#353: Yacine Sibous, Co-Founder of Parker, the Financial Stack for Scaling Your E⁠-⁠commerce Brand Faster and More Profitably

Yaseen, welcome to the show, man.

Thanks. Thanks for having me.

Yeah, appreciate the time. For people who don't really know what Parker is doing today, this is obviously end of September 2024 for context of when we're recording this. What is Parker?

So Parker is a digital banking platform for internet-based companies with a strong focus on e-commerce for now. And I'd say what's important for me to share is beyond a digital bank, really our vision is to essentially work towards building the first self-driving business. And I can go later into how a bank is connected to that. And really, like, when I think about it, the core driver for us when we were building the company was always to build something that can help more people reach financial independence. And we thought, like, building financial products would be a way to accomplish that. But yeah, I just mentioned those 2 things on mission and vision because I think it's, it's good context for the rest of our conversation.

Definitely. And I've done a lot of research on, on you and your story and everything as well. Take us back to the beginning and starting this. I think it's 2018. Like, why, why start this in the first place? I'm sure it's evolved over time, but take us back to that point in time. Why start it?

Yeah. So at the time I was Studying physics and computer science, and I actually thought I wanted to do research in quantum computing. So that was— that's why I was, you know, studying both things. I thought essentially quantum computing would completely revolutionize the way we use technology. Just, it's a completely different paradigm for computing. And You know, while I was testing out research, I realized it wasn't for me. And I always had an entrepreneurial knack. Even when I was in high school, I was always, you know, kind of finding ways to make money. And so that's how I sort of discovered the world of e-commerce when I was in college. Actually, a friend of mine, my childhood best friend, started selling iPhone cases on a Shopify store. And he would sell it, you know, he would advertise his product on Instagram. And I first, when he told me he was doing this, I thought, you know, it's probably not gonna work that well. You might make a couple thousand dollars a month. Because I had done stuff like that before. And I think within the first month or two of starting, he was already making like $60,000, $70,000 a month in sales.

Jesus.

And we were 19 at the time. So obviously as 19-year-olds, I thought that was completely insane because That was already way more money. And the profits were really good too. It was like 50% profits because he was selling on Instagram pages and had very— he's paying very little for advertising.

Yeah.

I thought that was completely insane. And it was certainly more money that I can make in research over a summer and even more than I can make doing an internship. And so I thought, hey, let me spend some more time learning this. So that's how I first got involved in ecommerce. It was just really really, I wasn't even building any type of sophisticated brands at first. It was really just like, you know, when dropshipping was really working out in 2016, 2017. And then while I was doing that, something that became very apparent to me was that there were very sophisticated tools built, you know, to help you build an internet-based business in almost every category except for finance, right? So, If you want to build a store, you can use Shopify. If you needed email marketing, you can go to Klaviyo. Reviews, Yotpo. Payment processing, there was Stripe. But then when I looked at the accounting products we were using, the banking products we were using, the credit card products we were using, all of these tools weren't yet— there was no like modern internet-first version of these tools. They were just, you know, built by old banks. And even though QuickBooks was a software company, it was like, A very old one from the '90s. So that led to a lot of problems. And actually at the time, what I was really trying to solve for was just to understand the profitability of what we were doing in real time. Because I was actually, because I was more, you know, I had kind of the best quantitative skills in the people I was working with. I was always the one managing the books, managing the financials, doing the accounting, the bookkeeping. I learned all this stuff myself. Basically trying to understand our profitability across the board. And I was like, this is so tedious, and there's no good tool to help me solve this. And the idea I had at the time, which is actually still what Parker is today, was that the best way to solve this and the best way to get to a real-time view of your P&L was to actually have your bank and your card power your P&L, right? Because if you think about how accounting platforms work, You just connect all of your financial products to QuickBooks, and then you take that list of transactions, you categorize them, and then boom, you get a P&L. And I thought, hey, if I can just have a, like, streamline the data, so it's just one banking platform, one card, and we build those financial products, then we can get to the insights part much more easily. Now, what I didn't know at the time was how long it would take to build the financial products and how much capital I would have to raise. to get it done, you know? So like when you're young, you're really naive, you think it's gonna be so fast and it's a big opportunity. So that was really the inception of the idea at first. And actually in 2018, that is when, around like summer of 2018, so wow, 6 years ago now, right? Is when we applied to Y Combinator and we actually applied, Milan and I, with this idea. And after YC, we ended up pivoting from this idea many times, right? So we actually, after that, we were like trying to build a basically Thrasio before Thrasio. Then we were told, you know, no one's gonna fund you guys for that. It's too capital intensive. Then we built this, you know, we had the idea of building like a Shopify equivalent for SaaS entrepreneurs. We'd help you build a landing page, manage your customer data, all this stuff. And then that didn't really work out. Then we started building this consumer bank for internationals. And actually what got us to come back to this original idea was COVID. So while we were building this consumer bank for internationals, what happened was that during the COVID lockdowns, basically no one was able to immigrate to the United States anymore. I think there was, you know, I don't, my memory's not fully accurate on this, but from what I remember, You know, we were going after like Canadian interns moving to the US, and I think all the internships were basically canceled. So no one really needed what we were building.

Yeah.

And we had to make a fast pivot because our burn was pretty high given where it was, given we were, you know, building this banking product. So Milan and I thought, okay, well, we need to get profitable because we don't know what's going to happen in e-com, and there's no way we can do it with this consumer bank. So let's start building these e-commerce businesses because we know how they work and they can get profitable really quickly. to offset the burn we have for the startup we're building. So it's kind of like this complicated scheme to get to profitability without our core product. But, you know, we were just like, let's, let's do it. So we started doing that. And while we were doing that, we realized like, oh wow, it's been almost 2 years, if not more, since our original idea. And we thought, hey, these problems we had would be solved by Brex because Brex had launched an e-commerce product, by Wayflyer, by Clearco. There are all these players. But it hadn't been solved. And at the time, you know, now we were just more experienced, and we realized like, hey, like once you see a problem, it's not because there's other big players that, you know, you'll get outcompeted if you, if you have an idea and no one's solving the problem. You know, we just felt like we had the right skills to solve it. So we said, screw it. Let's build our own card. So we started repurposing the consumer financial products that we had built to serve the needs we had for our business. So, that was the goal at first. Then we started telling our friends about it. Our friends wanted to use our card and the product we were building. And then I started doing cold outbound and reaching out to merchants and seeing if we can get clients and customers that were not our friends to use the product. So, it was really just following kind of the basic startup roadmap.

Right.

You built something that you want and then you get other people to use it. And we really thought there was a big opportunity there, 'cause, you know, e-commerce was huge and no one was building that sort of product we wanted.

I'm curious about a few things with that. One, even taking a step back, how'd you meet your co-founder, Milan?

Yeah, so Milan and I met at this kind of social experiment of a school called 42 that was started by this French billionaire. And yeah, Milan, Milan was also working on e-commerce. So we had that in common. And Milan actually at the time was working on his own educational video game. That was his startup idea. And then I thought I wouldn't be able to convince him to work with me, but he was one of the, you know, best engineers I knew. So I thought, hey, like I'm working on this, are you interested? And he just decided to work, we decided to work with each other. From then. And yeah, it's been going since then.

What was it about that? I mean, what conversation— what was the conversation like?

The conversation was exactly what I just told you. It was like that. Yeah, there was no— there wasn't this like big elaborate speech. There was no like intense co-founder vetting. It was just that. And also at the time, what we had in common is I take it for, you know, you take it for granted, but really when you're in an environment where not people have the belief or conviction that they can build a startup, just being able to find find one person who is and is willing to commit is already rare in and of itself.

Stands out. Yeah, definitely. And with that too, so how did you even find that program? Because like, I can't just gloss over that. Because like you mentioned, some French billionaire starts this program, you get in to meet this guy, meet Milan. Like, how did you even find that? What was this program? Want some context?

Yeah, I found it on Twitter. So I would follow Paul Graham quite a bit and read his essays because I was always interested in startups and Paul Graham just had by far the best content on building startups, and he tweeted about 42 one day. So it piqued my curiosity, and I went to try it out for a couple weeks, and I thought it was super fun. I was, you know, I was already making some money in e-com. So I was like, oh, let me let me try it out for longer. But our stint there didn't last that long. I think from the time I went there to when we Started YC, there were maybe 5 or 6 months. It was a very short, short period of time.

Gotcha. And then going from YC, obviously you had the idea for this in the first place. You kind of came back to it a little bit later. When you came back to the idea for a second time of what Parker ended up becoming, take me through more of that. And just in terms of like you mentioned kind of cold outbound a little bit, as well as family, like kind of friends of yours who were running businesses. What was the feedback you were getting early on that gave you enough confidence to kind of continue on with this idea? Because obviously you had quit a few other ideas.

So, 2 things. One, we were so tired of pivoting that we adopted the mindset that it's up to us to make the idea work, and we just wanted to see it through. So, there was, there was almost like a desire to force the idea to work. And second, it was very clear from conversations we were having with customers that the credit cards they were using were creating bottlenecks in the growth of their business, both from how the limits they were getting were set and how the payment terms they were getting from their cards worked, and that there was a lot of lack of flexibility there with existing players.

One of the things too with that, take us back because you went through Y Combinator. Did you raise right after Y Combinator? And then like, you obviously are pivoting for a year or two there. Take us through the funding, the funding side of it, kind of getting off the ground with Parker as well.

Yeah, so back when I was in YC, I really didn't understand the concept of fundraising. So getting into YC and getting money from Y Combinator was my first experience with fundraising at all. So prior to that, I don't think I even had met someone who had fundraised capital from VCs. So it was very— I knew it was something that happened, but it was very foreign to me. So I didn't understand how it happened or what criteria you needed to meet to even raise. So I didn't understand that like there were people out there that were willing to give you money just for an idea. So when we were in YC, we actually just, I think a lot of the partners there liked Milan and I. So we ended up rising just from insiders within YC. So it was just all, basically all angel money. Some money from Paul Graham ended up investing, Paul Buchheit, Solomon Hykes, who was the founder of Docker, who was actually a partner at the time in YC. 22 Ventures, which was also like a kind of YC-related fund. And yeah, and then from there, really no one else was willing to fund us. I think, you know, we just had this different background and maybe I wasn't, you know, not the best at pitching at the time. And it took, it took me a while to figure it out. And, but yeah, we had enough money to, you You know, it lasted us quite some time. We were very scrappy. We were just, we weren't really burning a ton, which in hindsight was a mistake. Because I think, I think the question of runway is really important early on because some people overdo it where they burn way too much. And that's kind of the cautionary tales you hear about. But actually, I think the opposite of that is also true where some people have such low conviction on what they're working on that they underinvest. And they just basically like live off of nothing off the co-founders and they have 8 years of runway on paper, but they just never reach escape velocity. So they kind of like, it's very easy to be in that position when you do YC because you'll raise a lot of money for 3 people. And so you convince yourself like, wow, I have all this runway. But now that I'm 6 years out of YC, I've definitely met a number of people who You know, are still living off that, that like pre-seed round, but haven't built that much out of it.

Yeah, haven't used it efficiently to actually build the business, which is what you should do with that capital ideally to get to what you want to get to.

Yeah, exactly right. Like you need to, if you're building, if you're aiming to build a fast-growing company, you kind of, you need to, you know, you need to invest in stuff. You need to invest in building your product. You know, you need to take some amount of risk where you don't have perfect information or perfect data. that your idea is going to work. But you kind of, yeah, it's kind of an art on how to manage your burn, right? Because you want to invest in the future and build something, but you don't want to overdo it either, where you run out of money and you can't survive.

So from kind of that point of, you said maybe like underutilizing that a little bit on the funding side, you obviously then raised a lot later on. But let's take it from the kind of post-COVID, you come back to the idea that you think was going to be a better idea, you're going to stick with it. You get some initial customers, it sounds like. Like, what fueled the growth from there? Because if you take a— if you look at Parker today, you would look at the headlines, you'd be like, $100+ million raised. You look at like all the things you're doing, people kind of raving about it. But there's like a couple of years in between that, obviously, from the post-COVID to now in 2024. What fueled that growth and what kind of happened from that?

Things started taking off, I would say, at the end of the summer of, let's see, 2021. So what happened was from enough customer conversations, we actually figured out enough points of differentiation to grow quickly in e-commerce. So we had like interesting, you know, we built the rolling terms, we built the e-com-first underwriting. So that, and then we kind of figured out a go-to-market motion with that was basically like outbound plus events combined. And that got word of mouth going. So then we started growing our customer base very quickly. And this was still during the fintech boom, right? So, I think like the context here is really important because if we had the same thing happen today, I don't know that we would be able to fundraise. So, there was, there was like this, you know, the backdrop was that fintech multiples were really high. There was, you know, there was a lot of VC appetite to fund fintechs. So, we were growing really quickly. And then doing our Series A with our seed investor, was very straightforward, right? Because we had that growth and had a lot of success funding fintechs. They just recognized the pattern there, and they were willing to fund us. So, raising that money, plus proving out the model with lenders, allowed us to raise the warehouse facility, right? So, the sort of $100 million to fund this even more. That was kind of the backdrop. So, it was like a combination of something that was out of our control, right? It was just fintech was booming. VCs wanted to fund fintechs. And then also like we were growing very quickly and our numbers looked good.

Love it. And with that too, so thinking about at that point in time, you said events plus cold outreach. What was the events piece of it? Sponsoring events, hosting your own events? Like what was that? Is this like post-COVID, pretty high appetite for events?

It was really just hosting our own events. So inviting, Calm founders to events and making them feel a part of a community. And just, we weren't even being forceful or pushy when we were explaining the product. We're just, it was like, hey, like, you know, we're Parker, we're sponsoring this event. And then people are curious to learn more. And also the, you know, what we were doing resonated a lot. So it was, you know, it was just a very straightforward pitch.

Yeah, that makes total sense. Especially given what you were doing, your audience is pretty clear. And you said it at the time, There's other cards out there that weren't quite doing things specifically for e-commerce, like like a Brex or someone else who's not quite fit for this. Take us through the feedback you were getting from from people because I I think I looked on Twitter, did some research, like founder of like Native Deodorant was like raving about you. Like Parker greater than Brex, all these different things. Like you had all these different people kind of raving about it. Like what were you already hearing around around that time in terms of feedback around features or products that you need to build out or like things that were working well? I'm just kind of curious on what the customers were kind of saying.

So at the time, we only had our card product, right?

Okay.

So if you want to understand the landscape, there's basically 2 main categories of products you need that, you know, we compete with on the card side. So you have the incumbent legacy products from the banks, right? So that's the American Express, the Capital One, the Chase cards that offer like very high cashback, very high rewards. So there where we really differentiated was One, we underwrote the customers to their business financials. If you're going and you're applying for a business credit card on American Express or Capital One's website, they're only looking at your FICO score, which is actually a very, you know, very strong predictor of delinquency or default, and it makes sense. But in terms of assigning a limit, it's better to also pair that data with a business's financials. Now versus Brex and Ramp, so actually if you look at Brex and Ramp as card products, like the actual card users use, the value proposition of the card is still the same as Amex or Cap One. It's still just a 30-day monthly charge card that gives you cash back. It's just that Brex and Ramp essentially ramp— wrap around the better expense management sort of layer or experience around the card. And what we realized for a lot of these e-commerce companies, because they were relatively smaller teams, a lot of the expense management features that Brex and Ramp offered were actually not so relevant for them, right? So, trying to create controls for organizations of hundreds of people is not really a problem you have if you're running a 10-person e-commerce team, right? But what was a real problem for them was managing cash flow. So what we did is we said, hey, let's actually innovate on how the card works so that we can help these businesses manage their cash flow better. And that's how we actually invented, you know, rolling terms, which means that, you know, every single day is its own statement and you get net terms on every single day of transactions. We created the ability to have cards that have different types of terms. So you can get a card that gives you up to 90 days on the same limit. a card that gives you cash back or rewards for different transactions. So, we really focused on, you know, the card not just as like this cat— this way to get cash back and manage, you know, control expenses across your team, but as something that can actually fuel the growth of your business. So, that was like the key difference. The other thing too is managing risk in ecommerce is kind of tricky, definitely trickier than when you're doing it for venture-backed startups. So, with Brex and Ramp at the time, they had— it's sort of different now, but at the time they had underwriting models. They were giving you a limit based on how much cash you had, which just didn't work for e-com, right? So, for us, once we realized that and we actually built a credit model that was, you know, e-com focused and was more about like your profitability, your revenue, things like that, then we had something that was very different, very attractive to our customers. We were really the only ones doing it or who had figured it out on the cart side. Yeah. So that really enabled us to grow very quickly.

How did you guys figure that out? Because I remember Nick, or I said my friend who introduced us, tell me about the rolling terms and everything else with that. Like, obviously it wasn't being done at the time. What was the insight? Did you guys just kind of look at the landscape? You're like, well, it makes sense to just have rolling terms. Like, how did you get to that point?

It was just from talking to customers. And, you know, we had a customer sort of pitch us on the way, the way the conversation went was like, Hey, the issue, the problem that I have with my card is that if I put transactions on my card at the end of the month, then I'm not getting a full 30 days, and that messes up my cash flow. And then the complaint was that, you know, they weren't really getting full net terms on every transaction, and that, you know, once the bill is due, it's just a huge amount of their cash gets drained out of their bank account. And so when we saw that problem, we thought, hey, what if we gave you Net terms on every transaction. Would that be interesting? And he's like, oh yeah, that would be amazing. I would switch right now. And at the time it was a large enough account and we just wanted to grow. So we thought, our team was so small, we thought, okay, screw it. Let's see if we can build this. And everyone was actually, I remember we were talking to some vendors that kind of give you these out-of-the-box card solutions and statement solutions. They're like, yeah, you can't build this. It's not possible. Well, we thought, okay, well, if this— if we can do it and it helps us grow and we can win this customer to do it, then, you know, that's good because we want— we need to grow and we need to build something different. So we did it. And it was really that simple, you know. It's not like we didn't run some large analysis that told us that this was this big problem in the market. It was really just from a single customer conversation and it turned out that other people wanted that product too.

Yeah, I mean, it's funny how it can just be that simple, but obviously you have to build it on the backend and make sure you can execute on it. But you can obviously have the insight around it.

I think it's that simple, but you need to earn the secrets, right? So I think every great startup idea is built on secrets, and secrets are, you know, things you just can't Google, right? Or you can't find in some consulting research report. You need to kind of go out there and talk to people yourself and come up with your own ideas. Find growth your own way.

And does that tie in then with the raising the larger round with a bunch of that being like, I guess, debt piece of it? Or take me through that part of it then.

Yeah, the debt. So raising debt is more, much more about growth is also very important because you need to have lenders need to see that they have enough capital to put at work where it's worth their time. But it's also a game of proving your credit model and your losses and your default rates and showing that your numbers and economics make sense. So, it's a very different game than raising equity. Some similarities, I think it's, in some ways, it's much more straightforward, right? The conversation, there's not much of a dance you're playing. There's less storytelling. It's much more metrics and data-driven.

Yeah, and I guess you said, you know, you had never raised venture capital prior to YC, and then you're raising $100+ million, What helped you learn that? Was it your investors giving some insights? Was it more of the Paul Graham essays? Like, what was just like helping you as a founder to be able to learn these things?

Actually, the best advice I ever got on fundraising was from my friend Patrick, who's the founder of a company called Atlas. And he actually had raised from, you know, the same investor we raised from prior to me. And his advice to me was just like, Just have your KPI, your North Star should just be, it should just be a volume game for you because you've never done it. So, just optimize from speaking to as many investors as possible. And you're gonna mess it up and you're gonna make mistakes. But just learn that way and have investor conversations and iterate your pitch from there. And at first when I was pitching, what I was saying didn't make any sense. But over time, as you have to explain what you're doing and you can see when people are confused, your pitch just gets better and you get better at explaining your business, your story, your growth. So, it was just practice that way. It was really that. But I think there's a luck aspect to it, right? Like, sometimes you just meet an investor who's very compelled by you or your story or what you're working on. And then you just need to find one, you know, big believer with enough capital to support you and For us, that's been Valar, right? And, you know, maybe if Valar hadn't backed us, we, you know, we certainly wouldn't be where we are today. So there's, there's definitely that luck component, but you just, you just get, you know, you'll find your luck by playing the volume game.

Yeah. I've talked to so many founders about this and it really is that. And anywhere from hundreds to even like people who have done 1,000 meetings, which is absolutely insane. But whatever it takes to get the round done, I suppose, and build your company that you need to build.

Yeah, I think there's some, you know, obvious tactical advice around just, you know, make it very clear what it is you're building, avoid jargon, clear slides. Like, you know, there's the basics are there, which we can go into if it's of interest. But yeah, it's mostly just getting the reps in.

Yeah. And one of the things we haven't talked about, I'm curious about. So obviously going from you and Milan starting this company then to building out a team and take it to where it is today. Just take me through that side of things. You know, what's helped you on the kind of the hiring front of things, like building a team for, you know, maybe the first time a team this big, at least. Tell me more of that. Like, what's been helpful for that?

I think for senior hires, working with well-respected recruiting firms is super helpful because they can give you access to a network that you don't. And obviously, if you have referrals from investors or people you know, that's always a good source of leads. But Yeah, I really recommend working with an exec search firm that's well reputable. That's, you know, that's what I do for execs. Then for the rest of the team, I mean, early on it was just really people that we knew that were good because we didn't, you know, we didn't even know hiring. So we just had friends. It, you know, it's just like, who are your smartest friends and just get them to work with you. That was kind of, you know. So Just say, hey, like we're friends, do you want to work together? And, you know, I can give you the salary and they're like, cool, cool. Sounds like a cool idea.

Dope.

And doing the whole, the whole big picture pitch. Yeah, I think you just, I mean, like what, what to look for in people. I think you want to look for people who see what you're working on as a really big opportunity and are just very excited about the vision and what you're trying to accomplish. And you also want to hire people who are just, you know, I found that we've had more success not necessarily with someone who has, comes from a big company background, at least with sort of like younger, more junior hires. Not necessarily for people who come from the most like credentialed backgrounds or kind of like, you know, can go work at Meta or Google or things like that. But just people who are really hungry and who are very grateful for the opportunity and view what you're doing as like, you know, an opportunity, like a really big opportunity for them. And not as, not to be in the mindset that what, you know, like coming to work at your startup is a trade-off from being at Meta. And like, you really want to avoid that, right? Because like for me, for example, when I was in college, I just viewed working at a YC startup as like the coolest thing ever. So I would've been super excited to do it. And so, you want that kind of person, not the person who's like, oh, the probability of failure is so high. I'm making such a trade-off working here. I gave up this huge salary. I think that's like a dangerous mindset. I think what I like to look for now in executives we hire, it's just really, it's very simple. It's like, one, do we get along? Like, you know, if we're talking, do we vibe? Like, is there chemistry? Yeah. Right? It's like a sports team. You want to make sure the players have good chemistry. Like, do we have chemistry? Do we actually enjoy talking to one another? Do we, you know, do I get excited getting on the phone with this person, or am I just annoyed or bored? Right? Second is, has this person done what they need to do here successfully before? So I think, like, have they been in this environment? Have they done this specific thing before? I think that's a very big predictor of success is like, if you've done it before, you might be able to do it again. That's more important for executives though. I think for more junior hires, it's harder to tell whether they were responsible for that success or they kind of just, you know, Right. Rided the wave. But for people who had, you know, leadership roles where they actually had to make big decisions in a company. So for example, now for head of sales, we're really looking, it's like, Were you at a startup that was at our revenue range and did you scale it? And then doing your diligence to see that their efforts were actually responsible for their scale and not some prior hire or not some, or not just that the product was so good that it was gonna happen. Like trying to understand that I think is important with executive hires.

You're 6 years in now, which you've gone through some iterations. You said pivots already. Obviously went to the peak of like 2020, 2021, which was a different time than it is now. but still chugging along. How do you think, I guess I'm curious about what you think has led to the success so far of Parker, because obviously most companies do not get to this point. A small percentage of companies get to this point where Parker has in terms of amount raised and how far you've come along. Like, what's allowed you to have your success so far with Parker?

Yeah, the only thing you can really do that's in your control is the 2 fun— it's actually funny because when you hear this advice when you're starting out, you don't realize how long it's going to be valid for, but there's really 2 things that matter, right? It's building product and talking to customers. And doing those 2 things are in service of one thing, which is growth. So it's important to have in the culture of the company this almost like pressure cooker feeling that the only thing that's important is really growth. Now, obviously, over time, people have, you know, there's these debates, what's quality growth, not quality growth. Let's say like, Let's assume the growth is efficient, but having the North Star be on that and having the North Star be on building something that people want and that a lot of people want is really the only thing that matters. And I think, and I'm seeing it now because we're not perfect at this, but as an organization grows and more people come into play, people start valuing, if you're not careful, with making sure that that's part of the culture, and you're not reminding people of that, people start valuing things that are not that. So what got us to this point was really just like, hey, the most important thing is growth. You know, I remember when we had our first hire come in, you know, he wanted to work on all this operational stuff and like set up rippling. And I was like, dude, it's just, this just does not matter right now.

Yeah.

I can just give you cash. Not actually, but I was like, I can give you cash for your paycheck, but like we need to grow. So you need to help me talk to customers. It's like you can't code. So the only way you can be useful is like help me sell.

Yeah, you're either building or selling. So choose one. If you don't have the other, you obviously have to do the other thing.

Exactly.

I'm curious at this point, are you working with a coach or anything or what's helped you kind of like How are you investing in yourself as a, you know, one of these co-founders of the company, obviously an executive lead in this company? Like, how are you investing in yourself as a leader to continue to improve and everything? I'm just curious.

I definitely invest a good amount in coaching and just executive coaching and things like that. That's, I definitely do that.

How did you find your coach? And did you start working with them? Like, at what point did you start working with them? Because that's always something that pops up with founders.

Actually, I asked one of my friends, hey, what's the thing you've done that has had the biggest impact on your life? And then he recommended me a coach and then I was like, okay, well let me try this out. And it's been, it's been great.

What does that look like? Is it like a weekly call with them? Is it like, what is that exactly for you?

Yeah, it's a weekly call, weekly 1-hour long call.

Weekly 1-hour call with the coach. Is that just going through kind of both personal and professional to kind of make sure you're the best human? Or is like, what does that look like? I'm always fascinated.

Yeah. I mean, I think for me, the, there's just, the personal and work has always been very blended in together. So yeah, it all goes together. But it's, at this point, it's a lot of like people-related things, right? Because it's like once, you know, I'm not asking my coach about tactics on outbound. Yeah. Right. I'm just asking about, you know, that information I can get elsewhere, but it's more about managing people, How to handle people, manage myself, my psychology, or things like that.

Yeah, I remember I did like a deep dive research on a founder named Amanda Bazeed from Incredible Health, and that was like one of the things she mentions, like the biggest thing a founder— for a founder is like managing your own psychology. And it kind of tracks to all the people I've studied so far. And same with my other friend, he's a Series B founder of a robotics company, kind of a similar thing. He has a coach as well. He's kind of always going through that and just like make sure he's in the right headspace to obviously take the company to the level it needs to be at. And as we kind of wrap up, I'm just curious, like, what's next for Parker? What are you most excited about?

So we just did our B in, you know, closed in July, I think, June, July. So yeah, so I think what I'm most excited about is how the product is evolving from, you know, a card and banking platform to actually becoming like a full centralized place for all your company's financials. And I think the opportunity there is really that once we understand what drives your business's profitability, we can start building out workflows to automate parts of your business or a lot of the decision-making in your business so that you can drive more profits. So everything from, you know, which products you should be selling, which you should discontinue, to which ads are working best, which ads aren't working, which email campaigns drive more profits, which don't. All of this stuff will, you know, all this decision-making process will be done within Parker. And the reason I think Parker is gonna be that control center, it's because for most small internet-based businesses that are bootstrapped, profit is really what you're optimizing for. And there's no financial platform today that's helping you achieve that. And then something I'm also potentially excited about is the idea of expanding Parker to verticals outside of ecommerce and seeing if there's interest for SaaS or, you know, mobile apps or any kind of other, you know, creators, any kind of other business that started online.

To that point with the ecommerce side of things, has it always been the same kind of customer you're targeting or has that changed over time? I know you have like a range on, I think, your website, the size of customer. I'm just curious if that's changed.

It's always, for the longest time, it's always been these like profitable ecommerce companies that are like $10, $20, $50 million in annual sales.

Just curious then, where is the best place for people to learn more about Parker, connect with you if they'd like to as well?

Yeah, just reach out to me at yaseen@getparker.com.

Perfect. Yaseen, thanks so much for your time today. Really appreciate it, man.