.

It's kind of like talking to yourself. Exactly.

But what I want to say is that, you know, what Joe's doing here, you know, we look at it, starting that relationship, just getting somebody to raise their hand, somebody who was an invisible reader of Forbes magazine is now because they've seen an ad in Forbes, they've come to the website, they've opted in. Now they're in a relationship. So he's got a way to continue that dialogue. Now, something about the ad caught their interest enough to go and come to the website. And then when they were at the website, something got them interested enough to leave their name and their email address voluntarily. Nobody's coercing them into anything. They voluntarily did both of those things. They went from a print ad to their computer right to the website, and they voluntarily typed in their name and their email address so they're interested on some level. And now everything that happens is all about profit. Activator three And Profit Activator four, where you're educating and motivating people by telling them all of the things that 25k is all about, all the people that it's about, the success stories that other people have had, the things that the people who are going to be speaking at 25k are going to be sharing and then making offers that are going to get them to say, yeah, I do want to come. You know, not just leaving it up to, hey, if there's anything we can help you with, please feel free to call.

Yep, exactly. And I've been here listening. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. And you know the thing too, to go back to why I'm running the ads now, certainly, you know, the initial thing was for the New York event. That's one of the objectives. Another objective is to in the follow up system, getting people to listen to our podcast. I love marketing and 10x talk that I do with Dan Sullivan. And so we're putting people on the list and we're letting them know that we have this stuff. So it's like, wow, once you've generated a lead, it's not just this guy that's offering this exclusive high level event called Genius Network Annual gathering. They actually have a whole slew of helpful, useful training, much of it free. So it's building podcast listeners, it's promoting New York, it's promoting Genius Network and it's also introducing people to our 25k members. Because one of my main objectives is to we've got some brilliant people in 25k, as you know, and all of these brilliant people have skills and capabilities and the more that I can drive people to our own existing clients in the group because after all, you know, people, you know, look at me as a marketing guy and certainly I have that. I'm really a networking guy. I'm a networking guy though, at a very high level because I don't just, you know, network with a bunch of people. I literally network with industry Transformers.

And I would you say you're a connector together?

I would, yeah, yeah, I would, I would maybe. I would say that. And so that's sort of what I do. So part of that process is introducing all of these people to each other and they meet each other through Genius Network. That's another thing. So highlighting our existing members, giving them exposure. But you can only do so much with exposure, right? So a lot of the exposure you take all the people that I'm promoting and I'm offering things with. So we're offering different reports in different ads. One of the ads like in the current issue of US Airways they can visit genius25kgroup.com and then there's a forward slash so we know which magazine they're coming out of and they can register to get free Seven Steps to More Growth and Success which features Dan Sullivan, Brendon Bouchard, Tim Ferriss, Peter Diamandis and me. And so we follow up with things there and then, you know, on the Forbes, in the current issue of Forbes, I've got, you know, special bonus. They can not only receive that but they can get, you know, Steve Forbes hour long interview, abundant affluence led by one of this year's 25k guest speakers, Peter Diamandis. And it's basically when Steve Forbes and you know, Peter spoke at my 25k event at the last annual meeting, they did an interview on stage. And so we're offering to send that out. And that would make more sense to offer, you know, something with Steve Forbes in Forbes than it would to offer that in ink. Not that it wouldn't work, but it's just, you know, there's more of an affinity. And in the current issue of Forbes. Well, let me. I'm looking at the June issue right now and so I can't even keep track of all the different ads I'm running here. But we're running an advertorial ad one with a headline that says 4 Common Mistakes that Millionaires Make. Eight out of the ten millionaires are making these simple mistakes and why you don't have to be one of them. So we're running that and then we're also running one where I'm doing something called Profiles in Prosperity. And what I'm doing is featuring different 25k members. In this particular one, there's a big picture of Dan Sullivan and what's really cool is people that are in strategic coach are going to Dan and saying, oh, I saw you in Forbes. Which of course Dan thinks that's cool. Dan is a huge promoter of my group. Not an affiliate level. We're not exchanging money. He loves 25k, he endorses 25k, as do all of the people. I don't have affiliate things set up where people are getting paid cash for recommending and endorsing my event because I never wanted to bring affiliate stuff into this particular arena. And that's what's going on with that. So here's one of the things that is a goal and objective. A lot of the leads that I'm generating from these magazines, they just aren't at the level to where 25k is right for them. They don't make enough money. They can't join a 25k group. They don't qualify in order to do it. But a lot of the people are at an income level where they would actually qualify for, like, the lowest level of strategic coach, which is $100,000 a year net income minimum. And they can go to a strategic coach group. So a lot of these leads, if what I'm offering cannot help them, we still direct them to things that can help them, including the free podcast. So the cool thing is a lot of the leads are just going to opt out because they're just going to opt out. But the coolest thing that we're getting from some of the leads, which you can't always translate this into money. Right now, although I, you know, because I'm running ads, clearly, Dean, I mean, I just want to make this distinction. I'm running ads to make more money than what it's costing me to run ads. I mean, that's my main objective. Even if it takes me two years to get the money back, I'm willing to do that time of harvesting. So I don't want to misconstrue that with what I'm about to say. So that's my main objective. The secondary thing, which is like a goodwill thing, is how many people that have like, going, wow, I never even knew a company like yours existed. This is unbelievable. I saw your ad. We've opted in here, and you sent such valuable, useful information on how to build and grow my business. You guys are great. I mean, I'm kind of putting together, like a mixture of different things that we're hearing, but we're getting a lot of messages like that that are sent to my office saying, hey, we can't do this right now, but it's my goal to your group. A year from now, we're getting that sort of stuff. And I love that because it's aspirational. I mean, people are really seeing all the people and they're aspiring to do it. And I think it's kind of cool to have your company set up to where even if people can't do business with you right now because they simply, it's not a right fit, they can't afford you, they can't make the time, whatever, that, you know, they're aspiring to do it because they've had a good relationship, because I've done a good job of patiently and systematically educating and motivating the prospects to Meet with us, me, my group. But some of them can't even afford it because it's not the right fit. But they're like, man, I really want.

To be in this group.

So it's like, well, in the meantime we got all this stuff. People will constantly try to reach out to me. And one of the things is like this. Use what we teach on I love marketing. Listen to what I say on 10X Talk. Build your business and when you're making enough money, the group is going to be here, that sort of thing, assuming it's not completely sold out. And then I put a cap on it, which is probably going to be very happening relatively soon too, which is kind of a cool thing. But anyway, that's some of the things that are happening beneath the surface with all of the magazine ads. So. But anyway, there's more we can talk about on this. I just wanted to belt all that stuff out.

Yeah, I mean, I think with people, anybody who's listening would probably read one or more of those magazines that you're in right now. They've probably seen them. But it would be a great experience, just like we said, to go and go through the process, see what, see what they do.

Yeah, exactly, exactly. And you know, and if someone, you know, just wants to kind of see what I think we're two marketers that actually are very clear with our clients, with, you know, our listeners on I love marketing to. If you want to know how to best do this, don't just listen to what we're saying, look at what we're doing, how we're doing it, do it yourself. I mean, when I used to sell stuff straight out of magazines, driving people to free recorded messages when there was no Internet, like back in the early, starting in 1994, 1995, when I used to run full page ads in trade magazines in the carpet cleaning industry and people would call a 24 hour free recorded message and they request a report. And then the report would sell my full marketing program for professional cleaners. And then I ended up licensing my program to multiple different industries. And so all kinds of different industries were buying a marketing program based on and modeled after mine. One of the things that I would always tell people that would buy, they're like, well, you know, I just don't know if this marketing stuff would work. I mean, I've talked about this before, but I used to do in 1997, I spent a good portion of time, 1997, 1998 doing, going around the country in the cleaning industry, doing full Day seminars called how to Double youe Business in Six Months or Less. So I want to share a couple things that were kind of funny about that. For one, what I learned is that a client that bought my marketing program off of a full day seminar was a much different client than someone that bought it just off of a sales letter because they had the advantage of spending an entire day with just me training them on all of this marketing stuff. So they simply became better clients because they were more educated clients. They were closer to me, they learned directly from me. So they tended to have more success than people that just bought it through the mail simply due to the commitment that they would put into it. So I learned the value of coaching somebody or, and I wouldn't even say me coaching people. I learned the value of people that were willing to get their ass on an airplane and fly somewhere in order to get training. They just got more out of it than people that didn't. And what I also learned at these events was there were people that would come there and I'd ask, what are you guys here for? What are you hoping to get out of it? I already knew most of the answers that they would have, but I always liked hearing the perspective. Plus, it started audience engagement. People would be like, oh, here to make more money, get better clients, learn how to not work so much. There were people that were there for moving towards and moving away from goals, as Dan Sullivan would say. So there's all that sort of stuff. But there would always be a couple of people that would be, oh, I'm just here to see if this marketing stuff works. And I'd say, oh, really? So you don't believe this will work? Nah, you know, I think this is a bunch of hype. I think it's a bunch of crap. I mean, you know, my clients are different, you know, but, you know, you say it works. I want to see if this stuff will actually work. And then I would say, well, you're sitting in a room right now that you paid money to be in from reading an ad or a letter that probably drove you to a free recorded message, had a powerful offer. You read a very long sales letter, very long, anywhere from minimum 8 pages to 24 pages about why you should come to a full day event, and you're sitting here right now as a result of the marketing, as you ask, I'm wondering if this will work. Now, of course, that would immediately. It did not dawn on them that they responded to the exact thing that they doubted. So here's the kicker. As it relates to everything we've talked about with running my full page ads and telling people to go look at these ads and check this stuff out. I would say the exact same things that I use to get carpet cleaning clients to hire my carpet cleaning services are the exact same things that I'm using to get you to come to this seminar. Then I'm getting you to invest in my marketing program. It's education based marketing. I brought you into the funnel. It's multi sequence, it's multi step. I first had to offer you something you wanted. You wanted to learn how to double your business in six months or less. I sent you a long letter about what you need to do to double your business in six months or less. In that letter, certainly it was a pitch I was selling you on a seminar. But I also told you in the letter things you need to do enough so that you had enough trust with a guy you never even spoke with on the phone. And you actually called up and you registered to come to this event. But you know, I made it very non threatening for you. I offer 100% money back guarantee and I would say to everyone, you're going to sit through the whole day. If any of you are not ecstatic with what you get out of the day, I'll happily give any of you your money back at the end of the day. And hardly anyone ever asked for their money back. And when I say hardly anyone, I did multi hundred people boot camps in the cleaning industry for 15 years straight. Some years I would do two in a year. I had two people ever ask for their money back. And they were, one of them never even showed up the second day. Because there are people that actually go to events where they're having affairs on their, you know, spouse and they use the going to event to, you know, make it seem like they're actually doing something. They don't even show up. Shouldn't have said that though. That'll make everyone.

That's like kind of everybody's been looking around who's having an affair.

Oh my God, they can't be going to an event. One of these, you know, sees marketing, but they usually don't go to marketing seminars.

They go to those, yeah. Trade shows and expos? That kind of thing.

So that was some interesting stuff that would happen. But here's the point. Once people got the fact that, oh wow, yeah, I actually responded to these free recorded messages because that's how Joe sold me into the thing, then all of a sudden it was much easier for them to do it themselves. Because the marketing stuff we teach works. There's no question about that. Anyone that would deny this either is unfamiliar with what it is that we're doing and hasn't spent enough time learning about it, listening to it. That or they're just idiots. I mean, they're so skeptical that you couldn't give them, you couldn't help them, no matter what. I mean, they're incapable of being helped. And so once they realized that, oh, I actually responded to that, it would remove a lot of the, It would actually eliminate the skepticism and the fear and the resistance they had because they themselves see that. So the point is this level of redundancy in telling people this, I learned to be very important because I would have to remind people there's so many forces in the world that are bad information that are fed to people about selling and marketing and about how you connect with people. And don't use a lot of, you know, don't use long copy, don't put a lot of words in your ads, all of that sort of stuff that I would have to constantly counteract that by, you know, evidence of proof that you responded to this, this actually works. And then when they started doing it, they would see that, you know, free recorded messages, consumer awareness guides, long form sales letters, powerful copy, you know, unconditional guarantees, packaged presentation offers, audits, all those things actually worked. And it would remove resistance. So that's something. Nothing. I just, this is kind of an aside, but I was, you know, talking with John Benson about this when we were brainstorming, he was here yesterday and basically we were talking about doubling your business. And one thing I used to do in the full day seminars is the name of the seminar would be how to double your business in six months or less. And I could easily teach any carpet cleaning company still do how to double their business in six months or less. And they would all come to this event and, and I would be, okay, well, I'm going to give you a guaranteed way that you can double your business in six months or less without learning anything about marketing. And what I'm going to teach you today. How many of you would like to know what that is? And they'd all raise their hand. I'm like, okay, what you do is you double the amount of time that you're currently working. You do just as much that you're doing now. But I mean, you take all the things you do now, you double it. Okay, you double. And you just work twice as hard, you put twice as much effort into it, you do twice as many. Now the thing is that actually will work. The problem is, can it really work? Can you do that without sleeping? So of course you cannot double your business if you work twice as hard. But that's not what everyone wants to do. So you have to multiply yourself by subtraction. You need multipliers, and that's what the marketing is. The two ways to build and grow a business to truly leverage yourself are either do it by hiring other people so they can take some of your workload without you physically doing it, or you improve. Better advertising and advertising is the way to double your business without spending more time. The advertising is as. Who's the original person that said advertising and salesmanship multiplied?

I think that was.

Who was it? Johnny Kennedy?

Yeah, right. Told Albert Lasker that.

Right, okay, okay. Yeah. And those are the old school awesome marketing books. And you know, that's what it is, it's salesmanship multiplied. So when you look at my ads in the magazines, I'm just trying to take any salesmanship and I'm paying the advertising, I'm paying the magazines to carry a message to people for me. So for instance, there's a full page ad I'm looking at here with a picture of Dan Sullivan and I literally use Dan Sullivan's exact words and it says $25k group will be a huge unfair advantage for you, just as it has been for me. I can say that within my first two hours at 25K, I received my initial $250,000 idea. Since then, it has saved me at least 500 hours per year. Plus I've received millions of dollars in direct results from the strategies in my 25k group. There are three main reasons you should join. One, exposure to the brightest entrepreneurial marketers from around the world, especially those using the latest technology. Two, direct connection to the best information and expertise related to entrepreneurial time savers, shortcuts and multipliers. And three, interaction with cutting edge thinkers in hiring, training, problem solving, packaging, meeting, media innovation, health, medicine, and every area of technological evolution. Dan Sullivan, founder of Strategic Coach, the world's top focusing program for successful, ambitious entrepreneurs. And then it goes on to make an offer. And so the point is that's using someone who's well known, has enormous credibility, has a brilliant reputation, who loves my group, and using him to speak to people through the ad in this particular issue, Forbes, although I have this ad running with Dan in a couple different magazines and you know, that leverages me because you know, what would, how would I reach these people without doing that sort of stuff. So when people brag about how they don't spend any money on advertising, that still doesn't make any sense to me. It's like, okay, well, that's great. I mean, I know companies that, you know, I mean, you take by referral only, which you designed, you know, for years. I mean, you know, you still teach many realtors how to build businesses by referrals. I mean, they quote, unquote, don't have to advertise. But in a lot of ways, this is sort of like advertising, referral marketing. Because I'm using the endorsement of Dan Sullivan and you know, how many 25k members do I need to get long term to justify doing some of that stuff? Well, that still doesn't guarantee it's going to work. But the point is, this is a blueprint here. Go and look at it. Look at how it applies to you. How do you do the same sort of thing in your business? That's how you grow your company. If you can get an ad, down a sales letter, down a landing page, down a sales page, figure it out. Be willing to go through the rigamaror, be willing to go out and fish. I mean, that's like any skill. It is developed through experience, it is developed by doing it. And the way to shorten the pain, the mistakes, the failure is to look at other people that are doing it, putting the money out there and look at what they're doing. It's kind of the things that me and you have done for years. We would tell people to read their junk mail, look at what, not just read it for entertainment. This ain't like reading a comic book. Like, look at your junk mail. Because people are paying a fortune to send you advertising campaigns and the things that you see showing up over and over again, you should probably pay attention to it. If Geico Insurance is sending you a letter every two weeks for five years straight and you still have not signed up for Geico, you can say, well, yeah, they're obviously wasting a ton of money. But you know what? They also know the lifetime value of a client. They know that they can probably mail to someone for 10 years straight and eventually they may pop someone and then make money off of them. You know, do the vast majority of those letters work? Absolutely. Not if they only mail them once, but if they go over and over again. And that, that's not to be confused with, you know, if something doesn't work the first time, it's magically going to work the second. Or third time. I mean, if you're, you cannot multiply zeros. I mean, you just can't. So if something falls flat economically, you got to change the ad, you got to change the offer, you got to.

Change where you're fishing.

I mean, if, no, so much of.

That, so much of the insurance advertising like Geico especially, you're dealing with something that everybody has to have and it's renewable every six months. So when you look at that, you've got a one in six chance that this is the month that people are about to renew their insurance. So you know, being there right at the right time, because it's the kind of thing where most people are not in the middle of a insurance policy that they're already, they've already set up and paid for. It's not going to be on the top of anybody's to do list three months into their six months and you know their insurance isn't due for three more months, they're not going to call and investigate getting better insurance. But if it's already on their list that their insurance is due or they get a new car or they for whatever reason need to get new insurance and there's GEICO with that same message. You know, 15 minute phone call could save you whatever amount of money that's like, it's, it's, it makes all the sense. You know, the number, the numbers are so big.

Yep, exactly. Yeah. So, you know, the best way to become a great marketer, a great at anything is for one, learn from the experiences of other people. That's the best way to shorten, you know, the pain, the learning curve, the mistakes. But at the end of the day, you got to go out and do it. I mean, you got to go out and do it. And so hopefully this will motivate people to get their advertising down and get it working and see if you can. What's a Star Trek thing? Boldly go where no man has gone before. Part of it is, I would say boldly go where many people have gone before that are really mining for gold. Because there is the whole thing about pioneers end up with arrows in their back. So you should not take pride in the fact that you're the only one doing it. I mean, there is a risk that I'm taking running campaigns, doing something that most people statistically never have success with long term. So if we find out that this long term, that it's not a viable strategy, then I won't be running more ads in the future. But as of right now, I Think I, I think there's a couple magazines that I'm going to probably be in long term until they tire and I cannot. And when I say tire, meaning your ads will get tired, meaning you will not get response.

You see, run the same ad to the same audience again and again.

Right. Right. Now, that doesn't mean you can't switch it up because a lot of people cannot figure out how. Here I am going on, having started selling to professional carpet and upholstery cleaners, marketing knowledge and training and templates and stuff since 1994. People are still trying to figure out how can you still sustain it in that niche? Because there's a lot of people that are like, oh, you can't stay in the niche. But I mean, look at you. You've been selling stuff in real estate for as long as I've been selling stuff to carpet cleaners. Because we, you know, we change as the marketplace changes, Right?

Exactly.

There's always new things that they need to learn. And when they got a, you know, when they got a marketing person figuring out the best ways to, you know, communicate and reach their intended clientele, I mean, you know, you should probably continue to learn that stuff. So. Yeah. All right, so look, in the time we got remaining, why don't we get caught up on you? You've been traveling everywhere, you've been doing all kinds of crazy stuff. Let's take the last few minutes of this episode and talk about some of the insights and anything that's been going on with you. Sure.

I mean we had. So I've been doing these, my breakthrough blueprint events all over. Just got back from London, did one out there, going to Australia in August. And one of the things that I've really been focused on is this idea of these books as lead generators in profit activator 2. And we have been. It started with Dan Sullivan. We were talking about this idea of create space on Amazon of using these, the ability to create version one of a book and realized that in thinking about it, the real thing, the most important thing about using a book for lead generator, the two things that you have to have are you have to have a book and you have to have a title of that book that upon reading it, somebody is going to say, yes, I want that. I immediately want that. And they're going to go and take action to get that book. Now we've found that it doesn't have to be more than a 50 page book in a lot of cases. We've turned a lot of these podcast episodes I want to do a whole episode about this in the future. Here we'll talk about some of the books that we've been doing. But we did that book with your the Magic Rapport Formula, which is a easy book to create by just getting the audio transcribed. We did that episode where I interviewed you about your whole Magic Rapport Formula. And now you've got a book called the Magic Rapport Formula. And it's very easy to do. I've figured out now how to get the whole process down to about 90 minutes. If you take 30 minutes to really outline and think through the title of the book, that's really the thing that drives it. We had some cool ones come out of London. And let me read some of the things because I'm really a big fan of this. Dan Sullivan's got a new book out called the 80% solution. Is that what it's called? The 80%, I think.

Well, hold on, let me grab an actual. I'll have to move away from the recording mic. Yeah, it's the 80% approach.

The 80% approach. That's it.

I did a whole episode with him@10xtalk.com on that.

Perfect. Let's put that up.

Okay. Yeah.

So just listen to these. When you look at it, here's some of the things that we had a guy who was a hypnotist, so we came up with a book called Hypnotize youe Husband, how to Make Him Love youe Only youy and Never even look at anybody Else. And so you think about hearing these titles, you know, the influential Introvert, how to gently and confidently get your voice heard at work, at home, and with your friends. And then another guy came up with the fire Free Work Day. How to get more done, have more fun, and take control of your time today. Then we had someone come up with lose three sizes in three Months. How to turn back time, Melt the parts you hate and love what you see in the mirror. Then we had the skinny jeans solution. How to melt your muffin top, lose your saddlebag, slide into your skinny jeans and look hot from behind. And you start to think, like when you just even say these titles, you say these words. For some people, that's all they need to hear. I'll give you a real world example of using this. It doesn't matter that the book is short. Doesn't matter at all. It's a book. These books look like real paperback things. But you also get a chance to pinpoint your audience in a completely compelling, all cheese kind of way. Especially if you've got something that requires an education for somebody to make a decision if it's not something that you're really easily going to be able to sell just from an ad. So we used one of the best ones we've been using right now is a book called the Adult Acne Cure. And by advertising on Bing and Facebook and plenty of fish can identify people, women who have adult acne and are interested in curing it. Because that's just here in that book, the Adult Acne Cure. Now that opt in page is getting just about 50% opt in. And so now the opportunity is to educate and motivate them to try this device that combines ultrasonic waves and red and blue LED lights to penetrate the surface of the skin, to reactivate their elastin and collagen and basically grow new skin for them that you couldn't do in just an ad, but you can do it in a way of educating people about this one device that does all the things that this book told them, the science behind what you have to do to cure acne. And it's so it's amazing to see how just using simple things, even though most people, if you have a product, you want to make the product the star of the ad, but if you're not worried about that, if you're worried about making the ad a gateway, making the ad. I often imagine that people walking down a hallway trying to choose which door they're going to go in. And the ad is like the sign on the door that tells them what's on the other side here. And if you say the Adult Acne Cure, that's, oh, I want that. So they open up the door to come on in. Now you've got them in profit activator number three. And you can educate and motivate and have a dialogue with them and coach them along the way and lead them to the next step and ultimately make an offer that's going to be able to help them, you know. Now meanwhile, the offer is to go through a 90 day program where you can try the device for 90 days, try the skin care routine, and it's either going to cure your acne or it's not. And if it doesn't, then you won't be billed. If it is, then you pay $895 and that's a winning offer.

Yeah, I like it.

I do too. So this whole thing, like, you know, if you can think about what would be the title of a book that the person who is your ideal target audience Clients would be compelled to want to read. And use that as your lead generator. Start the conversation by focusing on something that they really want. You know. Yeah, I was like that conversation I was having with you because I do want to do a book with you about executable ideas, you know, because this. I really think that 25K is about, you know, the two ways that people are going to get their return on investment for being part of 25k is either through getting elegant ideas from other people in the group or being connected to people who can provide a service or do something or introduce them to somebody or, you know, guide them through something that they've already done. And I think that those two things, ideas and connections, are really, if you look at all of the success stories from 25k, at the. @ the core of them would be one of those two.

Things. Yeah, totally, totally. I go, well, yes. So that for sure, we should talk about that even deeper on a future episode. We're out of time right now. But I completely agree. One thing I do want to mention, too, because at the time that we. That we're recording this, a few days ago, there was one of the worst fire disasters in Arizona history. Now, 19 firefighters lost their lives, which is just horrible. The whole community has been completely devastated. It's not too far from where I live, less than a couple hours away. And what I'm going to do is after I do a trip to New York that I have coming up, a short trip to New York and Chicago, I'm going to go down to Yarnell and just kind of see how the. You know, with all the. Because I think they're getting a lot of financial support, which I hope. But I want to. I want to kind of check it out and kind of see how things are, because we're obviously pretty good at marketing. And if we decide to do a future fundraiser, either things that we could offer. And I'm not talking about using a disaster as a way to sell stuff. I'm talking about raising money for people directly to. That's something we may bring up. And if it seems like something we could make an impact with, if we need to, we will. And if not, if anyone just wants to, if you haven't already seen it on the news, a lot of places to support these people, they're poor families. I mean, it's just unbelievably devastating what happened down there. And, you know, in situations like that, that's also another side of marketing and communication, too. You know, whenever there's people that need things. If you know how to get a message out, if you know how to persuade, that skill is critically important. And that's the other side of the marketing of what you can do in a very powerful and impactful and good way with marketing that I don't think people ever really hear that marketers are usually not viewed as good doers in the world, when in reality, the people that make the most impact are the ones that know how to get messages and move messages and stuff. So that may be brought up if I feel it's in the future. But I just wanted to kind of plant a seed for that right now. I haven't even brought it up with you yet.

Dean. Yeah, no, no, but that totally makes.

Sense. I want to go down there first, though, not just have every interpretation through the news, but I literally am going to go down to the community and a lot of the buildings have been lost and everything, and then see if we should do a big fundraiser, an event or something that would just if need be. But anyway, so that's the deal. So I'd love to have everyone's comments on what you got out of this episode and go pick up the magazines and check out what we're doing. See how you can apply it to your business. And if you ever want to go to Dean's Breakthrough Blueprints. How do people find out about your Breakthrough Blueprints other than just being on our.

List? Being on our list? Or send me an email, deanejackson.com I'll get them all the.

Details. Okay, cool. All right, well, until next time. That is it for this one. And everyone, have a wonderful.

Day.