The One With Jon Benson (Video Sales Letters) - I Love Marketing With Joe Polish And Dean Jackson - Episode #44

I'm dean jackson, he's joe polish, and this is the I love marketing podcast. Hey, everybody, it's Dean Jackson and Joe.

Polish and a very special guest by the name. What's your name, sir?

What is my name? John Benson.

The world famous.

Yeah, the one, the only John Benson. All right, well, on this particular episode we talked about, you know, we're going to interview this guy named John Benson. And unlike, you know, world famous marketing gurus like me and Dean Jackson, this guy is, you know, really, I think he's going to become one of the most impactful marketers, maybe, maybe perhaps of, of this decade.

Certainly the most buff.

Yeah, he's the author of everyday diet, 7 minute body.

Every Other Day. Every other day.

No, no, no.

You're so disrespectful.

Just relax, relax. Fit after 40.

Fit over 40.

Fit over 40. Okay, let's get all the titles, let's.

Get them all wrong.

Every Other Day Diet and Seven Minute Body, which you also did. Seven Minute Muscles, Seven Minute Bite. So you're saying that you're better than.

Tim Ferriss by 3 minutes and what, 53 seconds? 3. 3 hours and 53 minutes.

All right, well, this is the comic, this is the comical part of, the starting part of this. We're not even. Let's just keep going. We could, like, in typical fashion, we could redo this, reedit it, get it. All right, but this. Yeah, this is real.

Keep it real.

So John is actually the. You know, I don't know if you're the inventor, but to me, you would certainly be the first one I ever learned from the Ugly video sales letter, which we'll refer to it as a video sales letter, which can be used in all kinds of different applications. But you've created, in your fitness and exercise world, you've helped literally tens of thousands of people transform their bodies through exercise and eating. And you've helped a lot of people in the fitness world that actually sell training materials, ebooks, you name it. And now including me, by the way.

Yeah. Dean's a success story, man.

As of this point in time, Dean has lost 42 pounds. How much more are you going for?

142. No. I don't know.

You want to look like me is.

What you're trying to say.

That's my aspiration.

Yeah.

So basically, John, explain who you are, what you do.

Ah, who I am, what I do. Well, I am John Benson and I was in. My sole focus for years was the fitness and nutrition market. And through that, you know, did like everybody Else was doing. I was doing along. My first book was fit over 40 and Tom Venuto actually wrote most of the copy for that. That first page. He's in the fitness world too. Very good marketer. And that back in 2004 when it was launched, set a clickbank or at that time set a record for fitness launches. It shut down racks of servers. This was before, you know, cloud and we hit 1007 on Alexa.

That's great.

Which, you know, we, you know, by today's standards of these launches, it was. It's relatively small potatoes. Right. We were like totally psyched and thrilled when it hit 100 grand. But. So, yeah, but back then, that was pretty cool deal. And from that point on, I quit my job. I was a graphic designer and just totally quit. Gave all my clients. Just didn't. Just gave them all away. I didn't carry it. So I decided I want to do this full time and wrote my second book, Every other Day diet. And that was going well, but I was noticing that everybody was stuck at this 1% conversion rate. Like 1%.

Was I thrilled with it?

And thrilled with it.

Yeah.

And people still are, by the way. Yeah, people are still very happy with. I was telling my programmer this the other day. I said, you know, this is still. This page we were looking at, still converting at 1%. We need to change it. And he said, 1% is really good. Yeah, not anymore. Not anymore. And a lot of that is because of this. This thing that I kind of stumbled into, which was the. What Joe's. The distinction is the ugly video sales letter. So I love. I love marketing as. Not to coin a phrase because it's already coined or as I told Dean on the way over here, said I loved marketing, but the Never called me back. But anyway, I. I love marketing and I have a real passion.

I don't see that funny. I don't know what you guys. I'm kidding. It's amusing.

So. So yeah. So I really love marketing and the science behind it, the psychology behind it. I was a psychology minor. So I decided to kind of decide to get good at it or as good as I could get at it. And looking at a lot of copywriters because I wrote copy for ad copy. So I figured, you know, for designing for. When I was on the design firm and we did advertising. And so I figured, yeah, I could probably do this. And through just trial and error it led to there was. I'll tell the story if you want to hear it, how it happened. I started getting into every Viral aspect of marketing. I could, and it landed me on YouTube and I started doing YouTube videos with just me talking to the camera. And then I started getting real fancy with it and it ended up being like nine hours to produce a five minute YouTube video. It was completely not worth it.

Crane shots.

Crap. Yeah. No, it was me getting stupid with screenflow. Really. I got really good at screenflow though. But dismal for conversions. Really, really awful. And so what I decided to do one day because I hadn't shave. I look like really crappy, crappier than normal. And I said, I'm not gonna put my face on camera today. And besides, I did a survey of my list and my list was responding what they thought of the videos and it was all comments about me. And a lot of them were like positive. And some of them were not positive. But I don't want people.

Well, it's distracting probably, right? Because especially most of the people buying your books are not. They don't look like you maybe think maybe could be intimidated by that or.

A lot of the very. The. The number one phrase was too big.

Yeah.

And I want to get.

I don't get that.

Yeah.

I don't think of myself as a big guy. So. So. And now remember Tom Venuto warning me about this when we did fit over 40, all the people, the people we picked as our role models, 52 people from 40 to 80, you know, and a lot of them were, you know, body bodybuilders or, or fitness athletes. And he's going, dude, this is way. I'm telling you, it's way over the top. You just need to get somebody that's. Man, that's not over the top. Over the top is Mr. Olympia, you know, So I have a totally different standard of that. I've learned my lessons.

Can I say something about that too? Because you're going to talk about copy and stuff here. And a lot of the use of video sales letters are words just with a voice in the background. Some photos, sometimes some video thrown in. But one term that I heard years ago when I was learning marketing is that everyone's heard a picture's worth a thousand words, but I heard a twist on it, which is a picture's worth a thousand words, but a mental picture is worth 10,000 words. And I think even what you're describing right now that your perception and what you think is over the top or not, it doesn't even matter because the reality is people have their own perceptions of everything and what you're about to describe really is not about a video that just happens to be a delivery system. It's about psychology. And I think of marketing as applied psychology. And I think even your understanding marketing originally is what has allowed you to really, you know, enter the conversation that exists in that prospect's mind, as Robert Collier said in, you know, the Robert Collier letter book from years ago. But yeah, I wanted to point that out because I think that's a very important distinction that everyone needs to understand to get the most out of what you're about to talk to us about.

Yes, and it is. And it's using video sales letters and webinars, which I think kind of bred out of that whole genre of video sales letters was, was, and remains the very best way to take advantage of multiple psychological elements that are simply just phenomenal to work with. And I'll go over some of them here. But anyway, just back to how it all started. So I decided to shoot a video with just me and words on a screen. Now this was the first ugly video sales letter. So yes, I am the inventor of that. I don't know about. There were people, probably PowerPoint looking stuff, but no one was doing just words on the screen. So the words on the screen just crushed everything else. So. But anyway, I thought this would never work in a million years, but basically all I was thinking is, I'll give them a transcript. And then I remembered back in one of my psych classes, they said there was a study done on retention and 67% greater retention when you're looking, listening at the same time. So I thought, well, maybe just get people to pay attention more, you know, maybe they said it's kind of cool highlight. And then because I studied nlp, I started thinking, well, what if I, you know, highlighted certain words that I wanted really to leave out, you know, and make those words kind of cool. And so I did this for a 6 minute YouTube video and it took me like a fraction of the time it took to do this to do the other videos and uploaded it. And the conversions were like 7,000%. I was ridiculously off the chart higher to go to this. I just drove into a tech space sales page. It was much, much higher. And so I thought it was a fluke. And I thought, you know, there's got to be something.

I want to just clarify though, did you change your. Was this different than the sales letter that you were using or was it essentially the sales letter turned into a.

Yeah, I'll get to that. Yeah. Because what I did the first time wasn't A sales letter at all. It was me talking about a topic, right? And so I said, if you want to know more about how you can eat your favorite foods and still lose, we wait. Go over here to Every Other Day diet. Com. And I was doing this in every other video and I was getting dismal response and all of a sudden I got like literally 30 times the response to go over to the sales page. So naturally I had more sales. So I decided to take and focus on one book and I took Every Other Day diet. I've got seven. So I took Every Other Day Diet and said I'm going to create a sales page completely around this formula. And at the time it ended up at 18 minutes. And I thought that was just insane. Who is going to watch an 18 minute video? It's going through my mind the whole time. I thought, well, you know, it's not gonna hurt to try. I mean you can just split test anything, right? And then I remembered I said the same thing the very first time Tom Venuto sent over his copy for fit over 40. Who the hell is going to read 6,000 words? Well, a lot of people read those things. They don't read all of them. But this long page sales, long form sales copy works, right? No. No one's in disagreement, right? Right. So, well, this is the same. I hear this to this very day. Who on earth is going to watch an 18 minute. And now they're like 30 and 40 minute, just words on the screen and nothing else. No pictures, no graphics. And we'll throw in, I'll get into this more strategic stuff later, but we'll throw in pattern break pictures and very, it's very specific way that do help conversions. But what happened was amazing. Within literally a month of doing that, or is this about three weeks, my conversions went from about 1% to 6 and a half percent. They just, it just threw through the roof. I could not believe it. So I had a couple of marketer friends of mine that were in the fitness business. They sent their traffic there and they were going, Jesus, that this thing really converts. And that's all it took. Once everybody said this thing is really converting, I built a good backend for it. And next thing you know, within weeks I had the two biggest paperclip affiliates spending about a million bucks a month more on Google. They were spending just a ton. And this was before the Google slap. So it just took off like crazy. I ended up, I would have ended up with a number one book on ClickBank, but we got slapped. It was Climbing so fast. But it took two books with it. So I ended up with two books in the top 10 of two different genres, which was kind of cool. So it was obviously a success. So then my friend Mike Geary, who had the number one book, Truth About Abs, and Mike's a hell of a good marketer, he called me up because, dude, I'll pay you 20 grand to do this for me, but will you voice it? I go, well, if I voice, it's gonna be kind of weird, wouldn't it, if I voiced it? He goes, no, I just think you just have the way you voiced it. And I later discovered in what I teach now, it's not the sound of your voice. I mean, I have a decent radio voice because I did radio in college, but it's not that you don't want to go into the radio voice. This is not what you want at all. It's the cadence. It' the tempo. It's the emphasis on certain words. Like we were talking about. Like when I was coaching Joe through this, I said certain words. You want to really elongate and slow down. It's just knowing which words to do that and practice and some of its intuition. But anyway, so I did it for Mike Geary and wrote my own story with Mike. And the truth is, I had his book, and his book was really helpful for me. And so I just wrote my story, and it ended up doubling his convert. He was already number one on Clickbank. Already had extremely high conversion rate on Cold Traffic. He was buying mostly cold traffic doubled his conversion.

We talked about that on the last episode. We talked about that. Leveraging things and sometimes how just an idea that you apply can have really incredible leverage. Like the idea of replacing a long copy sales letter with a video sales letter.

Yeah. Because your original result was, like, you.

Six times.

You went from 1% conversion to 6%.

Six times. And we talked about the last episode as a primer to the fact that we were going to have you as a guest on this episode. So, you know, having said that.

So, yeah, that's a little bit of the history of it. And since then, it's been nuts. I mean, I've had. Since then, it's been obviously knocked off by, you know, literally thousands of marketers. Ryan Dice did a course on it. I went down to teach Ryan, and then Ryan did a course on it. And. And he does mention that in his course, by the way, but no, no one picks that up. It's like, hey, so. So a lot of people think Ryan created if You. If you were to get in a.

Physical fight with Ryan with, like, one of your hands tied behind your back, you think you could.

No, I can still take him.

Yeah. We're gonna see if Ryan listens to this episode.

Yeah, he's gonna get really, really.

I couldn't take Nathan, but I could take a ride. Nathan's a beast. But, yeah. So anyway, so it became a little bit of. It became a genre in and of itself. And then I know other guys that, like I said, we're doing PowerPoint style stuff, and some people get better results with that. Most people don't. Most people get better results with the uglier version. And we tested it. Ryan went through tons of tests with this, and just the ugly stuff wins. And I asked my good friend Jeff Siegel, who's got a video freaking killing it right now, the diet solution video. And his is more PowerPoint, more like a. And I don't know Keith Walman. I've never met him, but people were saying when this came out, they go, oh, yeah, there's this Keith Walman guy that does kind of PowerPoint stuff. Cool. So. And this is more Keith stuff, I think, but in some of mine and some of Keith's. And it worked out great. But I asked him, have you ever tried just text? He said, to be honest with you, that's the one thing we've never split test. I go, dude, I think you're leaving money on the table. I'm not sure. But he's. Because he's already doing well. But anyway, so the point is that the reason why video sales letters work is because it does a couple of things. Number one, it forces your reader to read every word of your copy.

Right? Forced consumption. It's effortless consumption.

Right.

It's buckle in. You're not skimming, you're not scanning.

So if you've ever done heat mapping on a website, you can see that people will read the headline. And assuming they keep reading, they'll read a sub headline. They might read the first paragraph, they'll jump to the first picture, they'll scroll down and read the price.

But that's important because they're reading it the way that you're intending them to hear it. And I say hear it because when you're reading, essentially you're hearing it in your mind as you're reading. And so they're adding their inflection or their emphasis on words that maybe won't be in the same place that you are intending it to be in some way.

I'm taking Away their imagination.

Right.

Taking over their imagination.

In sales. I think that's a very good thing.

Yeah, that, that is a good point though, what you just said. Taking over their imagination. Yeah, people are, people are wanting their imaginations taken over.

Yeah. And. Yeah, and so that, that reminds me, one of my favorite south park episodes where the terrorists take over our imaginations. I won't go into imagination land here on Island.

How much do you think you've learned about marketing from watching like things like South Park?

A ton. Honestly.

It's absolutely true. We talk about it all the time.

Let's talk about it right now. Yeah, no, I mean, let's give the listeners like, so, like when. Well, I find there's a lot of.

Similarities between south park and. I love marketing.

Think about it. Because it's captivating. Right. People watch South Park. Right. They use words. Right. Now it will offend the hell of a lot of people, however. But what, what, you know, I mean, what is it that you got like. Because, you know, I, I asked Frank Kern what are his favorite books and you know, Carpet bagger by. What is that author's name? It's one of the, you know, but it's like these, you know, different marketers, some will read romance novels, some will read mysteries, some will watch south park, you know, and they learn things from.

That's the common thread.

South park seems to be very much the common.

Yeah.

And for me it's. Trey Parker is an absolute genius in my opinion as a writer. Matt is as well. But I would love to hang out with those guys for a weekend. But, but to be able to. For one thing, it's inspiring to see the creativity a guy can do in just six days.

That's what we were talking about the other day that they. That's what I was saying reminds me of, I love marketing, is that they literally do the episodes on in six days. They start on Wednesday and then deliver it.

Unbelievable in the quality they come out with is as far as like just sheer social satire. Is unbelievable.

Yeah.

So the other thing I learned was in this. I'm serious here. The most important part about a video sales letter is when it originally started, it was a pattern break in and of itself because no one had ever seen it. Now they're popular and people maybe have seen it. So the most important thing is that very first 10 seconds and you have to break the pattern. I call this the snap suggestion. It's based around a simple model. It's a two step model. First of all, if you walk into a conversation and you go. Everybody gets quiet. It's a really unique.

You snap louder than anyone else, really.

Does that spike it spiked off of it. So it's an interesting phenomenon. I mean, people will stop and slow down and listen to you. That's how you want to think about that moment. Because you don't know where your user is coming from. They may have just opened their email and clicked a link. They may have watched a YouTube video. They may have been watching TV. They may be like Joe Polish and doing 22 things at once. You don't know. And the only way to captivate their attention is to give them something they are completely not expecting. And then after you do that, what happens psychologically is when your mind is given something that you do not expect temporarily, your defenses are down. And when your defenses are down, you're open to suggestion. It's a little hypnotic, and it's definitely a little sinister. And. But the suggestion that I give right off the bat is you need something, and I want you to watch something. So I give them that suggestion. So that's very, very important part of the whole process.

Yes. Yes. Okay. So for I love marketing listeners, you know, one of the things that we always want to deliver to them are processes, capabilities, methodologies that will help them obviously improve their ability to put into the hands of their prospects and clients the value that they create in the world. And this process that you've created, refine, develop. I mean, I had the highest close in Glaser Kennedy history from a recent speech that I gave at Dan Kennedy's event. And, you know, the recent one you gave just absolutely killed it. And what. What me and Dean were talking about. Maybe we'll actually put that video right on ilove marketing.com so people can actually see an example of this in case they don't. They're not quite even aware of what we're talking about. We'll put some. We'll put some things up there. Maybe we'll even put my speech up there. I don't know. We'll talk about that, but we'll discuss it.

I would. Because it's just. It's just sexy.

Of course. Yeah. I mean, people cannot get enough of watching me on video, I think. But, you know, let's. Let's kind of talk about how can they start using this themselves? I mean, let's kind of give, you know, I mean, we have a limited amount of time, and this is something you've developed over many, many years. And you charge, you know, for private consulting. People are paying you I mean, upwards of, you know, $100,000 to develop killer.

That's been the highest offer so far. I mean, so I've made that on like back end stuff. But yeah, in fact I'm showing us, I showed that screen capture. Well, like my iPhone. I showed you. That's, that, you know, that's from Dan said, will you take 100 grand to do my video? I just kept telling, telling him, no, you know, I'm busy, I'm sorry. I was working on that stuff with Dean Graziosi at the time and working on my other stuff and, and Dan said, how about, you know, he sent me this text message. Will you do it for 100 grand? And so that's been the highest offer right off the bat. But usually, yeah, it's at least 20.

Well, but here's the thing though. Like when we were at my 25k group, you explained this the first time it was actually shared like in the Mastermind group. Like that. In my 25k meeting, Dean Graziosi had a event he was doing a week later. And Dean is the annoying guy you see on television selling real estate stuff. He's actually very, very bright. And so a week later, I mean literally it's like a week later he's doing an event to 200 people, used a video sales letter because he learned about it at you talking about it and did over 400,000, 440,000 in sales to a group of around 200 people. Yeah, totally insane. And I had, you know, I had like just over 500 people standing in line at the Glazer Kennedy event. A couple hundred of them dropped out of the line because they thought they missed the offer because literally they couldn't get, they couldn't handle all the sales. Kind of like we talked in the last episode, sometimes you can get too many sales. But this is a video sales that are done in a live environment. Someone doesn't have to speak from stage in order to use it. Oh no, I think I actually, I.

Think I'm the first one to do it.

Yeah, I was the first one ever sell from the platform. Yeah, because even, even the year before that, because I saw you speak in 2010. And so I literally sold 68 people into a thousand dollar a month program using a video sales letter. And what's great about it is this was not like a, you know, because we've all been to some seminars where there's a highly manipulative salesperson and that's getting people all frothed up and you know, shaking money out of their pockets. I mean no one feels it's like, oh, oh my God, you know, I'm being pressured. I mean they're watching a video, they can walk away. You know, it's a very non threatening way to present, you know, and it is education based selling because in your videos you're actually teaching people stuff, they're learning stuff. And so I think this is just an incredible method so to, you know.

So where do you start? Where do you start? That's the question I think is the biggest thing people want to know is where do you start? Basic stuff like, I mean, I don't even know. Okay, maybe I don't have PowerPoint, maybe I don't know how to record screen capture. What about a microphone? All those things I cover when I go over this course that we talked about through at Glazier Kennedy. But because that's actually the simple part, the most challenging part is starting with understanding the basics of what the product is that you're selling and defining what, what's known as your usb. So this, I'm good. So in other words, this, this part is not necessarily geared toward video sales letters. This is geared toward any selling. Okay, any selling at all. You've got to know your usp. And I have an exercise, I walk people through to get it to 20 words or less. The reason you want it to 20 words or less is very important. 20 words or less or is easy to say on one slide. You can fit that snap suggestion in there. It's very powerful, gives them exactly the benefit and you're only asking them to believe one thing. So all of those are psychological elements in good sales. So where to start actually isn't with video is to start with a USB to know what your usb, that's your unique selling position, unique selling point, and you only have one, even if you think you have four. One. You only want your user to understand and believe one thing. So we start there. When I work with people, what is your usb?

Do you have an example?

Yeah, you got a couple.

For example, my ESP is the only diet in the world that allows you to eat your favorite foods and still lose weight. That's under 20 words. The only diet in the world that allows you to eat your favorite foods. In fact, it demands you that you eat your favorite foods and still lose weight. So what I'm asking my user to believe is you can eat your favorite foods and lose weight.

Yeah, so that's. We had this conversation, you and I in Phoenix in April and that was one of the things we went through that exercise, you asked me what are my favorite foods, what are my favorite proteins? And just eat those basically, is what you said. Yeah, in these combinations. I mean, in the combination that you said. But that's really essentially what, what I've done. And it just makes, it makes it simple.

It makes it simple.

Yeah, yeah.

The cool thing about that is it's not just your favorite foods. What I do in every other day diet is I say what are your favorite healthy foods? And what are your favorite junk foods? So I'm just not a food purist because I don't think anyone is going to follow that for a long period of time unless they completely devote their life to it. So I want to get people better and in the journey, if they decide to go further, that's great. I eat 99% of the time. I eat extremely healthy because it's my job and I love it. But I love the foods that I eat when I. But I also enjoy my pizza and sushi and I do that every week unless I'm getting ready for a contest or something. So that's very important to understand. So anyway. But I get them to believe and understand one thing and from that point on, and I think everyone listening needs to do that too. So figure out what your USP is and get and understand that that's the one thing that you have to communicate. It has to be unique. You know, it's like, how are you, how is your product unique? If there is some way that, that it is unique, find what it is. What is the number one benefit that it brings to your user? Number one benefit, the best thing about it. And what does it enable them to do? Everything. Every USP should have an enabler. In my case, the enabling part is obviously losing weight. The benefit is eating the favorite foods. That's the benefit. The enabler part is losing weight. So everything's enablers are usually verbs, something that allows you to, to attract, to consume, to earn, you know, that kind of thing. So that's, that's just a really rough overview there. And so once you have that, you can actually get into writing, writing the formula, writing down what the video sales should be. And we probably have nowhere near the time to actually go into the five parts of the VSOL process and all that stuff. But I'll cover whatever you guys ask me to cover, so.

Okay.

Okay, so Dean, go ahead.

Well, so that's a good start. So you get the. You got your unique selling proposition or unique selling position. Is that how you Is that what you open the video with? Are you using that as a guideline to. Everything you're doing is supporting that?

No, you open. You open the video with what I call the snap suggestion. So there's some sort of. There's some sort of pattern error. You give them a reason to watch. And then within the very first 10 slides, there's always that mention of the USB. Here's what I'm going to tell you. I'm going to reveal a secret. This is how I eat my favorite foods and still lost weight. I've been saying this personally. I lost 68 pounds and I used to be obese. So, yeah, this is how it works. I'm going to show you everything about it. So that's why you need to watch till the end. So I'm suggesting throughout the entire video. Now, let me just explain, since this can't be a how to, because my how to course is like 12 hours long. But what we can talk about is why it's essential for everyone to have one.

One.

There we go. Okay, so I'd love to get into the conversation of modalities.

I don't think. I don't want to talk about that.

Okay.

No, I'm kidding.

We were just saying that. Less modalities.

Yeah. I'm so tired of freaking modality.

Yeah. You know, I think modalities is what's really undermining a lot of things. Even the economy, perhaps.

It really is.

All right, well, explain a modality. What does that mean?

First off, what's a modality? Well, modality. It's like, for example, the other day when I saw you down at the 99% mark and you're participating. I'm kidding. The modality is a different way. Basically, it's this. Okay. There's a psychological point of view that you can approach that each person basically has. They filter through. And some are auditory, some are visual, some are, you know, kinesthetic, whatever. You've got different forms of modalities there.

You.

In marketing, you have different forms of modalities. And what I'm using is the term modality is some people like to read, some people like to listen. Video sales that are. You read and listen. Some people like to interact webinars. So to not have all three of those is to leave at least two thirds. If you only have one of your buyers on the table.

Right.

You're losing two thirds of your money. So there's a sequence that you can follow, and that sequence is very, very cool. I think video sales letters are by far and away the best sequence starter. Not webinars, video sales letters. Webinars are the last. People are so in love with webinars because you hear this all the time. Webinars were created using my ugly video, to be honest with you, and then basically taking that and saying let's do it on a live call. And I love webinars. They're great. You know, people say all the conversions are so much higher. Yeah, your click throughs are a lot. You know, you get people sign up, maybe 25% click through and then 50 of those percent of those sign up and 50% of those show up. So if you end up doing the math, the conversions are a little better sometimes and sometimes a lot worse. But. But the modality is necessary. So you're selling the people that actually need the interaction. They actually want that. Okay, so that should be there. But your very first introduction I like to make is a video salsa. Because if people window out and say they're not interested in this, assuming you're not buying Google traffic and you can't use an exit splash, what we do is we show them an exit splash. It says wait. How would you like to read an article on the top five boost for Exit Splash? Yes.

Just, just find that. Because in the reason I'm asking you for these things is for people that are not familiar with this and we're obviously trying to get them familiar with it so that they can decide if they want to use this in their marketing to understand what. So things go by and I stop you. It's just because I'm trying to do that to clarify for the audience.

Cool. An exit splash is just a line of JavaScript code that allows if you Google Exit Splash, you'll find the ones that are available out there that you can buy. It's cheap. It takes control of the browser system. So in other words, whenever people close a window, either with a click of the window close or they window out like a Mac would be control w there's going to be a message that pops up. The system message. It says wait. And there you have two options. Stay on this page or leave this page. By law they have to highlight leave this page, I believe. But what you do in that system message is you show them, say wait. Thank you for visiting my page. Before you go, I would love to send you to an article the top three foods for weight loss or whatever it may be. In my case it'd be three, three foods. You absolutely need to. And then what we do is split test that we'll go from a positive modality to a negative modality. Wait, before you go, I want you to read about the top three foods you think are healthy but are preventing your weight loss. Right. Different modality.

Yeah.

See different way, different sense of motivation. So when people click. Yeah, let me read that article. That article is basically almost the same computer.

Right.

It's just worded from the very top without the suggestion bits to say, okay, here's some top three foods. And then everything else is the same. It makes copywriting a lot easier because you've already done the grunt work through the video sales process. Video sales that are making. Once you know you're just using it in different formats exactly the same thing. So. And then if they window out of that, say hey, we've got a free webinar coming up in two days. We'd love to invite you. So you send them over to the webinar and this is how the system works. So. So you're capturing people with multiple modalities and you can also use visual video if you, if you're comfortable with that. Andy Jenkins is the bomb.

Yeah.

Really the boss.

The boss when it comes to that. And yeah, he's awesome. So. But all those are essential. So when Ryan dies came out with his course on on video sales letters he as a clever marketer that he is, he said hey, the text based sales pages are dead.

Yeah.

Clever marketing angle. Not true, not true. You need a video sales that are just as much as you need a text.

Well, I think Ryan says everything's dead, right?

Yes, that's his.

And I thought was really great. Is Mary Ellen Trippy who we saw speak yesterday. She actually is talking about how valuable free reports are for conversion as a giveaway versus a free video. And I was like, okay, you're running Ryan Deiss's company and wasn't it just a few months ago that Ryan Dyson free reports don't work anymore. This is, I think really this episode should be about bashing Ryan. And having said that, Ryan is a brilliant marketer.

Ryan is one of the best. Yes, absolutely. And he's a good friend too.

He's a nice guy. He's a good looking man.

I wouldn't go that far, but yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

Do you know that he's a closet Democrat?

Really?

No.

Really?

Okay, you know now but see here's the thing though. Now that it's put out there, you've planted a seed.

Yeah.

Right. Because anything could be said about anyone and people can tend to believe it's probably if it comes from an authoritative individual, he's about.

Yeah, that's a very funny statement. You know, Ryan, so can I say something?

Right, okay. Because one thing I want to, because I know from reading comments and I love marketing and for so many new people that come into I love marketing on a daily basis, this is the. Or sometimes this will be the, you know, for over like, you know, 1500 to 2000 people. This will be the first episode of I love marketing they've ever heard. And they're like, well, what is all this stuff? And so me and Dean are always encouraging people to go and listen to back, so they're going to understand the learn marketing. Like there's always a thing. Well, you know, I don't want to. I don't want to manipulate people. I don't want to hypnotize people. I don't want, you know, and there's always that sort of. In a lot of ways, it's not, it's a nonsensical sort of, if that's even a word, a nonsensical sort of belief system. Because if you have something that's really going to benefit people, but you are ineffective at getting it out to the world, you're not going to help them.

And you're not going to help you.

And you literally are a convert of your own system. I mean, you were. I mean, if someone looks at your before and after pictures, you were obese and you lost a lot of weight and became ripped. You know, you've been in bodybuilding contests, that sort of stuff. And you had a good methodology. But if you had no idea, and it's helped thousands of people, but if you didn't know how to do this, you never would have delivered it.

No, they wouldn't have bought it.

And that's my point with like all of these things that people considered tricks and strategies and tactics, you know, as far as I'm concerned, as long as it's legal, moral and ethical, you should do whatever it is humanly possible in order to persuade people to get what it is that you're offering them. With the caveat being that you're delivering value.

That is the case. And I think that that's essential, that you have to have a product worth delivering. And I've said this multiple times from the stage and on audio, video, whatever, without the product of value. If you do not have an intimate relationship with your product, I mean, you absolutely love it. You know, don't take that in the wrong way, Jeff, but you love it. And you actually, you know that value. And I'm going to talk, talk a little bit more. In the next talk I give on how important that intimacy is, how it comes across, it seeps over the Internet. It's a very powerful concept. Once you understand the power of that, you understand that you cannot do this with a text based sales letter, not anywhere close to what you can do with your voice and a text.

Right. Because there are passions that can be conveyed in. Like even when you've coached me through how to record a video sales letter, there are just things that you can do to. I mean, in a lot of ways this is taking powerful copy and dramatically enhancing it. That's the way that I look at video sales letters. And the reason I keep pointing this out is because I know in the time we have that it's impossible to deliver to someone every aspect of how to develop a video sales letter. And just like me, you know, this has been a learning process and I continue to go through it with you. And so I wanted to, you know, have people here listen to things that I know they're not going to hear from any other other marketers. You know, they're, they're, they're. And I want them to be aware of it and I want people to actually watch video sales letters of yours. And we will put up some companion material on ilove marketing.com so people can really see it and they can understand it. But I, you know, the point I always want to make is to, is to break that sort of belief that, oh, well, you know, you know, I can't do that or I don't know if we can do that. And like, yeah, you should do everything you freaking can because, you know, this is how you become successful at marketing is you literally do everything. Because we talked about leverage on the last episode. This is an ultimate form of leverage.

Yeah. I have an analogy. If it's, if it suffices. If you had, if you were in a burning building, you got everybody out but your dog. And the dog's up there on the second floor. He's like, oh, you know, he's barking. He doesn't know what to do. Yeah, come on, boy. Come on, boy. He won't jump. He won't jump. Come on, boy. You're trying to get him to jump out of a burning building.

You're.

I have a treat for you. I. Let's go for a walk. You would say anything. You would say, you would even lie to get him jump out of the building. Only reason why is you want to save his life. You have no intention of hurting them. So while I don't lie, I don't believe in that. I believe in doing everything, like you said, morally and ethically, within reason. To manipulate, and I will use that word. Manipulation is not a negative term. Right. It is simply a state of mental being. And so I. We manipulate people every single day. So most of the. Thank goodness is for the good. You know, it's for, like, you know, we say. I say, hey, Joe, I'd love to take you to dinner tonight. You know, I'm manipulating Joe to go to dinner, but I'm not. You know what I'm saying? So we use that word in such a crass way. And marketing should be about ethical manipulation in the highest standard possible to get a product that can change your lives.

Yeah. Dean Grazioski said the same thing where we're at at the outlet marketing conference. Dean said that same thing. If you, you know, talking about if you're, you know, somebody you love, you know, they're. They're a smoker and they're, you know, heading for lung cancer, you do anything ethically, you know, to. To get them to stop, you know.

Yeah, yeah. You know, I'll go so far as I remember when I first got into being a quote unquote marketer, you know, being guy that people thought of as not just a fitness writer, but a marketer. And one of my best friends, she had a real problem with it. She was, like, real snooty about it. And now with people like that, you know, I literally just say, fuck off. Yeah, I really. I mean, I do. I try to explain it at that point. I said, fuck off. Honestly, I don't have time to deal with someone that stupid. If you don't understand the importance of this, you do not deserve to be in this business.

Right.

That's the way I feel about it.

Yeah.

I mean, I really appreciate if you wouldn't sugarcoat how you feel. We try to use, you know, here we. We're really open to people talking, like, openly, you know, and not having to try to kind of soften the way they feel.

Good, good, Joe. Yeah. Yeah. I'm not opinionated on it, but I. I just think it's a very important concept to get across because you free yourself now. Let me say this one more thing about this. Once you're free from that burden, it's like if you grow up in a religious family and you grow up feeling guilty about, I don't know, we'll make something, and feeling guilty about walking around with your shoes off, who knows? And then all of a sudden you realize, you grow up and you realize, oh, there's nothing wrong with that. You still kind of feel that guilt until you put it completely behind you. Okay? And this is the same way I want everybody to put this guilt of quote unquote, manipulation, quote unquote, you know, scare tactics or, or clever copy behind them so that their creativity can go. It opens a big window to the creativity and that's what's important. Unless you do that, you got some problems. You're gonna have problems because your marketing is gonna come across like, like a guy. I heard it at Glazier today. His, his clothes was like I was watching and he's like reading directly off the PowerPoint. This is really a wonderful thing. It is a one time offer only. I think it is good. I'm not going to try to close you hard. I am not yet.

Yeah. You know, and people even when they say that, I'm not going to try to sell you. Whereas we believe that selling is a good thing. We even said this on some of the episodes. I think marketers are saviors. I think sales, you know, because it's like using the Dan Sullivan definition of selling, which is my favorite definition is, you know, getting people intellectually engaged in a feature result that's good for them, keyword, good for them, and getting them to emotionally communicate to take action to achieve that result. And so if you, if you really can lead people to a bigger future and the method of getting there is selling. And you're helping people how you cannot. Every person in the world that helps guide anyone to do something that's good for them, including people that saves, save people's lives by teaching them, you know, everything from how to eat better, to take care of their health, to not get involved in destructive things. I mean, that doesn't happen without persuasion. It doesn't happen without selling. And so there's I think a lot of this fear, like John Carlton calls it, selling from your heel. You know, I'm not going to try to sell you as you're trying to sell.

Exactly.

I mean, what the hell are you talking about?

It's funny because that person has some sort of moral problem with that, yet they're lying out their ass. So I, I'm sorry, I have a problem with lying. You know, that's my problem. I don't want to get up on stage and say something like that. Positioning, something clever like what we, how we closed it out where I said, you know, how many people want this blueprint? But I'm not going to give it to you.

Right.

At least not in the way you think. Now if I just said I'm not going to give it to you and just then we. We closed it out, it would have been lying. I'm not going to give it to you because I literally didn't give him a box.

Right?

Yeah. And so it's like.

And we're going to save those results for another episode, you know, because, you know, obviously we talked about that before our session here. At least me and Dean did. Not much with you. However, this is a game changer. And the point is, all of this with the video sales letter is a game changer. And what I wanted to do on this particular episode was define the game. And then I want people to really start looking for it because now whenever they see a video sales letter, they're going to see it in a different way. It's kind of like if you buy a red Corvette, you never really notice them until you buy one. And then all of a sudden you start seeing them.

Everybody else got theirs today.

Yeah. And when you start studying, you know, people that suck at marketing in a lot of ways because they don't pay attention to it. And when you start getting them aware of what are the reasons this works and why this doesn't work, then all of a sudden people start noticing things they didn't notice before. And when you start looking for those things, you start understanding it, you start breaking it down, then you can actually start using it and applying it. Because the first step, step to anything is awareness. I mean, hell, even 12 step groups and addiction. The first step is being aware. And so basically we want people listening to this to be aware that this is from everything that I've seen. And you guys, correct me if I'm wrong, all of the marketers that I know, if you want to talk about new, although this is not new to you, you've been doing this stuff for years. This is the highest converting marketing methodology that currently exists in. In the way that I see it. Done right.

Well, yeah. And that done right is the key. And there is a. There is a new fad that's been going around and several guys I know have done it very successfully. And that is this. And you know, it's animating. Yeah, guys, anime.

We were just talking about that with Andy Jenkins.

Yeah, yeah.

Well. And see, I still consider that a video. Yeah, well, it's.

Is it.

But it's different. It's a different adaptation of It. But I still. I would still put it in the same genre.

Well, here's what's interesting. I do want to share this story because my friend Mike Gary, he used my. My voice, my copy, gave it to an illustrator. I think he paid like 20 grand or something. It's 10 to 20 grand. I mean, it's expensive to get an illustrator to draw all this stuff out on a board and sync it all up. To me, it's frenetic. I mean, that's the first thing I thought is I would. I. I don't. I'm gonna go into an episode epileptic seizure. I'm just. I can't watch this stuff. But obviously to a lot of people, it worked. It increased his conversions.

The thing is, you are like a walking epileptic seizure. Your behavior, I mean, you're, you're part of.

You said that like you kind of go. I think maybe there's a distinction because when what you're talking about with the video sales letter, with the text is you're pacing, and it's almost like they get into a trance in a way where they're, they're, they're listening, they're reading at the same time, but they're. You're doing the inflection, you're doing all the stuff. So they're hearing it exactly the way you want. And they're kind of like on a. On a monorail where you're going. And. And it goes along and there's only one sidewalk.

Yeah.

Now, the other thing that I thought about with the animated videos is because it's disconnected, the, The. You're processing two different things. You're processing the visual of the, of what's going on, but you're hearing something that is not exact.

You're.

You have to process on two tracks. And I was wondering about that whether if you're, you know, paying attention to the, the visual, whether there's less resistance to the audio, like the audio message might be going right in or something. I'd love to get the real psychology you studied.

What is going on in the minds of people when they're doing this and why. So if you could explain that and break it down, that would be really.

I would love to know what's happening with, with the animation stuff. I mean, I have some theories. One of them being that when you're watching somebody draw something again, the going back to the snap suggestion, you know, you momentarily take someone out of their current mind frame and they're just kind of entranced in watching and eventually I think people get past the drawing part after a couple of minutes and start listening. So I think that's the reason it's working so well. It's a very, it's like a two minute pattern interrupt. Now, it hasn't worked well for everybody. For some people it's worked exceedingly well. Big, big tip here. Start with the video sales letter because it might be Mike proved it. It's like he had already had a winning video sales or he tried to beat that thing for two, almost two years. He paid like high end animators did it. Did a video bus style thing. Nothing, nothing could touch it. Just the ugly. So the ugly video sales are easiest way to get the highest conversions. And then after that, if you want to try the animated thing, then go for it.

Well, how some people might just be happy if they were to go from 1% to 6%.

I will.

I would be freaking thrilled. Yeah. One to two.

Here's one thing though, that we have learned consistently with the results because we now have a lot of people making a lot of money as a result of listening. I love marketing. They're utilizing. I mean, you know, when I go to the meet, everywhere we go. All right here all the time. Oh, yeah, yeah. No, I mean, I mean we literally, I think, I think we have helped generate millions of, of additional sales of stuff since we started doing a freaking free podcast.

I made about a buck fifty so far.

You made nothing. You got a ball of water and.

You keep stealing it from my room. So you need to stop that.

But basically, I can't even remember what the hell I was gonna say now. What was I gonna say?

People making a lot of money off. I love marketing.

Well, no, I know what it was. So whenever, like when we've gone through the education based marketing stuff, we're having people write consumer awareness guides and creating free, you know, free reports and doing, you know, free recorded messages. The mere act of going through and putting it together gives someone a much deeper understanding of their business. I mean, just saying, hey, put, you know, everyone should have a sales letter. If you sit down and write a sales letter and you've never done a, you've never written a sales letter before. Every other aspect of your marketing, from your website to your blog to your mobile marketing or whatever the hell it is that you're using as a delivery system, it improves. So this raises the level, the water level of, you know, higher. And so if I could encourage everyone listening to. Even if you're not quite sure how to do it, even if you Think you're going to completely screw up if you sit down and record your first video sales letter and just do it. That alone is going to give you a much deeper understanding of how to put it together. It's like, you know, I sit and run into people all the time. Like, you know, I really need to write a book. Well, you know, the best way to get started is to just get started. And you know, Steven Pressfield, you know, who, who's my friend and wrote the book the War of Art and the Legend of Bagger Vance. And he's just a fantastic writer. You know what he says in the War of Art, which is a great book? He says, the hard part is not the writing, it's the sitting down to write. And that's what every writer needs to do. And so the hard part about a video sales letter first is the sitting down and just doing it. So let's talk about. We have a limited amount of time here, and it's a very basic question, but it's a really. It's really not a basic question because it doesn't matter how much someone studies psychology, marketing, if they don't sit down and crank out, who gives a shit? Right?

Right.

So what do they need in order to do this? I mean, if you use a Mac, a PC, how do you do this?

Well, what you need, what I use, I'm a Mac guy, and that's because I like real computers.

Because you're cool like us.

Yeah.

Can you. Can you. I heard you singing I'm cool like that.

I'm cool, I'm cool. I'm cool like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, go ahead. It's like, yeah, you know, Honey badger, don't care, didn't give a. So, yeah, I would. Here's the thing. Yeah. Mac or PC, it doesn't matter. I use PowerPoint.

PC, Mac, use.

Yeah, I love Macs. Okay, so PowerPoint. I write the script. Sometimes I'll write the script in, like, word or like in cut and paste. Every slide over, that's a pain in the butt. So a lot of times I just follow my own formula naturally.

And through that, write it that way.

I'll write it right, slide by slide. It's so much easier once you know the formula because you know that on these lines, this is the formula that I'm going to follow. This is what I need to say. Without that formula, it's a pain in the butt. And then yet you wonder where to go next. But, But.

So we'll post info on. I love marketing for anyone that wants to actually look at what you're offering, your formula. If they want to invest in your training, because you do have all that, we'll put it up on the site. Yeah. So if anyone wants further information about it. So with the time we have, just to the best your ability, tell them.

How to do it.

Because I always say, even if people never pass a penny, we always want to deliver.

Absolutely. Yeah. I'm trying to get as fast as I can. So you got PowerPoint and so you would start typing your slides. Right. If you want to write outside, like I said, you can whatever you're more comfortable with. And then let's pretend that you write in word. Okay. So then you write your sales letter like you're writing in word. What you want to focus on is one sentence at a time. Each slide should be a sentence. Occasionally I'll use two sentences and separate them by ellipses. And each slide should end with an ellipses or a colon. And the reason why is you always want the. It's the forward motion. And this is the one thing that, you know, we, we started a lot of this stuff. And this is one of the things that I started with. Is this for the idea of forward motion or you just don't end with anything. You just have. Have the words on the screen center aligned. You can go title, case, or you can go normal tied to case. There's not a huge amount of difference in conversions. You should test it. I usually center all my copy. So in other words, everything's centered like. And then once it's in PowerPoint, I use a program called Screenflow, and that is to record the screen. And what I use for a lot of people, record audio directly into either PowerPoint or Keynote. That's what I do.

Yeah, record it right into Keynote.

I like to get a higher quality audio, so I use Amadeus. And Amadeus is a. Is a very inexpensive audio program for the Mac. I don't know if this for the PC or not, but. So I'll record the audio. Audio first. So once I get the screens down. Okay, I've got it all on screens. I record the audio and then you.

Just advance the slides before I record the screen. Right.

So yes. And so I'm playing the audio back and I know exactly where to advance the slide and I'm capturing the screen at the same time. And here's a tip. It's a really good tip too, especially if you're using PowerPoint. In Screenflow, you have one monitor. So how are you going to see the Slides, unless you're looking at them printed. And I remember Joe had something printed. You could keep hearing the pages turn. So that's not a good idea. But what you do is a lot of people don't know that PowerPoint has a rehearsal mode. Go into rehearsal mode and record the screenshot from there. The reason why that's advantageous is first of all, you can see the copy coming up. And second of all, you don't need a copy of the Word document. So you know, you know where to click. Click. And you can, all you have to do is just, you can play the audio underneath it, you know, it doesn't have to be so.

And you could just. So you just adjust your, the recording box to fit the, the real side and you're seeing the next one coming. Yeah, that's a brilliant idea.

Yeah. And I do, I do it afterwards.

That's the difference. You're doing it with the keynote, with recording it on keynote. You have to play it full screen.

Yeah.

So you don't see what coming.

Exactly. Yeah. And I used to think that you had to do it with PowerPoint. I stumbled on the rehearsal mode and that solved the problem. Because the thing is, in PowerPoint, if you're in full screen mode and the problem is, okay, you can, you can record the audio. You can listen to your audio going in full screen mode and record it. But if there's certain places where, like I don't always put every word on the screen, Right. So if there's certain places where I need to make notes, where I say, okay, I tell it where I'm going to click to the next line, or if I need to look at my Word document, which, you know, those are cool little tips you can do in.

Rehearsal, but sometimes that I noticed you do that too in some of them where you're reading a sentence, then you'll say something else that kind of is a comment about that.

Yes.

But you're not putting that word. You're not putting those words very clear. And that's kind of like catches them by surprise too, right?

What it is, what that is, that's strategically placed about every five to 10 slides. I don't have every word on the page. Sometimes I do have three words. And the reason why is because I don't want them to know when the next slide is going to come. Because they were reading or in their already ahead, they read fast or whatever. Then all of a sudden they see three words. You're like. And he's talking. Is this over? Oh, next, next Slide is a pattern break. It's one pattern break after the other. So this is something I experimented. Hollis Carter gave me the idea and he's funny because he never did it. He said, you know what? I think you should. I'm thinking about doing like just, just three words on a slide. So I went home and tried it with seven minute muscle and it converted great. I had like three words on every slide. And then I figured out a better way to do it, which is put three words. And then you put all the words and put three. That's what I did for the clothes that give me.

Yeah. So, okay, so what, what about length? What's the shortest? Longest?

No, 18 minutes is the shortest. If you have a really cheap product, like if it's say $19.95, you can get by with 15. Nothing under 15. It sounds like a long time. The most successful that I've. That we've done is anywhere from 30 to 40 minutes. So don't. Yeah.

And in a seminar room when I did a thousand dollar sales to 68 people, 22 minute video that they watched.

Some of them are even. I mean, how long is that End of America video? Do you know what I'm talking about? That I think it was about.

I think it's Porter's video.

Yeah, I think those are over an hour long.

Yeah, they're. They're 60 minutes long. Yeah, his video was fantastic.

Of course, financial.

Yeah, he's using the ugly video, right? Yeah, he's killing it. Absolutely killing it. Yeah. Yeah, he's doing okay.

So for the limited amount of time that we have, you know, again, like I said, we've got a couple minutes left. We'll put some videos on ilove marketing.com. so if you're listening to this episode on itunes, then go to ilovemarketing.com and you'll see stuff there. I would also encourage you to listen to some of the past episodes we've done because it'll reinforce this. So really, to kind of. Any final things for people just to get to do, to understand, to learn how to better do this.

What would you recommend to them to learn how to better do it? I mean, most people will need some sort of training to do it, to do it faster. You can go look at video, a lot of video sales editors and just watch them and see what the pacings are. Of course that's a long endeavor because you got to watch hours and hours and hours of a video and then write down what you think the sequences are. But I still go back to getting into more of the fundamentals of the psychology of understanding why it's so important to figure this out. And the reason why is because first a, you force people to read every single word. Now, I didn't mention this, but the close. And me and my programmer Ted created the magic buy button that everyone uses now.

Everyone appears right when you talk about.

Right. So I was. When I started doing this, I started looking around it to find out if anyone else was doing it. And they said, yeah, this guy Keith Lohan's doing something. And his stuff was similar, but it was more PowerPointy. And I said, great minds. That's kind of cool. But at the end of it, you have to go to a different URL. So it's really a webinar model. Well, I did like, can you job script time something? And if, you know, at the 16 minute, 34 second mark, your pitch hits, look below this video right now. Boom. You know, and we've taken that to a whole new level. Don't have time to go into it, but. But anyway, the reason why that's so important is that you haven't sold anyone until the very end.

Yeah.

Unlike a tech sales page, which you can scroll to the end, know immediately what it is.

Yeah.

You know, someone has to be really, really. So your buyers are far more qualified.

Yeah. They're totally positioned because of you just. You just put that much information in education into the. Okay, so. Well, first off, John, thank you for sharing your knowledge on this. If people want to go and look at any of your video sales letters, go to your website or whatever, maybe buy some of your diet stuff. Where do they go?

Oh, my gosh. There's a lot of places you can go. You can go to johnbensonfitness.com and John, with Jon, you can go to 3X videoformula.com or 3X video.com and. Yeah, that's the place.

Awesome. And we'll put some videos and stuff up there and maybe we'll have to decide because for one, we have to make sure that the stuff that we can put up there is like, you know, edited and we. Because there's some recent stuff that's been done that I'd love to throw up.

Yeah.

It's a matter of how quickly we can get it.

Quickly. Is this going to air like in a week? Week or.

Yeah, it's gonna. It's gonna air. Yeah. Okay.

If it's gonna air in a week, I mean, in a literal week here, then they could go to video salesletters.com because I now own it.

1.

Oh, there you go. Video salesletters.com awesome.

Any final words for you, Dean? Since last episode, I said I must have the last word because I'm cooler.

Than you because you're cool like that. I'm gonna let John have the last word on this episode.

Why do you love marketing?

Why do I love marketing? Because it empowers people while it empowers me to live a life of freedom.

Awesome.

Thank you. I like you both equally. There we go. I want to see a menage of.

So you know with that. Thank you for listening. And we will see you on the next episode of Ilove Marketing.com. please give us your comments and feedback on the website. You have yourself a wonderful day. And now crank out a video sales letter. For the love of God, do it now.