How I Make $1,000/Day Selling Insurance As A Stay-At-Home Mom ft. Mary Kraft | Ep105

My days have to be 1,000 points.

I was hoping you talked about this. This is really cool.

If you're an agent in this business and you want to make money, you need to be hitting 1,000 points because this business is literally just an activities game, a math game. Yes, 1,000 points. A call is 1 point, a presentation is 100, and a close is 100. My goal, even at a day, 2 years later, I still hit 1,000 points a day. Don't care. So the other day I did 469 dials, but I did 6 presentations. So I presented to 6 people and 5 of them told me something.

600 points and 4, 6, you're still over 1,000 in that case. Yeah. Appreciate you getting on the podcast. Uh, we're already recording because that's how my team rolls.

I saw that on my kid.

Yeah, so it's all good. He'll cut it, he'll do whatever. For those watching, again, welcome back to another episode, Insurance Insiders Podcast. We're, uh, we're getting a little traction here. Every time we have, we have a new guest, it seems to have the most views than the last guest. So no pressure at all, but you are killing it. So I have no doubt. Uh, well, yeah, it's getting a little traction and, you know, we're having fun sharing what people are doing out there and folks are hiring people from it. And there's all kinds of crazy stuff happening. And for a little while, I didn't even want to do this, to be clear. I was like, yeah, but now I have fun with it. Yeah.

So yeah, that's amazing. That's amazing. That's great that everyone gets better than the last. I mean, it's fun. You just got to have fun with it. I feel like the coolest thing about this industry is Although we all do the same thing, everybody does it kind of different. And so as an agent, it is so helpful to know that you won't just learn from one person, you'll learn from a million. So it's amazing that you do this.

Yeah, I try to help, help pass the message, but at the same time, a lot of people watch and they keep watching, they keep watching, they keep watching, and they never do anything. So I'm like, the important part is you take the info and you go do something with it, you know? But I learned a lot too. That's why I like doing them. Yeah, it is, it is. I, I hear you sell a lot of insurance and you got a team. I don't know what size team you got, but I hear you got some people moving. I see you on— I see some videos and Zoom calls and I kind of get a little sneak peek of your stuff. Yeah, yeah. Um, yeah, tell us a little bit more. I know, uh, I don't know how you've been in— I don't— I, to be clear, I tell everybody this, I don't prep for these. So me and you figured this out as we go. We're just gonna have a conversation. I have no plan. I don't know where this is going. So yeah, but I would like to know a little bit about how you got started and kind of what your journey is.

It's kind of like a fluke, actually. I feel like nowadays life insurance is like blown up, and whether that's on TikTok or media, like everybody's heard about it. Well, when I got into life insurance, it was a fluke. I didn't know I was getting into life insurance per se, or really what it was. Um, it's been— I've been full-time 2 years now, but rewind to like October, that'd be 2024. So October 2023, I was working a salary job and I loved it. It was a med spa. I ran it. We started with like 6 people and then we grew to 12 and then 18, then 20, then 30. So the business just kept growing and growing, which is amazing, but I wasn't. So I was like, okay, jobs have caps. I don't like that, you know what I mean? I want this business. Like, you're making so much money, which is amazing, like, that's awesome, but I like I'm not moving up, you know what I mean?

So I was like, yeah, yeah.

And I trained people on sales. Obviously it was a very different world, but you grow the business, you need to train on sale.

Like Botox and stuff? Like that's what a med spa is?

Yeah, yeah.

I used to work for a spa, like an actual spa, like where they did massages and stuff, and they added that to it. Yeah, so I kind of, I kind of know that world a little bit.

Yeah. What did you do there?

I was an accountant.

Oh, okay.

Yeah, I did, I did numbers. Now, now, I, I got a lot of massages and facials because when you work there, they gave us all kinds of freebies. So yeah, we had like 6 locations and I would always go get— uh, yeah, I got lots of massages. It was nice.

It's amazing.

But no, no, no jabs. I didn't. I was like, I'm gonna pass on that stuff.

Fair enough, fair enough. But yeah, it was, it was fun. It's business. I'm like a numbers person, salesperson. I love it. And well, my friend, one of my good friends who was an esthetician at the med spa, her stepsister kept coming in and all the time, once a month. And then when she'd come in, she'd buy service packages and all these products, like thousands of dollars at a time. And she might have been my age or younger, and I was 24 at the time, maybe 25. No, no, no, no, no, no, 2 years ago, 3 years ago. I've known her for a while. Nicolette's been going there for a while. But when I met Nicolette, I might have been like 25, 26. I've always known of her, but But at that point, 2 years ago, she was just buying so much. And I'm like, what does this girl do? Like, that's what I want. Like, I want to be able to do this. Like, where is this money coming from? So that is when I just reached out to her. I had no clue what she even did, and I just reached out to her and I was like, hey, you know, I know, I know you from the med spa, but like, what do you do for work? And she's like, I sell life insurance. I'm like, what? She's like, yeah, it's sales. And I was like, okay. So I booked a call with her and I took it from the parking lot of my job and I just grilled her. Because for me, being in like a sales industry, when I hire people, it's like, what are your numbers? How do you do it? Like, you know what I mean? And I, I kind of like just got to the point. Now it's like, who's your top salesperson? What are they making? Is this real? Show me your bank account and then I'm in. And she was like, whoa, like Okay, so she did all that and I was like, all right, I'm in. So in October, I was working my job, I got my license, and then I started part-time. So I would work this mitzvah all day and then I would get home. We have 2 kids. I have 2 kids, they're 6 and 5, but then they were 4 and 3 or whatever. Yeah, something like that. My husband over.

Yeah, still pacifiers and whiny and cry. Yeah, all the stuff.

Yeah, hard age. Hard age. They're better now. Still hard, but he would take them over. I would dial from 5:30— I didn't have an office— in my bedroom from 5:30 to like 11 at night. And I would dial Hawaii, or I, I was in Arizona, so I headed out Hawaii or Oregon or whatever, back dial. And I would do that every single day. And then on the weekends, I'd work all day, Saturday and Sunday. So I was working 40 hours of life insurance, 40 to 50 hours in a full-time job. Hell yeah. Yeah, I was going crazy, but I believed in it. I was around people that were doing it. Like Nicolette was making money. Madison was making money. There was other people on the team making money. So the belief—

Savage.

Yeah, yeah, it was absolute savage. The belief was—

they're stacked with talent. It's crazy. The— I'm like, what, what do they put in the water out there?

I, I could have felt so many ways, you know. I mean, there's just so many people in life insurance. I thank God every day that it fell the way it did. I got both right then because it was the best fit. I mean, my team is the best mentors, still are. Um, but yeah, that's kind of how I got started. I really didn't make any money, to be honest, part-time. I think I paid $4,000, so I was making some money.

Working that many hours?

Yeah. So working—

yeah, okay. Where did you start? What was, what was hard?

What was hard?

I think it was just like, why are we not making money with that many hours? What do you think? Uh-huh.

For me, it felt like although I was working a lot of hours, the times were like 4 to 5 hour blocks, and I was dialing bronze and silver, which is great to start, but I feel like dialing them— yeah, you need to put in like 8 hours uninterrupted. Why? It might take you 3 hours to even get your first pickup, you know.

True.

And so true. Did that pickup want life insurance? I don't know. They probably could have just picked up, told me F off, and be done. So in 5 hours, maybe I only had 3 people pick up. So it was hard to build momentum, but that was all I had. On the weekends, I'd usually get a sale. So I was making about a sale a week, but they were, you know, $600 AP, whatever. Um, so I wasn't doing much, but I learned a lot. I got comfortable with the script. Comfortable with the process, the application. Like, there was so much value in that time. Um, then that was October, November, December, January. I went to my first convention, and I was fired up. That, that changed it for me mentally, I think.

Just seeing— 24, 24, January '24.

Okay, dope. Yeah, yeah. Um, yeah, yeah, yeah. I knew no one, felt like a dork, really hadn't sold much, But it was just so cool to see people talking about it and like their stories and how much they do. And I was like, I can do that. If they can do it, I can do it. Um, and so then I went back and I was planning to go full-time. I'm not sure I would have with two kids because I wasn't making money, so I didn't really have any money to put away. But long story short, the road led to where I was forced to go full, full-time, um, in February. Yeah, yeah, my— I didn't tell my boss I was doing insurance, and, and then she asked about it and I lied. And we were, we were friends, and it just, it just went south.

It was my fault.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's my fault. Um, and so it ended bad at that point. Um, so I was like, well, I can't come back to work, you know, so bye-bye. Um, then I went full-time in life insurance, and I think for me that's when everything changed.

Everything. You sold $367K that year. Is that right? Uh, is that '24 you did that?

I think I might have done my math wrong. It was $390,000. It was just shy of $400,000. I almost made a Hall of Fame and I was so mad. But yeah, from March of 2024 to the end of that year, I almost hit Hall of Fame, which is— I mean, it changed, it changed my life.

Yeah, that's good. How much of it did you keep? I always ask because there's always comments that go, yeah, but everyone cancels and there's no money in it. You're selling final expense, right?

Are you doing it then? Then I— yeah, I was running for the most part. I was running. Yeah. Okay, cool.

Okay, dope. Yeah. So how much of that did you keep? Call it $400K. You know, you're a numbers girl, you must ballpark it.

Yeah, um, I kept that year— kept's a loose word because I spent a lot on personal things.

Okay, how much got deposited? How about that? Let's go with that.

$290K.

Okay, dope. And leads, what do you, where do you run out? What do you push on leads?

It was $4,000 a month.

So, okay, so $50K. So you netted $220, $230, $240, whatever it is. Yeah, which is more than you were bringing in as a household before because I saw one of your videos. Yeah, that said like y'all were making, yeah, I think $160 and couldn't pay your bills or something. I saw something.

Yeah, and, and it was like a lot of money, but like my kids' daycare loan for one month was like, it's for $3,000 a month for daycare for 2 kids. So it doesn't matter how much money you make, that's so expensive. Then add in your rent and your bills, and like, I was like, I'm— I'm— for people that know me, I've never been afraid to work for what I want, but it was driving me crazy that I didn't have a vehicle to like do the work in, you know what I mean? Like, I didn't know where to go to make the money that I wanted to make. So when I found this, it was like prayer answered because I now was able to because I wanted to go on vacations. Like, I want to spoil my kids. I want to buy a house. We rented forever. Last year I missed convention because we bought our first house because we were closing. So I'm like, hell yeah, insane, amazing. Um, so it's just, it's, it's just been unreal. And, you know, I now, you know, there's, it's a roller coaster still. There's great days and bad days, but I just learned to stay even keel, you know. I could never do anything else because there's nowhere I could be in my home office, some days in my pajamas, and make the kind of money I do, you know what I mean? And get my kids and be lunch mom and, and take the day off and go downtown and go shop. Like, it's just not possible.

Not possible. Crazy. I think, you know, when you start looking at anything on social, it follows you, right? So your videos have stalked me for a couple days. Uh, I saw one on— I saw one on— I think it was yours on TikTok this morning. I think you said it was something like, more people should show this And it was like you made an obnoxious number of phone calls and sold like a $30 app or something. I don't remember what exactly it said.

That was it. No, that was it. Yeah.

How many dials was it that day? Do you remember? It was a lot.

It was a ton. And the way I actually do it is— and this was always taught for me from when I go, so I talk about it a lot— my days have to be 1,000 points.

I was hoping you talked about this. This is really cool. Yeah, go ahead.

Yeah, 1,000 points. 1,000 points. And if you're an agent in this business and you want to make money, you need to be hitting 1,000 points because this business is literally just an activities game, a math game. Yes. And then like, if you can control your activity, the rest is going to follow. So 1,000 points, a call is 1 point, a presentation is 100, and a close is 100. So my goal, even today, 2 years later, I still hit 1,000 points a day. Don't care. Um, it's just I, I still do. Yeah. Yep. So the other day, this was actually Monday, this was just like recently, and I still crybaby and it's, it's just normal. I did 469 dials, but I did 6 presentations. So I presented to 6 people and 5 of them told me something, which, that, that's not 600 points and 4, 6, you're still over 1,000.

In that case.

Yeah. And then I— and then it was like 7 o'clock at night and I was like, yeah, I've hit my 1,000 points, like I got bodied. And I was like, no, we're not going to give up. And then that last like hour of dialing, that's when I found someone who was a lead from November. So an aged lead, right? And it just so happened that the timing was right and I wrote them and it was only $30 a month. So it wasn't like anything huge. It was 300 and something AP. But you know, some days it's like that and then some months I submit 12 grand.

It's like, in order— some days it's obnoxious.

Yeah, yeah. And some weeks are obnoxious, and, and then it's like 2 weeks of crickets. But you won't get back to the $12,000 day unless you survive the very quiet ones, you know? And I think I hear people talk about it all the time. It's like, just outlast. And I think it was, um, it was Andrew Taylor. I say this a lot because it really just sticks with me. He's like, I sucked. I was not the best salesperson, ask anyone, but I just worked hard. I just worked more hours, I dialed more people, and like inevitably I did more deals. And I'm like, yeah, I love that because I think it is so true. And even to this day, I get on and I'm very much in the trenches, if you will, with my team. I'm still on Zoom, I'm still on mute, I still present, and I laugh every single day because I get 10, 15 people that answer like, I didn't do this. And then they tell me, you know, whatever. And I'm like, I'm in the same boat as you. Keep going, keep going, you know? And then you find them, which I think is good because a lot of times, and I don't know if you can relate, but a lot of times I think in 1099 commission sales, it can feel very emotional. Like your outcome feels very emotional when you're getting told like, fuck off 500 times, or you're not interested, or you go a couple of days without sales. Like you feel like it's like you. Like you're down on yourself, you're feeling very emotional. But this is not an emotional business. It is very much like a— this is very much a math business. So that's why I always feel like dials, conversations, presentations, applications, and your income. So, you know, as a new agent, it's not close more deals, it's just get to the next step. Like dial, get someone to talk to. When you talk to them, maybe you'll run a presentation. If you run a presentation, maybe you're going to close. So I just like to make that a visual so we can like feel things based on facts, not feel things based on our emotions. Because when you have that, I feel like that's when people kind of fall off.

All right, guys, if you'd like to attend my office 2-day workshop event that we put on 2 or 3 times a year, spend 2 full days, deep dive into everything you need to know to be successful in the space, whether you're selling or whether you want to build an agency, whether you want to learn how to run a staff, recruit, sell at a high level, whatever it is, we dive into it. Again, workshop style. So super interactive. I run them every 2 or 3 times a year. There is a waitlist. If you go to johnwetmore.com/workshop, you can put in your information and we will let you know when the next one is. There are 2 levels only. There's a basic ticket, you sit in the back of the room and you can attend. But the executive ticket is access to a private mastermind at my house where we have a full dinner. We spend 3 or 4 hours there as well, engaging with each other and learning at a deeper level, a little bit closer-knit. So if you want to be at the next one, register link later. Yeah, 100%. I like it. I saw it this morning. I'm, I'm a complete numbers nerd. Like, I'm, I'm a complete dork with it. Um, and at some point during this, we'll send— I wrote a book on that side. I'll send it to you. It's all number stuff. So I'll, I'll— you'll, you'll— I'll send you one. We send everybody that does the podcast a little package, but you'll get it. And it's— I learned— so what I try to teach my team is that we get paid per phone call. Not per close. Yeah, because I figured out what I make per phone call.

Yeah.

And so I do something similar. I like the points, it's kind of unique. I just tell people to prospect and present for 40 hours a week, and I do a minute per phone call and an hour per presentation and 20 minutes per recruiting call. So I'm like, if you do 40— so we track hours based on dials and presentations, which is same concept. You're doing literally the same thing, you just turn into points, which is way cooler than ours. Um, So yeah, I'm gonna, I'm gonna start sharing that shit with my team. And it's— but it's wild even doing it that way. The average agent struggles hitting basic numbers, but they feel like they're doing a ton, you know.

I feel like— I'll give some examples. Like, I feel like people put off dialing, like, because they know they have to do it. Like, that's what's going to get them a sale, and it feels scary. They, they subconsciously or maybe purposely put it off. Like, I know people who will, like, spend all day trying to get their leads in RAINY, and I'm like, it's been 5 hours. Like, we should be dialing. Please start. You know what I mean? Like, please don't worry about that. Don't worry about reading XYZ. Like, just start dialing the phone, you know? I like to suggest to agents getting a CRM. I know that is an extra expense, but there's a couple of reasons why it's easier to track your, like, activity. It records your phone calls, which I think is super important, but also it makes it super easy. Like, I have GoHighLevel and I just pay for the Wave inside of it. Wave Dollar, 3-line dollar, $150 a month, and that just cranks through. And I rotate my numbers once a month. I check them to make sure they're not spam, so we're all good. And I feel like that just helps get through because I'll sit here with my headset on and, I don't know, draw on my whiteboard, listen to some music, and then I'm like in it, you know what I mean? So it's not hard. I feel like when you are picking up your phone and hand dialing, I feel like it is a lot easier to get sidetracked because if you do need to do something, you can't do something and dial the next lead. But if you have it on your head side, it's just ringing, going, yeah. And when somebody answers, it's like, hey. So I think that that makes it easier. Um, but yeah, people put it off and then— and I don't know why. Like, just if you can like get used to the fact that you're going to have to dial every single day for as long as you're in this business, it'll, it'll get less scary. Like, in the beginning, I didn't want to dial the phone. Someone would give me an objection, I'd hang up. Like, I didn't know what I was doing, you know?

For sure.

Yeah, for sure. But like, eventually it doesn't feel scary anymore when you've closed a couple and you're like starting to understand your products and you're feeling kind of confident in what you're doing. It's not scary anymore. So, but you can't get there unless you start here. So like, just start here and try to get it done as quick as possible, you know, just Buzz through it, be done with it. That's how I feel. Like, we can drag this out or we can do it, you know what I mean, short. I would prefer to do that because you're trying to make money, right? Right. Okay, let's do that. So that's the way I kind of look at it.

Mhm.

Like it.

And how many, um— no, go ahead, please finish your thought.

Finish it. Oh, I was just gonna say, I think from a mentor standpoint too, because I actually did personal producing for my first year and a half. Why? I managed 30 people. I had 30 people texting me, calling me, needing me all day long for 7 years. Like, this was the first time I could just like sit down and focus on me and like tune out the noise and like just focus on me. So I loved it. I was making so much money, I didn't care. I was like, why would I want a team? This is easy. Everybody's got to work, you know, so this is fine. And then finally I was like, I had some agents that came to me actually from, from someone else, not, not an FFL, and they're in a lot of debt. They're like, this person didn't help us. They just told us it was the leads, buy more leads, buy more leads, buy more leads, but never gave us feedback, never heard us, never anything. And now we're $20 grand in debt. And I was like, what? I was like, I have never been in debt in this business. I mean, in the beginning I took out a small loan, but ever since I paid that off, I've never been in debt. I've always been profitable. So to me, I was like shook.. And it was, you know, so then I brought them on and I turned it around to where they were producing the 20 to 30 quickly a month. And I was like, wait a second, I think I can do this. I actually can do this. And this is great. This feels really good. So that's when I started recruiting. But right now I don't have a big team. I have about 10 agents. Um, but it gets kind of hard for me, in my opinion, to like train them really well when there's too many. Because I, I do have leaders, like I have one that's always willing to help, but I, in the beginning, I want to be the one to train them. Um, so I don't move very quick, um, because I want to teach them how to write at a high level. I want them to be profitable. But from a mentorship standpoint, why I drill these points is because, you know, instead of like an agent saying leads suck or people aren't buying, we can really just kind of see where you need help when you're doing 1,000 points. Because if you're tracking everything, you know, if you're getting low conversions, like low pickups, it could be your number, it could be a dialing problem. Like, are we dialing enough enough, right? If you're getting low presentations, maybe it's an objection problem. It's like a phone skill problem in the beginning, in your intro, you can't get through it, right? If you're getting low applications from high presentations and low apps, well, we've got a presenting problem, you know what I mean? So it's like, it's very clear where somebody's at if you're tracking it. If you're not tracking it, who knows? You know, I don't know what's going on. So that's why I will ride and die for that 1,000 points.

I love that idea. What do you do? What do you tell the people that aren't tracking it? How do you handle those? Because I know they don't, don't all— there's no way unless you got, got it all figured out. Like, if you get one that comes to you and they just won't, they just suck at it, how do you handle it? Just let it, let loose.

So if I have an agent where I have— because when I like talk to people about the business, like, I do not overglorify it. I tell them how hard it is. Like, like, this is what is required. If you are not willing to file 8 to 10 hours a day and spend money every single week? Like, please no. Like, because this is not gonna work, you know. I can help you do it if you do this. And then we have this conversation, then they join the team, and then they're not doing that. Um, I'll say it's like kind of like a rule of 3. Like, first time I'll like say something like, hey, like, how's everything going? Like, I'm not seeing your numbers. Like, are you tracking things? And they're like, no. And then I'm like, okay, well, are you writing any business? No. Okay, so let's do this. Let's get back to it. This is why we do it. So let's do it. And then after that, honestly, I don't say anything because if you don't want to listen to me and then you're not selling, I've got so many people that do want my help and do need my time that I'm not even going to give it to you or focus on you. Like, figure it out on your own. And they kind of fall out. They fall out. They weed themselves out of the business. Truthfully, I try. You know, I text and I stay on it and I like train on it and we talk about it and like we're all on Zoom together. But you know, you can lead a horse to water, they say, right? But not everybody, not everybody will do it.

Don't be scared to say it. You should say it just like that. You hesitated to like put it out there. I'm like, I was, I could feel it coming, and that's how it should be, you know what I mean? It's like, why, why should you go out of your way for someone that's not doing the basics? Yeah, or like, I just, you know, especially when you explain it up front what it requires. That's what I love about it. And it's so simple, your concept. It's really easy. I like that.

Thank you. There's no shortcuts. Like, I know people want to come in and they think that they have a better way to do this and they can like, they can skip A, B, and C and go right to D, right? That, that's possible. Well, don't you think, John, if it was, we would all do it that way? Don't you think? Like, so it's like sometimes people want to reinvent the wheel and they want to take a shortcut to a skill. But like, life insurance sales is a skill. Yes, it's about activity, but along the way there's a skill, and you need that skill. Because if you go in and you buy a fresh lead and you are a brand new day one agent I always tell people this— time or money. You need time or money. What do I mean? You either need time to rip through 1,000 dials a day on an aged lead. You know, there's going to be some laydowns in there. There will. But honestly, you probably aren't going to sell much in the beginning. That's to be expected. You know, you're learning a skill. Or if you don't want to sit there and dial like that and you have money, you can go ahead and buy $1,000 of fresh leads, get 30 fresh leads in a week. Just because as a brand new agent you buy 30 fresh leads does not mean you're going to close.

Uh-uh.

It does not mean you're going to close anybody. What it means is you're going to get through your learning curve quicker because you're going to get to talk to people quicker. So you're going to get to a spot where you can make money quicker. But you buying that fresh lead is not going to make you money. But if you want to, be my guest, you know what I mean?

So yeah, I love it.

That's kind of one of those ones where it's like, you know, I recommend we start here and then once your skill is there, I'll tell you to go here. But if you just want to skip this and you want to go here, that's fine. Just know it's still going to take the same 30 to 60 days till you're in momentum and making money because you're not really going to know what you're doing and they're going to be able to hear that.

So yeah, guy who mentored me, he, he would always remind us, he goes, new leads don't make you good, number one. And number two, if you go that route, cool, it's just going to be an expensive education.

Yeah, I love that. I love that. And I will clip that and play on repeat and repeat and repeat because it's so true. And either one of those things are going to make you money, that much money, I should say, in your first 30 to 60 days. But you've got to learn the skill. You cannot skip the steps. Like, I run Fresh Leads now. You know, I'm at a point where I'm able to invest, right? We have a Facebook, they come in and go HighLevel. You know, I spend $200 a day., sometimes more. Yep. I still get my butt handed to me by those people, you know what I mean? And they just filled it out. They just said they want to be called.

And a lot of them don't pick up still, and they ghost you and ignore you and pretend they didn't do it. It's still—

that shit still happens. That guy I closed Monday was a fresh lead in November that told me to kick rocks over and over and over, and now in March he wanted it. Well, somebody might have bought him on a lead platform, aged, and then closed them. So I don't think there's a difference between like an aged and a fresh, like, you know what I mean? It's just like people where you're going to get objections. Yeah. Where you're going to get objections. An aged lead, you're going to get objections right away. I didn't do this. Oh, I already got it. Take me off your list. A fresh lead is going to let you talk and they're going to let you get through that. Then you're going to give them options. I'm going to shop around or, oh, I wasn't ready yet. I just wanted info. So you're still going to get objections with both. It's just where you're going to— Yeah.

And to be real, if someone fills out a new one, They ain't confused. When you put your number on the internet, people are going to call. So a lot of them fuckers don't— they know to not answer their phone after they fill it out. 4 seconds after they fill it out, they definitely try to avoid the call. I mean, again, it's easier to get the laydowns and you find it. I play the— I would only play the new game, new lead game also. But yeah, it— I don't think it's as glorious as, as, as the agents working age leads think it is.

No, we gotta grind. Yeah. And I remember being a new agent. I started on bronze and silver, and then I remember complaining to Nicolette, ah, these people, I don't want to work with these people. She goes, okay. So she bought me fresh ethos. Okay. She brought— she bought me fresh ethos. She gave them to me, and I ran through, and I got humbled so quickly talking to 35, 40-year-old, 50-year-old people, working class, with-it people, when I didn't know what I was It was the most humbling experience. I said, never mind, I will call those bronze and silver. Sally down the road, she's a lot better than this one. So it's just like, I thought I knew it all too. And then I got humbled and I went back to what I was supposed to be doing, followed the steps, and here I am. So the agents that work with me that do well, ego goes bye-bye, ideas go bye-bye. And they, and they like are a good teacher or a good student. I'm teacher, they're the student. They're a good student. They just do what they're told. They track the things they're supposed to, spend the money they're supposed to, and it works.

Crazy. I like your concept. I don't know exactly how you said it, but you know, with the idea people, I always go like, do you think between all of us we hadn't thought of that before and tried it?

Right? Like, you really— I, you know, I'm like And you can have that conversation 10 times over and they don't hear you. So I just throw my hands up sometimes. I'm like, what? Let them, let them.

You want to do it?

I told you, you know, 10 times, go for it, go for it. And those people just weed themselves out, you know what I mean? And that's fine. It's not a good fit and that's okay. This business is not for everybody.

Leads are the same way. I mean, leads aren't all a good fit. Fit. So it's why all agents be a good fit. The way you work leads is honestly, quite frankly, it's the same way. The same way you work leads is how you should work with agents. It's like, see if there's something there, and if there's not, move the F on. Yeah, there's nothing wrong with it. Nothing wrong with your thought process at all. And no, I'll say this, the being slow thing, like, and being intentional. I've worked with Andrew for a long time. I've known him for 15 years or however long Yeah, and you know the size of his group. He's a behemoth and he's a savage. He started out really slow, like his team was not at the beginning. He was, he was nowhere near the biggest team in FFL for the first few years, you know, but super intentional, smart as shit, and just, and now his group just crazy. Yeah, it's bananas. Yeah. So what up, y'all? So YouTube memberships, we have one now, right? Next to the subscribe button, there's a neon white join button. You can't miss it. Subscribe, whatever it says, click the link, get in there. I do a ton of coaching, teaching people how to dial, corrections, working on their presentations, working on their mindset. I will coach on theory, but I like coaching real world stuff. And if you join the membership section, you're going to see live coaching where I am not only helping people, but every once in a while I get in there and dial myself. There's some cool videos coming out, tons of content, all All the training videos will be directly on my YouTube channel that's available to members only. Super easy to find. So join now if you're interested. Click below. See you in there.

It's crazy. And then it's like, I love when people are like, if it's so easy or not so easy, if you make so much money, why wouldn't everybody do it? I'm like, I don't know.

You know what's funny? I saw a meme yesterday that said The gym works really easy too, but not everybody does that.

I posted a TikTok and they said, what did I say? Here, let me try to find it really quick. It got some— it was, it was controversial, but in a good way. Serious? Yeah. Here it says, if selling life insurance works so well, why doesn't everyone do it? And then it says the gym works too, but look around you.

Oh, that was you that did that? No shit. I told you your shit's been stalking me. I didn't know that was you that said that. That's freaking hilarious. I literally just watched that yesterday or the day before. Yeah, I did not realize that was you. Oh, I love it. That was one of my favorite things of the week. I'm like, I'm stealing that.

This business is so easy, it's hard. Like, it's so easy, it's hard. It's really easy. Like, it's so easy. The leads are there, the script is there, the carriers are there. You just gotta do it, and that part's hard. Nobody— everybody wants to change their life, everybody wants to make a lot of money. Nobody wants to do the work that's required to make a lot of money, to have freedom. You know, I also get a lot of people, and I don't know how you handle this or if you still have— if you're still growing, you know, width instead of depth, but I get a lot of people that are like, yeah, so, and, and I'm a mom, right? So I'm kind of in this, like, I went to ASU a long time ago, I'm a mom of two, I'm 30, so I don't fit in with the 21-year-olds. And, and I'm also like like, not sure how I feel about having a lot of moms. I love moms, moms are amazing, but not all moms are the same. Like, I have some moms and they're like me and they're great. Then I get on calls with people who are like, yeah, so I've got kids at home. And I'm like, okay, great, like, what's the schedule? Are they daycare, school? Like, what's the plan? And they're like, well, I can do like 30-ish hours a week. I'm like, great, what are your time blocks? Well, maybe like 2 hours here and maybe there. And I'm like, honestly, I, I want to be napping. Yeah, yeah. I'm like, I'm gonna be completely honest with you, this is just not a good fit. Maybe you can find somebody that, that says it is and maybe go with them, but for me, this is just not going to work. I've said that to people before. I've seen that it doesn't work. I've babysat my, my sister's baby trying to dial, and that I know doesn't work. So I was like, I just like don't want to lie to you, you know what I mean? I don't want to be the one that says, oh yeah, anybody can do this, because the truth is you actually You can't, you know. Yeah. So I don't know. You know, for me, it's like I used to tell people part-time worked because I did come from part-time, but I'm like a very different— I'm not like a 20-hour-a-week part-time. I was like, nobody had to say, Mary, where are you? Mary, why aren't you on? Like, I work 90 hours willingly. I was there. I was blowing up Nicolette's phone on a Sunday because nobody was on Zoom, but I was working and I needed her. Blowing her up. No one had to worry about me. So if that's your part-time, I'm in. But I usually will only work with full-time people because it just, it just takes a lot, you know, to get where you want to go, to make the money you want to make. It takes a lot of time.

Yeah, it does. It doesn't— I started part-time too, but it's most hours more.

You were an accountant and like numbers guy, and then you started this part-time, and then that was— it was in-home, right?

Yeah, yeah. So yeah, I would do it. I would drive to people's houses after work 2 nights a week. I would call on Sundays, and then I would go see people Monday and Tuesday nights after work, and then I would do it. I would call again on Thursday and Friday at work, and I would go see people all day Saturday.

That's crazy. That's crazy. That's crazy. I don't think I— I'm not sure. I'm, I'm not sure I would be where I'm at if we still had to go and call.

That's all we knew. There was no one ever thought of over the phone. Like, that didn't even— it wasn't even a possibility. The technology just wasn't a thing.

There was no e-app. No, there was. Yeah. How did you fill out the application?

With a piece of paper, and then we had to scan it. And when I first started in the business, I'll tell you this, this is how fucking old I am, and I have not— I've been doing it like 15 years. When I very first, the very, very, very beginning, There was a couple carriers where I remember, uh, Mike, the guy who mentored me, we would have to give him and he would FedEx the stuff to the carrier. But that was for like 4 seconds and it was one carrier. For all of 2012, '13, '14, '15, for sure, it was all, uh, you write a paper app and then you go home at night and you had to scrub your apps, meaning you had to make sure you filled out everything right, and then you had to scan it in. And send it and email it or fax it. There was a phase where you faxed them, then it went to email, and then it went to upload. And then they— I remember when AmeriCo came out with their e-app, we were all like, holy shit, it's the best thing ever.

Yeah, I'm just at a loss of words.

Yeah, I used to have to literally get a check, like a physical check, and I would staple it to the paperwork in the house or paperclip it or whatever. And I'd go home— if you go home with 4, 5, 6 apps, you get home at 10, 11, 12 o'clock at night, then you would literally have to undo all the papers you did because we didn't fill out the entire paperwork in the house. I'm not writing their address down and all that shit because I have it all. It's just sign here, check these boxes, whatever. So you'd have to go home and finish the paperwork. And when you send it in, if you missed a check— but like, now you can't mess up an e-app because it's like you can't hit continue if you don't finish. Well, you can certainly mess up paper if you sign in the wrong place, if you put a date wrong, if you check— if you miss a box. If you do, they would make you used to do amendments and go back and get them resigned. It was a shit show. It was a shit show. Yeah, so I used to spend 2 or 3 hours a night scrubbing apps after I sold. Yeah. Oh dude, it was a nightmare. It was a nightmare.

Oh no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

Yeah, now it's— so that's why y'all is like easy. You have no idea how easy this is. It's such an easy game now.

It's just taken off.

It's stupid easy. It is. Yeah, I just tell people, it's— I always— I'd say it every day, I'm like, easy game, you just got to play it right. Most people are playing it wrong.

Just follow the play. Not even play right, just follow the play. You do the— do what we say, follow the play. You know, it's crazy. That's crazy. That's crazy that you did that. And you started building a team, getting people to go in people's houses.

That's all we did until COVID.

Hey, come on over.

Yeah, COVID. And we were going into houses during COVID still. That was the— that was the start of the change though. Whatever year. I don't remember what year that was, but 20— what, 2021? I don't fucking remember. But up till that point, we were— 95% of people were still going into homes even though eApps were still there at the— they had started at that point, right? But you'd go into the house and you do the eApp. We were not—

I feel like the only positive, at least in my head, which I don't know if it was this way, it's like it'd be a lot harder to get an objection when you're literally right there.

It's hard. It's— you don't get no— like, and we all booked appointments for the most part. I mean, you can door knock and shit for sure and show up on people that don't answer the phone, but the overwhelming majority of us, we dial on Monday, book appointments on Tuesday, Wednesday, then we dial again Thursday and run Friday, Saturday. That was basically the schedule of everyone in FFL.

They were expecting life insurance and they were like—

they thought it's hard for them to— yeah, they can't just hang up on you. So you still got— yeah, shows, but it was like 25% no-show. You— not now. If you try to book appointments, fucking 90% don't show up naturally, you know. You try to one-call close them. Yeah, so yeah, it's a different game. And I always say this though, the ones— here's what I've learned, and this is— this will be for you because it'll happen to you too in just a new way. One day you're gonna tell stories about how you used to have to do it, I promise you. Because the people before me tell their war stories where they used to have to go fucking debit routes and read about that one day. Um, But like, the people that have done the best over the years just really keep their head on a swivel and they adapt to change really, really easily, easily and smoothly. Because it will change again. Something big will change, you know. Um, it's, it's always going to change. People are going to think of new things and technology and opportunities and the way we get leads, all that shit. It, it all— it's changed several times over the years, you know.

Yeah, yeah. So yeah. I think that's why it's important too in this business. This isn't even like sales related, but like something I'm forcing myself to do is like make sure you put away your money or you're smart with it or you invest it or you do something while you're making this money because you really never know what the future holds. I mean, people need life insurance. They're always going to need life insurance. But you also need to be smart when you're making this kind of cash. You know what I mean? You got to, you got to invest so that way someday, you know, just like everybody else, if you want to retire, you can. You know, otherwise what are you gonna do?

You don't want to end up like a lead in $1,200 a month Social Security. That always motivated me because I'm like, if I don't do something, that's my future. No, I'm good. I ain't— uh-uh. I don't want to be that guy.

No, I, I don't want to be that guy. Or when they say they lost everything, or I'm like, I don't want to be that guy either. Anyway, so that's why I always just work, work, work, work, work, work, and just try to figure it out.

Let's talk about— since you've been in sales forever, and now obviously this is sales to some— Sean Mike would argue we don't do sales, we take orders, like, you know what I mean? It is what it is, but clearly it's sales. Um, give them some— say, give us some sales stuff, whatever you want, you pick. Phone stuff, just word tracks, intentionality, mindset, I don't care at all. Literally, you— whatever you want to talk about sales-specific.

I feel like there's a, there's a couple different things. I mean, some just like random tips and tricks that I use. Let's start there. Have you heard? I'm sure you know what Crankwheel is, right?

I've never used it, but I have heard of it. Yes, I do. I know what it does.

Yes. So that's a big one. Crankwheel is a big one because we're on the phones even with a fresh lead, right? You're going to get those people who are like, I don't want to give you my social. I'm like, sure, I get it. You know what I mean? Yeah, I get it. And I don't typically like to go, well, that's why I gave you my license. Like, I don't like to go that route either. So I'm like, yeah, no worries. And I take a second and I get Crankwheel up. And I text them over and I don't say, hey, I'm texting you, Elaine, to see my screen, because that bugs them out. They're like, no. Yeah, now it's what I'm doing. I'm like, hey, I just texted you, did you see it? And they're like, oh my God, it's from a 301 number, let me know when you see it. They're like, I see it. I'm like, okay, great, go ahead and click it. Again, giving them an order, not can you go ahead and love it, go ahead and click it. And then they click it and then they see the app. And now I'm going to try to rebuttal their objection. I'm not going to try to—

you don't fight them first. You just go. I like that a lot.

Yeah, I just go. So I send it. They're looking at them. See, look at Kathy. This is everything working on. Yeah, this mutual of Omaha, everything here on the left with green check. That's what we gone through. Putting your info here. Now, obviously, I know nothing wrong with being secure, but this is how they're going to make sure it's you. So if you die, that they're, they're going to pay a claim on the right person, but also how they're going to make sure you're healthy. So what's your social? So what's your social? And then they're like, And they give it to me and they can see me typing it. I just let them stay on the app the whole time. At that point, I don't care. Sometimes they get out, sometimes they don't. But after that, if they see what you're doing, you don't really get any objections. Because when it comes to effective date, I'm like, okay, perfect, you want it to fit. So then I go down to the bottom, like, okay, initial payment 4/5/2026. Okay, recurring this date. Is that right, Kathy? It says it right on there. Yeah. Okay. I'm like getting her to tell me she sees what I'm doing and then I'm like, okay, great. Checking or savings. Boom. And I get it like that. So I feel like when I started using Crinkle— I've been using it for years, um, honestly since the beginning.

They see it pretty good on their phone, clearly, right? It's not a mobile. You don't make them get on the computer, literally on their phone.

Yeah, the text. Yeah. And it's right there. Boom. I think it's $30 a month. Um, I think that that's super helpful, um, for like objections. Um, another thing I think when I first started This is maybe one of those stories of like how I used to do it, and this is really bad, but when I started, I was with people that are no longer here, but they taught you to— they didn't teach anything.

Do dumb shit.

Dumb shit. I won't even go into details. Just dumb shit, right? And there was no like figure— like you had someone on the phone, they were telling you what's wrong with them, and you had to guess what carrier was going to work. You know, you didn't really know what to do. So then you do it, and then they get declined.. And then you have to do another one and another one, another one. 6 months later you're like, oh, okay. But instead, something I use, I focus a lot on teaching my team a lot is underwriting. I'm a big— like, people always come to me. I'm a nerd. Like, they're like, they're on this med, this med, this med. Can they do this? I'm like, no. Can they do this? This, this? Which one? I'm like, this one. So I know products and underwriting really well because I like use— what I like to use, I know we have Integrity Connect now. I'll be honest, I'm a creature of habit. I've been using Toolkits for so long that I just won't take the time to learn anything new. I'm sure it's great, but Toolkits, if you people are watching and they don't use insurance Toolkits, pay the $30 a month for it because you're going through your needs analysis. Some people are like, oh, type it in. Like, what medical conditions do you have? I don't need medication names, just what's going on. I don't do that. I'm like, you're on medications? Great. What are they? And I take the names and I pop it right in and I hit get quote. And it's no longer a guessing game.

It's like, yeah, boom, you can— their shit checks the medicines also. It's not just checking the health stuff, correct?

Yeah, it's not just by code. There's like lists of medications. Yeah, some medications are knockouts for sure. So I think underwriting is really important to kind of get it right the first time. But what I think is important is not to be like every person on the phone. And so what I do and the way I try to explain it, because I feel like an objection you get is like when you're telling them options, I feel like a lot of people in the back of their minds wonder, is this really the best one? Like, is this really the best? Or like, maybe you don't even explain term and whole life and you're quoting on $40,000, but in their head they're like, ooh, but why did I see $500,000?

I saw that shit on TV. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

What kind of life insurance is that? I don't think I want to go with this right now because I want to figure this out, but I'm not going to tell you that, but I'm thinking that. So it's like, how can you figure that part out. So typically what I tell people is I just like, after I just like say who I am, what I'm doing, and I give them my name and license number, I just say it doesn't matter who I work with, I have 3 goals. I keep it super simple. Goal 1 is just figure out which insurance company is going to approve you. Um, and then I say we work with over X amount in the state of state that, that we have, but they don't all accept the same medications, health conditions, things like that. So figure out who's going to approve you. 2, make sure it's affordable, because you can talk about coverage all day long, but if you can't afford it, you know, it's not really going to hold any water, right? And I make them be like, oh yeah, yeah. And I'm like, 3, we're gonna get you as much coverage as possible for what you can qualify for and afford. The reason I'm able to do this is our underwriting software syncs up to every carrier's underwriting here in the state of. So when I put in your info, it's going to show me all the carriers that would approve you. But then it's going to list them from least expensive to most because I'm always trying to make sure I'm getting you the best bang for your buck. Does that make sense, John Wetmore? He's like, yeah. So I'm already telling him, like, he— like, what I'm doing and that I work with all the carriers. And then it's like, well, you can qualify for it. I'll get you as much as possible. I'm going to look at all the carriers. I'm doing the shopping. And then I have them tell me it makes sense. And then I usually like to ask if I can do those things, is there any reason you would not apply for a policy like that? And I will not move forward unless they say yes. It's got to be a yes.

But a lot of times— what if they push back a little right there? How do you handle it?

Yeah, I mean, well, Well, it really just has to do with price. Yeah, John, that's exactly why we're going to make sure we're only looking at things in your budget because your budget is going to be different than anybody else. You know, per month, John, what's a ballpark budget that you have for this? Like $200 to $150? $150 to $100? Under $100 realistically? Where are we at? Okay. Yep. That's what we're going to look at. So, or it's like, ah, you know, I'd have to talk to my wife. Oh, I got you, John. Yeah, it'd be kind of weird if you didn't talk to your wife. Do you guys usually handle this stuff together? Yeah, you know what, let's do this. My husband and I would do the same things the same way. What time are you guys going to be home and settled? So I already know that I can't close him without her, and I know that right then and there. So now I'm going to do it rather than shoot myself in the foot, get to the end, and him say, well, I can't make a decision without her. I— that's my problem. I didn't ask. I didn't ask the right questions, you know what I mean? So I feel like any reason that they'd give you an objection is they're going to give it to you right then and there so you can handle it, um, to the best of your ability. You know, sometimes people are If they're kind of iffy, I'm just going to go for it because it might not matter what I say. You might just not be able to close them. But then it's important to hear what they're telling you and why they want it. And then I always try to make them talk to me about their pain points. I like ask questions to get them to answer me, to like admit what the pain point is, like problem aware, problem aware. So now I got the solution. Now we're solution aware. So now it's like so undeniable that you need this. So let's make sure you can get approved for it. Which one do you want to do? You know, that's kind of how I handle everything. I'm very direct.

Like, one thing about me, me, I tell me the 3 again with the 3 things you're going to do today. What do you, what you qualify for? Just give me the overview.

Figure out who's going to approve you. Figure out which carrier is going to approve you to make sure it's affordable, something that works for your budget. And 3, get you as much coverage as possible for whatever you can qualify for and afford. And then I end it with like, I'm able to do that because my underwriting software shows everybody.

Makes sense. Yeah, it's fine. Yeah, I like asking it. I, I certainly— we always explain, but I don't, I don't go 1, 2, 3, and will you do it? I, I like that.

Like, is there any reason if I can do that you wouldn't? Yeah, because why am I gonna go, you know what I mean? Let's figure out this reason right now before we, we do this.

What if— what about the guy at the random— this is to help the overthinkers— like the guy that's like, I mean, it all sounds good, dude, but I'm really just shopping around. I just really want to prices first. How do you handle that right there?

Yeah, no worries, John. So I'll actually show you as when we get to the end of this, I'll go ahead and share my screen here with you. That way you can see all the carriers. That way, you know, I am doing all the shopping for you and these are just numbers on a paper. So honestly, at the end of the day, just because we see the best rate doesn't mean you're even going to qualify for it. So we're going to submit an application to make sure you can even have this. If not, we got to go to plan B, C, D, and F until we get you approved. Does that make sense? And then I go through it and then crink wheel, crink wheel. I send it to them. Yep. And I show them, listen, John, here's your state, here it is, your height, your weight, your meds. And I hit get quote. And look at John, Mutual of Omaha isn't going to approve you. Why? You had a heart attack. If ever had a heart attack, decline. So that's why. So you can't— it's not like shopping for a car. You can't just go around. It's not like that. Insurance is going to be plus or minus $5 to $8. Like, it's really not going to be crazy. Crazy, you know. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna pitch the best carrier from the start, and I just show them, because I feel like, again, one of those things are, is like, you know, your script is like psychology of the sale. Like, the way you say it has them really like envisioning you doing things, you know. That's like how they stay with it. Well, if you can add the visual to the, like, story, I feel like that really closes it. So when I show them Crinkwheel and I show them that that's it, you know what I mean? They're like, oh yeah, okay, she's right, she is showing me everything. And here are all the carriers that are grayed out that actually wouldn't approve me. I see why.

For those of you follow— that have followed me for a while, you know I've, I've helped build this agency up to over $200 million in paid annual premium per year. We have over 5,000 agents a year that sell, and I am rebuilding. We're building a new base shop, helping people build big agencies, get to multi-seven figures in income, or producers that want to, that want to just sell and get to a multi-six-figure sales career, hit me up. I'm hiring direct. I'm looking to train and mentor winners that want to work their ass off and build something dope. Click on the link below or you can go to JohnWetmore.com/join and put in your application. We'll see if I'd be interested in working with you. DM me, hit me up, whatever you like. So if you're doing your 1,000 points a day, you got to be presenting probably 20 to 30 times a week, I'm guessing. Somewhere in that range. Yeah. How many times do you think you use CrankWheel out of the— call it 20 times a week— how many times will you use it, you think?

19.

Shut up. All the time. Use it on a majority.

Yeah. And it's like one of those things, like, why would I not? Like, why would I not? The reason why is like, I— like, I, I just think it like kind of takes up your legitimacy. Like, I am an insurance professional. One thing about me is I know everything about everything when it comes to insurance. For the for the most part. Like, I know underwriting guides front and back, who you're gonna get, who you're not gonna get. Like, this is just the way it is.

So that's a must-do for you, essentially. That's not like, oh shit, let me use that as a get-me-out-of-a-hole thing.

Wow, nobody's ever taken the time to show me this the way you did. Yeah, that's it.

I've heard crank wheel. I've never heard anyone use it other than, oh shit, let me prove it kind of method versus just use it as an everyday tool. That's cool.

Yeah, I love it. I send the link and I'm like, listen, like, these are whatever, you know? And then I go, okay, I'm gonna jump into the application. I go through and they can see what I'm doing. I just feel like legitimizes what you're doing because people are cautious on a phone. Sure. And they're hoping you are who you say you are.

So does it let you see their phone too to help with the PIN and shit, or no? It doesn't do that. If they can't figure out the PIN code and all that, does Crankwheel do like, you know, the other way?

No, what I do is, um, uh, what I do is I FaceTime them. So if they have an iPhone, I FaceTime them and then I show them how to screen share. So if you FaceTime someone, if they have an iPhone, there's a button that says share screen. So I'll walk the client through how to share the screen so I can see their screen and help them.

I didn't realize FaceTime— I had a— I got a guy that does it. He does Google Meet, the same thing, and it screen shares. Yeah, but I didn't realize FaceTime had it built in.

For your Gmail, Android, or phone. Yep, Google Meet. iPhone has a share screen too. So if someone can't figure it out— again, I never announced, I didn't know that. We don't announce anything in sales, we just do. I, I just send it. I'm like, hey, look at your phone. Like, are you FaceTiming me? I'm like, yeah, click it. I'm like, okay. I'm like, hey. They're like, oh, hi. I'm like, hey, do you see the three dots?

Swipe up. Yeah, do that.

Yeah, go ahead and click share my screen. And they don't even think about it, they just they just do it.

Yeah, they will.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. They don't even think about it, you know what I mean? And Crankwheel has a camera feature too, so like on days I'm not in jammies, I'll turn it on and then they can see me too. And I think it just helps them put a face to the voice, to the screen, to all the things, to like let them know like, neat, I am who I say I am, this is legitimate, we are going to do this. Um, and then it, it works.

I like it.

I think it makes a big difference between riding 20K and 40K.

Hell yeah. That's smooth. You got me thinking. I'm selling a lot just for fun again. I got back doing it because I never did telesales, so I've been doing it a bunch. So I'm learning like all the little tricks that people do.

What kind of leads are you running?

Final expense, just straight final expense. So I'm working on building a direct base shop again. So I'm doing a mix. I do like 50, I get like 50 final expense a week and 25 vet. That's all I'm running right now. Final expense.

Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, learning little, little, learning little tricks. I know how to talk to people, but all the little quirks y'all do, I ain't done this shit in 10 years.

So yeah, yeah, when I was new, and even now, like, I'm still a student. Like, I love hearing from people doing better than me because it's like, obviously you're doing something, so what is it? You know what I mean? Like, is it what I'm already doing, or are you doing something different? And so I'm always listening to trying to like learn something else, or a word track, or like a something to help close even more. Because I mean, I consistently IP like 40 to 50, but I want to write 70, 80. So it's like, well, one, you gotta up your lead spend, but two, like, yeah, there's got to be something, like, you know what I mean?

Sure. Yeah, yeah, that's good. I love it.

I love it. Have you done— have you done inbound?

Um, I've to— I've toyed with like I toyed with it a few months ago. I haven't messed with the ones— I've seen Trey putting some stuff out here recently, like the ILC inbound. I ain't messed with those yet. I tried like some that are, um, the call-in, like, you know, they saw some commercial or clicked on something on the TV and they think it's, you know, it's one of those everything's free from the government type call-ins. I— those are not— I'm not a fan of that. Um, but I've not tried the new stuff. And you, you working them? Okay. Do you like them?

I, um, So I could be so wrong, but I think Ringba— so when I went to Gala this year, there was a guy on stage, his name was Sam. I don't know if you were there. Were you there? I don't know. But if you were there, Sam was up there talking about his inbound leads, how they were going to the ILC. So I think Ringba came from Spectra. Got it. I think they're correlated somehow. But I just went straight to the source. I just went straight to him and I ran them last week and I actually closed 4.

Oh, cool.

So I think I spent $500 and I closed 4. So I'm like, sick. Honestly, just for like a little bonus, why not?

You know, why not?

Yeah, I don't know how consistent it is. I gotta keep trying it out. But yeah, it wasn't bad. It was definitely very different. Wasn't the conversations different? You're more like—

sure, it is.

But, um, it is, it is.

I get call-ins from— I run a lot of like, uh, those GOAT leads. So yeah, and they— because this, the landing page will have the number on it, so I get some that call in from that. So I work with those. Those aren't like call-in leads per se, but they do call me.

That's great, we love that.

Oh yeah, yeah.

No, I, uh, I think I've used GoLeads. I have my New York license, which, you know, a lot of people do. So I love buying New York leads because people always leave them high and dry.

Who do you in New York.

You can do NLG and Trans. Yep, Trans, it has to be a paper app.

So that's— see, you know paper apps. I, I didn't know this. I didn't know if there was anything new. I did know those two.

Yeah, no, it's just TransAm and NLG, but you know, that, that's enough.

Yeah, it is. And not a lot of people will do it. It's not good shit.

Nope.

Well, I appreciate your time. I appreciate you getting on and sharing. It was savage stuff. This is, this is dope. I could keep talking to you forever. But I'll let you run. End with, end with something. End with whatever you want to share with people in the last— give it another 30 seconds, minute, whatever.

And yeah, whatever you want. Honestly, I truly just think like the biggest thing, and it's like beating a dead horse, is just like if you're going to come into this business and you want to sell, you want to be a top producer, you just have to have activity. So when all else fails, go back to your activity, go back to your dials, record your calls, listen to them back, ask for help. Like, don't be afraid to ask for help. Um, I think that that's what's going to take you to the next level.

I love it. I love it. Yeah, I appreciate your time. Thank you for sharing. Yeah, absolutely. If I can do anything to help, let me know. Um, otherwise, keep killing it.

Appreciate you.

All right, girl. All right, guys, if you've enjoyed the podcast or any of the previous episodes, if you're on Spotify or any of the other Apple Podcast platforms, would love if you'd go in leave a review for us. If you're, if you're watching on YouTube, comment, like, subscribe, share, do all the things. We'd greatly appreciate it. Helps get the word out to everybody. Appreciate you, and we'll see you on the next one.